AirForce CO2 adapter is put to the test! - Part 1
by B.B. Pelletier
The new AirForce CO2 adapter is an exclusive at Pyramyd Air.
I have the best job in the world, because when new stuff comes out, I get to test it. Today we're going to take a look at the new CO2 adapter for AirForce air rifles. They'll be available exclusively from Pyramyd Air either tomorrow or the first of next week.
What it does
This adapter lets you operate any AirForce air rifle - the Talon, Talon SS and the Condor - on CO2. The CO2 is contained in a large tank that replaces the AirForce air reservoir and also serves as the butt of the rifle. The AirForce adapter is long enough to make up for the short length of a CO2 tank, so the pull of the rifle remains the same. You can use any standard paintball tank with this adapter, and Pyramyd Air sells both 12-oz. and 20-oz. tanks for this purpose. These tanks come filled with CO2 and ready to use. They also sell unfilled 12-oz. and 20-oz. tanks. Plus, they offer combos of filled tanks and adapters (12-oz., 20-oz.).
This is the adapter connected to a 20-oz. tank.
Let's examine the adapter
This is not just a simple coupling! It contains an entire Condor valve! So, the cost for this adapter is higher than for the Logun S-16 adapter. Because CO2 operates at one-third the pressure of the normal AirForce air tank fill, all AirForce models can use this adapter. Even though the Condor valve is huge compared to a standard valve, the lower pressure lets the two standard rifles use it, too.
Installing the adapter
Connect the adapter to the CO2 tank by simply screwing them together. I put three drops of Crosman Pellgunoil inside the adapter before I put the parts together so it will get blown into the valve when the gas starts flowing. As the connection nears completion, the adapter opens the tank's valve, filling the adapter with CO2 gas. That makes the final few turns harder, because now there's 850 psi pressing on the tank's O-ring. Keep turning the tank until it stops.
After the adapter is on the tank, attach the tank to the rifle the same as you would a standard reservoir. The adapter is made of blued steel and looks like it will last a long time. There is nothing else to do but shoot! The power wheel doesn't work as well on CO2 as on air, but there is a small range of adjustability.
Power
CO2 is a lower pressure gas than the air used by AirForce airguns. Also, the CO2 gas molecule is much larger than the atoms of gases in air. So, the power is lower when operating on CO2. Here's what to expect from .22 caliber rifles at a temperature of 85 degrees F:
Talon SS: 610 f.p.s. on high power/495 f.p.s. on low power
Talon: 650 f.p.s. on high power/475 f.p.s. on low power
Condor: 734 f.p.s. on high power/685 f.p.s. on low power
In case you aren't that familiar with CO2 in .22 caliber rifles, the Condor is shooting about as fast as rifles ever do. Only a few wide-open Philippine guns are faster, and they're not accurate. The Talon SS on high power is right where the Benjamin AS392T is.
Number of shots per CO2 tank
Oh my gosh! This is where it gets good. CO2 gets many TIMES more shots per fill than air. Where a Talon SS gets 35 powerful shots per air reservoir. With a 20-oz. CO2 tank, the number climbs to over 1,000. Pyramyd Air tested the Logun S-16s and got over 1,300 shots on a 20-oz. tank before they got tired of testing. Over 1000 shots is a very conservative estimate! A 12-oz. tank delivers fewer shots, of course, but the number is still in the high hundreds.
On Monday, I'll tell you the rest!
posted by B.B. Pelletier @ 5:30 AM
30 comments
30 Comments:
Wow, for CO2, the velocity out of the condor is insane!
At ~$130 for the adapter plus a 20oz tank, that would definitely be worth the buy to a condor owner, IMO.
BB, do you think CO2 would be safe for and produce enough pressure to cycle the action on an FX Revolution? Looking at the numbers, it seems ok.
Seeing these CO2 adapters for good PCPs is starting to attract my interest.
If they came out with a CO2 adapter for my FX Revolution, I'd strongly consider buying one. While ~60 shots/fill is plenty for hunting, in a plinking scenario with a semi-automatic, it goes FAST. While a thousand or so shots would be awesome!
Any numbers estimates for .177?
I've been looking for a way to get many shots at a reasonable power for plinking out of my SS. So far, I have it set up for 55 shots at around 850fps using CPL's, but thats about as good as I can do with it.
Sounds like this CO2 adapter might be a viable option.
craigjwjr,
Yes, the Condor's perfornance is impressive. But remember that the temperature was 85 degrees.
As for the FX Revolution, have they got it sorted out, yet? Last I heard the importer was rebuilding every rifle because all their seals failed.
I don't know if CO2 would work the action, but I believe it would not.
B.B.
The .177 numbers are here on the Pyramyd website. Condor 850, Talon 775 and Talon SS 700.
B.B.
B.B. Do you think that my SS seals/o-rings might be damaged by CO2? After all, it was designed to be high pressure air operated.
This adaptor is made by AirForce. I don't think they would make something that would hurt their gun.
Also, there are only two O-rings in the bolt of your SS. All the rest of the seals are in the valve, which the adaptor replaces.
B.B.
Are there any negative effects from leaving a full CO2 tank attached to the gun for long periods of time? Same question goes for the air tank. I'll be purchasing the Talon and probably be shooting a little at a time, so the tank will remain full for long periods of time.
Hey BB
Is there a post just about spring gun maintnance (cleaning stocks, barrels, champers, proper lubricants, ECT.
As always I love your input, Matt
Hey guys, quick question - really had no better place to ask..
When shooting up at an angle, how is accuracy effected? I tried taking out some pigeons but couldn't! I thought I had zeroed in my scope for about the same distance, but maybe it was just operator error. I dono.. If there IS some undesired effect to shooting at angles, please explain. It'd be much appreciated.
~Air Gunner
B.B. Are there any other adjustments necessary (like top hat) to start shooting with CO2?
BB I have a few questions. Is the tophat exterior dimensions the same for a condor as the talons? It sounded like there is only one adaptor.
If there is only one adaptor is the incresed speed due to barrel length or from the heavier condor hammer?
I
Air gunner,
YES, depending on the angle you will not shoot the actual distance to the target but instead you'll try to decide the degree of upward (or downward) angle then decide how much to adjust. The steeper the angle the less time gravity will have to effect the pellet drop compaired to a flat horizantal shot.
check this link for the math. that unit is way over priced. But the info is good.
http://www.snipertools.com/aci.htm
B.B. Off subject: Did you know that a "pickle" (in some airgun parlance) is a silencer? I just found out after many years thinking that I knew all relevant airgun terms!
Rob,
I have left the tank filled on my Talon SS for many years. I have owned CO2 guns that have been left filled for DECADES! Only when you empty the tanks do you invite dirt to get into the valve. Filled is the only way to store a bulk-filled or PCP{ airgun.
B.B.
Matt,
Try the 13-part series Spring Gun Tune
http://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2006/08/spring-gun-tune-part-13-range-testing.html
B.B.
Air Gunner,
Turtle got the uphill question right, but I will also blog it for you.
Turtle,
The top hats dimentions are all the same. The adaptor works on all AirForce guns.
NO ADJUSTMENT REQUIRED! I shout because that is the LAST thing we want people to do! CO2 works on dwell time, and the top hat is set to Condor specs.
The increased speed is due to BOTH the longer barrel and, in the case of the Condor, to the powerplant.
As for pickle, it's a name they made up. Like moderator, can or anything else.
B.B.
Don,
NO ADJUSTMENTS. JUST SHOOT.
B.B.
B.B--Scott again--looking at the leapers4x16--will that give me enough magnification to clearly see the center of the bullseye at 50yrds-also wouls I be able to leave my c mount in place an just attach this scope. not famaliar with the terminology what would I be loosing by not going with the other leapers-thanks again
sorry B.B. meant 6x24--Scott
Hi BB!
Can you address the last post at
http://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2005/08/just-like-real-gun.html
?
Thanks!
Scott,
You would be able to see the bullseyes at 50 yards with a 12-power scope, which is what I have on my Whiscombe. You saw what it did?
Yes, you can leave your C-mount in place and mount the scope to it.
I don't think you will be missing anything important if you get a 6-24 scope. Each scope has different features and you have to choose the ones you want. The 6-24 doesn't have a sidewheel parallax adjustment, but if you're not going to shoot field target with the rifle, you don't need it.
B.B.
On the topic of scoping, what are some solutions to protecting the dovetailing of a rifle from marring by scope mounts?
DLB,
If you use aluminum mounts, you lessen the chances of marking. Steel mounts sould never be slid along the dovetails. They should be fixed in position before tightening, and after loosening, they should be taken straight off the gun.
That will help prevent marking the gun, but care is always the best tool.
B.B.
aluminum makes sense, thanks BB.
BB,
Very interesting! I have a Talon SS and am wondering about what results I could expect with a longer barrel in .22 and this new CO2 option? It gets plenty hot during the summer here in California and I'm thinking this could be an ideal set up for a weekend camping trip. Also, I've got a 12" .177 barrel and would like to know what kind of performance I might expect? The options just keep growing for this gun. Now I need to replace my scope with something good for hunting and plinking at various distances...
Thanks, Dale
Dale,
The 24" barrel will give you a lot more velocity, but probably not as much as the Condor. Give it a try!
I would expect the .177 to shoot a little faster than the .22. Perhaps 650?
The Bug Buster 2 is a great plinking scope.
B.B.
Hi,
I noticed you said you "put three drops of Crosman Pellgunoil inside the adapter......" when using CO2 with Airforce gun. However, according to Pyramyd web site on the Crosman Pellgunoil that "do NOT use in precharged pneumatic (PCP) airguns!......"
Since Airforce gun can be swtiched from using CO?2 to compressed air, wouldn't the adding of pellgunoil creating problem when switching from CO2 to compressed air?
You DO NOT "switch from CO2 to compressed air" when using this adaptor. This adaptor only connects the rifle to a paintball tank, which should NEVER be used for compressed air. The regular compressed air tank that comes with the AirForce gun is not filled with CO2.
That is what the subject of this report was all about. The text repeats that theme numerous times.
Was that not clear?
B.B.
Hi,
I totally understand your posting. (And thinks for all the very informed discussions.) The CO2 adaptor is only used for the CO2 tank. The compressed air tank has its own valve. The two things are completely separate.
My question was won't some amount of Pellgunoil be blown into the beach of the gun therefore creating issues with the gun---per the comment seen on the Pyramyd site?
Yes, the Pellgunoil will be blown into the breech, but that's not a problem. The problem is inside the high-pressure air tank. Nothing from the breech can enter the tank unless it is empty.
B.B.
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