by B.B. Pelletier
I bet many of you had forgotten this report existed. I changed the title from B.B. gets disappointed to B.B. works it out, because I’m now on the upswing with this gun. This is a report on a firearm: a Taurus PT 1911. I’m doing this as an analog of a new airgunner encountering a gun that fails to live up to its advertising. The .45 ACP Taurus PT 1911 sells for under $700 and is supposed to have the same features as a $2,100 1911 pistol. Well, the one I bought had a lot of feeding problems from the start, so I’ve reported how I dealt with them to show new airgunners how to deal with their problems.
Ammo is important
Many things have happened since my last report back in January. I discovered, for example, that some of my reloads do not work reliably even in a Wilson CQB pistol, a .45 automatic that really does cost $2,300 and is considered the gold standard for pistol reliability. So, if they don’t work in that gun – which is the TX200 of sidearms – they’re hardly going to work in a cheaper pistol with known faults. The analogy here is that pellets are very important to the operation of your gun. Never overlook that! Don’t limit what you shoot to whatever is available at the discount store or sporting goods dealer. Buy the best pellets, which are generally available only from online sources.
The principal fault of the Taurus has been feeding the ammunition. It has a failure to feed that is symptomatic of a faulty extractor. A qualified 1911 gunsmith would have known this pretty quick, but it took me about 400 rounds to narrow it down. That’s my analogy to a new airgunner who would encounter the same difficulty finding out what is wrong with his airgun.
Another problem I thought I had was with the two Taurus magazines that came with the gun. They continued to cause failures to feed, while the Wilson Combat magazines seemed to work perfectly after the extractor had been reworked. I was ready to toss the Taurus mags, but then I read several reports that said they work just fine in other PT 1911s. Apparently, the corrections I’d made to my pistol were good, but not good enough. If I use just the Wilson Combat mags in it, the feeding problem seems to be fixed, but I think the Taurus mags reveal a latent tendency for feeding problems. I’ll feel more comfortable fixing those problems, because this gun is meant for self defense.
I cooked up another handload with a bullet that has a great reputation for feeding well in a 1911, and I switched gunpowder to a type that has a splendid reputation for accuracy. I went back to the range several more times. I’ve now run about 1,200 rounds through the Taurus. That counts the 100 rounds I shot this past weekend. There were only two failures to feed in those 100, and I was using only the Taurus magazines. I think I’ve narrowed the problem to just one faulty part – the extractor. The failure is even less than ever before, with just a quarter-inch of the slide out of battery instead of the three-quarters of an inch I had before I adjusted the extractor.
That brings me to a decision point. I can continue to work on the Taurus extractor or I can buy a new one from a reputable third party vendor. Wilson Combat sells one that is a drop-in, and up to this point everything I’ve tried from them works as advertised. That’s the way I’ve decided to go.
The pistol is now completely reliable with Wilson magazines and somewhat reliable with Taurus magazines. My goal is to make it completely reliable with the Taurus mags, as well.
Don’t forget accuracy
Reliability is just one component of a defense pistol. Accuracy is another. The Wilson CQB can shoot tighter groups than the Taurus, but the Taurus has sights that are quicker and easier to align. At 25 yards, I am shooting an 8″ group at the aimpoint for 35 shots, shooting one-handed timed fire. Timed fire means about three shots every ten seconds. That is center-of-bad-guy accuracy, so I’ve decided to keep the Taurus and continue to work on it.
When I started this report with a brand-new gun, I faced a decision to either send it back to Taurus for warranty repairs or to fix it myself. I decided to do the latter, and I got a 1911 gunsmithing course on DVD. From that course, I was able to narrow the fault down to the extractor, which I then adjusted to near-perfect operation. However, I feel I’ve taken the factory extractor about as far as it can go reliably. It is made from a metal injection molding (MIM) process, and gunsmiths everywhere, including the one in the video course, warn that certain parts made by MIM – like extractors – cannot ever be considered 100 percent reliable because they lack the ability to hold the correct spring tension.
The replacement extractor I’m buying is machined from bar stock steel, because Wilson Combat believes that is the only way to make a reliable extractor. Wilson Combat makes the gold standard of reliable 1911s like my CQB, so I think I’ll trust them on this point.
Like any new airgunner having a gun with which they are not familiar, I don’t know if my decision is right or not, but my research shows that Wilson Combat parts have been reliable up to this point. I’ll take the risk. This report is not over.
BB – what do you mean ‘it won’t hold spring tension’? Isn’t the extractor spring a separate part? Is the MIM extractor bending or wearing?
In the 1911 platform, the extractor hook is at the end of a rather long part that works as a flat spring.
Its butt end is seen to the right of the hammer. It always impressed me as a quirky design compared to the hook and coil spring design, but millions of 1911s out there seem to prove me wrong.
Hi,B.B In 1968 I was in the Navy and a Marine friend of mine sold me a Goverment .45 made by Remington Rand Corp for $60.00.After Viet Nam I became a cop in a large urban city.We carried .38 S&W at that time.During bank robbery season(NOV-JAN) I carried that .45 as a backup weapon every day,and qualified with it at the police range to cover myself.I fired thousands of rounds through that weapon and if it was clean it rairly jammed.The govt. made them fast, but the sure made them reliable.My son recently moved to a remote area and I gave it to him for home defense ,so it"s his now.He did some research and found that it"s semi-rare because it was made by Remington-Rand. Iknew that but I never put a dollar value on a trusted friend like that weapon.Sorry this is so long.Just though a fellow veteran like you would be interseted in this story.Thanks
Often, I’ve used a mirror to help find the accuracy problems with my air rifle (this method is like using the mirror on a back of a compass: so you can see who’s lost). Once I remember to employ what I was taught (from you and other sources), accuracy returned. Any way to narrow down what the PELLET is doing in flight? Find out if it’s spiraling, or flying sideways? JP
You deserve credit for hanging in there with the Taurus. Most people would have gotten rid of it. Now that you are finding out where the gremlins are hiding in it, do you still think that the Taurus is a good deal?
Al in CT
Good morning B.B. When I buy something, I expect it to work properly or back it goes for repairs, unless I want to tinker with it. Example my Diana 350 Magnum got sent to Umarex for the awful noises she made when being cocked. She’s now almost as smooth a shooter as my Diana 35. Thanks for sending me to Rck Willnecker for resealing my 1077. Transfer ports, who would have thought….thanks Jane, and everyone else. Wish I could end this with see you in Roanoak, but have a safe trip. Mr B. A PS to JP; what is the mirrror trick-thanks.
B.B.,
Put 5 drops of pellgunoil down the barrel of your taurus, stand it on end overnight then shoot it. 🙂
kevin
Al,
At one point early in the process I was ready to abandon the pistol as a bad investment. But as I became more familiar with it, I found myself enjoying it more. Now I use it extensively, since I gave the Wilson Combat to my wife for concealed carry.
If I can solve the reliability problem, I believe the Taurus is a great deal for the price – which is a complete turnaround in thinking.
B.B.
Vince,
Thorin got it right about the extractor. Getting the spring tension right is pretty important to good feeding. The internal extractor that is also it’s own spring is one of the most-criticized features of the 1911, however when properly adjusted they last for decades and tens of thousands of rounds.
B.B.
Remington,
I know the feeling! I have always been a wheelgun guy, with the Colt SAA being my favorite handgun. However, I started playing around with the 1911 when I was in the Army in the 1970s.
Recently I became aware of the vast refinements gunsmiths have made to the 1911 design, and also how easy it is to reload. It has not become my go-to handgun, despite an SAA still feeling better in the hand.
B.B.
JP,
You ask an important question. I, too, have used the mirror to locate my biggest shooting problems. The accuracy of this procedure is simply amazing! It never fails to reveal the true cause of the problem.
As far as a method of determining an accurate pellet other than by shooting them, I would have to say no, I don't think you can do it. Let me give an example. The Beeman Field and Target pellet is a domed shape that doesn't look much different than a Crosman Premier. But nine times out of ten, a Premier will shoot better.
What I do is choose the pellets from a short list of known performers. Starting with JSB Exacts in the heaviest weight and moving through Crosman premiers, the Beeman Kodiak/H&N Baracuda is always third. Generally that is how I test guns – with my short list of pellets.
B.B.
B.B.
Have you ever shot a springfield GI model? Whats your take on them? I have one but have not shot it but maybe 150 times. It seems to be a good gun and was cheap at around $525.
Also whats your take on a talontunes tune up on a SS?
the lubricator:)
Lubricator,
I have owned several 1903 Springfields. They feel wonderful in the hand, but they kick the stuffing out of me when I shoot one. I guess that’s why I don’t own one today.
The Springfield has been called the rifleman’s rifle, and indeed it must be. The stock fits so well.
I own a 1917 American Enfield made by Winchester. It’s another classic that also kicks like hell.
I am not overly sensitive to recoil. I shot a .270 Weatherby Magnum a lot years ago, and I loved a .458 Winchester Magnum that was made on a custom ’98 Mauser action. Those rifles fit me well and did not kick as much. I think it has to do with the amount of drop to the comb of the stock.
I have no experience with Talontunes, so I can’t comment on them.
B.B.
I believe he meant a Springfield GI 1911…
Thorin,
Thanks! I completely missed that.
Duh,
B.B.
B.B.
Thanks. I know what you mean about recoil, I dont mind it but why put up with it when it is not necessary. ie why shoot a deer with a 300 win mag when a milder 270 or even 30-30 will do the trick.
have a great day i am going hiking and scouting for the rest of my day.
Lubricator:)
I did mean 1911 but no biggy
Lubricator
B.B.,
“Kick the stuffing out of me”
I sure enjoy your articles and answers. Jogs this old memory. I elk/deer hunted with a .300 Weatherby Mark V (the german version) for years. Still have the gun with an old redfield 4-12 with range finder. Remember those? Great hunting gun, flat shooting, great knock down power. Not a fun plinking gun. Factory ammo is now around $4.00 per round I hear. Years ago one of my hunting buddies bought a .460 Weatherby for his african safari. Went to the range with him when he first bought this gun to sight it, open sights. Shot his gun once. I’m not a small guy but almost knocked me off the bench. Thanks for the memory. Ouch.
kevin
Shot a 3 1/2″ buckshot out of a 18″ barreled tactical shotty. And I AM a small guy. OUCH.
Worst part – I’m used to the artillery hold. I use it for my airguns and it works for up to a .223 Remington but not so much for the shotty. The first time I fired it I used my default artillery hold and BAM – the gun jumped right out of my hands and smacked me in the face. The second time I gripped it tight and… after I squeezed the trigger I was afraid I might’ve shot out the roof of the covering because I was looking almost straight up!
Wayne,
The test is in. Here's my equipment: a B30 with a 4X32 Leapers scope and two Beeman benchrest sandbags at 25 yards.
http://s415.photobucket.com/albums/pp235/blargho_2008/
?action=view¤t=range.flv
And here is the target. The five 5 shot groups are circled.
http://i415.photobucket.com/albums/pp235/blargho_2008/
b30.jpg
As the Japanese emperor told his people at the close of WWII (with his country a flaming ruin), "[events] have not necessarily gone to our advantage." Group sizes were:
1.25 in.
.88 in.
1.4 in.
.93 in.
1.00 in.
with an average of 1.12 in. As you can see, I shot better with firearms! The big holes are the M1 with the G.I. sight and the next smallest holes are the Savage sniper rifle. This may indicate that the problems are with the rifle and not the shooter but I don't think so. Among the many excuses I generated, the only ones worth passing along are that I think I need to try JSB Exacts instead of the loose-fitting Beeman Field Target Specials which I'm trying to shoot off. The 20 foot distance I normally shoot at probably covers flaws that show up at a longer distance. Also, I think I will try a more powerful scope. My 6-24X scope was tied up on the sniper rifle. The 4X32 that I used was clear and bright enough but the reticle was coarse. I was discouraged enough and short enough on time that I didn't bother shooting off-hand or sitting; maybe next time. Now we know why B.B. is testing the guns for us! Anyway, your shot sir.
By the way, I have to give another plug for the M1. I was getting 2 MOA at a hundred yards with the G.I. sight and surplus ammo. Even more important are the intangibles of how solid and authoritative the rifle shoots. If firearms get your adrenaline pumping, this rifle is for you.
Matt
As for .45 ACP, I have a few friends who like shooting their SA-XDs and are very affordable.
As for me I am having trouble finding an adjustable sear for a crosman 1377c. Anyone know where I can still pick one up?
B.B.
What a timely blog after my weekend shooting session. I actually hit the target with my 1911 at 25 yards! Here is my target with 24 shots:
http://i415.photobucket.com/albums/pp235/blargho_2008/
25.jpg
The remaining 8 shots or so that don’t appear were off the paper (on cardboard) in roughly the same pattern of dispersion. The gun was zeroed at 7 yards. Is this a normal amount of bullet drop at 25 yards or is it me? The grids are 1 inch on a side.
Feeding is also an issue. The SW1911 has had one failure to feed in 150 rounds that may or may not have been caused by me riding the slide. That’s fine for me. However, the Savage sniper rifle is failing to feed the second round of a four shot magazine maybe one time in four. Surely, the police expect better. I’m wondering if this is the sort of thing that smooths out over time or whether I need to take it in (which I’m very averse to doing because the travel to a place where I can mail the gun is a real hassle and very expensive).
Also, I’m thinking of getting another powerful scope. The Air Force scope that is 6-24X50mm is in the same price range as the Leapers counterpart. How would you compare these brands? The Leapers scope was working okay with definite clicks to the controls–although a little looser and less positive than I would have liked. Some adjustments did not go where I expected although I’m not sure if that was the scope, me or the wind.
Wayne, incidentally, some of my estimates for our initial match-up over the IZH-61 turn out to be pretty accurate. I managed to benchrest groups at little over 1 MOA with the sniper rifle with most of the groups going closer to 2 MOA. And my standing groups were around 7 MOA. So, the ratio of 2/7 was about right; I lifted it from a blog of many months ago.
Matt61
BB, I’m going to to play devils advocate here: You are using reloaded ammo right? “I cooked up another handload with a bullet that has a great reputation for feeding well in a 1911, and I switched gunpowder to a type that has a splendid reputation for accuracy. “
This is from the Taurus 1911 manual:
2. The use of reloaded, “remanufactured”, hand-loaded, or other nonstandard
ammunition voids all warranties. Improperly loaded ammunition
voids all warranties. In another location in the manual Taurus recommends against the use of reloaded ammo.
Now I don’t know if you had failure to load or extract using factory loaded ammo or not.
Could your reloads be part of the problem?
Nathan
ajvenom,
Have you tried at Crooked Barn?
http://www.crookedbarn.com
B.B.
Nathan,
Yes, that could be a problem, except that I am specifically trying to develop a more reliable handload. The gun still fails to feed with commercial hardball fed from the Taurus magazines at about the same rate as my latest handload. So I don’t think my reloads are the problem.
IPSC shooters who shoot 50-100K rounds per year all reload for economy and better reliability/accuracy, as well as reduced recoil.
B.B.
Yes, I am waiting for a response from Crooked Barn and Big Ed. Charlie (B.W.) said he wasn’t going to be making them anymore. There’s a couple more I tried with no luck.
I could ajust the one I have, but it’s a lot nicer to have a two stage feel and ajustments to get it just right.
BB,
I have a Colt 80 Series that I had nothing but feed problems with. It seemed that nothing I did worked, and the colt magazines were the worst. I also changed to Wilson Mags and solved 50% of my problems. I really wanted to shoot the 200 gr Semiwadcutters for targets and after at least a year of fighting with the gun a shooter at the range walked up to me one day and started a conversation about the gun and problems he saw me having. His suggestion was to start my loads at the min. OAL and work up .010 at a time. I wondered if it could work so I went home and loaded 25 each starting 1.220 thru 1.290 with a H&G semi wad. I took them to the range the next weekend and started having the same problems I always had until I got to the 1.250's and it got better and better. The 1.270 fed 25 rnds without a problem so I loaded several hundred at that length. They all fed through Colt mags without a single failure. I have since loaded several thousand at that length and except for a time or 2 when I limp wristed the gun they function flawlessly. Its not a perfect solution but sure has made shooting that gun more enjoyable. As a side note the 230 ball loaded to the same OAL also function perfectly although I dont shoot much Ball ammo.
Sam
BB: Will an R-9 Stock fit a Beeman R-10 rifle? thanx
Update: Roy at mountian air says No. PSP uses Big Ed now and no response from Bryan and Associates and Mac1. I guess I’ll have to hit the boards.
Sam,
My loads measure 1.197″ overall, which may be a little short. I may extend them to the longer lengths you mentioned.
But hardball 230-grains that measures 1.255″ also jams in this gun in the same way, so I’m still thinking that it’s the extractor.
B.B.
R10,
I don’t know, but I think not.
Anyone?
Matt61,
I put up my results of a blown out day, which turned into a “best in the wind” contest between the Air Arms S410, Condor .22 with bloop tube, and the CZ634… on the weekend blog… here is an updated photo bucket..I hope..
http://s424.photobucket.com/albums/pp325/wayne177/
Randy also had trouble in the bench rest with the Avenger 1100 last night as well. His best groups of 5 out of 21 groups, at 20 yards, indoors, was 3 @ 5/8″, worst one was 1-1/8″ and the balance average 7/8″…. The Cz 634 I guess won the day, with a best group of 7/16″ and worst of 1″ and average 3/4″.
The CZ 634 has so little recoil, that I think that is the difference.. I doubt it is me or that it has a more accurate barrel, than your B30 or the Avenger 1100… It’s just easier to hold and shoot through the shot.. closer to the AAs410 with no recoil or condor, with very, very, little…both(PCPs)..with more accurate barrels as well..
Of course as the distance gets farther, things change fast, especially in the wind..as you can read in the weekend post..
Wayne,
Ashland Air Rifle Range
http:www.//s424.photobucket.com/albums/pp325/wayne177/
I have just about given up on the 1911 for a dependable carry gun. I have had a dozen fairly stock guns and the only one really dependable is an old Clark custom I picked up at a gun show. I have now sold all of my 1911s except for the Clark and switched over to Glocks. I have not had a single failure of any kind since I switched. No custom work needed, work if clean or dirty, and very accurate.
woguph,
Please tell me more about your Glocks.
Until I bought this Taurus I would have said pretty much the same thing about 1911s, though I didn’t shoot them thousands of rounds a year like I did revolvers.
B.B.
Wayne,
I had a look at your report. Very interesting. I’ll pay more attention to CZ products. Otherwise, my impression from your report and my experience with airguns and firearms is that getting 95% of the way towards top accuracy is a lot easier than that final 5% which is susceptible to all sorts of things including the shooter. I was so immersed in articles about people shooting half inch and one quarter groups at a hundred yards that I had the impression that you could go out and just do it. By no means is that the case.
I also found out that my understanding of precision and accuracy was completely wrong all these years. I can still hear a Ph.D. instructor telling me, “Accuracy is all about repeatability….”
woguph, this is very interesting. What I’ve read about Glocks is that they are dependable but not as accurate as 1911s…. There are references to the “spongy” trigger pull.
Matt61
Hi B.B.,
The replacement extractor made by Wilson Combat fixes the problem with the .45 ACP Taurus PT 1911.
Can you tell me the replacement extractor part number from Wilson Combat that I need to get?
Thanks!
BeeKeeper.
ajvenom,
I think only Big Ed is selling the adjustable sear (http://www.bigedmachining.com/).
As far as Mac1, if you emailed them, give them some time. From my experience they are very busy and it takes them awhile to reply to email.
Hope that helps!
.22 multi-shot
Oh well, on the 1377 I knocked two pounds off the trigger pull….down to 4 lbs now. Just polished, lubed and used a lighter spring. The spring I used was a little lighter and shorter, so I shimned with a old rubber faucet washer. I generally feel a two stage in the 2LBS area and a single stage in the 3LBs area is about right, unless you compete in matches.
Other than that I am only going to add a steel breech. It may not look like a fancy custom job, but as long as it shoots nicely, that’s all I care about and not spending a bundle.
BeeKeeper,
The Wilson part is for a Series 80 1911, which the Taurus is, of course. The 80 has an additional safety device in the firing mechanism, which makes the trigger harder to tune and requires a different extractor.
You need the entire Wilson website:
http://www.wilsoncombat.com/
This is the 1911 page with all the parts they offer:
http://www.wilsoncombat.com/index_1911_part_acc.htm
And here is the BulletProof extractor page:
http://www.wilsoncombat.com/a_extractors_bp.asp
You need part number 415,80
And now I need to know something. As a Beekeeper do you sell beeswax? I just bought 12 pounds for fluxing my lead pot, but I’d come to you next time.
B.B.
I used to shoot Bull's Eye all the time. I have had only two semi-automatic pistols that I have NEVR had a misfeed or other jam with, probably because I haven't shot them enough: A Taurus copy of the military-issued 9mm, and a .380 Makarov.
I have a Concealed Weapons Permit. I don't trust semi-autos so I carry a .38 cal S&W SS Bodyguard. No safety to remember except "keep your finger off the trigger." There's always a round "in the chamber," and I have NEVER had a misfeed. If you "double tap" you don't even need to worry about a failure to fire–no stoppages or jam clearance to worry about. The big drawback is I have only 5 rounds instead of 8.
I am sorry to see the military using the 9mm Beretta; I don't think it is as good a gun as the .45 1911, which I used to shoot in the Marines (1961-1966).
–Witt
Witt,
You know, my Makarov has similarly never had a malfunction. Very SKS-like, I would say. If only it were a better defense round.
I know a revolver is the most reliable way to go, but I guess I want it all, the extra ammo and the reliability.
B.B.
Anyone ever try a springfield 1911-A1?
B.B.,
What is a good .22 caliber break barrel hunting gun under $200?
Under 200 bucks? Just go to PyramydAir and click on “air rifles” and then click “search” and then set your parameters to 150-200 dollars and 800-1000 fps. Some of the Mendoza choices are there and I have an RM-2000 that works but I’d keep the distances sort of short since I think they’re over-valuing the velocity by about 100 fps. That’s the only one I have personal experience with.
I've heard that Taurus automatics tend to have problems, however their revolvers are supposed to be very good and not badly priced.
I own a Beretta 9000s which I have had several problems with. I have extensive experience with firearms so I tend to get angry with myself for not seeing the potential for these problems before I purchased the pistol.
My 9000s was the .40 cal variant which instead of being its own design, was more like a caliber conversion kit that was slapped on during production. I also purchased this firearm when the model was brand new and before all of the bugs had been worked out of the design. I have a personal rule to not buy any firearm when the model is brand new for the reason of design problems not foreseen or detected during development and testing. I kept telling myself that it is a Beretta, and that the gun will work just fine because Beretta is one of the best firearm manufacturers in the world.
I bought the pistol and had nothing but problems. There were several failures to feed, lousy accuracy, and the recoil was very heavy and "snappy" for the .40 s&w round.
I fired well over the recommended 500 round break-in, switched brands and types of ammo several times, and bought different magazines. nothing fixed the problem.
I sent the pistol back to Beretta only to find out that there had been several design changes added to this model since I purchased it.
A retaining spring was added to the rear sight to keep it from drifting while shooting. The extractor was changed and the recoil spring which was the same in both the 9 and the 40 was changed for the 40.
My 9000s now shoots accurately and smoothly. Unfortunately there were so many problems with the model line that the 9000s was removed from production.
The Beretta seldom misfires, I’ve heard of guns going thousands of rounds straight out of issue without problems.
As much as I like the 1911, they do have feeding issues from time to time, and require that appropriate maintenance be performed. Remember, the 1911 has almost 100 years of upgrades and work to make it what it is today.
The Glocks are as close as it comes to being like the AK-47, in that they ALWAYS seem to work. A friend of mine, who is a DEVOTED 1911 guy, bought one for kicks and threw it behind the farm pickup truck seat and actually forgot it was there. 7 years later, he was cleaning out the truck when he found it. The gun was almost welded to the holster leather after 7 years in the heat and humidity of South Carolina. Deciding that he would see if Glocks REALLY were as tough as he had heard, he pried the leather off and headed for the range.
He went through more than 100 rounds and never had a misfire.
He still loves his 1911’s, but he now carries a Glock! I tease him about it all the time, but he says that his carry gun has to be 100% faithful and Glocks are the only guns he has NEVER had a misfeed from. Since he is one of those 50,000 round a year guys, I believe him.
ajvenom, my shooting partner has
a Springfield 1911-A1, and I like it, but it is pretty basic compared to a Wilson or Kimber, and it misfeeds occasionally, without seeming to care which mag is in it.
I have never had a misfeed from my Ruger .40 P94 either.
Bill
Hi BB-
This is an amazing blog. I bought a Daisy 953 and a Crosman 1377 based on the info here and the PA reviews. Fantastic resource for airgunners.
Here’s my Q: Now that we’re getting into the indoor shooting season, I’m trying to figure out how to scale my targets for shorter distance shooting.
How do I scale a 10m target for 5m? Is it simply a direct proportion?
Thanks.
–Target Scaler
Sorry, the R9 stock will not interchange with the R10.
Derrick
Target Scaler,
Geometry says the transformation should be a direct proportion.
Bill, how can you buy a gun then forget you had it…?
Matt61
I agree the 1911 extractor seems inferior to the coil-spring loaded claw found in many other designs, until you consider that the 1911 extractor can easily be field stripped and cleaned by anyone, anywhere. You can drop it in sand, mud, even wet concrete for that matter, easily take it apart, clean it, and be up and running again. Try that with your Glock slide assembly.
My other gripe with all the striker fired designs I'm aware of is that they effectively "cock on closing" where the 1911 and all hammer fired designs "cock on opening". Why does this matter? Because there is a large amount of excess energy margin when blowing the slide back in recoil to cock the firing mechanism. There is much less available margin when the slide is closing, has to chamber the new round, cam the cartridge rim into engagement with the extractor, AND cock the striker spring.
I've had failure to fully return to battery issues with Glocks and Kahrs. Careful polishing of the breech face, cartridge rim engagement surface corners and extractor help, but the difference in design margin remains. It gets worse when things get dirty.
I'd always pick a 1911, H&K, Sig, Beretta, etc… over the Glocks, Kahrs, XDs, S&W M&Ps, etc for self defense.
Just my $0.02. Worth what you paid for it.
Robert,
For under $200 and a breakbarrel, I recommend the RWS Diana 34 Panther.
B.B.
Everyone who responded about other reliable pistols,
I see there is still debate over handgun reliability – no matter what model we talk about. It wouldn’t be a real discussion if it was any other way.
Thank you all for your input.
B.B.
Scaling it down,
Yes, size is proportional to distance, but Pyramyd AIR sells actual 5 meter targets. Did you know that? They are exactly what you need.
B.B.
BB,
“Please tell me more about your Glocks.”
Hi BB,
I now have a Glock 30 which is the compact 45, a Glock 27 which is the most compact 40, and a Glock 20C which is the 10mm with a compensator.
One of the first things to mention is that I am left handed and with a standard 1911, I always had to get an ambi safety added. I would also add an extended slide release so I could grab it with the nuckle of my trigger finger easier. With the Glock, things are easier for a lefty.
I usually carry my Glock 27 in an Uncle Mikes pocket holster. The spare mag mates up just below the trigger guard and the hole thing makes a rectangular shape in my front pocket. It is very comfortable to carry this way. I have shot my 27 less than the other glocks. With heavy ammo, it is a bit of a handful.
I shoot the Glock 30 the most. It feels great in my hands. I always liked the lightweight commander the best of the 1911s and the 30 is about the same size but with a larger grip. It is probably my most accurate Glock but not as accurate as my custom 1911 Clark. When I carry the 30, I use a kydex tuckable inside the waist band holster of my own design.
My Glock 20C is a really neat gun. I wear glasses and when you shoot the first shot with the 20C your glasses smack back against your face. That comp really blast you. But, the unreal thing is that when you fire the 20C, the gun whole rises horizontally, the nose doesn’t rise. It is therefore the fastest back on target.
I don’t shoot firearms near as much as I did before I got into airguns. When I was shooting my 1911s a lot I went to Texas Pistol Accademy a few times and also some other local courses. At every single event there would be nice custom 1911s jambing and usually at least one parts breakage. A friend of mine was shooting a Glock 30. He is a really good shot and I was intrigued by his gun. I tried it and was hooked. I will tell you that the Glock 9mms do not work for me. I shoot with a fairly loose wrist and the Glock 9mms would not feed well for me. I have not had that happen at all with the 40, 10mm, or 45.
I bought my Glocks before the other polymer framed guns came out. Some of the others are very interesting but my Glocks fill my needs.
woguph
Matt61,
“How can you buy a gun then forget you had it?”
Someday you’ll be our age too.
Thanks for all your recent input regarding the garand. Really enjoyed it.
kevin
Matt,
That particular friend has more 1911’s than most stores that specialize in 1911’s.
I’m guessing, but I would guess he has upwards of 200 pistols/revolvers and about half that many rifles.
Forgetting one, especially one that he bought on a whim as a “truck gun” doesn’t surprise me.
I don’t think I have ever seen him without at least 2 pistol/revolvers on him, and sometimes I know he has been carrying up to 5! He is a REAL believer in backups, as in “2 is 1, and 1 is none”!
Bill
I have a Kimber 1911 that I have a continuing slide stop problem with. At first, the slide stop would catch mid way through the magazine, on all mags and type/brands of ammo that I tried. I sent the gun back to Kimber and when it was returned they had replace about half the pistol and adjusted and/or polished just about everything else.
The gun now shoots very smooth and surprisingly accurate. the down side is that the slide stop does not work at all. I took it to a local gunsmith and for less than what it cost to ship the pistol back to Kimber, he replaced the slide stop with one manufactured by Colt. He also test fired the 1911 and said that it had no problems.
I haven’t been able to test it myself yet.
woguph ,
Thanks for that info on your Glocks. I especially appreciate the fact that you shoot a .45 ACP, because the 9’s are just too small for defense, in my opinion. I wouldn’t want to be hit by one, but a .45 just seems to do the job right more often than not.
I have to look into this Glock 30.
Thanks,
B.B.
mechredd,
For what it’s worth, I bought a Kimber steel 7-shot mag while I was trying to get the Taurus to be more reliable and it failed to keep either my Taurus or my Wilson CQB open on the last shot. Kind of curious, in light of your problems, wouldn’t you say?
All I know about magazines, and I have tried some very highly regarded ones like Chip McCormack etc, is that the Wilson 8-shot mags are the best I have tried. If you have never tried one in your pistol I recommend you give one a try.
B.B.
what does the “ACP” mean in “.45 ACP” ? are there other types of .45’s ? can “acp” ammo be used in a non-“acp” pistol or vice versa ?
Leon,
ACP stands for automatic Colt pistol. It is an official designation for that specific round. There is also a .45 G.A.P., for Glock Automatic Pistol. It’s a shorter case of similar dimensions as the .45 ACP.
.45 ACP can be used in revolvers chambered for .45 Auto Rim – a rimmed version of the same cartridge. but you have to use a special steel clip called a half-moon or full monn clip.
B.B.
The RWS 34 is about as good a it gets for around $200.00 If I had to replace the .22 springer I have now, the RWS 34 would be one I would definately consider buying.
I’ve experienced bad luck with the Wilson 8 shot mag in my series 70 Gold Cup. Something about the shape of the magazine follower pushed slightly outward on the slide stop, resulting in the slide stop lobe moving out just enough to enter, but not clear the takedown notch. The slide rides over the the stops’s lobe and ties the slide up tight.
Nothing wrong with the mags, just didn’t get along with this particular pistol. Never had trouble with the 8 round Wilson mags in my other 3 1911’s.
1911’s can be finicky
B.B. if you have the Wilson, WHY would you want to carry the taurus? Beware the man who has only one gun. From SavageSam
SavageSam,
I gave the Wilson to my wife for her carry gun because it is more reliable. If I get a failure, I know what to do.
When I save up enough, I will buy another Wilson, unless I get the Taurus running just as reliably.
B.B.