Wednesday, September 02, 2009

The Benjamin front-pump pistol - Part 3

by B.B. Pelletier

Part 1
Part 2

Maintenance
To maintain a Benjamin pump gun--first and foremost--keep a pump of air in the reservoir at all times! What this does is keep both inlet and exhaust valves shut tight against the internal pressure, thus preventing the entry of airborne dirt particles. Just look at any wooden surface that hasn't been dusted for a month to see how much stuff is floating around. Now, compound what you see by many years of accumulation, and you'll get a picture of what happens when the valves are left open.

Don't worry about the seals going bad from air pressure in the gun. That's just what they need. It's the lack of pressure that makes them fail. I've encountered guns that have been under pressure for decades, and they still held perfectly. On the other hand, find a gun that isn't pressurized and chances are it will have to be rebuilt before it will hold again.

Other than that, there are just a few simple steps to remember to keep your air pistol in top working order. One is--never clean the barrel! Benjamin barrels are made from brass and they aren't that hard. Cleaning them simply promotes damage to the bore. There can be no accumulation of gunpowder residue to worry about, like there would be in a .22 rimfire, so there's nothing to remove. The small amount of anti-oxidant compound they get from pellets passing through (the black stuff) is scraped out with each new pellet. They don't lead up as long as you use the right ammunition and don't clean the barrel, so what's left to clean? Yet, for some strange reason, people love to run patches through their airguns.

The same people who won't look twice at their .22 rimfires after a day at the range will scrub the bore of their Benjamin until it shines. And shine it will, as the brass is worn down to nothing and accuracy goes south in a handbasket. Benjamin specifically warned against cleaning the barrels of their rifled guns in the Benjamin Beacon, a company bulletin; unfortunately, they didn't put that warning into the instruction sheets for the early guns. Still, take a hint and don't clean!

Wipe the outside of the gun after handling with a clean rag that has a little silicone oil on it. A little means not very much. Do this to protect all the finish your gun came with, except the black may continue to flake off due to poor factory application procedures. That's variable from gun to gun, and there's nothing that will prevent a poor job from flaking, not even putting it in a case and never handling it.

Speaking of cases, don't ever store any gun in a soft case, or in a hard case that contains a foam liner. These soft materials attract and retain moisture and will rust or corrode your guns as certainly as death and taxes. The only cases that are safe for gun storage are the ones made for that purpose, and even then you probably shouldn't do it. Many a fine cased Colt pistol has rusted on one side from contact with the inside of its case.

Also, never store guns in anything made from leather, such as a holster. The solutions used to tan and preserve leather can destroy fragile finishes quickly, especially in humid climates.

What about oiling the leather pump head seal? It certainly needs some lubrication to maintain a seal, but too much oil can destroy the gun as certainly as not oiling it at all. What a dilemma!


The air hole in the end of the pump tube is just that. Don't oil it, or your gun may malfunction.


Benjamin experienced so many difficulties with owners over-oiling their guns and returning them for repairs that they finally stamped the words, "air hole-don't oil" next to the air intake hole. Our example was made before that was put on, but you will see it on a good many later guns.


To put some snap back into your front-pump gun, remove the front cap and take out the pump rod. Lubricate the leather washer with a coat of petroleum jelly and reassemble. Your gun will pump easier and more efficiently.


The instruction sheet they send out with the gun tells the owner to remove the front barrel band and either smear some petroleum jelly on the leather pump head seal or make a new leather seal if the old one is beyond repair. This procedure works well, but don't do it just out of curiosity. Your gun should really need this oiling before you undertake the disassembly of anything.

Benjamin used what they termed "Neo-prene" as packings in their valves prior to WWII. Neoprene is relatively oil-proof, but the pre-war buildup of the military meant material shortages. Therefore, they couldn't always get what they wanted. So, they reserved the right to substitute another suitable material, and they would not be able to guarantee its resistance to oil. So, no oiling!

Where do you find these guns today? Well, they show up pretty often at regular gun shows, where they can be priced from reasonable to ridiculous. If the dealer isn't familiar with the gun, he'll usually over-value it because it looks like more quality than he's used to in an airgun.

A pistol in similar condition to the one shown in Part 1 should sell for $75 to $90 in working condition. A box would add another $10-$20 to that; and anything special, like one of the Benjamin home shooting kits, might double the price. A Benjamin-marked leather holster is a nice addition, as well, but price it as a separate item and not as part of any particular gun. I've seen really nice holsters go for about $50, and even the semi-ratty ones bring at least $20.

Most often, you'll find a pistol that's been worn down to the brass and isn't holding air. I would try to get one in that condition for no more than $30 because it will cost at least another $20 to get it repaired. Rifles seem to command about the same money as pistols or just a bit more.

62 Comments:

At September 02, 2009 8:43 AM, Anonymous wayne said...

B.B.

Great article today. Storage issues are on my mind, with all the collecting I did last Spring.
Thanks for all the great info.

And for the outside, lightly rubbed down with a silicon rag instead of oiled rag? Is oil OK too? I also used some furniture polish on stocks and barrels sometimes.. did I screw up?

Wayne, Ashland Air Rifle Range

 
At September 02, 2009 9:28 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Question for anybody -
Want new air rifle to shoot pigeons with in barn. THinking of Benj 392. Will this do the job? Scope or peep sights? Pellets?
Should I go more expensive or higher caaliber?

Thank you all.

BJ

 
At September 02, 2009 9:32 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

b.b., so you're saying NOT to leave guns in foam cases? I'm specically talking about the cases that a lot of Umarex pistols come in...my CP99 being the prime case.
From what you are saying I'm assuming these are for transportation only?
It would verify one of my suspisions. As suggested in the manuals, after a tin of pellets I'll oil the trigger, and along the slide. I've noticed that after a week sitting in the case they will seem dry as a bone again.
CowBoyStar Dad

 
At September 02, 2009 9:43 AM, Anonymous twotalon said...

BJ
I used to shoot pidgeons in our barns with a 1400 loaded with the old Crosman flat nosed ash cans.

Knocked the crap out of them. A 392 should be about equivalent.

twotalon

 
At September 02, 2009 9:44 AM, Blogger FRED said...

BJ,

a 392 is a good, inexpensive air rifle for one or two off varmint shots. I say one or two off because you need to pump it 6 times for every shot and after the 8th or 9th shot, you might get a bit tired. If you can spend a bit more, consider the RWS 34 spring piston rifle although being a spring piston rifle, it takes a bit of a learning curve to become proficient with it due to the triple recoil (do a search on artillery hold on this blog). Since you are shooting at large targets (relatively speaking) at fairly close range, I think the iron sights will be just fine but you should sight the rifle in first for the range you will be shooting at.

There are a number of other rifles that are good hunting rifles, from Crosman, RWS, Beeman and Gamo. Just be sure the Pyramyd Website here specifies they are acceptable for hunting.

Fred

 
At September 02, 2009 9:59 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Re: Pigeons

I have a friend in the roofing business. He recommends a 0.50 caliber at 1000 fps to all of his customers.

;-)

Herb

 
At September 02, 2009 10:26 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Okay, so after doing a bit of 'googling' I have found a number of sites that say the best way to store handguns (I'll assume this works for pistols as well) is to use old socks.
And that the foam in 'proper pistol' cases is in fact bad and that if you're going to store your handguns in these cases to leave the lids open (kinda defeating the whole thing).
I guess they are mainly meant for transportation.
CowBoyStar Dad

 
At September 02, 2009 10:30 AM, Blogger ajvenom said...

BJ, I like my Daisy 22sg for inside dwellings for a few reasons:

1. variable power (multi-pump)
2. easy to pump
3. .22cal
4. easy to scope etc...
5. decent power for hunting (close ranges and head shots/the 392 is more powerful)
6. not too expensive
7. easier to learn how to shoot vs. a springer
8. has good power in cold weather vs CO2
9. really accurate with the right pellet.
10. Fiber optic front sight - good for low lighting situations

etc....
etc....
etc....

Wayne, you sound like me. I used pledge once and silicone chamber oil on a rag. If you haven't wrecked anything by now you should be ok. I use Ballistol now because I like the fact it says it's good for a variety of materials and recommend by BB.

BB - so if I have a soft gun case, made for guns, then it's ok. I also throw in some silicate packs sometimes when I come across them. From what I remember, I also have a pistol case with foam in it. Well in 2 to 3 years nothings rusted yet, but I'm probably one to over oil.

If this doesn't work, perhaps I will invest in a giant food vacuum system and hermedically seal up all my airguns when not in use.

Just kidding on that last part.

 
At September 02, 2009 10:37 AM, Blogger CJr said...

Wow, proper long term gun storage has just leaped to the top of my care bear list. Before I start doing a lot of time waster internet searching, does any one know a good source(s) of internet info on the subject?

-Chuck

 
At September 02, 2009 10:50 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

There's a rumor of a new version of Senate bill S.2099 going around which is a hoax. It's supposed to make you list all your handguns and magazine loading rifles on your tax return & other restrictions.

I am not sure it is a hoax but could not find mention of it on a government website. It would be bad to start firing off letters to congressmen about a bill which doesn't exist.

 
At September 02, 2009 10:52 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

RE: Pigeons

Could someone who has actually shot pigeons help?

More seriously, 0.177 or 0.22?

Head shots or body?

I have a 392 and I don't particularly like it. The iron sights are bad to me, and it is next to impossible to mount a scope. (with required adapters it ends up really high and you don't have a good cheek weld.) I really like my Daisy 22SG much better. Its velocity is a bit slower, but it takes a scope more nicely, and it is much easier to pump. The 22SG is my "go to" gun to whack squirrels.

The scope that comes with the 22sg though needs to be replaced with something better. The dovetails on the two 22SGs that I have also aren't precision cut. Be prepared to futz around with mounting the scope.

If you'd shooting close, I'd also try the iron sights instead of a scope. For short distances the iron sights are closer to the boreline of the rifle. This would work best if you could do body shots. Don't know if body shots would work though.

All in all though, what happens to misses? A trap isn't as much fun, but would you end up with holes in the roof?

Herb

 
At September 02, 2009 11:03 AM, Anonymous twotalon said...

Herb
I have shot a bunch of them.
Old barns that had old hardwood boards nailed to the rafters before the sheetmetal was nailed over the top. The buggers liked to perch on the hay track. A passthrough would stop against the hardwood boards.
Then there are the shots when they land in the open window for a few moments allowing their eyes to adjust.

Body shots right to the boiler room with a .22 pellet.

Newer barns are made with soft wood and much exposed roofing. Not real safe to shoot them inside.

twotalon

 
At September 02, 2009 11:07 AM, Blogger A.R. Tinkerer said...

Here is an older post where foam was discussed in the comments (search for "foam").
http://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2007/07/introduction-to-field-target-part-3.html

And another where BB said NOT to store guns in a foam lined case.
http://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2006/02/should-you-clean-new-airgun-barrel.html


Ajvenom,

I'm carefull where I use Ballistol because it "dissolves traces of copper, lead, brass, zinc ..." (quote off the can). It may not dissolve more than traces, but I don't want it gradually destroying the brass and zinc parts of my airguns (die cast parts often contain zinc)!

A.R.

 
At September 02, 2009 11:12 AM, Blogger CJr said...

Volvo,
On December 20, 2008 you wrote:

"I would guess the length of storage would come into play also. When my collection was larger, I would sometimes not shoot a rifle for a year or more. I would guess that is when it would be most critical to store properly."

Can you elaborate on what you did and the condition of a gun left alone for a year?

-Chuck

 
At September 02, 2009 11:54 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

B.B.

Yeow! Don't store in foam lining? That's where all my guns have been after careful oiling. I just store them in the Plano cases I bought from PA. Where should guns be stored? What about removing the foam linings and leaving the guns in the plastic cases?

Herb, I figured the high-tech camera was an unwieldy solution, but I don't see such big problems with a record of sight settings for different distances. Trajectory and parallax are things that are supposed to be corrected for anyway. Once this has been done, you should have a record of spiraling if there is any. When the spiral pulls left, you set the windage to the right; when the spiral goes up, the elevation goes down and so on. The sight settings should provide a sort of negative image of the spiral. Even when the complicating factors are not compensated for, you should still be able to see an identifying cyclical pattern. The exception may be parallax settings. While it is very unlikely that parallax variation would exactly counteract a hypothetical spiral, it could confuse the pattern enough to make it unrecognizable. Anyway, I still suspect that if you looked at a detailed list of sight settings and found no cyclical variation whatsoever that is pretty compelling evidence that there is no spiral or that it is so small as to be almost insignificant.

Kevin, I understand that Crosman Premiers lead the barrel over 700 fps and don't want to risk them for the B30. As B.B. mentioned, the problem could be the B30 with its oversize bore, and the JSBs don't fit too loosely. But that's a very nice offer of the Eley Wasps, and I would be glad to report. You're on.

Matt61

 
At September 02, 2009 12:20 PM, Anonymous Mr B. said...

Anonymous pigeon shooter,

When I was a kid we'd climb up on the hay bails in the barn and use our Daisy BB guns to kill the pigeons with head shots which resulted in either a kill or a clean miss.

When I got older I bought and used a Crosman 140, which I gave to #1 son last year, that would kill a pigeon from the floor of the barn with body shots--no more climbing up on the rafters,etc.

Pumping a 392 isn't a big deal when hunting or plinking. It will reliably kill your barn pigeons. Put the Willkiams peep sight on it and enjoy!! Good gun reasonbly priced which will last for decades if you store it with a couple pumps of air and lube the pumphead with Pelgun oil. Just my two cents worth

Mr B.

 
At September 02, 2009 12:23 PM, Blogger kevin said...

Pigeon Shooter,

I vote for the 392 along with the many. You can vary the velocity depending on distance and fear of overpenetration into your barnwood. I also vote for open sights since I assume that the inside of your barn is dark like most and scope would be difficult to use without light and a scope makes a 392 difficult to pump.

kevin

 
At September 02, 2009 12:25 PM, Blogger kevin said...

Matt61,

Don't fear shooting crosman premiers in your B30. Just lube the pellets. Whiscombe Honey or KryTech bike chain wax seem to be the most popular. I like the krytech since it's less messy.

kevin

 
At September 02, 2009 12:29 PM, Blogger kevin said...

Foam lined cases are for transportation only. They grab moisture and even with dessicants will rust a gun. Just store your guns in a rack (locked preferably) and let them breathe. I prefer horizontally but have friends that have stored guns in locked cases for years with the butt down and didn't seem to create problems. Horizontally is my hang up (pun intended).

kevin

 
At September 02, 2009 12:39 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Now this has me wondering. A lot of hard-sided camera cases have foam in them.
Hmmmm!!
CowBoyStar Dad

 
At September 02, 2009 1:06 PM, Blogger ajvenom said...

oh no, I read that part before, but I didn't think about the cast metal parts being made of zinc. I don't have any brass parts. Well, back to silicone I guess.

 
At September 02, 2009 1:07 PM, Blogger Jake said...

I just had an idea to check pellet spiraling, but I don't know if it would work.

What if you set up several sheets of thin paper (the stuff on doctors' examination tables, maybe?) pulled taut, seperated by a few feet, then fired through them? If the pellets are spiraling, the holes wouldn't line up, correct?

 
At September 02, 2009 1:15 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

BB: Off Topic. Other than Airgun Classifieds, do you know where a Slavia 630/631 could be purchased? Are they still being made? Thanx---D.G.

 
At September 02, 2009 1:25 PM, Anonymous Joe B. said...

I shipped 3 shotguns to Maui when I moved here, thinking to shoot Skeet. Alas, no Skeet fields on Maui. So I put the guns in soft, zippered, foam cases and promptly lost the keys to the locks I was legally required to put on them. That was in 2001.

I moved recently and found the keys. The guns have a patina of rust from the high moisture content of the air here on this island, as well as mold on the stocks and rubber recoil pads. Guess I need Ballistol and fine steel wool...not to mention a gun safe and either desiccant or a heating wand.

Can anyone recommend a good fix for the mold?

Also, as a kid, I got carried away oiling my Belgian Browning O/U, and the forestock rotted internally, causing it to split when I reattached it one day in 2001. I'd had it since the sixties.

 
At September 02, 2009 1:47 PM, Blogger kevin said...

Joe B.,

Re: Good fix for the mold

First step in mold abatement is to kill the mold and spores. Diluted solution of chlorox is typically used. Don't think this will hard your rubber recoil pads but I'd be careful about getting it on the stock depending on the stock finish. If it's black mold wear gloves and a mask.

kevin

 
At September 02, 2009 1:48 PM, Blogger kevin said...

Joe B.,

Meant to say "harm" your rubber recoil pad. Should have proofed it.

kevin

 
At September 02, 2009 2:04 PM, Blogger kevin said...

D.G.,

Slavias are still being made just not imported, to my knowledge, into the USA. Try D & L Airguns in Canada.

There are great deals on tuned 630/631's that show up on the classifieds and gunbroker frequently.

kevin

 
At September 02, 2009 2:17 PM, Anonymous The Trout Underground said...

". One is--never clean the barrel! Benjamin barrels are made from brass and they aren't that hard. Cleaning them simply promotes damage to the bore. There can be no accumulation of gunpowder residue to worry about, like there would be in a .22 rimfire, so there's nothing to remove."

BB, after a year, my 392 had begun shooting poorly - to the point I was getting groups 2x-3x the size I used to with the thing (yes, I save my old targets).

I even shot some benchrest rounds to see if it was me.

It wasn't.

The pellets were headed all over the place.

Two weeks ago - using a very soft coated nylon cord cleaning tool - I pulled a couple of soft cotton patches through it, and what came out was... well, gross.

It was a black tar-like substance, though it only took four patches to get rid of it (well, mostly).

The good news is my groups shrank back to their original size, and while I mostly shoot JSBs in the thing, I've resolved to wash the Premier Hollowpoints I bought for plinking use.

I wonder if the powderish residue on the Premiers (which turns your fingers grey) combined with the Crosman Pellgun oil blowing through the gun to create something I'd rather not see closeup again in my lifetime.

I don't think a few cotton patches are going to damage the barrel - especially if I take care to avoid scoring the crown - but I know that tar-like crap was doing a number to my accuracy.

It's possible I over-oiled the pump head earlier in my tenure with the gun, but in any case, there was certainly something in mine worth removing.

BTW - The TV show keeps getting better (and I don't mean just because of the high babe-osity factor of the last one). Can't wait to see your field target episode.

 
At September 02, 2009 2:45 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

D&L Airguns is probably the closest thing in Canada to Pyramid. They are knowledgable and very pleasant to deal with.
It is where I got my Slavia and they do still list them on their site.
Though I try and buy as much as possible from Pyramid (to help support this blog) I do buy the items that would have problems coming over the border from D&L, though I do feel just a bit quilty when I do ;-)
CowBoyStar Dad

 
At September 02, 2009 3:31 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Off Topic:

Does anyone know how long the barrel (inside the shroud, not including the baffles) is for a Benjamin Marauder? Just the barrel itself.

Thanks

 
At September 02, 2009 4:00 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hello B.B.,

Love the 3 part article on "Airgun Accuracy", and that PyramydAir is emailing the links to these (and other helpful tips) to customers.

In your 1st part, I like what you said about twist rates, pellet speeds, and the effect on the erosion of the pellet material as it traverses the barrel. This erosion can, of course, lead to deformation of the pellet.

I guess it goes without saying that barrel length would play a part in this erosion too. The longer the barrel, the longer the pellet is inside the barrel, and the more pellet deformation, or material stripped/scraped off. I guess the erosion would affect the pellet fit, and may possibly "bounce" down the end/muzzle of the barrel, similar to undersized metal bb's. Probably not as drastic, but enough to affect accuracy in the long run.

I know there has been experiments to show the best length of barrels for guns powered by CO2 and air, to maximize fps.

Has anyone every investigated the potentially optimum length of a barrel before detrimental pellet erosion would take place? I know the pellet makeup/material (higher levels of lead; higher levels of antimony) would come into play.

Just wasn't sure if any research had been done by anyone...

 
At September 02, 2009 4:01 PM, Blogger Joe in MD said...

BB/Tom,

Re your 1911 shooting video:

The current Army technique for the M16 is to wrap the thumb over the middle finger (nail, at least). This reduces the movement of other fingers when pulling with the trigger finger.

Another technique (I am still having trouble remembering to do, myself) is to hold the trigger until after the gun has cycled -- consciously ease-up on the trigger; this allows you to keep contact with the trigger blade rather than having to reconnect for each shot (makes a difference in rapid/timed firing).

I will try your techniques on my S&W Model 41 to see if they get me a few more points (I usually shoot about 90 for slow fire and 95 for timed/rapid; on a really good day, I can average just a bit better than 95%.).

Best,

Joe

 
At September 02, 2009 4:49 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I can shoot hard lead pellets through my 392,...but cotton-patches or Beeman and RWS fiberous cleaning pellets are a no-no?

Uh,...that doesn't sound right...

 
At September 02, 2009 4:52 PM, Blogger ajvenom said...

How about cleaning pellets in a brass barreled air rifle?

 
At September 02, 2009 5:16 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Matt

Re: Camera and Corkscrew

I have been assuming that multiple cameras would be mounted perpendicular to the path of the pellet. At each position along the path you'd need two cameras - one to measure horizontal deflection and another to measure vertical.

The other option of course would be to use one camera focused some distance down range. Something like a field target scope focused 30 yards down range. You'd need something fast like the 4000 frames per second camera that was mentioned, and strobe lighting synced to frame speed. the strobes flashes would essentially freeze the pellet at various points. It is doable, but one very expensive project. Not clear to me what off the shelf components could be used. But there might be such a camera/strobe system.


RE: Range chart & corkscrewing of pellet

I have no facts - just speculation. i don't believe in time machines because we are not overrun with tourists from the future. Pearl Harbor, the assassination of President Kennedy, and 9/11 ought to have drawn tourists from the future like flies. Using the same sort of logic, I don't think that you could create a range chart which shows a spiral because such a use isn't documented all over the place.

I'm guessing that are enough interacting factors to turn a "spiral" into a "pattern" at the target.

Jake,

In their book "The Airgun from Trigger to Target" the Cardews outline just such an experiment. They suspended targets from a taut fishing line. (page 186-188). They used rice paper (used to put under cakes) which has no fibers for the targets. They didn't observe corkscrewing. But they also didn't test a zillion different kinds of pellets in different guns. It also isn't clear how far apart the targets ought to be. Does 1 corkscrew take 5 feet, 10 feet, 20 feet, or 50 feet?

RE: Does corkscrew really exist?

Like I said before, enough reliable folks have stated that they have observed such corkscrewing so I believe it does exist. but is it every shot for a particular pellet type with a particular gun, or just fliers?

Military machine guns fire tracers. Doesn't seem to be a lot of examples of folks watching tracer rounds corkscrew. This could be due to difference between bullets and diabolo pellets. The pellet has a lot more drag, which creates more torque about the center of mass.

I'd expect that a pellet type that was shooting patterns instead of groups would be more likely to corkscrew.

RE: Corkscrew & noise??

The one thought that I've had about this would be to use a parabolic ear focused onto a microphone. It seems that if the pellets does corkscrew, then such motion ought to make some audible noise. A Fourier analysis (frequency vs noise level) ought to isolate the pertinent frequency. The corkscrewing rate (spins per foot) should be less than the rotation rate imparted by rifling. So I don't think that there would be harmonic problems. But I have nothing but book knowledge of Fourier analysis.


Herb

 
At September 02, 2009 5:44 PM, Anonymous twotalon said...

Herb
When my TSS was corkscrewing, I could see it make about 1/2 revolution in about 50 yds. Zero was 20 yds..at whatever point in the corkscrew that was. Out there around 50-60 yds the pellet had swung right by 2-3" by the time the trajectory peaked. When the pellet dropped from the trajectory peak I could see it swinging back to the left . Finally the pellet got too far away to see what it was doing.

Different pellets shot from different guns at different speeds seem to shoot loops that rotate at different speeds and to different degree over distance.

twotalon

 
At September 02, 2009 6:00 PM, Anonymous Jane Hansen said...

I can comment again on "spiraling" - it is well known and well documented, but I don't think we should worry to the extent of high-speed filming sessions. If the pellets are spiraling, you will detect it best as you change distance and notice odd shifts in POI. MOST of the time, spiraling is consistent, and due to a defect somewhere - (in the crown, in the magazine, the probe, in the barrel mount), that is imparting a diferential pitch or yaw on the projectile as it leaves the muzzle.

One less-expensive experiment that may be helpful is to shoot into gelatin, observe the entry angle, (should be clean and circular), and examine the pellet for any irregularity. The cause of any dent, crease, scratch, or similar deformation needs to be tracked down.
Examination of the crown, and the muzzle retention, could also give some clues. I doubt airgun barrels "whip" like firearms, but anything that would let the barrel give a pellet any lateral "kick" on the way out can induce all sorts of precession.

Best regards,

Jane Hansen

 
At September 02, 2009 6:04 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Just received my PyramydAir order which contained a Umarex Desert Eagle .177 caliber pellet pistol that I was anxiously awaiting.

Talk about a disappointment!!!

Looks like I got an open box or used item, as the Umarex seal was cut, and by the appearance of the gun.

Inside the box, there was nothing to support the gun during shipment, and it looks like the manual and tools were just thrown in. Worst of all, the rear sight was damaged, which I can only assume happenned while shifting around during transport, or maybe it was damaged prior to shipment.

How did this purchase unneccessarily end up like this? $139 invested, and now the need to ship it back (don't know if I'll be out-of-pocket for this), and the waiting game again. My pellets were as I expected, but what about the GUN itself.

 
At September 02, 2009 6:38 PM, Anonymous Jane Hansen said...

B.B.
I couldn't wait for further review of the Blizzard - I was so impatient that I did what any woman would do.

I bought both the AA S410, and the Blizzard. Let me say, having the Infinity, the AA, and the Evanix makes for some interesting comparisons:

The Infinity was built from the ground-up as a side lever. The mechanism is well-forward of the receiver end, and Shinsung can round that receiver off and meet the stock much nicer. Both the AA and Evanix are obvious re-works of bolt-actions, and have huge, blocky, receivers.

The Blizzard is such an obvious, (and nice), clone of the AA. They even copied the rough shroud finish, the comb, and the single-screw stock attachment.

The Blizzard and the Infinity are typical Korean hunters - high power that falls off rapidly. 70+ FPS drop in 10 shots is common. The Infinity tucks it's clip tight into the receiver. I'm not crazy about the protruding clips on the AA or Evanix - not good for moving in the woods.

The AA valving is a dream - It pushed Eunjin 28g pellets for 10 shots with a 14FPS spread, and will push 15 RWS-14g before the spread opens beyond 15FPS.

Curiously, the Infinity is the smallest, and lightest, but cleanly the most powerful. Using the power adjuster, I can easily empty the first clip with 6 Eunjins averaging 920FPS, with a 15FPS spread, making it the perfect game hunter. (it is a huge air-hog, after those 6, it's back to the pump).

The AA is best suited for smaller game - Eunjins fly at 700FPS, not bad, but too slow for hunting. Large depth-of-field requires higher velocity - I like to get as close to 1000FPS as I can, and that means light pellets in the AA.

My observation of the Blizzard is that they either need to work the valve so it performs as advertised, or they need to have a power-adjuster to compensate.

For now, I love them all, (Evanix needs to fix the magazine so it holds pellets).
I have a game-hunter, a birder, and, the Blizzard is my challenge - you not only need to adjust POI for distance, but also for pressure. With a better gauge, it will be an interesting gun to perfect my ballistics on.

Best regards,


Jane Hansen

 
At September 02, 2009 6:41 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Umarex Desert Eagle customer,

I forwarded your comment to people at Pyramyd Air who will make this right. Send me an email (edith@pyramydair.com), and I will put you in touch with the right people.

Sorry this happened!

Edith

 
At September 02, 2009 6:53 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Thank you Edith. Email is on its way.

 
At September 02, 2009 7:00 PM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

CSD,

No foam case storage.

B.B.

 
At September 02, 2009 7:07 PM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

Barrel erosion,

Airgun barrels have been documented to last for MILLIONS of round without losing accuracy, so I don't know where the erosion issue is coming from. These barrels don't erode.

Perhaps you are thinking of firearm barrels that erode in a few thousand shots, or blackpowder barrels that erode from shooting patched balls. Airgun barrels just don't erode.

B.B.

 
At September 02, 2009 7:09 PM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

Joe,

Funny you should say that about releasing the trigger after the shot. More and more I find myself feeling the release after the shot has been taken. Often I have held the trigger in the pulled position for several seconds after the shot.

I guess we all progress along the same path.

B.B.

 
At September 02, 2009 7:33 PM, Blogger Jake said...

BB,

I keep my 2260 in a plano soft rifle case. Should I not use this for storage?

 
At September 02, 2009 8:18 PM, Blogger kevin said...

Jane Hansen,

Thanks for the review of your new additions to your arsenal. Interesting.

Assume your AA S410 is in .22 caliber since you're out hunting with it. Please consider trying 18 grain jsb pellets in your gun. Please also consider ordering an aftermarket magazine from RC machine. Will make your shooting experience much more enjoyable.

kevin

 
At September 02, 2009 8:20 PM, Anonymous Volvo said...

CJr,

My storage was fairly standard: I mostly used an old white t-shirt with Beeman MP-5 on it to wipe the metal. Inside I use a felt pellet coated with the same and a lead pellet together to slow the spring down. In the gun safe, I keep one of the large drying packs.

Additionally, I would keep an assortment of silicone cloths to handle and wipe the rifles as they were put in place. Lastly, I run a dehumidifier within about 4 feet of the safe, as it is in the basement. I have never had the slightest rust issue.

The biggest thing as BB states is to never store in a case. As a teenager I learned that the hard way. However, I did clean my sister’s Marlin, which she preceded to store in a case for about 5 years. I expected to pull out a rust stub when she told me of this, but amazingly it was fine. I had used MP-5.
Volvo

 
At September 02, 2009 8:28 PM, Blogger kevin said...

Anonymous asking about barrel length on the Marauder,

Per the spec sheet in the Marauder manual the barrel in .22 caliber is 20" long. Here's a link. When the page opens click on the picture of the guy holding the Benjamin Discovery and it will take you to the Marauder parts list and exploded diagram:

http://www.network54.com/Forum/581291/

kevin

 
At September 02, 2009 8:47 PM, Anonymous Volvo said...

Jane,

Nice to hear you expanded your arsenal. If three is good, certainly four would be better. Think FX Cyclone. : )

If I am reading correctly you have relegated the AA to just avian pests?

Volvo

 
At September 02, 2009 8:56 PM, Blogger BG_Farmer said...

Herb/Matt,

Try this link (Lilja):
http://www.riflebarrels.com/articles/bullets_ballastics/bullet_imbalance_twist.htm
I tend to agree with it, since it agrees with me:).

I've posted this one before, but its a good one:
http://www.nennstiel-ruprecht.de/bullfly/index.htm#Contents
If you look in the right places, you'll see pictures of normal bullets corkscrewing to one degree or the other depending on stabilization and defects.

 
At September 02, 2009 8:56 PM, Blogger Fused said...

I'm taking my air rifles out of their soft cases and storing them back in the cardboard boxes they came in. Anything wrong with that?

I wish I would have picked up this tidbit a couple of months ago, it would have saved me a few dollars which I could have kept toward my 22 fund! Here I thought I was doing something necessary for the ones I had. Oh, well live and learn.

 
At September 02, 2009 9:15 PM, Blogger BG_Farmer said...

Herb,
A couple more thoughts on the helical ("spiral") path of a bullet. It seems like there are a couple of extreme cases: 1) where the spiral is minimal and virtually invisible, resulting in a normal, small group. 2) where the spiral is relatively large, resulting in either a large group or a normal group displaced by distance. I think these are the ones people see, and they result from serious problems with the rifle or projectile (shroud in path, for example).

Also, the fact that a group can be described in Guassian terms means nothing in my opinion, except that the cause of the grouping is of a type that results in such a distribution:).

 
At September 02, 2009 9:19 PM, Anonymous Joe B. said...

Hi Kevin,

Thanks. My wife uses that formula to remove mold from the bannisters here...works well. I'll give it a try on the shotgun stocks/pads.

 
At September 02, 2009 10:52 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Jane,

I'm curious. Are any of he rifles quiet enough to get off multiple shots before the critters scatter?

Herb

 
At September 03, 2009 6:53 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

If you want something to protect your guns, get rust-prevention sacks. Since these are not hard items, they will not prevent them from damage when knocked around. You can put your gun in a hard case, gun safe or the original cardboard box while it's in a rust-prevention sack.

Pyramyd Air no longer sells the rust-prevention sacks, so you'll have to do a Google search to find a retailer.

Edith

 
At September 03, 2009 11:00 AM, Blogger CJr said...

Edith,
By rust prevention sack sold by PA, does that mean or include the silicone gun sock I mentioned earlier?

Also, here is something interesting I found on the web:

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m3197/is_2_48/ai_98413452/

Excerpt:

"Brownells has made gun storage even easier with their Triple Tough Rust-Blox Storage Kit. It consists of tough, flexible storage bags that are puncture resistant, semitransparent and have a 0-percent moisture transmission rating. Rust-protected items sealed inside will remain rust and corrosion free indefinitely. The sacks are resistant to all petroleum-based oils and solvents, and are non-biodegradable. They are so tough they will never break down, even in full contact with soil or moisture."

-Chuck

 
At September 03, 2009 11:19 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Chuck,

The socks are knitted and I am unsure if they will protect sufficiently.

BullFrog makes good cases & products.

Edith

 
At September 03, 2009 3:32 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Kevin & Joe B.,

Mold removal is a tough nut. Texas is probably the mold capital of America. I've used all sorts of things, but the most effective mold removal/killing stuff I've found is a 50/50 solution of white vinegar & water. I have an arsenal of commercial products I've tried over the past 6 years, only to have the mold come back quickly (1-2 weeks). However the vinegar/water solution keeps the mold at bay for 4-5 weeks.

Vinegar comes in various strengths, but the stuff I'm talking about is 8% strength and is the stuff you find in the grocery store.

While 8% vinegar is acidic, I feel there's less potential damage to your lungs (no chlorine vapors) & your skin than chlorine bleach.

I don't know what a vinegar/water solution will do to wood stocks, but I do know that the wood edging on my kitchen countertops is unaffected by the vinegar/water solution, which I use several times a day.

Edith

 
At September 03, 2009 4:35 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Hello Edith,

Would that same 50-50 vinegar/water solution work on mold outdoors like on sidewalks, and landscaping stones? I hate the idea of using chlorine next to landscaping and grass for fear that it would harm or kill plants, but vinegar and water appear like a more natural and harmless way of cleaning outdoor surfaces.
thx

 
At September 04, 2009 6:48 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I don' t know what vinegar will do plants and the acidity of the dirt even in this relatively mild solution. I suppose that in enough quantities it could change things and possibly hurt/kill plants. However, mold is a destructive thing & dangerous to our health, but plants can always be replaced & the soil can always be amended to return it to the proper acidity/alkalinity.

Edith

 
At September 10, 2009 7:31 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

hi bb

would like to know how to tell the difference between the crosman 1400'svariats, i know that the first has no bolt but 2 and 3 does and i know the 3rd is the slim line but i'm not sure how to tell, i have two the no bolt type and i think i have the slimline , any help would be great

thanks again vinny

 
At September 11, 2009 9:38 AM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

Vinny,

I'm going to send you to the Crosman Forum for the answer to this one. Those guys are fanatics on the small details.

http://www.network54.com/Index/12861

I have seen the large and small wood stocks, but I don't have pictures.

B.B.

 

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