by Tom Gaylord, a.k.a. B.B. Pelletier
Beretta model 84 FS BB pistol
It’s accuracy day for the Beretta model 84 FS BB pistol, and some of you have been eagerly awaiting this day! I decided to shoot 3 different BBs in the gun just to give you a general idea of how well it groups.
Because this is a BB gun, the shooting distance was 5 meters, which is 16 feet, 5 inches. I sat backwards on a chair, resting my forearms over the back, so the pistol was fairly steady. I selected a 10-meter rifle target for this session because the smaller bull seemed appropriate for the shorter distance.
I forgot!
After installing the CO2 cartridge and loading the first 10 BBs, I tried to shoot the target and the gun wouldn’t fire! What was wring? I knew this was a double-action-only trigger, and it should have worked. Right?
Wrong! This trigger is not DAO. It only feels like one! It’s really a single-action trigger that requires the hammer to be cocked before it’ll work. You can squeeze the trigger all day and nothing will happen until the hammer is cocked. So, with this little problem out of the way, the test could begin.
Crosman Copperhead BBs
First up were 10 Crosman Copperhead BBs. As I shot, I noted that the pistol was very steady in my rested hands. And the target shows that…I think. Ten Copperheads went into 1.521 inches at 5 meters. But note the 2 holes that are apart from the main group. Eight of those BBs made a group measuring 0.78 inches.
The farthest of the 2 holes that are apart from the main group — the one to the extreme right — was a called flier. My hand twitched to the left as the shot fired. The other one, though, was held just like all the rest.
Ten shots in 1.521 inches, though the one at the right was a called flier. But look at the 8 that landed on the bull. They measure 0.78 inches between centers.
Daisy Premium Grade BBs
Next I tried 10 Daisy Premium Grade BBs. Like I mentioned in Part 1, they’re top-grade BBs that always deliver the goods. This time, 10 of them went into 1.114 inches. There were no called fliers, and the group is fairly well centered on the bull.
Ten Daisy Premium Grade BBs went into 1.114 inches at 5 meters. No fliers were called.
Umarex BBs
The last BB I tried was the Umarex precision BB — another top-grade BB. Ten of them grouped in 1.28 inches, with 9 going into 0.998 inches. There were no called fliers in this group, either.
Ten Umarex BBs went into 1.114 inches at 5 meters. No fliers were called.
Overall impressions
As I told you in Part 2, the trigger-pull on this pistol feels very much like a double-action pull. That’s one where the trigger first cocks the hammer before releasing it to fire the gun. It “stacks” or increases in effort significantly toward the end of the pull, like a vintage Colt double-action revolver. Once you learn how to use that, it helps with accuracy. The pistol is actually stabilized before firing.
This little Beretta is a fun BB gun, make no mistake. I found it trouble-free and easy to use. The sights are right on, and there are no quirks in the operation. If you like BB repeaters, this would be one to consider!
BB
You did the article yesterday on the bb firing Avanti 499. I knew the pellet firing Avanti’s were accurate. And I have thought about getting one of those. Based on the fact that most pellet guns are accurate when you find the right combination. And I will get me a 499 just because of what it is.
But this is what got me thinking about bb guns. I had a Red Ryder when I was a young kid. And it was a fun gun from what I remember. Then came the 760 and then the .22 cal. Benjamin pump. And after that it has been pellet guns for me all the way until recently.
I got a Umerax Steel Storm a while back. My first bb gun after all these years of shooting. And it is a fun gun. Then the 2 recent airsoft guns I got. And if you really want to know the truth about what I thought of airsoft guns I looked at them as toys. But now after shooting the TSD SD702 sniper rifle and playing around with different airsoft bb’s and the hop up adjustment Im really impresessed with the gun.
So that brings me to this point. The bb pistol your testing right now has its place for diferent people. And Im now getting more into the rapid fire stuff shooting inside. But after messing around with the air soft gun I think there is more you can do with them concerning accuracy then you can with this steel bb firing pistol.
You have alot more choices in airsoft round balls then steel bb’s. And the hop up adjustment on airsoft guns is a cool tunning device when you mess with them and learn how they work. And you can get some airsoft guns that fire with respectable fps.(and I still don’t understand how somebody would want to get hit by a airsoft round ball).
Christmas day we were shooting at beer cans with the .32 gram ammo out of the SD702 at 25 yards and we were destroying the center 2 inches of the can, now through both sides of the can. Standing up shooting freehand. It was the first time my brother shot a airsoft gun and he was amazed. But he is one of those type if it aint accurate it aint no fun. So for him to be amazed with the airsoft gun is amazing to me.
My brother actualy has I believe the model 84 or 86 Beretta.
But he brought this bb pistol over yesterday and I got to shoot it also. He got it for his daughters wich are pretty well the same age as my daughters to practice with and get familiar with the gun so they can shoot the bullet firing pistol. He got it at wally world so I dont know if it is the exact gun your testing. But I had no proplem with the trigger at all. It seemed pretty good to me and the gun was fairly accurate. But the 702 could way out shoot it. I know ones a pistol and ones a rifle. But one of them is also a airsoft gun.
So I know the Avanti 499 steel bb gun is a yes. But now Im staring to lean to the airsoft guns for the plinking type shooting because they are tunable and there is more choice of ammo. They kind of resemble pellet gun shooting to me but on a diferent scale. And everything that Im shooting through the airsoft guns is Biodegradable. And I know this for sure the airsoft guns are definatly quieter than all the other guns. And after Im through shooting my PCP guns and the Shoebox is filling up the 4500 psi Bengamin buddy bottle I shoot the airsoft guns to pass the time if I want to continue shooting.
What would be a positive thing about the steel bb pistol or guns over the airsoft guns that I aint seeing?
GF1,
There is no advantage, if you know as much about airsoft guns as you seem to know. This gun is for BB gunh shooters. But a good airsoft gun can be incredibly accurate, as you are finding out.
B.B.
BB
I’m just trying to learn a new ball game doing the airsoft guns. Its just like anything else you do. Some kind of problem pops up and you try to learn how to over come it.
And just like anything I have done. It seems when I actually got my hands on if you will. I will learn about something more thoroughly if I’m doing it myself. I don’t mean to seem like a know it all. But if I have experienced it I can only say what has happened to me.
And yes the airsoft guns are more accurate than I imagined.
For me it’s just a question of not getting into a whole new sport. I’m not getting any electric guns, I already have one and don’t like the sound it makes at all.
So I’m left with CO2 and green gas… So I’d have to get green gas and a bunch of airsoft BB’s on top of everything I already have for BB and pellet shooting.
Being in Canada and having a smaller market there’s less stuff available for us to have the all black stuff it has to shoot over 366fps but if it’s bought from the US it has to have that ugly orange blaze tip.
So add those up and I’m sticking to airguns.
J-F
J-F
I know what you mean about more expenses.
But the TSD 702 sniper gun is a spring gun only. You don’t have to use Co2 or anything else. Just load 30 airsoft balls into the magazine with the speed loader that comes with the gun and your ready to shoot. That seriously only takes not even 10 seconds to load the magazine. And the gun comes with 2 magazines and a adjustable bi-pod also. So you have to come up with $109.00 and 10 bucks or so for 4000 bio balls if you want to go that route. And the regular airsoft balls are cheaper.
And no I don’t work for PA. So no I ain’t trying to sell the product for them. I’m just saying what it is. Probably only certain people would be interested in airsoft. But I just find it another thing to learn about shooting.
I know, that why I was interested in your sniper rifle last time you talked about it. The orange tip is easy to conceal too.
The thing is this seems to be a very slippery slope (for me anyways 😉 ) and I don’t want to get hooked to another hobby. Appart from the other expenses I’ll join another forum and look for another blog (even if I highly doubt I’ll ever find something better than this one).
I don’t have the fund OR the time to embark on a journey into another hobby.
I already have a few spring powered airsoft pistols some good, some crappy. One leaking green gas pistol and an electric rifle that is a ball to shoot but makes some noises I just can stand.
J-F
J-F
You have more experience with airsoft than I do. And I think I will only get one more airsoft gun. That’s going to be the Tanfoglio Gold. I want it for inside doing the rapid fire practice. Well and maybe some closer range outside target practice with the pistol. I like the idea of a machine gun in airsoft but I think I’m going to keep the guns practical so they relate to the kind of shooting I do. So the machine gun wont happen. And there is so many more pellet guns that I still want. So yes I’m going to save the money for the pellet guns and maybe a few certain bb guns also.
But you said you have some spring guns and a green gas gun. Did you like the performance of the green gas gun when it was working? And what about the good spring pistol you have. How is it to shoot?
Seasons Greetings J-F
I don’t know if you are aware that a couple of major Canadian on-line airgun dealers have just recently added the Benjamin Marauder synthetic stock to their respective lineups. I had heard through the grapevine awhile back, the RCMP was allowing shrouded barrels to be sold in Canada, however the baffles have to be removed. Sort of two steps forward and one step back, but we are still ahead by one step. I remember you lamenting that the Marauder was not being sold in Canada in the past, so now is your chance my friend. The fact this gun is now for sale in Canada, confirms the information I had heard a while back.
I hope you had a great Christmas, and had lots of goodies under the tree. All the best in the new year to you and yours.
Ciao
Titus
Thanks Titus, greetings to you and your family too.
Yes I’ve seen that the Marauder rifle will now be sold up here too. I will need my PAL first but I think it may just be the ticket to push me over and make me get it!
Wonder why they’re not selling the .177? I’ve only seen the .22 and .25 for sale.
It’s a bit expensive here too, wonder if we can buy it in the US and remove the baffles ourselves… and what I found surprising is nothing is made to keep the buyer from putting them back??? It’s not like it’s hard to buy! Maybe we’ll finally be getting a relaxation towards shrouded barrels and silencers?!?
J-F
BB,
I’m not an airsoft fan, but the idea of airsoft hop–up by imparting backspin on the projectile has me wondering if this principle would work to increase accuracy on a bb gun?
Do you know if this has ever been tried?
Les
Desertdweller
/Dave brought that up one time when we was talking about the hop up on airsoft. He had a idea that I think could work. If I remember right he was going to drill and tap the hole with some threads then thread in a piece of rubber o-ring or something to make a adjustable hop up for a steel bb gun.
You never know. That could be a big game changer for steel bb’s if it works.
I forgot to say drill and tap a spot in the barrel at some location. (and maybe the location would matter also) Look at the smooth twist barrel on the FX brand guns. Only like the last 2 or so inches of the barrel is rifled. So maybe that location would be good for what /Dave was talking about.
I’m actually going to do that with a new 760 that I bought a while back. It scatters bbs pretty well at 9 yds, so I’m thinking it’ll be a good candidate. I hope to accomplish that soon since I have a week off now that Christmas is over. Does anyone know where the bumper is located on an airsoft hop up? I’m thinking close to the muzzle and on top of the barrel but I don’t have one to look at to be sure.
I also just received my Maccari spring for my LG55 so I can get that back together too. I just need to decide whether or not to install a greased thrust washer set on one end or use Teflon. I also got some buttons for the piston while I was at it. Might not have the report done by the end of the year, but soon…
/Dave
/Dave
The one on my rifle is a little over half way up the distance of the barrel closer to the muzzle end. And I haven’t had the gun apart but I seen pictures of the hop up. It looks to me like it hits the top of the airsoft ball. Which makes the most sense I would think. That would put more up spin on the ball.
If you watch any of the airsoft sniper rifle videos of them test shooting the guns at targets some of the people have ridiculous amount of hop up dialed in. It looks like the ball rises like a foot and a half after its straight flight path. So they are out shooting the range of their gun or they ain’t quiet got the concept of the hop up yet.
But I want to know for sure what happens when you try it.
Yeah, I was thinking about an inch from the end, but I guess I could try a couple of locations while I’m at it. It would be a lot easier to deburr the inside if it was closer to one end or the other…
/Dave
I think I would put it closer to the end of the barrel that way the bb has time to accelerate going down the barrel. Then when it does exit it has a higher amount of spin when it leaves the barrel. Maybe wouldn’t have to hit the bb as hard with the hop up and would help keep the FPS higher on the bb when it exits.
Les,
I’m pretty sure it hasn’t been tied.
B.B.
BB
Back to the gun your testing. When I shot the one my brother brought over yesterday I believe it was the same one as what your testing here. The magazine looks the same also. So I’m pretty sure it is the same gun.
But the trigger on his seemed pretty good to me. Do you think the triggers could very that much from gun to gun when they are producing them?
I know on my Benjamin .25 and .177 cal. Marauders that both triggers feel identical.
GF1,
The difficulty may be in how each of us defines a good trigger. I define it as one that breaks with glass-rod crispness and has no overtravel. A good single stage trigger can do that. Ask Kevin, who has tested the trigger on my Wilson Combat .45.
The trigger on this gun has a long first stage that stacks towards the end and then releases. It feels like a good double action pull, despite being a single-stage trigger.
B.B.
Good point BB.
The trigger on my brothers Beretta (the firearm version) has to be cocked then the first time the trigger is pulled it acts like a double action I guess. All the shots fired after that are like a single action trigger. But it is like what you just said. But at the end it feels the hardest but breaks good.
I guess what I meant was the trigger on the bb pistol that I shot yesterday felt similar to the firearm trigger. But maybe not quite as hard or defined. So maybe that’s why the BB pistol seems easier to pull the trigger to me since I’m trying to compare it to the firearm.
I think maybe the way we define is the same. Its just hard to compare with out actually touching the guns to actually feel what happens. That’s what is hard sometimes to do in words when your trying to explain what something feels like.
That’s like the trigger on my 1720T I was almost afraid to take that trigger apart to see what the pieces look like. The trigger is just way good. I messed with alot of the different Crosman/Benjamin pistol grip assembly’s and none compare to the way the trigger feels on the 1720T. The frame is the same as the others. But inside its like the Marauder pistol frame/trigger but the1720T is just way better if I shoot the guns side by side. I tryed to adjust the Marauder pistol to match and it just wont do it. I really need to look at them both to see where the magic’s at but I think I should just leave well enough alone this time around.
B.B.,
New topic,two questions.
1) Any thoughts/time line on a Diana P1000 review?
2) Could you comment on pros/cons of buying a RWS 34 versus a Diana 34?
JGC
JGC,
I have already shot the Diana PCP. It’s a fine gun and very accurate, but nothing special for the price. I may eventually test it.
Edith tells me that the Diana 34 doesn’t have fiberoptic sights. That would be a reason to get one over the RWS model.
B.B.