I’m sorry — What are you trying to do?

by Tom Gaylord, a.k.a. B.B. Pelletier

I was getting ready to go to the range yesterday to shoot several airguns for this blog. When I go to the range, I usually try to take a couple of firearms along, just to justify the time and inconvenience of loading the truck and driving all the way out there. The range doesn’t cost anything, but the time spent getting there, setting up and getting back home again seems like an expense.

Anyway, I decided to take my Desert Eagle .357 Magnum pistol along this time, to find a good long-range cartridge for it. Up to this point, I’ve just function-fired the gun for a couple hundred shots or so at shorter distances because I read on the internet that this gun is unreliable with lighter bullets. Well, I’ve shot only 125-grain bullets that are considered light for a .357 Magnum, and to date the gun has never malfunctioned once. So, that much of what I read turned out not to be true!

Monday morning, I’m was online looking for some good accurate loads, and this is what I found:

“I don’t own a Desert Eagle .357, but I have read that they are unreliable boat-anchors. They are way too heavy and they recoil too hard! I don’t need that. They also cost three times as much as my Taurus wheelgun. Why would I spend that kind of money, just to have a gun that jams?”

So, you DON’T own a Desert Eagle? Then why are you commenting on its performance? I’m all for open discussions; but when you don’t have any experience, why not just say what you’ve heard and ask whether or not it’s true?

I DO own a .357 Magnum Desert Eagle and here are the facts. They DON’T kick very hard. They feel about like a 1911 pistol shooting Plus P ammo when they shoot full-house .357 loads. And they DON’T malfunction! At least mine has never failed to feed — ever! They ARE heavy, but I don’t find it debilitating to carry a 5-lb. pistol from my truck to the firing line — a distance of about 20 feet.

Then, I found another website with guy who lists all the factory ammo brands that don’t work well in his Desert Eagle. Excuse me, but who said anything about shooting factory ammo? I reload! Why would I care if one brand that does function costs more than another brand that has feeding failures? I’m going to make up loads for my gun that ALL WORK. Who buys an expensive handgun like a Desert Eagle and then shops in discount stores for the cheapest ammo? That’s like going to a 5-star restaurant and looking for their dollar menu. If you want to save money so bad, cut a slot in your head and become a bank.

Finally I find the worst one of all. I swear I am not making this up:

“When I shoot targets, I shoot Winchester White Box (a type of commercial ammo) in my DE. It’s the cheapest stuff I can find locally. I used to shoot some Lapua imported stuff that was really accurate, but it cost a lot more than the U.S. stuff. I can’t tell you how accurate any of this is, but most of the really hot stuff cycles the action fine.”

WHAT!!??

Is the last writer shooting his gun just to hear the sound? Is it News Year’s Eve and this is his noisemaker? What is he doing? He says he shoots targets, but he can’t tell me how accurate any of the ammo is. Is he closing his eyes when he shoots? Does he just shoot at the targets and then never looks to see if he hits them?

Applying this to airguns
I know what this guy is really trying to say, but he can’t find the words. He’s saying that he uses his Desert Eagle as a bragging-rights gun, and he doesn’t care how accurate it is. He doesn’t shoot it to hit things — he wants to be seen shooting it and to be able to tell his buddies that he shoots a Desert Eagle.

I’ve seen enough guys like this at the range to know what I’m talking about. A couple weeks ago, a man at my range was warning everybody on the line that he was about to shoot a .300 Winchester Magnum, and everyone should be careful of the blast! When he shot his rifle, it was anticlimactic because the guy next to me had been shooting a 7mm Remington Magnum for the previous hour that made just as much noise. But Mister Win Mag wanted to be noticed, and he needed to draw attention to the fact that his rifle was a tactical nuclear weapon!

And this is how it applies to airguns. These same folks buy those 1,600 f.p.s. breakbarrel cannons and shoot ultralight lead-free pellets in them. If they do shoot at anything specific, they aren’t paper targets — they’re probably metal plates. Then, they can determine how much mild steel their pellet gun is able to penetrate, and at what distance.

Everything they do is a weird science experiment. They’re the ones who wind up on You Tube with blood pouring out of their ears while their friends laugh maniacally in the background.

That’s not airgunning! That’s being back in the fourth grade and trying to light…well, you know what I mean. And if you don’t, you’re probably still doing it. And you aren’t reading this blog, either, because people like that don’t read much of anything longer than the label on a beer can or a juicy tweet on Twitter.

I shoot airguns to augment my shooting experience. And the point of that experience is to maintain and perhaps improve my shooting skills. Small groups are important to me, but so is standing on my feet and shooting the center of a target offhand — as I have done in front of witnesses several times.

I’m in this game to place my shots where I call them, or to know that I haven’t whenever something goes wrong. I’m in this partly to keep my shooting skills sharp and partly to find guns and pellets that can shoot better than I can.

And that’s what’s behind all my reviews. Sure, I like a nice trigger; but without accuracy, a good trigger is like a rusted-out car that has a deep, resonating tone coming from the tailpipe. HEY — I once owned a VW bug with a stinger exhaust that was just like that! It sounded like an expensive sports car and ran like a model A Ford delivery truck.

So, manufacturers, I am warning you here and now — send me your guns and you can expect me to shoot them for accuracy first, and all other things second. I will use every trick I know to make your guns shoot well…and with luck, they will. But if they don’t after I’ve exhausted all attempts to the best of my ability, you can expect me to tell everyone about how it really performed.

So, send me your mega-magnums. Just make sure they’re also accurate. Send me your gilt-edged light sabers, but expect me to turn them on and attempt to use them. I can put up with a lot of things when I shoot, but missing the target because my gun is throwing curveballs isn’t one of them.

The lesson of the wise barber
The wise barber said you can cut a man’s hair every month, but you can only scalp him once. Marketing departments and airgun manufacturers need to internalize this wisdom because putting a bone-jarring air rifle into a customer’s hands may be the ticket to losing him forever. On the other hand, give him a gun so good he’ll want more, and you have created a loyal customer. His business won’t just be worth the $300 he spends today, but tens of thousands of dollars that he’ll spend with you over the next 40 years as he enjoys his hobby.

98 Responses to “I’m sorry — What are you trying to do?”

  • Kevin Wilmeth Says:

    You seem to have had a series of trying times and pressures, of late. May whatever is in the air, sort itself out! (I suspect I don’t speak only for myself when I add “…I’ll be here regardless.”)

    It does seem like it’s getting easier and easier to step in vast quantities of Teh Stupid without really even trying. I like to think of it as one of the predictable byproducts of a free market; the smell of freedom is the smell of all the drek you have to push to the side to get at the things that are worthwhile.

    For my money, I think that the late Jeff Cooper summed up one of your primary points as well as anyone I’ve ever read: “The purpose of shooting is hitting.” Amen.

  • Bob from Oz Says:

    G’day BB
    Your 5lb pistol or any firearm.
    Randy Wakeman wrote on recoil these words of wisdom…
    “Confusing the issue with common sense, the first stop is physics. Shotgun weight affects recoil on approximately a “one-to-one” ratio. Add 10% to a specific shotgun’s weight, it kicks about 10% less. Lighten our shotgun by about 10%; it kicks about 10% more. That’s all there is to it.

    Muzzle velocity and ejecta (wad, shot, etc.) both affect recoil approximating a “two-to-one” ratio. Bump up the muzzle velocity by 10%, recoil increases by 20%. Increase our payload by 10%, again the free recoil goes up about 20%. That also, is about as simple as it gets. There are all kinds of ballistic programs that will give you a number to go along with it, if you need it, but that’s about all there is from a “free recoil” standpoint. The matter of “felt” recoil is subjective, and most anything can be claimed in that department–and has been.
    Cheers Bob

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      Bob,

      I find it interesting that you talk about free recoil and felt recoil. The Desert Eagle is gas-operated, so the recoil impulse lasts a longer period of time that does the impulse of a revolver.

      I have always maintained that the M1 Garand doesn’t kick much, but the 1903 Springfield kicks very hard. Both use the same cartridge. And I read in an article that both had the identical amount of free recoil. But the Garand, being gas-operated, has a longer recoil moment, compared to the bolt-action Springfield that puts everything into the first hard punch.

      And there is the fact that the Desert Eagle is heavy, and that does absorb recoil.

      Thanks,

      B.B.

      • Willmore Says:

        I’ve shot several DE handguns up through .50AE and I never found the recoil bothersome. Sure, the amount of recoil–in the sense that you integrate force over time–is a function of the cartridge and barrel, but that only starts to matter if you’re firing an anti-tank weapon. As long as the energy is spread out over enough time, the recoil from even a large shell can be easily tolerated.

        I’ll skip the physics and the math because it didn’t go over well last time, but the nature of a gas or spring recoil firearm allows them to handle recoil much more gracefully than a rigid frame firearm. It’s easy to test, take a .44Mag revolver for a spin and then try a DE with the exact same round. I know which one I’d rather use to make holes in paper.

      • Wulfraed Says:

        And I consider the 9mm Parabellum to be more unpleasant than the .40S&W…

        Granted, the initial feeling could be from the mass difference between an alloy frame (second gen) S&W 459 and the steel frame (third gen) S&W 4006… But then consider that my nightstand gun is the polymer framed first gen Walther P99! (Strangely, imported/distributed by Walther — and I believe may have been the starting point for what is now the M&P semi)

        To my hands, the 9mm “snaps” while the .40S&W “pushes”.

  • Slinging Lead Says:

    BB

    It is good to know that behind your calm cool exterior lurks a boiling mad furious eternal skeptic, but whenever you write these rants I really begin to worry that my negativity is rubbing off on you. It warms my heart nonetheless.

    If these people spent half the time shooting that they do futilely pecking at their keyboard they just might have something half intelligible to say. I see it on the forums all the time. This blog should be titled “I am sorry– you’re a damned idiot.”

    I used to mountain bike quite alot before I got fat and lazy. I would sometimes find people on the side of the trail broken down and cursing their equipment. The $100 bikes from Walmart weren’t working out for them. They have now had a bad experience and will likely never try cycling again. However, these were usually the same people that after I had spent my precious time fixing their problems with their bikes, would ride off without so much as a “Thank You.” So there it is. Some people are deserving of all the disappointment and misery that befalls them. Any counseling I try and give about the merits of better equipment are wasted breath on these mouth breathers.

    You can lead a horse to water, but you can’t force it to drink. Especially if they are as dumb as dirt.

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      SL,

      Well said! I mean the comment about the cyclists failing to thank you after you fixed their bikes.

      Maybe that is what differentiates wise and stupid people? The wise are aware of much more than just what they are doing.

      B.B.

  • Gunfun1 Says:

    BB
    What you described ain’t just in the gun world.

    I have flown my RC planes in clubs. Raced motocross and scramble tracks with dirt bikes. Did road racing in the Sport Car Club of America. Did the Fastest Street Car Shootout in Drag racing with cars in different classes through out the years when it was active.

    Alot of people are just like what you described. Somebody is going to brag or show off in what ever sport or event your in. Some will even go as far as stirring trouble with you to get you thrown out if they feel your a threat. I have been there when they tryed pulling that with me.

    And I even think I have a problem here on the blog. I cant write what my mind thinks correctly. The brain and hand wont connect right for some reason. If you were to meet me in person at a event or competition I’m actually pretty laid back and quiet. I don’t and will not go and say my car is going to beat yours or mine is better. In fact all through my life my cars, motorcycles, airplanes and guns were always the under dogs of the event. But I put alot of time into what I showed up with behind the scenes that people didn’t know about. And by no means I was the rich kid.(I bought my first car with my grass cutting money I earned and sold my Suzuki RM 125 that I raced to help by it).

    All my stuff I had was put together with the stuff I could verily afford. And I tryed to pick the right stuff when I was putting that project together. My $3000 cars where competing with $150,000 or more cars and winning a fair amount of times.

    But the biggest thing is I always was there to have fun. And if I could help somebody I did. Matter of fact one of the things I did is I gave a guy a U-joint to fix his car so he could be ready to run the final round. Guess who he was racing. Me. And he won. But you know what after the event was over he came over and offered me some of the winning money and he wanted my family to go to dinner with his family. We did go to eat with them and No I didn’t take any money and we had a really good time that night.

    So you know what BB I don’t even worry about those kind of people, haven’t worried about them and ain’t going to worry about them. Matter of fact I started laughing when I was reading today’s blog.

    But your right people do brag when they have something interesting to show. I guess its all about how you brag that makes the difference. Well again I guess that why I picked Gunfun1. I get tired of shit to but what can you do.

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      GF1,

      You nailed it! It’s the type of person who determines the outcome. The guy who took you to dinner was a real gentleman. He knew how the world turns. As opposed to those who must win at all costs. Their cost of winning is great, for in doing so, they lose themselves.

      B.B.

  • RidgeRunner Says:

    Dude. What was that in your Corn Flakes? I hope you come to Roanoke next year and I remember this so I can hear “the rest of the story”.

    Back in the mid 80′s I owned a .357 DE. I liked it, but I had two issues with it, one minor and one major. The minor issue I had was magazine capacity. The major issue I had with it was it would unexpectedly turn into a machine pistol. If it had a 20 round magazine and I could have controlled when it went rock ‘n’ roll, I would have kept it. I went back to my 1911.

    This is why I like this forum. You will tell us how it is. You may not take us by the hair and rub our nose in it and say “Hey Stupid, can you smell it now?!”, but like you said, those guys cannot read. As an example, I was on another forum and a guy was asking for Talon P owners to post pictures of 50 yard targets. He was considering buying one and wanted to know how it performed at those ranges. No one posted any pictures for days and then I posted a link to your review of it. He replied that he did not read the various blogs such as yours because the companies are just trying to sell their air guns. I replied it was his loss.

    You may use better language to express yourself than some, but you do tell it like it is. Thanks.

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      RR,

      I never would have figured you for a DE owner. And a .357 to boot!

      I dislike the heavy trigger, but the light recoil cancels that in spades. Now, if I could just get the thing to shoot!

      B.B.

      • RidgeRunner Says:

        I had a .44 Mag for a short while also. I have never fooled with the .50 though.

      • Matt61 Says:

        Are you having accuracy problems with your Desert Eagle? If it’s reliable and the recoil is light, I would think that it’s doing at least okay even without a tailored load.

        Matt61

    • Gunfun1 Says:

      RR
      Bad night at work. Had to fix something because of somebody’s stupidity.

      They are one of those people that always do and don’t ask. They screw stuff up and get themselves in trouble over and over. And you know what comes out of their mouths all the time. (I thought) You know what the first thing is that comes out of my mouth. No you didn’t. Look what we are doing right now.

      And of course perfect timing with BB’s blog.

  • triniair Says:

    BB
    This post to me appears to about the frustration of the M16 lookalike. What people enter a new field for is out being inexperience and curiosity the sales department takes advantage of this by marketing products with a lot of noise no action. This result in primarily three types of customers (1)the ones who endures and learn the field and appreciates it. (2) the one who quits after a bad first experience (3) the one who remains and brag about the noise of the product makes. Just when the airgun industry is growing globally we are flooded with inferior stuff

  • TargetShot Says:

    Hey BB,
    Always enjoyed your articles of airguns, I think it is most informative. I do agree with some of your rants in past articles and in some parts this article, however, far as reloading ammo for firearms, I cannot agree with you since I live in an apartment complex. Ammo reload operation in an apartment is dangerous not to mention there is no way to control temperature fluctuations, and storage issues of supplies of gun powder and other explosive materials. Always remember their are people for one reason or another that we can’t or aren’t allowed to make ammo reloads, never assume. I rely on ammo reviews of others to find a good reliable cheap available commercial ammo for me to shoot. Anyhow, I enjoy your articles rants and all. Thanks you for your hard work, I appreciate it.

    • Fred DPRoNJ Says:

      Targetshot,

      I don’t understand why you feel it’s too dangerous to reload in an apartment complex. I don’t think it’s anymore danagerous than re-loading in one’s basement or attached garage. For those who are single, I’m sure the kitchen table has been put to good use on occassion. Plus there are kits as well as stands you can buy if you’re short on space to have a reloading bench. A pound of powder plus a brick of small or large pistol primers and you’re good to go. Just don’t set off a primer when you’re seating it :)

      Fred DPRoNJ

    • /Dave Says:

      TS,

      I would think that the noise of reloading would be harder to deal with in an apartment. The press noise travels through structures, but can be compensated for. There are many apartment dwellers who reload. The storage of smokeless powder is no more dangerous than storing a bottle of rubbing alcohol or some common kitchen cleaning chemicals. For instance, ammonia mixed with some caustic cleaners results in a form of phosgene gas. Smokeless powder only burns unless it is contained and the gases can build pressure. The containers that it comes in have been designed to burst long before that critical pressure has been reached. So really, it is just another fuel, which burns really well. Primers come in trays designed to not let them go off all at once. They are spaced so that one going off won’t set the others off. Any safety convoys person will not store his primers and powder together anyway and will separate them by 10 feet or so. In an apartment fire there are other more hazardous items that people live with and don’t even think about. Natural gas being another. Anyway, you get the idea. It isn’t as dangerous as people are led to believe. Of course, if your landlord forbids it, that’s another matter entirely…

      /Dave

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      TargetShot,

      You are goading me into doing a blog on the ease of reloading!

      I also write for “Shotgun News”, and this month I have a feature article that has a sidebar on reloading. People say components are impossible to find. Yet I have purchased 20,000 primers and more than 20 pounds of powder in the past 4 months.

      They say brass is impossible to find, yet I have picked up 2,000 cases at the range this year, just for the .223 Remington I now shoot. And yesterday a local SWAT team member took my phone number because he wants to give me 1,000 more cases — for free!

      I guess what I’m saying is, “Where there’s a will, there’s a way.” I reload in my living room, with tools that I store in the garage, out of the way. My component storage occupies about a quarter of one closet. If I can stand the climate, so can the primers and powder.

      I do buy and shoot commercial ammo, too, but only when it is a super bargain buy. And when the ammo shortage hit, I was not affected by it.

      B.B.,

      • Richard Says:

        Please do…
        A nice, long series of articles.

        On the topic of this Blog…
        I’m a self-admitted Cheapskate…
        (Remember my comment about the Thousand Dollar Thousand Yard Gun?)
        (I shoot mostly 7.62×39… I may even get that 1000-yard shot done with it.)
        My good friends call me frugal.

        But the game for me is doing it without “buying it”, while others are satisfied with spending tons of money to “get it,” without earning it.

        I could drop 10 grand on a rifle, put it on a sandbag and get the 1000-yard shot done in 1 or 2 shots. What fun is that?

        I came back here looking for info on Extreme Spread.
        (Yeah, I broke down and bought a Chrony. Not for the MRod. I want to develop my own BC for the cheap Russian ammo out of my CZ. The standard ballistic tables and calculators don’t work for me.)
        But, since I have the Chrony, I’ve been running pellets over it…
        My personal opinion is that “Focus” is more important than Velocity when it comes to Small Groups…
        Yeah, the POI changes slightly with velocity drop, but based on the first shot, adjust…
        (Throwing out a little bragging (more about the fact that the MRod IS better than me)… .082 C-2-C at 50′.)
        I don’t seem to see any correlation between larger group size and velocity from 3000 down to 2000 PSI. I have seen what appears to be a “sweet spot” with the second group of 10 shots, but the data doesn’t back it up. I get 50 shots and I’m usually at around 2125 PSI when I refill.

        And one last comment: I really so get tired of seeing people brag about Group Size when the Group is “miles” away from the Bull! (I understand that you sometimes more you POI so you keep the Bull clean as your POA.) It should be about hitting the Bull (or Vitals), not small groups away from the X…

  • 103David Says:

    Having spent the requisite time on the firing line—you and many of this blog ‘s readers know what the “firing-line” means…places ranging from holiday retail-sales work to locales where your targets actually shoot back at you…) I try and remember a few simple life…observations;
    “Gas-Bags are easy to puncture, but you shouldn’t too often as they have a certain entertainment value.”I think it Frank Luke that said that.
    “As a matter of honor, avoid engaging in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent,” which has been attributed to many ranging from Winston Churchill, to Oscar Wilde, to Dorothy Parker, but I seem to recall the earliest reference was our old friend, Will Shakespeare.
    And my personal favorite, short, sweet and equally as useable on oneself as others, “Life has a tendency to be its own revenge,” which I think could possibly be a quote from me, since I can find no one else to attribute it to. Feel free to us it as is appropriate :)
    Happy Holidays:)

  • J-F Says:

    It’s like people buying CO2 action pistol, they want blowback but complain about how much CO2 it uses.
    We can all relate, we see this in all spheres of activities.
    You just do your stuff and not worry or listen to these people.

    J-F

  • chasblock Says:

    Wow, did this blog ever hit home with me today. I don’t frequent the powder burner forums, even though I shoot pistols regularly to qualify to carry for my job. But I do read the air gun forums. A lot.

    Some folks ALWAYS have to get their 2-cents in about anything, whether they know about the subject or not. The guy who has a cousin who knows a guy who works with his uncle who has a buddy that owns something or other, always has a huge opinion about something that he’s overly willing to share, even though he may have not even SEEN the gun.

    EVERYONE says *that gun* is a piece of crap! Yeah? really? Who said that? Of course, we all know the answer to that one–he can’t cite ONE instance where someone actually said that.

    All these things now make me chuckle, just a bit. Followed by a sigh and slow nodding of my head in a negative manner. I now read the forums (especially a particularly popular colored forum) with a HUGE grain of salt. What? You’re going to review a gun AFTER you made 535 modifications to it, so that it doesn’t even resemble what came out of the factory? Good for you, but it does me, and hundreds of others no good whatsoever. I’m glad you’re an outstanding airgunsmith, but I’m not going to so much as even change a seal. I want to shoot a stock gun, not something that someone has tinkered with.

    Now, don’t get me wrong, I’m happy for the folks who take their hobby to the extreme, if that’s what rocks your boat, good for you. You want to go down to the tavern and brag to the boys about your conquests? So be it. I can easily ignore you.

    Let’s all keep it real folks, this is a great hobby enjoyed by a lot of different people. But let’s limit our opinions to those things we’ve touched, felt, shot or otherwise have a PERSONAL experience with.

    Thanks B.B., for keeping things on a real level. This is one place I can get FACTS, both from you and from the fine folks who comment on this blog.

    Happy Holidays to all!

  • Robert From Arcade Says:

    I understand , where I live (NY) so much stupid along with non-answers to explain it, is forced upon us on a daily basis that if someone from Texas like you came here, you’d probably instantly implode. As for the airgun world , I could site many examples. Hell there is a guy who runs a forum about Diana airguns who regularly spouts information about hunting with them ,but hasn’t, NOT EVER !Then there are the ones who do something ONCE and declare themselves knowledgeable. As the old gunsmith who lived next to us when I was a dumb urchin used to say, ” once don’t mean nothin”.

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      Robert,

      Funny you should say that, because it actually happened to me in 2009. I was traveling to the Catskills in New York to film “American Airgunner” once each month and one month we had a .22 LR AR-15 lookalike from Umarex to test. It had a magazine that held more than 10 shots and everybody was regarding it like it was unlicensed nuclear material! I had never heard of such a thing, of course, and was amused at their reaction to a large capacity magazine. But by the end of the week, I was feeling guilty about the hi-cap mag, too.

      B.B.

      • Robert From Arcade Says:

        Tom: Back in 2009 your 10 rd mag wasn’t illegal, today it is thanks to the passage of NY’s UN-SAFE Act last year in response to the Sandy Hook murders. If you had such a thing now you could face a fine, six months in jail , and your weapons ,(ALL of them!) would be confiscated. You are allowed only 7 rounds in your ten round mag , except at a certified range . So if you come here (and I would recommend that you avoid that) do not mis-count!

    • Gunfun1 Says:

      ” once don’t mean nothin”

      Ain’t that the truth.

  • zimbabwaeed Says:

    Kevin, Roger Ascham wrote toxophilus, the first good book about archery in 1545. In this book, he writes-”The chief point in shooting is to hit the mark”. This has been known by real shooters since projectile weapons ( of all kinds) were invented. It has also been ignored by those who use weapons as status symbols-My rock is bigger than yours, my spear is longer than yours, etc. and now -my gun is more expensive, my gun shoots faster, etc. We are fortunate in having a blog like this and owe a debt of gratitude to BB for shining the light of truth on guns and separating the good ,accurate ones from the status symbols. Ed

    • Kevin Wilmeth Says:

      I love tidbits like that. It wouldn’t surprise me if Col. Cooper had read that archery book himself.

      And a big +1 on the idea that we’re fortunate to have this space, both because of all the obvious Tom & Edith factors, and also because of what Claire Wolfe calls the “commentariat”. It’s hard to put a value on good information, which kinda starts at “priceless” and goes up from there, but there seems to be an enormous amount of that floating around these parts, which makes it very easy to stick around. (Let’s be direct here: a resource like this makes being a noob an absolute joy.)

      I suspect all of us get caught, from time to time, in committing too soon to “something we know“. I’m absolutely sure (irony meter!) that’s true for me, even though I try very hard to avoid it, on account of it bothers the snot out of me. (If I’m going to make myself look like a buffoon, I want it to be on purpose, and I sure don’t want to miss the fun of doing it!)

      Watching B.B. back up and “take himself out of the equation” by reverting to a comparison against a known rifle/ammo combination (as he did recently with the gas-piston breakbarrel AR), just to make sure he hasn’t forgot how to shoot suddenly, is a great reminder for a noob to observe. It’s not the first time I’ve seen him do this on this blog, and it is always notable. As well, it seems obvious enough that he is always well grounded in the whole context of what he is trying to do, which is sometimes not just an important detail, but The Point Entire. “Sure, I like a nice trigger; but without accuracy, a good trigger is like a rusted-out car that has a deep, resonating tone coming from the tailpipe.” Absolutely! (I found myself wondering if he wasn’t talking about the Tanfoglio Airsoft pistol with that comment.)

      I am reminded that it is much easier to specialize than to generalize, and it seems like lots of Teh Stupid is simply rooted in an unhealthy fixation on some tiny part of the whole. Like “that guy” who wants everyone to see his sub-MOA 500 yard benchrest groups with the New! Lazer-Flat! .300 Galactic Magnum!, who then misses an entire deer standing still at 100. You saw it: the deer was not spooked, he had plenty of time to sling up, or take a jackass rest, or at least sit down and use his body to steady himself…but instead he just stood right there, threw the rifle up to his shoulder, yanked on the trigger, cursed as he only then remembered to disengage the safety…and then reshouldered the rifle and blew up a tree stump about fifty yards downrange.

      The guy may be perfectly nice, and that benchrest group may be perfectly legitimate, but it’s pretty clear what he cares about most. At that point it might be well to ask: does that matter?

      That may be what B.B. was getting at with the title of this post. :-)

  • Chris Legate Says:

    Excellent article as always Mr. Gaylord. I had run into this before and I’m not even a stickler when it comes to shooting. A friend of mine bought a HIGH dollar “over and under” shotgun, for skeet, or so he told me. I think, if my thinker is working write, it was even a custom build for his length of pull. Well he never shot it. It resided in a space on his wall. WHAT A waste.

    I have a side question sir. I have a Air Venturi G4 hand pump bought used from PA and it has locked up. It did so after shortening strokes. While I would love to use this as a way to get a bottle, my budget, and my wife, would die from trying. Fixing this is the only way to go for me. PA wants me to sent it back to them, but I don’t want to spend the money to ship it and the money on top of that to fix it. Do you have any advice to pass on here?

    ATB Chris

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      Chris,

      When I worked at AirForce Airguns, one of my duties was to repair the hand pumps that were returned to us. They were being made by Axxor in those days, and the repair parts were complete sets of o-rings. I fixed about one out of every three pumps I worked on.

      You need a clean room and lots of high-temp silicone lubricant for fix a hand pump. I suppose you can get the parts from Sun Optics in Ft. Worth. They claim the pumps are easy to repair, but I currently have two broken pumps in my gun room, awaiting someone to open a pump repair business. If Pyramyd Air says they can fix your pump, I would let them!

      B.B.

    • Paul Says:

      Chris,

      I had the exact same problem with a G4 pump, also. The problem was a check valve in the base of the pump – the spring was broken and that caused the issue. Removing the pump body from the base will give you access to that area. If it is any deeper into the pump I would send it off for repair.

      Paul in Liberty County

  • Beazer Says:

    Mr. BB, GREAT job, Thanx, sir. Run into these same guys everytime I saddle up. All part of a club called the H.A. Not the Hells Angels, they’re wussies compared to these bad mo fo’s. They’re the much feared & dreaded Hells Accountants (said in hushed tone w/appropriate scary music, think Black Widows in Clint Eastwoods, Every Which Way But Loose)!!! Always willin’ ta tell ya why their 75k custom is better than my 25k semi stock H-D. Not as tolerant as the rest of the Gang here, they get told, Didn’t ask & don’t care. Come talk to me after the tags fall off your shiny new leathers, Spanky. Love the pic floatin’ around of Sam Elliot with the quote “You’re just a special kind of stupid, ain’t ya.” Shoot/ride safe, ya’ll.
    Beaz

    • John E. Says:

      Around these parts we call them Tough Guys, the ones who wear shorts too early, cut the sleeves off their shirts and do a burn out at the drop of a hat.

      • J-F Says:

        Hey leave the shorts alone! I still have my sleeves but do enjoy the occasional burnout and I hate pants, I’d wear shorts year round if the climate here allowed it.
        But I don’t own any loud guns. My favorite airgun is a Slavia 618.

        I’m a walking contradiction.

        J-F

  • Fred DPRoNJ Says:

    BB,

    you just lit a lightbulb over me. I reload my handgun ammo but my reason was mainly to save money. It never occurred to me to load and then test to see if my rounds are more accurate than store-bought. I also was under the impression that only bench rest rifle shooting was involved in loading for accuracy. Another world has opened to me.

    To add to the quotes Robert from Arcade stated, my favorite is supposedly attributed to Mark Twain but others have also claimed it: “Never argue with a fool. They’ll just drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience”.

    Fred DPRoNJ

    • Wulfraed Says:

      No… any reloading where you control the variability of the components (even down to weighing the brass cases, sorting by lots, etc., trickling powder, and adjusting seating depth) is likely to produce something more accurate than commercial loads — which have to be sized to function in firearms that may have minimal spec chambers, etc.

      However… the most accurate ammo may not be the most reliable; especially for a semi-auto… (when you are sizing the ammo for the chamber, a semi-auto may jam if some powder residue gets in the way). For a defensive gun, reliability is #1; hitting a four inch circle when aimed at center of mass may be acceptable.

  • kevin Says:

    The internet is a powerful, therefore potentially harmful and sometimes dangerous tool.

    Within an hour of reading information on the internet some folks have convinced themselves that they are experts and start posting their form of gospel on the internet. I’m especially fond of those folks that write a product review right after they’ve unboxed, but not used yet, their new acquisition. NOT!

    Back to airguns…….”What are you trying to do?” is an important question we have to ask ourselves and our airgunning friends if we are to find a common ground for communicating.

    If you want the most powerful springer made for under $200 because you like the recoil and sound but could care less that it can only hit a large skillet at 20 yards consistently THAT’S OK WITH ME. I need to know that though if we’re going to have a relevant conversation.

    If you want accuracy out to 25 yards and easy cocking so your shooting session will be pleasant all day I need to know that before we can talk about the importance of mega power to accomplish this task.

    If you intend to hunt, what do you hunt and at what distances.

    Etc., etc.

    One of my mistakes is in assuming that all airgunners are going to or should use airguns in the same way I do.

    I won’t judge your intended use of your next airgun acquistion but I do need to know “What you are trying to do” to improve the odds of my suggestions being relevant.

    kevin

    • Edith Gaylord Says:

      Kevin,

      One thing I’ve learned the hard way: People who ask for advice don’t necessarily want advice. What they really want is confirmation of what they already believe, and they want you to tell them they’ve already figured out everything.

      Edith

      • kevin Says:

        Edith,

        Spoken like an airgun trooper that has traveled many miles down this path.

        The flip side to this are airgunners that give advice with little to no experience. There’s a guy on another forum that is a prolific poster/advice giver. He’s owned one airgun for 20+ years and is therefore an expert in all things that shoot.

        kevin

  • dangerdongle Says:

    “Cut a slot in your head……”
    LOL! That had me rolling! Of course, they’ve all ready got a slot built-in at the opposite end but their heads are normally stuffed firmly up it.

    The types that really get to me are the ones who try to force their advice on you. There was a gent at the range I used to frequent who assumed I was a n00b because I shot my AR in it’s bone stock configuration. It does not have a collapsible stock (I prefer the A2 style) and, heaven forbid, has a carry handle!!! He couldn’t seem to get it through his thick skull that I had a very specific reason for keeping it that way and made all manner of suggestions as to how it SHOULD be built. He even complained that it wasn’t black!

  • dangerdongle Says:

    dangit.
    That should be ‘already’ not all ready. My kingdom for an edit button!!

  • Michael Says:

    B.B.,

    One of the things that annoys me is unsubstantiated speculation that then spreads as if it were fact. Example: Paul Walker of the Fast and Furious movies dies in a fiery crash in an exotic sports car after attending a charity event he organized for victims of the typhoon in the Philippines.

    Before two or so hours have passed, some major media folks, who have very few facts in front of them to report but air time to fill SPECULATE that he and his friend (who was driving) might have been drag racing another car.

    Oooh. Juicy rumors about the celebrity. But it’s not true. Still, the next day I heard at work person after person repeating the SPECULATION.

    A day later the police investigating the accident say that there was no drag racing involved. One car going too fast for a curve and it hit a pole. Tragic, but a simple story.

    The story (this one is probably correct, however, as pro drivers have written about this in legitimate forums after driving the model) is that the car (unnamed here but it starts with a P and ends with an E) is notorious for erratic and difficult handling and is just sold as a show piece for their millionaire owners to brag about.

    And like certain airguns, it is FAST. 208 miles per hour fast. But if it is almost unusable at even 40 miles per hour, like the inaccurate magnum airgun, so what?

    Who first said it? “Only accurate airguns are interesting.”

    You mention the DE in .357 having an unearned reputation for jamming with light ammo? “I hear that they jam with light ammo.” That is a far cry from, “I have fired one with light ammo and heavy ammo and found it not to jam at all with either.”

    Repeat the untruth (be it speculation or outright lie) enough, and it becomes truth.

    Kennedy said, “Ich bin ein Berliner” at the Brandenburg Gate. Quickly reports circulated that his aides screwed up the translation and instead of “I [too] am a Berliner” Kennedy was actually saying, I am a jelly donut.” (Berliner also refers to a jelly filled pastry in Germany.)

    NOT TRUE! Kennedy’s staff got it right. They consulted someone who spoke excellent English and excellent Berliner-German to translate and write the line for the President. In BERLIN what he said translates to “I [too] am a Berliner” (“one with” the citizens of Berlin). Elsewhere in Germany, Austria, and Switzerland, I do not know — but JFK was standing in front of Berliners and speaking about the city of Berlin. But the false story persists more than does the factual truth.

    For once, just once, I’d like to watch a breaking news report in which the reporter says, “And that is all we know for certain at this time. Anything more would be merely speculation.”

    Michael

    • kevin Says:

      The days of responsible journalism are a fading memory. Especially for the current media.

      Chet Huntley, David Brinkley, Walter Cronkite, etc.

      The media is an Empire that controls the “news”. Sorry for the rant. Just finished reading Mike Wallace’s biography. Scary stuff.

      kevin

      • Robert From Arcade Says:

        Sadly what you say is true and because of that “Empire” as you put it, we have elevated the least common denominator to a position of supposed relevance, and influence.

        • cowboystar dad Says:

          The death of legitimate journalism is indeed painful to watch.
          I remember the 1st Gulf War…and it’s TV coverage (I was just a bit too young to watch Vietnam unfold on the small screen).
          I remember watching Peter Arnett, Bob Simon and Arthur Kent (the Scud Stud) reporting from in the field…bringing the Kuwati and Iraqi deserts into my living room.
          Now what do we have. Cell phone footage from Syrian (and other hotspots)…always with the disclaimer “these are unverified cellphone images that we can in no way verify”.
          I’m not naive enough to think the media never lied to us…but there was time when there was honor amongst journalists (Walter Cronkite and Robert Capa for example) that seems harder to find these days.
          After all, why send (and pay) a true professional into a war zone when you have your pick of cell phone videos being sent to you whose owners are only hoping to get there images on TV, free…for their moment of fame.
          Sad.

          • Wulfraed Says:

            I remember the 1st Gulf War…and it’s TV coverage

            Ah yes… The one that added 5-minutes to the end of the 11PM news, shifting all the late shows to start at 11:35…

            And didn’t go away after the war.

        • John E. Says:

          I try to get my news from people i know who travel frequently, at least it’s more accurate on the social level than the tv or news paper

    • Matt61 Says:

      I heard that the guy driving the car was actually a professional race car driver. Anyway, future editions of this series will be hard to watch, knowing that it doesn’t really happen like in the movies.

      Matt61

  • RB7 Says:

    B.B.,

    I read your blog daily, and much enjoy it and others’ comments.

    Like you, I like shooting and experimenting with most everything, and I’ve been privileged to shoot some fine weapons, from M1 tanks to longbows. Only the accurate ones are interesting. Beyond that, I greatly appreciate lightweight, low recoil, ergonomics, safety, and high quality. And I’d rather shoot and hunt with an antique any day. A weapon must only be powerful enough for it’s purpose. The rest is just noise, weight and recoil. Quiet is important; that’s what first drew me to airguns.

    Unfortunately, my TX200/Hawke scope and I are still at odds. It’s a heavy combination for me, which I would forgive if it was more accurate. On a bright note, I’ve been shooting a HW75 for a few weeks and really enjoy it.

    Hey! I was selected in Dennis Quackenbush’s recent drawing! This will be an adventure!

    Best wishes, hope everyone had a great Thanksgiving,

    RB7

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      RB7,

      Tomorrow’s blog is the TX 200 (the new one) at 50 yards. It is a real eye-opener!

      B.B.

      • Beazer Says:

        Howdy Mr. BB, with all due respect, if this airgunnin’ thing doesn’t work out, you could always write a girls advice column, You, sir, are a masterful TEASE!
        Shoot/ride safe.
        Beaz

      • Gunfun1 Says:

        BB
        I’m ready for some good news. Sounds like you had fun with the TX.

  • cowboystar dad Says:

    This is the reason I find the internet such a conundrum.
    On the one hand it has some of the most opinionated, WRONG information that has ever been put to paper or typed on a keyboard.
    But if you can weed through all the dreck you find gems like this forum/blog.
    Another that I have found for you powderburners is Snipershide.com
    Very much like this…civilized with a wealth of ‘real’ world shooting knowledge.
    Anyhoo…in my area of expertise (I sell imaging equipment to industrial, professional and commercial users) I deal with much of the above all too often.
    My favorite is the camera that is introduced today, and has an expected ship date to retailers of two weeks down the road.
    Guaranteed….GUARANTEED that by tomorrow morning there will be at least a dozen reports on the internet from people listing all of the new units defects…though no one will have one in their hands for at least two weeks.
    The internet is fast becoming a parody of itself.
    Oh, and another thing that also bugs the crap out of me (as you mention). The post that runs…”I just set up my Savage .22LR (or Diana air-rifle) …put on a nice scope and got her all dialed in. Picked up a great deal on (whatever bulk ammo/pellets Wallymart has on sale at the moment) and headed to the range”
    They then go into great detail of it’s ‘accuracy’…which usually isn’t that great but comes with the caveat…”it’s a great price and good enough for plinking”.
    Well…it may be…and I’ve shot enough cheap ammo at tin cans in my time.
    But I sure as heck wouldn’t take up time or space giving a detailed range report on my efforts and expect them to be taken seriously.
    Keep up the great work b.b. And you too Edith, I have a feeling b.b. would be pale shadow of himself without you ;-)

  • John Says:

    I feel I may be guilty about some of this. In particular that new MTR77MP. I don’t have one but I tend to dislike it based on numerous reviews I have seen and or read. Every one of them complained about workmanship and accuracy. Several of them even Noted that these say Crosman, an American company, but are Made in China, which I confirmed by calling Crosman and asking them. From there I could connect the dots from made in china to poor performance and poor workmanship. And I said something about my investigation. (made in china, sloppy workmanship, accuracy not there) Keep in mind I have been behind the trigger of some rifle for most of my life and have shot some of the most exotic rifles a few pistols you may have only seen in movies or video games, And have owned and shot some of the most common rifles out there too. I’ve owned and fired every type of airgun there is from cheap Crosman 760 where I started to Barret .50 caliber sniper rifle, Uzi full auto machine pistol to M2 .50 cal machine gun, to main 105mm M1A2 Abrams tank. So I know guns quite well. So when I have been investigating a gun and several sources have tested the gun and complained about the same things I call it how I am seeing it. I’m not going to waste money on a gun several reviews are calling a poor gun just so I can grumble about a junk gun. Not when I have some of the finest guns in my stable. If I did that I’d have a room full of guns I couldn’t beg a buyer to take off my hands because they were junk. That is a lesson I learned the hard way. I’m still trying to get rid of some junk guns.

    • chasblock Says:

      Nothing wrong with reading reviews, provided of course that those reviews are intelligently written by people who have actually used the product, if not owned it.

      I buy from Amazon quite a bit, and always read the reviews on whatever product I’m intending to buy. I weigh the reviews and frequently make a decision based on a majority of the reviews. It’s just smart buying. But I wouldn’t think of adding to the reviews based solely on reading the reviews.

      To call a product “junk” just because it’s made in China, Taiwan, Viet Nam or Mexico is just plain downright wrong in my opinion. It’s only junk if it doesn’t do what it is supposed to do for as long as it’s supposed to do it.

      If someone is expecting Olympic Grade accuracy from a $200 (or $89) gun, well….they need to adjust their expectations.

      • cowboystar dad Says:

        I too buy a lot on Amazon.
        The reviews I love run like this.
        The product has 50 reviews, 47 of which are 4 and 5 (out of 5).
        But there’s always those one or two 1 star reviews:
        “The package came to my door and the side of the box was crushed. I opened the box and the product was in pieces. I wouldn’t recommend this piece of junk to anyone”
        Really…are they that stupid??

        • John Says:

          I remember when the Crosman M4-177 came out. I went to their web site and looked at the reviews on this gun. There was one kid that claimed he could hit a squirrel 1500 yards out with it and kill it with a head shot using the iron sights that come with the gun. Yeah, right. Even with the very best gun I have and I have some very good ones that is never ever going to happen. However I did manage to kill a squirrel with mine….from 10 feet away with a chest shot while it was climbing my livingroom screen. So there was at least the tiniest bit of truth to that kid’s posting.

        • BG_Farmer Says:

          Those reviews are ludicrous at times. I was buying a tool from Amazon. It was listed multiple times (slightly different descriptions) with prices from ~$45 to $99. The $45 version was panned for shipping mistakes, etc., and the higher priced versions were reviewed more favorably. Some will say, “you get what you pay for”. Maybe, but the model number from the (US) manufacturer was identical! Anyway, when I ask my wife to order the cheapest one (she’s the wizard with Amazon and the other thing), she asks me if I’m sure, because the reviews are really bad! It turned out fine, and I bought another tool with the money I saved between the “best” one and the “cheapest one :)!

      • John Says:

        I do discriminate when I’m looking at reviews. I ignore those written by people with no experience with the product and those that have experienced the product. I have also found consistantly that things made in china are really not made very well. I don’t expect an olympic style performance from a cheap gun, but if I’m going to be buying a gun I do expect it has the ability to at least put ammo on target with some type of reasonable accuracy. At this time I have several under $100 guns that are capable of outshooting that MTR77NP. At this time the gun looks good but it’s lack of accuracy is really sending it closer to trash can status. But I’ll be keeping an eye on future reviews to see if it can be redeemed. But I have to say, based on several reviews from credible sources it isn’t looking all that good.

  • /Dave Says:

    BB,

    I owned a DE .44 mag for years. Reloaded thousands of rounds for it and found it to be somewhat finicky as far as reliability and accuracy. Wrong load would give me stovepipes after just a few shots. Many loads would cycle great but accuracy would suffer. A few choice loads performed great. I could get somewhere around 80-90 rounds off before it would get too dirty to operate properly. Same results with its factory recommended ammo. 80-90 rounds consistently and then sometimes it would fail to eject, or the bolt wouldn’t close quite enough and I would get a fail to feed/ fire. Then it would give me a problem every few magazines or so. Meticulous cleaning was the key to its reliability. I traded it back for a Para 45 Hi-Cap custom simply because I want shooting it as much anymore.

    I’d be interested in hearing about your experiences with your DE .357 mag.

    /Dave

  • Matt61 Says:

    There some guns on the range that are obnoxiously loud, and there does seem to be an interest in them that I cannot identify with. One day, a local blackpowder group brought out a small cannon to demonstrate, and you should have seen everyone flocking around with their cellphones. When it fired, it through up a big cloud of dirt on the 50 yard berm. Yeeehaaaa.

    On the subject of gun ignorance, I’ve been listing up the firearms errors in the Lisbeth Salander books. There is a Glock with a manual safety. There is something called a Colt .45 magnum, also described as a cowboy pistol. They must mean a Single Action Army in .45 Long Colt. There is a Smith and Wesson revolver in 9mm. Isn’t that a semiauto cartridge? And there is something called a “Browning .22 calibre,” a “Boy Scout pistol,” with which you can be shot in the head and survive with all of your faculties intact. I’ve always wondered how novel writers seem to have such deep knowledge of what they write about. What research effort could enable this? Well, maybe they don’t know much after all.

    Yes, B.B., I think it is apparent to all that you will do everything you can to give a gun a fair chance, almost beyond reason.

    Edith, your married lunchtime conversations must be in the minority of what’s out there. :-)

    Matt61

    • Wulfraed Says:

      a “Boy Scout pistol,” with which you can be shot in the head and survive with all of your faculties intact.

      And I used to think the old “Avenger” pulp series (do NOT confuse with the UK “Avengers” TV series; the pulp was done by the same writing factory that pumped out “Doc Savage”) carried things to extremes: the main good guy carried a custom 4-shot .22 revolver in an ankle holster… He uses it to “bounce” bullets off bad guys skulls, knocking them out.

    • kevin Says:

      For you M1 Garand fans I thought you might find this interesting. I did.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KydwknyfUrg

      If you skip the intro and go to 1:50 you may find this interesting too:

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lo0NLKAvmDM

      kevin

  • chris in ct Says:

    To bad Crosman did not come out with a 90 Anniversary Edition 2100 Classic this yr.(2013)!

  • chris in ct Says:

    My 8 year old son will be happy to see a 2013 Edition Christmas Story Red Ryder under the tree this year.Thank You Daisy.

  • RidgeRunner Says:

    BB,
    Today’s PA 12 Deals of Christmas is…

    Crosman MTR77 NP Scoped Air Rifle

    Paul Capello did a review and to get it shoot worth diddley, he tightened up his grip on it.

  • chris in ct Says:

    We are just having fun with these MEGA MAGMUN AIR GUNS same way we did when we were little kids tryin to see if our BBGUNS would go through a soup can and fightin over who gets the next shot because the two older guys missed it from 20 feet.NO NO I mean across the street.

    • chris in ct Says:

      Didn’t we all shoot from to far away? Farther than the gun can shoot accurately was the case.

      • cowboystar dad Says:

        I remember my first airgun, which I think was an old Slavia 618 from what I can tell from a couple of photos of myself when I was younger.
        I remember a couple of time shooting at a neighbors tractor…and then thinking I’d catch hell if I hit it and was caught.
        Thing is it was in their field adjacent to our house…200 yds I’m sure.
        Never occured to me that the pellet had likely hit the ground long before it ever got close to the tractor.

        • chris in ct Says:

          Me and my son just read what you said WE are both laughing so hard THANKS for sharing that..

        • J-F Says:

          When I started shooting it was at my grand parents house where my uncle had kept his old air rifle (a Rellum Telly that I own today) and he kept 2 or 3 of his cars there as parts car and my cousin and me used to shoot at them not knowing that they we’re for something other than rotting away. The cars gave us a rewarding PING everytime we’d hit them and some were pretty far! Until a few years later he changed the radiator on a friends car of the same model and a coolant geiser came out of it, when the flow stopped he found a pellet stuck in it… D’OH!

          We tought we were wartime snipers, shooting the driver (the windshield was already cracked), the tires and engine.

          J-F

      • chris in ct Says:

        What in the world are we grown ups doin with all these nice airguns anyway?(got at least 80 in my collection (hope my wife reads this blog) last time I checked you can only shoot one at a time anyhow).

  • JGC Says:

    BB,

    Many years ago a local gun shop/range had their grand opening. Part of the festivities included supervised shooting of various firearms that manufacturers had brought in to promote. A contest for a Ruger 10-22 Carbine involved shooting 5 rounds through a .50 AE Desert Eagle for best group.
    I gave it a try and came to the the determination that the pistol was the most physiologically challenging pistol I had ever shot. It was accurate though. My curiosity was satisfied. Subsequently over the years, the .44 and .357 were tried. My personal favorite was the .44 Magnum. Never bought a D.E., but I can tell you that they can shoot well. Later in life the top spot for challenging went to a T/C Encore in .460 S&W. Accurate but punishing.

    In both cases, the guns were shot for accuracy, not “Hollywood appeal”.

    To me, the act of shooting is broken down into two parts. Everything up to the moment of the sear breaking, and everything that follows. It’s the result on the paper that matters to me. Learning to shoot
    anything well is where the satisfaction is. If it happens to be a recoiling monster, then that falls into the “after the sear breaks” column.

    That is why I started with airguns and why I will always have airguns available to shoot. The technique needed to shoot an airgun well prepares one to shoot any firearm.

    JGC

  • David Enoch Says:

    BB,
    I have mixed feelings about the blog today. Some guys just like to shoot guns that they think are cool. I don’t get it but I don’t think that makes the shooter an idiot.

    I had a friend who had bought a highly accurized Mini 14 but he didn’t enjoy shooting it. He wanted to buy my neater looking Min 14 that was paper plate at 25 yard accurate. He said that if I could hit a paper plate at 25 yards that he could hit a milk jug filled with water at 25 yards. Oh, no, he wouldn’t trade or sell me his accurate Mini 14.

    I enjoy shooting steel targets even though they do not give me as much feedback as paper. For me, plinking at steel is relaxing. Shooting at paper and worrying over group sizes is sometimes fun and sometimes stressful, but is never relaxing to me.

    I think there is room for everyone at the range (just like there should be room for Airsoft on the blog :) )

    David Enoch

  • BG_Farmer Says:

    BB,
    If you aren’t having good luck finding a load for your DE, maybe you should try some of the cheap factory ammo for ideas! Some of us who shoot mostly (and mostly cheap) factory loads with some success wonder what the hardcore reloaders are trying to do in some cases :)! If it was a 1911, for example, I would start with 230gr. FMJ bullet loaded to 830fps or so and call it a day for 500 or more rounds, whereas a reloader might try 200 gr. SWC powderpuff loads and experience a string of failures… I know this because a friend and I went through the process in the last year. We did find several very cheap ammos. that shot extremely well — to the point where we have to watch our costs reloading very closely, esp. factoring in time, to make it worthwhile.

    I agree about the airgun stuff. While there are reasonable levels of accuracy for different applications, it is the “sine qua non” for a rifle, no matter what it looks, feels, or sounds like otherwise.

  • Wilbur Says:

    The problem with gun talk is that everybody is so insistent that they are correct. I like a writer who backs their opinions with experience but doesn’t use their article as a bully pulpit to prove they are correct.

  • Slinger Says:

    A truly vintage (& highly pleasurable) blog today. Couldn’t enjoy something so much & not comment!
    Cheers all.

  • Gunfun1 Says:

    I came home from a really stupid night at work the other night.

    I had to fix stuff that should of never got broke and had the guy that broke it helping me. And I didn’t get to even touch the stuff I was supposed to be working on because of his problem.

    And I just wanted to sit down eat something and read BB’s Blog and relax when I got home. And what do I see but this article. I just couldn’t help but think about things that have happened through time with me. So I had to write what I wrote. And my finger did hesitate a bit when I hit the Submit Comment button.

    But after reading back through everybodys comments it just goes to show we all had our different experiences throughout time. And different things that bother us or different views we have.

    And I think I made it sound like in all the different events that I was involved in there was just nothing but bad people trying to start trouble. And it was by far nothing like that at all. I have met so many knowledgeable people through out my time that I don’t even know where to start.

    So many times at events that I have been at we stayed around or went somewhere afterwards and talked for hours with the people we met at the event about the cars, planes, motorcycles and guns, hunting or whatever. Its kind of like that here.

    I know I have commented about this before. Everybody here has a ideas. And very interesting conversations come up. But nobody here is trying to be the one on top and I think we are all learning. I am. That’s what I see since I have been here anyway.

    Maybe when its time to vent its what keeps a person sane. I don’t like it when I do it. But some how it seems my mind is a little clearer afterwards and I kind of have a more open perspective of the situation. So please If I offend its me not seeing clearly. All I want to do Is have fun and learn.

    Anyway. Sorry but that’s what I’m trying to do.

  • robert w Says:

    this is off subject to a point but has a lot of similarity to what b.b. is saying. first off I drive a semi truck for a way to pay for my gun and ammo addiction. but the other day there was a bad wreck in springfield,mo. local news said bad wreck caused by another truck. everybody took the bull by the horns and was blogging on the news site saying we need to do something about those trucks bla,bla . after reading how big trucks were the cause of the wreck , I had to throw my nickle’s worth in. first off it was an import small PICKUP TRUCK , second park the big trucks a week and then wonder where the food went on the store shelves. and I read several that have a crosman titan shooting 1500 fps and cant hit a thing, got a crony ? no. hum. they need to read ,then experience what they speak of before they comment . as for a d.e. never shot 1 want to but all I can say is what I hear and read.but I have shot a 454 casull several shots . it was kinda mean on my wrist . but it had some hot loads too. I was using both hands . however the guy that owned the pistol liked it and I was ok with that too. but I enjoy toms point of views . b.b. you always hit the target when you write them I have a lot of respect for your posts sir

  • Jim Payne Says:

    Dear Mr. Gaylord:

    I’ve been a fan of yours since I bought your book about the R-1. Thanks for signing same. I have collected a few of your favorites: P-1. R-7. R-1. FWB 300. And a Chinese piece of junk (got rid of it).

    I enjoy shooting and trying to master this sport. I am passing the sport on to my son and we together
    Bought the Benjamin Marauder in 22 cal. Latest version with synthetic stock..mostly due to your recommendation.

    I’m glad to hear you are a fellow Texan. Best wishes on your recovery.

    Jim “GAS” Payne
    Former USN. A-4 pilot

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      Gas,

      Thank you for your service. A Skyhawk pilot, eh! That’s going back in time, some. I think I heard some war stories about A4s in Nam, but of course I could be mistaken.

      Anyhow, welcome to the blog and how do you like your new Marauder?

      B.B.

      • Jim Payne Says:

        BB,

        Marauder is awaiting shipment from Pyramid Air…A nice place to shop.
        I also have a couple hundred hours in the F-8 Crusader..A-4 was my favorite.
        I miss that fun time in my younger days

        Gas Payne

    • 103David Says:

      You know, W-A-A-A-Y back in the day…the somewhat universal “they” used to point out certain truisms, such as,
      “An M-60 MBT needs three things to be effective, Mobility, and Communication, but without a working Gun, all you got is a 50-ton portable radio.” (That’s for B. B.)
      But my personal favorite (because I was one,) was the observation that it was entirely possible, as a lowly SP4 or Buck Sergeant, to find oneself in command of the USS E********e with their attendant A-4 entourage. “Oh, please, L-T, could you put another…right…there? And behold, shortly there would magically no longer be a there there.
      Great appreciation would follow.

  • Wimpod Says:

    I enjoy reading your blog. I too am a DE owner/fan. Both in .357 and .44 mag. I reload my own ammo and have found the heavier 300gr XTP to work and function real well in my .44 the muzzle blast is also lower. So well that two weeks ago I took my second buck with it. 28 yards out, he dropped like a rock. The one before that was at 75 yards and took 100 yards to expire. I have not come up with a good .357 load but have plenty of 140, 158 and 180 grainers to experiment with.

    Since range time is more limited every day with a busy schedule, most of my marksmanship practice is with air guns (along with pest elimination). Keep up the great works!

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      Wimpod,

      Welcome to the blog! Yes, I figured that the .44 Mag was the better cartridge for the DE. I hope I can find a good .357 for mine. I’m just starting to experiment.

      B.B.

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