Thursday, October 30, 2008

Roanoke 2008 - Part 2

by B.B. Pelletier

Part 1

The next deal I got at the show was earth-shattering! It was a once-in-a-lifetime kind of thing that seems to happen to me more and more the older I get. I was admiring some airguns at a table and a fellow walked up with a strange airgun in his hands. He wanted me to examine it. On the rubber recoil pad it says it's a Benyamin, but on the receiver, it says Benjamin. This maker is listed in the Blue Book of Airguns, right after the Benjamin listings. I won't get into the specifics now, because I'm going to do a separate report on the gun for you, but listen to what Robert Beeman says about the price.

"Extreme rarity precludes accurate pricing on this model."

Now that's music to any collector's ears! However, my Benyamin is a different model than the one Beeman owns, so what does that say about rarity? Almost nothing is known about these multi-pump pneumatics, so I am going to do a report in my Shotgun News column to try to publicize it. If anyone has another gun like this, they may see that article or this blog and the learning will begin.

The seller was very motivated to sell the rifle, even though we showed him the passage about the value, so I could not refuse the deal. I'll show you the rifle tomorrow.

Another rare air rifle
At the table behind the one where the Benyamin came into my life, there lay a Parker-Hale Dragon single-stroke pneumatic sporting rifle. I didn't get a still photo of it, but you will see it in the first part of the video. For most of the show, I thought it was a Daystate Sportsman Mark II, and so did Davis Schwesinger, the owner of Air Rifle Specialists. However, while we were both examining it at the end of day one, we asked the seller what it was and he told us. You will remember that I made a special report on the Dragon from the 2008 Little Rock airgun show. Well, you don't often see a rifle like this for sale (only about 100 were made) and for only $750, to boot! I told you the dealers were making sweet deals at this show.

Field targets
Dick Otten had several tables for his field targets and action targets. He has a new tree mount that works sideways. Field target clubs will want to get several. Dick also showed a challenge-type target that pits one shooter against another in a timed match. And his standard field targets are now the tops in the industry.


After Hours field targets by Dick Otten of Florida.


BB guns
If there's one thing Roanoke is famous for it's collectible BB guns. This is the show where they all come out of the woodwork. It's also the show where more than one first model Daisy wire-stock gun has walked in the door, though I don't think that happened this year. If you like cast iron and tinplate BB guns, you really should attend this show.


One of many tables of collectible Daisys.



Roanoke is one of the few places where you can find specialty parts for antique and vintage BB guns. You won't find these things anywhere else.


Custom guns
One of our readers walked up to my table and showed me a Sheridan he had modified for easier pumping. He extended the pump handle backward for better leverage, so he could run a large scope on his blue Streak and still be able to pump the gun.


Look at the pump handle on this Sheridan Blue Streak. It comes all the way back to the triggerguard, so the gun can be held at the wrist while pumping. The owner is a blog reader, as is Lloyd, to his right.


Scarce modern guns
There are some very modern collectibles, too. The Kalashnikov BB gun is one example. BATF has stopped importation into the U.S., so the handful that made it through the first time are all there are. Though the gun is still being manufactured, it's very hard to find one for sale in the U.S.


This blog reader was thrilled to find this rare Kalashnikov BB gun at the show.


Back when the war in Vietnam was still going on, the Defense Department was hot on instinct shooting. Daisy supplied the guns to the Army, but Crosman was invited to bid on the contract. They converted a few of their V350 guns for instinct shooting and there was one at the show. It's just the second example I have seen.


Crosman made up a handful of these special V350s to compete on the Army's Instinct Shooting contract.


The auction
At the end of the day on Friday, the show held an auction. Dealers may enter guns for auction and they split the proceeds with the show. You might think that the only guns they sell are junk, but that's not the case. Knowing that this crowd has money, dealers will auction off some very nice specimens.


Show host Fred Liady ran the auction. This looks like a 250-series Benjamin pistol - which is definitely not junk!


Day two
On day two the locals come out in droves. They're mostly interested in new and modern airguns, so this is the day those things sell well. The attendees often bring in guns of their own to sell.

Day two is also the day the gun show opened upstairs. Show dealers are admitted free, so I ran up there and bought some reloading supplies and some World War II-vintage magazines for my M1 Carbine. I ALMOST bought an 8-bore (about .90 caliber) muzzleloader that stood about 74" tall. It would have been a bragging rights gun, because at just 17 lbs. the thing would have kicked my head off. I was also severely tempted to buy a TM Dowell hunting knife. Ted Dowell was a contemporary of Lovelace, but his knives have not risen in value as fast. You can still buy one for under $500 if you shop, while a Lovelace goes for over $5,000.


Day two, before the show opened at 9. This is the day the local public comes in force.



Want to buy new guns? Pyramyd Air had them in pallet loads!



Once the show opened on day two, the Pyramyd booth filled up fast. And, yes, their 4 tins of pellets for the price of 3 was available, but the tins were prepackaged in sets.


For those looking for tunes on their spring guns, Paul Watts had several tables and was selling guns he'd already tuned. Watch the video to see more on this. I'll have it up pretty soon.

So - whadda ya think?
As much as I've told you, there is still more to this show. I thought it was the best show ever, but I managed to sell a lot and to find some really super deals. I guess if you didn't do the same, you might not have felt the same about the show. This year I had deals already made; so when I arrived, the show was already a success. But the deals I made while the show was open were as sweet as the ones I'd arranged. I know it's difficult for some of you to make an airgun show, but if you can only make one, this is probably the one to attend.

Many who flew in had arranged to FedEx their buys back home before they left, so travel didn't prove to be a problem. Maybe you'll want to pencil in this time next year for the biggest and best airgun show in the world.

54 Comments:

At October 30, 2008 6:58 AM, Anonymous Brian in Pa said...

Hi BB,
Nice report, can't wait to see the video. The Parker Hale Dragon was one of my favorites at the show. Did you know there was also a Daystate Sportsman MSP rifle there for sale? It was in the box behind the table with the FWB 124 you posted yesterday. He was sking $750as well. I bought several other guns from the seller at very good prices. A lot of his guns (including the Vulcan III I bought) were sold with box and papers in LNIB condition! I have to agree with you that this was the best (of the 3 I have attended) shows for great deals.

Brian

 
At October 30, 2008 7:40 AM, Anonymous Al said...

BB:

Actually that was a Benjamin 252 Fred was holding in the auction pic. Oh it went home with me.

Got to dig out some 8gr CO2 and try it out this weekend.


Al

 
At October 30, 2008 8:04 AM, Blogger woguph said...

BB,
Is there an index of subjects covered in the blog? The search function isn't coming up with the blogs I am looking for. I just have to go through the archives month at a time until I find what I am looking for.

I am not trying to get you to extra work. You have your hands full answering the questions in the comments.

Thanks for your hard work,

David Enoch

 
At October 30, 2008 8:27 AM, Anonymous Dr. G. said...

B.B.,

My pet dogs smartly slink away when the air rifles come out for indoor target shooting, even though for this purpose the airguns are detuned AND modified and usually shooting into quiet clay, so that the resulting sound is no louder in volume than that of the 2-squirrel belch. I think that what occurs is that the dogs know that for safety purposes I want them out of the basement range while shooting (true, even though I have not "trained" them accordingly), and they read my body language (both are herding dogs, and are most sensitive to visual cues) which probably tenses up.

And, I think that is what happened the other day, when my Collie ran out of the room whining while I was looking at the blog and refused to return upstairs. This is much more likely than his seeing a picture of a gun on the blog that scared him.

If took him a few hours, and now he is back to normal.

Speaking of photos, I see in one of today's that the guy in the middle is pointing the powerful unloaded Sheridan Blue Streak at the chest of the other guy. Did he get his money, or did the other dude call his bluff?

- Dr. G.

 
At October 30, 2008 8:49 AM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

Brian,

I heard about the Daystate Sportsman, but I didn't see it. They have been priced at $550 for the past several years, so I thought $750 was high, but maybe that's a sign of the times.

B.B.

 
At October 30, 2008 8:50 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Dr G, It's funny you mention dogs. I've never bothered to train my Jack Russell mix, but I'll be darned if he's not the best spotter dog ever. I don't bother looking for squirrels unless he reacts first. And he stays out of the way while I'm shooting(at least until I've bagged one. Then he gets all Jack Russelly).

Nate in Cincy

 
At October 30, 2008 8:51 AM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

Al,

Thanks for that report. It's difficult to guess the caliber from a photo.

Let us know how it does, and of course use Pellgunoil.

B.B.

 
At October 30, 2008 8:54 AM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

David,

I once did a 6-month index (Sep 05) and was told not to because the search function would find anything. I agree that it is quirky.

I don't know of a better way to index the blog, but I will pass your concern on to our webmaster.

B.B.

 
At October 30, 2008 8:58 AM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

Dr. G.,

That picture suffers from being two-dimensional. The guy on the left is standing behind the muzzle, but you certainly can't see it! The guy on the right is standing about 4 feet behind the guy in the center.

About your dog's reaction to the guns - my cat who is afraid of handguns has very sensitive ears. When I dry-fire the mechanisms he may find the noise too loud.

B.B.

 
At October 30, 2008 9:22 AM, Blogger BPH said...

BB,
Thanks for the great info, I'm only 2 yrs. into airgunning and it'll be with me forever. I've got to say that I've really enjoyed your blog and I've learned decades of info from it--thank you. Other than upland bird hunting, I haven't shot a firearm since I found high powered airguns. Thanks for the show info, I'll have to get to one sooner or later.
Bret H

 
At October 30, 2008 10:05 AM, Anonymous .22 multi-shot said...

The animal reaction stories reminded me of my friend's dogs. They did't mind CO2 or pumped airguns, but when the springer came out, they left! They would hide until it was put away.

I'm wondering if springers make a sound that hurts some dog's (and maybe cat's) ears?

.22 multi-shot

 
At October 30, 2008 10:12 AM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

.22 multi-shot,

Jim Maccari told me he could hear a crack from a Theoben gas spring gun. My ears are shot from being a tanker, so I never heard it, but I don't doubt that it's there.

B.B.

 
At October 30, 2008 11:40 AM, Anonymous Dr. G. said...

TwoTalon,

When your Talon is on CO2, what fps do you achieve with power wheel at 0,3,7,11 ?

I ask, because on my .25 Condor it seems to make no difference where I put the power adjustment when using CO2 (which I use always indoors), which is disappointing.

I think that you will do less damage to your bird structures and more damage to those birds if you use a lighter, h.p. pellet.


If anybody knows where I can purchase at least 10-20 tins of .25 H & N pellets (Pyramid discontinued months ago) please let me know. Thanks.

- Dr. G.

 
At October 30, 2008 12:01 PM, Blogger kevin said...

Dr G,

Here is a source for your .25 caliber H & N pellets. They're in stock and ship from ohio:

http://www.airgunwarehouseinc.com/py-p-463.html

kevin

 
At October 30, 2008 12:11 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Air powered cars in the horizon powered by of-the-shelf compressors
http://finance.yahoo.com/family-home/article/106040/Air-Cars-A-New-Wind-for-American-Roads

Hey B.B., I liked your picture on yesterday's blog. You little devil had yours eyes on that jar of possum jerkey across your table, did't you?

 
At October 30, 2008 12:53 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

B.B.

That was nice of you tell the guy about the value of his rare airgun before buying it off of him. That's nicer than your childhood "friend" who bought your broken airgun for a nickel and had his Dad fix it.

Is it possible to discern any trends in airgunning from this show? Perhaps that's more possible at the SHOT show.

vince, I was appalled to hear about your problems with the IZH 61. There is a review on the PA site about a similar experience where a guy who nine clips for this rifle and found only three that were usable; the rest had terrible accuracy. I can't understand this since the extent of my problems with the gun was having the clips stick sometimes in the early going; I've heard about others with this problem. But that cleared up and the rifle functions flawlessly--feeds reliably, super-accurate. Maybe I got lucky.

Matt61

 
At October 30, 2008 1:34 PM, Anonymous twotalon said...

Dr g.
That is mr b who is running on co2. I just run on air..either with the standard or the micro tank.
Your co2 adapter must work like my micro.Power adjustment makes no difference so set it all the way down and shoot it.

Lighter pellets or hollow points will not make any difference on bird feeder destruction.

twotalon

 
At October 30, 2008 1:39 PM, Anonymous Mr B. said...

Twotalon: How about using a gallon mlk jug with a two sides cut out leaving a lip on the bottom to keep the bird seed from falling out. When it gets shot up make another, no problem. Mr B.

 
At October 30, 2008 1:46 PM, Anonymous twotalon said...

mr b....
That is about the best idea so far.
Until it gets brittle from UV exposure it should soak up a lot of pellets without coming apart.
And dirt cheap too!!
twotalon

 
At October 30, 2008 1:47 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

A SAD, CAUTIONARY TALE

Here on Maui we have lots of rats...especially upcountry when the avocados are ripe. This part of
Maui, on the slopes of 10,000' Mt. Haleakala, has them everywhere. If you love avocados, all you have to do is take a walk on the road and scoop them up from the roadside. The trees are literally everywhere.

So about this time of year the rats move into the attic and hold races above your heads, at least that's what it sounds like. We put out poison and traps but for everyone we kill that way, it seems dozens more survive.

They're a curious animal, very big, who seem to feel like we are their family. Several times we'll be watching TV and one will run across the floor in front of the set, stop to sit up on its haunches, and regard us with friendly intent. As if to say, Hey folks, thanks for having us--got anything to eat?

So yesterday, at the end of class, one of my shooting buddies pokes his head in the office door and says he's cornered a rat in our glass-lined shower. I offer him a choice of a Crosman 760 with pellets, or a Crosman 357-SIX pistol. Both are .177. He shoots the rat at 3 feet 8 times with no visible effect other than to have the rat run up to him and stare at him through the glass door, inches away, as if to say, "Why are you doing this?"

The rat eventually dies, although it takes too long. My friend tells me, "You know, I love to hunt for food, and to target shoot, but this was rough. I don't want to do this again." I agree whole heartedly. I think the rifle, developing quite a lot more energy than the pistol, might have knocked the little critter right out of its body with the first shot, but my friend chose the pistol because of limited room to maneuver in the confines of the shower.

Clearly, as Elmer Keith advised, we had not "used enough gun". (absurd vision of shooting the rat in the shower with a .44 magnum) Years ago in Portland, a friendly airgun repairman had offered me a used Crosman CO2 pistol in .22, the one that looks like a Ruger Standard pistol. He claimed to have killed a possum on his roof with it with one headshot. I wish now I'd bought it.

So, let this be a caution to you, not to try to take rats with a .177 pistol with its lower energy level. And if any of you know of a good .22 air pistol they can recommend, I'd love to hear of it. We still have beaucoup rats.

--Joe B.

 
At October 30, 2008 2:30 PM, Anonymous wayne said...

Vince & Matt61,

While Josh & I were driving out to the elk hunt, Josh mentioned he shot some rats in the backyard of his trailer park with the IZH61.. and killed them quick with head shots. It was only 20 feet, and I don't think you can kill anything past 15 yards with a IZH61... but anyway, that's the same gun that had the mag feeding problem at first. Josh said it smoothed out after 500 shots or so. He thought the plastic mags just need to where in.. He really loves it with the Leapers Bug Buster on it. He also said it's ready to do a contest again.... maybe 20 feet for the 61 and 20 yards for the AAs410... I'll talk to Josh...and/or you can shoot some new groups at 20 feet and I'll show my practice session tonight at the 20 yard range off knee on the recliner.

Wayne,
Ashland Air Rifle Range

 
At October 30, 2008 3:21 PM, Anonymous BG_Farmer said...

Matt,

I'm still pondering your trajectory question, and I think I see where you and I are analyzing the problem differently. It seems you are saying that the bullet's inertia follows a line from the muzzle to the _POI_, and that that line diverges from the muzzle=>POA line by the "dispersion rate". On the other hand, I think that the bullet's inertia follows the muzzle=>POA line, but that it is displaced somewhat by spiraling (not to mention other effects) and that the dispersion rate is simply a handy characterization of accuracy (or lack thereof).

RE: not believing the spiral has much effect on the group size, did you look at the actual bullet paths depicted in the link I put up? I can see what you are saying about 15" orbits at 300yards, though.

 
At October 30, 2008 3:26 PM, Anonymous Airdog said...

Joe B. - I would recommend a Crosman 2240 variant. You could get a stock model and have it modded by Tim McMurray at Mac1 Airguns, or just go with a longer barrel. Crosman can do the barrel and steel breech upgrade too; check out the custom shop section at crosman.com.

 
At October 30, 2008 5:17 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Joe B.

That was incredible. I do believe the rats would drag down the value of the property friendly as they seem to be. For hunting, I'm of the Colin Powell doctrine of overwhelming force, so I would use a high-powered .22 repeating air rifle myself. My parents had a rat crawl into their apartment and were told to trap it with some sort of sticky paper--the fly paper principle. Sure enough, the rat walked on to it in the middle of the night and raised an incredible ruckus trying to free itself. My parents managed to get hold of a corner of the paper and drop it down a trash chute with the rat alive and kicking. Gruesome.

Wayne, I like Josh without meeting him yet. Obviously a man of fine discrimination. Sure, I'm ready for a shoot off with the IZH 61 and the B30 too. We can try the sitting position which I've been working on and other variations. I'll be heading out to the range fairly soon, weather permitting. I've been visualizing myself as one of those characters in a Kung Fu movie who gets licked in the initial fight then practices monomaniacally to emerge victorious....

BG_Farmer, you're really indulging me here. Yes, you're quite right that I'm analyzing the projectile motion into a component from muzzle to target and a dispersion component at right angles to the first component that connects it to the projectile. Whatever the source of motion--gunpowder, spiral, wind, whatever, the projectile is surely describable by these two components, and each one should have an inertia associated with it, again regardless of the force that produced it. So in the case of the dispersive component, I could see the initial force that caused it getting attenuated down to zero. For example, if the pellet was overstabilized, a later stabilization could stop that contribution to the sideways movement. But in the absence of a force, basic physics says that the pellet will continue to travel sideways at a constant rate. A new force is needed to slow the pellet down beyond that constant speed which is what you would need to reduce the MOA. A constant sideways velocity would produce a constant MOA.

I actually was not able to find the particular image you mention. The site had many links, and I didn't know which ones to go to. I do remember from The Bullet's Flight From Powder to Target that the bullet will wobble in flight to produce a spiral. But I don't see how the diameter of that spiral can correspond to the width of a group. That doesn't scale upward to greater distances.

Matt61

 
At October 30, 2008 5:21 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

B.B.

Here's a chance for me to clear up something ridiculously basic about field target shooting. As I understand it, a shooter has many targets, say 20 at distances between 25 and 55 yards, at different elevations. Each target has a 1/4 inch area to knock it down and a shooter has only one shot at each. Is that right? It sounds awfully difficult. What score range out of 20 or whatever the actual number of targets would you get in a match? Do you have people missing every target? I expect that is what would happen to me. Do you have people hitting every single target?

Matt61

 
At October 30, 2008 5:38 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Joe B,

I'll second that Crosman 2240 recommendation by airdog. That-- or better still, the Crosman custom shop version, the 2300. With the 10.5" .22 cal barrel and the steel breech, you'll be set.

Derrick

 
At October 30, 2008 5:39 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Isn't that something. I was just drawing up some sketches of an extended pump arm very much like that Blue Streak. Nothing new under the sun.
-I.B.McGinty

 
At October 30, 2008 5:43 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

It is fun to hear about different pets and their reactions to our shooting sport.[and possibly BB's picture...]My preferred place to shoot is my friend's house in Abita springs LA.Since hurricane Katrina we have adopted 4 cats who are brothers and sisters marked like raccoons.all become scarce when we shoot off the porch except one.the weird thing is that cat had already been named bullseye because he was born with a perfect target on each side instead of stripes like the other three.he's a great shooting companion,and a pretty good hunter of lizards,dragonflys and junebugs.FrankB

 
At October 30, 2008 5:47 PM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

Matt,

The kill zones are different sizes, up to 1.5 inches and more.

B.B.

 
At October 30, 2008 6:13 PM, Anonymous wayne said...

Matt61,

B.B. did a blog on it you could probably find....but as I get it, the targets are 2 or 3 per lane, set at 10 to 55 yards, with holes from 3/8" to 1-1/2" (the match director decides what and where) with 8 lanes or so, two or three people go from lane to lane and take turns, scoring, resetting the target and shooting.

One shot per target, score or no score. After the groups have shot at all 8 lanes, they move back about 20 yards or so and shoot the lanes again.. You might have a total of 40 to 60 shots. If I remember right what I heard from Billy Lo, (2005 national champ) a perfect score is very rare, but only 5 misses in not uncommon, and in windy conditions the winner might miss 18 or 20 times...

The match director usually has quite a few easy ones as well as a few very hard ones..

They have three divisions: 1) Precharged/PCP airgun, any sight..
2) Piston division, Any piston/Spring gun, any sight..
3) and the new Hunter Division, any safe sporter style airgun of any power plant, no adjustable butt pads or butt hooks, 12 power scopes or less, no turret adjustment allowed during the match.

The AAFTA rules are easy to google as well..

Wayne,
Ashland Air Rifle Range

 
At October 30, 2008 6:57 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Back to question about MOA that Matt posted October 29, 2008 1:29 PM, Anonymous

It isn't that the bullet becomes "more accurate." It is just that there is some factor which causes dispersion which decreases as the bullet's velocity decreases. So this factor's contribution to the inaccuracy of the bullet goes to zero. I was looking at the ballistic coefficient of a bullet the other day at different distances down range (as bullet slows). The BC changes with the velocity of the bullet.

There are so many types of guns, bullet sizes, bullet shapes, and types of powder that some combinations are bound to be weird. It is easy for me to believe that a ballistic projectile (bullet or pellet) can both spin and precess. (just like earth spins and precess on its axis.) I would think that the precession would slow due to drag.

Herb

 
At October 30, 2008 7:30 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

1.5 inches is a bit more like it. I suppose that the quarter inch I read about was an extreme.

Herb, I expect that the explanation about MOA behavior lies outside the realm of pointlike idealizations. When it gets into the realm of gyroscopic effects where things move at right angles to where you expect them to, I know it's time to quit.

Matt61

 
At October 30, 2008 7:59 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

RE: MOA changes

Look at the link at:
http://www.nennstiel-ruprecht.de/bullfly/fig12.htm

For the two-armed model it is easy to guess that the slow and fast oscillations are not equal, and they they have change differently as the velocity of the round slows.

I never hear of "nutation" before!

Herb

 
At October 30, 2008 8:51 PM, Anonymous Vince said...

I removed the barrel from my IZH-61, loaded it up, pointed it down, and cycled the bolt 5 times. This would chamber every pellet and let it fall out so that I could examine it. Some of them are mangled almost beyond recognition.

It appears that the hole that accepts the pellet from the mag and guides it into the breech isn't beveled at all. No wonder it ain't feeding right.

I contacted the seller, hopefully I'll hear from him soon. I suspect he'll tell me to send it back to EAA...

 
At October 30, 2008 9:12 PM, Anonymous BG_Farmer said...

Matt,

It's an interesting question. Obviously, I don't agree with your model:). I don't know where the perpendicular force of dispersion would be coming from, since the dispersion rate is independent of wind(age). Also, the fact that the bullet does spiral (upon which we both agree) tends to make me think that the sideways inertia of the projectile is trivial compared to the spin-induced motion and should essentially sum to 0.

I'll use a Socratic stratagem and ask this: why do "they" worry about the twist rates on rifles? Anecdotally, it seems be a fairly important factor in group size.

 
At October 30, 2008 9:30 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Airdog & Derrick,

Funny enough, I and my rat-shooting friend have spent a good part of the afternoon looking at Crosman Custom Shop versions of the 2240. Someone on PA suggested the 14.5" barrel with compensator to reduce noise, whereas another thought the 18" bbl looked better and developed maximum velocity (around 500 fps).

I'm thinking of just getting the basic gun from Crosman, then adding stuff later. Remember in my recent post a pistol was perfect for close quarters (although I doubt seriously if I can get all my rats into the shower stall).

Derrick, Is the difference between the short and long steel breeches a matter of scope/ring requirements?

Joe B.

 
At October 30, 2008 11:29 PM, Anonymous Mr B. said...

Dr g, I haven't shot the SS over the chronny runing CO2, but AirForce said that the power wheel won't make much of a differance. I'v got mine on 6 for air and just leave it there for CO2. Mr B.

 
At October 30, 2008 11:44 PM, Anonymous .22 multi-shot said...

Speaking of air cars, I am interested in electric compressors like the one you got BB. What other machines do compressors like that come from? What kind of pressures do they produce?

Along with other projects, I am designing (in my head so far) an experimental "toy" air car for my kids. I will need a compressor to fill-r-up. The car should run about 30 min. with an 80 cu ft, 3000 PSI tank (10mph or so). The compressor could come in handy for filling up airguns too! :)

Joe B - I can vouch for the Crosman custom shop CO2 pistol too. I've got one with 14.5" barrel. Great gun! Its in the middle of being converted to a "Disco" pistol.

.22 multi-shot

 
At October 30, 2008 11:53 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

RE: Precession and nutation

Nice diagram of the theoretical path for a 0.38 pistol at:
http://www.nennstiel-ruprecht.de/bullfly/fig26.htm

Herb

 
At October 31, 2008 12:32 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

RE 2240's,

I got mine for $30 on sale at a sporting goods store. With Crosman Priemer dome pellets the squirrels drop out to a range of about 30-40 feet. One shot, one squirrel.

While I own a few air guns, this is the pistol I shoot the most for other than 10 meter (or 29' in my basement).

After about 500-600 pellets the trigger actually got better. Pengunoil on every new CO2 cartridtge as our host and moderator says.

Al Pellet

 
At October 31, 2008 9:09 AM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

Vince,

Good work, tracking that down.

B.B.

 
At October 31, 2008 9:15 AM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

.22 Multi-Shot,

Compressors like mine come from combat vehicles and aircraft. But look for them under paintball compressors on Ebay. They can range from $500 to over $5,000.

B.B.

 
At October 31, 2008 9:17 AM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

Herb,

That's an interesting website. Matt should check it out.

B.B.

 
At October 31, 2008 2:02 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"Joe B - I can vouch for the Crosman custom shop CO2 pistol too. I've got one with 14.5" barrel. Great gun! Its in the middle of being converted to a "Disco" pistol."

.22 multi-shot,

What's a Disco pistol?

And what other goodies did you order on your 2240 from Crosman's custom shop?

Joe B.

 
At October 31, 2008 2:04 PM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

Joe,

A Disco pistol was what John Travolta used to murder Olivia Newton John in Saturday Night Fever.

B.B.

 
At October 31, 2008 3:27 PM, Anonymous .22 multi-shot said...

BB & Joe B,

LOL, I wondered if someone would play on disco.

A "Disco" pistol is a Crosman pistol modified with Discovery parts. Hence the term "Disco".

.22 multi-shot

 
At October 31, 2008 3:31 PM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

.22 multi-shot,

Sorry. I couldn't resist!

B.B.

 
At October 31, 2008 6:54 PM, Anonymous .22 multi-shot said...

Joe B,

Sorry I didn't answer the second half of your question, "what other goodies did you order on your 2240 from Crosman's custom shop".

I got it with long steel breech, walnut sport grips, the LPA mim sight and black muzzle brake. I switched the grips for cocobolo target grips later (found a deal on EBay). I don't care for the width of LPA sight's notch so I plan to gently file the paint out of the notch, fill it with JB weld and file a smaller notch. Oh, and I got the black trigger shoe. I think I will eventually make a replacement brass trigger so I don't need the shoe.

Let us know what you get if you order one!

.22 multi-shot

 
At November 01, 2008 12:55 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

"A Disco pistol was what John Travolta used to murder Olivia Newton John in Saturday Night Fever."

I'm sure she had it coming, although she was really cute.

For violence and Travolta, I suggest "Carrie".

.22 multi-shot -- I'll let you know when I decide on the customized 2240. It's my birthday at the end of this month! Right now I'm thinking of the basic gun as well as goodies: long steel breech, 18" bbl, blue trigger shoe (to match my eyes), black muzzle brake, plastic shoulder stock, engraving (I guess they engrave it on the receiver?), 3-9x scope, all so I can have the best of both worlds. My rat killing friend wants the same, only no basic gun, 14.5" bbl, brass muzzle brake, red trigger shoe and the stock.

Joe B.

 
At November 01, 2008 9:59 AM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

Disco pistol.
http://www.network54.com/Forum/278474/message/1225252374/discovery+pistol

-McMginty

 
At November 01, 2008 9:06 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

BB

you've given me good advice in the past - so another question. (No good deed goes unpunished, ...)

I've got a Daisy 953 & a 22SG. I'd like to put an peep sight on the 953 for sure & maybe even on the 22SG. (Mostly target practice in the garage, but every once in a while the 22 gets a taste of chipmonk or squirrel.)

What would you recommend?
Beeman Sport looks interesting.
Daisy Avanti looks interesting.
Any of these worth the extra bucks over the 5899?

 
At November 02, 2008 6:54 AM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

The Daisy Avanti sight is plastic and sloppy. You have to move it several clicks in the direction you want to go just to take u the slop in the gears.

AirForce will have a rear aperture out inside a month that will work wonderfully on both rifles. Watch the blog!

The Mendoza peep sight would be a good alternative if you can get it to go high enough, which I'm not sure it will do. The Beeman will have the same problem.

B.B.

 
At November 09, 2008 12:43 PM, Anonymous Anonymous said...

I have a S&W Model 78G, 22 cal. I need to replace the O ring in the CO2 cylinder chamber. I tried to email D. Gunter, but the email kept coming back. Any ideas on where to get the replacement O rings. I have tried locally and everyone I tried didn't work. The gun is in otherwise mint condition. Thnaks.

 
At November 09, 2008 7:53 PM, Blogger B.B. Pelletier said...

Try this guy:

John Groenewold, PO Box 830, Mundelein, IL 60060-0830, (847) 566-2365
http://www.jgairguns.biz

B.B.

 

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