by Tom Gaylord, The Godfather of Airguns™
Writing as B.B. Pelletier
The NXG APX multi-pump is new from Umarex.
This report covers:
• What’s different?
• What’s the same?
• Comes as a kit with a scope
• Summary
As I was leaving the Ft. Worth airgun show, Umarex U.S.A. Marketing Manager Justin Biddle handed me a plain cardboard box that said, “Personal for Tom Gaylord.” It was a full week before I opened the box; but when I did, I found today’s topic air rifle inside — the Umarex NXG APX multi-pump that shoots both BBs and pellets. There are enough new features on this rifle that I’m going to cover them in this special Part 1. Justin said every kid will want one for Christmas, and I want to find out why.
What’s different?
For starters, the APX (I’m going to call it that from now on) is styled like a very modern air rifle. The synthetic stock has 2 cutouts in the butt that both strengthen the butt and eliminate the hollow sound most synthetic stocks have. The feel of the stock is conventional, except the cheekpiece is rubberized to resist cold and also to stick to your face. The rubberized portions extend to the buttpad and down to the toe of the butt, where there is actually a flat pad for resting on a bench. Not that the APX is meant as a benchrest rifle. No, this is a plinker, pure and simple. I see it as a modernized version of Daisy’s popular 880, only with potentially greater power. The box and manual say a maximum of 800 f.p.s. is possible, and I’ll look at that in greater detail in a bit.
A second big difference the APX offers is an automatic safety. The first time the pump lever is pulled away from the stock, it trips the safety that’s on the left front of the triggerguard to on. It stays back until you push the safety release with your shooting finger. The safety release pops out through the front of the triggerguard and has a release button in its center, so it can be easily taken off. This is one automatic safety you may not mind, because of how easy it operates.
The pump handle swings forward for every pump stroke.
The first time the pump handle is pulled down, the safety pops through the triggerguard. Push it off with your trigger finger before firing. This picture also shows the open BB reservoir door at the upper left, below the pellet trough.
The safety can also be manually operated at any time. The switch is on the left side of the triggerguard, and it goes on and off independently of the rifle being cocked. The APX is the only multi-pump that has an automatic safety, and Umarex is proud of it!
The rifle comes with sights that I’ll discuss in a moment, but the top rail also has cross slots similar to a 1913 Picatinny, though it’s not one. Weaver rings cannot be used on this rail as it’s only 11mm wide, where a Picatinny rail is 21mm wide. So, 11mm airgun scope rings must be used.
The last difference I see is that the pump head is massive! It looks and feels like the rifle will not lose any air as it’s being pumped. That may be why you get up to an extra 150 f.p.s. from the APX.
What’s the same?
The APX is a lot like other modern multi-pumps in a number of ways. For example, it’s a single-shot when shooting pellets and a 75-shot repeater when shooting BBs. The BBs are loaded through a door on the left side of the frame and come out into the loading trough one at a time through a hole in the trough. Cock the gun by pulling back the bolt and tilting the rifle to the right and a BB rolls out. A magnet holds the steel BB to the tip of the bolt.
Like other dual-ammo guns, you have to avoid that BB hole when loading pellets. The way to do that is to move the bolt forward so the tip covers the hole. The APX loading trough is wide enough for easy loading access and long enough to load pellets when the bolt is partially forward, covering the BB hole.
The pellet trough is long and the approach is wide enough for anyone’s fingers. You can easily roll the pellet in from the right side.
The barrel is a thin steel tube that’s rifled. It’s housed in a tubular sheetmetal shroud that gives it the look and feel of substance. The rifling looks crisp, but we will find out how good it really is in the accuracy test.
The sights are a post that has a red fiberoptic bead in front and a plain notch in the rear. The rear sight adjusts up via a sliding elevator and sideways via a locking screw holding the notch tight to the base, with an oval hole allowing the notch to slide in either direction. These are simple adjustments, but they’re effective.
The front sight is a red fiberoptic bead. It doesn’t gather light very well, though and will usually look just like a post, which is better for precise aiming.
Rear sight moves up and down by an elevator (a stepped piece of synthetic sliding in a cutout notch in the sight blade) and sideways by sliding the notch and locking it down with a screw.
The rifle must be cocked in order for the pump to compress air, and I must comment that the cocking effort feels stiff to me. I’ve never measured cocking effort in a multi-pump before, but this one feels hard. I think younger shooters may have some difficulty cocking it.
The rifle is light, as you might imagine from the use of synthetics. It weighs 3 lbs., 6 oz. and is 39 inches overall. The literature says it can make 800 f.p.s. with lightweight alloy pellets, which I assume are RWS HyperMAX pellets. It should do pretty well with BBs, too and maybe be in the mid- to high-600s with lightweight lead pellets. That long pump head conveys the feeling of power, and the pump strokes also feel like they’re doing a lot! You can pump the rifle up to 10 times, and you know I’ll be testing that for you with lead pellets, lead-free pellets and BBs, alike.
Comes as a kit with a scope
The APX will come as a gun with a 4×15 scope and rings and also as a kit that includes a 4×15 scope, rings, safety glasses, 5 paper bullseye targets, 500 pellets (250 pointed, 250 domed) and steel BBs. I’ll be testing the rifle with both the sights and the scope.
The APX also comes as a kit.
Summary
How do I like it so far? I like it! The rifle feels solid and somehow I get the feeling it’s going to be accurate. We’ll see. This may well be another gift for the upcoming Christmas season.
Bb
Its about time that Umarex came out with something to compete with the Daisy and crosman pumpers. The APX looks like they listened to what air gunners had to say about the other two companies versions and incorporated the best of all of them into this rifle. I wish it was available when I bought my 760 for my 8 year old grand son to start learning with as I would nave bought it instead.
I am eager to see what kind of fps and accuracy it is capable of and how you like it. I know after me tuning my grandsons 760 to be a full dump gun that at 15 pumps it will shoot CP 7.9 gr right at the 800 fps range and since I installed an older models rifled barrel in it is a tack driver. He has learned to hit his POA with diopter sights and has now been allowed to move up to a 4×32 scope and is getting to be a good shot with the scope now also.
Eagerly await the next review.
buldawg
This gun does not compete with a Daisy 880, it IS a Daisy 880 with a new stock that, in my opinion, looks like a crossbreed between lady shaver and assault rifle. But each to his own, I guess.
I believe multi-pump pneumatics have a lot of potential that is, for whatever reason, not taken care of. A Sheridan 397 with a good adjustable trigger, different stock and integrated scope mount would be a tackdriver! The efficient pull-open valve of the Daisy 880 could also find its place in a much better made air rifle.
LOL! I’m with you Mel. This looks like something to appeal to the gamers, which could be a good thing I guess. Maybe it will help lure them from in front of the boob tube and go outside for a bit. Of course you could always shoot the boob tube with it and run them outside with a stick, but that might get you suspended from playing football and possibly arrested.
A really well made multi-pump would be a real nice thing to have. I have considered a 392 or 397, but for the shortcomings you listed and others, I have hesitated from doing such. Maybe this will get Crosman’s attention and they will build a mult-pump based on the Discovery.
While we are dreaming, why not build an air rifle similar to the FX Independence based on the Marauder. That would be pretty awesome and likely affordable.
Let us not wake up quite yet. What about a SSP in the 12FPE range. I for one was pretty excited by the Daystate prototype that was going around. Very likely too many fingers got caught by the lever. That is a real shame as it looked to be a real quality air rifle.
Ah, the SSP in the 12fp range would me my airgun of choice as well…however, it is not easy. Guns like it existed – the Titan JB1, Parker Hale Dragon, Webley Paradigm, Airlogic Genesis. All tried to squeeze as much efficientcy out of the single stroke as possible…using either very much force to operate the chraging handle, or rather delicate valves, moving barrels to eliminate dead space between valve and barrel, etc. The results were fascinating, rather complicated airguns, which, needed too much maintenance to appeal to the average airgunner.
But an airgun that goes at 12fpe with 3 pumps, has a good trigger, well made stock and a scope mounting rail? Count me in 🙂
RR,
I have see a single stroke that puts out 12 foot-pounds. Believe me — you would not want one! The pump stroke is about 130 degrees long.
B.B.
With you on Crosman making a Marauder like the FX Independence.
The FX independence operates at high pressures, and uses a highly refinded five-stage pump to do what it does. You cannot just put a 100$ lever pump to the Marauder to get your “Marauder independence”.
Mel
I kind of know what you mean. I was thinking more like put a 5 stage 500 dollar lever pump on the Marauder and sell it for 900 bucks.
I had a FX Monsoon. It liked about 2900 to 3000 psi. kind of like where my Marauders and Hatsan operate also. Do you mean to tell me that the Independence operates at a higher pressure than 3000 psi. I’m think it stays at the 3000 psi pressure. And maybe it does operate at more than 3000 psi. I don’t have a Independence so I cant truthfully know its operating pressure.
The 1800$ FX Indy operates at a pressure level of about 3000 psi. It has a self-regulating valve (like the Marauder), so most of the pressure in the reservoir stays there during the shot. This is very favourable, as you only need to pump ever 2-3 shots, depending on your power level. You can also shoot a pellet with a power of up to up to 30 fpe. However, you need a relatively complicated pumping system and high quality parts to manage that pressure level. The valve must be well balanced, too.
Compare it to a 160$ Benjamin 392. It runs at ~1500 psi, and simply dumps all of its air into the barrel. This allows Benjamin to employ a very rugged and simple valve, and all parts can be much cheaper as they only have to withstand half the pressure. Drawback is a relatively poor efficiency, as you always have to pump the gun from zero psi after every shot.
Mel
So tell me do you think a HPA gun running at 3000 psi could have a on board pump like the FX Independence and sell in the 900 dollar range.
If you look at the Benjamin Marauder they are at 500 dollars right now which I believe shoot and have the quality of a 1000 dollar gun easy when I compare them to the FX Monsoon. I think it would be do-able for Crosman to build a gun that is on a design platform of the Independence and sell for less than the Independence.
And yep I know what you mean about the pump and dump guns. Those are designed a whole different way.
Phew, tough question 🙂 Yes I believe it may be possible.
A definite possibility would be a “refined Sheridan” pump-up pneumatic that has a better valve, maybe a linkage system in the pump and operates at higher pressure to reduce the necessary volume. Plus, the gun could be easily 10″ longer than the tiny Sheridan, and also have a full sized charging handle. This gun would still have a simple dump valve system, but some 3-4 pumps would suffice to give you some 12-15 fpe power, which in my opinion is all that is ever needed in an airgun.
Mel
There is a company that modifies a Benjamin pump. A 392 I believe it is. And it sounds like exactly what you described about the Sheridan.
They are a direct competitor with Pyramyd AIR so I can’t provide a link.
They are priced very reasonable and I have almost bought one. Actually I really should buy one. I had a 392 I guess it was still called that back in 1970 when I was a kid. But it was .22 caliber regular multi-pump Benjamin. It was definitely a good shooter.
Mel,
I can tell you from cocking the APX that it is not a coipy of the 880. Also, the pump head is more massive and fits the compression tube better.
B.B.
Tom I can see both points of view on this and to a point agree with both. If that’s confusing, allow me to elaborate. I’m sure that the APX isn’t a copy of the Daisy 880, if for no other reason than Daisy’s lawyers would have something to say about that. But at the same time, the lines and styling look like a tacti-cool version of a Daisy 880.
Personally I’m thinking this could be a very interesting gun if it performs well and delivers better power. Then again I’ve gotten burnt on a couple of pumpers that had reputations for better power and accuracy than the Daisy 880.
Thinking about that reminds me how much I miss my old Crosman 664…
BB, I’d love to see the internal differences between the Daisy 880 and the Umarex apx! However, I bet it is made by Daisy. First, the “NXG” logo is used by Umarex to label the products of other companies, such as the Trumark slingshots. Second, that rear sight is a very stong indicator…one would be hard pressed to find this design in a newly designed airgun.
However, I find nothing wrong with it. For 60$, you’d better buy a pump-up pneumatic than a cheap “1000 fps” springer.
Mel, when it comes to this type of pump gun, I agree that Daisy 880s used to be the best. I owned one for a lot of years. That said, when it comes to accuracy, consistency, and craftsmanship, the newer 880s don’t stack up to the older models. I grew up shooting an older model, and never had any issues. Always held pressure…always had tack-driving accuracy.
Bought a newer 880 a few years back, and immediately had problems. It wouldn’t hold pressure, and consistency/accuracy was all over the map. I ended up giving it away. A few days ago I shot my neighbor’s 880 and experience the same thing. I can tell after having now used this new Umarex NXG (just purchased yesterday), there is no comparison. The quality feel is similar to the older 880s, and after breaking it in with about 20-30 pellets, it was putting pellets through the same hole (consistently) at 15 yds. I wouldn’t recommend remaining stuck on the 880, they’re not what they used to be. Give this one a try, and I think you’ll be surprised. I will say that one bad this about this gun is the trigger. The manual says it’s 3.5 lbs…felt more like 10!
Mel
I do believe this gin is a direct competitor with the 760 and 880 gun and it is not an 880 in a different stock as far as I am concerned. I have never been a daisy fan as they are always on the cheap end of the air gun world other than their competition guns.
I have own crosman guns for years and have a 1968 crosman model 1400 that has killed more game than any other air gun or firearm I have ever owned mainly because it was my first gun and got used on a daily basis for ten + years as an 8 year old and on in to my late teens. It now being a 45 year old pumper that when came out of retirement about a year ago still pumped up and shot as hard as it did when new after sitting for 20 years. So I feel that pumper do have there place and the APXC is looking to be a god entry level pump gun for are young shooters to learn with. I would rather see it in a nice wood stock rather than plastic also, but with the price of wood it would be hard to keep the price down to a level that would be affordable as a beginners gun.
My 45 year old 1400 is a tack driver that easily shoots at 800 plus fps with 15 pumps and up as I have rebuilt it to make it a full dump gun with any number of pumps all the way to 25 pumps, it will go higher if you have eaten your Wheaties.
Buldawg
The niche that was once fille by Crosman 1400, Sharp Innova and Titan Mohawk is indeed empty as of today. That’s what I would love to see…a pump-up pneumatic in the region of 300-500$, with a decent trigger and a stock that suits adult shooters. There is no need to go nuts about the valve design and try to make a 12fp single stroke pneumatic, yet it would be rather easy to improve the relatively crude valve of a Benjamin 39X rifle.
Currently, there is no pump-up pneumatic between the 160$ Benjamin and the 2400$ Feinwerkbau 600. I often wondered for the reason. The market for springers is absolutely overcrowded, and said niche is not even covered by a single airgun.
Mel
I agree that there is no middle range level of pump gun that is available today also. I would love to see a pump gun that is all wood and metal that can be capable of the extreme velocities of today spring gun with 8 to 10 pumps range.
I have rebuilt and converted my 1400 to fill that niche by modifying the valve spring and hammer spring to allow it to fully exhaust all the air compressed into the valve regardless of the number of pumps used, the only problem with it in doing the mods to it is that it is a self cocker design in which that the hammer holds the valve closed against air pressure in the valve and when you pull the trigger it releases the hammer from holding the valve shut. This has the issue of causing the trigger pull to increase with each pump stroke so that at 20 or 25 pumps the trigger pull is about 10 plus pounds so it is increasingly more difficult to pull the trigger with the increase in pumps.
This design is also by todays standard considered unsafe as it will shoot with out you having to physically cock the gun, you just load a pellet and pump it up and it will shoot.
So yes I would like to see a nice wood and metal pumper that could compete with the spring and pcp guns today also.
Buldawg
I was looking for “starter” rifle for my 11 year old. Benjamin 392 was first choice, however it is VERY hard to pump for the kid. But I still like the look of 392 better, so probaby will end up getting it for myself 🙂
I have an NPG and an 880. I believe the pump handle is noticeably stouter on the Umarex. As Tom states here, the pump head is much larger and has more seals than I’ve ever seen on my other multi-pumpers. After getting used to the trigger on the APX (which is about on par with my 880), I can say that this APX will out shoot this 880.
buldawg
Do you have a part number for that rifled 760 barrel by chance.
I still have my wood stock with wood pump handle 760 with the rifled barrel. I got it in the early 70’s. I got a newer one also. Well its probably somewhere around 10 years old. Its a smooth bore. I would like to get a rifled barrel for it.
And yes my old 760 is a good shooter also. And it just feels different when you hold it compared to the newer model 760. I guess that’s what wood does to a gun.
Gunfun
I do not have a part number for the rifled barrel that I put in my grandsons 760 as it was one I got from ebay for the fact that it was rifled. I had to do some mods to make it fit into the newer gun where the receiver halves are held to the gun with two screws that thread into the barrel transfer port block and the rifled barrel did have the bosses but were not drilled and threaded. The transfer block on the new barrel is plastic where the one on the rifled barrel is metal. my best guess and suggestion is to look at the crosman schematics for the 761 or 766 models as I believe the 761 is the same as the 760 but with the rifled barrel instead of the smooth bore. I know that the first variant 760s back in the late 60s and into the early seventies were rifled barrels and I believe that is the era of the one I got from ebay. You will just have to search for 760 rifled barrel on ebay and check for the first variant schematics on crosman website, but you know as well,as I do that crosman will not help you determine which barrel is rifled and which one is not. I do believe that the barrel I got was from a 761 or 766 as it is 2 inches longer than the barrel that I removed from the gun.
I got my 22 hipac together and shot it some yesterday but it started to rain so it was only for a little while. I have my 177 tube sealed and am in the process of pinning the valve and installing the nylon face seal in the valve and getting it put together right now. Everything is working out as planned so far.
I will have my nitro venom tomorrow and the money has been sent for the nitro Benji that is going to be a parts donor. My whisper did not sell so I lowered the starting price and relisted it and will wait and see.
All plans for being able to start tuning and sighting all my guns are going as planned and the rain is supposed to done till the end of the weekend so it is looking good.
I will let you know the results as they develop.
Buldawg
buldawg
Ok I thought I was going to get lucky and you knew the part number. Yep I will have to do some checking.
So did you get to shoot enough yesterday to say you like your 22 hi-pac gun. Or still to soon to say. Did you ever get any of those premier heavy’s in the box to try yet? I think you said you were going to try them in a .177 caliber though. I don’t remember what you were going to try them in.
And I ended up putting that Leapers golden image fixed 4 power scope on my 2240 hi-pac with the Disco barrel. Its liking it.
Got the refund back on the Evanix so I’m on the prowl again. I did order me a Hawke scope when I got that E.Speed. So its going on the HW50s. When I got that E.Speed and the scope they had that 10% off plus free shipping going on. Wish they had it now because I’m ready to get something. They do got that 20% off if it rains on Oct. 25th. I checked the Farmers Almanac and it said for Ohio that rain is a possibility. I think the rules said it has to be 1 inch. It usually does rain pretty much in Oct. so I guess there’s achance to get the 20% off refund.
And yep let me know what happens.
Gunfun
No I did not get to shoot it enough to get it tuned completely but I am liking the results so far and I was just shooting it to get some fill cycles in it to make sure it would hold a charge and it is doing great so far. I was trying to get my 177 done also so I can tune both before I go to sight at 50 yards. I am going to try the 177 10.5 CPs in both my spring guns and the 2240 conversion, and that is why I am trying to get my 2240 177 done because my nitro venom that I am going to keep will be here tomorrow so it will be time for tuning and then sighting Thursday and Friday.
Check the link I sent you on the barrel for the 66 from ebay as I just checked the crosman manual for a model 66 and it is a rifled barrel so as long as your newer 760 has the square block with the four round bosses on it that the barrel is pressed into it should work and at the very worst case you may have to swap the barrel blocks between the two , I just used the one on the barrel I got because it was metal instead of plastic that was on the new one from the 760 stock.
Glad you got your refund and hope you can decide on a new toy so you can get in on the 20% off rain deal and prey to gods or do a rain dance on the 25th. I thought you were going to get a TX200 with the money, decisions, decisions, decisions.
Get the 66 barrel from ebay it will fit and is rifled and you can cut to the length you like.
Got to go get to work on the 2240 so I will talk to you later.
Buldawg
Gunfun
I don’t know if your newer 760 has the steel bolt handle or is the plastic one that has the block that the barrel is pressed into and is held in the transfer port of the valve and receiver by the two screws that go in either side of the receiver. If it is that style ( the difference is if the bolt handle is metal in the older style with a angled open barrel loading port and the newer style has the loading port as part of the receiver housing with a plastic probe that slides in the receiver housing ) there is a barrel on ebay for a power master model 66 that will work on the newer style 760s and looks to be 20 to 24 inches long, it is designed to have a shroud around it which is included is so it does not have the provision for rear sights or front sights from what I can see. It is a buy it now for a total with shippinjg of 10.79. I am not sure if it is rifled but I believe the power master 66s have a rifled barrel and it would only need the bosses on the side if the barrel block drilled and tapped to fit. here is the link .
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Barrel-housing-and-tube-Powermaster-66-air-bb-gun-/351170707483?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item51c367c01b
The crosman barrel number that I believe is a rifled barrel is 761-024, I am not sure it is but maybe the people at crosman can at least tell you if it is rifled or not. If it was me I would message the one on ebay and see if it is rifled and get it as you could cut it to the length you want or leave it long and have a very good and accurate newer 760. I know pitting the rifled barrel in my grandsons 760 made a world of difference in it accuracy.
Let me know what you do .
Buldawg
buldawg
Thanks for the link on the barrel.
And you got to get on the ball with that .177 hi-pac gun so you get all your setting up done.
And I should get the Tx200 but I do got a 54 air king that does pretty good. I’m thinking about a nitro piston gun but not for sure what yet. I see that Hatsan has some. Not really for sure yet.
Gunfun
I got the 177 2240 valve face seal installed and the valve pinned to the tube. Screwed the hipac assy into the tube and seated it against the nylon face seal and began to pressurize the hipac and the o-ring at the tube to the end that screws into the gun started leaking, so it took me some time to find just the right o-ring to fit right so the tube would screw all the way together against the adjoining tube face and completely seat tight together. I finally found the right size one and it is at 2000 psi and sitting till later before I go to bed, if it is still holding 2k psi then I will fill to 3k psi and let sit overnight. If it holds it will only take me 30 minutes to put the rest of the gun together and start tuning. I am very confident I have it fixed, my 22 cal has been holding 3k for several days after three shoot downs and refills so I do strongly believe the 177 is fixed and will be together tomorrow before my nitro venom gets here.
Let me know if you get that barrel from ebay as I think it would be a very good fit and allow you to tune the barrel length to your liking. You may have to cold blue it as it was a shrouded barrel so I don’t know what type of coating it has on it.
If you have an air king then in my opinion you have one of if not the best spring gun made, I know the one I built for the head instructor at the CMP range was a very smooth and accurate gun and would spit 177 pellets out at 970 fps all day long, I actually hoped he did not want to spend the money to fix it as I would have bought it and fixed it for myself.
I would take your time and do some comparison shopping for what is out there and want you don’t have one of if there is one style you don’t have. I can tell you some more about the crosman nitros after tomorrow when I get mine, if it is smoother than my firepower I will be very happy.
That Firepower is just very quiet and smooth for a spring gun and accurate as well for 40 bucks I am thoroughly pleased with it and only hope the nitro is as good or hopefully better.
I will let you know more later on the 177 when I check it for holding pressure.
Buldawg
It would take some whittling on the plastic but I think I could get enough room to fit that shroud down into the receiver a little bit. Cool idea!
Reb
I think you could trim out the receiver to fit the shroud in it but in the 760 I don’t think I would bother if the barrel is 7/16 in dia like the stock one I would just drill the two holes in the side of the transfer block and put it in the gun. The 760 uses a barrel band/ pump arm at the front of the pump tube that would not allow for the shroud to go past the band so it would be easier to just paint or cold blue the barrel if it is not been done already and put it in. Then GF1 could tune the barrel length to what the gun likes and have a nice light little pumper for cheap.
I know if I had not already found and bought a rifled barrel for my grandsons 760 I would jump on that model 66 barrel, It is a little cheaper than the one I got for my 760 as I think I paid 20 bucks for mine. it made a world of difference in the accuracy of the 760 and my grandson is becoming a very good shot. I understand why they put a smoothbore barrel in it because it is made to shoot BBs but it just makes it so inaccurate that ruin any effort you try to put into teaching a young shooter to aim correctly and that is what the gun is marketed for is first time shooters so put an accurate barrel in it to start with. heck they used to be rifled until every company had to start pinching pennies.
Buldawg
The newer 760’s also have a plastic receiver so I could see a big difference in handling characteristics of the 2 versions. I’ve been keeping an eye out for an affordable older 760 or 880. Wood &metal just feel right as opposed to the engineering resin they keep shoving down our throats.
I’m also interested in seeing the performance. As to the competition, I’m thinking in terms of my favorite multi-pump, the Benjamin 397 series which I came close to picking up. Perhaps its in a more expensive class than this gun, but the 397 would be hard to top.
Matt61
Matt61
The Benji 397 is way above the class of gun the this APX is in and much more expensive I am pretty sure of that. The APX seem to be more of an entry to mid level pumper , where the benji 397 is a upper level fine quality pumper right there with my old crosman 1400 as neither one of them have any plastic on them at all. If I did not have my 1400 and it still be in top notch condition I would buy a benji also, but it would be a 392 as I much prefer 22 over 177 in a pumper for the extra fpe they make. I bought my 1400 back in 1968 brand new and so I know how it was used and cared for, which in my childhood years I was to busy hunting with it to ever do any thing more to it than wipe it down and oil the piston when needed.
I to am interested in its performance and accuracy as it may be the next gun my grandson gets as he grows out of his 760 that he has now and is becoming a very good shot with, I wish I still had young eyes. We will have to wait for BB to finish his review to know more.
Buldawg
RifleDNA had one for a short while.
but he’s hard to find around here anymore.
He did say it was ridiculous easy to load
Reb
Are you talking about the benji 397 or the crosman 1400. My 1400 is very easy to load with its sliding breech cover that exposes the pellet tray completely so that you just drop the pellet into the tray and close the sliding breech cover.
I have never own a benji so I cannot comment on the ease of loading on them. Well I have to take that back as I have just bought one benji break barrel and one crosman nitro guns but have not received them yet. I will have the crosman tomorrow though and then the benji one next week.
Buldawg
That’s the same breech I had on my 1377 and I liked it but I was talking about what he said about his APX. It looks as wide open as those old Crosman sliding breech covers’.
Reb
yea the breech is quite open on the APX and looks like it would be easy top load pellets one at a time, I don’t know if it has one but something I would like to see is a detent setup that stops the bolt either at the full rear position for loading BBs and then one that stop the bolt at the position for loading pellets so you would not have to fiscally look to see if the bolt is in the position for the ammo you are shooting you would be able to feel the position. kind of like the detent on the 760s and 853/953C that allow you to advance the clip without having to look at it but rather just feel it move one position over as you load each pellet to fire it.
Buldawg
I’m a fan of multi pump air guns. I have an old Remington Airmaster 77 that’s a fine shooter. I tried the Daisy Model 35. It’s a smooth bore. My first one shot pellets great at 10 yards. BB’s not so good. But, it quit pumping air pressure while still under warranty. The second (warranty) Model 35 couldn’t hit the broad side of a barn, and it developed a problem pressure in short order. I gave up on that model. The first one was too good to be true. I then picked up a new Crosman Model 66. This gun has a rifled barrel. This gun shoots great! I don’t care for all the plastic used on it, but this little inexpensive multi pump shoots way better than I could have hoped.
I don’t do well with spring piston rifles. But, oddly, I have a Browning Buckmark Umarex spring piston pistol that I shoot well.
Anyway, I might be interested in this new Umarex. I didn’t see a price. Did I miss it? I’ll be looking forward to your accuracy tests.
My Remington Airmaster is my most reliable gun! It’s also very accurate!
Jon
I started out at 8 years old with a pumper with a 68 model crosman 1400 in 22 cal and I still have it today. it still shoots as good now as it did then, I have rebuilt it about a year ago but it did not really need it as it still would pump up and shoot fine. Just after 45 years and sitting my closet for the last 20 I figured it could use a fresh set of seals and piston cup. I do have a complete rebuild kit for it still also so it will be good for another 45 years.
I have never been a real fan of Daisy other than their Avanti series for target match shooting, I am just learning to like and shoot spring guns myself and am getting quite fond of them because of the ease of just needing pellets and a single cocking/pump to shoot with very high power levels.
I did not see a price yet either so we may have to check the PA site for it. I am interested in more info on it also.
Buldawg
Click on the top picture it will direct you to the PA page the describes the gun.
Clicking on any picture of it will take you to the Ad for it, -$60, 3.5# trigger and 800 fps.
Reb
I saw that and that price is very competitive , we just have to see how it shoots now.
Buldawg
I think it’ll shoot a lot like an 880, hopefully the little extra umph and more positive stock will keep it around 1/2″ out to 30 yards benching it.
Reb
I have not shot an 880 so I cannot have anything to compare with but lf it shoots ion the 700 to 800 fps and is accurate then it will be most likely god out to 30 yards benching it which is just about the only way I shoot any more as I am to shaky in the off hand position or kneeling. I can shoot prone pretty good just as long as it is not a time event as it take me awhile to get back to my feet.
Buldawg
Jon, about 60 bucks plus shipping, just click on the image at the top of the blog or follow this link:
/product/umarex-nxg-apx-air-rifle-combo?m=3524
Looks like an excellent plinker, just waiting for BB’s report on how accurate it may be.
Mike I posted to quick. I saw you posted the link but overlooked that you also told about clicking on the picture. I need to slow down and read.
The pellets in this rifle are loaded one by one in what looks like a tray, easy to reach and no need for any kind of magazine. I recently purchased a Crosman M4-177 and disliked the pellet magazine. I don’t see a reason for a multi pump to be a repeater, and if you do want a repeater, it is much easier to go with bbs.
By the way, the old question of durability of the barrel rifling using the steel bbs come to mind. How serious is the wear using the steel bbs? Any clue on how long would the barrel last using bbs?
Fred_BR,
I see airguns that are 40 years old and have been shot a lot in that time and the rifling still looks good. I will say it lasts indefinitely.
B.B.
Huh? Is that right? I’ve seen you say it before, but I just can’t get myself to shoot BBs for fear of doing permanent damage. I guess I should get over my phobia.
BB, what is the very best multi pump out there, in your opinion? (In terms of foot pounds and accuracy?) Would like others opinions too.
Thanks,
Rob
Rob,
At this time for the money its the Benjamin 392. The Independence is great6, but too expensive for most to own.
Sharp of Japan used to make wonderful multi-pumps that would cost about $600-700 today if they were still being made. They sold the machinery to Indonesia and the rifles continued to be made but the quality tanked. Webley now sells one of those they call the Rebel, which I plan to test soon.
B.B.
Here, here for the Benjamin. And I believe you can scope them too.
Matt61
I asked my chess friend yesterday how long he has had his Sheridan Blue Streak, and he said he bought it new about 40 years ago! Still shoots it.
I would like to have a multi-pump/on-board pump PCP rifle based on the Discovery.
RB
I like that Idea also. A Discovery built on the FX Independence design.
Isn’t multi-pump and pcp a contradiction in terms?
Matt61
Your website seems broken. Trying to look at any post before todays takes me back to the 5th of september and skips over all the days in between.
If you click the archive link it works fine and paginates like normal.
works fine for me. maybe you need to clear your cache?
Tried it on multiple devices.
Even tried using wget, which has no concept of cache. The URLS are not the same either.
The following URLS are just the last part since this comment system does not like links.
“Previous posts” takes you to /blog/page/2/ which has only the one article from the 5th. If you look at the september archive link that takes you to /blog/2014/09/ which works fine.
It looks like it works ok, but instead of the previous link showing yesterdays articles it takes you back to the 5th.
Steven,
You are correct. Pyramyd AIR is aware of this issue. I’m waiting for them to fix it.
Thanks,
Edith
Thanks, I just wanted to make sure somebody knew about it.
I don’t get a chance to read everyday, but I do make sure to read them all. Still working my way through the older articles. Which is now much more pleasant on my tablet with the new layout.
Thanks! You guys are really doing something special here.
At least the price ain’t bad.
But the stock looks like somebody was staring at a stealth jet before they designed the stock. I don’t mind a synthetic stock on a gun that’s going to get knocked around verses wood. But I just don’t like the lines of the stock on the APX. I like the smooth flow of a standard stock.
And if the guns a shooter I guess I can close one eye when I pick the gun up. Then maybe the stock will only look half as bad. Well depending on if I use my good eye or my bad one.
I too love wood. I always said I was born in the wrong generation. I like airplanes from the WW’s one and two. I like the look of the ladies they adored and painted. I like the smooth, velvet feel of oiled walnut in my hand and against my cheek when I pull a trigger. I was lamenting the lack of class in women, planes, and firearms these days to my good friend who was born between the wars, and he just laughed. He was an engineer for Northrop and Douglass back in the day and he said this about plastics: “when it is the right tool for a job, you use it. They make plastic that is stronger and lighter and cheaper than steel, doesn’t oxidize, and will last a hundred years. How much will YOU care about it in a hundred years!?”
The old fart had a good point. Now that I’m becoming an older fart, I don’t mind carving, machining, and finishing furniture for a pellet rifle. I’ve spent more money on wood for a gun than the gun itself. And then had one of my kids out shoot me with the plastic version. But . . . My young, about-to-be-a-dad son can afford to buy and shoot the plastic version–where the one that feels right to me is out of his reach. We’ve discussed his next build–mine too. We are going to do the HPA Crosman pistol build ups. Mine will be pretty and accurate. His will just be pretty accurate. A sharp shooting, plastic gripped carbine, not nearly as pretty as what I have planned for mine. You know, the kid is pretty smart . . . Must be his mom’s fault!
Zack,
Everything has a place. I love cars from the 1950s. But I also remember seeing lots of cars stopped on the side of the road all the time in the ’50s. Cars needed a LOT more maintenance & attention. Today, cars dead on the side of the road are an uncommon sight. I’ll take today’s cars over yesterday’s for getting from point A to point B — which is the whole purpose of a car. I can still appreciate the styles from the great age of cars of decades past. I just don’t want to have to depend on them to get me where I’m going.
Edith
Edith
I can appreciate your perspective on newer cars, but when a new car does quit on the side of the road my wife’s fingernail file and a book of matches along with a pair of pliers and a screwdriver will not get that new car rolling down the road again, whereas it will on an old car. Both have there plus and minus and because myself being a master auto mechanic much prefer the golden oldies to the plastic newbies.
But that is what makes America great is that we all are entitled to our own opinions and choices.
Sorry but I just could not resist.
Buldawg
Zach
Those 2240’s with the hi-pac are cool little guns. And if you keep them at 2000psi they are easy to fill with a hand pump.
It sound’s like you got a plan.
The MSP & SSP dreams (If they build it we will come)
Allow me to offer my two cents since I’ve spent thousands of dollars and many years to learn about the MSP & SSP “dreams” that are being shared on this blog this morning.
It’s all been done. The market is slim and a quality product costs money.
Converting a discovery to a msp has been done. Search the crosman forum. Around 12 custom parts and you have a Frankenstein that will work for awhile.
Why doesn’t crosman produce a msp or ssp using the marauder and/or discovery platform since they undoubtedly could mass produce at a lower price point than the hobbyists that are doing one offs in their garage? Because, IMHO, they learned from the FX Independence and FX Indy.
You want powerful, self contained, accurate, quiet? Get an Independence that can be tuned to shoot 20fpe consistently for 4 shots then you pump it back up 8 times (2 pumps per shot). You want more power? Tune it back up to 30fpe and pump 4 times per shot. Good triggers on these guns and they can be very quiet.
You want more power? Get an Indy in .30 caliber.
Don’t overlook a sharp ace or sharp innova in your search. Great guns with good triggers, good power and decent accuracy.
Want a 20+fpe msp that will excel in every department? Buy a titan Mohawk. My .22 cal had an optional match trigger, ldc and French walnut thumbhole stock with figure that would knock your socks off. Two strokes and it shot a 15.8gr pellet 620fps (13.5fpe). 3 strokes and it shot 780fps (21fpe)
If you can live with a little less power, still demand efficiency and don’t want to break the bank buy a Benjamin 392ACP. You can still buy them new.
Here’s what I learned….self contained sounds great but comes at a price. On board charging equipment (pump, linkage, etc) adds weight and the better pumps are side pumps which throws the gun off balance. Buying a QUALITY gun AND pump together, in one package costs money. An efficient MSP requires at least two strokes and these are usually awkward, side levers that have long throws. The third stroke on are not fun.
If you don’t mind pumping and need power get a pcp with a separate pump that is unattached to the gun and pump up your gun 2-3 times for each shot ALL AT ONCE WITH AN EASIER PUMP STROKE.
kevin
Kevin
I know what your saying but think about it another way also. The FX Independence would make a nice survival gun. That is less equipment you have to have or carry with you.
If there was a true self contained PCP gun made and priced a little cheaper than the competition. I believe the guns would sell. If I was only going to buy one or two good pcp guns for a specific purpose and never buy anymore the on board pump would at least balance out the cost of a hand pump,bottles and compressors.
But in my case it would be just buying another gun. I get air guns so I can experience the different characteristics they offer. So yep I would never only be able to buy one or two guns. To much cool stuff out there to limit myself to only two.
Gunfun1,
“I know what your saying but think about it another way also. The FX Independence would make a nice survival gun. That is less equipment you have to have or carry with you.”
You’re always carrying the pump in a self contained ssp/msp.
“If there was a true self contained PCP gun made and priced a little cheaper than the competition. I believe the guns would sell. If I was only going to buy one or two good pcp guns for a specific purpose and never buy anymore the on board pump would at least balance out the cost of a hand pump,bottles and compressors.”
Not sure what PCP and power you’re referring to. Cheaper is relative. Power, accuracy, good trigger, reliability AND self contained comes at a price. Personally I think the Independence is cheap for what it is and what it does.
“But in my case it would be just buying another gun. I get air guns so I can experience the different characteristics they offer. So yep I would never only be able to buy one or two guns. To much cool stuff out there to limit myself to only two.”
I like to try a variety of airguns too and formulate my own opinions. That’s fun for me. Don’t let my post inhibit you from trying all the guns mentioned first hand.
kevin
Kevin
What I mean by cheaper is if somebody like Crosman could produce a good quality gun and offer it at lets say 4 or 500 dollars cheaper than the Independence I think they would sell that gun.
And also what I’m getting at if a person was to buy just only one pcp gun and it had its own pump system attached to the gun and lets say it did sell for $1000. There are pcp guns out there right now as you know that cost $1000 with out the attached pump. Then you have to purchase a fill device whether it is a hand pump, bottles or a compressor. So if you add them costs up you will probably go over the cost of a Independence.
And even if the gun would become out of balance that would be just a little problem to have. What is good I could pick that gun up and shoot it anytime no matter where I’m at and never have to worry if the electric is not working for my compressor. And also that would be less support equipment to carry if I was out hiking in a survival situation. Weight is a killer plus the extra bottle or pump could take up room for more important things like food and water when your out for a day let alone maybe weeks or more if one of those natural disasters or other things would happen. At least with the Independence you will always be ready to shoot and not depend on anything else.
And yep everything cost something you just have to weigh out the costs for your needs.
And as far as trying different guns go you bet I will but only one problem. My gun hobby is kind of like my old muscle car hobby was. I had to sell one to get one. Never seem to have the money to keep’em and buy more. Well at least with the air guns I have been able to hold on to some of the ones I bought. But there are some that I’m glad to see go. I’m thinking you know what I mean.
B.B., about an hour after I posted yesterday I realized mis-wrote. I should have at least called it the predecessor of the M-1. The movie took some liberties with the facts, but I still find it amazing that Williams was able to work on his project while in prison.
I hope Edith and you are doing well.
~Ken
Hmm, not a Daisy, but sure looks heavily inspired by one:) Interested to see how accurate it is and how it holds up. While the stock looks strange, it also looks like it could be comfortable- and that’s what matters to me.
Tom,
This looks a lot like the Black Ops Junior Sniper. I wonder if their powerplants are the same. Their specs on the Pyramyd air’s website are quite different from each other.
Disappointing to me is your observation that this rifle is difficult to pump. The best thing about the Daisy 880 is the easy pumping, Hmmm.
Nevertheless, this is pretty interesting.
Michael
Michael,
Not pumping — cocking. The bolt has to be cocked before the gun can be pumped. It is the cocking I was addressing, not the pumping which is equivalent.
B.B.
That 953 I had was hard to cock the bolt for some reason. Matter of fact I changed that spring in mine.
Tom,
Ah! I need to have two cups of coffee before I comment in the AM, I guess.
Well, within reason, cocking effort is not too big of a deal for me. As for pumping effort, you wrote, “The pump strokes also feel like they’re doing a lot.” Does that mean that it pumps with more difficulty than, say, a Crosman 2100B?
Michael
Michael,
Not so much harder as you feel the resistance sooner.
B.B.
Baron Wulfraed are you the same as Wulfraed? You sound a lot like him. Thanks a lot for the info on lights. I’m moved to remember a scene from the Nicholas Cage film, Conair. One convict is explaining to another convict how he is rewiring a plane’s transponder to defeat detection and steal the plane, and the other guy says, “How do you know all this stuff?”
buldawg76, ha ha. So, if you are supposed to feel the rock concert, what exactly do you feel? It must be powerful vibrations accompanied by a powerful beat. And what’s the emotion? Are you filled with happiness? Exultation? That seems to be the case from the people I see. Anyway, I love your attitude. I’m reminded of rock star Keith Richards who recently gave a quote to the effect that his life was devoted to sampling every kind of extreme experience by any means available. He looks like he’s been around but his flag is still flying at an advanced age. The fact is that nothing last forever. So, of you can look back at an experience and say it was worth it, then, to quote Jesus in the Bible, “Surely you have taken the better part.” But I think I’ll enjoy my rock concerts through you. 🙂
Gunfun1, good man, you won’t regret following through on either the Mosin or the Garand. Now that I’ve moved I’m getting ready to reload for my next outing with the Garand.
David Enoch, I’ve only had fired 80 rounds out of my Mosin and my box of 700 surplus sniper rounds remains unopened, so the best is yet to come. The best I can say about the shooting experience is that it feels like a 30 caliber bolt action rifle or like my other military bolt action rifles. A caveat is that I was shooting factory ammo of 180 gr. whereas my surplus ammo is 150 gr. so it will probably be lighter. Recoil was stiffer than the Garand and it did not have that symphonic, resonant booming sensation. In other words, you aren’t buffered by the action absorbing some of the gas. On the other hand, the Mosin was not painful or distracting to shoot at all. As to accuracy, I got a little mixed up sighting in the scope and then losing some of my rested technique. Results at 50 yards were outstanding with the rounds on top of each other. Things drifted a little bit at 100 for the reasons mentioned above and one other. There’s a YouTube review saying that the Mosin shots start to wander with prolonged shooting because of the rifle’s standard profile, non-target barrel. Maybe, but my rested technique could have used a lot of improvement.
You can get a good Mosin online easily enough for a little over $100. One place sells them by the crate. You can improve your odds of accuracy by getting a sniper rifle, but here you get into dangerous territory. First the cost is greater. Mine was almost $500. Second, you can’t be sure if you really are getting genuine sniper rifles and whether they are still in condition or shot out. I was told that mine was reconditioned after World War II so it met the sniper standards which were about 1 MOA, but were not of war vintage. That was fine with me. My gunsmith’s verdict is that if the rifle is a fake, it’s a good one. I’m happy with it, but the bargain probably lies in getting a quality standard Mosin and mounting the Scout scope that B.B. described.
Speaking of bbs as in today’s featured gun, my move has allowed me to rediscover the joys of airsoft which has given way to my pellet guns for a number of years. In particular I’m enjoying my 1911. It is perfect for practicing close-quarters battle and instinct shooting. I just vacuum up the rounds afterwards. I’ve also discovered the value of concealing the gun at the lower back. It looks uncomfortable. But it actually feels okay because of the lumbar curve and it is faster to reach than I had supposed.
Matt61
Matt61
I have been listening to you over time talking about yours. And maybe that’s true if I don’t shoot it as often it will be more affordable.
I like the Garands so that will be it if all my stars line up.
Gunfun
The 177 hipac cylinder is at 28kpsi and it held 2k until 9 pm then went to 2500 psi and held till 10 pm when it got set at 2800 psi so if it is still holding in the am I will have it together and shooting by the afternoon.
I am getting anxious to see how it does with the 10.5 CPs in fps and get it tuned to around 900 fps , then go get it sighted with my 3,5x 10 x40mm Leupold scope on it. the 22 hipac has a red/green dot sight on it now and I will sight it for my backyard right now.
Then after I get my two nitro guns and figure out what the firepower and benji are going to get swapped out and tuned I will sight them in, the scope from on of the nitros will probably end up on the 22 hipac, but I will just have to see how they all fall together depending on their shooting ease and accuracy.
Buldawg.
buldawg
The decisions never end do they. Sometimes its fun dialing in them new guns. Sometimes its a pain in the you know what. And I still ain’t decided which way I’m going to go on my next gun.
And at least that’s a good sign on the .177 hi-pac gun. And my .177 cal hi-pac gun likes the JSB 10.34 a bit better than the 10.5 premiers. But the Hatsan loves the premiers. So you just don’t never know till you give them a try in different guns. So it will be interesting to see what your .177 cal. guns like.
Let me know what you come up with tomorrow.
Gunfun
Remember my 177 has the lothar walther barrel from a Daisy Avanti that I fixed for a customer and was able to keep the barrel so it is any ones guess as to what pellet it will like, It was used to shooting at 500 fps not 8 or 900 fps. It does have a good choke in the last 2 inches of the barrel as I pushed a pellet down thru the barrel after I got in machined to fit the crosman breech to see if it would hang up the lead in and it works great and the hollow bolt probe lines up perfectly with the transfer port in the barrel that I drilled and spot faced.
I don’t have any JSB 10.34s so I may have to put in an order to PA for some JSBs and CPs in the box, I will shoot it some and see before I order any.
Like I said you need to shop around and do some comparisons on different guns you would like and find something you like. I was looking at the FX independence that you and Kevin were discussing and I think having the pump incorporated in the gun is pretty neat, but it does not say how you do the initial fill. Do you use the pump on the gun or do you fill it with a hand pump or tank first and then just keep it topped up as you shoot or do you fill completely with the on board pump, if you fill with the on board pump how many pump does it take to get to the 2 bar fill and how hard is it to pump I know with my hand pump to fill the hipacs to 3k I have to use my full body weight to get the last 1000 psi in it and I don’t think you would have that kind of leverage with the on board pump. Just wondering because if I was going to spend 1500 bucks or more on an air gun it will be one from the XP-airguns site and either the ranger 45 or the Quigley 72 because I just want an air gun that can pulverize just about anything you would want to shoot.
Buldawg
buldawg
I couldn’t remember what barrel you were doing. Between you and me we got alot projects happen’n all the time. But that barrel just might be a big surprise and throw them pellets good out of that hi-pac gun if you hit the 900 fps mark.
And you know what I have been thinking. I may not buy anything right now. I got the synthetic Mrods that are doing good and now the Hatsan QE also. Then the .177 cal. hi-pac gun with the 23” Disco barrel and almost last but not least the HW50s and then last but not least the 54 air king.
I have only shot the 54 a couple times through out the last 5 years or so. When I started messing around with the pcp guns back then I sold some of my springer’s and nitro piston guns to get the pcp guns. But I have always managed to hang on to the 54. Its been at my brothers house and I would shoot it here or there when I went out there. I decided tonight at work that I’m going to go and get it Friday from him and start shooting it again. I can’t even remember what scope I have on it.I think its a Bushnell Banner. But I just may take that scope off the 54 and put it on the HW50s and put that Hawke 1/2 mildot I just got with that Evanix and put it on the 54. If I remember right the 54 will stretch out on distance a little farther than the HW50s. But that’s kind of my plan for the weekend sight the scopes in on those 2 guns after I swap them.
Then the FX Independence. Its been a while since I checked them out. But from what I remember you can fill them from empty with the on board pump. And you can top them off with 2 or 3 pumps between shots. Or shoot 3 or 4 shots then pump it back up and top it off. I would think if you found the sweet spot on the fill pressure you could just do a pump or two after each shot to maintain that psi and get a consistent fps out of the gun. That should be a accurate combination I would think if you did it that way.
But I know just recently that somebody posted a reply that they just got a new Independence. You know my memory I can’t remember who it was. Hopefully they will be reading and can post first hand what kind of experience they have had so far. I would like to know.
Wow that was a long one. But got to get to sleep. Got to get up at 7:00 am with the kids tomorrow. Talk to you later.
Gunfun
I hope the 853 barrel does good on the hipac and as soon as I get done replying to you here I am going to check the pressure and if it is holding then get it put together and start the tuning of it and my 22 cal. The 22 should be close as I have already tuned it some before it started to leak so it is set back at the same 4 turns in on the hammer spring. I will know in awhile, it is perfect weather here with calm wind and temps in the low 80s with low humidity.
I would get that 54 from your brothers house and start shooting it some more for sure, I really liked the one I worked on other than it being so heavy, but I think that is part of why it is so smooth along with the sliding action. I just would not want to tote it through the woods for very long.
So on the independence you fill from 0 to full with the on board pump, how many pumps does it take, it must move a lot of air per pump. I would think it would be a real bear to get pumped up to full unless it is designed to multiply the leverage enough to make it easier to pump than you would think it is. What is its operating pressure as the website does not give much info about the pumping and fill procedure other than you can pump twice between shots to keep it at its peak or shoot it 4 or 5 times and then pump 8 to 10 times to refill. I hope that whoever got that independence will chime in and give some more info on it as it sound like it would be as good as spring gun in that all you need is the gun and pellets to have some shooting fun.
Got to go check my hipac cylinder now and start putting the gun together so I can start tuning it before my nitro venom gets here so I will talk to you later,
Buldawg
buldawg
Been raining here today and is suppose to all day. Kind of cool right now. Suppose to make it to 70 today but not sure that’s going to happen. But sounds like you have a nice day ahead of you.
Yep the 54 is definitely coming home. I think I’m going to give my pcp guns and ShoeBox compressor a little break for a while and shoot my springer’s like I use too. And the 54 is a excellent bench rest gun because of the extra weight. And usually when I was shooting at my brothers I had my hand holding on to a tree or branch then wresting the gun on my arm. I now got that adjustable bi-pod that I have been using for the pcp guns that is working out nice if I’m out in the yard or woods. So I want to try it with the 54. I have used the bi-pod with the hw50 already and it likes it. So will see how that goes.
And as far as the FX Independence goes I don’t remember to much of the details about the gun. But I did a search a long while back and found a FX video they made and it mentioned if I remember right the pumping effort was not that bad because of the leverage the linkage made. And again I’m going by memory.
Let me know how things go today. Time for work again. Talk to you later.
Gunfun
I finally got some tuning done on both hipacs today and it went very good and I am very pleased with the 177. The 22 did very good also and held up well but I just refilled it to 2800 psi and when I put the rubber cap on the foster nipple it came right back off so the check valve o-ring has started to leak after holding for 6 days and three shooting tune sessions today. I have some better stem type valves with a better o-ring that I will put in it in the future.
Back to the tuning results, first the 177 is finalized as follows.
10.5gr CPs domed,hammer spring adjuster flush with end of tube cap, fill pressure of 26/2700 psi, total shots above 800 FPS = 25, max FPE = 22.58
High FPS = 984.0
Low FPS = 816.5
AVG = 915.1
ES = 167.5
SD = 50.42
The 177 is hitting harder than the 22 is and makes more FPE so now it is time to get the scope mounted and sight it in, but that is going to have to wait till Friday as I was just informed by the boss that it is grandparents day tomorrow at my 8 year old grandsons school and I have never been able to go before due to working so now that I am not working I am looking forward to going.
Now for the 22 which I am still very happy with and it could be tuned stronger but I don’t want to lose the good shot count it has in the tune it is set at as follows.
14.3 CPs hollow point, 2800 psi fill pressure, 4 1/2 turns in from flush with end of tube cap, total shots above 600 FPS = 20, max FPE = 18.39
High FPS = 761.2
Low FPS = 613.6
AVG = 709.6
ES = 147.5
SD = 44.74
The 22 is shooting good , I would like to have a little higher FPS but don’t want to drop below 20 shots per fill so it is as good as it can be and keep a decent shot count. I am just going to have to take the first tube off and swap out the check valve pin and o-ring, or may be there is just something caught under it. I don’t think so though because when I disassembled the tube to do the machining on them I noticed the o-ring on the check valve stem had a small cut or tear in it and I replaced it with one of the extras that came with the kits. I don’t think that the o-ring is of a high enough durometer to handle the pressure or is to small and is being cut by the opening of the foster fill port inside the tube. I have some better ones that I will swap it out with that have a larger dia head and bigger o-ring.
All in all though I am very happy with the results, especially the 177 as it actually did better than I expected with it at the lowest setting as I would not want the adjuster to be threaded out past flush with the end of the cap. I may even put the stock spring back in and see if I can get it down around 900FPS max with a higher shot count because the 984 FPS is getting into the transonic range and may affect accuracy some. I will decide that when I go to sight it in, it will be an easy change as since I drilled and tapped the cap the same thread so all I have to do is unthread the adjuster and swap the springs and then readjust the tension on the spring.
Have a good night at work and I will talk to you later.
Buldawg
Gunfun
I forgot to add that my nitro gun did not show up today like the tracking said it would it has been stuck in Warrendale PA since Sunday and has not updated on it status since then. I am going to call the USPS tomorrow and see what the issue is, it has 200 dollars insurance on it so if it is lost or damaged I can at least buy a new one or something different since I have the Benji nitro coming also. Its just a bummer if it is lost or damaged.
Buldawg
buldawg
Sounds like things are working out.
And my 1377 and 2240 did better with the .177 Disco barrel than any of the .22 cal. barrels I tried. Even when I still was running the Co2 cartridge in the 2240 before the hi-pac conversion.
And I always insure my packages also. But that’s a bummer when your expecting it and it doesn’t show up.
Its getting thin on my phone. If you comment back I have some replys over on today’s blog about the P1. Just post over there if you want. And there ain’t as many post over there. Easier to scroll through the comments. Talk to you later.
Mat61
Back in the 70s Matt I can honestly say that I was not aware of what I really felt at a concert as I grew up in Loco Cocoa beach Florida. Brevard county Florida had the intercostal waterway that was connected to the ocean by Port Canaveral and had one Coast guard boat to patrol 150 miles of coast line at in the 70s Brevard county was second only to New York City in smuggling of drugs into the US. Now I am not admitting to anything but lets just say I had a very colorful teenage life and at concerts it did not matter if you did do drugs or not because the air (or should I say smoke clouds ) was so thick that you would be feeling good no matter what and you were happy, Happy and Happier as the concert progressed. I was most definitely experiencing exultation and many other emotions all at once.
I would not change a thing as I have always lived like there is no tomorrow and I have been through wrecks and mishaps that should have taken me from this earth but I still remain above ground and living.
I believe in the lord, but I also believe in fate in that there is nothing I can do on this earth to cause my death until the lord is ready for me and that he has my day already planned out for me so that until it arrives I can live the way I like and walk on the edge and tempt fate because there is no greater high than your bodies very own adrenaline rush from when you cross that line for a split second and survive to tell about it.
I have been in more motorcycles crashes on my dirt bikes growing up than I can count , have been thrown out of cars in wrecks and many other on the edge of a cliff type situations that the rushes have about lost there appeal and the fact that my 18 year old mind and 58 year old body don’t get along the way they used to so that what I want to do my body cannot do. but I will continue to live as if it is my last day because you will never know when it is. So I would rather die doing what I love than sit and wait for time to catch up to me. We are only here once so get all you can while you are here is the way I live and always will until it is my DAY.
Buldawg
Most likely… At some time in the recent past when the site no longer agreed with Firefox’s memory I probably expanded the “name”. The on-line “Wulfraed” has always been a baron…
http://home.earthlink.net/~baron.wulfraed/wr_biog.htm
(Frith — I need to update that page… mid-50s now; a true greymuzzle)
Hello BB and Fellow Airgunners
I have never warmed up to the idea of multi pump guns. That you need to pump a gun up to ten strokes before you can shoot, has never been appealing. Not when I can achieve the same result with one. i.e. a break barrel. That being said, I do understand the people who are devoted to these guns. A clear case of each to his own.
One look at this Umarex NXG APX, and it becomes evident who Umarex plans to market this gun to. All the shoot-em-up computer games young males enjoy playing, sport a multitude of futuristic looking weapons. As much as most of us demand accuracy, and quality in our air gun purchases, young male teens tend to lean to a gun that looks as cool as the weapons they use for gaming. This rifle defiantly fills that demand. As an example, At the age of 15, I remember having an argument with my Dad about the type of bicycle I wanted to buy. My dad was adamant I purchase a single speed with fat tires, but I wanted a ten speed with road racing tires. The fact that a lot of the roads I would be using were gravel didn’t enter in my decision. I wanted to look the part, and my Dad was being “old fashioned”. After fixing a few flat tires, I began to see the wisdom to my Dads way of thinking.
I just hope this gun is of good enough quality so as not to turn off a young shooter to our wonderful sport.
Ciao
Titus
I actually like the looks of this air rifle, and bought one in the future (I often go back in time and read Tom’s earlier articles. They are no less valuable to me because they were written years ago–thanks Tom). I find airguns like the Crosman MK177 and M4-177 more designed for youngsters who play war video games and such. The NPX just has a hint of this militarized look. And you certainly do not have to pump this type of airgun 10 times. In fact, I never use maximum pumps on any of my multi’s. Eight for hunting, and as little as three for punching paper.
B.B. I have to agree with Titus that Umarex’s marketing is definetly geared toward the younger generations. I’ll admit the rifle looks pretty cool as do there others but just to new style for me. I like funky sometimes but have more of a traditional with innovation streak in me. But if it shoots well and brings the youth in more to the sport cool by me.
On what others are saying, I am not a big multi pump fan myself even though I have a Crosman m4 for plinking fun, but it will sit now indefinitely because my new Crosman 1077 is taking it’s place. More fun less pumping… Unless it’s a PCP…
Glad you’re enjoying your 1077!I’ll be watching for these APX’s on the used market.
Reb, sorry so late but thanks and hope your getting better Sir.
Personally I have just gotten back into air guns. And have found that I am really enjoying the 2100 classic air rifle.
I am going to be looking for this on PA as well at my local stores, at a price of just $60 one is going to come home with me. I am a bit old school and must say I like the looks of a wood and iron gun myself, one of the things that drew me to the 2100.
I must agree with what others have said I tried an 880 and it left such a bad taste in my mouth I did not touch another “cheap” air gun for a long time. I then bought the 2100, and my faith was restored. I have a few other Umarex guns and have been very happy with them. I hope this is no different. I am not done with daisy but the only thing I am likely to buy is an Avanti…the rest of their products are very lacking, and I let people know that when I am at stores like Bass Pro, Cabelas, Dicks, even Walmart. The current Daisy branded offerings are just not good products at all.
i have this gun i love it, great aim but a little loud. But over all i love it buy it. FYI very good for squirls
For those talking about replacing the Crosman 760 smooth bore barrel with a rifled one, according to some of the guys over at Gateway To Airguns forum, it’s the barrel from the Crosman MK-177 that is a direct fit. Barrels from the Model 66 are, I believe, different. MK 177-010 is the part number for the barrel. I think they are about $10.