by Tom Gaylord
Writing as B.B. Pelletier
New 4-inch Dan Wesson pellet revolver from ASG is very realistic!
This report covers:
- Loading the CO2
- Loading the cartridges
- The tests
- RWS Basic
- Crosman Premier lite
- Qiang Yuan training pellets
- Shot count
- Trigger pull
- Analysis
- 2017 Pyramyd AIR Cup
- 2017 Texas Airgun Show
Today I test the velocity of the Dan Wesson 4-inch pellet revolver. This should be an interesting test.
Loading the CO2
I installed a fresh CO2 cartridge in the grip, after putting a couple drops of Crosman Pellgunoil on the tip of the cartridge before piercing. The oil gets blown into the valve and coats every seal inside, ensuring the gun remains gas-tight.
Loading the cartridges
The cartridges load from the rear, which is easy to do. The pellets slip into the plastic liners of each cartridge easily and stay there securely until the gas blows they into the barrel.
The loaded cartridges also load easily into the cylinder. When you’re done shooting, all you have to do is open the cylinder and tip the muzzle up and the cartridges fall right out. There is no expansion from gas the way there is with a firearm cartridge.
The tests
I will test the revolver in both single action and double action fire. We want to know how consistent the action is in either mode, as well as whether there is a big difference in velocity.
I waited a minimum of 10 seconds between each shot, and sometimes longer. CO2 cools the airgun as it is discharged and cooling leads to lower pressure, which means less velocity. CO2 guns are just not well-suited for rapid fire, unless certain special things are done to them.
RWS Basic
First up was the 7-grain RWS Basic pellet. This pellet weighs the same as an RWS Hobby, but sells for less. Basics averaged 376 f.p.s. on single action and had a spread of 31 f.p.s., from 362 to 393 f.p.s. When shot double action the average was 380 f.p.s. and the spread tightened to 8 f.p.s., ranging from 376 to 384 f.p.s.
Crosman Premier lite
Crosman Premier lites weigh 7.9 grains and averaged 359 f.p.s. from the Dan Wesson revolver when fired single action. The spread was 22 f.p.s. and went from 345 to 367 f.p.s. When fired double action, Premier lites averaged 358 f.p.s. and had a spread of 10 f.p.s. The range was from 354 to 364 f.p.s.
Qiang Yuan training pellets
The last pellet I tested was the 8.2-grain Qiang Yuan training pellet. This was the heaviest pellet I tested, but I think the results are going to surprise you. They loaded into the cartridges easier than the other two pellets and in single action they averaged 376 f.p.s. — the same as the lightweight RWS Basics. The velocity spread went from a low of 367 f.p.s to a high of 383 f.p.s. That’s a range of 16 f.p.s.
In double action this pellet averaged 363 f.p.s.and the spread went from 360 to 368 f.p.s., a range of just 8 f.p.s. This pellet is very efficient in the revolver.
Shot count
At this point in the test there were a total of 39 shots on this CO2 cartridge. Now I returned to the RWS Basics that had averaged 376 f.p.s. in single action, and I started seeing how many good shots there were on the cartridge. Shot number 51 went out the muzzle at 350 f.p.s. You might be tempted to think the gun was slowing down, but then shot 62 went out at 365 f.p.s. Don’t count it out yet. Shot 71 was 308 f.p.s., so the gun is definitely slowing, though the shots are still powerful. Shot 81 was 245 f.p.s. which is getting low enough to stop shooting. Given that the cylinder holds 6 rounds I think it’s safe to say there are 12 good cylinders or 72 shots in one CO2 cartridge.
Trigger pull
In the single action mode, where the hammer is cocked manually, the trigger breaks at 5 lbs. even. When the trigger is pulled to fire the gun in the double action mode the pull is just over 9 lbs. It ranges between 9 lbs. 2 oz and 9 lbs. 4 oz. That’s very light for a double action trigger pull
Analysis
I learned several things from this test. First, the average velocity with lead pellets seems to be around 376 f.p.s. Sure, I could have loaded lead-free alloy pellets and probably would have gotten velocities above the 410 f.p.s. rating, but these are the velocities you will see with the kind of pellets you will most likely use.
I also discovered the revolver is more stable when shooting in the double action mode. With each pellet the velocity spread was about half as large as it was in single action.
The average velocity was close to the same in both modes, with a very slight bias toward single action. When I shoot it for accuracy I will be shooting single action only, because I am not that good in the double action mode. That takes training and practice.
2017 Pyramyd AIR Cup
The 2017 Pyramyd AIR Cup will be held August 25 – 27, 2017 at the Tusco Rifle Club in New Philadelphia, Ohio. There will be more information on this event very soon.
2017 Texas Airgun Show
Unfortunately, I will not be able to attend the Pyramyd AIR Cup this year, because the 2017 Texas Airgun Show is being help on Saturday August 26 at the Arlington Sportsman’s Club in Mansfield, Texas. I do plan on attending the 2017 Flag City Toys That Shoot airgun show in Findlay, Ohio on Saturday, April 8, so if you want to see me, look for me there. I will share two tables with Dennis Quackenbush.
BB, Thanks for the report on the revolver,It looks like a classic Dan Wesson. Is the rear sight adjustable for both windage and elevation?Do you think it is capable of humanely taking out say,a red squirrel at four to eight yards?I have a little outlaw getting inside my big plastic garbage can w/lid on!I don’t want to put a hole in my can if he’s near it and I miss?Thanks,Dan
Toto,
Yes the rear sight adjusts both ways and no, this gun is incapable of killing small game. You need a lot more power for that.
B.B.
I must be in the minority, we had squirrels in our attic, hired an animal trapper to catch them and toss them in the woods miles away, cost me a chunk but it kept my wife happy.
Get a lock for your garbage can.
If you kill one and have an unsecured food source another will be along shortly.
B.B.,
In Part 1, Bob M. and I asked about this style grip VS the traditional grip. Is there an advantage to this type/style? Fits a smaller hand better? Better/more stable aiming? More ergonomic? Any thoughts/speculation would be appreciated.
Chris
BB,
Have you seen or heard anything out of Air Venturi about their new spring compressor?
RR,
It’s supposed to be coming out soon.
B.B.
2.5″ – 344
4″ – 410
6″ – 430
8″ – 426
Note that the 2.5 inch is listed at 344fps, the 4″ (+70 fps) at 410 fps but the 6″ is listed at only 20 fps more.
While reality is producing different numbers, the step size between rated speeds of various barrel lengths is interesting.
I get the big jump from 2.5 to 4 inch as the gas released by the gun has more time to accelerate the pellet.
And the four to six inch jump being much smaller has the same valve will probably release the same amount of air thus there is a diminishing return between those two lengthens.
However, I expected the eight inch to be slower than it is due to the extra friction and apparent peak of CO2 expansion with the 6″ length.
Belgrath,
I agree completely, especially with my own experience bearing that out.
Obviously it would vary from model to model and even between different examples of the same model. I have a number of the old Crosman 357s, and I recall the 357-4 being less hot than the 357-6 and the 357-8. The 6 and 8 are about the same on the chrony, however. I think there is probably a tiny amount of further CO2 expansion with the 8, but as you point out, there is also a diminished return because of the added friction. My guess is that a tiny amount of additional gas expansion is off-set by the additional resistance of the barrel rifling.
Once the Benjamin 392 and Sheridan Blue Streak became the same rifle except for branding and caliber, the longer .20 Premier pellet, the same weight as the shorter .22 Premier, had slightly less velocity because, presumably, of the increased resistance in the barrel.
Michael
The 6 inch may not be increasing much more because friction may begin to kick in . It would be nice to see these revolvers that are built like tanks ,and are the most realistic replicas yet, get a power boost to over 450 fps, for true magnum velocity
Michaelr,
My Crosman 357-6 and 357-8 and Umarex S7W 586-8 get about that. My other 6 and 8 inchers shoot at about 400. But there are limitations with CO2.
In muzzle energy, my hottest CO2 air pistol is a valve-modded .22 caliber S&W Model 78G. It is a thumper for a CO@ pistol, producing a bit over 7 foot-pounds!
Michael
I had a Crosman 600 revolved a while back picked up over 50fps. A lot of shots are wasted towards the end of the co2 in these revolvers. By adjusting hammer fall and valve I bet they could pick up 25-50 fps and give 50 solid shots. Something satisfying about ripping through both sides of a soup can
Belgrath,Does this mean 6″ in the optimum leanth to get the best fpe. for a pistol barrel?Or maybe just one powered by Co2?What do you think?
Toto@F52,
Most likely it is for this particular size and type of CO2 power plant.
Siraniko
Optimal length Also dependent on the valve design.
For a different valve design that stays open longer the 8″ barrel may be needed to realize the gain.
This can best be seen with B.B’s series on the Airforce Talon and the effects of a 12 or 18″ barrel vs 24″
Belgrath04,
Now you’re talkin’! 🙂
B.B.
Toto,
Velocity aside, there is also the matter of sight radius. I collect CO2 revolvers, and of all of them four are much more accurate than the others: my two 8 inch Daisy 44s, the Dan Wesson 8 inch pellet revolver with the early, screw-on cartridges (ASG-17612 /product/dan-wesson-8-co2-pellet-revolver-black?m=3461 and /blog/2014/08/dan-wesson-8-inch-co2-pellet-revolver-part-3/ ), and my 8 inch Umarex S&W 586.
I think the velocity of 6 and 8 inch CO2 revolvers is roughly the same, the extra friction, as Belgrath points out, offsetting a small amount of extra gas expansion.
Michael
With as few large scale airgun events as we have in the United States, I think it’s is unwise (I am being polite here) to schedule major events on the same weekend..
Come on guys, coordination!
45Bravo,
You think this was intentional???
I scheduled the Texas show two months ago and set the date to not coincide with the PA Cup.
Pyramyd AIR asked the Tusco Gun Club (months ago) for late September, so they wouldn’t conflict with Texas. The Tusco Gun Club could only give them those dates because of other commitments.
Sometimes bad things just happen.
B.B.
B.B.,
No need to feel suspicious unless a Burger King opens up across the street from a McDonald’s! ;^)
These Dan Wessons are head-turners, no doubt. If this one proves itself a winner, I am inclined to get the snubby. I know that if these were real firearms the 4 inch would be the minimum to get the full power of the cartridge, and I know that the velocity of the CO2 revolver will be a bit less, too. And the shorter sight radius, etc, but I do not like the look of accessories or accessory rails. To me the clean lines of the snub nose makes it look absolutely stunning. Besides, this is a plinker’s delight (if it can shoot, of course). If I purchase one, no aluminum can in my backyard will be safe!
Michael
No, I didn’t think it was intentional on your part.
But you never know how big companies work.
I thought PA may have arbitrarily decided that this is the day they are having the cup, and the others can go fly a kite..
Since I have moved closer to Texas, the show there is within driving distance, and would like to attend, and the Ohio event is a stretch, but can be done also.
Having the option to attend both would have been nice.
Looking forward to Malvern this year..
45Bravo,
I just heard that Malvern is at the end of April. That’s jamming it for me, because I also film American Airgunner that month, but I will try to attend.
B.B.
45Bravo,
I’ve attended the 2015 and 2016 Texas Airgun Show and the Malvern show in 2016. Both were great shows.
I’m looking forward to the 2017 Texas Airgun Show. Unfortunately, I will not be able to make the Malvern show this year. The timing will just not work out. Hmmm. Maybe that was why Mrs. Qwerty scheduled our family vacation for the last weekend in April. She said I spent way too much at Malvern least year. But she did spend more than I did at the Texas show (for a Christmas present for me).
Make both if you can.
Jim
BB,
My head exploded on the single action velocities for the RWS Basics. Can you clarify the average velocity and the range? I don’t think you can get an average of 376 with a range of 376 to 393.
Thanks,
Tom
Tom,
I have corrected that. The low was 362 and the max spread was 31 f.p.s. for that test.
B.B.