by B.B. Pelletier
HW75M is a beautiful target pistol.
Taking a different road today to look at a higher-priced air pistol. Don’t fret – I haven’t forgotten the RM-2000 or the Remington Genesis.
I have owned this pistol for about 8 years and, though I never thought I’d ever be able to buy one, an opportunity suddenly presented itself and I did get it. It’s funny when things happen that way, because you can end up owning something you never would have picked for yourself; but through prolonged use, you grow to LOVE it! That’s what happened to me.
No longer a Beeman
My pistol is a Beeman P2, but it’s identical to the HW75M except for the markings and the grip. For many years, Robert Beeman touted the P2 as being as accurate as a 10-meter pistol – without the ergonomics. I am a 10-meter air pistol shooter, and I can tell you that this description is accurate. However, because it was in the same catalog as the Beeman P1, guess which one I bought first? The P1, of course. Why? Because it has more power, and although I try not to admit it very often, I tend to make the same decisions most of you do when buying airguns. Speed sells. Beeman stopped carrying the P2 recently, making the HW75 the only game in town.
Beeman P1 (top) and P2 look very similar. They have completely different powerplants with different firing behaviors.
I thoroughly enjoy the P1/HW45, and you can read my blog about it, but the P2/HW75 is a different pistol altogether. As a single-stroke pneumatic, it’s easier to cock (pressurize) than a P1, has no recoil and has a much lighter factory trigger. Though the velocity is stated as 410 f.p.s., my own pistol shoots around 440 with lightweight wadcutters. It’s no hunting gun, to be sure, but what a wonderful plinker or target pistol!
Accuracy
When I was a kid, pellet pistols were one of two different things. Either they were Benjamin pneumatics that would shoot 2″ groups at 30 feet, or they were CO2 pistols that wouldn’t group that tight. Velocities were in the 350 f.p.s. range, and of course the pellets we had were trash compared to what’s available today. If there had been a pistol like the HW75M back then, it would have been regarded as world class. I can shoot a perfect 50 for five shots on a 10-meter target with this pistol. The adjustable sights sit a little higher in the hand, and you have to use an M1911A1 grip for best results, so it’s not as easy to shoot as a 10-meter pistol; but, like the P1, the 75 is another perfect training tool for 1911 shooters.
Operation
To load and cock the gun, press in on a flat button on the left side of the frame next to the hammer. The top of the frame containing the barrel is unlocked and swings up and forward – pivoting at the muzzle. Compared to the P1, much less of the gun swings forward and there is very little resistance. When the barrel is fully extended forward, load a pellet directly into the exposed breech and close the gun. It takes a lot less effort to close this pistol than the Marksman 2004 that is now called the Beeman P17. The gun is now ready to shoot. The safety is not automatic, so it remains off throughout this operation.
P2/HW75 with barrel fully forward for the pump stroke.
Do not leave any single-stroke pneumatic pumped for very long. The flexible piston head is also the front reservoir seal, and, being flexible, it does not want to remain under pressure for a long time. Perhaps five minutes should be considered the maximum.
Trigger
The two-stage trigger is butter-smooth, and mine is set to release at 20 oz., but you can easily adjust it down to 10 oz. or less and make it a single-stage, if you like. The pull weight is also adjustable. You can dry-fire the pistol by cocking the hammer without pressurizing the pistol.
Sights
The rear sight is fully adjustable and features a sharp notch. The front sight is a low, square blade that’s nicely sized for the rear notch. The top strap that’s used to charge the pistol has an 11mm dovetail cut for mounting pistol scopes or dot sights, so the choices for sights is broad.
The grip
Weihrauch made two different grips for the HW75. One was a standard set of M1911A1 scales that interchanges with those on the P1 or a 1911. The other was a more sculptural grip with slight ambidextrous thumbrest scallops on either side of the gun – the grip you see on the 75M. This grip is heavily checkered and very attractive, in my opinion. Unfortunately, mounting this grip requires machining of the grip frame, so it doesn’t fit a P1, or P2 that currently has 1911 scales. This grip is the one thing I wish my P2 had, but it was always a costly option, so the standard grip probably outsold it by a wide margin.
I have said this before, but it bears repeating. The HW75M is an heirloom air pistol – the kind you hand down to your heirs with pride. As the years and decades pass, quality of this level will become rarer and rarer, and makers of new airguns will not think of trying to repeat it.
A big thank you for this article. I’ve been thinking about this pistol for some time. I don’t like springers much but never owned a single pump. Question. Will target grips for the .45 auto fit this gun? Thank you.
No, you are pretty much stuck with the grips it comes with. I say “pretty much” because you can always have a custom maker like Ralph Brown do a one-off for you.
B.B.
On second look, the grips it comes with might work out ok. With fathers day coming up, your article may have sold one of these guns.
If you do get it, will you please write us and tell everyone your impressions of the gun? I know this is an expensive airgun – especially since it’s a pistol for plinking and target practice. I’d just like to hear how you feel about it, since you have never seen one before.
B.B.
Hello B.B.
This is kind of a follow-up to yesterday’s warranty blog. I recently had trouble with a 4 month old Leapers 3-9×32 AO where it wouldn’t group anymore and started producing 3/4” flyers at 10 yds every few shots. I tried several things and finally ended up buying a new Leapers 6×32 BugBuster and the gun went back to shooting nice one-hole groups at 10 yards. The first Leapers had definitely gone south. It has a limited lifetime warranty, but honestly, I had been experimenting with shimming the scope to sight it in on the optical center, (the B-Square adjustable mounts I wanted were out of stock) and as you warned, I over did it and distorted the outer tube enough to mess up the internals. So I’ll chalk this up to a $45 learning experience because I guess this was “misuse” on my part. At least I’m trying to do all my “learning” on the less expensive stuff.
Pestbgone
Pestbgone,
I would probably do the same, but did you ask Leapers about possible repairs anyway? I wonder what sort of return policy they have?
B.B.
B.B.,
Not yet, but I will see what I can find out about Leapers’ out-of-warranty repairs.
Pestbgone
Pestbgone,
Thank you. It’s not an assignment or anything, but I think our readers would be interested to hear your experience dealing with them. I certainly tout their scopes enough – now let’s see the other end of the business!
B.B.
Yesterday you were curious about Leapers warranty. I purchased a 5th generation 4-16×50 scope for my new B40. I dialed it in close with adjustable mounts. When I tried to fine tune it with scope adjustment, the windage knob fell off. The detent spring was also bent. I called Leapers and they offered to replace it free or, for $40, upgrade to a new model Swat scope. I chose a 8-32×56 Swat and I love it. I called three days after mailing my old scope to verify arrival and the new one was already on it’s way.
This is a timely article for me too. I have been looking at both the HW75 and the P1/HW45 for some time now. I am totally on the fence about selecting one over the other. My use would be for target shooting, plinking and 1911 firearm training. The P1/HW45 is a bit more versatile in the grip choice and I read somewhere (on this blog, I think) that the P1/HW45 could be dry-fired by releasing the hammer but not actually cocking the gun. Sometimes I think the recoil of the P1/HW45 would provide a more realistic sensation as far as 1911 training goes. The HW75 seems like it would be the better choice for target shooting and, since I would be shooting in my garage, the lower power, lack of recoil and quietness is probably an asset. Unfortunately, I have no way of directly comparing these two pistols. In your article, you almost sound like you might have gotten the HW75 first, if you had not been influenced by power the same way the rest of us are. Either way, it does not seem like I can make a mistake in choosing one over the other, but I would not mind getting nudged in one direction or the other. Thank you, Mark
This is off topic sorry….But I was wondering if You had any experience or opinion on the Remington Summitt? Do you know if its made in china? I know crosman makes it. But it looks to be a little different than the other crosmans.
Thanks in Advance
Mark,
I’m going to nudge you in the direction of the HW45/P1. The reasons are the two you mentioned. Recoil is more realistic and grips can be interchanged.
The 75 is superior for accuracy, but the 45 is not far behind. Only the shot impulse makes it slightly harder to shoot accurately, which is desirable in a trainer.
B.B.
Mark,
I had a Remington Summit (model RW1K77X) the model before they removed the open sights. It was made in China and is the same internally as the B-19. It was a fun gun to shoot once I got the bugs worked out where were MANY.
1. I had to chamfer the breach as the pellet skirt stuck out too much unless shoved in with Beeman Pell Seat. Then re-blue.
2. Replace sloppy plastic Barrel Pivot Bushings with custom made brass ones.
3. Replace original new but flattened breach seal o-ring with new one.
4. Replace seal (was cut bad probably from cocking slot edges.) with apex during tune.
5. Replace one piece non adjustable mount with B-Square adjustable mount as the original was terrible. Scope would have to be bottomed out to compensate droop.
6. Cleaned barrel with JB Paste.
= Finally could shoot sub 1” groups at 20 yards with good technique as it is very hold sensitive. At 16 yards I could also hold 1” or less groups with the open sights so I was not convinced the scope was as good as Leapers at holding zero.
KTK
After all I did to the Remington Summit to shoot good plus spending $300 with all told not including labor! I would have been better off getting the HW50S from the start. After less than 100 pellets in finding what it likes, and in 2 weeks with diopter sights, out of the box, is shooting 5 shot 0.414” c-t-c groups @16 yards. Just shot a 10 shot group @ 16 yards (0.597” CTC) over lunch break spending as little as 5 min to sit down shoot and then go and eat. This is with the post with bead on top in the front sight and the rear peep supplied with the HW50S. After buying the TX200 (Most accurate) and then the HW50 my second most accurate gun from Pyramyd. Thank you BB! 🙂
KTK
this is off topic but can anyone tell me how i can re-crown a 177 airgun barrel and what equipment i would need to do it
thank you very much
The crown must be absolutely perpendicular to the bore and true all around. A lathe-turned crown is probably the best, if you cut the crown close to the headstock.
This is a job best done by a gunsmith.
B.B.
how much would that cost like $10-$20 or would it cost more
I think to get a barrel crowned and reblued a small gunsmith might do it for $50. A friend might charge less.
B.B.
thank you very much
hi mark i just wanted to nudge in the same direction as b.b. the hw45 is a delightful pistol to shoot. i find that when you get a good pellet that fits the barrel tight you get a very realistic recoil which for 1911 training would be more desireable. i have this pistol in .20 cal which some of the pellet weights are crossovers to the .22 cal very good hitting power.
BB.
I got confused with the grip issue in the HW75M. If I buy an HW75M from pyramydair, will it have the grips seen here: /product/weihrauch-hw-75?m=46#
Thanks
Jr.
Yes it will. Confirm that when you place the order.
Weihrauch USED to make a P2 that had regular 1911 grips. Mine is like that. But they stopped making that model and switched to just the one you indicate.
B.B.
B.B. — How about the HW75 versus the IZH 46M? Seems that the 46M may have the edge on the HW75 in terms of accuracy and adjustability, but seems like the HW75 may be more readily available.
I can't find ANYONE who has the IZH 46M in stock, and no one who can even say when they will be in stock for sure.
Which would you be looking for, especially if one consideration is getting it in time for Christmas?
If I got one, would I regret having not purchased the other, or are they both pretty close and both fine pieces that will last a lifetime?
I'm looking for the TX-200 of air pistols.
Thanks!
Russ,
The IZH 46 shortage is temporary. The 46 has a 10-meter grip and sights. That's what it has over the 75. I'm sure both guns are equally accurate, but the 46 will always outshoot the 75 in the hands of a good 10-meter shooter.
As far as regrets go, get the 75 first. That's the one that's in jeopardy of extinction. The 46 M will last a few more years.
B.B.
I’ve recently purchased the hw75 from a friend knowing that a seal had gone ( sucking noise when cocking ). Yesterday I picked her up for plinking a few cans and as I went to extend the barrel for cocking I could lift further than 10/15mm from closed position, as if it was over pressurised..? Nothing is jammed anywhere, any help will be much appreciated.
John,
Welcome to the blog. When did you last oil the pump piston head with Crosman Pellginoil?
B.B.
As a proud new owner of the HW75 are there any comments about initial use?
And one more thing. If there is a sucking noise, probably like the one John mentioned, when I use a HILL pump does it mean something, although it fills the Talon P without any problem?
Thanks in advance for accepting a newbie.
Bill,
That sucking noise is the inrush of air into the Hill pump. Worry only when you don’t hear it.
B.B.
Hello again
It seems that my new HW 75 is not functioning as stated because velocities with 8 and 8.4 gr run around the 300 fps mark consistently. Any thoughts or suggestions would be highly appreciated.
All the best
Bill,
If the pistol is brand new it is shooting slow. Have you oiled it with Pellgunoil, as I mentioned?
B.B.
It seems that velocity does not change even with pellgunoil. Any suggestions?
Bill,
You may be at the point where you have to get the gun resealed. Is it still in warranty?
B.B.
Unfortunately-fortunately it was bought brand new one month ago. PItty cause i fell in love with it as soon as i handled it out of the box and its’ accurracy seems beyond my skills.
Bill,
If you bought it from Pyramyd AIR, I bet that will make it right for you.
This blog can prove you tried to correct it yourself.
I want to know one last thing. How high is the breech seal and is it intact without any nicks?
B.B.
The breech seal seems ok (no nicks?) but pressed almost flat to the valve exit face. Looking closely at this valve exit it seems there is already some wear at the lower part of the circle, under the seal but not the at the upper part of the circle.
I hope i describe it correctly. What do you think about it?
Bill,
Your breech seal sounds low and flat to me. They will get that way from being stored in a warehouse before being sold.
If you didn’t have a warranty I would suggest removing this seal (you have to pick it out with something small like a dental pick) and turning it over. I would also place a shim of typing paper (only a single sheet thick) underneath the seal.
But you probably do have a warranty on your gun so I think it should be looked at by the dealer.
B.B.
Since I’m here, let me add my 2-cents on related topics that haven’t really been covered. I have both an HW75 and a Beeman P3. If you have big hands, the grips on both guns are small. A rubber sleeve on the grips helps on the P3. Files, grinders, or a Dremel tool would be needed for the HW74; but it’s too nice a gun to do this too. It’s easier to insert a pellet into the breech of the HW75, than into the P3 – but its still a clumsy process in either gun (round nose pellets are easier than wadcutters). The P3 is a bit better thought out, e.g., auto safety and fewer steps to open and operate. It’s as though Weihrauch designed the P2, then realized some improvements were needed, so incorporated them into the P3, but not the P2. Also, I find the P3 is easier/quicker to bring and hold on target. Maybe my next comment needs to be settled once and for all. My HW75 has 14 mm scope dovetail grooves. Do all its sister guns (P1, P2, HW45, etc.) have this spacing, or are some made with 11 mm scope dovetail grooves???? BKL makes a 14mm to 11mm riser, but this makes the mounted site way too high for a pistol. 11mm ring mounts will fit on 14mm spaced grooves, but they won’t be centered. Final windage adjustment will only be good for one distance. I had to custom make a 14mm to Weaver adaptor. There has been other internet chatter about this, but it doesn’t seem to be common knowledge. Thanks for the PellGunOil comment. I’m still chewing on this, but I would have to ask, how do gas springs keep their pre-charge? When a SSP sucks in its air, is the air filtered, or can dirt get in (to mix with this oil)? I’ve been told by people who should know, that modern synthetic seals should not be lubricated. Thanks for the review!
I bought a P3 before my HW75. I agree the P3 is easier to shoot. It was great until a spring broke (or slipped off a post or something) in the trigger, and I still have not found someone to fix it. Trigger flops around. Maybe I will try to fix it when I have a day free. The HW75 is beautiful and quiet. I stalked and shot a backyard rat with it at 10 feet.