FWB 300 disassembly instructions: Part 2

by Tom Gaylord
Writing as B.B. Pelletier

Part 1

FWB 300 disassembly instructions: Part 1

by Tom Gaylord
Writing as B.B. Pelletier

Today’s report describes how to disassembly a Feinwerkbau 300 air rifle. It was written for us by reader CptKlotz, our interpid German airgunner. We are breaking it into 2 parts because of the large number of photos.

If you’d like to write a guest post for this blog, please email me.

Over to you, CptKlotz.

This report covers:

Introduction
Our thanks

Today’s report is the continuation and completion of how to disassembly a Feinwerkbau 300 air rifle. It was written for us by reader CptKlotz. Once again, do not attempt this unless you are sure you understand the instructions and can perform all of them safely!

If you’d like to write a guest post for this blog, please email me.

Over to you, CptKlotz.

This report covers:

  • Step 7.
  • Step 8.
  • Step 9.
  • Step 10.
  • Step 11.

This article was originally published on the German co2air forums (www.co2air.de). It was created by the users Pellet (original text guide), Paramags (additional information and FWB150 details ) and boerni (photos and forum post). They kindly gave me permission to translate their guide so people who can’t read German can use it as well. The original forum post can be found here.

Translation by Stephan Szlosze (CptKlotz). Any text in italics is a comment from the translator.

Disclaimer: If you decide to work on your gun, you do so at your own risk. Neither Pyramyd Air, co2air.de, the authors or I will accept any responsibility for injury or damage to you, your rifle or yourΒ equipment. Please read the guide carefully and proceed with caution.

 

I will pick up where I left off yesterday.

Step 7.

 

Now the trigger/ratchet unit must be removed. Loosen the screws shown in the picture.Β The larger screw (the one in the back) can be VERY tight. Make sure you use a screwdriver that fits it well and apply enough downward pressure so you don’t damage the screw’s head.

FWB 300 trigger ratchet
Loosen the trigger ratchet screws (arrow).

This picture shows how the unit is mounted.

FWB 300 trigger ratchet removed
Trigger ratchet mechanism has been removed.

 

Step 8.

 

Now, the cocking lever can be removed. It is held in place by a bolt that has a threaded upper end. It can be removed like a screw. The lever should be opened (same motion as cocking the rifle) so there is no pressure on the bolt.

FWB 300 lever bolt
Open the cocking lever and remove the bolt at the back of the lever.

Now the lever can be unhooked and removed.

FWB 300 lever unhooked
The cocking lever has been unhooked and removed.

Step 9.

 

The leaf spring sitting in a notch at the rear end needs to be removed. To do so, you need to remove another e clip (circlip) locking washer, and then remove the pin from the inside.

FWB 300 leaf spring washer
Remove the circlip and pull the pin to the inside.

When the pin is out, the leaf spring can be taken out. Notice that the angled tab at the end of the spring is pointing outward. Make sure to reattach it like this when you reassemble the rifle!

FWB 300 remove leaf spring
Remove the leaf spring from the inside. Note that the angled tab (on the right) is pointing to the outside of the tube.

Now, the last pin (which secures the springs) can be removed. It MUST be reinserted from the outside to prevent parts from being shot out of the action during the next step.

FWB 300 insert safety pin
Inserting the safety pin from the outside of the tube.


Step 10.

 

Now we will remove the springs and piston from the action. You need to loosen the large screw with the 17mm wrench (don’t remove it!).

Make sure the safety pin from Step 9 is still in place or the spring and other parts will be shot out of the action with great force!

FWB 300 loosen action screw

Step 11.

 

Now we actually let the piston slide out of the action. There are two ways this can be done:

1. By using a mainspring compressor

2. By pressing the action on against a non-slippery surface (muzzle up)

Now the action screw from step 10 can be removed completely. If you reduce the pressure a little, the spring will now press against the safety pin. You can now remove the pin and slowly reduce the pressure to slowly let the spring (etc.) slide out of the action.

I did it by myself by pressing the action against a shoe as shown in the picture. I am a fairly heavy male and didn’t have much trouble. The FWB300 is a 7.5 joule gun and thus has a weaker spring than the magnum rifles, but if the insides start flying out of the rifle, they will leave a dent in something. So be careful and if in doubt, ask a second person to help.)

FWB 300 compress spring
The action rests on my foot under pressure when I remove the safety pin. Hold onto the gun or parts will fly!

FWB 300 remove spring
Slowly relax the tension on the spring and the parts will fall out of the action.

Two pieces of metal that hold the leaf spring will also fall out of the action. They need to be reattached the correct way when reassembling the action.

When those two pieces came out of my rifle, I couldn’t see where exactly they had been sitting before. Getting them back in the correct way involved some trial and error, but it was obvious when they were back in place the right way. If you can, make a note of where those two pieces of metal sit before you disassemble the power plant.

This picture shows the parts of the powerplant:

FWB 300 powerplant parts
And there are the powerplant parts.

Put the rifle back together by reinstalling the parts in the order you removed them.

That’s it for the FWB 300. In the next report we will look at the differences of an FWB 150 and what special things we need to know to disassemble one of them.

153 thoughts on “FWB 300 disassembly instructions: Part 2




    • Yogi,

      It really is not a hard rifle to work on with the exception of the trigger assembly. Before you disassemble it, I would recommend studying it very closely and then perhaps have a professional do it. πŸ˜‰


  1. Great strip down. very interested to see how this went together as – if I ma not wrong, correct be somebody – the 300 was the first of the sliding breech rifles, and thus stands at the head of a long line of development.

    BB – thoughts with you.


  2. CptKlotz,

    Thank you for the fine report. I liked all the pictures as well as the clear and concise text. The 300 is quite a bit more involved than a AA TX200.

    On the re-assembly side of things, besides doing the usual cleaning, de-burring and re-lube,…I think it is important to take the time and (really) understand how all the parts interact with each other and “what does what”. It’s amazing what you will learn,..finding little things along the way,.. that can be improved on,..even if only in the slightest way. I spread my first tear down over a couple of days doing just that.

    Thanks again, Chris


    • De-burring? On this rifle? Only if it has been sorely abused. You may rest assured that was not an issue on a new one. Without actually tearing into one of these yourself you cannot grasp the quality that is there. To build an air rifle like this today would cost almost as much as a new 10 meter rifle would cost. Even the old beat up, rusty club guns are nice. Ask GunFun1.


      • RR
        Your absalutly right. That is one of the definite differences of low quality brand name guns verses the FWB 300s.

        You can tell there is alot of attention to detail of how the gun is designed and assembled from the factory.

        If there are people out there that have air guns and don’t have a 300 they should definitely consider getting one. Very nice guns. And they shoot nice also. No felt recoil and very easy to cock. And there is enough power to take care of pest birds at 30 yards or in. Well even farther out with a precision head shot. Which a 300 is very capable of doing.





              • Reb
                They are 2 different guns.

                The 300 action is a lot like the 54 air king action but makes much less power and a way better trigger than the 54.

                The Tx has a excellent trigger but the 300 trigger is way better. Quality of biuld the 300 and the Tx I would say are pretty close to equal. But I have never owned a new one. But I shot a 300 years ago when I didn’t know anything about air guns.

                But truthfully I don’t think the 300 should be compared to the Tx or LGU. All 3 guns have different personalities.

                So how do I answer that question correctly. Other than they are both fine guns.



                • GF1,

                  I can not imagine a trigger lighter than the TX. I adjusted it VERY light (pull weight screw only). The slightest pressure and it fires. I can pull the 1st. stage to the 2nd. and hold it, but beyond that, it’s instant.

                  Going from the TX to the LGU is quite the callenge. Even with the LGU pull weight screw backed out, it does not even come close.

                  If I tear into the LGU, it will be to lube up the trigger assy. (as best I can access).

                  As for the plastic trigger blade,…I don’t have any issues with it. What’s the issues with it that people complain about ?

                  I’ll have to search for LGU trigger tune/tear down. It could well be that it will never adjust as light as the TX trigger,.. no matter what I do.

                  I really need a trigger gauge. I don’t know why PA does not sell them. Probably get the Lyman digital at around 70$.


                  • Chris USA
                    The trigger on the 300 is in the feather weight class.

                    How can I say it. Let’s see. It is veeeerrryy light.

                    And I don’t know why people don’t like the plastic triggers.



          • RR
            You really need to keep that other 300 you have.

            Everytime I pick mine up to shoot it I totally enjoy the gun.

            I call mine the Mini 54 but definitely not mini in performance. And with a better stock and trigger and just the right velocity.

            Should I go on. πŸ™‚


            • It does have what is probably the finest trigger on a sproinger ever made. I have been giving it a lot of thought and I am pretty sure I can up the power level a little bit. Now whether I can get it up around 12 FPE and what will that do to the firing cycle is another question. We will see.


              • RR
                With that anti recoil slide system I think it would still have a nice shot cycle that shooter feels.

                The 54 air Kings are kind of a magnum springer. I don’t know if you have ever shot one but they have a shot cycle that’s pretty equal to a pcp rifle. But as you know they are scope torturing rifles because of the power they make.

                I’m willing to bet if you kicked the 300 upto a12 fpe gun it would still be a nice shooting gun. Plus the 300 is heavy like the 54. So that should help keep the 300 under control a little also.

                I say try it. You can always take the components back out and put the stock stuff back in. I think your making a mistake if you don’t try since your lucky enough to already have a 300.


                • If I try the power thing and it works out and I keep it, there are a few tricks I can do that will shave off some of that weight. One thing that will have a drastic effect is remove the barrel weight/sleeve. I do not know how much it is, but it would not surprise me if it was over a pound. I may even consider shortening and re-crowning the barrel.

                  I could also take off a fair bit with a little stock work. There is enough lumber here to build a small house.

                  The main mass of this thing though is the action/recoil/trigger assembly. There is a lot of machined steel there. It can be lightened there some, but not much.

                  The big question is whether it is worth doing all that? The TX, the LGU, the LGV, the HW35 are already there. No, the triggers are not as nice, but they are usable.

                  I have my 1906 BSA which is a 10 yard competition rifle. I have my Edge which is a nice, light 10 meter competition rifle. I have my Izzy which is a nice 10 meter competition pistol. I do not need another 10 meter airgun.

                  Also, when it comes right down to it, the thought of doing a chop shop job on this thing sends shutters down my spine. I think that is why I have been taking so long to finish this rifle. I could not decide what I was going to do with it. I think I have decided.


                  • RR
                    I don’t think I would try to lighten it. That’s probably part of why it’s a good bench rest gun. It helps it stay in position.

                    But I bet if you just up grade to a zero end gap ring that FWB sales and a little heavier spring. Or even add a shim or washer to the factory spring.

                    It might not get it upto 12 fpe but still give it a little more performance.

                    Or just shoot the gun as is and enjoy for what it is.


                    • That is what I am saying though. I have a bunch of ten meter stuff. I do not need another 10 meter rifle. I am looking for 25 – 50 yards. Can I get that out of this, that is very debatable and chopping and trimming and such may or may not work. I know the TX, LGV, LGU, etc. will.

                      I have pretty much decided I am going to put new seals in it, clean it up a bit and give somebody a real good deal on it. Then I will get a nice sproinger that will fill that slot.



                    • LOL! Are you thinking you would like to get your grubby little paws on it?

                      I really do think that anyone who gets into airguns should at one time or another own a 10 meter air rifle. The bad thing is when you get use to a trigger on something like a FWB300, everything else is downhill. If Feinwerkbau can put such a fine trigger on a sproinger, why can’t anyone else?


                    • Reb
                      I got one already so you get a chance to get it from RR get it.

                      They are just nice guns. I usually don’t have two of the same guns. But if its another 300 I would love a second one.

                      But I hope you can get it from RR if he decides to sell. You won’t regret it.


                    • Oh, I think you will be able to afford it. We might even be able to work out some trading. Do you happen to have a Weihrauch laying around?


                  • RR
                    I know what you mean that you want a sporting gun with a little more power than the 300.

                    And I will say again I put that zero gap ring in mine and goned the cylinder a little just like you do a automotive engine and seat the ring in with a little tranny fluid. The stock springs are in it still. The power did come up.

                    And like I said before the 300 isn’t a hunting gun. But my 300 as it is now will take a starling at 50 yards with no problem.

                    And I did this weekend fix the bug buster scope and put it back on the 300. I’m shooting it right now and I just shot some extremely good groups with it at 50 yards. I will say I’m very steady today for some reason. But the gun is shooting pellet touching groups. And it will reset all 4 paddles on my Caldwel steel spinner target by hitting the top 5th paddle all day long at 50 yards. So its making some kind of power.

                    And just maybe if somebody don’t jump on your other 300 I may just buy it from you. As long as your going to make a good deal like you have mentioned. πŸ™‚




                    • I will certainly keep you in mind about it. It will likely be about the same price as the last one. I have to give G&G first dibs as he mentioned wanting it a while back and Reb has been making noises about it also, but you are third on the list now. πŸ˜‰



            • They are superb shooters and you have not pulled a trigger until you have pulled the trigger on one of these things. You can adjust that trigger ten ways from Sunday to suit you. It will spoil you so bad that you will look at Rekord triggers as crude junk.

              Now if you want to shoot one of these all day you had better eat your Wheaties or take up bench rest shooting. It will not take you long to figure out that 10 meter shooters really are athletes.

              Like I was telling GF1 though, it is below the power level that I am looking for right now. I know I can bump it up a little bit, but it will also probably make the firing cycle a little harsher and that will affect accuracy some.



              • RR
                I’m replying here. There was no button to reply above.

                By all means give G&G and Reb first dibs on the 300.

                I have one already from you and I’m satisfied and happy I have it. Ask me about your other one only if other people don’t get it. But just keep me in mind. And thanks.


    • Chris,

      I don’t want to take the credit for the work of others. The folks mentioned in part 1 wrote the guide and made the photos. I only translated it and added a little bit of information.

      Stephan


      • CptKlotz,

        None the less,…very nice. ( on the photo’s, some good and some so-so ) I was curious as to their origin,…but you explained that…..

        If nothing else existed, you did a great service.


  3. BB,

    good to hear you’re feeling at least a *little* better.

    If you find the time, could you please put my comments in italic again, so people know who’s “talking”?

    Also, where removing the cocking lever is described, it would be better to use the second version I wrote (β€œunlatchβ€œ, instead of “same motion as cocking”). We don’t want people to cock their naked actions…

    Sorry to bother you again, but I think these things should be clarified.

    Stephan


  4. CptKlotz,

    Thanks for your translation. I didn’t know about the trick of reinserting the safety pin from the outside. Let’s just say that I was impressed with how many parts can come flying out of the spring tube.

    The picture of the leaf spring orientation is super valuable since I think mine might have been reinstalled in the opposite orientation.

    Can you explain in detail (in your next installment) how the “cheese wedges” that work as the anti-bear trap are re-inserted? These were two of the pieces that flew across the room


    • Subsonic,

      I am not 100% sure. It’s been a while since I actually had the gun apart (I have a 300S).

      I think the ratchet unit prevents the cocking lever from snapping back when you let go and the leaf spring and safety pin block the trigger until the rifle is fully cocked.

      I guess somebody with more experience can give a better explanation.

      Stephan


      • Ck
        You explained it very good. And I just wanted to say what I find odd about the 300 there is no actual safety on the gun that you can manually engage. Or a automatic one for that fact. When the rifle is cocked its ready to fire.

        And again a nice job on the write up.

        And a part 3 assembly of the gun really needs to be done. Somebody searching this on the internet for help would benefit from having the assembly procedure there also.


  5. Buldawg76, you are the kind of guy on whom I rely for technical matters. I have also kept all my fingers and toes, and I plan to keep it that way. πŸ™‚

    Duskwight and Mike, congratulations on identifying the obscure Bond gun with extra information to boot. Sometimes I think there is almost nothing that the blog cannot answer, at least about guns. I do wonder about Major Boothroyd’s comments about the power of the .32 caliber Walther, maybe in comparison to the .25 caliber but that’s about it. As for the Beretta, Bond says in the movie seen that his Beretta has never failed him in 10 years, so I’m curious where it does in From Russia With Love. I don’t remember this in the movie, and the closest I can come is in the book in the final fight with Donovan Grant, played in the movie by Robert Shaw. It’s significantly different from the movie. In the book, Grant is an unstoppable behemoth who also gets the complete drop on Bond with a gun concealed in the spine of a book. I believe it is .25 caliber because of the small size. Bond first becomes aware of it when he glances at his watch and it gets blown away by the hidden gun. Grant then promises to execute Bond in the next tunnel with a shot through the heart. Coolly distracting Grant with extravagant motions of his hand holding a cigarette, Bond surreptitiously slides his gun metal cigarette case over his heart, and when the shot comes, he slumps over convincingly. Then he gets hold of a small knife and launches a surprise attack. Even so, Grant manages to overpower Bond while his life is slipping away. As a last recourse, Bond grabs the book gun and after figuring how to work it by pressing its spine, releases a fusillade right into Grant’s face which makes him finally succumb.

    Mike, interesting you should mention head shots with the .25 and .32. Real life as well as fiction suggests how ineffective these weapons could be. Do you recall the case of the Long Island Lolita. Jealous woman shows up at the door of a housewife with bad intentions. When the housewife turns away, the caller pulls her concealed .25 caliber handgun and fires to the back of the head. The housewife turns back to say that she can’t help the caller but gracefully takes her leave. After some time, the housewife feels a headache coming on and decides to lie down. Eventually, she suffered some minor nerve damage which may have been permanent.

    Matt61


  6. GF1,

    yeah a safety wouldn’t be a bad thing. When shooting the Diana 31 or HW 35 it becomes second nature to just press the safety button once you’re on target.

    The FWB trigger is amazing but it also means that the slightest touch will fire a shot. I suppose the upside of this is that you learn your finger does *not* belong near the trigger before you’re ready to fire. Of course I know this because I’m really wise and not because I *might* have shot a hole in the wall or something πŸ™‚

    I think the reassembly shouldn’t be that hard if you have done the disassembly according to the guide and reinstall the parts in the reverse order.

    I don’t really feel like creating a reassembly guide because my rifle is working so well after installing the new parts. I fear that opening it up again might upset something.

    Stephan


    • Ck
      For some reason I knew you would say something like that about not wanting to take your gun back apart. I’m like that too. If its working I don’t want to touch it.

      And yes I’m just like you with my Tx and other guns that have the self setting safety’s.

      And as it goes. Trigger finger stays away from the trigger till its time to shoot. The Benjamin Marauder safety is manualy operated. So after you pull the bolt the guns ready to fire. Even if the bolt is left open. If you dont have the magazine in place or if you have the single shot tray you will get a plast of air to your face. And if you have a pellet setting in the single shot tray with the bolt open the pellet will come flying out of the tray. Dont ask me how i know that.

      The 300 has a extremely light trigger. I have to pay attention to that when I shoot it also. My finger is positioned in front of the trigger when I’m getting on target. I just start moving my finger closer to the trigger till I touch and the shot goes off.

      And darn I thought with the part 3 reassembly you could of gave away some of your lube tricks. πŸ™‚


      • I don’t know any lube tricks πŸ™‚

        FWB have a special grease for the piston, but I found that out after ordering parts.

        So I just cleaned everything and applied a *little* bit of moly grease to the walls of the power plant. It seems to work fine.



          • It’s Liqui Moly LM47 MoS2 “long life grease”

            “Multi-purpose grease for high pressure and long term lubrication. Special additives ensure reliable lubrication even under the most difficult conditions”

            All I can say is it seems to work ok. No dieseling, no smell, no noise.

            I guess with it’s “engine style” piston ring, the FWB300 has very little wear or need for a lot of lubrication anyway.


            • Ck
              Thanks for the response about the grease.

              And you know what works good for that ring to keep the cylinder from polishing. A few drops of transmission fluid in the transfer port hole about every couple of tins of 500 pellets. It helps keep the ring and cylinder honed in if you will. It keeps the ring seated basically to make compression.


  7. My dad told me of a multi pump air rifle he once know of that was as power full as to days pcp rifles in .22 (875-950 fps). What was this rifle and what would it take to make one to day with existing platforms available.


    • Some of the Sheridans came with instructions for overpumping but they were .20 Caliber. crosman 140/1400 and Sharp Innova had valves that wouldn’t lockup under overpressurizing.
      Just a few That come to mind.
      Although these are some of the most powerful multi-pumps, I doubt any approaches power generated by standard gunfire ammo.

      Reb




        • Reb
          I know when I was a kid and I got my 392. I thought it was a powerhouse. Especially after shooting the 760.

          They were a powerful gun and with a 13 or 14 grn pellet it would put a thump’n on something.



            • Reb
              You know something. That is all so true.

              It’s probably been 40 years since I shot a 392. I wonder what I would think about a 392 after shooting my modern day .25 caliber Marauder.

              Maybe it would be like shooting a AirForce Texan and then the .25 Marauder.

              But yea I bet if I shot a 392 today it would probably not seem as powerful as it did when I was a kid.



      • BB

        Was the Al Nibecker ‘Quigley’ rifle not in that power range? It was my impression that it was.

        Of course this rifle never made it into production that I am aware of, so I doubt Twister’s dad would be familiar with it.

        I think I remember that you once did a report on that rifle during the airgun letter years? If I am right about that, I don’t think I am alone in saying that I would be very interested in you dusting off that report and reposting it here.

        That rifle was both beautiful and intriguing. It’s too bad insecure and petty individuals relentlessly bad mouthed Al and his gun on the forums. Al seems to have disappeared from the scene, I haven’t been able to find anything recent from him, and his old website is offline.

        I read Jim Chapman’s take on the gun, but I would like to read yours, if you can dig it out.


    • Twister

      There was a multi pump made by a man named Al Nibecker that might have been close to that range, but it cost close to $3000, and I don’t think the gun made it into production.

      Tim McMurray at Mac-1 airguns does convert Sheridans and Benjamins to a higher powered and much improved “steroid” version, but it isn’t quite in the same power range of PCPs. His work is held in the highest regard by those in the know

      BB did a report on the gun, way back when.

      /blog/2009/05/a-steroid-streak/


    • TwisterDM,

      MY Titan Mohawk (John Bowkett limited production multi stroke pneumatic) did around 830 fps with a jsb 15.8 grain pellet. This was with six pumps and it wasn’t much fun pumping that gun beyond 4 strokes.

      kevin



        • Reb,

          My Titan Mohawk was sold several years ago.

          Mine was a late model according to Mr. Bowkett. FAC version that had all the options. Thumb hole high grade walnut stock, match grade trigger (broke at around 1.3 lbs), custom ldc, upgraded valve, etc. he remembered the gun well since it took him almost a year to make it. Think he said he made around 90 of these guns. Man is a genius when it comes to AIRGUNS.

          Very fine gun, well made, accurate but not my cup of tea.

          Someone contacted me and offered me a fair price for the gun. I sold it. Here’s the listing, with pictures, when I bought it:

          http://www.network54.com/Forum/79574/thread/1280360498

          Kevin



            • Reb,

              That’s funny.

              All of that and more went into a custom 6mm ppc built around a Sako action that I have been reloading for the past 2 years.

              Keeping the Mohawk would have been cheap but boring in hindsight.

              We all like to push the envelope of accuracy and experience in shooting don’t we?

              kevin


      • Thanks for the reply to this question. you have showed me what has been made in the past. Now what could we build to achieve this range. I know of the gun from FX but that is a hybrid a pcp/multi pump. I would like a strict multi pump gun. lets say one you pump 15 times or less to hit those numbers this could be a low cast to mid cast gun for the beginner or casual shooter or small game hunter. One that would not have the high entry cost to git in to the sport (pump, tank, compressor). This type of gun with such a large rang of predictable velocities would be welcome as a gun of necessity in case you found your self stranded for a prolong period of time.

        This gun should have good sits, a descent trigger, good accuracy, pumping force that is on par or better than the Benjamin air guns and should com with a gauge for better shot consistency .

        As pcp and springer have evolved it seems we have forgotten the multi pump air gun.

        thank you

        John


        • John,

          I would like a car that handles like a Ferrari on the road, can also fly through the air like a jet and reach 50 mph on the water. I would also like it to be mid cost to low cost!

          Seriously, the FX Independence fits your criteria at a very reasonable price point for what it does. An airgunner friend of mine has an early FX Independence. The FX Independence is a multi pump THAT DOES NOT HAVE TO BE USED OR FILLED LIKE A PCP, gets 6-7 good shots without having to pump again (try that with a Benjamin or a Mohawk), has a great trigger, can easily be scoped (try that with a Benjamin), has a large on board gauge, pumps easily (I’d rather pump the Independence 21 times that fill a Benjamin or Sheridan), can be adjusted for power up to 30 fpe and has excellent accuracy.

          You don’t need to reinvent this gun. It’s available today.

          kevin


          • Thank you for your timely response. the FX guns are Ferrari they cast the better part of $2000. I am tallking a gun that is $300-$450 the next level up. as of now I do not see that in a .22 gun as a multi pump. the option is allays nice to have. I just was saying that it would be nice to see the multi pump start to evolve like all the other guns out there. It has not. the FX guns are grate. I have one. There has to be a more cost effective versos of them like the discovery rifle.


  8. The Impact is about 200 rounds into break-in and loading pellets is much easier, still getting a puff of smoke every now and then.
    The front sight sticks up so high it creates a blurry spot in the bottom of the scope.


  9. Matt61– A waitress was killed in an accidental shooting with a .25acp a few years ago, in Orange county, n.y. The .energy of the .25 acp can reach 90 foot lbs, with light bullets. The 50 grain bullet usually has 65-70 foot lbs. of energy. Compare those figures to the energy of most air guns. There are many variables that can effect bullet performance, but the .25 CAN be deadly. I own 2, a baby Browning and a Bauer (a Browning copy). I also reload both lead and jacketed bullets for this cartridge. I admit that they lack power when compared to many other pistol cartridges. The are often called mouse guns, but they have killed some very large mice! Give my regards to Joey and Amy. Ed


    • Yeah, I’m not volunteering to stand in the way. I was going to say that the wronged wife in the courtroom was mouthing “I love you” to Joey through some facial paralysis, so maybe that .25 ACP packed an extra something.

      Matt61


  10. BB
    A special time, a special lady.

    Who could of known how important this day was 67 years ago.

    Thank God you did get to know.

    And how many life’s did Edith get to touch. Alot more than could be imagined. I never met her in person. But so glad I did get to know her a little through the blog.

    When a baby is born do we really think at that time about what they will mean to somebody as time passes.

    Sorry BB and God be with you and Edith on this journey through time.


  11. B.B.,

    Going back to your test of the FWB 300S I see that you shot the rifle at 10 meters and 50 yards. At 10 meters the groups were what you expected. Smallest group wa sunder 0.10″.

    At 50 yards the gun did not do well which led you to conclude that 50 yards was too much for the gun and you declared the test invalid.

    My question is why not test it at 25 meters? This is the distance one might reasonably expect to shoot the gun in a contest other than 10 meter. Especially benchrest. 25 meter benchrest is exactly why I would want to get the gun because I think it may be as good or better than the typical springers that are used in benchrest competitions.

    If time ever permits I would love to see you give the FWB 300S a 25 meter test. I would know for sure then if I wanted one to compete with and not just as a collectable.

    G&G



      • B.B.,

        I never said 25 yards. I did say 25 meters three times. Yes, I could shoot it at 25 yards and meters on my own but I would have to own it first. I was asking, if time ever permits, if you could maybe test it at 25 meters so that I would know if it was as good as or better than the typical springers one sees in 25 meter benchrest, before I bought it. I have a reason for the request.

        That would enable me to prioritize the purchase of it. The good ones out there are not cheap. The only left handed one I’ve seen to date was $1500. I would love to have the rifle but If I’m getting it as a collectible and for pleasure shooting only it’s not at the top of my list. If it performs better than a TX200 or HW97 or LGV or LGU or whatever, then it jumps to the top of my list.

        I did not mean to antagonize you. At this time that’s about the last thing I wanted to do. I really did think it was a legitimate request and not to put unnecessary pressure on you I added “if time ever permits”. I’m sorry if I upset you.

        God Bless B.B. To use one of my favorite phrases from back in the day “keep on truckin”. I know it’s not easy these days.

        G&G

        By the way, our club has a sanctioned match next Saturday. I’m going to the range today to shoot for score in preparation for the match. As you can see, I’m still plugging away and loving it. Shot my best 10 shot group ever the other day at 25 meters with my TM1000. It was 0.206″ at 25 meters.


        • G&G,

          You haven’t antagonized me. I am just trying to understand your request. As I said before, there is no competition that’s run at 25 meters. That distance may be important to you, but what competition is it?

          25 meters is 27.34 yards, so it’s pretty close.

          B.B.




              • B.B.,

                You should look into it. It’s United States Air Rifle Benchrest. Most of the major players are participating now. Except for the Field Target guys I guess. It’s a great alternative to F.T. and really tests a shooter’s accuracy. The ten ring is 2mm. Each match is a set of 3 targets. Each target has twenty five bullseyes for a total of 75. Max score is 750 with 75x’s (ten ring is obliterated). A .177 caliber pellet can barely do that so it takes near perfect shots.

                My scores are typically 730 to 750 with 25 to 30 X’s.

                G&G

                G&G


                • B.B.,

                  I should have added that I really enjoy Silhouette but no airgunners here are doing it. I would love it if there were IPSC style tournament here for air handguns. I think I would really like that but again, no go.

                  In some areas of the country the sport is still growing slowly.


                  • G&G
                    I just need to add that my 300 shoots very well at 50 yards.

                    I use the JSB 10.34 grn pellets in mine and the only thing that I have noticed is that if there is a variable wind that’s 5 mph or more it does tend to push the pellet around because of the lower power it makes.

                    I have to have a very calm day to shoot good groups at 50 yards with the 300.




          • BB,

            thanks for editing the blog πŸ™‚

            What I find interesting is that there is a dedicated category (#5) for recoil-compensated 7.5 joule springers.

            The only currently produced compensated springer that comes to my mind is the Diana 54 and the “Target Hunter” gun based on it. So I guess this category is mostly populated by vintage guns like the old FWB, Diana and AnschΓΌtz target rifles.

            Stephan


  12. Re gun safetys —French bolt action military rifles have no safetys–starting with the Chassepot (1870 @) . The French did not need a safety until they began using semi-auto rifles. Jeff Cooper-“safety is in the mind of the shooter”. Read Tim Mullin, Testing the War Weapons–he has an interesting opinion about safety,s and why he does not use them on most firearms. For many years, the Finns used a highly modified M1891 action to build their sniper rifles. To speed up the lock time, they cut off most of the heavy cocking piece. In the book that I read, the author spoke to a Finnish sniper about the lack of a safety on these rifles. The sniper held up his trigger finger and said-” this is my safety”. I have no objection to a well designed safety ( but many guns have bad safetys). I once owned 2 Thompson Center rifles ( TC 83 and 87). The safety button had a safety button! In addition to being slow and awkward to use, they made a loud click when you released them . Most hunters would not use the safety on these rifles. They made the rifle too safe. I was surprised to find a firing pin in these rifles. Removing it would have made them even safer! Ed


    • Trigger finger away from the trigger is a good safety.

      And back to the 300. I find myself not loading the gun till I’m ready to shoot when I’m bench resting it. Plus I keep the cocking arm open and load the pellet only when I get ready to shoot.

      On the 300 when you leave the cocking arm open it disabled the trigger. Plus the racheting slide will hold the piston and cylinder. That slide is also what pushes against a pin in the trigger assembly that sets the gun action forward on the anti recoil slide.

      The 300 trigger assembly definitely has its work cut out for it for all the jobs it does. But with the good design it is a very easy functioning gun all around.



      • The safety on the AK is certainly positive. But I found out yesterday that it can pinch like hell if you’re not careful.

        I didn’t know that Glocks have a safety other than the one built into the trigger. The AR safety is convenient to reach, but I don’t find that the dial action really fits the thumb that well.

        Matt61


  13. Ed,

    One of the newer co2 1911a1 gov’t model replicas has a slide safety like that…a “safety button” on the safety lever that must be depressed in order to disengage the safety lever. Not sure if it’s the Colt or the Remington version but I’m thinking it is the Remington.
    At least on these, I think it’s a bit much as thr design itself already has the thumb operated slide safety PLUS the grip safety… (not to mention the “shooter-safety”). I know that there’s no such thing as too much safety, but THIS? Really? So much for the 1911 “replica” status of that version. (Yes, the ” replica” status is also diminished on the Colt version with the non-functing grip safety, but in the opposite manner, IMO).

    Denny


  14. Ed,

    I found the one that I was referencing in my post above… it is the Winchester M11 co2 blow-back bb pistol. (The safety on the safetu). My apoligies to both Colt and Remington, as I stand corrected.

    Denny


  15. First, allow me to express my condolences for Edith’s passing. I’ve felt like I’ve known the two of you ever since the days of The Airgun Letter. Very sad.

    Now, for something else . . . and I know that this is probably not the time or place . . . can you guys please do something to improve your search function? Finding stuff is a nightmare. There is so much good information here but it’s like a library with all the books piled on the floor. If you can’t come up with a more efficient search feature, would you please create a site map with an alphabetical list of every thread topic you’ve done? That would be a big help.


    • Bladeswitcher
      Hello. This is something I believe Edith and BB has told me in the past.

      Google or use some other search engine that you like. Give a description about what your looking for then add at the end Pyramyd Air Blog.

      I gaurentee you that if BB wrote about it. It will pop up. And you are right I don’t have very good luck with the search feature on the blog page. It’s like you have to get the title right word for word to get the particular blog to come up.


  16. Although I will probably never have an FWB 300 to even consider disassembling, I will c ertainly want this report if I ever do!

    Regarding the blog on optics from a couple of days ago. It was interesting and I am glad to say previous blogs helped me quite a bit. I still have a perfectly good Daisy Powerline 3-9×32. Recently, it was still working quite well on my rejuvenated Titan. Having corrected the Objective as I learned from an earlier blog this little scope still serves me well, although others may not find it so. Nevertheless, I decided to install the Centerpoint 4-19×40. I set the vertical and horizontal clicks to the mid-point, and I started my sight in from about 10 feet (I am using one one pellet for sighting purposes). From there I started backing up. Now, at 40 yards, I also get too try out the front rest I purchased yesterday. It is probably the cheapest made under the brand and is all plastic except the thumbscrew and a few very small screws. For me this is actually and upgrade. I now have my can with camo cushioned seat, my bar stool, my adjustable front rest, my super deluxe scope (shades of Honor House, among others), my personal range with decent safety measures. I am all set. Now, if I can just tighten those groups … Until they are one hole I won’t offer any measurements.


    • Ken,

      Sounds like your getting your “set up” together. I wish you the best of luck. Let’s just say,…I can relate ! πŸ˜‰

      By the way, “1 holers” at 40 yds……..Gunfun1 corrected me the other day,…a 1 holer is a ragged one hole (group),…one bigger hole. I think a 1/2″ , 10 shot group is a good goal. Do that at 40yds……and you might consider FT.


      • Chris USA
        Do you know people have said that I’m cheating when I say my pellet holes are touching and I say it is a one hole group.

        Ok I have seen some pretty good groups out of guns at closer distances. But a one hole group of 5 shots maybe. And I mean one hole at a close distance. A 10 shot group and that will be tougher.

        Sorry but if all my pellet holes are touching in a group of shots. That’s a one holer to me.

        And I know you said your shooting tomorrow. Let me know how that one hole group goes.


        • Gunfun1,

          Let’s face it,..how many of us will EVER put 10 pellets into the same, or near same hole ?

          ( G&G/Tandwweir might be the exception,…amazing results at 25 meters. )

          Good point on range as well. Even I can do a 5 shot, .270″, C to C, at 41′. Push it out to 25, 30 and 50 yards and let’s just say,….things change a bit. Plus, all my 25~50’s are 10 shot groups.

          Good point on # of shots also. The “odds” are (literally) against you the more shots you take at the same bull. I have had many, heck most, very nice groups, just to have the last 5 shots open a tight 1/2″ group to 1″ plus.

          { So,…until I hit the G&G level,….this airgunner will be calling 1 single (larger) hole,..a 1 holer ! }

          I just looked at some of my 25 yard targets,..the duct tape on the rear of the paper will maintain 1/8″ gap very cleanly. A 1/16″ gap will appear as 2 holes touching, but still very clean.


          • Chris USA
            Think about this too. As the caliber size increases a one ragged hole as we are calling it will be a larger group if your measuring outside to outside of the hole. A smaller caliber if measured that way would be a smaller group.

            So does that mean we can shoot a smaller group with a smaller diameter pellet easier if the gun and shooter is capable?


            • I find shooting .22 for groups to be much more difficult and the group sizes tend to be at least double.
              that’s part of the reason why I was disappointed with my 392(it was going up against my 953 & Aam77) and measuring groups without deducting projectile OD.
              Hang in there Chris!


              • Reb,

                If needed, I will measure overall and deduct. I use a mm. scale C to C which is accurate enough for me. Most all 25yd. groups show some sort of separation. Forget the 50yd. No problem reading those. The 41′ indoors, which I have not shot since winter/spring, are 75% “one holers” and often take the overall/deduction method, but not always.


                • Been playing with the 392 on my new spinner and trying to recover the pellets, haven’t found any remnants that I could swear are 15gr but got some outta the 25.39gr monsters, mostly just the skirts unless I use 5 pumps or less. Some are so splattered I’ll bet most are vaporizing.
                  Only 8 yds and they open to 1.26″@25 but an excellent close range pester.


                  • Reb,

                    Just looked up the 392 in the PA catalog. Wow, that is one “wacked out” scope mount. How does that work out ? Look’s pretty high.

                    Yea, I bet they do splat. My 41′ indoor is steel backed and they are all as flat as pancakes.


              • That’s why you have a better chance of winning a feild target match with a .177 caliber pellet.

                The pellet diameter is smaller and gives you a little more margin for error when shooting at the determined kill zone on the feild target.



          • Chris USA,

            I appreciate that very much. I will go to my grave saying that you’ve got to have the right, by right I mean best, gear(guns) available. I could never get groups like I do with my Marauder. I can do it with my R.A.W., and Daystate rifles though. Thanks again.

            G&G


    • Ken
      I have heard to many times people say the generic scopes won’t hold up. I have shot with them in the past just to see if any problems ocurred.

      I shot them in springers, nitro piston and pcp’s. I have not had one fail yet.

      But wait maybe I don’t really know what those people meant by fail. That could be a interesting blog.


      • If you can see through them they actually work pretty well and can be considered an asset but when it looks like staring at the sky from the bottom of a mud puddle it’s just more junk.


        • Reb
          I have had pretty clear throw away scopes I guess I’ll call them.

          What I have seen with them on springers or nitro piston guns anyway is they won’t hold a consistent zero. Like the reticle is floating. It will make you shoot big groups.

          I tryed one of those scopes on my 300. I shot groups with it and there never was group were the pellets touched. Then I changed to one of my Hawke scopes and even with the bug buster on the 300 my pellets started touching again.

          And I have tryed other throw away scopes and they produced good groups.

          I believe it falls back on design and part quality that the scope maker uses. Well probably even assembly procedures.

          So as it goes. If you get something good you better hold onto it no matter what it is.


      • I’ve had to rotate the scope(just a tad)I have on the QB-36(I believe to be the original one for the Regal) a few times and watching for more rotation, if so I’d prefer putting a decent rear sight on it.


      • I have not had any problems with my scopes. The Centerpoint scope marketing claims it has been torture tested for airguns. Now that I am shooting more again, I do hope it continues to serve me well. And the Daisy scope is better than the one that comes with the Titan, in terms of sighting, that is. ~ken


    • Ken,

      Another thing to do to cut yourself some “slack”, and still be “legit”……..

      If shooting a 10 shot group, and say 3 of 10 are “off” from the rest,…shoot an extra 3 and only count the 10 best. Most of the time it works. You can take a 1″ group down to a 1/2″ that way.

      If you are recording group data, I think this a better and more representative way of judging progress.

      Of course there will be “those days” when nothing seems to work.



        • Matt 61,

          πŸ™‚ πŸ™‚ πŸ™‚ πŸ˜‰ ,Hey,…..I got’s to do what I got’s to do ! Don’t want to beat myself up too bad.

          And,…the “odds” are against me ! I still “pull” shots and my “steady” varies. So yea,…as I believe ol’ Buldawg76 said,….the only fight you “win” is the one you walk away from. It’s still 10 (+) shots.

          Made me laugh on the “slippery slope” bit…… πŸ˜‰


          • Buldawg76 has the moral high ground, but I prefer another philosophy that says: “If you’re in a fair fight, your tactics suck.” That would justify subgroups…

            Matt61


            • It’s rough to have to start over all again, if I call a flyer or pull a shot I still want the data so sometimes I’ll do the same to fill in the blanks. I just missed 4 in a row with the Impact all low which is understandable considering I was shooting 26+gr Monsters. It’s a good thing I slide my 1/2″ backstop behind my spinners or I’d have trimmed the bottom of my fence pickets!
              Wow those things hit hard!


        • Matt61,

          πŸ™‚ What does statistics tell you about going past 10 ? Seems that the odds would be better on failing/ not improving.

          “Slippery slope” made me laugh,….that’s hard to do. Congratulations !


          • We had a very intricate discussion a long time ago about the statistical value of groups of various sizes, and I don’t remember all the particulars. The basic idea was to assume that the distribution of shots in a group is described by the Normal (Bell) curve. Most of the shots will cluster in the middle with the outside edge corresponding to the tails on each side of the Bell curve. Groups will vary between shooters and equipment. But when these are specified, the shots will fall within a boundary, the “call radius.” And the distribution of these shots inside the boundary is a statistical process described by the Normal curve.

            B.B. pointed out that 30 shots establish your call radius. In theory, after 30 shots, you should be able to shoot forever without enlarging the group. The game is to see how many fewer shots you can shoot while still getting a sense of your accuracy. There are a number of interesting effects that you can visualize with the Normal curve. Like the universe after the Big Bang, group size inflates very rapidly with the initial shots then starts to slow. That’s the problem with 3 shot groups. You might get a very tiny group, but it’s hard to know if that was skill or whether you just got lucky. I think we even came up with relationships between one group size and another. I believe that a 3 shot group is 70% of an equivalent 5 shot group. And a five shot group is 80% of a 10 shot group, something like that.

            So, for your question, once you start taking subgroups of 10, you are undermining the reason for shooting 10 in the first place. Your subgroup may not be a reflection of accuracy but of probability.

            I wasn’t thinking of “slippery slope” as funny but I can see the humor. The slope could refer to the slope of the Bell curve as a well as a moral dimension. πŸ™‚

            Matt61


            • Matt61,

              You are of course,..right. I think I was here for that stastistical conversation. I believe Calnib had quiet a bit of good input.

              At 25~50 yds., I always shoot ten for that reason. For me being a new shooter, I am amazed at how the (slightest) mistake on my end, can throw a shot. What the “make up” shots do for me is give me the chance to “redeem” the group and myself. In other words,..a chance to buckle down, concentrate, and do it right.

              I save all my targets, at least for the TX anyways. Stock and 2 tunes, plus about 10 pellet types, it allows me to go back and see high/low POI, patterning, etc. I reduce it all down to simple #’s of group size on one page. So I guess I see that keeping the “pulled” shots in the data, is not a true representation of my progress. It muddys the water if you will. If I took the best 7 or 8 of ten, then I would feel that it was “cheating”. Instead I shoot the required make up shots. On occasion, I would have done better to leave it alone and use the original 10. Most of the time, I can redeem the group. For now, that’s the way I do it.



  17. Denny– I can live with a complicated safety on air guns, and even on some target firearms. But not on a hunting rifle or gun. The TC 84-87 would have been a good rifle to take to Africa. The fewer guns that I have to register and fill out endless forms (at both airports) the better. One rifle, with a group or interchangeable barrels ( including shot gun and .22 lr). would make traveling easier. If only Thompson Center had put a decent tang safety on their rifles. Ed


  18. PS–I am learning to live with the safety on the bug-a-salt that arrived last week. But the heavy trigger pull is another story. It may seem strange, but the last fly that I saw was the day before it arrived! I am trying to get my wife to speak French when she sees a fly, just in case they understand English. Ed


    • Sorry Ed your fighting a loosing battle.

      Here’s the problem and I guess I should ask first. Did you get the camo model?

      Them flys have a communication network you won’t believe. They already passed important intelgence messages to the proper sources and they know what that yellow gun will do.

      Supposedly I have heard that they don’t recognize the camo model as a threat.

      I think you need to order the camo model and keep the yellow as a backup for those aggressive flys.

      Oh and just so you know u hears this through the grape vine. You know that’s one of the fly’s favorite hangouts.

      Any way time for me to fly. πŸ™‚


      • Well I messed that up. It’s suppose to say.

        just so you know I heard this through the grape vine.

        And now I’m in big trouble after repeating this. I will have a fly invasion tonight. Bug A Salt or not. Flys I’m ready for ya.


  19. Hey Everyone,

    Just to bring you up to date with my Competition status in the United States Air Rifle Benchrest organization. I mentioned to B.B. earlier today that I was going to range today to practice for next weeks Sanctioned match. My scores today were 247, 245 and 246 for an aggregate 738 score (out of a possible 750) with 26 X’s. I feel good going into next week. Wish me luck on Saturday. There are always prizes for the top 3 competitors and the are not bad. Scopes, gift certificates, trophies etc.

    By the way, I don’t think I ever said how the First Half of the Postal Series ended. I finished 2nd out of app. 20 shooters with a 9 target aggregate score of 2181 with 63 X’s in the Heavy Varmint Division. I feel very good about that especially considering it is the first time I ever participated.

    I know competing isn’t everyone’s thing but I am having a great time. Really keeps me on my toes as far as practice and staying up with the latest gear is concerned. Obviously it maintains your motivation for air gunning in general.

    G&G


  20. GF1,

    You heard right, very often flies are completely up to date on “the latest buzz” πŸ™‚
    They’re really good with that grapevine intel network of theirs.
    Ed, GF’s idea is a good one…try the camo verson. If you already have it, then get yourself a ghillie suit to go with it…they’ll nrever suspect it much-less understand the threat it conceals. (Well, not for 3 or 4 days anyway…the grapevine, ya’ know πŸ˜‰

    Denny


  21. GF!, Denny–I did not get the camo version. I have 2 rolls of camo tape that I use on my bows and rifles. After I plaster it all over my bug-a salt, I will wear the camo clothes that I use when chuck hunting. I have not washed them for the last 3 or 4 years. If all goes well, I will nor have to use flybait. Since my last post, I used my b.a.s. on a wasp. The blogs that I have read are right. The wasp survived numerous blasts of kosher salt. However they put enough holes in it,s wings so that it could no longer fly.Once it was on the ground, it was completely in my power. With some luck (and camotape) I can begin ridding the world of flies tomorrow. I am glad that flies do not have names, so that I do not have to fear reprisals from peta. Ed


    • Ed
      Be careful. That suite just might be the ultimate deterant.

      Set it out in a nonconspicuos place and kind of hang back and see if the fly’s take the bait.

      And you know what happens next. Unleash al that firepower from the Bug A Salt.

      Just remember to take off the dreaded automatic safety.


  22. Well ut finally happened…I ordered the Daisy/Winchester M14 at about 11:30 tuesday night. It was literally at my door 36 hours later and that was with PA’s free regular ground shipping
    Wow talk about fast.
    BB was, as always, 100 percent accutate in his2012 eval of this rifle as far as the looks, construction of it, etc. During the coming werks or so I’ll be doing my shooting to make sure that nine is as accuracy-capable as his is but I believe it will be, as the only true complaints I’ve read anywhere all reference all of the plastic used inmaking it.
    Due the rifle’s low price-point I gad to add a few other items to get the free shipping. The item that put me over rhe threashold was…the Umarex Beretta M84fs (also based ib BB’s writing on it. This is now one of my favorite aieguns.
    The M14, so far, is exactly as I expected it to be based on the researching I did before ordering it so I was suprised/disappointed by it. The M84fs? WOW was all I could say.(yes, even with that trigger-pull, because even the firearm it copies was never meant to be a long range one holer—and the UX copy’s trigger pretty much guarantees that fact. Of course the firearm’s is much better, but the airgun I can afford.
    Anyway, thanks for the very accurate reviews that you do, and thanks to PA for the fast, good service.

    Denny.


  23. Okay, a surprise range visit to report. I would say the star of the show was archery. For the first time, it was not the last thing to squeeze in at the end. I spent over an hour firing arrows. Doing that with guns would wear me down and cost a fortune, but the archery felt renewing like I could do it all day. Apparently Japanese archers used to practice shooting 24 hours a day. I think this was bound up with the religious practices of monks, and I could see that.

    Working with my 60 pound longbow, I think I may have figured out the ancient forgotten secrets of the English longbowmen! I’ve finally done it!! You step forward with bodyweight like Jack Dempsey throwing a straight left. Then use the momentum to swing the bow upward like Ronda Rousey doing a hip throw (and also like certain YouTube videos I copied). At the top of the arc, let gravity do the work dropping the bow into position and powering your draw as your arms move in opposite directions. Accelerate the string backwards to take advantage of momentum. Complete the draw by slamming the shoulder blades together and expanding the chest like drawing a samurai sword in the art of iaijitsu ( and like another technique I copied from YouTube). While my 60 pounds is a mere faint echo of the original bows, I begin to see it. There was a painful load on the left arm which no doubt was the why the left arm bones of archer skeletons are deformed. The end of the draw came with an impossible steely force, not to be resisted and no doubt the reflection of the gigantic muscles that could control it once upon a time. I feel sure that in my melange of physical techniques, something must be right. And insofar as the ancient techniques must have used body mechanics rather than pure brute force, it’s unlikely that every last thing I did was wrong. Anyway, standing in the sunblasted field, I was convinced that I had become one with the English archers, and I believe that being a legend in one’s one mind is a more common criteria than acknowledged. I was also confirmed in my belief that the fun of accurate shooting is not necessarily based on the accuracy of your weapon but on the experience of being part of it, and I certainly got that with my longbow.

    On to the shooting range. My first move at the 25 yard range was to try the red dot scope with my Saiga offhand at 25 yards. This time I used the steel-cased Hornady ammo. Results were astounding. I put two three shot groups each into one inch. I was impressed before when I could put five into three inches with the Serbian brass cased ammo. I seem to have found my load. I also couldn’t help gloating over the shooter at the next point who was shooting at 15 yards with an AR that kept jamming. But it turns out that I was a little premature.

    At the 100 yard range, it was time for another installment in the saga of the M1. After jamming only twice in 48 rounds with the last load, I thought I would try it again. I got the exact same number of jams again with the second jam coming on almost the last round. Accuracy was horrendous. It looked like a shotgun that barely held the black on a 100 yard military target, making this my most inaccurate rifle by far. I was casting about to try to find something positive in this experience. The trend which I graphed shows an inverse correlation between number of jams and powder weight. So at least, the result has been established. Otherwise, it would seem that such is the perfection of Matt61 ammo (correct to 1/10 gr.) that whatever ails this rifle, I can make it jam the exact same number of times. How about that?… Blog reader TPC is advising me on this, and I believe that my gun will be headed to a gunsmith sooner or later.

    To boost my spirits and give time for the guns to cool, I turned to my AK. For this session, I left nothing to chance. I had my most solid scope mount and my cheek rest. After the promising start, I was really licking my chops with the Hornady ammo to see what it could do. After some zeroing, I put three rounds into a little over an inch, so you could say that I shot MOA. I was an inch left of center, so I clicked in the adjustment and fired another three shots. In the scope, I found that these were also close to MOA but now two inches to left of center. Could I have got the adjustment backwards? I made another adjustment, and this time, I was completely off the paper never to return for the remaining 25 rounds left. Finally in shooting at the berm, I looked to be about two feet up and right, but by the time I adjusted to point of aim, I had run out of ammo. The whole thing was baffling. I checked the mount on the rifle, and I checked the screws locking the scope into the rings. It was all solid, and I was completely confused. Did anyone see what I missed? It was only when I dismounted the scope afterwards, that I found that the rear screws locking the rings into the mount were completely loose. It was even more specific than that. As part of my cool new optics technology, I had rings that mount to the picatinny rail by two throw levers that are each tightened with a screw. I had thrown both levers and tightened the front screw but not the rear screw.

    Augh! This was really one of my worst to be so close to confirming the accuracy of my rifle and then waste half of a fairly expensive box of ammo. This ranks right up there with forgetting to bring Allen wrenches to the range to mount a scope, losing a piece from my Anschutz scope mount and searching in the dirt for 20 minutes to find it. Or the time the lizard crawled under my cap while I was shooting the 1911. I guess I should be grateful that I figured out the problem, and there are certainly signs that the Saiga can shoot with this ammo.

    The only thing to do is head back to the range with another box and to get to the bottom of the M1 mystery once and for all.

    Matt61


    • Yes, it’s good ammo. Good enough for what you can expect that class of rifle to do out to 200.

      Do you live in CA? If you don’t, the 154gr stuff might be worth looking at as well. Also, if you want to spend money- anything loaded by lapua or double tap should do well.

      My saiga dislikes remington PSP’s.

      It will probably not shoot much under a 2″ five or 3″ ten shot group without handloading.

      I shot a guys heavy barrel AR that he uses for hi power. Just under 1/2″ groups in 223. He said he had an 18″ barrel AR in 6.8 that was just as accurate.- the secret was he spent time working up his loads. I don’t have time for all that.


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