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BB needs your help

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ballistic groundhog
Clear ballistic gel groundhog 3-D target.

This report covers:

  • Background
  • Why?
  • Description
  • Seeing the target
  • Back to my problem
  • Summary

Remember that yesterday I commented on how much you readers can help me? Today I am requesting your help. I have a Clear Ballistic Gel Groundhog 3-D Target, and I’m trying to figure what to do with it.

Background

Pyramyd AIR sent this target to me several months ago. I left the box sitting in a corner where I could see it every day, hoping that I would think of the uses to which it can be put. Now don’t get me wrong; I know exactly how this target is used. You shoot at it and are able to see how your pellet performs inside the clear ballistic gel. That part gives me no problem.

Why?

What troubles me is why. Why would someone spend $73 ($80 by the time you get it delivered, but let’s be kind and say just $73) for a target that is good for no more than 100 shots? I’m being very generous with that number, because after there are 50 pellets inside the target you’re going to have difficulty determining which one you just shot. And that’s just for the pellets that remain inside the target! Huh?

Remember when I shot the .41-rimfire Remington double derringer for you? I put a 9.5-inch block of ballistics gel in front of the pistol and fired a shot completely through. You had to take my word that a thin line in the gel, indicated by two blue arrows, was where the bullet passed through.

Remington derringer penetration
The .41-caliber bullet slipped through this 9.5-inch block of ballistics gel (arrows) at point blank range.

Of course a .41 rimfire round is more potent than a pellet from an air rifle — isn’t it? Well, yes and no. Yes the 135-grain lead bullet leaves the muzzle at 516 f.p.s., generating 79.83 foot-pounds of energy at the muzzle. “But BB,” you say, “that’s less than a .25-caliber heavy pellet from an Escape rifle from AirForce Airguns (105 foot pounds).” Yes, but the .41 caliber bullet leaves a bigger hole. Indeed it does. And it is the reason that cartridge was so deadly in the 19th century, despite the lower muzzle energy. It could take days but many if not most people shot in vital areas perished. And, shooting from 3 feet away it’s difficult NOT to hit the vitals!

And THAT, dear readers, is what this ballistics gel target is all about. Except… Any pellet moving fast enough to generate that kind of energy will do what the slower .41-caliber bullet did. It will slip through the target.

Well, BB, that takes care of your too many pellets in the target problem, no? Yes, it does, but you don’t shoot woodchucks with Diana 27s, do you? So I am left with the same question as before. What do you use this target for. Or, better said, how do you use this target?

Description

I’ll come back to this discussion in a bit, but first let me describe the target to you. It’s made entirely of ballistic gelatin and the one I have weighs 13.5 pounds.

ballistic groundhog scale
The ballistics target groundhog I’m testing is sitting on my balance beam scale. It’s about 13.5-inches tall, 9-inches wide and 8.5-inches thick.

ballistic groundhog
The groundhog target weighs 13.5 pounds.

Seeing the target

To see this target you’ll need a dark background. The more even the color the better. I sat this one on my couch and took a picture to show you.

ballistic groundhag couch
A dark even background makes the ballistics gel target stand out.

Stock Up on Shooting Gear

Back to my problem

As I stared at the box I thought that maybe there was a mold inside with the target and after it was shot up you could melt it to remove the pellets and pour a new one. But no, you just get the target by itself.

Then I thought about penetration. Like what does it take to shoot a pellet completely through the target? How shall I test that? Shall I shoot the most powerful pellets first and then the weaker ones because they won’t go through — or will they? What if a weaker pellet impacts the target where a powerful one has already passed through? What will happen? Will is slip through the same hole? Should I try to make that happen so we can see?

Do you see my problem? I’m wondering if I am overlooking anything. How should I proceed? I will test this target but I want to do it right because I only get one chance.

Summary

Readers, I have great respect for you. You guys and gals are my toolbox, and on this report I need your help.

author avatar
Tom Gaylord (B.B. Pelletier)
Tom Gaylord, also known as B.B. Pelletier, provides expert insights to airgunners all over the world on behalf of Pyramyd AIR. He has earned the title The Godfather of Airguns™ for his contributions to the industry, spending many years with AirForce Airguns and starting magazines dedicated to the sport such as Airgun Illustrated.
See Full Bio

132 thoughts on “BB needs your help”

  1. Shoot it from every angle with powdered Kool-aid from the Bug-a-Salt until you make a giant gummy!

    After shooting it full of pellets, could you melt and re-cast the gelatin using a bread loaf mold?

  2. B.B.,

    Please PUT it in your Refrigerator!
    https://customcollagen.com/how-to-properly-store-ballistic-gel/#:~:text=How%20Long%20Does%20A%20Ballistic,it%20must%20be%20used%20immediately.

    You should use it with your slingshot!
    If you have a loaf pan you can remold and reuse it since it will still be close to a groundhog/woodchuck dimension.
    Please fix: In Seeing the target
    “I sat this one on my couch and took a picture to shot(w) you.”

    Then use an airgun of your pesting choice to compare to slingshot/catapult terminal ballistics.

    shootski

    PS: https://www.tinkertar.com/

      • BB-

        What about a short series-

        “Why We Don’t Hunt With…

        BB guns, CO2 pistols, inaccurate or inconsistent guns, beyond a gun’s given accuracy, etc.

        Pick a big box gun with bold advertising and SHOW what happens when you don’t know… about airguns, I guess. Show what happens with a gun that that has power but isn’t capable of reliable accuracy.

        Shoot it with a BB gun and show why that is bad.

        It might provide a good framework for talking about both what is required to ethically hunt and what is not. With pictures.

        • I just read your post on this gel-hog.

          I think that your idea is a really, really good one. A case study in ballistic gel about what should be and should NOT be used to pest.

          There is so much BS about what various arms can do, so it would be refreshing to look at this in real terms using the gel model. The proportions of the ‘chuck would be informative, incidentally, about shot placement in relationship to terminal velocity.

          I second your suggestion. It would also be a potentially more useful destruction of the life-size target than just blowing holes in the gel.

          BB, ProfSteelToe has a great idea here and I think it could be the tie between air gun capacities and humane dispatch of pests.

          • LFranke-

            My first thought on the gel target is that it isn’t ideal for testing at all. It isn’t that thick, isn’t uniform- what can you do with a thing like that but blow it apart and chuckle. But, boy, there is no shortage of those videos online.

            There is a story here.

            I was plinking with my Umarex Fusion .177 CO2 on Friday when this popped up. I had just swapped a scope on the rifle. The Fusion is a fun and easy to shoot little plinker, but MY Fusion is not that accurate. So far. I have seen reviews and videos that show these can be very accurate.

            As I sight in the scope, a cheap-o 4x that came free with some airgun, I can tell there is a lot of unpredictable stiction and not a great range of adjustability. When I get on target, or close, both my elevation and windage screws are backed way out. The sight is floating on almost no spring pressure. The pellets are “in the neighborhood” of striking the target’s aim point. But I have only shot Crosman 7.9 grainers and there are many other pellets that may be more accurate.

            And then up walks Mr. Grey Squirrel to raid the bird feeder just outside my window.

            Now, run through all that is wrong in this scenario with me drawing a bead on Mr. Grey.

            I held on Mr. Grey as he settled down to dinner, my finger itching. He nibbled away, face on, taunting me, as I set the crosshairs on his forehead.

            And then something whispered in my ear, “hey, dipsh*t. You have no idea where that pellet is going to land. You don’t know this gun. You don’t know this optic. You don’t know this pellet.”

            And so I shot Mr. Grey with my Marauder.

            But when I was 14 I would have squeezed. When I was 25 I probably still would have squeezed.

            The path to smart, ethical hunting is often littered with wounded critters and a fair helping of shame.

            I’m not trying to get overly philosophical on this. I just know I was way too far into adulthood when I discovered, much to my surprise, that not all guns shoot big, laser beam holes through all things for 1 shot kills 100% of the time.

  3. BB,
    Perhaps you could start with your lowest power airguns (one shot per gun), and work you way up to see what power level it takes to get total penetration through this little beastie. 🙂
    Blessings to you,
    dave

  4. Tom,

    I think this is a sign for you to mess around with that crossbow pistol again (/blog/2020/04/sen-x-ar-6-tactical-arrow-repeating-crossbow-part-3/)

    Siraniko

  5. Use it as a decoy. Once you put that out every “gopher” in the Lone Star State will need to see if they can mate with it.
    Whatever you do, do not shoot it. Perhaps put it out in the sun and see how long it will last?

    -Y

  6. BB, I’m afraid that I’m hung up on that $73 price tag, thinking of all the pellet’s, targets, and maybe even the start of my fund for one of those new, updated TX200’s with the fancy buttplate and cheek riser. We’ll, the price of this offering from Air Arms seems about as ridiculous as the price of these ground hog gelatin targets. Do we Americans now have so many extra dollars that we should spend them on these products? I’m just sounding off a bit. Orv.

    • Orv
      I fully understand your concern, money wise, but regarding the price of quality items I have to say this; is the price of the TX is high only for Americans? I don’t think so. We can blame anyone we want for general prices increase but it’s exactly that, general. And it’s always the matter of quality. Denial to the trash is not country oriented.

    • Orv.

      I too think Air Arms sales must be on drugs. They have moved on from the velocity race to the price race with the other UK airgun manufacturers. No wonder the Chinese are winning the market share. Their quality has drastically improved and their prices make them affordable.

  7. BB,

    Afraid I can’t help you on how to test this beast, pun intended. I can’t imagine it providing any real useful data. Those animal molds seem to be the favorites of shooters with super high speed cameras when shooting large caliber bullets and exotic shotgun slugs. Other than that, IDK The blocks, on the other hand, are useful with firearms and could be the same with the right airguns.

    The photo that you posted of the block seems to have a problem that I see addressed on some of the gun channels that I watch on YouTube. Apparently the over wrap that comes on the gel block leaves wrinkles on the surface that refract the light enough that it’s difficult to see the “wound channel”. That is often corrected on those channels by passing a propane torch over the surface of the block and melting the wrinkles flat. It seems to work well in those videos.

    Back-lighting the block helps to make the channel stand out as well. Another trick that I’ve seen is to shoot some shots in through one end, then flip the block around and shoot the rest through the other end. It helps keep the shots separated, especially if they aren’t thru-and-thru.

    That’s all I’ve got. I seem to be your dull tool today.

  8. BB.
    Place it 300 yards away with a small flashlight behind, or under, it on a dark night and shoot it standing with a .22 rifle.
    At least it’s a little bigger than an egg! OK you may need an illuminated reticle.
    And don’t forget to record it for us.

    A slo-mo shotgun blast would be nice too.

  9. Shoot a groundhog. Skin it. Insert ballistic gelatin blob inside the hide, and blast away with various hunting pellets to compare them against their claims of terminal performance at range.

    Remold with walnuts embedded inside and repeat.

    • I am inclined to agree with the high-speed camera.
      From watching many YouTube videos that involve ballistics gel, it’s usually used to see what type of a temporary or permanent cavity is left by the projectile as it impacts the target.

      At the velocities we shoot as Airgunner‘s the permanent cavity on anything less than 25 or 30 caliber is going to be minimal.

      The high speed camera with the slingshot idea has its merits.
      I don’t think I have ever seen a video of that on YouTube.

      Even on the slingshot channel on YouTube. (Yes there is at least 1 channel dedicated to slingshots.). And he has over 3 million subscribers.

      https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=the+slingshot+channel

  12. “What troubles me is why. Why would someone spend $73 ($80 by the time you get it delivered, but let’s be kind and say just $73) for a target that is good for no more than 100 shots?”

    I dunno. I wouldn’t. Although I do spring for target paper (most don’t), I have cut out a bullseye-sized circle in a piece of cardboard and made the 5 bull target into a 9 bull target. Hey, if I wanted to exercise like Shootski, I would use single-bull targets.

    Why not just sell the mold. At least that would be reusable. Do they have a squirrel-sized one?

    We really need GunFun1 and HiHiHi to chime in on this one.

    • I would return it to PA for a refund. Use the refund to buy something useful. I hate people spending money on gag gifts and this is just as useless.

      Of the suggestions submitted, I like the idea of shooting it with the sling shot best.

      I have to tell you a ground hog story. When I was in high school we went to a friend from church’s house after church one Sunday. He had mentioned that they were having problems with ground hogs so I brought along my 22 rimfire rifle. After lunch we spotted a ground hog in a field about 75 yards away. I rested against a tree and fired. The ground hog didn’t move so I shot several more shots. Well, the ground hog was still sitting there so I moved closer and shot a few more times. Finally, I walked up to the ground hog and found it dead sitting on it’s haunches with a bunch of holes in it.

      I guess you can make a ground hog pin cushion like I did.

      David Enoch

  13. BB,

    Other than taking a high speed video of this thing being hit by a shotgun at close range, I can think of no use for it as is. You could melt it down and mold it into a block. Then it may have some use if you wanted to demonstrate gut shot penetration.

    Growing up, I shot a lot of groundhogs. They were always head shots. We ate them, so body shots were out. To me, that thing is useless, except for entertainment value.

    RG’s ideas have some merit. First a pellet has to get through a pretty tough hide. Then it has to deal with the bone structure, that is unless you gut shoot it.

    I guess you could send it back with a note. “Really?”

    • ROTFL at “I guess you could send it back with a note. ‘Really?'” Love that dry wit.

      Seriously, I am intrigued by your comment. What is the best recipe for cooking gopher? I have found them to be among the most foul-smelling and off-putting critters (second to the black and white striped ones). I usually don’t kill a creature unless it is either intended for consumption or causing damage to personal property and can’t be persuaded not to do so. However, woodchucks get no quarter from me. Woodchucks deserve my ire because when they get into your garden, they don’t just steal one tomato and eat it. They take a single bite out of every tomato! But if they taste better than “weedrat” perhaps I can take the high road.

      • RG,

        If cooked properly, groundhogs (woodchucks, whistle pigs) are quite delicious. I have never tried gopher.

        We would cook the ‘chucks in tomato juice until very tender and then roll them in flour and fry them in butter. Another way is to cook them in water until the bones can be pulled out easily and either make them into a gravy or mix them with BBQ sauce. I have served the BBQ to guests who would have sworn it was beef.

        Around here, the fuzzy-tailed tree rats like to steal my apples, even before they are ripe. I see a big pot of gravy in the near future.

        • A couple of days ago met up with one of our fraternity for some fun airgun time in the Casa FM backyard. As a bonus, airgunner friend bagged an iguana but neither of us thought it was a good time to fire up the grill…interestingly, he’s having a problem with “tree rats” as well.

        • Up here in Western Pa., gopher = woodchuck = groundhog = whistle pig.

          If “you are what you eat,” the ones at my Dad’s are already flavored with tomato juice.

          Thanks for the recipes. I can’t wait to sight in the Diana 350 Magnum .22 for maximum effective range.

            • RR

              I was going to say the same thing. A gopher the size of a ground hog would make the yard look like a moonscape.

              I’m from western Pa as well,, but I think RG must be from the “upper east side”.

              Ed

              • OK, OK, I looked it up and see the difference. I just don’t think we have any gophers ’round here so “gophers” are lumped in with the woodchucks. I stand corrected. Happy now?

              • eedlee,

                The reference to the “upper east side” must be an inside joke. This dumb ol’ cuntry boy just don’t git it. No matter. RG seems to understand your reference. 😉

      • Roamin,

        The Laurentian Mountains north of Montreal, Quebec used to be my stomping grounds.

        I was fortunate to meet a native who taught me a lot about the outdoors – hunting, fishing and trapping.

        Being invited for supper was a treat with most of the food coming from the land. So yeah, I’ve eaten all kinds of wild critters, plants and mushrooms and generally found them to be tasty. Best thing is to forget any preconceived expectations and judge each bite on its own merit. 🙂

        Cheers!
        Hank

        • Hank, when you say “Best thing is to forget any preconceived expectations and judge each bite on its own merit,” you could be talking about my culinary skills. ;o)

          • RidgeRunner,

            I think you would need lots of sauce with those pallets; especially if they are the Chinese ones.
            Do watch out for the splinters!

            shootski

              • RidgeRunner,

                Yea. Every time my parents complained that my grades were slipping i reminded them that i had no choice in being moved from a country that spelled most all words as they sounded to a country that embraced a language that didn’t spell almost any words as the sounded. I also complained that the way they taught arithmetic operations in our adopted country was backward; by putting the emphasis on the least values claiming it was important for learning precision rather than speed. And then they made us do timed tests with crazy formulas that penalized you more for not doing a problem more than getting it wrong!

                shootski

  14. Upon reflection, shootski’s idea of using the slingshot on it has some entertainment value.

    Possibly Yogi’s idea of setting it in the sun. Set up a camera and take a series of photos of it melting and put them together into a time lapse video. That would be fun to watch.

    • RR,

      It’s a Friday blog because I really do need some well thought-out ideas. I thought you guys were my tool chest! From the comments some of you are trying to be my comic relief. 🙁

      BB

      • C’mon, B.B., why the sad face? Whoever came up with this item did not think it through for serious testing because for $70 it’s basically a disposable item. Once you shoot it once, there is no other spot on it that is the same thickness for comparison, and you would quickly run out of new spots to shoot it. The lack of simulated skin and bones also make it less useful for testing as a comparison or approximation to a real woodchuck. But you did generate a few good ideas, and a few more funny ones. Bill and Frank and Robert from Arcade are onto something, and an inexpensive mold for $X would certainly soften the blow on the initial cost because you could make a new one or several. Heck here’s another idea: a variation on field target with jelly pigs hidden in a field of fire and one has to locate and shoot each one.

        • Roamin,

          Here’s an idea. Why not just sell the regular ballistic gel blocks that I had to purchase from a different vendor instead of molding them into useless shapes?

          I’m looking for good ways to test what I have, and so far I’ve heard two.

          BB

          • Regarding the gel blocks, for testing, that’s the way to go.

            Regarding testing what you have, if the price were significantly lower, some real fun could be had. Isn’t that what it is all about in the end?

            B.B. sorry, but I just had another idea. You can take that giant needle you have attached to your giant tube of TIAT, and inject a one inch red blob of it into the wood chuck’s head and chest and using the other more serious comments, study entrance and exit wounds.

  16. As I myself am likely done with this subject, I thought I would pass this on. I sent a message to Weihrauch concerning their new stocks.

    Dear Mr. Weihrauch,
    Although I have not used one, it is my understanding that the “new” Minelli stock design is not conducive to using open sights. I have an HW30S of the “old” stock design and it is superb with using the open sights.

    The Minelli stock is designed for scope use only. The cheek rest is too high for use with the open sights.

    Tom Gaylord is writing a blog concerning the shooting of his “new” HW30S that came equipped with the Minelli stock. I have attached a link to this for your convenience.

    /blog/2023/06/what-a-difference-a-stock-makes-part-four/

    Although I am very interested in purchasing more of your air rifles, I would hesitate to do such if they come equipped with a Minelli stock, although I am capable of rasping down the cheek rest and refinishing the stock.

    With Best Regards,

    thank you for your mail.

    The never design do not have a higher cheek as the older design. We test shoot all our HW 30 models with open sights and we do not have problems.

    Best regards

    Weihrauch-Team

    • Wow that is very interesting! Thanks for that RidgeRunner. I guess someone with both stocks has to measure the drop at comb and heel and the thickness of the comb to objectively report on the differences. I have two Beeman R7s but neither wears the Minelli stock.

      As for Friday blog material, I would love to hear from readers who rarely comment or even first time commenters, especially regarding yesterday’s blog and what would make a good first adult airgun or a child’s first airgun. Or, the opposite point of view, what makes a bad first airgun that might dissuade folks from the sport.

      • “A bad First Airgun”
        Probably the most powerful break barrel magnum with an advertised 1250 fps (Alloy).
        Although I have far exceeded that with an extremely light weight pellet in a Ruger Magnum that was dieseling. It’s a springer.
        And that would be the Umarex Octane. It’s a gas piston. You better know what you want all that power for because it will remind your cheek that it has it every time you shoot it. Heavy pellets, and perhaps slugs? highly recommended.

        • Thanks for that. I manged to stay away from the velocity wars upon my return to airgunning thanks to this blog, but the Wally World purchasing departments and the airgun companies that supply them have not seemed to get the message. Speed may sell, but you may lose your repeat customer base.

    • RidgeRunner,

      I hope i don’t run afoul of the family friendly rules with this…Many of the single or tandem seat aircraft had a thing called a Relief Tube. A cone was attached to a length of flexible hose that was vented to atmosphere on the dirty side of the aircraft. It was stored under the ejection seat in a holder. Sometimes when a new Aviator checked into a Squadron practical jokes were undertaken by the Maintenance Crew. One such practical joke resulted in entries on a Post Flight Gripe Sheet into the aircraft maintenance log like this:
      Relief Tube unusable; too short!
      Then in the corrective action section of the Maintenance Action Form (MAF):
      Could not duplicate gripe; checks good for Enlisted on deck.

      I think this person at Weihrauch must be former Enlisted!

      shootski

      • shootski,

        The helos on our ship were equipped with such.

        I was thinking the test person at Weihrauch must be pretty small as BB is smaller than me and he has trouble using the sights.

        It can also be very difficult to admit a very expensive error.

        We will have to encourage BB to investigate this supposed discrepancy.

    • With due respect to Weihrauch engineering, guess it depends on what the meaning of “higher cheek” is; perhaps the pics prove nothing one way or the other, but even FM’s non-pristine eyes and brain see a difference.

      HW30 new stock atop HW95 old stock.

        • Finally, side-by-side; disclaimer: FM seems to have no trouble sighting thru either rifle, but that’s based on his one-of-a-kind anatomy. And let us rejoice it is only one-of-a-kind. 😉

          • FM,

            I for one recognize the Minelli checkering. Comparing this to the HW95 (which I covet) will not give a “true” representation of the possible change in cheek weld of the HW30. Perhaps BB’s problem is a change in the “style” or design of the cheek pad, which has changed.

            The Minelli stock may also contact the shoulder in a different place. It would appear it is designed for bench shooting, likely with a scope. As in the revised Benji pumper synthetic stock, the apparent assumption is a scope will be mounted. The open sights are there because they were there in the first place.

            This is all speculation on my part. BB can measure and dispell our speculation as he has both stocks. Another way we can determine is if you were to bring your “new” HW30 with you to the NC airgun show and I bring my “old” HW30, we can compare apples to apples. They have a shooting range out back at the NC airgun show and we can pop at some spinners and see how they compare.

    • RR, this was a service to the airgun community. And hats off to Weihrauch-Team for making time to answer.

      I think the issue with the new stock is not the height of the comb. The issue might be the width of the comb. The way how it is wide at a higher corner of the comb, which is hard to compare just by looking at the photos. At the end of the day, every face is different.

      Here is the problem with high quality springers. For example, if it was a regular rimfire rifle, I could just walk into the closest BassPro shop and test it. Unless you live in Phoenix, there is no way to hold an HW30S in the US before a purchase. The new stock might work better with my face compared to the old one; I cannot know without an online purchase, which would be a gamble.

      As the sales are done online, how about selling them without stocks and sights. The folks who want to scope can order the springer with a high comb stock and muzzle brake, and the folks who want to use the iron sights can order the springer with a lower comb stock and those magnificient HW sights. Still, there might be a face out there that’ll need a higher comb to use the sights, and another face might need lower comb even for the scope.

      So, a WELL designed synthetic adjustable stock would work wonders.

      • Fish,

        I had just pointed out the difference of the design of the Minelli cheek rest to that of the “old” one with FaultyManuel. It would seem to me that the “new” stock is designed for bench shooting, where you would “lay” your face on the cheek rest. As for holding it while standing, as I have a high cheek bone the Minelli stock may work for me.

        As you have pointed out, we all have different faces. As for the choice of stocks and sights when ordering, that could be quite expensive to maintain such an inventory.

  19. Well, at $73 for a limited use target I can only say that a fool and his money are soon parted.

    I read (think it was in Outdoor Life magazine way before internet) about some ministry Game Wardens who put a realistic life-sized bull elk cutout near a highway during the hunting season. A number of people stopped and shot at it, illegally, from a public road at a “game animal” on private land the they had no permission to hunt on. I forget how many shots were taken (or fines handed out) but do remember that a high percentage of the shots at a broadside, stationary, elk-sized target would just have wounded an animal.

    That being said, I could see the educational benefits of shooting at a life sized gelatin woodchuck to check accuracy and performance of the shooter and the weapon… but not for $73!!! Cardboard cutouts and ductseal penetration tests (at that range) can do the same job for cheap.

    As to what to do with your gelatin woodchuck, maybe donate it to a local club to be used as a fun promotion.

    Happy Friday all!
    Hank

    • The Virginia game wardens do the same thing with “plastic” deer and reflectors for eyes. Sometimes they even use an animated one that raises and lowers its head.

      • RidgeRunner,

        So that’s what that was on my last Cull…i passed on it because I thought it moved like one of the Presidents at Disney World and wasn’t long for this world anyway.
        Must be Field Biologist/Game Warden’s idea of pranking shooters.

        shootski

  20. BB

    In all fairness, how do you test / price fun. It’s a reactive target and 10 year old me would have loved to shoot the heck out of it. 62 year old me would love to spray paint it orange, turn it into a 3D Shoot NC and let go at 15 feet with a Crosman 760. Given it’s size and weight I would guess maybe 2-3 thousand BB before it turns to goo.
    Heck might be interesting with a friend. One shoots Black Diamond BB, the other steel. Would be nice to tell the shots apart. Kids would definitely love it since they could actually aim and hit. I think they gave you the wrong target to test. Everyone loves Gummy Bears. 🙂

    If the thing can manage 3k shots, cost would be ,02 cents a shot but how would you price a smile

    Kind Regards

    JDA001

  21. So sorry B.B. because FM’s warped mind and sense of humor can only see the potential “Laugh-In” moments involving Mr. Jellychuck. For one thing, its pic sitting on your couch could make one conclude it is about to be subjected to intense interrogation and it is pleading for its life. Now if Pyramyd AIR were to send ole FM a Jellychuck, we’d see how it could handle a “minny” shot from the .58 percussion powder-burner.

    Have a great weekend, everyone!

  22. B.B.
    Really long range penetration testing, with a few universally acclaimed hunting pellets of the smaller calibers. It could show the real hunting potential to novice shooters here. After all something like this is the true purpose of ballistic gelatin. And after that testing melt and reuse. The high cost goes side by side with some good lessons from the Teacher…

      • B.B.
        I would assume that best selling powerful springers and average powered pcp s should be the most useful, from the Teacher’s point. There’s a chance to spread wisdom to many potential hunters. A piece of leather covering the kill zone would make an even better lesson as RG already said.

        • BB,

          DO NOT LISTEN TO BILL! HE IS JUST TRYING TO SCORE BROWNIE POINTS WITH THE TEACHER!

          Set it in the sun with time lapse photography! That will provide more entertainment than shooting it.

          • RR
            “Score brownie points with the Teacher”? Come on my friend, I have told you before that my original English teachers never taught me these expressions. Please explain so I can enjoy them as much as most of you. Although I have a feeling of what it means; why does my little Maltese leaks my face?

            • Bill,

              I am sorry. I forget that other people around the world participate in this blog, most especially when they use such great english.

              “the Teacher” is in reference to BB as you are likely aware. “score Brownie points” is an expression meaning trying to earn easy points with someone, curry favor, appease or please a person. Brownie is the beginning and youngest level of the Girl Scouts.

              It was meant in jest. I do hope I have not offended you. It was not my intention.

              Some people find it difficult to understand my humor at times. It leans toward the British in form.

              • RR
                Offend me? Jesus Christ, as we say in my country, by all means no. It’s just my urge to learn as I am getting older. Although I hoped that my comparison to my little Maltese’s behavior shows that I got the meaning.
                My friend your sense of humor is quite mild for my standards, according to my wife at least. I just don’t really communicate with many people, and you, along with a few others here, are among the exceptions.

              • RR and Bill

                Actually,, is a reference to the rather rude meme that one is so subservient that they have their nose up the superior’s ass. Not that I, personally, would ever have said such a thing.

                Points would them be awarded for depth of penetration and for duration. I doubt that there would be any awarded for style, tho.

                There are rude sayings and sobriquets in every language and most do not translate well. This may be one.

      • Tom,

        Why bother with the power level? Determine what you are going to it with at what range and then demonstrate if the pellet from Gun A at X yards would yield a humane kill or not. You have a lot of powerplant types on hand. Will a 12 FPE breakbarrel rifle do at 25 yards or do you need to be closer? Will a High velocity Wally World rifle be able to hit the target accurately? Up to what range? How far can a PCP take out the target humanely?

        Siraniko

  23. BB-

    I’ve read today’s blog and comments and then reread…. Still concluding that this item is a solution looking for a problem. Can’t think of anything useful beyond the cow-tipping entertainment value. But, I did get to thinking about groundhogs and Groundhog Day and Punxsutawney Phil and Buckeye Chuck and weather prognostication…….

    How about Pelleteer Pete- Prognosticator Supreme of Hits and Misses in the Airgun Biz.
    This could be his periodic (once a blue moon, say) appearance on the blog to predict how new products will perform in the marketplace. Or how previous introductions fared in the fickle finality. Seers have long used crystal balls. You could have your crystal ‘pig’.

  24. This is a silly thing. Same as judging “stopping power” of handgun rounds by shooting the same stuff. Armchair mall ninja crap. Personally I don’t want to be shot with anything! I have always thought shooting at jugs filled with water, ballistic gel, bars of soap ,ect… to be a waste of time and product. When I test bullets or pellets for hunting I use real bones and flesh. I set them up behind real cover where I’d shoot at stuff that was hiding behind that. Example: a fresh deer shoulder bone shot at 30 yards behind a wall of dry golden rod is often quite safe as the 12 ga slugs often deflected enough to miss it and would have caused a wounding hit. Moral of the story: wait for a clear shot to make a humane decision. You’ll get another chance ,but screw up and it will haunt you if you have a soul.

    You want to see how a pellet really does on lets say a squirrel or raccoon ? Obtain one and shoot it . I catch mine in season and shoot the dead carcass ,then bury what’s left in the garden if I don’t eat it. Probably unpalatable to some of the readers, but you really get an education on terminal ballistics. I’ve killed literally hundreds of small animals and processed them for food and fur. Some of the recommendations on what pellets or pellet gun to shoot certain game animals, leave me scratching my head. Clearly written by folks who have no idea.
    However ,I will admit to shooting clear pine 3/4″ boards to test penetration of pellets. Hold over from the old days when a pellet guns raw power was judged by how many you could shoot through.

  25. Good morning Tom and everybody.
    Perhaps this would be a perfect opportunity to test the efficacy and also illustrate it…… Of your best 12 foot pound air rifle. You could start at a range that would be considered marginal at best. Then you could slowly decrease the range…… With the ability to illustrate
    Maximum humane hunting distance.
    At least there’s no punchline to this one…. So I’ve got that going for me!

    Yes that’s a quote from caddyshack at the end. Couldn’t help it Frank B

    • I agree with your thinking. 12 ft lbs would be a widely useful power level here in the USA and abroad, and by shooting at maximum (marginal) distance you could really learn how hunting pellets behave at lower velocities. Then as you get closer how their performance changes.

    • Frank!

      Yes, BB could send it to me for testing. He just made my Diana 34 into a 12 FPE air rifle and I really do like groundhogs. I would be the perfect tester.

    • Frank,

      Another good suggestion! BB could send me the Giffard and I would be most happy to plug the “Jellychuck” with it. I mean “Pelleteer Pete- Prognosticator Supreme of Hits and Misses in the Airgun Biz”.

  28. BB,
    Me thinks we are participating in a marketing analysis, and all I can say is ‘Fuhgeddaboudit’. (Spell checker approved for use in Brooklyn NY)
    All thing considered; it is not going anywhere. Too expensive and not needed.

  29. BB

    So far you have gotten some wide ranging ideas as to the use of your new “target”. I kinda liked the idea about using the hand cross bow and maybe comparing it’s penetration to that of the sling shot. Maybe add a BB gun to the mix.

    If you had to move back farther, the “under 12 fp” rifles or hand guns might be fun.

    In the end, tho,, I think I like best the idea of using “Pete” as a sage advisor, sitting on your desk, whispering in your ear. No ballistic gel need be harmed in the making of those blogs that utilized him.

    Ed

  32. Tom,

    My wife and I were out of the house for much of the week, so I read this just now. That gel Groundhog is hilarious! I chuckled out loud when I saw the photo of it sitting on your sofa. I think you should not shoot it with anything but instead hold onto it and use it as a blog mascot, putting it in the random photo, having it peer at airguns’ internals, assessing groups on targets. Think of the fun you would have captioning those!

    And consider the fun and reader participation potential of naming it.

    This is an oportunity not to be squandered.

    Michael

  33. How much gel could a gelchuck chuck if a gelchuck could chuck gel?

    A gelchuck would chuck all the gel he could chuck if a gelchuck could chuck gel.

    You can talk all you want Chuck, but I can see right through you!

  34. B.B. and Readership,

    I keep thinking about Jelly!

    “Roll out those lazy, hazy, crazy days of summer
    Those days of soda and pretzels and beer
    Roll out those lazy, hazy, crazy days of summer
    Dust off the airguns and sing a song of cheer
    Just fill your basket full of sandwiches and Jellychucks
    Then lock the house up, now you’re set…
    You’ll wish that summer could always be here
    You’ll wish that summer could always be here

    composed by Hans Carste.
    It was originally written as “Du spielst ‘ne tolle Rolle”, …

    But now for the bad news:

    GEL is SYNTHETIC!

    i did learn something that i hadn’t known before reading this weekend blog! I thought all the ballistic gel was animal based…i need to rethink the possibilities this provides. With a modicum of care in handling this 3D Target is a better deal than i originally thought!
    The price of this gel regardless of the mold shape or size is a good deal.

    Tom, I think you should do comparative ballistic performance testing on every airgun you test even those that have no business being thought of as a hunting arm by anyone.
    It will/could prove to be a great service to new and old to airguns to know the Terminal Ballistics performance with various projectile types as well.
    To keep it from becoming your next life project we need to settle on the fixed range that airgun pesting and hunting typically occurs at.
    Perhaps a set of three Test Plans based on a range of muzzle energy of Low, Medium, and High Energy at fixed distances? The Testing could be reported as one part of each series since you would want to use at least four or five different weight pellets/slugs/ball as makes sense, or not, for the airgun.

    shootski

  35. Sir,
    This is my first post.
    I wanted to tell you how much I like your blog and how much I have learned.
    Your review of the HW30 gave me the nudge to buy one, and I am so glad I did. I have had bad experiences with springers in the past but they were cheap Chinese or Big Box store guns. This gun is a joy to shoot, it’s only limitations are me.
    I was recently gifted yes gifted a Sheridan C Blue Streak. This gun had very little use by the looks of the inner workings. The stock has a few dings and wear marks but perfectly functional. The advice you have given here allowed me to restore this gun to working condition. I put a Williams gunsight from my Benjamin 392 (which I do not like) on it and it is very accurate and quite powerful. I really enjoy shooting it.
    In conclusion, Thank you for your work and information.

    Sincerely

    Calmly

  36. BB,

    You can create a mould using the gel, and then you can make groundhog shape chocolates using the mould!? ……..Okay, sorry for the bad joke. 🙂

    I’d say start with the weakest airgun you have. Start with the 499B, for example… Just one shot with each airgun. At every step, pick a tad bit stronger one. Continue until you reach your strongest airgun. Let’s see which one will be the first one to tear it up into two pieces. I think this gel animal seems to be a fun target to ‘plink,’ or plumb in this case, than a serious ballistic test item – so have fun with it.

    Fish

  37. BB,

    How about you interview the airgun manufacturers or their distributors with our questions? You directly ask our questions to them and then write a blog using their answers. Perhaps, we might start with Air Venturi. I’d have a few questions to them about their past and future springers.

    Fish

  38. BB asks a serious question (at least, I THINK he was serious!) and the responses remind me of a high school vocational ed class! LOL!

    I agree, this looks like a product in search of a non-existent market niche. I vote for cherry bombs and M80’s.

    Motorman
    Eastern MO

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