Projectile weight

by B.B. Pelletier

Update on Tom/B.B.: Tom’s condition continues to improve, and some milestones the doctors have set have been reached and even surpassed. Since Saturday, he’s been all smiles and has perked up quite a bit because his best friend, Mac, has arrived for a week’s stay. He’ll be testing guns and providing velocity and accuracy data, which B.B. will use to write blogs over the next few weeks. Since Mac is a heck of a great shot, we should be seeing some really good targets and groups.

Today’s blog is based on the various comments to the previous blogs about Pellet variation and Mass production.

AlanL has previously commented that light pellets might be more efficient and was wondering about things like drag. He specifically mentioned using aluminum for pellets. I thought I would take today and do a short report on some projectile weight changes that have been made and had major impacts over the years.


Daisy’s BBs didn’t always look like this, they weren’t always this size and they weren’t always made of steel.

The first caliber BB gun was actually shotgun shot-size BB. That’s supposed to be a round lead ball 0.180 inches in diameter. Early BB guns shot this because the shot was readily available, and owners didn’t have to make any special provisions to get it. Every hardware store carried shotgun shot.

When the 20th century dawned, the Daisy company decided to lighten their lead shot, so they down-sized it to 0.175 inches. This reduced the amount of lead that went into each projectile. It doesn’t sound like a lot, but the savings are great when you’re selling millions and billions of shot. The benefits were that the new shot flew faster in given guns. Of course, being smaller, it didn’t work in the older guns; so different size shot tubes for Daisy’s private-branded Air Rifle Shot had to be fabricated for new guns.

Fast-forwarding to the 1920s, Daisy began to get returns of their BB guns with shot stuck in the tubes. When they looked at the problem, most of these were coming from the Minneapolis area. They went there and discovered that kids were going to the scrap piles behind the American Ball Company and picking out round steel balls that would fit in their BB guns. They gauged the shot by dropping it down the muzzle to see if it stuck in the shot tube. This new type of shot worked well, but it wasn’t suited for the shot tube, which was designed for lead. Daisy saw another savings opportunity, though, and they contracted with American Ball to produce Bullseye Air Rifle Shot. We’re now into the 1930s, and Daisy guns are shooting what we see today — traditional steel BBs. They went even faster than the older lead shot, but they didn’t shoot quite as true. The shot size was now nominally 0.173 inches. Daisy was able to reduce the power of the springs in their guns, making them easier to cock and producing an overall better product.

World War II
WWII caused shortages of materials that halted production of BB guns for the duration. When the war was over, critical supplies — such as steel plate — were still in shortage and hard to come by. So, the BB gun industry took several years to ramp up into production. Since steel was such a critical item, Daisy experimented with aluminum shot. This is where today’s story plays out, AlanL. Aluminum shot was very, very fast and had absolutely no accuracy whatsoever. Daisy had discovered the threshold beyond which you cannot lighten the projectile. So, they went back to steel, and we’ve been there ever since.

Airsoft
For more proof that lightweight projectiles are less accurate, you only need to look at the world of airsoft. An airsoft BB of 0.12 grams is often selected for smaller, less expensive airsoft guns because it flies very fast. But, when put in a potentially more accurate gun, they cannot be controlled and usually fly erratically. Airsoft snipers have learned this and understand the importance of balancing the weight of the ammo with the gun.

Pellet weights
You’ll notice that there are some optimum pellet weights. If you look at what’s available for sale, you’ll find that many of the pellets are clustered within a central weight range. When you go too heavy, they become clumsy and inaccurate. When you go too light, they become erratic and inaccurate. For long-range shooting, you want a heavier projectile and a more powerful powerplant that’s suited to that projectile weight.

60 Responses to “Projectile weight”

  • Orin Says:

    Well, I guess that pretty much sums it up for hyper-velocity pellets, too. I haven’t tried one yet, in any gun, that outshot lead.

    I really had high hopes for RWS HyperMAX, which appear identical from one pellet to the next, have virtually no imperfections, and are manufactured to extremely tight tolerances (according to my micrometer). How could anything shoot poorly that is presented in packaging like this?. Yet, in my Crosman 1077, which gets nowhere near the sound barrier, they were outperformed by cheap Daisy wadcutters. It’s shameful, really.

    B.B. – Sounds like you’ll be back on the horse in no time! Glad to hear it!!!

    - Orin

  • duskwight Says:

    B.B.

    Keep it coming! :) Glad to hear the news of your near-recovery!

    Yesterday I’ve finished tests shooting my springer @ 100m.
    Targets were A4 sized sheets of paper with a thick ring bullseye 50 mm in diameter. I was shooting again from prone with targets at the same distance, same rifle settings, albeit it was a bit warmer – 24 centigrade. Pellets were sorted out by weight, but not actually weighted.
    Well, to see how awful one’s hold is – one must shoot 100m :) Even tiniest of mistakes in holding your air rifle pop out and grow real big.
    Groups… Eeer… Well, there were something someone can call groups.
    Best is 72 mm, with 98 mm average in 5 and 10-shot series. I even made 2 “doubles” – 2 holes touching each other :) Groups tend to be quite circular, without significant vertical spread.
    However when shooting unsorted unweighted pellets there was definite vertical “stitch” – some went up, some went down. So, some tired maxim – pellet weight does matter, and it matters more with the distance, and of course, the result one plans to achieve.
    BTW the ultimate grouping that day was achieved by mosquitoes :) – an early and warm spring makes them a cross between count Dracula, kamikaze and African locust.

    duskwight

    • Matt61 Says:

      Duskwight, what I calculate to be 3-4 MOA shooting is very good and comparable to firearms. This is the only test on record for this blog of firing a springer at 100 yards, and, therefore, the best. We should give you a factor for mosquitoes too. What kind of springer do you have? I’ll have to take my B30 to 100 yards.

      • duskwight Says:

        Matt 61

        In 2007 it used to be Gamo CFX Royal Much water has flowed under the bridges since then… :)
        Custom made-to-measure stained beech stock (a cross between target/sport and fullstock). Epoxy bedding, new hardened hex screws, bronze bushings.
        Zero dead-volume piston seal, custom seals at loading breech.
        Precision-crowned LW barrel with standard rifling c. 40 mm shorter than stock Gamo barrel, albeit overall length is about the same, because of a longer stock.
        Gas spring.
        Tuned trigger assembly: sears angles corrected, springs changed, surfaces polished, CharlieDaTuna trigger installed, a bit of reinforcing its installation.

        Did you make any improvements to your B30? From what I know about Chinese airguns they definitely need re-crowning and reworking their trigger assemblies, as Chinese do not copy Diana T05 trigger units.

        duskwight

        • Matt61 Says:

          Wow, the Gamo CFX lives again. They were all the rage here a couple years ago, then disappeared. I think that the blog entry with the greatest number of comments at the time of polling was about the Gamo CFX.

          I sent the B30 to Rich Imhoff for a tune-up. He said it was full of rust that he cleaned out. He lubed everything; replaced the broken spring with a Maccari custom job; and did some kind of modification to the trigger that is similar to the work of Charlie Da Tuna. Rich said it would be like a new rifle, and it is. Oddly, the accuracy made a sudden rapid increase within the last year after hundreds if not thousands of rounds. I need to take it to the range to see what it can do at long distance.

          I’ve been thinking about what factor we should give you shooting with mosquitoes. B.B. had the same conditions on a memorable test in which the B40 outshot his TX200. He was getting about an inch with both guns at 35 yards which is the result he generally gets at 50 yards. I won’t do the math which is straightforward, but I think that correction factor might bring your groups under 2 MOA.

          • duskwight Says:

            Matt61

            Accuracy improvement is expectable, as sears break in and action becomes smoother and shorter. In my experience, short smooth action can shrink groups into half of their original size.
            What is not good about them is that sometimes, especially on cheaper Chinese springers, they are made from low-quality badly hardened steel so one must check surfaces and angles regularly, just for safety reasons.
            One must also notice the stock – basically all airgun stocks are made for average-sized men. If you’re lucky to be of such build – that’ll be your forte. My Dad is lucky this way – he is of perfectly average male height and average athletic man build. I’m not as lucky, I’m a big guy, so most rifles are 30-40 mm short for me. However, one can get used to one’s length and angles of stock. Or change stock to his lengths and angles :)
            So it’s either you or your rifle that have to fit each other and that’s IMHO second reason for your improvement – practice, which works a bit prigoginian way – in leaps and “critical masses” :) I guess despite the beauty of beech, walnut, zebrano or other wood, future belongs to fully adjustable stocks, and they’re cheap when made from alloys and polymers.

            Third reason is I guess that you won your Chinese barrel lottery :) I cannot say for products they import to your country, but here they can be of three types: quite good Gamo-like barrels, typical Crosman-like barrels with shallow rifling and oversized grater-like offcentered erratically rifled tubes. Last being prevalent.

            And to conclude – I think CFX Royal is THE first serious rifle for a man who wants to shoot. It has immense potential, yet very simple to upgrade and well-balanced in terms of power, accuracy and cost. And one must not forget its extremely safe loading system (BSA Stutzen is a good thing too, I wonder why Gamo doesn’t make this beaty based on CFX).

            duskwight

  • DaveUK Says:

    BB and Edith:
    There is nothing like having your best buddy come and visit for raising the spirits.

    AlanL:
    That was a funny story you wrote yesterday.
    Dontcha just hate it when that happens :)
    I kid you not,this is the first thing my old dad would have said to my mum if she had hit those targets as well as your wife did.
    “Good shooting love,don’t be offended but I will tell you where you went wrong”:)

    Orin:
    The old sabot Idea which has been brought up is the way to go I reckon.
    A two stage pellet.
    The current steel headed pellets have to drag the plastic outer all the way to the target.
    What is the point?
    The plastic bit has already served its purpose creating a seal,imparting spin and protecting the barrel.
    The steel inner or possibly tungsten could be made any shape then.
    The downside would be though that for example a .22 rifle firing a .22 sabot would actually be firing a .20 bullet head sort of thing.
    Looking at main battle tanks again,(Cheers Alan)the velocities are so high firing a depleted uranium ‘Dart’contained in a Sabot they have even dispensed with rifled barrels.
    The future of airgunning is very exciting and the possibilities endless.
    Revisiting old technology and bringing it bang up to date.
    Have you seen that youtube clip of that guy firing his home made full auto BB gun?
    Incredible!
    I am just off to buy some lottery tickets to make my dreams come true.
    I am crap at poker you see :)
    DaveUK

    • AlanL Says:

      Dave,

      If I’d’ve said that to her she’d have a put a pellet right between my eyes! :D

      -AlanL

    • Herb Says:

      RE: “Looking at main battle tanks again,(Cheers Alan)the velocities are so high firing a depleted uranium ‘Dart’contained in a Sabot they have even dispensed with rifled barrels.”

      Yes and no. The “dart” is long compared to diameter. If you spun it then the projectile would precess significantly. In this case spinning degrades accuracy.

      Herb

  • Mr B. Says:

    Good morning Edith, Tom and Mac,

    Mac we’re glad you had safe trip. Tom, walk the walk, talk the talk and run like hell for home.:) Edith, you are a remarkable woman.

    Your last paragraph is the “book” on pellet weights and air guns, all the rest are foot notes.

    However, just to keep the pot boiling, DaveUK’s remark about main battle tanks, smooth bores, hyper velocity, and sabots makers me wonder if anyone has tied that concept with air guns?

    Mr B.

      • DaveUK Says:

        Herb:
        Bless you mate for posting that link.
        Them was sure good pellets :)
        DaveUK

        • Ryan Says:

          I really like the H&N Coppa Point in .22 cal. Did they stop making these? I can’t find them except on Ebay UK. Shipping is too much. :(

          • Paul Says:

            The Coppa Point pellets are still available in both .22 and .177. Go to the USA Ebay and you will find them offered by a fellow in Canada. I just ordered four tins (and some others) and they arrived in a week. Good prices, too.

            Paul

    • DaveUK Says:

      Good morning Mr B:
      I gave you a method of casting moulds which I would use utilising my old dental skills.
      Probably not the best for the purpose I am afraid.
      I understand the new method used by dental labs are the injection moulding technique as opposed to the old flask pack method which I am used to.
      How is this for an idea though?
      Bond two H&N hollow points tail to tail.
      Bore a hole straight through the lot using the dimples as a guide.
      Use cheese wax to infill flush between each pellet head.
      Pop in the fridge to harden the wax.
      Fire it into water first so you can retrieve it and check the whole structure didn’t fly apart when leaving the muzzle.
      That combined slug is going to be pretty heavy though.
      All the best,
      DaveUK

  • AlanL Says:

    B.B.,

    Thank you for this morning’s blog. I am glad to hear you are recovering quickly. I did have my suspicions that aluminum would be too light. Oh well, back to gold it is! :D

    By the way, for any of you out there who enjoy a great read and like BB guns, I can highly recommend Arni T. Dunathan’s book “The American B.B Gun – A Collector`s Guide”. It was published in 1971 so is scarce today. It is not just a dry catalogue but a well written, highly interesting history of airgunning in America, with a number of funny anecdotes.

    -AlanL

  • Chuck to Kevin Says:

    Sorry for the repeat, although it deserves one. I wanted this on today’s blog.

    Kevin,
    You are a photography genius!!!! Great work!.

    Herb,
    Thanks for that link to the pellet batabase and sooooo much more.

    -Chuck

    • kevin lentz Says:

      Chuck,

      I must assume your praise of my photography skills refers to the library of pellets. If so, then I appreciate your compliment but that’s a different kevin.

      kevin

  • ajvenom Says:

    BB – Hey BB, hope to see you back soon. BTW…there’s been a few changes since you’ve been gone.

    1. All the roads have been torn up because we are all drive flying cars now.
    2. Weight watchers went out of business, since we are all eating a well balance diet in the form of a pill. I believe they call it soilent green II.
    3. All communications in television, radio, personal and internet have been done via a bio chip that is implanted in your brain.
    4. All the wars have ceased since the invention of high absorbtion solar panels. Oil sells for less than the price of water.
    5. Your clone is almost complete. So until then take it easy and your replacement organs will ready for implant in about a week.
    6. Aiguns don’t shoot projectiles anymore, they shoot out a light beam in the form of a lazer. Some antique airguns have been found is some guys garage in Midtown, Texas, but nobody knows how they work.

    LOL!!! I was born in Minneapolis and lived there and near there for about 20 years. Now I live in in Southern Minnesota. More peaceful here. As far as BBs go that’s pretty funny. They say that neccessity is the mother of invention………I suppose saving money is too.

  • Matt61 Says:

    I’d say that anyone combing scrap yards for round metal balls that happen to fit the barrels of their BB guns is pretty hard up for amusement.

    Thanks to all for their guesses. I’m afraid there is no winner unless it’s me. :-) The new acquisition is:

    “Anschutz 1907″

    I don’t have the capability to post photos, but if you Google the above term and go to the first result, you will get a good picture. For my clue, BG_Farmer is my consultant and rimfire advocate, and CowboyStar Dad is our resident Olympic shooter. Put those together, and you get Olympic rimfire which can be none other than an Anschutz rifle, the dominant smallbore Olympic rifle of all time. For those not familiar with this brand, it cost $2500 clams.

    For one with a previously spotless reputation for thrift, I feel exposed as a total pervert.

    Partly, my reasoning may have had to do with a backlash against thrift. No more calculations of relative cost, no more so-so triggers, no more things falling off the rifle and needing to get tuned! I’m reminded of a book where some Irishmen are describing their fantasy car. “A car so long you can’t see the end of it. Seats so soft that you need life preservers. Eeeee.” On the Anschutz 1907, the blueing is perfect, the walnut is top quality. The “anatomical stock” lines up perfectly on target. I dropped the price of a TX200 for extra-adjustability for the stock. (Truly the Twilight Zone.) David Tubb says that the future of accuracy lies in adjustability of rifles not improvements in barrel and trigger technology. So, I figured if I was going for the best, I may as well make this extra investment. As for the trigger, I am a great fan of the Savage Accu-Trigger which probably can match anyone’s potential. Team Savage can hold sub half minute MOA at 1000 yards with it which is the best that Nancy Tompkins can do. But I must say that the Anschutz trigger has a kind of extra-level of European refinement. I really have no words to describe it. Just a touch sets off a kind of micro velvet thunderbolt.

    The big challenge to my rationalization was why spend this kind of money on a firearm when 95% of my shooting has been and will continue to be airguns. Well, I’ve never been quite able to accept pumping a PCP and scuba tanks are out. But the real reason is that for my indoor range, I really can’t improve on what I have. A Feinwerkbau could hardly surpass the holes that my B30 is knocking in the targets (at my reduced distance). Any difference would not be worth what I would have to pay. Out at the firing range, I need to spend all my time on my firearms. On a more positive note, I purchased a special firing pin to practice drying firing the Anschutz. I seem to recall that most top shooters spend far more time dry-firing than shooting rounds, and I can’t dry fire my springers. This is an important part of training that has been neglected by me and probably most airgunners who are eager to shoot pellets downrange. With my dry-firing device, I’ll have a gun that never misses, has unlimited ammo, and costs nothing to operate. He he. Also, since most of my shooting will still be airguns, whatever I do with the Anschutz will be the result of airgun skills. It will be a way of enlarging my airgunning by testing it on the highest-level platform. So, there should be enough rationalization for someone to make use of.

    I’ve thought long and hard about a proper movie sequence to commemorate this event. I considered Iron Man, the physically insignificant and rather obnoxious person who puts on a high-tech suit and gains new powers. Remains to be seen with the new rifle. Or there was Bob Lee Swagger’s comment to one woman: “Beggin’ your pardon ma’am. Can’t have too many guns.” I may resort to this when my Mom finds out about this purchase and freaks. But what I finally settled on is the final scene of the Richard Harris film, Man in the Wildnerness about trapper Zachary Taylor who struggles back to his expedition in the wilderness after being left for dead. One of my reasons for getting this rifle is that it is essentially the same one I had (slightly upgraded) for my pathetic interlude of competitive rifle shooting in high school. It didn’t seem right that I had an Olympic rifle when I wasn’t ready for it, but I don’t now after all my training. So, as the scene shows, the Richard Harris character walks right through a battle between the trappers and Indians causing them to stop and stare at him. He walks right up to the head trapper who abandoned him and who holds the rifle he confiscated, comes to a halt and just says, “I believe that’s my gun.” :-)

    • BG_Farmer Says:

      Matt,
      That is great news. You did two things I’m proud of: 1) bought a rimfire; 2) bought a really good rifle despite the admirable thriftiness of nature I think we share:). Now your only problem is you won’t have any excuse for poor scores:). You really will need the best ammo, at least some of the time — I was afraid you were going to run Tenex (which seems to be still available) through a single six! Congratulations and a full report will be enjoyed by many of us. Chuck needs to get his BV out also (hint to Chuck).

      Also, I didn’t put things together in time to mention it, but I hope you went to the new location of Bud’s Gun Shop (online, formerly in a modest building in Paris) while you were in Lexington — its supposed to be pretty impressive, with a huge indoor range.

      • Matt61 Says:

        Thanks. Now that I have a rimfire, I can try it out in comparison to your (and Chuck’s) Savage. You’ve got nothing to lose in going up against the iconic Olympic rifle, and I would never be upset in losing to a Savage. :-) I figured that even if I don’t shoot like an Olympian it would be a nice goal to share their shooting experience in a way. But I am paying the price and am just now completing the hemorrhage of money for a spotting scope, scope stand, a whole new set of cleaning equipment, budget optical sights that cost $350! and on.

        By the way, nice shooting with the muzzle loader. In view of our little joust of before, I bask in your reflected glory. :-)

        • BG_Farmer Says:

          Matt,
          If my Savage ever outshoots you and your Anny, I’ll definitely have to kidnap you from your sister-in-law and take you shooting:). Are you going to scope it right away or does it have match sights? I think you are going to love rimfire, and that is the place to spend the big money, since they last forever and are usable in more places. You can still buy a Savage or other low-cost sporter, for about the same price as a case of Tenex:).

          Thanks on the ML’ing — its just for fun, but I was happy to have learned a little in practice. I’ve made some load adjustments since our contest, mainly size of ball which has improved the consistency a lot, but I think the thing that helped the most was my low expectations. I was more nervous about doing something stupid my first time out than how I shot, and it came out OK:). If I can get away from the inlaws (who are in town) this weekend, I’m going to do a woods walk. Also, next shoot I am going to look at the targets — I lost a lot of point shooting at the squirrel’s tail (which appeared to be the head from 25 yards away):).

          I’ve got to try to get to Bud’s myself (last time I went was for the BV). The old one was delightful, in what appeared to be an old truck stop or bowling alley, but the new one is supposed to have a building that matches their inventory (huge).

          • Chuck Says:

            BGF,
            I’ve already been humbled by an Anschutz air rifle and now you want me to go up against a rimfire Anschutz? Oh, my savage woman we’ve got some practicing to do.

            • BG_Farmer Says:

              Chuck,
              I hope the Anschutz will outshoot a $300 Savage, but I wouldn’t hesitate to match them informally. Compared to the 10M AR benchrest game that you have been shooting, shooter technique and wind will have an even larger effect on target with the .22′s. With top-notch shooters and manageable conditions, I would expect the only difference is going to be the size of the one hole in the target, perhaps as little as 0.10″ at 50 yards. Under “normal” circumstances with average-good shooter, that advantage to the Anny is going to be small. The difference really is important to top competitors, but almost entirely psychological to most shooters. I’ve seen great shooters at local c/f br matches lose by several fractions of an inch when they lost focus and “pulled” a shot at 200 yards, groups I would have framed and hung on the wall:). If we’re talking offhand shooting, the advantage is completely psychological as far as I’m concerned. My point (I so rarely have one, I know): shoot what you got until you can outshoot it:).

              Anyway, I’m itching to hear what you think of that BV. I’ve probably come across as over-enthusiastic about mine, but in reality, I’ve been pretty restrained. Get it out and shoot:).

              • Matt61 Says:

                Chuck, take heart. BG_Farmer is right. There is the truism about how only an ideally skilled shooter can tell the difference between very high quality guns. However, what is left out, I think, is that the difference between the very good and the top level is probably small and of diminishing magnitude the higher you go until you reach David Tubb who spends a huge amount of energy for tiny advantages. I suspect that the process could be modeled by a logarithmic graph, one of the slowest growing functions in mathematics.

                Besides, I need to learn how to read the wind which so far has been totally theoretical with me.

          • Chuck Says:

            Matt61/BGF,
            I’ve already been humbled by an Anschutz air rifle and now you want me to go up against a rimfire Anschutz? Oh, my savage woman we’ve got some practicing to do.

          • Matt61 Says:

            A prescient question about the sights. I debated long and hard about the aperture sights. The choice was the match (budget) version for $300+ or the universal version for $400. The match version moved the POA 2mm at 50 yards and the universal 1mm at 50 yards. How committed was I to excellence!? Then, I figured out that the match version corresponded to 1/6 MOA which is more than what David Tubb uses (1/5 MOA), so I figured that was enough for me. 1/12 MOA which is the universal would probably just confuse me.

            I did buy a scope, mostly for my Dad, who cannot use any other sight at a distance. This time I got the Air Force 4-16X50 scope. What a beauty. I love the positive clicking turrets. And I will say again to Leapers that the locking feature on their equivalent scopes, I think, is a bad idea that creates needless hassle and devalues their otherwise good products.

      • Matt61 Says:

        By the way, no luck with Bud’s Gun Shop. My sister-in-law seems to be hardening in her opposition to guns. I spent the visit chasing my nieces with my rc car and sharpening my sister-in-law’s knives.

    • AlanL Says:

      Matt61:

      “I’d say that anyone combing scrap yards for round metal balls that happen to fit the barrels of their BB guns is pretty hard up for amusement.”

      Matt, BB was talking about the prewar era, when bb’s were not available at every corner Wal-Mart and kids shot anything that they could stuff down the muzzle: stones, matches (these would light up when they hit stuff- cool!), dirt (made a nice spray of dust), and of course, lead shot or steel ball bearings of the right size. American Ball Company’s scrap yard was a favorite source of these for boys of that era…

      -AlanL

      • Matt61 Says:

        Yeah, that was another era. But I would find it no end of frustrating to have to scrounge for ammo like that.

    • kevin lentz Says:

      Matt61,

      Congratulations! You are now officially doomed to higher quality guns.

      kevin

      • Matt61 Says:

        We’ll see. If my guns were conscious, I bet they would be like Herbie, the Love Bug, who, when his owner Jim Douglas, bought a new Porsche, tried to drive himself off the Golden Gate Bridge. One reason I bought the Anschutz was as the ultimate gold standard of comparison for the value of my other guns. The first test, naturally, will be the claim that the IZH 61 is as accurate as a $2000 gun. I have my doubts….

    • AlanL Says:

      Matt61,

      I’ve been drooling for a nice rimfire for a while now, but I don’t have a basement. (Dig 3 inches in Miami and you’re in the ocean.) So I’ve been looking at a CZ with the special heavy barrel. Your Anschutz sounds great. Can you invest in soundproofing for your basement and an AlanL-style pellet trap? Then you can save the range fees and the heck with dry-firing– go all out!

      -AlanL

      • Matt61 Says:

        AlanL, I’m in a thin-walled apartment upstairs so no indoor rimfire shooting for me. My airguns come into their own there and that is still where almost all of my shooting will be.

        CZ is a good brand with what is advertised as an authentic Mauser pattern action. It would be a fine piece to own. However, my Anschutz has cut out any more high end guns for me. This was my tribute to German craftsmanship.

    • pete zimmerman Says:

      Congratulations on the Anschuetz! They make wonderful guns. I admit in my restricted world w/o an outdoor range, I’m not into rimfire, but I’m assuming that an Anschuetz rimfire is very nearly as precise as the air rifles that I lust for. I’m inclined to agree that the future of accuracy is in fitting the gun to the shooter’s body ever more precisely. I very much want one of the newer aluminum stocks where cheek piece, butt plate, etc are all adjusted by turning small knobs that can be easily reached by a shooter in his or her shooting position. Much better than the cut-and-try I’ve been going through moving the cheek piece by about 1 mm or so every try, slowly closing in on the right cheek weld but not quite there yet.

      You can probably pick up an FWB single stroke pneumatic rifle (600, 601, 602) for about $600, give or take $100 on the TargetTalk forum, and that will give you something with a similarly beautiful trigger to practice with indoors.

      Enjoy!

      • Matt61 Says:

        Thanks, Pete. I believe that the Anschutz rimfires are more famous than their air rifles. I’m not sure why. You would think the technology would transfer readily. Beware of the most modern stocks. There are comments on the Feinwerkbau air rifles at PA which claim testimony from Feinwerkbau workers that the extra adjustability really accomplishes nothing practical; it’s just to justify a higher price and a cool look. I was quite torn about whether to spend the extra $500 for the extra adjustability of my stock over the club version of the rifle which is what I used in high school. After all, the human body, as I know from martial arts, is a wonderously adaptable creation way beyond any simple mechanism, and I sometimes think that natural point of aim is largely subjective. But I decided to go for it and take a chance on David Tubb.

        There is a Feinwerkbau Olympic rifle that is a SSP which was a strong contender for the Anschutz, but my circumstances ruled it out as I described earlier.

  • ajvenom Says:

    I was going to list a few links to a few good old western tv shows. No they have influence over us.

    They should have a cable channels with just old western shows on it Like:

    Lone Ranger
    Bonanza
    Gun Smoke
    Wagon Train
    Have Gun will Travel
    Jim Bowie
    Bat Masterson
    Cheyanne
    The Renegades
    The Rifleman
    Roy Rogers
    Maverick
    Danial Boone
    Davy Crocket
    wyatt earp
    larado
    rawhide

    and western movies starring:

    John wayne
    Clint Eastwood
    Jimmy Stewart
    Gregory Peck
    Robert Redford
    Yule Brennor
    Steve McQueen
    Charles Bronson
    David Carradine
    Paul Newman
    Gearge Stevenson
    Rober Mitchem
    Robert Duvall
    Marlon Brando
    Henry Fonda
    Charleston Heston

    and don’t forget Lassie.

    and the list goes on and on and on…………………..

    • Desertdweller Says:

      Just received the newest special edition of “Wild West” magazine today. It lists what (in their opinion) are the top 100 western movies.

      What was #1? “High Noon.”

      How did “Quigley Down Under” do? #47. I would have ranked that one much higher.

      One of my all-time favorites that didn’t even make the list? “Son of the Morning Star.” Oh, well.

      Also: shot my Crosman XT today for the first time after cleaning with JB Non-Embedding Bore Paste, following BB’s instruction. Notable improvement in accuracy. Thanks, BB!

      Les

    • Chuck Says:

      Johnny Yuma with Nick Adams

    • SlingingLead Says:

      AJ

      What about Red Ryder for crying out loud!! ;-)

  • Ryan Says:

    Good read! I did not know anything about the history of BB’s, till now. One problem with aluminum is that it is expensive. It might be good in an alloy with other metals for a lead free pellet. Something like the RWS lead free pellets that are not sabot rounds.

    -Ryan

  • Mike Says:

    Good afternoon
    I have a marauder and the pressure gauge seem’s like it has a slow leak. Has anyone here had the same problem and is there an easy fix.

    • Ryan Says:

      Pellgunoil? AFAIK its used for HPA and CO2 guns.

      • Edith Gaylord Says:

        Ryan,

        Pellgunoil should not be used in precharged pneumatic guns. Please see this description on Pyramyd Air’s website regarding the use of Pellgunoil and high-pressure air:

        Do NOT use in precharged pneumatic (PCP) airguns! Pellgunoil is NOT safe for use in guns that use high-pressure air! Using Pellgunoil in a PCP could be explosive and may result in serious injury or death.

        Besides using it on CO2 cartridges, you can also use it on multi-pump pneumatics to lubricate the pump head.

        Edith

        • Ryan Says:

          My bad. :/ Just goes to show you that it might be best to double check some stuff you read on the internet. Heh. I guess something like silicone chamber oil then? Not that I’m an expert. I was really looking for someone else to give him an educated answer.

          -Ryan

  • JC Says:

    Re the limit on lightness of bb’s. I worked out a theory that was a little more complex than that when I was around 12 with my Benjamin multipump 100 shot bb repeater (because I could, in effect, vary the spring force). Try as I might to get accuracy with high speed, I was throwing knuckle balls and there was no repeatability. I finally arrived at minimizing the number of pumps to get something that hit what I aimed at. The lead balls could take more pumps than the bb’s, but neither could take nearly what the gun was capable of. So my theory was that there was a projectile speed that resulted in knuckle balls – heavier bb’s could take more pumps, but once they reached that speed, you couldn’t have any confidence of hitting anything you aimed at!

    • Orin Says:

      JC,

      In that case, we need some plutonium BB’s. Maybe then you can max out your Benji multi-pump without loss of accuracy. :)

      - Orin

    • Matt61 Says:

      I think the theory for bb guns is that except for barrels of exceptional precision like the Daisy 499, the bb’s bounce off the sides of the bore in unpredictable fashion. If that is true, it’s difficult to imagine a specific speed for all bb’s that would result in knuckle ball behavior. But this is just a guess

  • Mr B. Says:

    Mike,

    I’d suggest giving Crosman’s Customer Seervice Center call at 1-800-7AIRGUN (724-7486). Tell them what your problem is and they’ll take care of you.

    Mr B.

  • Mr B. Says:

    Matt61,

    Congradulations on your purchase of the Anschutz 1907. Keep us posted please. Have you priced shooting jackets, gloves, mats, etc yet?
    Mr B.

    • Matt61 Says:

      Thanks, Mr. B. I have priced a ton of equipment to the point of despair, but I’ve held off from the shooting glove and coat. The Anschutz handstop is so nicely contoured that I don’t know that I need a special glove. I’ll use the converted work glove that I have now, and see what happens. I can see that a coat would make a difference but David Tubb goes to such lengths to talk about how it needs to be fitted that I’m not ready to get one. It sounds like anything less than a custom fit means that you’re losing a lot of the benefit, and there is no need to spend money on that. I may, however, spring for the special form-fitting Anschutz shooting underwear which could make a difference. :-)

  • Chuck Says:

    Kevin,
    Your pellet pics are astounding!
    -Chuck

  • cyclealleyriders Says:

    Matt61,

    let me add my congratulations on your purchase of the Anshultz. Use it in good health.

    Fred PRoNJ

  • rikib Says:

    Edith,
    I’ve been trying to follow Tom’s progress and if it is not prying too much I have a question. I have been being treated for problems with my pancreas for over 5 years now, I have to take meds every time I eat even if it is only a snack. Tom seems to be doing so much better now, and I was just wondering if they had actually cured his problem or knew what the cause was. I’d really like to stop taking some of these meds, but have been to several doctors. If this is prying Please Delete.

    rikib

    • Edith Gaylord Says:

      rikib,

      Tom had gallstones stuck in his bile ducts, and they also made their way into his pancreas, where they threw that organ into a wild frenzy of self-destruction. We didn’t know that his sisters also suffered from gallstones. They all lead different lives, have different body types and eat completely different diets. Yet, all of them have gallstone issues. This appears to be something that might be a hereditary tendency.

      Tom takes pancreatic enzymes whenever he eats a certain amount of protein. It’s not a big deal, as many people who have never had pancreatitis will take these enzymes because the pancreas makes fewer enzymes as we age. For some, it’s a big enough drop that they need some help. Enzymes are available over the counter at most health food stores. I’ve already got a supply in preparation for Tom’s homecoming.

      I did a good bit of research and found out that there are several types of pancreatitis, and some types are likely to reoccur. Once Tom has his gallbladder removed, I don’t know if his chances of having another pancreatitis attack are diminished because the original source (gallstones) will have been removed. Time will tell.

      Another regular blog reader once mentioned that he’s had a number of pancreatitis attacks. I recently got an email from an airgunner whom I haven’t heard from in about 10 years, and he said he’s had 5 pancreatitis attacks in the past 2 years…and he’s a young guy. I don’t believe his were caused by gallstones.

      There are a number of reasons people get pancreatitis. Maybe that’s not what you have. Maybe, you just don’t make as many enzymes as needed and have to take those supplements. In my book, that’s not a big issue. I take a handful of vitamins, minerals and herbs every day and have done so for many decades. I change as my needs change, and I change as I age…increasing some, decreasing others. I no longer pay attention to those people who think I’m nuts for taking supplements. I do it because I want to stay healthy. I think it’s quite telling that I’ll be turning 62 this summer and have NEVER filed a medical insurance claim because I’m blessed with remarkably good health. The only time I was in a hospital for a procedure was when I was 4-1/2 years old and had my tonsils out…and that didn’t include an overnight stay.

      Edith

      • rikib Says:

        Edith
        Thank you so much for your reply and honesty. You have been blessed with your good health (Tom has been blessed with you). Before retirement/discharge from the Navy I was secondarily a Security Force & Physical Fitness Trainer. Now a mere 16 years later I’ve been hospitalized a few times, have difficulty doing much of anything. 100% disabled veteran, life turns on you so quick. I pray everyday that Tom returns home to you soon. Keep up the good work on the blog!

        rikib

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