by Tom Gaylord Writing as B.B. Pelletier
The new Pyramyd AIR Poker Game comes with 15 large paper targets and 7 different games.
This report covers:
- The package
- Let’s look at a game
- A game of skill
- Assessment
Okay — I know you readers are all clever guys (and a few gals), and I know many of you are tightwads, just ike me. So, the idea of buying a paper target game would never fly — except for one thing. I read every comment made on this blog, and fully a third of them deal with targets in some way. As airgunners you are obsessed with things to shoot at, [REB]!
The package
When Pyramyd AIR first sent me the Pyramyd AIR Poker Game set of games, I thought they were lame. But then I read the directions to the seven different games in this package and learned otherwise. They aren’t lame as long as you are a good shot. Or, to state that another way, maybe I was lame for thinking these are lame. In this package of 15 paper targets are at least seven good games that can be played with a pellet rifle. Some are games of skill and some are games of luck. You can vary the distance at which you place the targets, so the difficulty is entirely up to you. It can be a relaxing game for your children or a cutthroat game of marksmanship between two determined marksmen. Also included in the set is one deck of cards. It’s a standard deck, so they can be used conventionally for card games, but they are really there to help with the scoring. When shooters hit a card on the target they are given that card to keep track of their progress. There is only one of each card in the deck, so a second hit on the same card counts as a miss in my book.
Let’s look at a game
I won’t go into all the games, but the full set of rules may be seen on the product page linked above. However, let’s look at one game of chance. The targets appears to the shooters as the backs of all 52 cards in the deck.
The shooters see only the backs of the cards like this.
Each card is different — just like in a real deck. The shooters shoot any number of cards — according to the game being played (one each for high card, five each for 5-card stud or 7 each for 5-card draw). Then they turn the target around to see what cards they hit. Those cards determine their poker hand, or high card. Played this way, this is a game of chance. The rules suggest shooting at 10 yards with a scoped rifle, but you can vary that and admit even more chance into the game.
The side the shooters can’t see has the card faces. It’s like being dealt cards face down.
A game of skill
Want a real challenge? Each shooter shoots the spots on a pair of 10s at 50 yards or beyond. I shoot at bullseye targets for my reviews and I get away with a lot. I am interested in how small a group a particular gun can shoot — not in how accurately that gun is sighted. The thinking is, if the gun can put them all into the same place, you can always adjust the sights. What happens, though, when you have to hit something specific? How many shots will it take to touch all the spots on two 10-spot playing cards? Probably ten shots per card for couch snipers and a whole lot more for those who have to do it for real. Alternate shots with a friend and the first one to hit all 20 spots on his cards wins. I’ll bet there will be more than 40 shots fired! Alternate shots with a friend and the first one to hit all 20 spots on his cards wins. I’ll bet there will be more than 40 shots fired!
This target is labeled Pyramyd Poker, but I call it 10-spot for obvious reasons. Try hitting each spot when the card is out at 50 yards.
Good target paper
I wondered how good the paper is, so I tested it with low-velocity pellets from pistols. The first shot came from a Webley Hurricane and was a wadcutter pellet moving about 350 f.p.s. The second shot was a wadcutter fired in a Beeman P1.
A wadcutter impacting at 350 f.p.s. tore the paper but made a clean hole (arrow 1), while a wadcutter going 100 f.p.s. faster just punched a clean hole in the target (arrow 2).
Assessment
For what you pay you get a lot of play value with this target set. Yes it costs $10, and yes, you could print out or draw targets that cost you nothing, but for the person with no time, this is a solution. It’s perfect for family reunions, Cub Scout/Boy Scout meetings/functions and any other time when you just want something done right and done have the time to do it yourself.
I’m the sort that tends to be cheap and try to do-it-myself with things when possible but printing my own targets (which I do) isn’t exactly free. Card stock that makes a decent target isn’t too expensive but it does have a cost and every inkjet printer I’ve ever owned eats up the cartridges fairly quick. Given how much printing, and colour, there is on these targets the price seems fair. I like the idea of the games too. Every now and then I need to give myself a bit of a break from obsessively trying to improve my score on 10M targets. A home made spinner attachment for my (also home made Archer style trap) has been good for relieving stress as have shooting spent .22LR cases. The poker target looks like something I would like to try.
I too tend to lean In the DIY direction. I Created a simple mod to the trigger that reduces the travel and pull of the trigger through the optic perspective. If you search the “Earl Trigger” on Youtube it will come up. This could be a good mod for you. Good day.
Interesting product. Never did get into cards myself. I can see where this would be a good for “sniper” practice if one goes for the individual hearts, diamonds, etc.. In others words, more 10 point bulls per target.
The paper did tear nice. I have found the lower the power, the worse the tear w/bb’s being among the worst. Duct tape has been the standard for me, but testing the 499 (bb’s) indoors forced me to research further. Gorilla tape is working nice so far, better, but not perfect. The goal would be to get 2 bb’s 1/32″~1/16″ apart with no paper tear. I thought electrical type tape may be the ticket, but worse than duct tape. Oh well.
One of the cleanest targets I have ever shot was a lid off a sour cream container with domed pellets at 25yds., with no tape. Too much for bb’s unless very close. Maybe I need to try more lighter plastics?
A 2×4 with 10 toothpicks standing upright? “The wind was coming into my right at 5~10 mph. and I had to give it a 2 toothpick hold off for 8 of 10″…… 😉 Good day to all.
Hey Chris,
I found that the thin cardboard that cereal boxes are made of make a good backing and the white reinforcing grommets show up well on the back (unprinted) side.
I usually print my targets (that 12-up target I sent you) and glue them to the cardboard using a spray adhesive then cut them apart into individual targets.
I have started using those grommets as you suggested – they work great – minimal distraction and excellent for concentrating the focus! I stuck some on the tin cans to give my granddaughter a specific spot on the can to aim at rather than just shooting at the whole can.
Been a bit cold (-6 F) for shooting outside, hope it warms up for the weekend.
Have a great day eh!
Hank
Hank
Hank,
Good to hear from you. Glad the ring binder stickers are working well for you, and,….. the Grand Daughter. 🙂
While at work, I got to thinking,….I may be going about this tape bit backwards. How? Well, it may be better to shoot (through) the tape,…and (not) put it on the back of a target. I will explore this more this weekend. bb’s would be the biggest effort. Slap a 2″x2″ piece of tape on and a ring binder sticker on top and it may give the perfect “punch”. For those measuring groups, a clean “punch” would seem paramount.
-6 degrees,……yea,…..maybe just a “weeee” bit,… too cold. Chris
Hank,
I just noticed you said white. Wally World sells them in florescent colors as well pink, orange, yellow and green. Keep an eye out for them. All four colors in one pack. Chris
Chris,
I have been looking around for the colored grommets and have only been able to find them in white.
…Maybe it’s too cold for color up here in Canada – my whole property is white! 🙂
Hank
You’ve almost invented a new product.
If you really wanted to pursue it I’d probably start with 3M.
Reb,
You may be right. I will try some things this weekend with the materials I currently have on hand. It will be front applications and tested with the 499 at 24′ making 220 fps.
The real drive is to find an exact method for measuring bb groups that will leave 0% doubt as to exactly where the holes are. Something cheap and easy that anyone could do. Not really for the casual plinker, but perfect for anyone testing themselves, their bb gun or 2 friends in friendly competition.
We had the 52 Card Play at the 2015 GTA Fun Shoot. It certainly looked like a hoot and made a good fund raising competition.
I would not do this by myself, but this would be a great way for a few friends to spend an afternoon.
BB,
What a coincidence. I just happen to have looked at this yesterday. Have they sent you the Hatsan Gladius yet? 😉
RR,
No Gladius yet.
B.B.
Hi All,
Santa brought me a new .22 calibre PCP for Christmas and I am researching scopes for it. (I must have been good all year) 🙂
In deciding what features I want I started thinking about the exit-pupil size.
For hunting scope a large exit pupil is desirable for quicker target acquisition and this is typical of lower power scopes with good light gathering capabilities. Most of my scopes have these features.
Now I am looking for a higher power scope for (mostly) long range (50-75 yard) target shooting, pest control and some small game hunting.
I am evaluating objective size (40 or 50 mm), weight, exit-pupil and magnification (3-9 or 4-12, leaning to the 4-12×50 the moment) in that order.
My questions are about the exit-pupil. For target shooting would a smaller exit-pupil be desirable to help minimize parallax because it forces better eye/scope alignment? Would it act like a small aperture versus a large aperture on a peep sight?
Suggestions or comments appreciated as always!
Thanks in advance!
Hank
Hank,
I think you are going about this the wrong way. You are asking how fast a red car can go, when what you want to know is what kind of car do you want and how fast will it go.
The exit pupil is based on several things:
The size of the optical package
The clarity of the lenses
The number of lenses in the package and
The coating on the lenses.
The cheaper the scope components, the smaller the exit pupil. But the higher the magnification, the smaller the exit pupil, too. So very expensive high-powerted scopes will have a smaller exit pupil than expensive lower-powered scopes.
Don’t confuse the size of the exit pupil with the precision of the scope. Some scopes have a large exit pupil but require your eye to be in exactly the right place to see anything. I find this aggravating, although this is precisely what you get with a fine target scope.
I am testing the new UTG 2-16X44 scope on the .25 caliber Marauder. I have used it in very low light (dawn, using the illuminated reticle), and at ranges up to 50 yards. It’s clear, bright, given the magnification, and on the small side. It’s about the size of a good 4-12X, though perhaps 4 ounces heavier.
I would look at that scope before anything else.
B.B.
Hi B.B.
Thanks for the quick reply! I will check out the scope you mentioned. Right now I am looking a the Hawke scopes (have 4 Hawkes that I am happy with) and specifically this one…
/product/hawke-sport-optics-vantage-4-12×50-ao-rifle-scope-ill-mil-dot-etched?a=5048
I am a bit surprised that a scope can have a large exit pupil but require your eye to be in exactly the right place to see anything. I haven’t evaluated that but it always seemed that the larger exit pupils were less fussy about head alignment – but then I haven’t checked out the higher priced scopes or “target” scopes.
Learning a lot from bench shooting!
Hank
Yeah, I guess my order of scope feature precedence looks a bit strange. Weight is a concern.
My reasoning is as follows… I am looking for a scope for a heavy rifle (a HW100S FSB) that while it will be benched a good portion of the time it will also see quite a bit of free-hand shooting and will be carried around for hunting.
So I am looking for a scope with good light gathering capability (for hunting and high magnification target use), that is as light as I can find (‘cuse the rifle is already hefty), has a decent exit pupil (for convenience and comfort) and a good magnification range (low enough for “standies” and high enough for 50 plus yard shooting).
I realize that I am working in two opposite directions and ultimately one set of requirements is going to have to take precedence. Since the rifle is primarily for longer range use I think I am going to have to accept a higher mounted, heavier scope with more magnification than I would normally chose.
Anyway, that is my thinking and I would appreciate any comments or suggestions if my “logic” (term used loosely) needs adjusting.
Thanks,
Hank
Hank,
I think the specs on the HW100S are a little over 8.5 pounds. Mine weighed over 9 pounds unscoped.
Even with a sling and a lightweight scope I doubt if you’re going to be carrying that gun very far afield for hunting very often.
Buy the scope you want/need and don’t worry about a few extra ounces in scope weight. You’re trying to save weight while adding accessories to a tank IMHO.
kevin
Kevin,
Yeah, you are probably right – I am not going to gain enough to make a noticeable difference. Oh well.
I have a HW100S in .177 so I know what you mean about carrying it around which is why I was concerned with the weight – the sling helps though. They are beautiful rifles to look at and to shoot – super smooth with awesome accuracy. Yeah, really solidly built… worth their weight 🙂
I have changed my hunting style to suit the rifle (and my age), now I walk little and sit a lot. I find that the bushy-tails that run at 25 yards will sit up and look at you at 40-50 yards – an easy shot for a HW100.
The new rifle is a .22 calibre HW100S FSB which is ¾ pound lighter that the HW100S model. Decided, will be going with the 50mm glass.
A friend of mine has the same rifle with the “T” stock and has been scoring 9/10 on starlings at 50 to 60 yards and doing as well on pigeons out to 80 yards if the wind is reasonable. Looking forward to warm weather! The local grackles are in for a rough season!
Thanks Kevin, just needed a nudge in the perspective.
Hank
Exit pupil is simply the size of the objective divided by the magnification, unless there is some internal intrusion into the light path. So, BBs 2-16×44 would have a maximum exit pupil of 22mm at 2x and 2.75mm at 16x. The average adult eye with some age can dilate to ~5mm, so at 2x, the exit pupil is going to be excessively large and forgiving, but at 16x it will be fairly comfortable still. The image at 2x will be very bright and at 16 probably decently bright.
You say hunting and target shooting. I would think that would help you determine the range you need. 16x is more than adequate for 50 or even 100 yard groups, and you might even be happy with 12x. 4x is pretty standard for hunting small game. Whatever, decide your range of zoom and then figure out what objective size and exit pupil you want at the maximum magnification. Try to minimize the zoom ratio and don’t assume that bigger is better for objective size. Larger objective is always brighter, true, but image aberrations increase as the larger objective decreases the focal ratio. Parallax error also increases with objective size. The higher the zoom ratio, the more potential for image compromise and increased optical elements causing decreased light transmission. 4-12 or 3-9 is a 3x zoom ratio and that is pretty standard, and 6-24 or 4-16 is 4x and usually OK.
Thanks very much for the explanations BG – that really helps!
Hank
Shooting the spots on a pair of 10s @ 50 yds? Bucking Betty and me would need a month to complete that one.lol!
Pete
Pete,
Me, too! It would be faster for me to just cut the card in two at the base and get rid of all the spots at once.
B.B.
Does it come with a set of darts?
I don’t know about this game BB. I can’t figure out how to cheat yet.
Mr. Gaylord:
This look like a target set that’s definitely going to be added to the crew’s winter shooting activities. Junior shooters like variety. And after an afternoon of nothing but 10 bull 10 meter targets these targets looks like fun. Winter crew meeting numbers can be a little sparse and for $10 a pack, these may be something that will get participation back up.
Thanks for the heads up on these targets.
William Schooley
Rifle & Pistol Coach
Crew 357
Chelsea, MI
Took 3 shots with the Powermaster 66, wound up with a little 1/4″ cloverleaf but I kept feeling air in my face.
Tore a small piece of paper towel to lay over the breech and caught that in the face.
Gotta go back in. :/
B.B.
Just for the heck of it I decided to test a new Crosman 760 (with pellet clip) with BB’s I didn’t expect much and have never shot it with BB’s before. Surprise. All 13 groups of 5 shots each at 5 meters would have hit a dime. I tried 4 different brands with Umarex being the best, with an average of 4 groups under a half-inch. I tried muzzle loading 5 H&N round balls gaged 4.55 with an oil coating and got a 3/8 inch group.
I tried an old 760 and got a 2 inch group, which is about what I expected.
Are the new models that much better or do I have a rare one? I have a Daisy 102-36 that will shoot into a half inch, while none of the dozens of ither Daisy levers i have (except the 499) will approach that so flukes are possible.
Any input will be most appreciated!
Cordially,
Fido3030
.
Fido3030,
A quick update,…I found the lubed bb’s “stopping short” of the magnet on the 499 after about 100 shots. Oil build up? Soon after the cocking stroke started, you could hear the bb “click” down on the magnet due to piston suction. Pulled the barrel, Q-tip, and all is normal. (I will stick to the lubed bb’s). They work, hands down, for sure!
One last thought,….it could be that the 499 with it’s precise barrel and bb’s,….that it would more sensitive to the oil film affecting fit and roll of bb’s down the barrel? I may look into a thinner oil than Pellgun oil. Maybe something more along a thinner silicone type oil. Thanks again, Chris
Chris,
I know it has been about two weeks since I was going to run better numbers on the 499 in Chairgun. I didn’t forget though. I have been curious at what it might do at long range up to 30 yards as suggested by GF1. I finally put in your numbers and got the same results as your actual shots.
Sighted in at 24 feet 8 yards
I used 1 inch for the scope height. velocity 210 fps
It gave -3.5 inches at 41 feet exactly the same as you got at least as best I could read the graph.
It showed -11.68 inches at 20 yards
and -38.43 inches at 30 yards.
I could see shooting at a bell at 20 to 30 yards would be fun. It would need an extension on the rear sight.
I think you might be on the right track with the thinner oil on the bb’s. I might try it in my 1700 daisy co2 pistol. It is more accurate than I would expect for what it is. The oil may make the bb’s hard to feed if they get gummy or too sticky though.
Keep up the reports on your 499. My indoor range is only 15 feet so I am getting a little cabin fever. Need a few clear calm days so I can stretch my legs.
Don
Don,
Thank you for that report. After the initial test, I just placed a dot 3″ above where I wanted to hit, and kept the sights aimed dead on. By removing any inserts in the front, it would allow raising the muzzle and still keep an actual sight picture. The 499 did real well on windage as both test only had it 1/4″ to the right at 41′ with 10 shot groups.
As for the oil, it works. Please post anything you try. 2 drops of Pellgun oil will sit atop the tip of a 12g. CO2 cartridge, so I guess I would be looking for a silicone oil that would not do that, but rather run off. Something that would be easily available and cheap.
Thanks again, Chris
Fido,
I don’t know the answer. I do have a new 760, though it’s 5-6 years old. I might try it.
Thanks,
B.B.
CHRIS USA
I’ve noticed oil build up also. A cleaning pellet or three does a nice job of reducing it.
Fido3030
Fido3030,
I keep forgetting that. Nice for a breech load, but not so much for a muzzle loader. Very , very good idea for the oil method though. Do it every 50-75 or so and you are good to go.
On the side, I would love to hear from the bb “pros” if your method is allowed in competition. Like anything else,…I am sure someone has tried it,…or something close.
Since you have a bbgage, it would be interesting to see what you come up with for the Avanti Precision Ground Shot. If I remember correct, BB’s test’s showed a few surprises. Whenever you get the time…..
Thanks again for all your testing,…..Chris
CHRIS USA
Hi. I tried 20 Avanti with the BB Gage:
4.42 (7), 4.43 (2), 4.44 (10), >4.44 (1)
I also tried 20 Umarex:
4.42 (18), 4.43 (2)
And 20 Hornady Black Diamond:
4.40 (6), 4.41 (1), 4.42 (12), 4.43 (1)
These numbers reflect the ones I happen to have. Another batch of each brand might give different results. Also, other factors such as surface roughness or internal voids might be more important than just size.
Tentatively, I think in shooting unsorted BB’s oil helps brands with a greater variation in size more than brands with little variation, if that makes sense. A lot more testing is needed
Hope this is of interest
Fido3030
Fido3030,
Thank you for the data. Of course this is of interest. It would seem the your test of the Avanti’s showed some surprises as well. From the gage, it would seem that the Umarex’s are worth serious look and worth keeping an eye on. It will be interesting to see your results when you get around to testing your 499. With your bbgage data, both of us playing with the oil(s), and my playing with target material to get the cleanest punch,…we may help advance the bb gun world a little further. Very cool stuff.
Thank you again and be sure to keep us all posted as you discover more things. Chris