How about safety glasses?

by B.B. Pelletier

Today, I’m writing about a subject I’ve wanted to address for years — safety glasses.

This report is based on a test that turned out exactly the opposite from what I predicted. I was so wrong that I want the world to know about it.

Are safety glasses necessary?
I wear bifocals. And modern glasses are often made from plastic lenses, especially my Lenscrafters ones. So, for decades I have assumed that plastic is plastic and that my bifocals were just as good as a cheap pair of safety glasses. After all, as cheap as they are, my lenses cost over $100 and the cheapest safety glasses go for as little as $4.95. I thought my lenses were supposed to be shatterproof. So, they should be just as good or better than cheap safety glasses.

That’s why I constructed a test. I had a set of lenses from my old bifocals — the ones I’d been using as safety glasses for decades when shooting firearms and airguns. I stuck a lens between two duct seal pugs in front of my silent pellet trap and shot it with a Hobby pellet from a Webley Hurricane pistol. The Hurricane shoots Hobbys at about 450 f.p.s., so I felt that was slow enough to start with. If there was no damage, I planned to ramp up to a Beeman P1 that would add about 100 f.p.s. That was the test.

The impact of the pellet will simulate all sorts of horrible things hitting the glasses. I know my test isn’t scientific, but it is revealing.


The lens is held between two pugs of duct seal. Edith’s finger was not there when the shot was taken.


One shot smashed the lens. No protection!

I was going to test the other lens with steel BBs and finish the report. But I didn’t get that far. The first shot turned my “safety” bifocal lens into a million shards of plastic! Blew it apart. We’ll be picking up the pieces for weeks.

Okay, I thought. Can these el cheapo safety glasses be any better? Up went a pair of nondescript safety glasses, and I shot them with the Hurricane. The right temple was blown off the glasses when the pellet smashed against the lens, which did not break. Instead, it slid along the curve of the lens into the temple.


A real pair of safety glasses were next. Same test.


The pellet hit the lens where indicated and flattened out, then followed the curve of the lens to blow off the right temple.

Okay, so the lesson we should all take away from this is: use REAL safety glasses! Don’t assume that your prescription glasses can do the job unless you know for certain they can.

The wife of Pyramyd Air owner Josh Ungier is a noted eye surgeon in Cleveland. I’m quite sure I will catch a little well-deserved chewing out for being so stupid as to think regular plastic eyeglass lenses could substitute for safety glasses. But after seeing what I saw in this test, I thought the best thing to do was to spread the news as fast as I could, because I know there are others who are doing the same thing that I did.

From now on, it’s safety glasses for me. I even have a pair with bifocals in them!

161 thoughts on “How about safety glasses?

  1. Great thing,very well written!iI must admit that i dont use eyes protection though i should ,there were several times when i almost lost an eye becouse of it!I dont think that ricochet can deliver 500 fps so i think that el cheapo would be enought-correct me if i am wrong !


    • C-S
      It does not take 500fps ricochet. When my brother an I were kids (many decades ago) he shot at a squirrel up in a tree. The bb hit a branch and went right back into the corner of his eye. Fortunately he only had to wear an eye patch for about a month. If it had hit directly most likely he would have lost his eye. Back then bb guns were not near as powerful as now. Get some eye protection!

      rikib



  2. But shattered glas in the eyes ouch!You guys whith yours mighty high powered air-canons could make that kind of ricochet so i agrre -dont go with a cheap, glas in eyes is not good thing to have


  3. Excellent blog! To put it simply make sure they meet ANSI standards and that they are wrap around (you don’t know where a ricochet will come from). A decent pair doesn’t cost much compared to your eyesight.

    rikib


    • I heard a story ,read a story in fact in the newspaper -poor guy already had one eye (childhood injury)shoot whith a hunting gun and ricochet from a branch made him completely blind-sad thing but s..t happens,so i am all for safety glasses especially for kids PLEASE PROTECT THEIR EYES PARENTS


  4. Wow, very revealing article, B.B. My dad has always worn his eyeglasses in place of safety glasses under the very same misconception. Thanks for clearing this up.

    I saw this video link posted on the Yellow a couple of days ago. It is so hypnotizing that I couldn’t tear myself away from it. Enthralling footage of bullets hitting varioius targets in uber slow motion, and the results are nothing less than spectacular. There are a few shots of pellets around the 4:30 mark.

    – Orin


  5. I THINK but this dont have to be truth of course -that round bb if you shoot it in the wall at 90 degrees would bounce of like a ball throwed to the wall right back at you more or less !???


    • You are going beyond my old brain here by assuming a perfectly solid (no give) , absolutely vertical wall and a bb that will travel in a precise horizontal plane.

      rikib



    • C-S
      All I am trying to say is that whether a bb or a pellet, a ricochet cannot be planned. You have to plan for the worst, and hope for the best. As the old saying goes. πŸ™‚

      rikib





  6. 5 m and they are not safety glasses they are tin plastic glasses .Pistol is not so strong but neither is ricochet from”lesser”guns by the way glasses are destroyed-made (DESTROYED)by slavia :)!



    • C-S
      Sorry you destroyed your sunglasses, but better than if you were shooting and they did not protect your eyes. If you have access to amazon.com they sell a lot of shooting glasses for good prices, well in US dollars.

      rikib


  7. Rikib that was some old plastic my mother glasses nobody liked them- but alternative for REAL safety glasses MAYBE could be PLASTIC glasses couse they dont shatter!??




  8. B.B.,

    Thanks, that was very convincing and a bit frightening.
    I myself wear glasses and I always use and recommend others to use pellet traps or sandtraps and place targets only on wooden or cardboard frames.
    Steel BBs tend to ricochet easily, so majority of shooting galleries here have a “lead-only” policy, be it 10 or 25 m (50 is way too far for a steel BB).

    duskwight


  9. Hello BB:
    A very informative post about eye protection.
    I have had quite a few Rick’O’Shay’s whiz past my ear over the years.
    In my current abode though,I can’t even afford to have one stray pellet owing to the proximity of my nieghbours gardens.
    I used MDF board as a backdrop only once because the pellet came back almost as quick as it had left the gun πŸ™
    Not good.
    A big expanded foam Archery target block is what I pin paper targets to and it also sits behind my reactive metal target box.Behind all that a big lump of kitchen worktop,soft side up.
    Glasses are still something I should get though.

    Orin:
    That video link is amazing,Poetry in motion.
    Some shots remind me of a joke about flies hitting windscreens.
    What is the last thing to go through a flies mind when it hits a car windscreen?
    Its Butt πŸ™‚

    DaveUK


  10. Good topic Tom.

    I have been hit in the face with all kinds of stuff many times over the years, and most pairs of glasses that I have had have sustained some damage from various impacts. No doubt that even ordinary glasses do a lot to protect your eyes a lot of times. Things do come flying at you when you least expect it.

    It makes good sense that when there is a probability that there will be flying debris that extra protection is a good idea.

    twotalon


  11. Good morning B.B.,

    I am also guilty of that assumption. You have done us all an incredable service with this topic and I’m going to say thank you from all of us.

    Mr B.


  12. I was shooting an M1A and felt a hard blow to the forehead. Checked and found blood. A case had separated halfway around the web sending a jet of gas and micro-fragments of brass back through the bolt. There was a distinct impact line beginning just over my brow but not extending down into my eyes; the line marked where the safety glasses didn’t cover. The gas and the case fragments had very little mass compared to a pellet or bullet, but I think they had enough to have blinded me.



  13. When I got a BB gun around age 10, the very first shot I took was at a wooden fence about 20 feet away. The BB bounced back and hit me right between the eyes. I could see it coming for just an instant before it hit. No damage done, thankfully, and lesson learned.


  14. All,

    Well it’s been a while since I’ve browsed the PCP selctions on the PA website. Took a look around this morning and WOW!

    How about those Evanix offerings? The Monster and Windy City look like some very tasty items, huh?

    Anyone have some time with one?

    KA


  15. Nicely done, BB. I plead Mea Culpa as well and will now put safety glasses over my eyeglasses when shooting. As anyone who still has some doubts, ask yourself, “how much is you eyesight worth?”.

    Have a good weekend, everyone.

    Fred PRoNJ



  16. Think, “How important are your eyes to Me?” I hope as much as hearing is. Ok, that said, let’s discuss my experiences :
    1) Have worn glasses for quite a while, admit I don’t get eyes examined as frequently as I should. I have light sensitive eyes, so I wear those big dark oversized wraparound glasses that makes ya look “goofy”.
    2) Once reading a gun magazine, saw where Massad Ayoob wrote about wearing Safety glasses while riding in a car. Reason : In an automobile accident, you could have spalling glass (detached glass) flying about that you wouldn’t want in your eyes. Logical reason. Which leads to #3 :
    3) Was riding down the road one day, going to parents house, a Dump truck coming the other way. Heard/felt a “dink” on side of those “goofy” wrap-around glasses. Yes, it was a pebble that hit them that would have otherwise hit me right in the eye!!
    4) Mowing grass, weedeating, you can have flying objects hit a solid one and ricochet right back at ya.
    So, again, “How important are My eyes?”


    • Our local talk radio ( coastal Georgia USA ) said this morning that a guy was shot driving his car. The Doc removed a BB from just behind his ear. Granted glasses would not have helped him, but you just never know what may happen.


  17. Yikes!!

    Wonderful article. A real eye opener.

    The only glasses I wear are safety glasses. Have clear lenses and others with varying shades of tint. It’s just automatic to wear them since at our elevations in Colorado the suns intensity can burn your eyes especially when you’re around lakes and snow that reflect and magnify the sun. We’re also on atv’s constantly and the dirt and rock they throw up, especially when you’re behind another rider, makes safety glasses mandatory. I hate to imagine being blind.

    kevin



    • Slinging Lead,

      In Ralphie’s day, eyeglasses did not have plastic lenses. They really were glass, which is why they were so heavy. Compared to today, it was like balancing a bowling ball on the bridge of your nose! When I was a kid, I remember picking up my mother’s eyeglasses. Geez, they were really heavy.

      Edith


    • First i have to cogratulate US for result against Slovenia what s fair it s fair half-half 2-2 πŸ˜‰ Lead i have impression that you areally love Christmas story πŸ˜‰ Thank God that finger was not there -and it should not be there it is dangerous πŸ™‚


  18. I have written this a couple times before but I think is deserves to be written again in the context of this article.

    Let me lay some ground work first.

    My indoor range is 10m (33ft). The target area was a cardboard box for a table holding another smaller cardboard box filled with duct seal bricks. The back drop was carpet over a 3/4″ plywood sheet. Behing that is the wood paneling of the finished basement.

    One of my grandsons was shooting at a 2″ plastic cow (from a play farm set) sitting in the target area. He was using an IZH-61. His last shot at the cow richoched straight back at him and hit him in the forehead making a mnice red mark where it hit. Yes, he had safety glasses on and now has that safety feature ingrained in his memory bank.

    Anpther incident occured when one of the kids was shooting at soda cans. Things went fine until he put up a green bean can. I think he must have struck the hard rim at the top or bottom of the can because the pellet richoched straight back and struck him hard enough in the shoulder to make him wimper for a while.

    It’s hard to believe that these richochets are coming bach 33ft with a lot of force. I have found smashed pellets regularly as far back as 6 feet from the target area. I think these are coming from the metal spinner and squirrel targets. Mt ceiling above the metal targets has shrapnel marks in it and even pellet disks (compressed by hitting the metal target) wedged into the tiles.

    So, I also urge caution and glasses.
    -CJr


    • CJr,

      Once when I was testing a 500+ f.p.s. Anix pistol I had a BB come straight back 33 feet and split my lip. I feel it had to be traveling 350 f.p.s. or faster.

      B.B.


  19. Paul

    Great guest blog yesterday. Very thorough. The cost comparison between the 116 and its modern counterparts was an eye opener, and something I had not considered.

    Orin

    Cool video. I like the part where the bullet hit the thingy.


  20. This reminds me of when a friend ordered a .22 springer from PA almost a decade ago. If I remember right, it was a “Tech Force” rifle.

    Anyway, we were pretty avid paintball players at the time, and we had some “retired” paintball mask lenses lying around that were supposed to be taken out of service because of their age, and the fact that they had sustained multiple direct hits from paintballs.

    So, we decided to set one up and shoot it with his pellet rifle to see what would happen. I don’t remember the specifics of the pellet used, or the gun’s advertised velocity, but I do remember it was very powerful compared to the typical retail store pellet guns at the time.

    Anyway, to our astonishment, the paintball goggles withstood the pellet impact. A second shot cracked the lens and penetrated. It really bolstered our confidence in the paintball goggles.

    The lenses are typically made from polycarbonate plastic “Lexan” is a brand name. Not to be confused with acrylic or “plexiglas” which is way less impact resistant.


    • RoninUT:
      Those paintball guns pack a real punch dont they.
      I have done paintballing a couple of times.
      On the second occasion it had been raining and we were advised,if any paintballs drop on the floor don’t try to load them because they would be damp and swell up.
      This guy shoots at me from about 100 Ft,hits and knocks off the ball hopper on the top of my gun,spilling all my paintballs on the floor.Aaaaargh.
      DaveUK


      • DaveUK,

        They are limited by safety rules to 300 fps. But, .68 caliber ball still packs a wallop at that velocity. With some adjustments they can be made to shoot faster.

        I have been wanting to convert one to shoot pellets. The electronic grip frames have excellent triggers and some interesting firing modes.


  21. Folks,

    The following put a tears in my eyes anf pride in my heart. I for one will be doing what is requested!

    Mr B.

    Very touching story. Let’s not forget the sacrifice of so many in harm’s way.

    Will You give this to my Daddy?

    As a Company, Southwest Airlines is going to support ‘Red Fridays.’

    Last week I was in Atlanta , Georgia attending a conference. While I was in the airport, returning home, I heard several people behind me beginning to clap and cheer. I immediately turned around and witnessed One of the greatest acts of patriotism I have ever seen.

    Moving thru the terminal was a group of soldiers in their camos. As they began heading to their gate, everyone (well almost everyone) was abruptly to their feet with their hands waving and cheering.

    When I saw the soldiers, probably 30-40 of them, being applauded and Cheered for, it hit me. I’m not alone. I’m not the only red-blooded American who still loves this country and supports our troops and their families.

    Of course I immediately stopped and began clapping for these young unsung heroes who are putting their lives on the line everyday for us so we can go to school, work and home without fear or reprisal.

    Just when I thought I could not be more proud of my country or of our Service men and women, a young girl, not more than 6 or 7 years old ran up to one of the male soldiers. He kneeled down and said ‘hi..’

    The little girl then asked him if he would give something to her daddy for her…

    The young soldier, who didn’t look any older than maybe 22 himself, said he would try and what did she want to give to her daddy. Then suddenly the little girl grabbed the neck of this soldier, gave him the biggest hug she could muster and then kissed him on the cheek.

    The mother of the little girl, who said her daughter’s name was Courtney, told the young soldier that her husband was a Marine and had been in Iraq for 11 months now. As the mom was explaining how much her daughter Courtney missed her father, the young soldier began to tear up.

    When this temporarily single mom was done explaining her situation, all of the soldiers huddled together for a brief second.. Then one of the other servicemen pulled out a military-looking walkie-talkie. They started playing with the device and talking back and forth on it.

    After about 10-15 seconds of this, the young soldier walked back over to Courtney, bent down and said this to her, ‘I spoke to your daddy and he told me to give this to you.’ He then hugged this little girl that he had just met and gave her a kiss on the cheek. He finished by saying ‘your daddy told me to tell you that he loves you more than anything and he is coming home very soon.’

    The mom at this point was crying almost uncontrollably and as the young soldier stood to his feet, he saluted Courtney and her mom. I was standing no more than 6 feet away from this entire event.

    As the soldiers began to leave, heading towards their gate, people resumed their applause. As I stood there applauding and looked around, there were very few dry eyes, including my own. That young soldier in one last act of selflessness turned around and blew a kiss to Courtney with a tear rolling down his cheek.

    We need to remember everyday all of our soldiers and their families and thank God for them and their sacrifices. At the end of the day, it’s good to be an American.

    RED FRIDAYS —– Very soon, you will see a great many people wearing red every Friday. The reason? Americans who support our troops used to be called the ‘silent majority’. We are no longer silent, and are voicing our love for God, country and home in record breaking numbers.

    Our idea of showing solidarity and support for our troops with dignity and respect starts this Friday – and continues each and every Friday until the troops all come home, sending a deafening message that.. Every red-blooded American who supports our men and women afar will wear something red.

    By word of mouth, press, TV — let’s make the United States on every Friday a sea of red much like a homecoming football game in the bleachers.

    If every one of us who loves this country will share this with acquaintances, co-workers, friends, and family. It will not be long before the USA is covered in RED.
    The first thing a soldier says when asked ‘What can we do to make things better for you?’ is….We need your support and your prayers.

    Let’s get the word out and lead with class and dignity, by example.

    IF YOU AGREE, PLEASE SEND THIS ON.


    • Mr. B,

      Thanks for sharing that with us and I will pass it on to all I can. I also will have to go shopping, turns out red isn’t a color of clothing that I buy!

      Caveman


    • Mr, B
      This is a touching story, but one that started back in 2005. Was revamped in 2006 in Canada, as red is a color strongly associated with all things Canadian. Then brought up again in 2007 being associated with Southwest Airlines. Go to snopes,com and look up “Red Friday”.

      rikib


      • rikib,

        I didn’t know that this has been around for awhile. That being said, maybe we can give it a bit of publicity and perhaps we’ll be seeing more red on Fridays. What do you think–good idea or bad idea.

        Mr B.


        • Mr B.
          I did not mean to imply it was a bad idea! Was just noting it’s origins. As I have stated on here many times my whole family has served and retired or their spouses have. Even as I write this I’m wearing a t-shirt with a flag on it saying “These Colors Never Fade”. So in answer to your question, YES, it is a good idea.

          rikib


  22. B.B., great article. I wear $150 polycarbonate lenses and have appreciated them when spent pellets have rebounded and hit me in the face in some cases. My Dad, however, uses his sunglasses when shooting firearms. He is very attached to them, so I wonder if anyone knows of goggles that fit over regular glasses? I’ve seen them around.

    Matt61


  23. As a photographer I’m probably a little more safety consciencious than most…I only know of one blind ‘photographic artist’.
    That being said I don’t even trust the cheapo Daisy safety glasses that came with the boys Red Ryders. Though they cost as much as a cheap pellet rifle myself and the boys each have a pair of milspec Revision Sawfly glasses.
    Even if a b.b. or pellet is ‘only’ moving 350fps second on its way back…I’m quite sure that is enough to blind you if it hits your eye.


  24. Great article. This demonstrates that there isn’t a substitute for proper safety equipment.
    I do have an unrelated question though. I am considering purchasing a Gamo P23, but I can’t get a straight answer as to what ammo is uses! One website says to use only lead balls and not steel BBs, another says only steel BBs feed right. The ammo link on the P23 page does not show any lead balls, yet in the reviews there are a couple that say to use only lead balls. The Gamo website says BBs, but doesn’t state whether steel or lead should be used (In this case I assume they mean steel BBs, though I have heard lead balls being called lead BBs) And in the review article on the gun, B.B. says steel BBs, but no mention was made to lead BBs, so I’m wondering if the discrepancy was apparent at the time. I’m sure I’m not the first person to ask this, but does anybody know what to use?

    Thanks for your help.


  25. BB/Edith,

    I’ve seen PA updates Mendoza RM-200 .177 with Max Velocity to 850 fps (used to be 700 fps). Is this the new spec for RM-200 .177? Note that the description below that still says 700 fps. Thanks.


  26. Everyone,

    Josh Ungier, owner of Pyramyd Air, has asked the blog readers to come up with any optical safety questions that we can present to his wife, Dr. Mirfee Ungier, noted eye surgeon, since she knows a lot more about this topic than we do. I would prefer that you send the questions to my email address, but I realize that some of you would rather not contact me personally. Send them to [email protected] or just post your question on the blog, where I can pick them up and add them to my list. Don’t do both! Please πŸ™‚

    The questions and answers will appear in a blog post.

    Since some people don’t read the comments, we’ll repost the invitation for questions in Monday’s blog.

    Thanks,
    Edith


    • Edith, good news about PA looking for the new product.

      Not sure if this qualifies as a question for Dr. Ungier. However, if polycarbonate lenses take an impact, does that mean they are done and you have to get new ones? I believe that’s what they tell us about bike helmets.

      Matt61


    • What are the long term effects on a person’s vision from frequent use of rifle scopes?

      What adverse effects can class III laser sights have on a person’s vision, and how much (or how little) exposure does it take for damage to occur?


  27. Edith,
    I’m not sure about polycarbonate lenses — that is what I always get. My understanding, and the only reason I, of all people, spend the extra money over regular plastic, is that they are supposed to be shatter-resistant. I asked about it (again) last time I had to buy a pair, but my question was mainly related to blackpowder (primer and powder blowback) and c/f issues (gas in case of a blowout); I guess I didn’t think about BB’s and pellets being any worse, and rimfires seem comparatively safe as well. With the muzzleloaders in particular, ricochet is way down my list of worries :). Can you ask Dr. Ungier if polycarbonate is OK for the applications we are talking about (pellets and BB’s)?

    PS. — I once had glasses made from actual glass — heavy as lead, but the image is very clear and they do not scratch.


    • BG_Farmer
      One thing I would be concerned with is wrap around design. Never know what angle something will come from. I wear shatterproof glasses as well, but also wrap around safety glasses. Sometimes weedeating can be worse than shooting I think.

      rikib


      • Rikib,
        I understand your point about wrap-around, but I prefer to have something convenient all the time rather than an additional, bulky accessory item. Its the same with hearing protection — can’t stand the headphone type, but carry a little round case with push-ins all the time and wear them a lot more as a result.


        • BG_Farmer
          Sorry, but I cannot accept that. It’s only my opinion though. I wear safety glasses over my Rx. I don’t find them that bothersome. I keep them near my pistol along with ear plugs, just part of a routine. It’s like putting on a seatbelt in a car, after awhile it becomes natural. It’s a minor inconvenience for one’s eyesight.

          rikib


  28. I mentioned this early in the morning some may not have seen it. Amazon.com sells several shooting glasses that meet ANSI standards in various styles and tints.
    Edith, I don’t think I’m violating any policies by stating products can be obtained through amazon. Let me know if I’m wrong, but I originally found out about PA when I ordered through amazon and product was delivered from PA.

    rikib


    • rikib,

      Pyramyd Air doesn’t carry the glasses you mentioned earlier. I’m grateful that you provided the comment. Obviously, there are a lot of us who want safety glasses that we can wear over eyeglasses. There are also mil-spec glasses that exceed the ANSI standards. I believe these are the same ones that meet ballistic specs that protect our armed forced from shrapnel & IEDs. In fact, I once saw a soldier who had a pair of totally mangled glasses that saved his eyes from some sort of explosion. I don’t know which brand of safety glasses he had on, but they weren’t one of the brands I’d heard about. I just now tried to find it again with a Google search but was unsuccessful.

      Edith


      • Edith,
        Could this maybe more along the line of what you are looking for. The site is esseyepro.com

        It’s from ESS, so of course the Crossbow is compliant with U.S. Federal OSHA, ANSI Z87.1, CE EN 166 and U.S. MIL-PRF-31013. Form, Fit, Function..

        rikib



  29. Edith, the Revision Sawfly’s that I have may be the kind you’ve seen that are worn by the armed forces. The Sawfly’s will withstand a .22 12gr shaped projectile fired from 5′ at 800fps.


  30. B.B.,

    Excellent article. I wondered about this very thing. Haven’t shot BB’s in many years. I only shoot pellets at a minimum distance of around 23 feet, and use a Gamo pellet trap, which works fine. I have considered building a trap for BB’s.

    What material are you using for your BB trap? Is this something I can get at a hardware store?

    Regards,
    Victor



      • Just a tip if you’re looking for duct seal. Duct seal, I thought, should be on the duct aisle of course, so off to the air conditioning supply aisle. No luck. It’s some sort of plumbing compound said the helpful employee. So off to the plumbing aisle. No luck. I thought they didn’t carry it at first, but they had a sku number on their website that said they did, so I showed it to their stock person. We finally found it in the electrical conduit aisle at my local store. $2 for 1lb. still not cheap but much cheaper than when they call it impact putty.


  31. To add a comment about safety glasses: They are the only kind I have worn for years. Mine are bifocal and have Photogrey darkening feature. They are required for my job anyway, so I can deduct them as a business expense.

    They saved my eyes once. A short-circuit in a 600 volt electrical cabinet sprayed me with droplets of molten copper. One landed squarely on the center of my left lens. It was hot enough that it would have burned right through my eyelid even if I had enough time to close my eyes. That one time was more than enough to justify the expense for the rest of my life.

    I learned the lesson about bb bounce-back early. When I was a kid with a brand-new Daisy, I was looking for things to shoot at. My father had taken an old tractor tire and used it as a sandbox for me to play in. When I took a shot at it, the bb bounced off and struck the side window of my father’s car. It left a little half-moon spot in the safety glass (it was a 1951 Chevy. Back then, cars had double-layer safety glass in all windows, not just the windshield like today). He never replaced it, just left it as a reminder to me to be more careful.

    Les


  32. Awhile back we discussed max distance of a pellet. With some of the responses to this article maybe an article on max distance of ricochets needs to be done πŸ˜‰ “Safety” glasses are called that for a reason. make sure they meet standards you are comfortable with (easily found on the net). DON’T pick up a pair at the dollar store!

    rikib


  33. I have a question about PCP air reservoirs. Do you see any condensation inside the reservoirs after a while? I’m concerned that hand pumping will eventually cause water to collect inside the reservoir and make it corrode and become unsafe.

    Do any of you regularly open the reservoir and clean it out? What lubricants are suitable for this purpose? I have a tube of Dow Corning 33 silicone grease that is the recommended lubricant for high end electro-pneumatic paintball markers. It is supposed to be safe for the O rings and retain lubricity at low temperatures (which occur when gasses expand).


  34. Just thought Id let you know PyramydAir did an excellent job calming my frustration. I am as happy as ever, albeit still bipolar. But at least I get to enjoy spending almost all of my money here. πŸ™‚

    -Ryan



      • That was stupid of me. Looking through old post and noticed that should have been “hear”, not “here”. Sorry, guess we all make mistakes sometimes! πŸ˜‰

        rikib


        • Rikib you dont know how much easier to me is when i see that you guys make written mistakes too πŸ˜‰ and my native language is serbian so imagine how much thinking is involved to write a single word…



            • Ryan take my advice and do what i have done go to german blog and pretend that you know the language ,) ,sure you will make mistake here and there πŸ™‚ Now i know that i am like that policeman in “ALLO,ALLO”-(Dave knows who) but at least mistakes are funny and we learn from them and if we make somebody laugh that s a plus too πŸ˜‰


  35. There has been a lot made on TV about using cell phones while driving, pledges being signed not to do so!
    Why don’t we start our own little campaign pledging “Not to shoot without Safety Glasses.”
    I’m in of course πŸ™‚

    rikib


  36. Victor,

    I’d suggest duct seal in 2 pound bricks. One layer will be enough shooting just BB’s.Just make the trap big enough so as not to miss it. I use a old wooden drawer, that I picked up off the street, and just layer the duct seal blocks. Hmmm after further thinking not a good way to stop the BB’s for the long hall cause there will eventually be enough BB’s stuck it the duct seal to makes its surface hard enough to possibly cause one to come wizzing back at you.

    I think someone here said that he was using a foam block made to stop arrows. Then there is that old standby, stacks of the yellow pages inside a cardboard box.

    Mr B.


    • Ah he yellow pages as a backstop – DON’T Do It. shot my FWB 601 about 22 years ago using it as a backstop. First wad cutter out of the barrel came wizzing back past my ear just about as fast as it came out the barrel. Hey physics works.


      • I use an old metal pellet trap I got somewhere, maybe Beeman, decades ago. It has a spring-loaded hinged heavy metal plate that is pushed backwards by the impact of a pellet. This substantially eliminates ricochets. But to quiet the trap I covered the plate with duct seal. When I’ve shot too many pellets into the same area (behind the 8-10 rings I hope), the lead builds up and I get ricochets from that surface. Actually ricochets are lower w/o the duct seal than with it, because build up of gunk near the hinge tends to make the plate fixed rather than hinged!

        Even so, I’ve never seen a ricochet farther back than about 2 meters from the trap. I’m still buying safety glasses this weekend if I can find any. If I hit the target, I’m safe. But even the best shooter can have a misfire or an accident, and sometimes guests try their hands; the confident ones insist on the full 10 meter distance, and frequently miss entirely, and even my ‘engineered’ backstop of two layers of 7/8″ dry wall over a concrete foundation wall allows a ricochet.

        Safety glasses aren’t for when shots go the way you expect and intend.


        • Don’t drop your guard on my account, but, from my experience, I have not witnessed nor found any evidence of more than half a dozen ricochets over the past year that could have resulted from lead pellet build up in duct seal, and I have a lot of lead pellet build up in my traps. What I have witnessed mostly is the pellets fusing together.

          99% of the deformity I have noticed on ricochets is disk shaped from hitting a metal target. I can even hear these pinging off the walls or furniture or whatever occasionally. I have not found any household damage to anything yet except for the tick marks and “ninja disks” embedded in my ceiling tiles (which are soft) above the metal targets.

          I have found, over the course of about 3 months, maybe 5 pellets that have only slightly deformed heads about 3-6 feet from the duct seal targets. I suspect these are from the low powered rifles hitting the carpet coated back stop, however, I have not ruled out lead on lead ricochets completely. I have not found any pellets more than 6 feet from the targets and very rarely more than 3 feet.

          The only exceptions to the above are the two incidents I reported earlier about my grandkids ricochets.

          All this being said, like deer and motorcycles, and hikers and cougars, it’s not the one you see that gets you, it’s the one you don’t see. Even one unexplained pellet laying on the floor is enough to justify wearing safety glasses.

          -CJr



          • Concur. I’ve seen few pellets ricocheting significantly from the fused pellet lumps in the duct seal. Shooting rifle, I put a used pistol target behind the rifle target — the pistol target covers the entire opening in the trap — and that really limits low velocity ricochets. But it is usually the pellets that miss the trap that bounce. Once the phone rang just as I was squeezing off a shot. The pellet hit the rim of the trap (still dented!) and went off into the blue, ‘clicking’ as it hit something and then something else. Never found it.


  37. Well as I close for the night seems as though a lot of good safety info has been passed around today, but that is something we are here for right. Sleep well, my friends! πŸ™‚

    rikib


  38. Kind of like scopes being rated for magnums and just regular scopes.
    Some will shatter under the stress that a springer gives.

    Different comparison but kind of the thought where some people will think that a decent scope “should” hold up to a springer.

    Good post though!. Good to know.
    I’ve always wanted to test out the pair of Crosman glasses I have.
    I should pick up another one and give it a test.


  39. You can tell a lot about a guy’s shooting habits when you study their backstop.
    BBs,pellets and a…..paper clip?
    Have you been shooting your blackpowder ‘Blunderbus’ again BB? πŸ™‚
    DaveUK


    • DaveUK,

      I can’t get to the range in my current condition, so no, I haven’t shot the black powder gun again. I am going to start driving today, so maybe in the next month I will be able to get out to the range. I hope so.

      B.B.




    • Automatic…..
      Turns back on every time you cock. Must be turned off to shoot.

      Manual…..
      Never turns off or on by itself. Must be done manually. It stays where you set it until you change it yourself.

      twotalon



    • Chuck

      How long have you had the Recon? It isn’t pink is it? πŸ˜‰

      I must admit I am not a fan of Gamo in general, but was intrigued by your results. Further investigation revealed a rifle that is easy to cock, quiet, and with nicely proportioned plinking/target shooting velocities. Mmmm, perhaps a guest blog is in order.

      Between the 61s, the Bronco, and the Recon it seems you have the easy breezy low powered springers covered. Don’t you have a 953 as well? Mr. T and Mrs. M must be very frustrated at their cramped quarters.


      • SL,
        I have had the Recon for several months. I bought it black before the pinks were available. Um..still would have bought the black, though. My grandkids are all boys.

        It is easy to cock, and has a distinct, relatively quiet twang. Loves the JSB Exact 8.4gr as you can see.

        I consider the springer triplets as children of Mr T and Ms M. I do have a 953 but it was from Mr T’s previous relationship with a 1077.

        The less powerful air rifles are for the grand kids whereas only grandpa gets Mr T and Ms M and anything that uses powder.
        -CJr



  40. Regarding pellet traps, I emailed my brother a picture of the .22lr Champion trap from the PA site and he built me one at his work which is 14″W x 8.5″H and made out of I can’t remember what gauge steel.

    One day I decided to test the structural integrity of the trap by firing into it with the Walther P22. After several magazines, not so much as a scratch to the back of the trap. Encouraged by this and trusting my brother’s craftsmanship, I did the unthinkable and fired several shots from the 9mm Glock into it. I inspected the trap and…. several teeny tiny dents! Craftsmanship my butt. I need to call up my brother and give him a piece of my mind.

    In all seriousness it was a stupid thing to do. I don’t know what I would have told Mrs. Slinging Lead if the bullet had penetrated the trap and the spare bedroom wall. In my defense, I was wearing safety glasses and hearing protection and made sure BOTH cats were outside.

    Next up, .45 ACP πŸ˜‰



    • Ryan

      I just bought one myself just a few weeks ago due to BG_Farmer’s meddling. It is actually my first BB gun, I LOVE it! The wood stock/forearm is finished very nicely for a $30 gun. I shoot at 10 yards or so, and can always hit my beer, oops soda can at that distance. Plus it is a Daisy collectors edition and we all know how rare those are. πŸ™

      Added bonus… copper plated BBs! So pretty.


      • I bought one of too, this past winter. Shined it up and left it in the box. I figure maybe in 500-600 years it may show its true collector’s value. I have another Red Ryder at home to shoot. They are fun.

        Been thinking of maybe enshrining it like that FWB124 of Tom’s.

        Les



    • The Izzy’s bore is a little on the tight side. I’m using an H&N Match (pistol, light) pellet as sold by Champion’s Choice with a 4.49mm head size on my gun. Amazing how much easier it is to load, and how much more accurate shaving off that 0.01mm in diameter.


  41. Backstops, yes I’m a tight wad. I posted this a few months back. What I use is an old cabinet made of 3/4″ plywood (open front), I was going to take to the dump. I also had an old sofa that I was disposing of. I strapped the cabinet to a tree and electric stapled the 3-1/2″ sofa cushions to the back by the edges. I went to a carpet store, got some remnants for free tacked them to the sides. Now I have a nearly 3-1/2’w x 6’h x 18″d backstop for little or nothing (things I was going to throw out). I did buy some shingles (open package, so cheap) to cover the top. I just pin (attach targets to cushions) varying heights as I like. Enough said, πŸ™‚

    rikib


  42. Hi everyone!
    This post was great BB! I always thought that every day glasses were enough.I guess not!

    I have a question. My grandma has a co2 pistol, which my mom used as a kid. it’s a Crosman 38c. it is new in box, with speed loader, manual, and original co2 powerlet box. Is it in the blue book of airgun values? and if so, what is it worth? any thing appreciated!


    • chosenclay,

      The crosman 38c combat is a classic. Since you have the original box I’ve seen the blue examples for sale at guns shows for $110.00 -$130.00 with the box and original paperwork. I’ve never seen the chrome finish models but the bluebook says to add 200%-400% to the value.


  43. Well for something that started out as a lively blog it has sure slowed down. I guess everyones had they’re say and that’s a good thing!

    also let me say HAPPY FATHER’S DAY to all you dads out there!

    rikib



  44. Rikib-well i don t areally know what father s day is ,8 march i know but? -it is easy to be a parent in America you just keeping to getting presents and presents… πŸ˜‰


    • C-S
      I’m hoping to hear from my two children for the American Father’s Day. Don’t hear too much from them. Their mother and I divorced back in 1993, and it was not pleasant. In the last few years it has gotten a lot better, but they are grown now and have their own lives. What happened was a long story that I could not begin to post on here.

      rikib


  45. C-S
    Well in my case you don’t get presents and presents, you get bills and bills πŸ™‚ But I do love them. Maybe I am misunderstanding your english but it is not easy to be a “parent” in America. Most anyone can have a baby but that does not make a “parent”. Sorry if I am misinterpreting your english, don’t mean too.

    rikib


    • Yes you are, i did not wanted to say that it is easier to make a baby in America πŸ˜‰ just a joke you know .I understand you -i am not a parent still, but i hope some day i will be πŸ™‚ and i wlll be dad in real sense of the word


    • I have just read older posts and Rikib you said “the one you don t see(hear) that one will get you” and you are abolutely right -during the war in Croatia when you hear the granade chances were that one not gonna hit you,but if you dont hear one…people dies πŸ™


      • C-S,
        You can always defend against what you see or hear, it is what you don’t see or hear. It is a sad thing that we have to live in a world that is becoming more and more offensive an intolerant.

        rikib



    • C-S,
      Thank you! And for your future I wish you many Happy Father’s Day’s (or happy days of being a father)! You will laugh a lot, cry a lot, but you sound like a real man! πŸ™‚

      rikib


      • Rikib boys dont cry…a lot just enought to make our eyes wet πŸ˜‰ My cat just found a boyfriend BUT she is not interested and poor fella cry ALL NIGHT LONG nobody can sleep but that s love πŸ˜‰


        • C-S
          Got to get you cat taken care of before you have a bunch of little ones. It may seem expensive at first but in the long run it is better. We have 11 cats and 4 dogs, all have been spayed/neutered (don’t know what they call it there). They get along better because no one goes into breeding season. We don’t have to listen to any howling or crying either.

          rikib


          • Rikib my parents were divorced and after my father died πŸ™ (i was about 18 yrs old)i had to take over my father s house.That beautiful kalico cat was always around and she was wild.After some time she become more tamed i guess she felt that i dont want to harm she and we become friends.I dont know history of that cat but she never had kitten s and for that i am sad couse she is beautiful…


            • C-S,
              Sorry πŸ™ , to hear about your dad. It must have been a very sad time. When I was 21 I lost my brother (he was 23) in a boating accident. I’ve never really gotten over it. We were close in age and friends as well as brothers. He was the oldest of us all and suddenly it was dropped on me, had a younger brother and two younger sisters. Anyway…

              One of my cats, a Norwegian Forest Cat follows me around more than the dogs, needs to sleep with me and have treats as soon as I move in the morning.

              rikib


              • Rikib my father was doctor same as my mother but he had more than ten brain infarct and at his 57 his time has come ,he suffered much in his life but he saved much lifes and i know he was a good doctor!I only can imagine your loss, your brother was young -younger than me…


          • Rikib we say KASTRIRAN for neutered and 5 yrs that i have my cat i suspect(almost sure) that she IS neutered,should i see a scar or something you know with your animals !???


            • C-S
              I talked with my wife a bit as she knows more about these things. She said you may not see a scar at that age, it would be best to take her to a veterinarian to be sure. She also may have had litters that you did not know about if she is not kept inside (house cat). Another thing, male cats howling (crying) outside may be trying to establish their territory because they can smell her and don’t want other males around. Hope something here helps. πŸ™‚

              rikib


            • C.S.,
              Just to keep things accurate, male cats are neutered and female cats are spayed.

              Look for a surgical incision running from where you think the cats belly button is and towards her tail. If you see one and it is obvious then she’s been spayed. If you don’t see one or you’re not really sure if it’s a surgical incision then you’ll need a veterinarian’s opinion.
              -CJr


  46. I was at walmart and noticed they are selling a version of their 22 cal nitro piston without the full length shroud for $109 and the same price for the quest that still uses the metal spring. My question is will croman release a version of the quest in 177 with the nitro spring at the same price?


    • Mlee20,

      Crosman is out of the gas spring business. The Nitro Piston is no longer made. It has turned into the Benjamin Trail series. Wal-Mart must be selling off unsold stock. The price is great. Get the .22, which is quite a bit smoother than the .177.

      B.B.


      • B.B.,

        The Benjamin brand will carry the Nitro Piston guns rather than the Crosman-branded guns. I’m saying this to allay any concerns that Crosman has ditched gas springs, because they haven’t.

        Edith


        • Thanks for your input. I noticed a few months after Crosman released their nitro spring rifle under their name, it was discontinued in favor of the Benjamin line. That is why I was surprised to see a version of the nitro pistol rifles under the Crosman name being sold at Walmart. It doesn’t appear they are selling old stock of Crosman as they stopped selling Gamo at my local Walmart. A deal that good though, I can’t pass it up.


  47. Scope Destruction!

    Just passing along some info on my Bushnell scope. Has been on my HW97K for about 5 years and finally broke. The windage turret/adjuster actually blew-out from the housing, not completely off the scope but, hanging out at about 30 degrees off center-line of the housing. I guess 5 years is not bad for a “non-spring-gun” scope? Maybe 5000 rounds thru her during that period.

    Any comments on scope brands and scope life on springers? BTW, I don’t consider my HW97 to be “magnum” class and… it has a fairly well mannered recoil with no twang or “zing” from the spring. It does torque a little like mot springers.


    • Scope destruction!!

      I have a couple springers that have destroyed scopes. My Crosman XT apparently broke its Centerpoint scope. The scope apparently lost its ability to adjust its windage. You could turn the adjustment in or out, nothing would happen. Replaced it with a Tasco 40mm.

      My Beeman RS2 destroyed its scope in a most unusual way. The reticules began rotating within the scope tube until they were 45 degrees off vertical/horizontal.
      Replaced that with a Tasco 50mm with Leupold rings for the needed clearance.

      I don’t know if the old scopes could be fixed or not, have no idea how. So I gave them away to a co-worker. “Use ’em if you can fix ’em”. I told him.

      The Tascos are supposed to be shock resistant. So far, they have stood up well.

      Maybe if the old scopes could be “zeroed” they could have been saved. Maybe someone will tell how to do that.

      Les



  48. Nice article. And to be honest, I never wear them (with airrifles nor firearms). Except when shooting muzzleloaders.
    Actually, the only time here in Europe where you absolutely have to wear them, is at muzzleloader-shooting. And even there you see most people simply wearing their prescription glasses or shooting-glasses.

    I guess that’s what socialised medicine does to safety-rules.
    (not to mention very strict regulations on traps and barriers)


  49. I wear prescription glasses and use over-glasses eye protection all the time. These also give you side protection as well. They are a must. Once you get used to them, you won’t want to shoot without them. Do Not Risk Your Eyesight!

    Mike


  50. Basically when all is said and done it comes down to: Do you want to GAMBLE with your eyesight! It’s really up to each of us individually. Case closed.

    rikib




  51. I have no problem using my day-to-day glasses as safety glasses. Of course, I did spec them with ANSI Z87.1-rated lenses and frames. Now if I could just find the side shields . . . .

    I do have to add that my Champion pellet trap does spit pieces of lead back uprange, so even if I don’t miss I still wear my safety glasses just because.

    –WFH


    • W. Falcon Hunter,
      I bought a pair of polarized sun glasses at a fishing section in a sporting goods store. The glasses came with detachable side shields that clipped onto the ear piece. I never used them, didn’t see the need while fishing, but now I see they would be useful for something such as on your glasses. They might fit if your ear pieces aren’t too wide. You might try looking around Gander Mtn or some such place.
      -CJr


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