by Tom Gaylord
Writing as B.B. Pelletier
The HW 30S I am testing seems to be a new version.
This report covers:
- Lots of questions
- Air Arms Falcon dome
- RWS Superdomes
- Crosman Premier Lights
- Cocking effort
- Trigger pull
- Safety
- Rifle can be uncocked
- Summary
Lots of questions
There certainly was a lot of chatter about the HW 30S breakbarrel from Weihrauch. Several of you asked why Pyramyd AIR doesn’t carry it and is it the same as the Beeman R7? Well, it is very close to the R7, though I don’t know if the R7’s stock will be modified in the same way that the 30S stock has been. A lot of readers said they liked the new shape. I do, too. The checkering/stippling has also changed and I have no idea if the R7 will have the same pattern, but I doubt it. The R7 is a Beeman-branded air rifle and should not carry the Weihrauch name prominently, as this stock does.
I did ask Pyramyd AIR whether they carry the 30S and they said they decided not to, because the R7 is so similar. Oddly the Beeman R7 is also available in .20 caliber but not in .22, while the 30S is available in .22 caliber but not in .20. I think the .20 caliber is a nod to Dr. Beeman, who prefers that caliber best of all 4 smallbore calibers, but it’s also a marketing mistake because there aren’t that many different good pellets available in .20 caliber. I think a .22 would sell much better.
It’s clear from several comments that the 30S has changed over the years. Some owners have one with a globe front sight that doesn’t accept inserts like this one. Some have a breech that isn’t notched like the test rifle. But the ball-bearing barrel detent seems to date back at least 30 years or more. However, reader Fish showed us that there was a 30S that had a chisel detent in the distant past.
Now let’s look at the performance.
Air Arms Falcon dome
The first string of 10 Falcon domes averaged 601 f.p.s. The low was 589 and the high was 609, so a difference of 20 f.p.s. I believe a lube tune that I intend doing will tighten that up a bit. At the average velocity the Falcon develops 5.88 foot-pounds at the muzzle.
RWS Superdomes
Next up were RWS Superdomes. At 8.3-grains I expected them to be slower, and they were, but not by much. Ten averaged 591 f.p.s. from the 30S, with a low of 572 and a high of 614 f.p.,s. That’s a difference of 42 f.p.s. That’s quite a lot, and I expect it to drop over time and perhaps with lubrication.
At the average velocity the Superdome develops 6.44 foot-pounds at the muzzle. So they are a little slower than the Falcons but a little more powerful.
Crosman Premier Lights
The last pellet I tested was the 7.9-grain Crosman Premier. Ten of them averaged 593 f.p.s. but the spread was very large, at 47 f.p.s. The low was 569 and the high was 616 f.p.s. At the average velocity the Premier Light generates 6.17 foot-pounds at the muzzle.
Cocking effort
The rifle took 22 pounds of effort through the entire cocking stroke, with a bump up to 25 pounds at the very end. The end of the stroke is where the rear of the piston cocks the trigger, so I may be able to decrease that a little with lubrication. I have no plan to disassemble the Rekord trigger like some shooters have reported, so I’ll either correct it with lubrication or it will remain.
I also have to comment that, while the ball bearing detent does keep the breech sealed well, it also offers little resistance when you cock the rifle. There is no need to slap the muzzle to break the barrel open.
Trigger pull
I tested the trigger as it came from the factory. It is two-stage with stage one taking 12 ozs. It has a positive stop at stage two. Stage two then breaks at 1 lb. 15 oz., so even from the factory this trigger is nice and light.
I mentioned in the Part One report that stage two of the trigger in the test rifle had a little creep and that I planned to lubricate and adjust it for you in a special report. Well, after velocity testing today all the creep has disappeared. I could use this trigger exactly as it is today, but I will still do a special report on the trigger to show lubrication and adjustments.
Safety
The Rekord trigger has a button safety that pops out on the left side of the rifle when the trigger is cocked. You have to push the button in before the rifle will fire, and there is a definite click when it releases. On some rifles the tolerances are a little off and the rifle can be cocked without setting the safety. Some shooters learn to do this and others disable the safety altogether. Back in the real old days (1950s and ’60s) there was no safety at all. No HW 55 I have owned has had a safety and I have seen several older R7s without one.
But taking the safety off after cocking soon becomes second nature to anyone with a Rekord trigger. My advice is to leave it functioning and learn to work with it.
The safety is off.
The rifle is cocked and the safety is on.
Rifle can be uncocked
Because the safety can be taken off at any time, the HW 30S can be uncocked. Hold the end of the barrel against the mainspring and take off the safety, then pull the trigger and allow the barrel to close slowly. To reset the safety you break the barrel down all the way — even when the rifle is cocked. The piston rod has to push a part in the trigger down just a wee bit more for the safety to reset.
Summary
Reader Fish asked me if the 30S had replaced the Diana 27S as my favorite air rifle. I told him no, but it might be just as nice.
My plan is to complete a regular set of testing with this rifle, which includes one accuracy test at 10 meters with the open sights. Then I will address the trigger lubrication and adjustments in a special report. Then I will lube-tune the rifle and test velocity and accuracy again. Then I will mount a scope and test accuracy at 25 yards. Then I will install a Vortek PG-2 SHO spring kit and test velocity and accuracy once more.
When I finish with the Weihrauch HW 30S you guys are going to know it just as well as I do.
Then I plan to get an HW 50S and run similar tests. And then we can make some comparisons. We are going to have some real fun with these two air rifles, and it just may last for most of the rest of this year.
B.B.,
Considering how fast this rifle shoots the .177 pellets how much slower will the .22 pellet be? There just might be something with the .20 at this power range to make sense. You are getting a HW 50s next? That sounds like a something that will compete with the Diana 34.
Siraniko
Siraniko,
The Canadian HW30S retailers list 625 FPS for the .177 model and 450 FPS for the .22 model. BB’s numbers with the .177 model suggests the manufacturer’s .22 numbers should be about right.
Interesting to note that the .177 HW30S is one of the few Weihrauchs that don’t have a detuned 495 FPS SKU – maybe because it’s so close to the limit, Weihrauch didn’t think it was worth the effort.
The 35, 50S, 77, 80, 85, 95, 97, and 98 all have detuned 495 FPS SKUs in both .177 and .22
Cheers,
Nathan
Chanman819/Nathan,
Thanks for those numbers. Pyramyd AIR specifies 700 fps for the .177 with unspecified pellets and 620 fps for the .20 also with unspecified pellets. So maybe for somebody looking for a little more terminal power the .20 makes a good theoretical argument without a rainbow trajectory. Canadian gun laws are weird and getting restrictive from what I’m seeing, then again I’m in a country that classifies airguns as firearms. Have fun over there.
Siraniko
Siraniko,
The funniest thing is that those numbers I gave are from D&L Airgun, which has been out of stock of many Weihrauch products for months now. Air Gun Source (where I bought my HW30S) only has the .177 model, and lists it as 675 FPS and the Beeman R7 as 700 FPS (identical other than price – the Beeman is $500 vs. $430, but it has the benefit of being available)
My HW30S box doesn’t list the velocity anywhere that I can see.
I don’t think there are gun laws anywhere with functioning laws that don’t have a lot of weird and/or oddly restrictive bits about weapons in general and guns in particular. I do have my firearms license, so my air gun options are open. Otherwise I’d be looking at either the HW30S in .22 or a detuned HW35 or 50S.
Not that I’m not also looking at those anyway! I’m going to need a larger safe or offload some of the current occupants before that can happen though..
Nathan
Siraniko,
I have to agree with B.B.’s statement here regarding the .22 HW30S over the .20 R7:
“I think a .22 would sell much better.”
I read every scrap of info I could find on the HW30S before I picked the .22 HW30S, which was then a gift from my wife (so, of course, I MUST like it, if I am a smart husband…actually, I do love it for its own merits).
As to your question, the .22 pellets are not speed demons from this little rifle; I get a very consistent 485 fps with JSB 13.43 pellets (the most accurate pellets in this particular gun). So, we are only talking a 7 fpe rifle; it is no powerhouse; but it has the same energy as my Crosman 1322, yet without the need for 10 pumps. I didn’t buy this rifle for hunting or pesting; I bought it as a super-fun all-day plinker…and it is that.
I hunted plenty of squirrels with my old .177 R7 (hunted, as in “got close” and used head shots only); and I’m sure this rifle has enough power for such things out to 25 yards or so (not 40, though; the penetratoin drops off there quite a bit). If I wanted a hunting rig, I would look at the HW50S in .22 caliber. In fact, I will be looking closely at B.B’s next set of reports on the HW50S. Who knows? “The Great Enabler” may well push me over the edge to get one of those as well! =>
Blessings to you,
dave
Thedavemyster,
Between .20 and .22 I would also pick .22 caliber despite its limitations in this rifle. Yes there are more pellets to choose from and they are easier to handle for me. Besides what am I going to use it for? Nothing but paper punching and plinking!
Siraniko
Siraniko,
Yes, the .22 pellets are much easier to handle for me, too (with .177, I use a pellet pen from PA)!
And the limitations are minor, since, as you mentioned, this is a paper puncher and plinker.
Mostly, now that it is perfectly sighted in, it is a plinker; I have pellet traps in front of 3 conveniently-located pecan trees: one at 15 yards, one at 25 yards, and one at 39 yards (my shooting bench is in the perfect location already; hence, I have tried to convince the tree to move itself back one yard…yet it is quite stubbornly refusing to do so…hahaha!)
Anyway, this plinker is a very smooth shooter; I can cock it with just my index finger; hence, it is an all-day shooter. It is dead on at 15 yards; I hold one mil dot high at 25 yards, and two mil dots high at 39 yards. No pecan on the ground is safe within 40 yards. This is my most fun air rifle to shoot.
And to me, above all, airguns should be fun! =>
Blessings to you,
dave
Hi folks,
it seems these triggers really do break in.
When my HW75 was brand new, the trigger wasn’t as nice as it is on my well-used HW45, but after some use, it got there. Not really Rekord triggers, but also not entirely different I think…
As for the chisel vs. ball detents: That’s a bit of a theoretical debate, isn’t it? I remember the Diana 34 Panther that BB tested years ago. It wasn’t only accurate, it was ultra-accurate and it has a ball detent. So, I figure it either shoots or it doesn’t.
Kind regards,
Stephan
Stephan,
Let the theoretical debates begin!
My thoughts on this matter. I personally like the ball detent as it makes it much easier to open and close a break barrel. The reason many airgun companies do not use it is tolerances. The chisel detent is more forgiving of manufacturing sloppiness. The chisel will help to pull everything in tighter together. The ball detent will require a more precise fit, requiring more attention to tolerances which will produce higher machining costs.
The following is pure speculation on my part, but my thoughts are that there may also be an issue with a ball detent coming unlocked with the uber magnum sproingers. Those buggas have a tendency to jolt and twist every which way when you pull the trigger and inertial affects “MAY” cause the ball detent to unlock. As I said, this is pure speculation on my part as I have absolutely no experience with these matters.
Woohoo! Now I am going to HAVE to get an HW50S! I might as well get an HW95 while I am at it.
There are about five different “models” of the HW30S right now. They range from the “plain Jane” version with no checkering, which is the version I have, to the Hunter Pro with no open sights, a muzzle weight and a scope. In between are the synthetic version, the “stainless” version and the deluxe version, which I would say BB has. I have even seen a limited edition with a laminated stock.
There is an aftermarket resettable safety lever for the HW30 and other Weihrauch models. It is made by V-Mach. Since you have to go inside, this is not for the faint of heart. Is it really an improvement? I cannot say as I have no experience with it, but the present safety works pretty good if used properly. You can also take the present one out if you desire, which I may do if I get an HW95. Of course now, I am used to such as most of the ladies here at RidgeRunner’s Home For Wayward Airguns do not have safeties.
RR
Yes you are going to have to get all the Weihrauch’s in all the calibers….
I do not believe that the V-Mach safety is available any more. If so, please post where.
-Y
Yogi,
I cannot actually post it here, but if you contact a certain airgun dealer in the SW USA they may still carry it. You may even check with V-Mach themselves.
https://www.air-rifle-tuning.com/v-mach/Home.html
RR,
I did check with V-Mach. This is there response:
“Thank you for your email.
Please note that unfortunately we are no longer trading.
Kindest regards
M Pope”
I guess another one bits the dust!
-Y
Bummer.
Ridge,
I have a five or six year old .177 HW50S with maybe five shots through it somewhere in my basement. (I bought it and a 30S at the same time from Pyramyd AIR and ended up liking the 30S more.) Let me know if you might be interested in that and/or my Diana 72. Tom G. and Gunfun1 both have my e-mail.
Michael
Michael,
I would indeed be interested in it. burke93ATtdsDOTnet
As for the 72, yeeees but we would have to see what can be worked out.
Ridge,
Yes Sir. Even a stainless steel version too!
Doc
I wasn’t impressed by the new HW50. The older HW50 aka R8 is a sweetheart and another subject. The new HW50 is heavy and hard to cock for the power it generates. Harder to cock or as hard to cock as an HW95/R9. If you want an HW50 I would strongly encourage you to look at an HW95/R9 and detune it.
Kevin,
I do thank you for your insight into these. We will see if this can happen. If not I will just have to be patient and get my grubby little paws on a HW95.
By the way, if I did detune it, it would not be by much.
RidgeRunner,
Detune the hw95/R9 to the level of an HW50 and be happy
Kevin,
I do not think I would take it that far. Just enough to make it sweet.
RidgeRunner,
If you wouldn’t take it that far why would you consider a HW50?
Kevin,
Because it is a little more powerful than the HW30. The HW50 would be the next step up for my grandson. After that I would give him his father’s Diana 46E.
The HW95 would be strictly for me. I would only detune it slightly, enough to smooth it out nice. If Vortek has figured out what the problem was with their adjustable gas piston for it, I would likely get one of those. I could then change the pressure, depending on what I felt like doing with it.
As far as I know, currently, there are seven different HW30S versions in production:
1- The one with BB’s rifle’s stock – the best looking stock I’ve ever seen.
2- Synthetic stock / ambi
3- No checkering beech wood stock / right grip
4- 4 panel checkering walnut-stained beech stock / right grip
5- Stainless finish w/4 panel checkering walnut-stained beech stock / right grip
6- The silencer one with no open sights / right grip
7- The shiny R7 / ambi
8- …? I must be forgetting at least one…
Fish,
Right now I am trying to get my hands on an HW50S. If that doesn’t work, I will save up my pennies until I can get an HW95.
I say get an R9, and don’t detune it – just use heavier pellets.
Fish,
I will not get an R9. Beeman is owned by a Chinese corporation. I will buy an HW95. It is a family owned German company. If my money is going off shore, I would rather it went East instead of West.
As far as detuning, we will have to see how it behaves. If it is smooth, quiet and well mannered from the get go, I will take it as it is. Life is too short to fool around with ugly airguns.
East, West changed roles there?! 😉 But I think I got what you had said. 🙂
Then I say get an HW95, and don’t detune it – just use heavier pellets.
Well, Europe is to the East of us and Chinaland is to the West of us.
I never really caught on to that Near East thing though. If Israel is in the Middle East and Chinaland is in the Far East, is Europe in the Near East? Or is Israel considered the Near East and Iran is Middle East. Either way Chinaland is still the Far East. That is unless I head West. Then I will end up on the Left Coast, which I have finally figured out why it is so called. Not wanting to be there, I guess I could start swimming West and if I swam long enough I would end up back in Chinaland. Sheesh, what a mess! Just for a change I would likely swim South and end up in the Outback. Outback of what? If the Outback is out back, where is the Outfront? Is the Outfront out front of the Outback. Jolly jumbucks!
I think I will just stay here.
Brilliant!
Joking aside, I, personally, have no problem with buying Chinese products. I have a lot of Chinese friends – very hardworking and kind folks. I love them.
As long as it is a good product sold at a reasonable price, who cares where it is produced.
Joking aside, when I was working at GE, the Communist Chinese government sent one of their engineer/spy to our facility to take a class on PLCs. I was attending the class and was partnered up with him. While he was looking through some book, he came across the Republic of China flag. He had some rather disparaging remarks concerning such, much I did not understand but his body language was easy to interpret.
The goal of Communist China is to subjugate the United States of America and anyone else who stands in their way. The real sad part is the Communist party is taking over our government as we speak.
As far as the quality of products coming out of Communist China, unless there is parent company oversight of production, I am not impressed.
Are the Chinese people who are not living under the tyranny of the Communist government hard working, kind folks? I cannot say as there are not many of them living in the Appalachian Mountains.
What are your opinions about Gamo and Hatsan air guns?
The reason I’m asking is because as far as I know, Weihrauch produces it’s springers in Germany, Gamo in Spain, and Hatsan in Turkey. American brand springers could be produced in the USA as well. We can compete the rest of the world with higher priced but better quality products, just like Weihrauch and Diana do.
Considering the facts of the global trade, in the long run, being profitable and competitive with decent quality products might be the answer in the springer market. Weihrauch sells despite the cheap competition, so quality still is profitable.
Fish,
Let us start with Gamo. Of the low end sproingers, they are the best. They need to work on their triggers though. I had a CFX and it was a dime buster at 25 yards. It was also very hold sensitive. Their multi-shot system, I think it is the best looking and likely the best operating. As for the PCPs, I have had no experience. I have heard very good things about them.
Now to Hatsan. I have a Webley/Hatsan Tomahawk. I picked it up when all of the dealers were trying to unload them because Hatsan was using parts that they rejected for themselves for the Webley contract. If I had paid $260 dollars for it, I would have sent it back. I paid $30 for it. With a little work it turned into a fairly decent sproinger that is real nice looking if you do not look real close. The Quatro trigger is very nice. It is not a Rekord, but close.
Now to their PCPs. I think they are too busy chasing the “I wanna” market. They need to slow down a bit and really research the serious airgun shooter market. I myself would buy a Galatian if they did not change the stocks so much. I like the one they sold years ago, not the new ones.
As a general rule, I stay away from low end PCPs because I understand what companies will do to meet a price point. I did buy a Maximus recently, but it came from the Disco which came from an older Crosman CO2 rifle. It has been around long enough to work out the little bugs.
Just my thoughts. You asked, you got.
I’ve heard the Webley/Hatsan Tomahawk but never investigated until now. I checked it on the PA site; it was a good rifle, better than the current Hatsans. Things I liked: no cheap bundled scope, no fiberoptic sights (the sights were at least deleted – better option than fiberoptics), and seemed to be a little bit reasonably powered.
PCPs are different breeds. Forget all those other PCPs; this is the best PCP hands down. And priced reasonably too.
/product/benjamin-marauder-air-rifle?m=1774 w/ LW barrel.
Fish,
There are some sproingers being built in the USA, even if there are a few Chinese parts thrown into the mix. These are not what I would spend my money on though.
Sig was doing it for a short time, but it seems to be coming to an end. TCFKAC could do it, but would the airgun community even notice? They have a well established reputation for building mediocre sproingers. They have also established a reputation that you do not buy the first generation of anything of theirs unless you want to be a Beta tester.
If a company in the USA was to decide to be in direct competition with “the big dogs”, they would first have to understand why these companies are still competing in a market where everyone else is priced at around $100.
First thing they need to do is forget about everybody else.
Another thing they need to consider is it will take them a long time to establish themselves in the high end market. Can they survive that long? Sig stuck their toe in this market and decided the financial return on building pistols for the U.S. government was better. So goes the ASP20.
If they truly wish to compete, they will buy a couple of different Air Arms sproingers, some different Weihrauch sproingers and one of the “older” Diana 34’s with a T06 trigger. They will then take these air rifles and their engineering department and quietly sequester them away somewhere with instruction to build a better mousetrap. Most especially they need to keep it secret for the marketeers and the lawyers or it will be ruined before it even has a chance at the first sale.
Right now, to the best of my knowledge there is only one company in this country that is capable of doing this and that is TCFKAC. They have enough going to survive and still be able to take a small team of very knowledgeable people and allow them to build that better mousetrap. I would really like to see an American made sproinger worth having.
RR,
With all the internet, you tube videos, blogs, forums, independent testers,… I do not think it would take long at all to get established. Like you said, get the good quality stuff for ideas/inspiration. Just do it right the first time.
A really good start would be to not over spring something,.. if 1/2 ~ 3/4 of the spring puts out the same fps (but a ton smoother),.. for example.
U.S made? Well, your (our) new Uncle Joe does not seem too concerned with keeping/attracting U.S. based business,.. so it seems.
I do agree, Crosman seems like a logical choice.
Chris
Chris and RR,
To be on the same page, I’d like to tell that I was not talking about gas piston air rifles. When I said springer, I meant coil / spring piston ones like HW30S and such. I think you guys got me, but I just wanted to make sure.
HW30S is sold for $220 in Europe. An American company can produce something similar quality, or better, here in the USA using American parts and steel and sell it for $250. I don’t get why this childish daydream of mine cannot come true. In Germany, workmanship is not cheap either. In fact, it has to be even more expensive considering the EU regulations and red tape.
RidgeRunner,
FM,
Thumbs up! Why not buy from the original manufacturers.
Fish,
Weihrauch has already recouped the long term investment in tooling. Any new start up even if it an established company will be hard pressed to match it.
Siraniko
Good point. I agree.
When did that happen? I thought Beeman was a California company.
/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/09-16-10-01-124-San-Anselmo.jpg
/blog/2010/09/a-brief-history-of-beeman-and-air-rifle-headquarters-part-3/
Still, R7 & 9 are built in Germany, right? I’ll have to research this new – new to me – info when I can make some time. In the meantime, I’ll be daydreaming of an HW95L and an HW30S being roommates in my closet.
Fish,
Several years ago. The R7 and the R9 are indeed still made in Germany, but instead of some of the money supporting Americans, it is supporting the Chinese.
I think you’re over thinking this.
Fish,
I had heard just the opposite of the Tomahawk. Almost every single one of them were returned because of quality issues. The only reason I bought one is I paid almost nothing for it new. It does have a nice stock, but the air rifle itself is built from Hatsan reject parts.
RidgeRunner,
Beeman is indeed owned by a Chinese company, but they have nothing to do with the R-series rifles that carry the Beeman label. Those rifles are made in Germany by Weihrauch and sold worldwide through Pyramyd AIR.
BB
BB,
Yes, I am aware that they are still made in Germany. Are you telling us that the Chinese are allowing the Germans to use their brand name they purchased without receiving some financial compensation?
RR,
I don’t know the particulars, but that is EXACTLY what I am telling you. The Chinese did not want the high-end Beeman line. As far as compensation goes, nobody is going to tell me.
BB
B.B.,
That statement tells me that there probably is an existing contract between the then Beeman and Weihrauch before the Chinese investors came in. Only upon lapse of the contract will Beeman drop the high-end Beeman rifles. Hopefully the Chinese would have realized what by then what it takes to sell their own line of high end airguns, but I’m not going to hold my breath.
Siraniko
Huh!
I have no problem with that deal. The thing that I don’t get is why R7 and R9 are significantly expensive than the competition – and the competition is exactly the same air rifles with cheaper prices. I think PA has to lower the prices of these two beauties. R7 should be sold under $299, and R9 should have a price tag under $399.
With the current price tags of the R-series on the PA store, there has to be a selling point. How about producing them in the USA?
Fish,
The reason the R7 and R9 are more expensive than the HW30 and HW95 is the Beeman name. They have to get their cut, so it is added on top of the price.
As for your thinking of sproingers having the metal sproings, I understand. My experience with the gas sproings is you can have the gas sproings.
One of the saddest things FM ever heard was the news the Chinese had bought the rights to the MG brand and had started building alleged MGs in the PRC…the horror! The horror!
B.B.
I know the gun is new and not broken in, but those velocity spreads are ENORMOUS!
Over 10% in some cases. What do you attribute that too?
Which of the pellets mentioned fit the breech the best?
Thanks,
-Yogi
Yogi,
I think you said it. This rifle needs a longer break in.
I don’t remember about the pwellet fit. It must not have been outstanding in any way.
BB
B.B.
I think what the gun needs is for you to “break-in”, lol.
If the Vortek gas ram has been brought back, maybe you could test that too?
Also, a 50 yard test would be interesting. If anybody can handle 8-12 inches of drop it is you.
I maintain that the HW 30 is an excellent 25 yard gun. I hope you can prove me wrong….
-Y
Yogi,
“Also, a 50 yard test would be interesting. If anybody can handle 8-12 inches of drop it is you.”
Yogi do you really think it will be that big of a POI spread? Or is that the potential vertical spread depending on which pellet proves more accurate.
I can sort of understand the potential difficulty if shooting at various distances near 50; but if it is an exact distance why would that be difficult to handle? Maybe it is my inexperience with spring pistons. I must be missing something in your thought process… unless it is a simple case of egging Tom on to do the 50 testing. LOL!
shootski
shootski,
On other forums, I hear HW 30 owners brag, “I shoot vermin at 50 yards all day long. Hit them between the eyes everytime.”
I would like B.B. to prove them wrong.
I believe to be an ethical hunter you need to be able to put 3 in 3/4 inches at whatever distance you are shooting at.
-Y
Yogi,
You know how that goes,…. every time you (they) tell a fish story,… it by grows by at least an inch. 🙂
By the time you (they) are 90,… you (they) was a bonafied whale fisherman! 😉
Chris
Chris USA,
I hear there are folks that can put a .25 caliber pellet through the slot of a 5″ weaving needle…and not have the needle move!
shootski
Shootski,
And to think I just sold my whole collection of ” 5″ weaving needles ” ! 😉 I guess the .25 RW will have to be happy with paper and tin cans.
Chris
Chris USA,
I’m sorry to hear that!
You must feel lost without them;
I’m so glad you will be able to make do.
shootski
Chris,
I did not say Crosman was the logical choice. they should be since they build bunches of break barrels, but they still have yet to figure out how to make a decent trigger. I really do not think they ever will.
Also, more and more of their sproingers are gassers.
They are also too wrapped up in that power thing.
RR,
100% agree. But, they are established and big. Changing their operation/thought process is a whole other thing.
Chris
Yogi,
Got it. Makes perfect sense now.
I agree on your ethical hunting on the small game accuracy requirements.
You know the need to impress is strong in humans. As long as we can do that kind of accurate shooting in the field with real wind and lighting and not just from the bench makes me happy. I haven’t seen to many do that kind of accuracy in field target with PCP and scopes so powerful that you need a Spotter to get you on target.
shootski
Yogi,
We shall see. You know I’m going to try.
BB
BB
Oh boy! You’re going to test the HW50S too. I have both and predict that you and any reader keen on backyard accuracy will be giving full attention.
Deck
Automatic Safeties 🙁 I hate them. I only buy R-7s that are pre-safety models. I shot mine this last weekend. My HW50S is also a pre-safety model. Part of the reason I prefer the older BSA Supersports to the R-9 is the lack of an automatic safety.
I was a little surprised at the velocities you were getting with the HW30S. Over the last few years I have been seeing a lot of post with R-7s shooting in the mid 600s with lead pellets. It seemed that HW was putting a little stronger springs into the R-7s than they used to. Maybe this has changed again.
I look forward to the rest of this series and the series on the HW50s.
David Enoch
David,
It is getting faster. Maybe I will do a second velocity test after the first accuracy test to allow it to break in some more.
BB
David,
You know that you could just remove the safeties from the guns that have them?
Then plug the holes with plastic inserts….
-Y
Looking forward to all your testing with the HW 30.
Sold my Bronco to buy HW 30. Twice the price but also twice the rifle!
Speakski
Speakski,
I agree with your observatiopns. The HW 30S is twice the rifle at almost three times the price. And the Bronco is/was a good air rifle.
BB
BB and All,
For those of you who have the globe front sights that take inserts on their HW30S, you can fit a FWB 18mm clear iris in the front globe. It is not a perfect fit, but it will work. Now if you were to file off the lip on the edge, it would be a perfect fit.
I know this as I am at this moment looking through a front globe sight with an 18mm FWB 2.8mm clear iris in it.
🙂
RR,
Are you looking through the sights on your grandson’s HW 30?
As for triggers, the Record on my R1 is perfection.
Brent
BB,
I bought my HW30S from PA in May 2016. I was stunned when I looked it up, I thought it was much more recent. What happens with the darn calendar! Sorry, back to normal programming.
It doesn’t like heavy pellets, as might be expected. These are some the figures I got with it:
RWS MK Light 7.0gr: 679 fps / 7.16 fpe / spread: 6 fps
RWS MK Heavy 8.4 gr: 576 fps / 6.09 fpe / spread 15 fps
JSB Exact Diabolo 8.44 gr: 623 fps / 7.29 fpe / spread 4.0 fps
Crosman Premier HP 7.9 gr: 613 fps / 6.6 fpe / spread 18
Based on the rather large spreads you saw with your rifle I would think that it needs more shooting before it settles down. If it was mine, I would also clean the barrel, but then again, my wife always says that I am a bit OC.
Best,
Henry
Henry,
I think mine needs to settle down, too.
BB
BB,
Great to hear you intend to test the HW50s also.
While you are at it, you might as well test the granddaddy of Rekord trigger-equipped Weihrauchs – the HW35, which turns 70 this year! It has been in continuous production since 1951.
You tested some older variants of the HW35 in the past, but I’d love to see you give a brand new one the full BB treatment, preferably a 35e with those gorgeous walnut stocks.
Bob,
I don’t know. I have spent a bundle on airguns this month and I just bought a motorcycle.
Might take awhile.
BB
BB
B.B.,
Have you taken delivery?
May the other vehicles stay away from you and your bike.
May the street’s, road’s, and highway’s surface keep proper distance always!
May it always be there when you park it on your return.
May it get you home safely from every ride.
May it always bring a smile to your face.
shootski
shootski,
I don’t have it yet. I’m having some accessories installed plus I am waiting to take my course that lowers my insurance. Then I can get my lisence.
BB
BB,
Motorcycle?? Oh dear…
Please be careful on it and don’t go doing any Evel Knievel-type stunts! It’s difficult to test airguns with a couple of broken wrists.
Bob Ryan,
Yes, you’re correct. B.B. tested Mac’s thumbhole HW35 and an HW35L. I’m a big fan of the HW35 but seems like testing a new version would be “plowing the same ground”.
The HW35 is one of the classics but I think the chronograph killed the HW35 for the USA market.
The HW 35 was the first rifle that Weihrauch introduced after WW2, appearing in the early 1950’s.
It’s still a good seller in Germany (where most airguns are limited to around 600 fps power by law). That says a lot about its quality and finely balanced handling. The HW 35 has actually won “Gun of the Year” awards from German magazines twice in the last several decades. It has a wonderful reputation for accuracy, and many shooters appreciated the two-piece cocking linkage which eliminates the long slot under the fore end seen on many other barrel-cocking air rifles.
I have an HW 35 with a walnut Bavarian-style stock made in the early 70’s. Collectors go for the walnut variants–there have been several–but the beech-stocked ones are fine rifles too.
This gun is in .177 caliber. 15-shot strings average 767 fps with RWS Hobby, 762 with BSA Excalibur, 616 with RWS Superdome, 688 with RWS R10 Pistol, and 728 with H&N Match Pistol.
The HW35 was the first gun that Herman Weihrauch made in 1951. The millionth HW gun came off line in the 1980s. This millionth gun was a gold plated HW35.
The HW35 has the same size piston seal as the more powerful HW80 (R-1).
Being a die hard springer fan I cringe that the HW35 is not or has not been popular in the USA. It still has a lot of fans in Germany, Holland, South Africa etc and is still considered a very capable classic by many rural home pest controllers and plinkers . It is still manufactured and is selling well . I can see from various comments on this forum some time back that this model seems widely to be considered obsolete ; too heavy and not enough power etc. It seems that the R9 (95)/R1 (80) and now the “new” HW50S are what dealers bring in and what is being sold. Like the HW80/R1 the HW35 has many aftermarket upgrades available in continental europe and the UK. I have owned the new HW35’s in both .177 and .22. They haven’t changed.
My favorite was a HW35L that Paul Watts tuned. Paul said it was the hottest shooting HW35 in .117 he’d ever seen. Here’s a picture:
One more picture. Please note the serial number
Kevin,
Yes, the HW35 in the US was eclipsed by the higher-powered R1, which is essentially a long-stroked HW35. Funnily enough even UK airgunners (who are limited to sub 12 ft-lb air rifles) bought into the marketing hype surrounding the R1/HW80 and somehow imagined it to hit harder than other sub 12 ft-lb air rifles!
Today in the UK the HW80 costs about 50 quid more than the HW35e. In return for that extra 50 quid you gain maybe 1 ft-lb of muzzle energy, but lose the beautiful walnut stock, sling swivels, breech lock and that short, snappy firing cycle (the longer locktime of the detuned R1/HW80 means greater hold sensitivity).
Given how popular low/mid-powered quality springers, such as the HW30s and HW50s, have become in the US, I think the time might be right for mature US airgunners to rediscover the HW35. Maybe Pyramyd AIR could do a deal with Weihrauch to import a big batch of 70th anniversary special edition 35’s at a tempting price – just an idea.
Wow, that’s a beautiful stock on your 35!
One more picture. Please note the serial number
Kevin,
Beautiful Tiger Stripe! I’ll suspect its depth presents better in person with direct sunlight.
shootski
Shootski,
You’re right. Photos don’t do it justice
300035 – sweet! :o)
Also like the fact that the cylinder hasn’t been defiled with the ambulance-chasing-lawyer inspired safety disclaimer of latter days.
Bob Ryan,
You got it!
You make some fine points about the HW35. Not sure there are enough “mature airgunners” to warrant ordering a batch of HW35’s. The “too heavy for the power it generates” crowd has prejudiced many novices that are still chasing velocity.
Kevin,
Granted the HW35 is not the lightest of air rifles, but it balances well and that bit of extra heft means stability in the offhand position. The HW35e comes fitted with sling swivels to facilitate carrying it in the field. Also, the weight can be kept down by foregoing a scope and fitting a Williams peep instead, or even just using the excellent iron sights as is.
The way I see it, the HW35 is a sound investment, as it is destined to become a valuable collector’s item. The design will be 100 years old just one generation from now and Weihrauch won’t keep making them forever. That company is already an anachronism in this age of flashy, design-by-committee, outsourced-manufacturing, quick-buck merchants.
I ordered a .177 HW35e just last week in fact. It should be arriving soon, am really looking forward to breaking that puppy in! 🙂
Bob,
You’re preaching to the choir.
Kevin,
Hopefully the choir will keep gaining new members! 😉
BB,
You might try a hw35 instead of a 50. It’s a little snazzier.
HW30S vs. HW50S! This year will be fun.
I’m very excited about the rest of the year; both 30S and 50S are my most favorite in production springers.
That 30 is crying out for a peep sight
BB, does the barrel get ‘broken’ in like all the other parts do from use, or is that a myth?
I like the kerf marks on the dovetails, nice photo’s! Ok, I figured this one cost more than $300.
The stock is too nice for a $300. air rifle. The owner of this beauty is set for life, every time it gets taken out will give satisfaction. A peep would be cool, the open sights are faster. A scope would detract from the aesthetic, but wring every drop of accuracy out of it.
The aluminum adjustment screw on the rekord trigger on my R10 gets loose now.
I’m out of Vibra tite VC-3, time to reorder.
Fun to watch this series,
Rob
Rob,
This one was $278 delivered from Europe. And yes, to some extent, barrels do break in.
And that’s after shipping, I assume. Considering shipping cost to be around 50 or 60 bucks, the rifle’s price tag must be only around $220…
/product/beeman-r7-air-rifle?m=1899
Perhaps, PA would like to say something about that. 😉
You’re all dragging FM into HW Land; not that the dragging is being credibly resisted.
Basil,
What you need is a hammer sandwich. 🙂
BB
Or a hamster.