Crosman SNR 357.
This report covers:
- The test
- Crosman Copperhead
- SNR sights
- Daisy Match Grade Avanti Precision Ground Shot
- Hornady Black Diamond
- H&N Smart Shot
- Dust Devils
- Labradar
- Summary
Today we look at the accuracy of the Crosman SNR 357 revolver when shooting BBs. Let’s get right to it.
The test
I shot the revolver off a benchrest with my hands resting on a sandbag. The target was a BB gun target placed 5 meters away. I shot 6-shot groups because that’s how many cartridges the cylinder holds. I shot with a two-hand hold and I wore my reading glasses with +1.25 diopter correction.
Crosman Copperhead
First up were Crosman Copperhead BBs. Since the SNR is a Crosman gun it seemed fitting. Six BBs went into 2.857-inches between centers. This was the largest group of the test.
The Crosman SNR 357 put six Crosman Copperhead BBs into a 2.857-inch group at 5 meters.
This group hit the target high and to the right. I purposely did not adjust the sights in this test because other BBs might go elsewhere.
The Copperhead BB has never been the equal of other premium BBs when it comes to accuracy. I knew they were one of the smallest steel BBs on the market so I measured one for you today. It measured between 0.168 and 0.1695-inches in diameter, when other premium BBs start around 0.1715-inches and go up to 0.173-inches. I have seen how Crosman makes their BBs and, given the process, it wouldn’t be easy or cheap to modify the line to make them larger. But at least they no longer have the divots that used to abound.
SNR sights
I will note at this point that I like the SNR’s sights a lot. They are large and crisp and easy to hold on target. They are adjustable but as I stated I didn’t adjust them for this test.
Daisy Match Grade Avanti Precision Ground Shot
Next to be tested were six Daisy Match Grade Avanti Precision Ground Shot. They went to the same general place as the Copperheads but produced a 1.244-inch group. It was the smallest group of the test.
Six Daisy Match Grade Avanti Precision Ground Shot made this 1.244-inch group at 5 meters.
This group deserves a comment. With the right BB the SNR is minute of feral soda can at 20 feet for sure.
Hornady Black Diamond
Next up were Hornady Black Diamond BBs. They are a premium BB that usually does quite well in accuracy tests. In the SNR six of them went into a group that measures 2.206-inches between centers. It landed in the same general place as the first two BBs
The SNR put six Hornady Black Diamond BBs into a 2.206-inch group at 5 meters. I think two BBs passed through the bottom hole.
H&N Smart Shot
The last BB I tested for accuracy was the lead H&N Smart Shot. We know they are a little larger than most steel BBs and I expected them to group well. Six went into a group that measures 1.683-inches between centers. It’s the second-smallest group of this test.
Six H&N Smart Shot BBs went into a 1.683-inch group at 5 meters.
Dust Devils
If you look at Part 2 you will see that I tested the velocity of Air Venturi Dust Devils too. Why didn’t I test them for accuracy, too? Well, when I discovered that the Labradar wasn’t recording the velocities of the BBs correctly I stopped the test and set up a different chronograph to rerun the velocity test. Therefore I never shot the Dust Devils for accuracy.
That being said, we know that Dust Devils are smaller than other steel BBs. Copperhead BBs are smaller, as well, so I imagined that Dust Devils would group poorly in the SNR which seems to have a preference for larger BBs.
The reason I didn’t test them is I forgot. This tells me that when I try to do two things with the Labradar — testing both velocity and accuracy — I need to keep my wits about me.
Labradar
Looking at the readouts that the Labradar gave me I also wonder whether it was the closeness to the target (5 meters) and not the size of the BB that caused the problem. The result is still the same, because BBs need to be tested at a closer distance. If I back up very much the groups will start becoming horrible. I chose 5 meters because that is the international BB gun competition distance. It is arbitrary for me, but it’s still nice to have a standard and 5 meters is the standard for BBs when I test them. If I ever find a super accurate BB gun, I will back up and test it from farther away like I did the Diana Oktoberfest, but until then 5 meters it is.
Summary
The Crosman SNR revolver is a decent BB shooter, so long as the ranges are reasonable. It’s no target gun, but we didn’t expect it to be.
Remember that this revolver also came with 6 pellet cartridges, so those tests still lie ahead. I think pellets will do better because they are larger. Remember my recent report on The ubiquitous BB? Size does matter with airguns. I will back up a little (20 feet?) for that test, in the hopes that the Labradar will work as it should. I may even try testing a BB’s velocity from that distance to see if it makes a difference. We shall see.
Tom,
Do the shells load with BBs from the front and pellets from the rear for their particular shells?
Siraniko
Siraniko,
Yes, that’s correct.
BB
Hi everybody,
Youtube suggested the 1969 “Gunsmith Of Williamsburg” documentary about Wallace Gusler to me (I really like “how it’s made” videos).
https://youtu.be/X_O1-chxAdk
I guess this might be old news to the US folks, but I found it really fascinating. The guy had to be very skilled at a lot of crafts to do what he did.
I have been wondering how exactly a rifled barrel is made. Now I know one method.
I did a quick web search and apparently, many of the methods for making a flintlock gun by hand were largely lost when Gusler started out. He pieced it together by reading, talking to old folks and experimenting. He passed away last year at the age of 90.
Stephan
CptKlotz,
I share your enthusiasm over “The Gunsmith of Williamsburg,” it was a real treat to watch, I saw it about two years ago, was amazed and told friends and family about it. What a skilled craftsman in the different media required to make a flintlock rifle from raw materials, and he produced such a beautiful, detailed piece. Amazing!
I grew up with Wallace Gusler in Salem Va. Wallace is 80 years old. It was a Wallace Gusler that lived in Martinsville Va. that was killed in a car accident. He was 90.
StarboardRower (referring the M1 bb gun) please see day before yesterday’s comments (January 10th) thanks. 🙂
>>> I will back up a little (20 feet?) for that test, in the hopes that the Labradar will work as it should. <<<
BB,
You might want to try the "Low Power" setting when placing the target so close to the unit.
I had that exact problem with my FX Radar when I put the pellet trap too close to the unit and because it's designed to read muzzle velocity, it's (relatively) low powered. Considering that the Labradar is designed for tracking high velocity (up to 4,000 fps) projectiles long distances there is a lot of energy there and reflections off of close surfaces could be causing a lot of "noise".
Hank
Hank,
Wow! Not only do you enable me — you are there after the purchase to keep my con! I like that! 😉
Thanks. That is something I never thought to do. If it works I’m back in the saddle with BB guns.
BB
BB,
Thinking about it… You might not be able to monitor velocities while testing accuracy at such close range – just too much power involved.
I would try doing a velocity check on those stealthy round BBs with the pellet trap set back out of interference range.
Hank
Hank,
We shall see.
BB
B.B.,
I will add that some shooters have mounted the LabRadar unit on a “bridge” directly (vertical Plane) over their muzzle to get .177 bullets and pellets into the RADAR beam’s main cone (MAIN Lobe for you RADAR guys) quicker. You could also try to simply move the unit closer to the muzzle and if using the airgun microphone trigger much closer.
Using no metal in the down range area especially things that don’t act as a corner reflector certainly will help with the Signal To Noise ratio.
* Corner Reflector: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corner_reflector
Might remind you a bit of how some pellet/bullet traps look!
Since this is a Doppler System anything that moves is the worst thing to have in the units field of view and also in the sidelobes:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sidelobes
I’m going to turn you and the Readership into a RADAR Operator(s) if not Design Engineers, Lol!
shootski
>>> With the right BB the SNR is minute of feral soda can at 20 feet for sure. <<<
BB,
I had to smile at this as the expression gives a really good visual as to the capabilities of the airgun.
Interestingly, minute-of-a-can accuracy seems to have become the new reference since Ted Beir demonstrated shooting Coke cans (and it HAS to be a RED Coke can to be valid 😉 ) at 300 yards with the .22 caliber FX Panthera.
I've always said the every gun is a "tack driver" at some range, that range might be measured in inches, feet, or yards, whatever. That there is an airgun capable of plinking tins at three hundred yards is mind boggling.
…Only accurate guns are interesting. Wonder how far a Panthera would be able to consistently hit a bottle cap? Sounds like that will be an expensive question to answer… will let you know 😉
Cheers,
Hank
Vana2,
As you will find out it is the long overdue embrace of bullets ((slugs) optimized for airguns by typical airgunners (teethed on spring piston airguns) that is at the heart of this vastly greater range capability.
Obvious to the most casual observer (qed) had PCPs of old continued at the center of airgun technology development…just think how far the technology of The Dark Side might have progressed over those intervening CENTURIES.
Quackenbush’s Big Bores have been shot out to the 700s for the past few decades hitting firearm sized long range targets just as accurately as the firearms; the only differences being the slightly greater looping trajectory and Time Of Flight (TOF.)
shootski
Were they 12 oz. cans or the smaller, 7.5 oz.? :o)
The small ones! 🙂
B.B., thanks for this series. I was considering this revolver as a training substitute for my brother-in-law. I confirmed thar he has a Ruger LCR .38 Special, although it is only 5 shots, I’m thinking this is similar enough to be a decent training tool, and the rear sight is adjustable to shoot where his Ruger typically shoots. For Christmas, I gave him and my sister-in-law one of the Crosman Mark IIs that I have resealed and cleaned up. That should help them with basic marksmanship and sight picture. This revolver might help him with more practical self-defense training. If you happen to have any HN Excite Plinking pellets, please give them a try in this revolver. Those work surprisingly well in the Mark II (and they are cheap!), and then they could possibly use the same ammo in both pistols.
B.B.
Crosman must want them to be smaller for some reason (maybe to save money?). I assume you saw them being made in the USA. A few years back they stopped making them here (as you probably know) and now get them from China. In fact, every steel BB I know of is now made in China.
Doc
Perhaps it is so they will not jam in a large variety of BB guns. My recent experience was with a Glock 17 Gen 4 that I got for my nephew this past Christmas. We tried Umarex, Crosman, and Hornady BBs and the Hornady jammed the action for some reason. The Umarex BBs were the best of the lot in his gun. Next will be to buy some more varieties and test them out too.
Roamin Greco,
If they were Hecho en Mexico they were 237ml, 355 ml, or the tall 473 ml. In Red ONLY Lol!
shootski
B.B. and Blogmates: I recently acquired a Winchester 353 Target Pistol (Diana Model 5). Ever been inside one? Do I need a spring compressor?
When I bought it, it shot fine for a short while, but all of a sudden, it lost power and now barely gets the pellets to the target. I’m thinking it sat around unused for a great while, and the piston seal finally gave out once I started giving it a workout. I tried 5 drops of RWS silicone chamber lube down the transfer port and letting that sit muzzle pointed up overnight (I don’t know if it has a leather seal or synthetic), but that didn’t help. Perhaps you or others can provide some insights.
Sorry Roamin Greco, I have no experience with your pistol. However, I agree that a failed seal would result in loss of power. I also think that a main spring compressor would be advisable because…
a) I understand that the main springs in most handguns are under considerable tension, due to the need to achieve power from a limited space.
b) According to a Diana Model 5 diagram, the spring looks to be twice as long as the tube it lives in..
c) You may be interested to know that, on the website anotherairgunblog, Nick Carter documented the “Disassembly” of his Diana 5 for which, in part 2, he used a spring compressor.
(http://anotherairgunblog.blogspot.com/2008/06/diana-model-5-disassembly-part-2.html)
Happy tinkerin’… 🙂
Erm, sorry (again?) Roamin Greco about my interpretation of the diagram. Now I think that the tube houses the whole mainspring only when the gun is cocked.
Still, without knowing how much it’s pushing against the end cap, I would use some sort of spring compressor.
Indeed always use a spring compressor, better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.
Mike
Good advice.
Thanks, Hihihi. But I think that’s the piston. The one end of the spring fits inside that and then the piston and the spring fit inside the large cylinder below. Then on the other end of the spring is a spring guide and after that a spacer and then the end cap. And thanks for the link. I will review that a couple of times before I try anything.
Roamin Greco,
If you have further questions I think you can rely on Derrick who is active on the blog to help you. He’s the other author of anotherairgunblogspot.com
Siraniko
Yes Roamin Greco, I think you are correct, of course, and I apologise for my mistake.
What a shame that after 30 minutes of posting, our comments become the property of pyramydair (especially when the information about main springs is wrong). Oh well… 🙁