Umarex M3.
This is a guest blog from reader Snake. Today he tells us about his new Umarex M3 grease gun that he waited for, for a very long time.
If you’d like to write a guest post for this blog, please email me at blogger@pyramydair.com.
Take it away, Snake.
The Umarex M3 Grease Gun
By Snake
This report covers:
- First Impressions
- Safety
- Sights
- Stock
- Magazine
- Trigger
- Shooting/Accuracy
- Details
- Summary
- Now it’s BB’s turn
The late great prophet Tom Petty told us that, “The waiting is the hardest part,” and he was right. I ordered this Umarex M3 Grease Gun from Pyramyd AIR in September 2021 and then watched as the expected delivery date got pushed back month after month. Frankly, due to various world situations, I gave up several months ago on EVER seeing it. And then last week I got an email from Pyramyd asking if I still wanted it. Did I want it? Would I still like to hit the Powerball? It arrived last Friday (November 25).
First Impressions
Disclaimer: I’ve never owned, shot, or even held a real M3 Grease Gun of any kind, though I have seen several, and have some experience with the Broadhead Armory M3C, a semiautomatic-only lookalike that was available for several minutes back in the mid-1980s. The M3C was purely a “lookalike,” constructed in an entirely different way from the real M3s, and shared no real M3 parts except the magazine (and possibly the barrel and wire stock).
Although billed as an M3, the Umarex gun actually replicates the later, simpler, product-improved M3A1 which dispensed with the cocking handle in favor of a simple finger-hole in the bolt, which rode under a lengthened dust cover.
And replicate it does, in spades. Size and shape seem to be identical, and the weight at 7.7 pounds is only a bit under the real M3A1’s listed 7.95 pounds. I have to assume that the replica’s handling and balance are very similar, if not identical, to that of the firearm.
Near as I can tell, all original M3s were delivered in a Parkerized or phosphate finish. The Umarex gun is finished in an attractive satin black (paint, powdercoat, or something similar, I assume) much like their MP40. I have seen at least one currently-owned M3 with a very similar finish, but I have no idea if that one was painted, satin-blued, or whatever. At any rate, the Umarex finish is, as I said, very attractive and businesslike.
Umarex M3 and Umarex MP40, shown for size comparison.
Two M3 firearms photographed at a local gun show about decade ago. Upper gun is a straight M3 with cocking handle and short dust cover; it seems to have been refinished in black. Lower gun is the simplified, product-improved M3A1 with long dust cover. It also appears to have been refinished in Parkerizing (phosphate coating).
Safety
The original M3 has no safety button, switch or lever. On the M3A1 the dust cover includes a projection which fits into a hole in the bolt when the cover is closed and the bolt is pulled back. This locks the bolt in either the rear or cocked position. As the M3s fired from open bolt, the gun was as safe as it was gonna get when the dust cover was closed. The firing pin is fixed in the forward position, so when that bolt slams forward the gun fires.
The Umarex gun, like their MP40 replica, has an unobtrusive 3-position safety switch on the underside for Safe, Semiautomatic, and Full-Auto. Oddly, it does not have the safety projection on the underside of the dust cover, but then again with the switch it’s not really needed.
Sights
Sights are fixed, a blade front and an aperture rear. The front sight seems to be thinner than most USGI front blades I’m familiar with. It also looks a bit fragile, and subject to bending, dinging, or breaking if abused. Be careful with it. (On the bright side, it looks like it would be fairly easy to replace if need be.) The sights seem to be pretty well regulated—more on this under Shooting/Accuracy. The hinge of the dust cover is in view when aiming, but this is only a minor distraction and soon gotten used to.
Stock
Just like the firearm, the stock is a wire-rod unit that slides in and out. It includes the firearm’s magazine loader projection, which is of course not needed on the replica. This projection interfered with my hand a little bit when the stock is collapsed but is out of the way when the stock is extended. The stock seems very sturdy with little if any play when extended.
Magazine
The magazine is of the same general type as Umarex’s MP40 and M1A1 Thompson, but it is NOT interchangeable with either; the three guns each use distinct, dedicated magazines. The Pyramyd website lists the capacity as 30 BBs, but I had no trouble getting 52 in mine and I suspect it actually holds 60 (I decided at this point not to risk malfunction by loading it to full capacity.) The BBs are easy to load after you get the follower tab locked into its loading notch. (I’m going to invent some kind of little tool to help with that.)
The magazine holds two standard CO2 cartridges, but just like the Umarex MP40 and M1A1 Thompson, the gun will run just fine on one cartridge, with an empty cartridge place-holding for the second one. On one cartridge, the power/velocity isn’t reduced, just the shot count. The Pyramyd website lists shot count as about 120 per fill, but I easily got 104 (2×52) from just one CO2 cartridge. The gun stopped functioning full-auto at around round 98, but the last six fired just fine semiautomatic. A full fill with two cartridges should produce around 200 shots or more.
Trigger
As mentioned, I have no idea what a real M3 trigger feels like. [Editor: It’s long, stiff and creepy.] The Umarex gun’s trigger is probably on the high side of six pounds, and has a little creep and grit (as I imagine the real gun does), but who cares? This isn’t a benchrest or target gun, it’s built for full-auto rock-n-roll fun! The firearm has a very low full-auto rate of fire and supposedly a skilled shot can get off single shots; the Umarex gun seems to have a much faster rate of fire and I don’t think single shots are possible. But if single shots are what you want, just set the safety for semiautomatic. Trigger reach on this gun is very short, much like the AR-15/M16, so I shot it just like an AR-15, pulling the trigger with the proximal joint of my trigger finger. This technique works well with an AR and it worked great with the Umarex M3.
Shooting/Accuracy
Functioning of the Umarex BB gun was flawless. I fired the first 10 shots semiauto, standing and leaning against a door jamb in my basement from about 8 yards. Six of the 10 went into a nice half inch, with the other four not far out (a 1-1/4-inch group for all 10). The group was about 5/8-inches to the left but spot-on for elevation. I then put up a fresh target (a small paper plate) and fired the rest of that magazine and most of the next one full auto, about 4 to 6 round bursts, from unsupported standing at about 7 yards.
These shots tore a nice “rat-hole” of about 2-inches or so, right on for windage but maybe 1 1/2” low. I should add that most of my Umarex guns seem to shoot slightly left and slightly low. I don’t know if this is some lighting kink in my basement, or something about my particular eyes or sight picture or whatever but every shot would have probably hit a soda can and overall accuracy is — in my humble opinion, of course — quite good.
As the gun neared the end of the second 52-round magazine, it stopped running full-auto. The last six shots of that magazine spit out just fine semiauto, though, so I left no CO2 behind. (Remember, this was all on just one cartridge, not two.) I don’t own a chronograph so can’t tell you what the muzzle velocity might be, but I imagine it’s similar to Umarex’s MP40 and M1A1 Thompson.
The two pie plate targets.
Closeup detail of the shots on the targets. Left target is 10 rounds shot from about 8 yards, semiautomatic, from a braced standing position. Right target is 94 rounds fired full-auto in short bursts, unsupported standing, from about 7 yards.
Details
The gun has authentic sling attachment points (can’t really call them swivels as they’re quite solid) but no sling is included. The proper sling for an M3 is the common M1 Carbine sling and reproductions are available from numerous vendors, or perhaps at a local gun show near you. M3 firearms have a little oiler bottle screwed into the bottom of the grip, similar to the M1 Carbine’s oiler. The Umarex gun has a knob there that looks like it unscrews, but I couldn’t unscrew it with my fingers and haven’t yet laid a tool on it. Someday soon I’ll discover what might be hiding in there.
Summary
The Umarex M3 is authentic, well-made, functionally reliable, satisfactorily accurate, an excellent value for the price and an absolute joy to own and shoot. I couldn’t like it more! If you want one, I’d recommend that you order one as soon as possible, as who knows how long things will be normal in the part of the world where it’s made (Taiwan).
Now it’s BB’s turn
BB Pelletier has held and shot a lot of M3 and M3A1 grease guns. In his role as an Armor (tank) officer, he had them in his combat support company in Germany. He had several in his arms room and one time, without knowing beforehand, he sent his two Armored Vehicle Launch Bridges (AVLBs) through East Germany to northern Germany where he was reunited with them for a joint exercise called Grosse Baer. Each bridge tank had two grease guns clipped to their interior walls because his bridge section sergeant forgot to take them with him on the train. The whole battalion and all its equipment went through west Germany, but BB’s two bridges went through east Germany because they were 4 inches too wide to pass through the train tunnel in the Hartz Mountains. But BB wasn’t afraid because the hatches of both bridges were secured by sturdy brass government padlocks. After all — we can’t be too careful about weapons’ security!
Then there was the time when BB demonstrated the grease gun to ROTC cadets at Fort Lewis, Washington. He had two silhouette targets covered in balloons that were held on the targets by a net. BB intended to explode the balloons for dramatic effect but all the slow-moving .45 ACP bullets did was push them aside. Not a single balloon popped. Wellllllll — BB shot the sub from the hip, so maybe he missed the target altogether. Then, an embarrassed and angry BB grabbed an M16 and shredded all the nasty balloons!
Then there was the time when BB’s guards had to react to the Baader Meinhof gang in Tennenlohe forest, in Erlangen, Germany. So the battalion commander sent them out in an M113A1 Armored Personnel Carrier, each armed with an M3A1. But no problem, because the covers that are also the guns’ safeties were closed. No way they could get jostled around and fire accidentally inside an armored vehicle, where the bullets would rattle around like a golf ball hit inside a tile bathroom!
Oh yeah — BB knows grease guns!
Snake,
But can they shoot the star out? B.B. knows what I am talking about.
You complain about waiting 14 months for something…..guess you never head of supply chain issues????
I’m still waiting on stuff that has been in the transportation system that long! Thanks, FedEx, USPS.
-Y
Thanks Snake for your interesting review.
I have a couple of questions:
Presumably there’s no need to open the dust cover to shoot?
What variety of ball bearings can be used safely, ie without jamming?
Tom Gaylord (B.B. Pelletier) brass padlocks, eh? What a brilliant idea! Did nobody think of doubling the security by also attaching a no entry/Eintritt Verboten sign? 🙂
hi3,
Now why didn’t I think of that? No criminal would dare trespass against such a stern warning. 😉
BB
BB,
Signs like that work better when they are attached to a 10′ high chain-link fence with razor wire on top. (Fine print on back) For best performance they recommend dog patrols and maned machine gun towers be nearby. Supplied for a small extra cost, free shipping.
Hi hihihi,
No idea about ball bearings. I used Barra “zinc plated steel” BBs from Walmart. These seem to be identical to the Umarex BBs I’ve been buying from Pyramyd (I have a bunch of them on hand, but The Lovely Mrs. Snake moved them last spring while I was in hospital with a stroke and couldn’t tell me where they are now, so I had to go buy some locally. They worked fine.)
Dunno if it will shoot with the dust cover closed. It just might. I’ll try that next time I’m shooting it. Thanks for the interesting question!
Snake, thanks for the great write up. IMHO George Hyde(A German-American) designed just about the perfect personal defense weapon in the M-3 and it’s variants. I’ll leave this link to the Wiki page.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Hyde_(gun_designer)
SSC,
Thanks for the read. If you follow the internal links for the M3, you will note that it was still being used in the Gulf War. There were several in Vietnam who did not trade there M3’s in for the new Mattelomatic.
SSC,
Thanks for the kind words. Much appreciated! Have a great day!
I have always wanted an M3A1.
Are you guys sure that the dust cover will act as a safety on the real one? If you look at the projection you will see that it looks more like something to pop the dust cover open when the bolt moves forward as with the M16. I know, the Mattelomatic fires from the closed bolt and the dust cover pops open as the bolt moves backward, but I think you get my drift.
I know I may be mistaken, but I think the only real safety is when the M3 is not cocked or the magazine is not inserted all the way as in the Sten gun.
There were several “civilian” semi versions of the M3 for a short period of time, but they fired from the open bolt position and were thus easy to convert to full auto, so they disappeared real quick from the market.
RR
Same thing happened to the UZI, but they converted to a closed bolt and pressed on. They even welded a bar inside to prevent people from installing an open bolt. And an open bolt part that was machined to clear that bar used for a semi-auto is considered a machine gun by itself.
If I remember right the M3 was to replace the Thompson because it was made of stamped steel and required much less machining time to build, not to mention cost.
Bob M,
I have read that concerning the M3 supposedly replacing the Thompson myself for those very reasons. The M3 was also much lighter.
I used to have a semi Uzi pistol. I never tried to convert it, but I did take a long look see at it.
RR,
BB is ABSOLUTELY positive that the cover acts as the safety on the M3A1. Besides shooting them a lot, BB was taught about them in Armor Officer Basic at Fort Knox.
BB
Never having had the pleasure of looking at an actual M3, I must defer to the expert. It is just that in the photo above, the cover piece has an angular cut which led me to think such. Some type of safety would be a good idea when handing one of these to a trooper.
Hi RR,
I know for a fact that the semiauto Broadhead Armory M3C fires from closed bolt. And its “fire control system” is actually modified AR-15 parts, hammer and all.
The closed bolt was a wise decision on their part to help avoid government issues, but using Mattelomatic parts might have still led to easy conversion.
Although I am not a big fan of these replica bb guns, I can see their appeal to many. I just wish that Velocity Outdoors ST1 was not so expensive. Somebody finally came out with a SciFy looking airgun and put an awful high price on it.
Thanks Snake.
Mine shipped in 5 days on the 30th and should be delivered today. But who knows how long they will be in stock or get replenished these days. Waiting for months is not unusual, especially with airsoft companies.
Gotta hand it to Umarex. They really have this replica thing down pat. Although airsoft has been there for a long time. Come to think of it an M249 SAW or M60 would be nice or at least a BB conversion kit for the Airsoft versions.
Can’t leave out my Ultra Tac-T-Kool DSR-1 Sniper rifle. Or at least an FN SCAR H, L or any other version. Eventually, no rush 🙂
Hi Bob,
I think you’re gonna love the M3.
I’ll second your suggestion for a Umarex M60. I’d buy one! Would also love to see a BAR, MG42, Swedish K and/or MP-5, but with the MP40, M1A1 Thompson, and M3A1, I now have my favorite submachineguns of all time.
Would not hurt to throw in a Sten, PPSh-41, StG-44 and maybe even a Boys Antitank Rifle? Ok, kidding about the Boys – then again, that might make SOME PCP!
FM,
I am with you! I would really like to have a Sten.
As for the Boys, maybe. The Russians had a really cool looking anti-tank rifle during WW2. My Texan LSS actually looks a lot like it.
Snake
I just picked up an UZI select fire BB pistol sold by KWC. Folding stock and all. Fake silencer out there also. Top cover is all metal and the entire thing is heavy and hard to tell it’s not all metal. Outstanding replica.
Thanks Snake!
An interesting read and well presented/written. Co2, BBs and replicas are not my thing but the M3 Grease Gun looks like it would be fun to shoot.
Happy Friday all,
Hank
Hi Vana2,
Thanks for the kind words! I know replica BB guns aren’t everybody’s thing, but I’m having a LOT of fun with mine. Have a great day!
FM knows it has to be fun based on experiences shooting the Umarex MP40. Had been meaning to try Daisy Avanti Precision bbs in it and maybe that is overkill, but these replicas shoot with some accuracy so, why not? Of course, had just put in an order to PA and forgot to include the bbs…FM should change name to Tonto. Had seen a video showing you could fire the MP40 using only one CO2 cartridge/bottle which obviously keeps one from going through the gas and ammunition too quickly. Plus if there is something wrong with the magazine, seals or whatever would keep you from accidentally dumping the CO2 from TWO cartridges. Just a thought.
Still on the wish list: PCP versions of these, including the Thompson, in .177 or .22 – maybe even .25? One can dream, it is free. 🙂
FM,
Doesn’t matter if you put in one cartridge or two, you’ll have to reload BBs before you run out of gas. I only ever load one because I find that about 100 shots usually scratches my rock-and-roll itch quite satisfactorily. Shoot straight!
–Snake
Snake45,
Enjoyed your report even if it was about a airgun replica of a General Motors product, Lol!
I think this was from GM back in the days when they still had/showed a bit more integrity.
Always took a great deal of selfcontrol to keep from shooting away all 675 or so 20mm rounds out of the M61-A1 Vulcan at about 100 per second made easier by the long trip back to the boat for a reload.
Does the empty cartridge get gas from the new cartridge or is there a check valve? May have answered my own question?
So the CO2 gas would leak out without the empty in place?
Shootski
Hi Shootski,
The two cartridges sit butt-to-butt, if you get my drift. There would be no way to pierce just one–no resistance, Thanks for the interesting question!
–Snake
A Vulcan?! Yeah!
They should make a bb replica of a minigun. They made an airsoft one.
RR,
There was a BB minigun. It sold for $3,000. Nobody bought one.
BB
RidgeRunner,
A guy in Texas built the mini bb gun that Tom is referring to back at least two decades ago. It was a very good looking prototype but it was fabricated old school style and obviously way to expensive for retail sales to take off.
It might be doable with CNC and additive fabrication approach for a bit less today. Hard to build something that loads, spins, and burps out bb that fast accurately and reliably without a bunch of regular Preventative Maintenance.
I found this example while looking for the Original one Tom and I remember; have no knowledge about this one: http://www.xcalibertactical.com/products/gatling/index.html
The Website has a 2010 copyright?!?!
shootski
I have seen that particular gatling gun before. I wish I had the understanding of such at the time and I would have snapped it up. As for a bb minigun, Fred Liady in Roanoke, VA had one. It was all stainless steel. I was just starting into airguns at the time and deeply regret not getting to know him before he died. Many of his airguns are now in the Beeman collection.
RidgeRunner,
I met Fred at the one Roanoke airgun show i managed to get to…must have been before your airgun start time. Spent most of that show talking to Dennis and a few other interesting folks. Fred wanted to get together since we had a number of same/similar unusual airguns but it never worked out before his untimely passing.
shootski
Fred had quite a collection. He owned Quakenbushs, Barnes, Airrows and it seemed like everything else. His collection touched on everything airgun. I first met Dennis, Gary and Tom at his shows. It was kept going for a few years after his death, but I guess with not living local, the sponsor found it difficult. The Roanoke Show came to an end. I mourn both Fred’s and the show’s passing.
Did so this afternoon – inspired by your story, emptied a magazine into a pumpkin Mrs. had bought as a Halloween prop. Fun for FM, for the poor pumpkin, perhaps not so much.
LOL! Now that would be fun!
Now I need a pumpkin. HAHAHAHAHAHA!
Wow, Mine was just dropped off. This is definitely a man toy at 7.7 lbs.
I imagine it helped tame a 45 on full-auto quite a bit.
If it were not a replica, I might alter it a bit. The trigger guard is kind of low on the grip, More room for thick Korean winter gloves in the trigger housing? And metal tabs front and back could come off or get the edges rounded but it is what it is and should be left alone as a WELL-DONE replica. Gloves may make it more comfortable.
Need to go out for now, more later? This is one very impressive airgun 😉
Bob,
I told you you were gonna like it. I hope you’re as happy with it as I am.
–Snake
Just a quick fyi. Imagine the weight with one or two mags of 27-30 rounds of 45 inserted.
A mag pouch was available that held,iirc, 6 mags. It had a belt loop on the back that would fit a GI web belt plus a 2″ + shoulder strap. I can’t imagine hiking with that. I just put it on the truck seat or floor.
Snake, thank you for a great report on a cool piece of history! :
And B.B., thank you for your stories of them in days gone by. 🙂
Years ago, I was on our skeet range in Florida, when I heard some full-auto fire at the Cowboy Action Shooting range. I told my friend we needed to pack up our shotguns, and head over there, since that was the assigned range for the upcoming sub-gun championships. Sure enough, when we got there, a couple of guys had just finished shooting their guns: an UZI and an M3. They had just put their guns up due to a passing rain shower (those things are too expensive to let them get wet!); but they said if we stuck around for a bit, we could shoot their guns. Stick around for that? Heck yeah! We talked guns with them till the rain stopped; then my friend and I each got to shoot a magazine on full auto from each of the guns. Great fun! But at the time (20 years ago), they said guns like that were running about $8000 to $9000 a piece. Hence, this replica looks like a great way to enjoy a sense of history at a very reasonable price. 🙂
(Snake, I’m glad you hung in there and waited for your order!)
Blessings and good shooting to you both,
dave
I have had the pleasure of “playing” with several different machine guns over the years, courtesy of Uncle Sam. As far as owning a real one myself, not only are they outrageously expensive, but It can also be right expensive to feed one of them.
“…not only are they outrageously expensive, but It can also be right expensive to feed one of them.”
RidgeRunner, I see your point; I guess the cash-to-fun ratio is much better for the replica M3, which is the justification for Umarex making this little bundle of joy. 😉
Indeed! CO2 and bbs are much cheaper!
Just getting familiar with my M3 tonight. The pistol grip is short, and your pinky will slide under it. The wire stock magazine depressor tab carried over from the real M3 does get in the way some, as does the collapsed stock. It is described as adjustable but only locks in full open or closed. However, it is totally and easily removed.
I find it most comfortable when you grip it if you have the middle joint of your middle finger, directly under the trigger guard otherwise the flesh between your finger joints will move up into the trigger guard and get pinched into the pointed edges of the guard just above your finger. And this would go hand in hand with Snakes suggestion as to where you place your index finger on the trigger. Not on the pad of the tip.
This also moves the web of your hand to the right, if right-handed, so the back of the grip is more on your thumb. At least on my hand. The back of the grip is not too curved to be comfortable in the web of your hand. Basically, you are gripping it from the right side, or left, instead of directly from the rear. Much better control of the gun. The weight will rest on that middle joint and not pinch your finger. It’s also about the only way you can shoot it with the stock collapsed.
The front sight is thin, as Snake said, and it is sharp, as well as the edges of the locking spring tab for the barrel nut. On a real M3 the metal appeares to be gently rolled over itself but this one is folded flat and sharply pointed at the corners. I may file them curved a bit more, but it may affect the front sight some. Not a big thing for a fun plinker.
I hope this does not discourage anyone from getting this superb replica. Just wanted to point out some areas of concern I found. The weight of this airgun would probably amplify any pain inflicted if any of these sharp areas were to impact you. Just pay attention and be aware. I’m not about to let this one go for this trivial stuff. “From my cold dead hands”
Thankyou UMAREX for creating these great replicas!
Hi Bob,
Sounds like you’re liking it. Tolja so!
I hadn’t noticed the short grip/pinky thing you mentioned but you’re kinda right about that. Doesn’t bother me at all.
As for the adjustability of the stock, it looks like you could easy remove it and grind new locking notches in the underside wherever you want them. WAY easier than trying to get the correct angle on the underfolding stock of the MP40. (I saw an article in one of the gun rags last year on how to do this, but the whole operation just looked like WAY too much trouble with the potential for disaster, so I gave up on the idea. The MP40 is quite comfortable to shoot with the stock extended straight out–it might actually be more comfortable than the firearm MP40’s downward droop.)
Can’t wait to read your comments after you actually shoot that bad boy!
–Snake
BB-
Well, it’s been a few decades since my use of the M3/M3A1 subguns. Impressions were they reliably went bang. Unless you had managed to drop or otherwise damage the receiver or cover in such a manner as the bang bang part didn’t work so great. Of course you could usually bang, mash, tweak the light sheet metal back to sorta shape so the bang bang would again work. Or work as well as the poorly executed (and even more poorly maintained) magazines would allow. One plus was by that stage in time there was some pretty decent sound suppression available and the slow rate of fire made for good work. Unless you dropped the loaded gun just so and then it would fire a round or three on its own. Fun times.
Back in WW the Second Time Around, there were certainly worse contracts for stuff signed by the War Department but one has to wonder why they didn’t just adopt the Sten or PPsh41. GMs perhaps best contribution to the war effort was the CCKW truck. The M3 and Liberator- definitely not in the same ballpark.
Paco,
Ahhhh! The Liberator! There’s a blast from the past!
/blog/2018/05/the-fp-45-liberator-pistol/?swcfpc=1
BB
First impression update. Stepped outside with the M3 and noticed a few blemishes on the barrel finish, like paint scuffing. Nothing more serious than that of a distracting fingerprint would be but they do stand out on an otherwise perfect metalic black finish.
I found the cause. The box it comes in has a form fitting cardboard insert to stabilize the airgun inside and it is a very stiff cardboard material. Pattern formed from what looks like a dried-out cardboard slurry. It obviously needs to be stiff to control any movement of this heavy airgun.
However, it appears that in an effort to make it easier to remove and install they incorporated 6 small protrusions into the form that help keep it centered. Turns out the paint blemish spots are exactly where those protrusions touch the airgun. I’m sure the weight of the airgun amplifies the pressure being applied to those high points.
Good intensions gone slightly wrong with this type of airgun finish.
From my experience the black aeriated plastic material that fits tight and spreads the contact surface all over the airgun seems to work out good with heavy rifles, but soft, ‘thick’ foam rubber is even better.
A foam, form fitting takedown carry case would be nice, but the soda straw barrel seal may not hold up well with repeated use. Matter of fact I think I will look into that, being aware of the delicate seal.
Keeping the M3 out of the original box would end the paint chaffing also.
Bob M,
Perhaps a soft rag and some oil or Ballistol and bit of elbow grease may make it look better. Still have not shot it?
Mike
Mike,
No, I have not had time to get out and set things up. Besides it’s cold and nasty for my old body.
The finish is a metalic type paint? and varies in color or looks as you go into it. The scuff marks are actually shinier. I’m not worried about it. Not as bad as dragging your steel horseshoe taps on your motorcycle boots over a new custom paint job on your gas tank.
Living on a dirt road the delivery truck with a stiff suspension must hit over a hundred bumps and jog the gun around in the box much more than any normal delivery. So, it may even be limited to my M3? I just ordered an Uncle Mikes soft sub-machine case to avoid any more damage to it.
Bob M,
Hope you can get some better weather and put it to use, it should be a fun gun.
Mike
Hi Bob,
Sorry to hear about the box-rubbing problem with your gun. I checked mine and it doesn’t seem to have anything like that.
A while back when I bought my Springfield Armory M1A .22 from Pyramyd, it arrived with a broken-off “cocking handle” (it’s non-functional except for a little back-and-forth movement and is completely cosmetic). Obviously damaged in transit, as the box had a dent there and the broken-off pieces were in the box. Pyramyd offered to exchange the rifle for a new one, but I thought that would be a lot of trouble and expense for so minor a problem so settled for a $10 credit toward my next purchase, which I didn’t take long to use. I still have all the broken pieces and will probably try to epoxy the whole mess back together someday.
Was looking for some other pics on my puter last night and ran across this one–it’s my son when he was maybe 8 or 9 or somewhere in there with a re-enactor’s M3 at the big local airshow one year. (He turns 33 today!) I have pics of him with a Thompson and a BAR, too, and one of him behind the M134 Minigun on some kind of helicopter. Precious memories, good times!
ETA: Well crap, the board’s not letting me upload the pic for some reason. Ah shucks oh well.
Snake the picture may have been too big. I have to resize them down a lot in my laptop before sending them.
+Mike in Atl.
This is not my first full auto bb gun, have a dozen or so including two MP40’s, two Uzi’s, a few M92 Berettas, two DPMS and Bushmaster AR’s an AK47, a Steel Storm and Steel Force and M712 Mauser Broom Handle and the topper, an Evanix Speed PCP. Forgot my converted M1 Carbine.
Kinda been there and done that already so it’s not like I’m going to be totally thrilled, but this is another type, and it will be interesting to see how that big bolt reacts or if it’s just a replica part that is bypassed in operation after initial cocking? It looks too big to be part of any blowback system.
In the 50’s with a chance of ‘sunlight’ and possible rain tomorrow 🙁
I’m not going through all the BB offerings, just a test run
Tom,
I just realized that the Diana Oktoberfest will be shooting for accuracy with a handicap because getting the right ammunition for it is difficult compared to the Daisy 499 which has Avanti Precision shot specially made for it.
Siraniko
Siraniko,
I’ll find a way.
BB
Finally shot it. Boy that bolt is a slammer and very noticeable. I did not hear the CO2 puncture and decided to check it out by dry firing, No BB’s … Nothing, Then I realized it has a follower in the Mag that prevents firing without any ammo left.
Then I noticed I have a torn seal on and around the magazine valve. Fortunately, I ordered an extra mag.
3 0r 4 threads holding the CO2 seating cap on when it exhausts the gas so it will not go flying out when you back off a pressurized co2 cavity, slowly. Verified that with the new mag first. did not want to empty an entire CO2 cartridge with dry fire. or a leaking seal.
The bolt stops forward motion when cocked when it’s even with the rear of the magazine. Pulling the trigger allows it to move forward around an inch or so then it is blown back to reset. It feels like there is some bouncing. Thought I had a double tap actually. Works dust cover open or closed.
The sun was setting, and I could not see the BB’s flying out. Too fast? Aimed at the ground and started digging a hole with them. A bit more powerful than your average BB gun. Did not set up my Chronograph or empty the mag for shot count. By the way the BBs are not single stacked in the mag and shaking it will help them line up better. More BBs to the inch.
Everything was there on firing, noise and kick and the rate of fire did not seem insane, just right. Everything you ever wanted in a select fire BB Sub-Machine Gun, only more. Fantastic replica !
Bob M,
No FAIR!!!
“This is not my first full auto bb gun, have a dozen or so including two MP40’s, two Uzi’s, a few M92 Berettas, two DPMS and Bushmaster AR’s an AK47, a Steel Storm and Steel Force and M712 Mauser Broom Handle and the topper, an Evanix Speed PCP. Forgot my converted M1 Carbine.
Kinda been there and done that already so it’s not like I’m going to be totally thrilled, but this is another type, and it will be interesting to see how that big bolt reacts or if it’s just a replica part that is bypassed in operation after initial cocking? It looks too big to be part of any blowback system.”
ENABLER!
“Boy that bolt is a slammer and very noticeable.”
More ENABLING!
“Too fast? Aimed at the ground and started digging a hole with them. A bit more powerful than your average BB gun.”
smh!
How could you!
shootski
shootski, I see it differently:
. . . for me the opening of the dustcover to take the safety off is a character defining act to prepare for shooting.
What about cocking of the bolt via a finger sized depression in it?
However, it appears that this is a convincing lookalike of similar weight.
Besides, I wonder if it’s as ammunition fussy as Umarex’s MP40, ie will it take low-ricochet type balls like frangibles or lead?
I am yet to be enabled. 🙂
hihihi,
My dear friend, please be so kind to note that at NO point did I write that I had BEEN enabled! Instead I called Bob M an Enabler and accused him of BEING an Enabler and told him unfair in no uncertain terms!
I even used the Texters “smh” to express my “DISGUST” with his BLATANT attempt!
Lol! Pretty hard to enable most of us regulars after the Great Enabler has dulled our senses with his constant enabling!
I am also yet to be enabled! LOL!
Light a candle for me please.
shootski
shootski, having invoked the ‘magic word’, I grant your wish… 🙂
hihihi
Are you talking about a real M3 or this BB gun?
The safety is on the bottom of the receiver just forward of the trigger guard. White dot SAFE, one red dot SEMI, two red dots FULL-AUTO. I believe it only controls the trigger mechanism. The bolt does cock the internal hammer. and is not a totally solid item. It’s hollowed out and slice off some. Easier to move at first then tightens up.
Bob M, I was talking about both the real and the lookalike, by way of comparison.
Because I am not aware of another gun with a dustcover for a safety, I consider that this feature defines the gun’s character and worthy of replicating. Likewise the act of shoving one’s finger inside, if and when the mechanism wants to be racked. 🙂
Shootski
My driveway is just hard sand when it dries. Easy for the BBs to chip away on full auto and kind of dramatic when you swing the gun while firing. Puffs of dirt jumping into the air.
This is a real keeper and may be on the edge of “Backyard friendly”
I was ready to join the cast of ‘COMBAT’ 🙂
BB
**WARNING** INSTALLING & REMOVING the MAGAZINE
I found a large chunk of the magazine air valve seal missing at the top of the mag.
After inspecting the mag well for any possible cause. I discovered that the “Firing Pin” will protrude into the mag well and interfere with that seal, which it probably did, when you pull the trigger, hold and slowly allow the bolt to go all the way forward.
I did that to release spring tension on the bolt and firing mechanism (Decoking sort of speaking) Seems to act like an open bolt operation and at some point, I either removed or installed the magazine and probably destroyed that seal. I do not recall reading anything in the instruction book about it. Perhaps they did not count on anybody doing that when storing it.
MY STRONG ADVICE … MAKE SURE THE GUN IS ON SAFE, OF COURSE, COCKED AND THE BOLT IS NOT ALL THE WAY FORWARD BEFOR YOU INSTALL OR REMOVE THE MAGAZINE. THERE SHOULD BE ABOUT 3/4″ SPACE BETWEEN THE BOLT AND THE FORWARD EDGE OF THE EJECTION PORT OPENING, FORWARD EDGE.
THIS IS THE NORMAL COCKED POSITION OF THE BOLT BEFORE FIRING AND MAY ACTUALLY BE THE NORMAL STOWED POSITION.
IT TRAVELS BACK FURTHER BUT STOPS AT THAT POINT GOING FORWARD. … or … JUST LOOK INTO THE MAG WELL AND VERIFY THE BLACK FIRING PIN IS NOT PROTRUDING OUT INTO THE MAG WELL PATH FOR INSERTION.
Live and learn. I DID FEEL SOME RESISTANCE TRYING TO INSERT THE MAG ONE TIME AND GAVE IT A LITTLE PUSH WITH MY PALM TILL IT CLICKED. Probably should not have done that.
Just dawned on me. How does the bolt get blown back?
I believe the seal on the back of the Magazine that I may have destroyed is not really an ‘o’ ring. The center is open to expose the air valve beneath it.
I’ll bet that it is a seal that contains or seals off blow back gas from the mag valve that pushes back on the firing pin to recock the firing mechanism and it probably pushes the bolt back with it.
Why else would it be there. It’s not a breach seal. That’s part of the receiver that the straw barrel sits in.
Perhaps someone listened when I asked why they could not use blowback gas like a real firearm for semi / full auto operation. Hollow bolts? (SAM) and small piston pins here replaced the cartridge case and gas return pathways to the bolt face. They are getting good!
I believe one or more of the Hatsans bleeds air off the inner barrel allowing it to enter the space between it and the outer barrel allowing it to push on a disk surrounding the inner barrel that has linkage to reset the trigger for semi-auto and possibly full.
Wondered what that loose plate was in my Barrage.
SMG Carry Case
Received the Uncle Mike’s Sub Machine soft carry case with 6 mag pockets for this M3. P/N 52101. 24″x 13″
Not made for the grease gun but an MP5. It fits fine; however, you can fit it in with the mag attached, or the stock attached, but not both. The mag is too far forward and moves into the tapered section of the case when the stock is still installed. But that’s what the mag pouches as for. There are no retaining straps inside and the zipper does not go all the way around. It’s more like a pocket case, but the price was under $30.