by Tom Gaylord, a.k.a. B.B. Pelletier
R.A.I. Adjustable AR Adapter for Crosman 2240 pistols: Part 1
R.A.I. Adjustable AR Adapter for Crosman 2240 pistols: Part 2
This report covers:
• What this is
• Thanks to Rick Eutsler
• Step-by-step instructions
• How hard is it?
Today, I’m starting a fresh and different look at the Crosman 2240 air pistol. You may have noticed that I linked to the R.A.I. adjustable shoulder stock adapter at the beginning of the report. That’s because my plan is to convert the 2240 to operate on high-pressure air and test it again as a small PCP carbine. And, I might add, not only is it small, it’s also affordable if done in stages.
WARNING: This conversion changes the operation of the pistol to use air at up to three times the pressure it was designed for. The parts that are installed are strong, but there are other parts in the gun that aren’t changed and could fail when subjected to the higher pressures. Pyramyd Air advises against making such a conversion. This report is for information, only.
What this is
What we are looking at today is a device that is so simple, yet apparently effective that many will slap their foreheads and wonder why they didn’t think of it themselves. It’s a drop-in device that changes the operation of a 2240 pistol from CO2 to air. It appears very simple, but there’s some disassembly and parts-swapping involved, so that’s what I’m going to show you today.
What’s happening is that you’re dropping a high-pressure air cartridge into the space where a CO2 cartridge would normally go. And if that was all there was to it, we would be done. Just remove the CO2 cap, remove the empty cartridge, slide the unit in and screw it tight against the face seal. But there’s the rub. The face seal in a 2240 is not designed for high-pressure air. So, we have to substitute a different face seal, and that’s where the disassembly comes in.
Thanks to Rick Eutsler
This conversion was suggested to me by Rick Eutsler, who appears with me on American Airgunner. He thinks a lot of it and wondered if I’d tried it, yet. No, I hadn’t. So he sent me a device. The device is made and sold by PowerMax-HiPAC.com. This one I am testing sells for $65, according to their website, but there are many other configurations and accessories available. I’ll focus on just this one for now, and we’ll see where it takes us.
Before starting the conversion, I removed the CO2 cartridge. Then, I removed the UTG 6-Position Mil-Spec Stock Assembly and the R.A.I. adapter that connects it to the pistol. The gun was now in its factory configuration, and the conversion could begin.
The R.A.I. adapter and UTG adjustable stock were removed from the 2240.
The air tank (bottom) goes into the 2240, replacing the CO2 cartridge and end cap. The tank is threaded just like the end cap. The face seal inside the gun must also be changed, so disassembly is necessary.
What follows is a step-by-step disassembly and replacement of the face seal. The work is easy, but some of the parts are small — and you have to exercise caution to keep from losing them. Note that I did my work on a dark wool blanket. The wool keeps parts from moving, and the dark color allows me to use flash photography without the dark parts appearing black. If a white background were used, that’s what would happen.
Step 1. Remove front sight
The front sight is knocked off with a wood block and rubber hammer. The sight isn’t attached by fasteners, so it comes off with a light tap.
A wood block was placed against the rear base of the front sight and tapped with a rubber hammer to remove the sight.
Step 2. Remove barrel band
The barrel band is held by Allen screws, top and bottom. Loosen both, and the band slides off the gun.
Loosen the screws of the barrel band and slide it off.
Step 3. Remove rear sight
The rear sight is held by a single screw that’s one of two holding the end cap to the action. Take it off, and the end cap is almost ready to come off the gun.
Remove the rear sight by removing one screw.
Step 4. Remove grips (optional)
The grips come off next. This step isn’t necessary; but if you want to see all the working parts inside the grip, you can do it.
Each grip panel is held on by a single screw. There isn’t a lot to see.
Step 5. Remove end cap
Remove the rear grip frame screw, and the end cap will come off the gun. There’s a powerful spring pushing against the cap, so contain it as you remove this screw or the end cap will go flying.
When the rear grip frame screw is removed, the end cap and mainspring are free. Contain the end cap or it’ll go flying.
Step 6. Remove grip frame
Now the front grip frame screw is removed, and you can separate the frame from the action tube. Be very careful in this step not to lose the tiny spring and ball detent for the safety — it rests in the left side of the grip frame.
Remove the front grip frame screw and lower the frame from the action tube. Be careful not to lose the safety spring and ball detent that are in the grip frame.
The safety spring and detent ball are very small. They are not under tension when the grip frame comes off; but if you turn the frame upside-down, they’ll fall out.
Step 7. Remove receiver from tube
At this point, just a single screw holds the receiver and barrel to the action tube. That screw is located in the pellet trough and is very small (I believe it’s an .050, but it may be larger). Unscrew this screw, and the receiver and barrel can be separated from the tube.
Remove this screw, and the action and barrel lift off the tube.
At this point, you can remove the barrel from the action. It isn’t required; but if you do, you’ll see where the transfer port fits in the bottom of the barrel.
If you slide the barrel from the receiver, you can see the machined spot where the transfer port fits.
Step 7. Remove gas transfer port
After the barrel is off the tube, the steel transfer port will be exposed. It usually stays with the tube, but nothing holds it except the seal in the valve. This small part is how the compressed gas (or air, when we convert the pistol) moves from the valve into the barrel to push the pellet. So, it’s very important.
The steel transfer port usually stays with the tube when the barrel’s removed. If not, don’t lose it.
The transfer port has two lengths to it — a long side and a short side. The short side fits into the seal in the valve that’s still in the tube, while the long side goes into the underside of the barrel.
The short side of the transfer port goes into the tube and into the seal in the valve. The long side goes in the bottom of the barrel.
The transfer port seal is shown here. You see the brass valve body under it.
Step 8. Remove striker
Next, remove the striker — or what many call the hammer. It’s held in place by a small pin that must be lifted out, then the striker will come out the rear of the tube. This pin connects the bolt to the striker and is how the gun is cocked.
To remove the striker, first remove the striker pin. There’s an enlarged hole at the rear of the cocking slot through which the pin is lifted out.
Once the striker pin is out, the striker slides out the rear of the tube.
Step 9. Remove valve screw and valve body
Remove the screw holding the valve body in the tube. When it’s out, the valve will slide out the rear of the tube. I pressed it lightly with the barrel to start it, but some valves may take a little coaxing depending on how long they’ve been in the gun — but it isn’t difficult to remove this part.
The valve body slides out the rear of the tube.
Step 10. Exchange the face seals
Now we come to the place where the face seals are exchanged. The light-colored seal is for CO2 cartridges and is too soft for the air pressure we’ll be using. It must be pried out of the end of the valve, and the black seal that’s supplied with the air conversion kit should be installed in its place. Getting the new seal in is much like buttoning a shirt collar with small buttons. The new black seal will also work with CO2; so if you want to convert back, you can skip this teardown and just remove the air tank.
Here’s how the face seal looks before you pry it from the valve body.
Here’s the factory face seal (lighter one on left) and the new seal to be installed. Notice that continual use has made a groove in the factory face seal.
How hard is it?
It took me a total of 20 minutes to disassemble the pistol, and that includes taking the pictures seen here. It isn’t hard, but there are places where caution should be exercised.
Assembly is the reverse of disassembly, and there are no special tips. Just make certain that the bolt will engage the striker pin when you assemble the action, and make sure all the seals are properly seated.
That’s it for now. Next time, I’ll put air into the pistol and chronograph the results.
208 thoughts on “Crosman 2240 conversion to air: Part 1”
This is right up my alley.
I can’t count how many times I had a work bench full of those parts setting in front of me.
And I was going to post a picture of a gun I put together for my girls to learn to shoot with but just never did post it.The gun is about 9 years old now. Its made from a 1377 though. I will post it when I get home tonight from work.
Here is that 1377 I was talking about. I said wrong about how old it is. Its probably going on 6 years old. But it has a Disco stock cut in half to make the pump handle. I had to router it out to make the pump handle bolt up to the pump arm. And I cut some of the butt stock off to shorten the length of pull for my daughters. And it has a Disco trigger and steel breech. I forgot what barrel I used. And its got a Tasco red dot on it. Its a good shooting little gun.
Yes I know the picture quality is junk. Its from my phone. I really need to invest in a little digital camera. Does any body know of a good little camera that can be used to down load photo’s if I’m saying that right.
Canon Power Shot Elph 300HS. We needed a small camera at work for taking photos of equipment at work and our resident shutterbug picked one up for us. I used it one time and went and bought one for myself.
Thanks I will check it out.
I’d second the Canon Elph. I have the 300hs, but the whole series are excellent because they have good color, are good at low light-relative to other cameras of this size, and shoot wide angle shots well. I paid quite a bit for mine new, but I’ve seen them regularly used for much less. I think most small ‘cheaper’ cameras will do a decent job for you nowadays, but the Canon is better than most, and I’d rather have a used one than a more expensive other brand.
That is a great looking carbine. I wish I had your bench skills and willingness. I would have been afraid of messing up the crosman and the stock!
Thanks about the camera and about the gun.
My girls were learning to shoot and all I had was a 760 and a 1077 at the time and I cut the butt of the stock off of them about 3 or so inch’s but they were still too long and heavy for them. So that’s how the little gun came about in the pictures. Its light, easy to pump for some reason (I think the bigger wood pump handle helped) and its small. Its only 26” long from the tip of the barrel to the end of the butt.
The whole reason I made it because I really didn’t see a youth gun out there at the time that would work for them.
Back when I was considering going with a Backpacker,I started to ask if anyone had done the pumper to co2 conversion but thought it would be too much work. This makes it look more doable
I don’t know if I’m following you. If your talking about the pictures of the gun I made with the Disco stock its still a pumper.
If the pump-tube will fit in place of the co2 tube, then the opposite must be possible too. Pull the pump-tube & replace with the co2 assembly.
I see what you mean now. You mean like taking a barrel and breech that you have on a 1377 or 1322 and putting a tube from a 2240 on it.
The thing about that though the 1377 and 1322 use a smaller diameter tube. If you got the bigger diameter 2240 tube you would also need to get the bigger diameter striker that fits that tube if you didn’t already have the 2240 assembly.
And remember you have to have the 2240 type tube because it has the right spacing and threaded end for the PowerMax adapter to work correct. Its basically a Co2 cartridge with a tube reservoir made with it and a Foster fill fitting.
If your thinking something like putting the PowerMax on a 760 that would turn into a big deal.
It is doable, but other than “because I want to”, it is not worth doing.
Reb, I’m sure it can be done. My Daisy 990 rifle is a “dual fuel. A pumper that can also use co2. I know it’s a cheap gun, but I like it due to the metal receiver and unique pump/co2 use. Bradly
I am looking forward to seeing your results. I have read about this conversion and have considered it for my 2300T. If you have very good results I may try it myself. I hope that you have good success and are impressed by the results.
Did your 2300T come with a steel breech?
Here is the 2300T. Yep steel breech.
You can get a 2240 and buy a steel breech from PA and then get a 2300S barrel from Crosman cheeper.
And here is Crosmans 2300S part number for that barrel. 2300-001 and 2300-002 is for the 2300S which is a match barrel and they are .177 cal. And the barrels are around $30 or so the last time I bought one. But its been a while.
And here is the Discovery barrel part number which is 24″ long. 1760SE-001. That’s the barrel I use on the 1377/1322 and 2240’s.
I have a .177 Disco barrel that is cut down to 15” and recrowned if you want it when you decide to build you one of these guns. It will fit in the steel breech that I gave the part number to above. Just get me your address some kind of way and I will mail it to you. Shouldn’t be that much to get it to Texas from Illinois. The only thing the barrel isn’t blued no more it has been polished to the metal. So it almost looks chrome. But let me know. And then you wont have to buy a barrel. You can just get the steel breech and the 2240 and I guess whatever stock you want.
One downside to that build is I am quite certain the 2300’s have a much better trigger, however with a little tinkering you can probably improve the one on the 2240 to where it would be acceptable.
The trigger grip assembly to get is one from a 1720T or a Marauder pistol. They are a true 2 stage trigger with a set screw for each stage. Plus trigger travel stop set screw also. And the spring pressure is adjustable similar to the setup they use for a 2300S.
The 2300s has the trigger stop adjustment but still has the same sear like the 1377/1322 and 2240 but it does have the adjustable spring pressure.
I have cut a coil or so off of that bigger diameter spring that is positioned vertically in the grip on the1377/1322 and 2240’s and it gives a little better trigger feel than the stock spring. But you have to watch because if you get it to short the sear wont engage and the the safety selector could push out.
OK, I’ll just forget all about this happiness and buy a Marauder Pistol.
Seriously though, I do not see me building anything along these lines unless I pick up something at a yard sale. Then I can see me tinkering with it.
Hurry up and find you a yard sale. 😉
Got questions for you. When you put a longer barrel on, does it come with the barrel cover? I would love to put a Discovery or other longer barrel on my 2289 backpacker or 1377, but I don’t know how difficult it is to change out the barrel…and I don’t know what covers it.
I don’t know what cover you are talking about. Do you mean a shroud? If that’s what you mean these type of barrels for these guns didn’t have a shroud and they are not covered. The barrel sets directly over the main air tube just like a Discovery.
The Discovery has no cover over the barrel but it does have a little piece that slips over the barrel that stops at the breech for the open sites to be mounted on the Disco. Is that what you mean.
And the barrels are very simple to change out. If you look in BB’s pictures above there is a screw in the back of the breech, then one by the bolt. and the band clamp. Then the barrel and breech lift right off. The difference with the pump guns the hole will have to be opened up in the plastic piece were the front sight is because that’s where the 1377/1322 barrel stops.
Or you could order this plastic piece from Crosman and you don’t have to drill out the original piece if you want to keep it for the stock barrel. But this piece is from a 760. Here is that number.
They call it the front guide 760D008 and here is the screw that goes with it also 781A012.
Thanks Gunfun. No, I didn’t know if it was called a shroud or not. I thought all shrouds were for quieting or as cocking aids, bit I thought all barrels were thin tubing covered by another tube…the external part of the barrel that protects the inner barrel. So, you are saying the discovery comes with the inner barrel and outer barrel cover, or that it doesn’t come with any outer barrel covering…it doesn’t need one? Sorry for my naive questions and thanks for the info.
No problem. Its a solid barrel and no covering or shroud.
Gunfun is right about the front barrel guide for a 760 would work better than modifying the stock one from a 1377 or 1322 because the front guide on the 77/22 are to thin when you would enlarge the hole for a longer barrel to pass thru it and would most likely break, plus there is no screw to allow you to secure the barrel in the front guide it would just free float and could affect accuracy.
The best solution which is what I have done on my 2289 backpacker was to look on e bay for a front barrel guide from an older metal front guide from a 760. You can find them on there from time to time and I actually have one of the metal guide on my 2289 and my g-kids new model 760. it is way stronger than the plastic one and secures the barrel much better.
Huh. Well, I’ll have to look for one of the 760 barrel guides then. I’ve got a 760 (that a friends gave me because he couldn’t shoot it straight, but it does ok for what it is), but it’s one of the newer plastic ones.
Thanks for the help. I would love to se pics of your converted 2289 if you have them posted somewhere.
I will get some took and try to post them, here. I much prefer the metal to the plastic due them being stronger. they only have the one set screw on the top but I just drill and tap a hole 180 degrees from the top one to secure barrel top and bottom.
I would gladly give you some pics of my 2289, but I do not know how to attach the pics into this blog. if you can tell me how or maybe Edith can I will post some for you. I tried to attach them but could not figure it out.
You cannot attache pics to your blog comment. However, you can post a link to pictures you post on another site. Create a free account on photobucket.com.
Here you go with some pics of my 2289
Hope you get these photos
Let me know so I know they were sent right
Your photo links did not show up on the blog, but they did come to my email.
That pistol/carbine/rifle looks great! Fantabulous. That’s a Discovery barrel, you say? Or just a longer Crosman barrel? And is that just a weight on the end or a silencer? What other mods did you make, if any? How does it shoot? Did it improve in performance? How loud is it?
Thanks for the compliment, I spent a lot of time and money to get it there. Yes that is a discovery barrel shortened to 18 inches and crowned, it is just a barrel weight to help balance the gun with the longer barrel.
The loudness depends on how many times you pump it up, it can go to 25 pumps if you have ate your Wheaties which makes it quite loud and produces around 1000 fps. I have put a steel breech on it with the longer disco barrel, flow thru hollow bolt probe, opened up the barrel and transfer port in the valve to 3/16 “, replaced the transfer bushing and seal with refrigerator ice maker tubing that is 3/16″ ID and cut about .050″longer than the port bushing and seal height. I also had the seat in the valve and barrel spot face to .250” in dia which is the same as the tubing OD and by spot facing the seats a little deeper than stock it give a very secure containment of the tubing between the barrel and valve. It has an adjustable hammer spring seat, polished trigger, sear and hammer components. It also has a flat top piston and valve that I have opened up the inside of the valve to hold about 30 % more air with a light valve spring that allows for a full dump of all the air in the valve at any number of pumps, you have to cock the gun to get it to pump up without it being cocked it just burps the air right out the port because the hammer is holding the valve open until cocked. It is a tack driver that is for sure with the Bushnell 4×32 scope on it
I am going to be replacing the aluminum valve with a brass valve that has not been hogged out as much so you wont have to pump as many time to get the fps up, right now at 10 pumps it only shoots 590 fps and after the valve change it should be around 800 at 10 pumps and 1000 at fifteen. There is always something that it needs done to it, a never ending project just like my other pellet guns also.
Yes, the 2300T came with a steel breech.
Now, this is a very interesting article (not that they all aren’t!). Can’t wait to see how it ends!!
I was hoping the need to rechange seals was nonexistent.I have been studying this conversion process since your first installment of this series.I came up with this question the other day.Does the 2400KT come with a steel breech or the standard plastic one?
Read the reply I left you above. And yes the 2400KT does have a steel breech also.
Thanks! While playing around in the custom shop, I noticed that they mount the scope directly on the breech instead of using an intermount setup. Just checkin’!
Thank you for this walkthrough of the HPA conversion of the 2240! If I ever do get some money to work with, this, or a very similar pistol, will be my next airgun purchase I’ve also got my eye on one of those Hawke SWAT scopes
What a good idea changing the propellant, looks like you’ll have quite a few more shots with that nifty little air tank, what would that little tank normally serve for? Besides that a crash course on the 2240 is cool to see because I can really see how sturdy the guns parts look and that was a big question I’ve had all the times I thought I might want one. Now I do want one. The customizable factor is right up this born tinkerins alley, and here’s just another example of what can be done. Anybody got chrony numbers from a 12″ barreled version on hand?
Remember this pneumatic not spring-powered,I’m going with 18″. What a beautiful step toward PCP ownership! Dual Fuel style…
I messed with too many of these guns. The 1322/1377 and 2240 style guns and from what I have found as the barrel got longer the velocity went up and tended to get better on accuracy and they got quieter even. The shortest barrel that I like is the 15” cut down Disco barrel in .177 that I was talking to Reb about. But I like the full length Disco barrels the best. They are 24”.
from what I’ve read, one inch = roughly 100fps on these guns.
RDNA,Rick was getting 500fps with a 10″ barrel;+2″=700fps with 12″,results may vary. From what B.B. said, it looks like anything over 14.5″ starts creating drag
Let me be specific. Rick Eutsler said that with the stock 2240 valve and the stock 2240 striker spring, they 14.5-inch barrel is best. If you change anything, that may change.
Rick Eutsler who sent this kit to me told me that the 14.5-inch barrel is the optimum length. That agrees with my own testing over the years.
After I test this setup it is my plan to get the longer barrel and perhaps a steel breech and continue to experiment.
You need to do the experiment with the longer barrels. I think you will like what you find.
Anecdotally speaking, when I was on bulk fill co2, I think my 24″ barrel was in the realm of diminished returns (best energy was around 12fpe). However, once I got my Benjamin hand pump, it really came alive! Based on reports of other setups that were similar, but with shorter barrels (making less energy), I’d have to say “test it with a longer barrel…”. BTW, my highest fpe average was with Beeman Kodiaks with both fuels.
BTW, BB… thank you for your incredible devotion to this blog!
My first “adult” aigun purchase was a 1377c and the first thing I noticed was how solidly built it was The second thing I noticed was that the peep sight was useless at arms’ length.I’m learning more all the time about these guns and I’ll be getting another one just as soon as I can to whichI can apply my new knowledge.
I was wondering if you have heard of the modification for the transfer port by using refrigerator ice maker line tubing in place of the rubber seal and steel transfer port. I use that plastic tubing on my 2289 conversion with steel breach and 18 inch barrel and also on my 1400 for the transfer port seal between old action tube/valve and new style steel breach/disco 24 inch barrel. The Id of the tubing is 3/16 in dia which is about 1/32 inch larger in dia than the steel transfer port and rubber seal and the outside is the same 1/4 inch dia as the rubber transfer seal so it fits in place of the two pieces perfectly . I slide the tubing on the smooth end of a 3/16 drill bit and use a tubing cutter to get a clean straight cut and make it about .050 inches longer than the transfer port seal and bushings length combined. I have had no seal leaks or blow out issues even when pumping either gun to 20 pumps. That should give you a slight increase in flow to get full potential out of the PCP conversion. You can get it at any hardware store for 20 cents a foot.
Just a thought to maximize the full potential of the PCP mod you are performing.
You mentioned that to me a little while back. I haven’t tryed it yet but I will.
Yes I did and it is very easy and well worth the work to install the tubing for a seal because it takes away the restriction in the transfer port area.
Did you get my blog back to you in the BSA scorpion SE review about it being your fault that I ordered some more pellets and the Hawke scope for my Hatsan LOL. I bit the pellet and ordered the scope and four tins of pellets to test in the Hatsan while the sale is still going on so I can mount the Hawke to Hatsan and put the 10×40/50mm on my AR.
I must of missed that. But glad you ordered that scope and well the pellets also. I think you will be most happy with that scope.
When you get the scope let me know what you think of it. If something comes up with it give me a holler. But I think you will be happy.
No, I haven’t heard of that modification. Thanks.
As long as you have the 2240 all apart I would use the fridge tubing for the transfer port seal as going to HPA it will let you get the full potential out of the conversion.
I will consider it.
I have a question that you may be able to answer. IS the CO2 valves in the pistols held in the same way as the 2289 pumper with the front trigger frame screw. If so would just installing a CO2 valve in place of the pumper valve allow for the conversion to be made to a 2289, I have a 2289 with a 18 inch barrel and steel breach already and it would be cool to be able to convert it to HAP. I know the pumper tube has the slot for the the pump arm but with the HAP cylinder being a self contained unit it looks like it would work with a CO2 valve in place of the pumper valve.
Are the tube the same DOA as well as the valves. I also have an end plug that allows for adjustment of the hammer spring tension installed as well.
Just wanting to know if it would be possible.
I haven’t got a clue. You need someone who modifies Crosman pistols to answer this.
The 2289 looks like it has the smaller main tube like the 1377 and 1322. So that valve wont work in a 2240. And remember this PowerMax adapter/reservoir has to screw into the main tube were the Co2 cartridge would go. Basically it is the Co2 cartridge and cap,
It would probably be easier to get a 2240 and put your barrel and breech on the 2240 and then get a PowerMax system. But remember the 2289 has the plastic breech with the brass bolt. So to scope the gun or to put some type of sight on the gun you would need to order the steel breech from PA or Crosman so you have the dovetail grooves.
And if the end cap is for the 2289 it wont work on the 2240 tube. You will need the 2300S adjustable end cap to work on on the 2240 tube. Here is that part number 2300-124 and this part number will work for the Discovery’s also if somebody wants to make them adjustable.
I’m running out of time right now. Got to get ready for work. But I will try to post a picture tonight when I get home of my 2240 with the steel breech, Bushnell scope, 1399 stock (I have a RAI adapter and AR stock that is going on this gun also but is not on yet). Also this is the gun I turned down that .177 cal. 60c barrel for.
Next step is order the PowerMax reservoir for the 2240. This has got me excited again. And also now I have something in mind for the 60 I have and other guns that I have been looking at. I got to think about it some more though and check into some things. This PowerMax could be a big game changer for me.
My 2289 already has the steel breach and a 18 inch disco barrel on it, so my best option would be to buy a 2240 for the tube and valve parts and just swap my breach and barrel to the 2240 and then get the power max cylinder to fit my 18 inch barrel.
I agree with you on the barrel length adding fps because my 2289 with the 18 inch barrel shoots at 850 fps on 15 pumps, I have modified the pumper valve for more air volume and went to a lighter spring to allow full dump at up to 25 pumps, added an adjustable hammer spring end plug and tuned the trigger to be very light and crisp, it also has a hollow bolt probe with the port in the valve and barrel opened up to 3/16″ to use the ice maker tubing so there is no restrictions in the air flow. I also have a metal front barrel guide with 2 set screws securing the barrel from top and bottom in the guide. so yes a longer barrel will help with fps if other mods are also done to move more air smother.
Making a PCP from a 2240 and my 2289 is definitely going to be a project for down the road. Thanks for all the info on what it will take to make the swap.
Eagerly waiting for my fill fitting, scopes and pellets to test and sight with on my Hatsan. I will let you know how it all turns out.
I forgot to tell you to let me know your thoughts on what you have in mind for the 60 valve when you finalize them.
Keep this in mind about your trick using the tubing to replace the orifice.
With a pump gun you want that hole in the orifice big so it can dump all the air rapidly. Your not worried about shot count.
But on a pcp style gun or even a Co2 gun where you have multiple shots to make with your air supply you have to balance the hole size in the orifice between shot count and the power or I should say the velocity you want the gun to make.
So that big hole in the transferport orifice can actualy hurt you on a pcp gun. That is what that side setscrew does that is positioned half way in the stock on the Marauder rifles. That is part of why the Marauders can be tuned sucsesfully so many different ways.
I found a site to get a moderator for the Hatsan for 46 bucks and it is on its way. Check it out.
http://www.wolfairguns.com/ They have them for the 60s also.
That’s what I like about you and this site is that more heads are better than one. I did not think about it like that, but you are correct and I always wondered how the marauders adjusted their power levels so easily. Now you got my mind in overdrive again and that’s good because they say if you don’t keep your mind active you will lose it, I’m still looking for mine.
I checked tracking on my scopes and pellets and they both show to be here Saturday. The fill fitting just got shipped today and does not show a delivery date yet and my luck it won’t get here till Monday.
Hope its Saturday.
Got busy at work tonight. Couldn’t respond.
Bummer about the fitting. But the scope and pellets are on the way you say. Well you can still play with the scope holding it in your hand and see how it works when you get it.
And I just ordered my PowerMax tube tonight. Says it should take 3 days to get. Now I can’t wait for that to get here. But I will talk to you later.
Just checked tracking on my fitting and it is showing wed the 9 for delivery, it was ordered sat by phone but the people there dropped the ball and did not get it sent out till yesterday.
You need to read Andre’s blog at the bottom of this thread, he says the powermax assy have been known to blow out at psi levels above 1000 psi. just food for thought.
Going to leave a comment below about the it blowing out.
read my conversation withGF1.It looks like the entire 2240 co2 tube would be necessary in order to mount the Hipac to it’s threads
There was a lot of good info being exchanged between you and Gunfun. I already have a 2289 that is highly modified so for me it would be cheaper to buy a 2240 and just swap parts around. Read the reply above yours here to me that I left for Gunfun about the mods to my 2289. I am definitely going to be on the look out for a cheap 2240 or one of the other 22 cal series of CO2 pistols to do the conversion with for sure.
You’d be surprised how many Crosman Co2 guns all your Backpacker’s goodies will fit right on!
You take the best close-up pictures. They really make an article like this outstanding.
That was my first thought too. Great pictures!
As far as the conversion goes, I think I would be better off selling a 2240 and buying one of the Crosman PCP pistols. But, unlike me, there are a lot of guys that like to tinker with their guns and just see what they can do or make.
I too would prefer to buy something like the Marauder pistol instead of one of these other pistols, but If I was to end up with one of these, it is nice to know I can convert it to air.
Are you aware there is a repeating conversion for the 2240? Rick Eutsler used to build them.
B.B. Is this accomplished by using a Marauder repeating breech& mag? I started toying with this concept back when GF1 was talking about mounting Disco breeches on these guns.Auto-indexing or manual?
I don’t know. Rick Eutsler was the one who did it. It may have been an aftermarket part.
That is interesting, but the truth is I will probably not buy either unless I stumble on one that I cannot walk away from. It has happened before. Remember that Tempest I had? Right now I have TWO FWB300S’s.
If I stumble onto one of these things, I will start tinkering. I was holding a 2300S earlier today. Nice.
That’s my next project. Those kits include a nice shrouded barrel that is a bit less “dicey” than the tko muzzle brake that I removed from my gun (after reading BB’s take on them).
If you got a 2240 that you would sell cheap I would be interested in buying it to do the conversion with, they are 60 bucks on the PA site so if you do and /or will shoot me a price and I will let you know if I would be interested.
I should say thanks to you BB and Rick for telling about this little system for the 2240.
I will be ordering one for my 2240 with the steel breech and that 60c .177 cal. barrel that I turned down to fit the Crosman steel breech. Cool little device that’s for sure.
And its already got the male Foster fitting Incorporated into it. And I checked out the website. Its even modular so you can make it as long or short as you would like for the barrel you are using. Too cool. Get’n one ordered as soon as I get payed.
You can extend the reservoir 4″ at a time!
Tell Rick we said Thank You!
I second that, tell Rick thanks also.
I have never really been interested in buying one of these pistols for the simple fact that they are CO2 powered. Now I must reevaluate that decision.
Itoo shied away from co2 guns, due to inadequate power for hunting.Until I realized how close it would get me to PCP ownership.Once I got my fingers caught up during pumping a few times I knew it was time to do something different.
I’ll be getting more springers as finances allow.That Marksman 0032 is still sitting @$60. but the gun I have in my cart for under $100 is where my next airgun funds are going.
I have messed with CO2 before. There are too many drawbacks to it for my liking. I might pick up one more PCP and I am planning on a sproinger. I would not mind finding the right pistol, but this ain’t it.
OK, now I am really confused. I checked out the 2300 series pistols on PA and the description and specs say the trigger is single stage but the pull is adjustable. I guess that is possible, but I have never encounter such before.
As far as this conversion is concerned, if I was to acquire one of the 2300 pistols this would be a definite way to go.
The 2300 series pistol has a threaded brass plug that can be adjusted to increase or decrease the tension on the sear spring. Unfortunately the sear is a die cut piece that is unfinished, so decreasing the tension still leaves a creepy rough trigger pull. You can take the side cover off, remove the sear and trigger and polish the bearing surfaces on these parts to improve it some.
I kind of figured that was the case and I am sure a polish job would have to be done. I have pulled the trigger on a 2300T that a guy with the local 4H shooting team has and I must say that it was real sweet. He most likely had done just what you are saying. If this thing gives a decent shot count, I will have to let him know about it.
I have a 2289 that has basically the same trigger setup and polishing the sear to hammer surfaces and also the trigger to sear surfaces makes a world of difference in the smoothness and then playing with different trigger springs to get the right release pressure makes them into quite a good trigger for their design. you can also spend about 50 bucks and get the trigger pieces from a marauder that will fit in the frame of the pistols and have a true two stage adjustable trigger. I personally like the stock trigger enough when tuned that it is not really worth the money to convert to a two stage trigger.
I checked out the site and it is neat how you can either have it as a 2000 or 3000 PSI conversion. I am sure the shot count is much lower than with CO2, but it would not take many pump strokes to fill this thing up unless you extended it out. You really have this bunch buzzing this morning!
I can vouch for the effectiveness of this kit. I have a 24″ barrel, so I also bought three of the hipac extensions, and I get up to 30 good shots around 20fpe with only a 1900 psi fill!
Welcome to the blog and thanks for your comment. It sounds like you have made a Disco for yourself!
Thanks for the warm welcome, BB! I’ve been addicted to this blog for about 8months now. It’s a privilege to be here. I was thrilled to see today’s topic.
Well, don’t be a stranger. Now that you’re here, please join in.
The easy pump ability of the Disco is what inspired my choices, but I lucked out and got the shot count and fpe.
Thanks for the info! I was curious about the shot count and being ADHD was having a hard time waiting for tomorrow to find this out.
LOL! I get the ADHD thing (sprinkle in some OCD)…The info. is out there, but make sure you install a power adjuster and do your own R&D with a chrony. I have a stock valve, but a power spring from alliance hobby. I’ll have to resume my replies when I get home from work later, so I’m not using my phone/dodging my boss.
Tomorrow if we’re lucky!
Just as a small tip on this type of disassembly/reassembly, run over to the Dollar Store and pick up a couple of ice-cube trays to hold the highly mobile series of (truly evil) teeny springs and ball-bearings and irreplaceble pins and such. Keeps them in reassembiy order, too.
“Truly Evil” because, for some reason, your refrigerator beckons, entices, and calls to the teeny, the weeny and the irreplacable and inevitably the fridge will choose to squat directly over the fleeing ball-bearing.
You may find a collection of magnets handy to sweep over the floor (or shag carpet) as an aid to aging eyes and/or fingers not as adept as the once were.
LOL! Been there, done that!
I am tearing down a couple of FWB300S’s right now and have a bunch of small, labeled bags and photos of the disassembly to help keep track of things.
I love this article. There are other ‘tear down’ articles and videos online, of course-but few so thorough and I think none demonstrating the vocabulary. So, you doing this not only helps me learn the inside of the pistol but also teaches me the real name of each thingamajig and dodobber.
If you’re ever out of subjects, please tear down some more guns.
You practically took the words out a my mouth. Just wish B.B. would do more of these, at least for the more popular guns. I have never seen such clarity in take down info. There just isn’t enough good info on proper takedowns online. For example, I’m trying to find info on takedown on a Hatsan 1000s or at least a parts diagram to prepare me but can’t find any. So stuff like this is invaluable to me as I like to do my own gunsmithing.
Try this site for schematics and info they have a very large amount of good info.
Here is a schematics for your 1000
You have to click on the button on the upper left of the screen to change the language to English.
Thank you Sir! Much obliged. Will do.
You are welcome and I hope it helps you out. I know if I can just get a schematic I can get it took apart and fixed with the aid of the schematic.
I checked out the site & just can’t believe it. Everything I wanted is there. Thanks a MIL again. This is a DIY tuners dream, how on earth did you locate it? Would never have found it if not for you.l can tune the Hatsan now. I too can figure it out by studying the schematics for them. You guys are soo darn helpful I just can’t believe it sometimes the trouble you go through to help. God Bless you.
I stumbled across it when trying to find a schematic for a FWB 124 gun I was building for a friend. it is definitely a wealth of valuable info for sure. Glad it was what you needed and that I could help.
You put a BIG happy grin on my mug that’s going to stay there for a while. Can’t wait to find the time to tune the gun.
Let me know how it turn out when you get it done. do you have a spring compressor to get it apart with because the spring is under quite a bit of tension. You can build one with a 6 or 8 inch C clamp with the fixed end cut off, then drill a couple holes in the long side of the clamp and get a 2×6 about 3 to 4 feet long and draw a line down the center of the wood lengthwise. Position the clamp with the screw end at one end of the wood with screw turned all the way out against the clamp end, line the screw of the clamp up won the line down the center of the wood, then drill 2 holes thru the side of clamp and wood to fasten clamp to the wood ( you will probably have to space the clamp up off the wood so the clamp screw end lines up with the spring end of your gun ). Then with the barrel removed from the receiver lay it down on the wood along the line on center of wood, take 2 pieces of 1×2 or similar sized about 3 to 4 inches long and screw them to the wood on either side of the receiver to prevent it from moving sideways . Then at the barrel end of the receiver get a piece of wood that will fit in where the barrel would go and slide it in the fork of the receiver and mark on it where the barrel pivot hole is. Drill a hole thru that piece of wood to allow a bolt close to the pivot screw or pin size to be put thru the hole to secure the front of the receiver and fasten that piece of wood down on the wood centered on the line with the screw of the clamp threaded almost all the way in on the clamp so you have about 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch of thread for the clamp screw to be able to compress the spring, then compress enough to remove the pin or screw that secures the spring seat in place and slowly loosen clamp screw to get the spring out of gun safely. It a cheap easy way to make a safe spring compressor.
Thanks very much again. I do have a spring compressor of sorts but it may not be enough for the Hatsan.
I really appreciate your help here. What you have described is simple and just what I need.Will definitely be making one. Thanks for all the trouble on your part. will let you know how it works out.
Excellent report! You may want to get together with Paul Capelo and do this report again as a video for Airgun Reporter. Is there any possibility that Pyramyd Air might also make these conversion kits available on the Pyramyd Air website? I was also thinking that if the replacement black face seal for air also works for CO2, maybe Crosman should make the black face seal the default seal for the 2240 so that buyers could immediately use either CO2 or air. Have you or Rick Eutsler considered making that suggestion to Crosman?
Today’s report is a surprise to me, as well as to all of you. I didn’t anticipate this level of interest.
We will do more like this.
As for Crosman, who can say what they are thinking. I do know they are one of the few companies who sell their parts freely.
I have notified Pyramyd Air, so they will look at this, as well.
Although I may not make this conversion on my 2240, it’s good to know that it can be done. I also think there is a whole lot more of the procedure that could be presented through a video. You should seriously consider doing a video of this procedure.
I was just going to say I noticed you have the adjustable end cap from RAI on the end of your gun. You need to get his adapter and AR stock back on the gun and get testing that longer barrel.
I bet that will be a nice looking gun with a long PowerMax tube and a 24″ Discovery barrel with a steel breech the RAI adapter and AR stock. Then mount you a nice scope. I think you will be amazed at how well these guns will stretch out and hit in the accuracy department.
That is the plan.
Thats great. Can’t wait. Thanks. 🙂
Now THIS is exactly what I need for a ratty old 2240 I have been wanted to change to a pcp gun for a long time now. I was going to build a custom pcp body for it but this is so much simpler. I’m definitely going for the pcp kit. Then I’ll have reason to rebuild the old rat and make it something I’d want to shoot. I always said that crosman should have made the 2240 a light weight anti-squirrel gun. Now I can have what I desire.
I just wanted to thank you for this informative blog, and also send out a general thanks to all who conferred with Matt61 on which weapons to get for a novice. I am that novice and I’m having such a great time with the Makarov and 1377. This blog is a great resource and I’ve enjoyed scouring it for tips and tricks and of course content specific to the model weapons I’m learning on.
Welcome to the blog!
I am so glad the blog is meeting your needs. Please tell me if there is anything I can do to help you specifically with airguns or shooting.
Ah, the 2240 is the road not taken in my recommendation to my friend. Well, I’d heard that you can accessorize the 2240 just about any way you want, and now I believe it. This conversion will show if the gun’s intrinsic quality can hold up to what is expected of pcps. And who knows how my introduction will take root with my friend…
B.B. on off-topic comment…
I am researching on the Rossi FAL air rifle trainer that I mention on the Hakim post. As I mentioned, I don’t currently own one of these rifles, civilian or military, so I will be looking for one to give you guys a good review on it. What a perfect excuse for a new rifle!
What a find that would be! As I said before, I hadn’t heard of these until you mentioned them.
Thanks for the link to the HI-Pace, BB!
I was looking for one a while back and couldn’t find one… This may be a ‘must do’ mod for mine.
Do you think that the TKO silencer will still fit the stock barrel with this, or would I need to change to a longer barrel?
I no longer have a TKO silencer. That is a question for them.
Maybe your pic after its assembled will give me an idea. Changing to a longer barrel would be an option, but I’m trying to keep it an actual pistol instead of building a carbine. I don’t really have any gripes about the CO2, but it looks like a nice option. Can’t wait for part 2!
I had a TKO on mine, but after reading BB’s comprehensive analysis on the potential risks of owning one of these, I got rid of that sucker! Check out bnmcustom.com. These kits not only give you a 10 shot repeating breach, but also an integral shroud with baffles to boot!
I am not very educated on the type of air gun you are converting the 2400 into. Will it be the type you use a tank to fill, or a hand air pump?
Whether you use a tank (much more expensive) or a hand pump depends if you tune it to run at 3000psi(regulated tank plus scuba tank) or 2000psi (hand pump). I can get around 20fpe with the 2000psi fill, but I’ve seen reports of 27fpe with a 3000 psi fill.
It could be filled from either source. I’ll probably use a tank because mine is always out and ready, but I’ll probably not fill the pistol above 2000 psi, which would be easy for a pump to fill.
Perfect! I have a 2240 that was turned into a carbine with a .177 10.5 in barrel. It is a tack driver so I don’t want to mess with in any way case I screw it up. I am however looking to buy another stock one to tinker with. I have contacted an after market dealer who makes multi shot breeches. This one will be in pistol format. Your blog could not come at a better time! I have never opened a 2240 and I am looking forward to the rest of this blog.
Tell me; I’ve been reading that in this conversion from CO2 to HPA you will need to pin the valve, is there any merit in this?
I haven’t heard of pinning the valve, which I assume would make it more secure. But the valve is under no additional pressure, once it fills, so I’m not sure how pinning is needed. Rick never mentioned it and I haven’t read about it.
I plan to fill to 2000 psi only, so my pistol will be stressed as little as possible.
They usually “pin” the valve when they install a much-heavier hammer spring. They basically give it 3 screws like a Disco valve. The instructions for the hipac kit (vaguely) allude to this, when using the 3000 psi spring (no longer included in the kit).
That’s whats in my 60 c right now but got some changing around to do on it.
And as far as the valve getting moved by pressure that’s probably not going to happen because of the way the valve is designed for the cartridge or in the case of the PowerMax system. And somebody would have to have a heck of spring for the striker to move the valve also. I guess that could happen with the higher pressure fill if your hitting the valve stem hard.
So maybe that would be a good safety modification to do to the 2240 style valve. Safety first. 🙂
Since there is NO seal between the transfer port and the barrel, will air leak out?
Very perceptive. I never thought of that, and I HAVE had it apart. Come to think of it, my 1322 does weep some oil in that area between the main tube and the breach, right where the transfer port is, but I oil the heck out a the pump seal. However, my hipac 2240 doesn’t weep at all and I’ve never detected any puffs of air. I’m happy with shot count, power, and accuracy, so I think that any leaks in that area are negligible.
The transfer port metal bushing and the barrel have a chamfer machined into them that mate up when assembled and create a seal between the barrel and transfer port bushing. if there is oil seen in this area it is either being over oiled or the breach hold down screw may be loose. look closely at the pics that BB has taken in this article and you can see the chamfers.
I personally use the refrigerator ice maker plastic tubing in place of the barrel seal and metal bushing that crosman uses, it can be bought at any hardware store for about 20 cents a foot or less. take the tubing and slide it up on the smooth end of a 3/16 drill bit and use a small tubing cutter to make clean straight cuts on the tubing . Measure your barrel rubber seal and transfer port bushing height when they are put together as they would be in the gun and cut the plastic tubing about.050 inches longer or roughly 1/32 of an inch longer than the height of the seal and bushing. the tubing will compress and create a leak proof seal that I have used on highly modified 2289 and old 1400 22 cal pump guns that I have and do pump up to 20 or 25 pumps on a fairly regular basis with no leak issues. The tubing is also 1/32 of an inch larger ion diameter so it improves flow also.
If the air was contained in that area for any length of time, yes, it would leak. But all the air rushes through that joint in milliseconds, so any leaking is minimal.
What is the hardness of that black O-ring (for air)?
I don’t know, but my guess is between 70 and 90 durometer. And it isn’t an o-ring. It is a flat seal.
Again you opened up my “eyes”, thanks!
What is the Pros and Cons between using a flat seal vs. O-ring?
There isn’t a choice, here. For a flat seal, a face seal has to be used. An o-ring can’t do the same job. O-rings are used on the sides of cylinders and tube and rely on grooves in which they move when under pressure, Face seals are flat and aren’t supposed to move.
Tom, I just want you to know the powermax HIPAC is a very dangerous device. Discussion on them is even banned on some forums. They have been known to shoot out the front, and destroy the guns valve.
Please do not use them over 1000 PSI! They are safe at 1000 psi but anything over that is a real risk. I know a lot of people use them but they can be very dangerous. Please be careful.
Thank you for this warning! Rick never mentioned any danger when he sent this to me. I will look into it!
Im kind of thinking that wont happen. Well I guess it could because anything is possible.
But here is what I think. First most important think is there is no o-ring that goes on the outside of the air valve. So that means there is no air tight seal from the outside diameter of the valve to the inside diameter of the main tube. So if any air does escape from that black face seal it should just release the air around the valve and leak down. It may blow air out backwards to the striker area and release air all over the place for a bit.
And second the most likely way that will happen is if that face seal fails. There is no pressure in that area where the Co2 cartridge would normally go. If the face seal blows or leaks then that area would try to pressurize but I believe that any air there would leak around the valve and release in other places before it blew the threads out.
And that’s what I believe. And again anything could happen. But it is definitely something to keep in mind when messing with high pressure. Even if 200 or 300 psi is released abruptly it can send something flying.
And from what I seen with the Flying Dragon gun (60c) that 1500psi was a good pressure to achieve a good fps and shot count. But it has a pretty big air reservoir also. So I ordered my PowerMax last night for my 2240 with the 60c .177 cal. barrel I turned down. But I do plan to start out at a low pressure fill to see what it acts like.
I agree with you the only place for a leak to develop is at the black seal between the air cylinder and the valve seat. If it does leak you are right there are way to many other places for the air to escape before it blows the cylinder out.
I went to the PowerMax the website the first day BB reported on it and read about it.
They say if you overfiil and have valve lock that you are suppose to unscrew it a little till you hear the air bleed off. And thats how your suppose to seat the new seal. There is a little more to it than that without going into everything they say. But I think I will use the product without worry.
Yea I went to the site also and just scanned thru it and saw the part about seating the seal and all that to, my mind just don’t remember stuff like it used to. As I said in an earlier reply to you I am still looking for my mind.
Check out the firehawk springer I scored on gun broker last night, I send the link to you in the leapers scope review right near the top.
At work and kind of buisy. Today is suppose to be our scheduled day off for the 4th of July because of the 4 ten hour days we work. So some of us are working today and we still get the normal 3 days off over the weekend. And here is the good part we get 10 hrs. of double time and a half.
But I will go check that out now.
I started out with co2 for a while to “ease into” my comfort zone. I have to admit that I was nervous the first time I pumped mine up to 2000psi. I did notice that there’s plenty of engaged-thread surface area to hold the tube in. I haven’t heard of them blowing out, but I figure that if it’s rated for 3k, my 1900psi fills should be fine. I also agree that it should bleed down into the nonsealed main tube long before it launches the hipac. Furthermore, the exit port on the hipac constitutes a small area (a tiny fraction of a square inch), which works out to not-so-many pounds of force trying to push the tube off. Sorry but its my day off…I’m phonin’ it in without any math
I know at least one person who had one shoot out the front. I don’t know how, but I believe the threads on the tube go suddenly. You achieve maximum performance from the gun anyway at 700-1000 psi. That’s what it was meant to handle, some more and you probably just get valve lock. And 1000 psi is still safe in a 2240.
I put a stiffer spring to operate at slightly higher pressures. But you’re right… Mine is in the butter zone from 1600-1100 psi. From 2000-1600 Its still consistent, and I get about 10 extra shots. I also have a power adjuster to tweak it on the fly.
I just noticed a typo I did here.
“But here is what I think. First most important think is there is no o-ring that goes on the outside of the air valve.”
Should say. But here is what I think. First most important (thing) is there is no o-ring that goes on the outside of the air valve.
Okay here it goes if the port is 1/32″ (estimated) and I use the formula area= pie r squared, that works out to an area of .008 square inches. At 2000psi 2000x.0008= about 16 pounds of force trying to push the tube off. The threads definitely look substantial enough to be up to the task.
How long have you had your PowerMax set up?
Have you had good luck with yours?
I’ve only had it for about 3 months/1000 rounds. It works great, but at one point I hadn’t hand tightened the extensions enough, and the o rings bulged out. I had pumped it up to 2100 psi and left it for about 4 hours. Other than that, it works excellent!
Im excited to try it.
You should be! It will be awesome.
Thanks for the info, I will do that. Then I can copy and paste the link just like a web address rigjht.
I just created the account in photo bucket and tried to send rob some pics but the thread showed up without the links. I clicked on the gear symbol in each photo and copied the link for blogs and such and pasted it into the reply but like I said no link showed up.
Should I just drag and drop into the reply instead. I am not sure I did it right.
You only missed it by a little, just post the link http://s1376.photobucket.com/user/buldawg76/media/DSCF2242_zps5f08dc0d.jpg.html and that should do it.
Awsome build looks nice and I smell a guest blog.
Thanks for the help with the pics. So in the future do I just copy to the html point of the link or what. I just tried to drag and drop but that did not work. I clicked on the gear in the upper right corner of the pics in Photo bucket and copied the link for blogs but as you saw and fixed the link, what did I do wrong.
Just copy the link to the picture, it seems that you linked to the place that will put the picture on the site and PA does not like that.
I found the link by going to the feed that gives all the comments to all the blogs, if you go here you will see your comment with the links that got deleted.
I went to the link you gave me and found my thread to Rob, but I did not see the link to my pics that got deleted. I probably don’t know where or how to find them. I do not do social media and this blog is the first time I have even got this far in conversing over the Internet. I am old skool in that I surf the web and e-mail but that is it, I believe in phone conversations or face to face mainly. this whole face book,twitter,pinterest and such type of communication I want nothing to do with.
Einstein said along time ago ” when technology advances to the point that face to face human interaction is no longer necessary to communicate we will be left with a world full of idiots” I believe that we are at that point in the world now. The world now is no where near the world I grew up in and I fear for my grand kids that they will never even know what freedoms we used to have that have been slowly stripped from us by our corrupt evil gov’t.
I am sorry I got off into a rant to you about this country. I did not mean to offend you or anger you in any way. It was a bad day yesterday and I guess I just got very frustrated with trying to get pic posted.
I still am not real sure how to do it, but I will persevere until I get it figured out, a lot of it is I have just recently gone from windows XP to windows 8.1 and nothing works the same. So it is a big learning curve that fight with me at every step.
Again my apologies if I offend you or upset you in any way as you were only trying to help.
No problem Buldawg, it is always good to let off a little steam from time to time and I can understand your frustration.
Hope you had a great 4th.
Hope you had a great fourth also, I did have a much better day on the fourth and a great day today because my kids and grandkids from Florida payed us a surprise visit and it was good to visit with them.
I guess I will be the daring one here. I have been waiting for somebody to say this. So here it goes.
2240+1399 stock+steel breech and longer barrel and main air tube=100 dollar pcp.
Crosman if you do read BB’s blog biuld the 100 dollar pcp on this platform. You will sell them. You already have all the components in house to make it today.
Sorry but I couldn’t hold back any longer.
Check out my 2289 that I want to make into that PCP we talked about, the link is two threads above yours in the Mike in Atl reply . He fixed my links to Rob that wanted some pics of my little hot rod. Also scroll up[ about mid way and find the reply I sent to rob with the description of all that I have done to my 2289.
Let me know what you think.
Almost a carbon copy of my 2240 but I don’t have a pump handle of course. And you know what that is exactly the same scope I have on my 2240 right now. And the 60c barrel even looks similar because of how I stepped the barrel diameter down.
I will have to get my 1377 with the full length Disco barrel and breech with the 1399 stock on it and the See All Sight on it from the neighbor lady. She has been using it. I will get some pictures of it and my 2240 and post them tomorrow if time works out. Alot going on this weekend for me.
I would like to see your 2240 with the cut down 60 barrel for sure. I am keeping my eye out for a cheap 2240 also. I was looking on ebay last night and came across a couple kits that had the tube, valve, hammer and end cap which would be almost everything needed to convert my2289 to a 2240. it was late so I got to go back and inspect them more to see if it would.be cheaper to get the kit or just buy a complete gun. There is a 2240 on ebay also for 59.99 with free shipping.
Post some pics when you get a chance and I will try to post some of my old 1400 with the steel breech and 24 inch disco barrel
I posted the pictures of my guns down below. Tell me what you think.
Just remember that if you still need a pump or a tank it quickly becomes a 300$ PCP…
If you have been reading the blog for about the last 8 months I think BB has done the blog about the 100 dollar pcp that him and Dennis did from a Crosman gun. I’m like way interested in what the out come of that will be.
And I have thought about it and the support equipment off and on. And I believe the same as what you said. I think it will be hard for them to produce a package that contains the gun and a fill device and sell it for a hundred dollars. So I think that will be a ground breaking event if they can pull that off.
I will be all over that combo deal if it happens. But I think if we look at some of the other guns that have came up like the 60c that the cost of the gun will probably try to be held at the 100 dollar price range.
I have to tell you how I look at it. I got Co2 guns, pump guns, springer’s and pcp guns. They all costed me something to get them. And I needed something else for the gun to operate be it a hand pump or ShoeBox compressor, co2 cartridges, pellets and bb’s. So the way I look at it is if I want a new springer or some other type of gun I got to buy it. So when I see that 100 dollar pcp roll out from Crosman I will buy it. It will be another one added to the collection.
And I guess another way to say it there ain’t to many cars that come with something to pump up the tires if they go low. Its something I have to buy if I want to do it myself. And I don’t mean to be sounding like a smart you know what just trying to use that as a example.
But if somebody pulls it off and includes a fill device with the 100 pcp gun they will make a killing. I want it to happen. And I want the gun to be a nice little base gun but that has so many optional things that can be done to it that I can build multiple guns off of the same base design.
I think this blog speaks for itself what base gun that should be if it some how ever would come about.
It will be interesting to see what transpires.
Don’t get me wrong! I would be 1st in line for such a product myself! Especially since I’ve already got a pump! Perhaps if they made a 1000psi pump it might bring it down to affordable entry level status…
You know that saying. “Sooner or later”
I’m thinking it’s going to be “later” when we see a low cost pump even if it only goes to 1000 psi.
100 dollars for both the gun and a pump is a heck of a deal.
I think it would be sweet even if it were a PCP bb repeater. Something similar to the crosman comrade but with hpa would be awesome.
BTW…With 3 extensions, a bulk CO2 fill yields about 150 good shots!
After reading your posts, I assume you have experience using the PowerMax-HiPAC unit, and that you fill with CO2. I am curious if you could/would recommend the best way to fill the PowerMax-HiPAC unit from a 12oz paintball tank. I have looked at a lot of filling stations. They have a rather large price range and I want the one that will fill my needs regardless of price. I assume, possible incorrectly, that the fill station needs a female paintball tank fitting on one end, a “foster-type” fitting on the other end, and possibly a control valve in the middle to start/stop the flow of gas. Any recommendations would be appreciated.
Jason, I use mostly hpa now, but all you need to fill off of your 12oz bottle is a coiled remote hose (about 40 bucks). Just connect it to your gun via the foster fitting, hold the bottle upside down (higher than the gun) and open the valve slowly until you just hear it flow. Once it stops close the valve and slowly unscrew the bottle so until the hose pressure bleeds out of the little hole above the threads. Once the line is bled, you can take the hose off of the foster fitting and you’re good to go. If you go on YouTube you can find the american airgunner channel and there’s an episode from (I think) 2012 where they show you how to do this.
What do you use to fill the gun with HPA?
I bought a Benjamin hand pump. 2000 psi is easy. If you never let it get below about 900psi, its about 1.5 pump/shot with 3 extensions.
“WARNING: This conversion changes the operation of the pistol to use air at up to three times the pressure it was designed for. The parts that are installed are strong, but there are other parts in the gun that aren’t changed and could fail when subjected to the higher pressures. Pyramyd Air advises anyone making such a conversion to exercise extreme caution.”
I asked my engineering mate about this conversion. Apart from the cost this could be lethal with hypervelocity pundits. Like replacing a 4 cylinder with a V8?
Who covers ones insurance?
Do take care, I know you are not stupid!
That does make me wonder what pressure the the threads are rated at.
I know when I was talking to Loyd about making a Double tube conversion for the Marauder rifles that he said he did some testing with hydraulic over compressed air testing to I think like 6000 psi. And of course this is a different design. But I bet same test could be used.
And I think on the forum that PowerMax is involved with Loyd has some comments about this setup.
BB maybe you should give Loyd a call and ask his take about this if he’s willing to comment. Maybe that would help to ease the worry a little. Or even the owner of the PowerMax company. I’m sure they would have some data to share.
I believe it is a different LLoyd that has been commenting on the PowerMax forum after reading more posts that was made at earlier dates.
Just wanted to say that before more confusion could happen.
When one has been warned, one takes one’s own chances.
Here is the pictures of my 2240 with the 1399 stock and also a picture with the RAI adapter and AR stock. That’s the gun that has the steel breech and the .177 cal. 60c barrel that is full length but turned down to fit the Crosman breech.They are the pictures with the scope.
The picture of the gun with the See All Sight is my 1377 with the full length Disco barrel and steel breech and 1399 stock.
Let me know what you think.
I like the 2240 with the 60 barrel it looks like the barrel has a shroud on the end. I had forgot about the see all sights also. You are right your 2240 looks almost just like my 2289 just with out the pump handle.
Good looking guns.
buldawg thanks about the guns.
And I don’t know why I missed seeing this yesterday. I get email notifications on my phone and didn’t see this so I over looked your reply. And it was a crazy day yesterday with the 4th of July and everything going on.
But I noticed something else that I over looked on the PowerMax sight. It says that you can leave the orange washer (they say red washer in the instructions) in place if the gun is going to be used under 2000psi.
I wasn’t planning on even going up to 2000psi in my gun. I was going to try to stay at the 1500 or under.
So I was going to try it without changing the seal then I was going to keep the black one as a backup. Now I know I will try it that way and also wont have to take the time to take the gun apart. Just screw the hi-pac in and go.
And I was thinking since that tube is short were the Co2 cartridge goes in that the washer could be changed without taking the gun apart by using a pick of some sort with a point on it. I have done that at work on seals and o-rings when they need replaced or if I was rebuilding a valve or cylinder. Most of our stuff is hydraulic that I work on but we do have stuff that is air. But its all pretty similar.
I need to unscrew that cap that normally seals the C02 cartridge in the tube and look down inside and see if it can be changed that way. Sure would simplify things that’s for sure. I will have to see.
Did you get your Hawke scope delivered yet?
I got my scope and pellets today, I like the scope for sure . It will look just right on the Hatsan. I had a surprise visit from my kid from Florida today, they showed up out of the blue and spent the day with them and more of my grand kids. We all had a good time and got to let the g-kids do some shooting in the backyard. So I had a great fourth and fifth of July. I did not get a chance to open the box from PA until 20 minutes ago and I like the way they pack the pellets in foam to keep from damaging them.
I will be mounting the scope on the Hatsan tomorrow so it will be ready to shoot Wednesday when the fitting arrives, I sure wish I had ordered it from PA as I would be shooting tomorrow.
Well that sounds like that was a nice surprise to see your kid and the grand kids. And I was at my brothers yesterday and did the whole 4th of July scenario over again.
And yes that’s what I like about PA also is the way they pack their pellets. I’m picky about how I handle my pellets and that is just one more thing that makes me feel better. And I don’t know if you heard me say the other day that I was mad at myself for dropping a brand new tin of pellets off the table after I got it out of the PA foam packing. Well I did open them up and there was probably about 20 bent pellets and the others were all good. I was surprised because they hit right on the corner of the lid and it was about a 3′ fall. They were the JSB 10.3’s. And maybe that piece of foam they put in the lid helped some. Anyway I was glad about that.
And I did look and see if I could change that seal with out taking the gun apart and I believe that I can. Put like I said I ain’t going to unless needed.
And I wish you had that fill adapter I would like to know what you think of your gun and Hawke scope.
I got some shooting in out at my brothers with my HW50 and the now mounted Hawke scope. It was the only gun I took. And I took that tin of pellets that I dropped and sorted out the bad ones and a good tin just incase the tin I dropped didn’t work out. The gun shot great with both tins. So I was happy about that.
Yea I am glad it was only 20 pellets that got damaged. After you told me about your slip up I opened mine on top of my bed so if anything got dropped it would have a soft landing.
Yea yesterday was a great day and it was kind of like yours as we did the fourth thing over again and got teach and help my grandkids have a blast shooting some of my less powerful pellet guns and just catch up on parts of their lives we miss out on because they live in Florida and don’t get to see as much as we would like to be able to. Hopefully that will change when my disability get approved.
I definitely wish I had my fill adapter to, I should have told air gun depot to cancel the order and included it in with my order from PA because I would have it now and be shooting for sure. I definitely like the scope but I don’t have it mounted yet so it really hard to just hold it and look thru it and get a real feel for how it will be on the gun. The 10×40/50mm is just way to big for a pellet gun and it looks much better on my AR any way and since the AR is capable of several hundred yard accurate shots it really needed the bigger scope anyway.
My 40 buck break barrel has been shipped and should have it by end of the weak so I will let you know just how it compares to the FWB 124 of my friends that I built and shot for a couple of days. From what I read in the 15 reviews that BB did on the 124 I feel it is the standard by which to compare all other break barrels to. they claim 1200 fps with it so I will let my chrony tell the truth about that, if it shoots even half as good as the 124 I believe I got a good deal.
My shroud for the Hatsan is on the way also from the UK, check out: wolfairguns.com It is a Hatsan made accessory for 46 bucks shipped.
That sounds like a heck of a deal on that shroud for your Hatsan. And I’m curious how that break barrel works out for you that your getting.
And we were talking over on the blog about the Hakim about different things about the 2240 and I don’t know if you seen the reply yet that I left there or not yet. But I figured I would say something here.
I noticed on the PowerMax site that they said the hi-pac would work on the 1077 and 2260 also. I would like to try one in my 1077. That’s a good shooting little repeater. But I wonder how the hi-pac works for them because the Co2 cartridge fits deeper down in the tube. I guess I need to email them and ask about how that works. And then the hi-pac should be a neat setup on a 2260. The hi-pac would basically turn it into a Discovery in a way.
If this little system works out nice on my 2240 I see myself getting more for other guns. I will find out soon enough I suppose. Will see how it goes.
Yea I thought that was a good deal on the shroud, the tko for the Hatsan is 92 bucks and they make them for the 60Cs also at the same price shipped , they attach to the 60Cs with set screws and are a slip on fit. Check out the site a gave you the link to in the last message.
I saw where they had the powermax for the 1077 and 2260 also. I think the one for the 1077 has a longer length to the part that fits inside of the tube before the threads so it is the same as the 2240 just more of it fits inside the 1077 tube and the same for the 2260. I want the one I get for 2289 to be as long as the barrel so I would need to get two extensions which also increases the size of the air tank for more shot count. I can also see a lot more 22xx getting converted to HPA. Go to You Tube and type in hi-pac powermax, there a lot of reviews and test of the powermax already out there so you can get a better idea of how it will work for your 2240. I can see me converting all my guns to it that are possible to be converted.
But as far as your statement of a 100 buck pcp I think it is more like a 2 to 300 buck PCP. If I buy a brand new 2240 and convert it using my 2289 breech, barrel and trigger frame and just use the 2240s tube and guts and then the powermax PCP parts it would be a 220 buck gun. 60.00 plus shipping for 2240= 70 bucks, then powermax cylinder, two extensions + shipping =110 bucks for a total of 220 bucks which in not bad if you compare it to a P-rods price. The only real difference would be single shot versus repeater for P-rod and a slightly smaller air cylinder maybe. I don’t know how big the P-rods cylinder is so it may be real close. I just like the look of the crosman 22 series better than the P-rod any way, so it would be a bit of a toss up.
I was thinking more like Crosman use the Disco and instead of a wood stock use the 2240 pitol grip assembly and 1399 stock. That could help knock the cost down some and also not have to buy the hi-pac.
If you look on the TKO site he has some pictures of guns like that in the picture gallery. I had a Disco and a Mrauder done up like that in the past.
And I know it would be hard to keep the cost at a 100 bucks. But I think if they took the 2240 as is and made the air tube and barrel alittle longer and put a Disco fitting in the end of tube with the Foster fitting. And make the gun work at a lower preasure like 1200 psi or less they could still use the 2240 valve then. It wouldn’t cost Crosman any more to add a longer barrel or other things for that fact. And then add the 1399 stock.
Crosman would just have to determine if they wanted to put a 100 dollar price tag on it or if they needed to charge more. But I bet they could get pretty close to a little over a hundred dollars. And then think about the Flying Dragon air gun. I think Mike wants 165 dollars or something for them now. Who knows what will happen with Crosman building one. Im just hoping it will happen.
I was talking about what it would cost me to build me a PCP out of my 2289 that I already have.
I agree that crosman could in fact build a well under 200 bucks PCP pistol/carbine with the 1399 stock like my 2289 came with for sure. they could offer it in either a pistol 2240 setup with different barrel /air tube length options or as a carbine setup with the same barrel/air tube length options. I do believe there is a market out there for a less expensive alternative to a P-rod or M-rod. Just as you stated about the fling dragon guns even at 165 bucks they are a good value for the money, he just needs to install a better quality valve stem/seal setup in the PCP conversations. The CO2 valve that the converted PCP come with it not designed to hold up to the added stress from the increase in pressure from the HPA.
I to hope it will happen because I think they are losing a big amount of the market not doing so.
I think the more choices that are out there the better it is for us. But I guess we are lucky enough that the resources are there right now to make are own pcp. I’m really interested to see how the hi-pac works out.
I seen today that my account got charged for the hi-pac. So I’m guessing that its getting shipped today. I ordered on the 3rd which wasn’t probably the best day to order on with the holiday. But will see If I get a tracking number or something. I did email them yesterday but haven’t seen nothing with that either. Oh well I guess it will be here soon enough.
My wife just went out to check the mail. Guess what was in the mailbox. The hi-pac. Now that was a surprise.
And I just opened it. Very good quality. Made real nice. And it came in sealed plastic bags. One of the bags had the black seal in it that’s supposed to be used for above the 2000psi and also has the heavier spring that goes in the valve when you go above 2000psi.
Wont have no time to try it today about ready to go to work. But I’m at least going to but it on my 2240 tonight when I get home and pressurize it to about 1200 psi and see what it shoots like. I should just be able to screw the pieces together and onto my 2240 because I plan on staying at 1500psi or less. So going to try it without the black seal and the high pressure spring that goes in the valve.
Also I’m going to fill it up to 1500psi and let it set over night to see if it leaks down. But that was a nice surprise for a Monday.
That is good news that your Hi-pac is at home waiting for you when you get off work. I probably would go with only 1500 psi myself until I saw how it shoots at that and the shot count you get also. Why use more pressure than is needed to get the results you want from it. let me know how it works for you because I am watching some kits on ebay now that would give me all the parts I need to turn my 2289 into a 2240 for less than the whole gun itself, so I wait in eager anticipation of how you like your 2240 hi-pac conversation project,
I to got some good news today also, my fill fitting for the Hatsun will be here tomorrow instead of wed so that at least a day earlier I can start shooting. The bad thing is we are going to go to my wife’s parents for a few days to meet one of my grandkids dad half way to let the G-kid spend some of the summer with his dad, which is good because he needs to see his dad.
You know that crosman could offer it as an option in their custom shop to allow you to build a 2240 with a HPA cylinder instead of CO2 and then as you can already do add steel breech and different length barrels. It would not be that much of a manufacturing issue if it was done thru the custom shop as just another custom add on to what they already offer in the shop. Can’t wait till tomorrow and till you get some shoots on your Hi-pac conversation under your belt. let me know what you think and I will keep you informed about mine also. It will be next week till I can respond back after this Thursday, but I will get with you as soon as I get back.
That is good news about your adapter also. You got to let me know how it does. Remember I said I would like to get one of the new models with the muffler already factory installed.
And if all goes well tonight Im going to try to shoot it a bit before I go to work tomorrow. I hope.
And I think I will just wait to post any results until BB does part 2. That way we can see what results he gets with his barrel and pellet choices.
Sounds good on the updates about or new toys, I will be busy also getting ready to go out of town for a few days so it will likely be next week before I can have any decent results to report also. I still am in the process of getting my scope mounted because the harmonic balancer on the wife’s car went out yesterday and I spent the day changing it out so we could take our trip. Thankfully it went out here instead of in the middle of our trip where I would not have had the tools to fix it myself, the rubber cushion had dry rotted and the pulley was wobbling and about to come off the inner hub of the balancer. I guess it held up ok for 205,000 miles before calling it quits.
Talk to you next week.
Glad to see you playing with the 22xx platform. It is alot of fun to tinker with.
The ice maker tubing is a great addition, since you have the gun apart. Also adding a heavier hammer spring will really wake it up.
I have built a 2240 using a DAQ upper in .25 that I just added a Hipac to.
Haven’t had a chance to use hpa yet, but with co2 it works great.
Keep up the great work BB, I can’t wait to see your results.
Keep up the