The boogeyman in the sock drawer

by Tom Gaylord
Writing as B.B. Pelletier

• The sock drawer
• Are today’s children more mature?
• Deny, deny
• Explain everything
• Let them make their own mistakes
• What can you do?
• A program that works
• Things to consider
• A shooter training program

Although she may not remember, Edith asked me to write this blog some time ago. What do you do with guns when there are children in the house?

I’m not going to lie and tell you there’s one right answer. That would be foolish, because children have differing personalities, just like adults. Some are curious and others are cautious. Some seem to seek out the wrong paths instinctively, while others are wise beyond their years.

Every parent and guardian has to first take the measure of the children under their control, plus the possibility that visiting children might tread beyond the threshold that your children respect. And this is a challenge because parents and guardians are just as variable as children. I won’t run through all the possible combinations of children’s and parents’ personalities. What I’ll do is give you a simple rule — don’t trust nobody with nothin’!

The sock drawer
When I was growing up in the 1950s, parents kept things in their dresser drawers if they didn’t want their children handling them. Children were not allowed in the parents’ bedroom without permission, so those places were sacrosanct. Children back then knew that, of course, which made the parents’ drawers treasure chests to be explored at all risk. This is where the personalities came into play. Some kids stayed out of their parents’ drawers because they were told to. Others sought them out at every opportunity. Having a “rule” about access was as thin and foolish as the government explaining why a tax increase is going to benefit everyone. And the children saw right through it! They still do today.

Are today’s children more mature?
Today’s children are fundamentally no different than children were 200 years ago. They’re certainly more exposed to the rudeness of life, but at their cores they’re the same curious people they have always been. And there are various ways of dealing with this.

Deny, deny
One method of protecting children is to avoid mentioning the taboos altogether. The thinking is that if they never hear about it, they will not have the opportunity to be attracted to it, possibly making wrong decisions with dire consequences. This is applied to everything from sex to liquor to fire to firearms. And, because of the varying personalities mentioned before, sometimes it works and other times it doesn’t. But when it doesn’t work, the chances for disaster are huge! Get the wrong personality and vice together, and they bond instantly.

Explain everything
In this approach, the parent explains everything to the child — in detail. It works with some kids and not with others because of those personalities. Again, both the parent and the child are factors that cannot be overlooked. When it works, it works very well. When it doesn’t work, it often stimulates curiosity that leads to problems.

Let them make their own mistakes
“Kids are going to drink anyway, so I’d rather they did it at home — where it’s safe and I can control it.” This is a bad philosophy. All it does is introduce the child to things they aren’t physically or emotionally prepared for. I saw it in my own family and the outcome was a disaster that is still unfolding 50 years later. The parents are long gone, but the kids who are now entering old-age are train wrecks that continue to inflict pain around them.

What can you do?
This is where we will part ways. What I’m about to say is my personal philosophy, and many people will disagree with it.

First — Recognize that guns are dangerous! That includes airguns. Parents cannot afford to have Playstation personalities about the sharp pointy things in life. If you have guns in the house and also young people, you need to think through a plan of safety for everyone. Edith and I have a lot of guns in the house, and some of them are loaded. But when company comes to visit, we do things about it. The guns get unloaded and the ammo gets put away. The guns are then secured so the curious people cannot get to them. Never forget that children come in all ages!

Second — Recognize when it’s time to train the children. Not to fear guns, but to respect them. I can tell you how I would do it, but it varies with each child — because, as I have said, children are people, too. Each one is different and has to be approached in a different way. And each reaches the level of responsibility (where they can safely handle guns) at different times — with some never making it.

Third — Admit when there’s a problem. Some kids will never be responsible enough to handle or be safely around guns, and you need to be cognizant of that. If that’s the case in your family, you need to take steps to ensure that the situation never arises for the child in question to be around guns.

A program that works
Here’s a program that works. It doesn’t work with everybody because of that personality thing I keep mentioning, but it works well a large percentage of the time. It’s a phased approach.

Phase 1. Keep the guns away from the children until they’re mature enough to understand that they must behave in certain ways.

Phase 2. When the child shows they can behave in your presence, introduce them to your guns. Show them how they operate and how they perform when they fire. They don’t have to know everything about the guns — just the basics. This is where you begin instructing them about safe gun handling. Test them after they have learned these basic lessons. Make sure they apply them at the fundamental level — not just to satisfy you when you are watching.

Phase 3. Some children will be curious about guns and will want to shoot them. Others will not. Train those who have an interest but respect the ones who don’t. Make sure they all understand the basic gun handling rules, but don’t force a child to learn to shoot just because you like to.

Things to consider
Children are not always under your direct control. Sometimes, they may be at a friend’s home. Or at the home of a friend of a friend. The children in that household may not have the same education that you have given yours. Their parents may also be irresponsible. What can you do about that?

This is where the child’s personality really comes into play. Some will instinctively do the right thing and others won’t. You can’t do much about that either way. What you can do (and must do, in my opinion) is train your children to the limit of their maturity and then hope for the best.

The National Rifle Association has the Eddie Eagle program, which teaches young children to leave any room in which there is a gun. They’re supposed to leave the room and tell an adult. While this program is a good one, it has a flaw. The “adult” the child tells may not be able to deal with the situation. It’s still the best thing a child can do, but it isn’t 100 percent failsafe.

And that, unfortunately, is the bottom line for this report. Nothing is failsafe. My way may fail while a way that I oppose may succeed. There’s no guarantee for anything.

In the end, though, you have to be able to live with the consequences. If things turn bad, how will you feel about what you did to prepare? As long as you can live with that, you’re doing the best you can.

The holidays are coming around very soon, and some of you will be giving airguns as presents. If you do, I hope that you also give something more. I hope you give the training the recipient needs to enjoy that airgun as it was intended. That’s a gift that will last the rest of their lives!

A shooter training program
All that said, here’s a new shooter training program I wrote a few years ago for parents who don’t know what they don’t know about teaching kids to shoot. It includes specifics and psychology in its 6 parts. I hope it helps someone.

106 thoughts on “The boogeyman in the sock drawer

  1. BB
    I was trying to think of something to say or add to what you just explained.

    I can’t think of anything right now. All I can say is excellent, excellent job on this report.

    I know my two teenage girls will be asleep when I get home. They got school tomorrow. You and others know they shoot air guns and bow and arrow. So this should be a good read for them. I’m definitely going to show it to them. The more info the better is the way I see it. Thanks


    • This is something that I have had to deal with recently as my child is now tall enough to reach a certain place where I kept a 1377c .
      now I no he wouldn’t touch it but he mabye want to try and in press his friends so.
      so I emptied my drawer and it all went in the safe with the only key hid I hope fairly well im sure this won’t stop a determined kid from finding out where it is hidden.
      There has been a law passed in the Uk about this not long ago to keep airguns out of the grasps of children when a adult is not around.
      I’m sure it’s a bit different in the US as real firearms are more the norm and are seen as a way of defence so the no good looked in a safe im sure the attackers won’t wait for you to unlock the dam thing.


      • Barry,

        The difference between the UK and US used to be great, but they are growing closer all the time. Now, if a child mentions guns or draws a gun in school, they are expelled. And in some places it has been suggested that Child Protective Services be called if parents allow their children to shoot.

        B.B.


        • Sadly depending on how the election cycle plays out here in NY state we will have laws in place next year that will allow police to strip you of your gun rights and confiscate all your weapons if they are misused because they were not locked up in an approved manner. In addition we will have to have liability insurance for our guns,- for each one… This would apply even if your approved safe was broken into during a burglary, and the stolen gun was used by the perp to rob or kill someone . This stupidity will spread, I don’t care what state you live in. We are currently the test bed here. BTW, Barry I read that right now in the UK, where your police are now making unannounced inspections of folks weapons cabinets under the guise of preventing terrorism ?


          • I only own air rifles.
            And the one thing have taught my son apart from the safty aspect is not to talk about them or mention them.
            Which is a shame as the hobby is so much more then just shooting.
            Robert I read a post about firearms officials want to cold calling on gun owners at the weekend.
            At the minute im sure they have to inform you that they are coming on a certain day.


            • Barry; The source where I saw the article was Breitbart /London , which said that the ACPO ( police union in the UK?)was trying to do this starting on Oct 15, but as of yet no one of interest has been targeted. Apparently they would like to overstep their bounds if given the opportunity.


              • Robert
                I’m sure
                in the UK it’s not going to be long before licencing comes in for air rifles it will probably start with a good old gun amnesty unfortunately we have stiff upper lips and nothing will change until it’s to late.
                as with the firearms they may be trying to scare some folk into giving up the licenses these tactics work as I’m sure some people only use there firearms or shotguns a limited time each year.
                It’s probably the same idea as the authorities have in your state.



      • BB
        I showed them both this morning when I got them up for school. They said they would read it. I also told them to check out the 6 part report you did that is highlighted in blue.

        So tonight while I’m at work I will call them and see if they read it. And I have a bit of a idea what the answers from them will be. I will say what I think now and will see what they say.

        The oldest daughter will ask me if I think she is responsible then ask questions about your article. The youngest daughter will tell me she didn’t finnish reading it yet but probably didn’t even look at it. She is good at what she does like her older sister but she has to be pushed to get something done. They both have the opposite personalities.

        And I probably shouldn’t of wrote this response yet till they read it tonight. But if they do read it I’m sure they will have something to say about that too. But they know I tell it like it is. So we will see.


        • Well I was partially right. The oldest daughter did ask questions. And wanted to know if I trusted her. I asked her don’t you follow the rules and ways we discuss. She said yes. I go well there is your answer.

          But I did get surprised about the younger daughter. She went and got her sister and they read it together.

          They said they will read the other 6 part article. They are interested anytime we talk about or shoot guns. Sometimes they will ask me if we are going to shoot before I get the chance to ask them.

          They did ask me when they were going to get a chance to go shoot in the woods by theirselfs like I got to when I was a kid. I told them I may need 20 more years to think about that answer. 🙂


  2. BB
    I have to say I agree with your view totally and have used it just as you have described with my children growing up just as my father did with me and am getting the very pleasurable privilege of teaching the grandkids that live nearby and visit often about the safety of guns and the dos and don’t of responsible and safe gun handling. I do believe that if the child is not interested then do not force or push them into something they have no interest in.

    I also believe that it is far better to remove the curiosity of such things than to say they are off limits because as soon as you say don’t do this or that the first chance most kids get that is exactly what they will do.

    I do have loaded guns in my house and they stay loaded with my grandkids here because a gun does no good in an situation where your life is in danger from a home intruder if your gun is not loaded, but on the same hand I have shown my grand kids where they are and why they are not to touch them and have shown them pictures and news clips of the reasons why I do not want them to touch them and they understand what the risks and consequences are from them disobeying my request of them.

    I have let them shoot my 22s and 12 ga shotgun and the revolver that stay loaded next to my bed so that their curiosity has been satisfied just as my father did with me and is why at age 8 I was allowed to go hunting alone with my 12 ga shotgun. They were very surprised and shocked at the amount of recoil and kick the 12 ga and 38 revolver had and how much less the 22 had, but I could see in their eyes that they had gained a respect for the guns that was not there before they actually got to shoot them. My 8 year old grandson could not hold the 12 ga by himself and while I did hold it so that it would not come out of his hands he was allowed to put the butt against his shoulder to feel the recoil and it did bruise him some but he knows now that the 12 ga is not to be bothered for any reason and I truly believe that both of my grandkids that come on a regular basis are educated to the point that they respect my rules and understand why they are in place.

    Buldawg



      • BB
        I feel very fortunate to have the two grandkids here to teach and watch them gain the understanding and enjoyment of responsible gun usage. I am blessed in that they are very mature for their ages and that their personalities as you state are of the type that they listen and obey as they should and I have let them read this report and it has just reinforced what I have been teaching them.

        So thank very much for giving all of us out here another tool for us to use in the teaching and development of our youths.

        Buldawg


  3. I agree with your sentiments. I also believe in making them realize early on that they are responsible for their actions after we have taught them them the rules. Although sometimes they really need an object lesson now and then as to why the rules were set-up that way.

    Is there a proper way to securely mount a Williams FP aperture sight on a scope rail of a spring air rifle?


    • Siraniko,

      I have several Williams peep sights mounted on different spring piston air rifles. I don’t have a problem with them moving but where there is a scope stop or a screw on the top of the piston tube, I will move the peep sight back against that stop or, you can always buy a scope stop and use that in combination with your Williams sight. If the sight is moving on your rifle, make sure there’s no oil in the grooves. On some of my more violently recoiling spring piston rifles, I have resorted to an automotive anti-vibration fluid we have here in the states called, “Locktite”. In fact, I think this company is now owned by a German company so you may be able to purchase it in Europe. It’s blue in color and many of us have found it works well preventing scope mount screws from loosening up.

      Fred DPRoNJ


      • Ok I will try mounting the sight in front of the scope stop. I do believe Locktite is available locally but I am not aware what color it is.
        Thanks for the advice Fred DPRoNJ.
        PS I am located in the Philippines which is in Southeast Asia.


        • Siraniko
          There are different strength’s of Locktite. They are colored differently.

          The blue will hold a bolt in place but can be broke free easily. There is a green colored one that will need heat if I remember right to break free. Then there is red that is suppose to be permenant.

          I know I got the blue Locktite description correct. I may have the red and green mixed up. We don’t use the red or green at work anymore because of how hard it will lock the screw in place. It made for tuff repairs so we stopped that.


          • So the procedure would be to clean the threads and screws (would denatured alcohol be sufficient?) of oils then place a drop along the threads before screwing into the hole?




                • Siraniko
                  I don’t have the patience or time to do that. I’m betting your reading some interesting things.

                  And after you try the Locktite I would like to know what you think.


                  • Yup. Just passed BB’s rant on language and now reading about the Theoben Eliminator. I do wish he had put pictures of the airguns he reviewed previously. It would have saved me some time from researching what they looked like. Initially I just read the blog entry but when he started referring to the comments I had to start reading them which is slowing me down.



          • Never used any green threadlocker although I can’t say I haven’t run across it. It’s niche is probably in the manufacturing trades. It seems repair sleeves only use blue and they’re pretty permanent!
            Thanks!


            • Reb
              When I started working at the machine shop back in the early 80’s we were making alot of military stuff. One of the things we use to make was the 25mm tracer target practice projectile/bullet. The tracer side we called the core it was the backside that had the tracer cavity in it. And the ogive/nose was made out of stamped steel. We use to assemble the two pieces on a Acme screwmachine (and had to hold a total of .002” runout after assembly). There was a Loctite injector at one of the stations that put it on the knurl that was on the core. The nose would get pressed into place then crimped. We had to take and wipe each one off by hand with trichlorethalene to get the green Loctite off. If we didn’t when they phosphated the projectile for painting to etch the metal it wouldn’t even take the Loctite off if it was dry.

              I have some of the red here at home and the blue. We used the blue when assembling engines in different places. If we sleeved a steel liner in a aluminum block we used red. The only way to change that sleeve was to heat it then press it out.

              And we have a red almost brown looking type of sealer that is almost like a hard piece of rubber when it dries that we use for threads at work that involves high pressure like hydraulics and liquids. Its not the Locktite brand. There is alot of choices out there though if you look through the industrial catalogs.


        • My apologies – I did not remember you saying where you were located. The “blue” Locktite is for anti-vibration applications and allows the threaded nuts or bolts to be un-done if needed. Locktite also comes in green and red which are for “permanent” applications, such as engine head mounting studs. Don’t use those products as it is extremely difficult to remove the screws/nuts/bolts if you have to.

          Fred DPRoNJ


          • To all
            Loctite thread locking compounds come in these colors and grades of use.
            Purple is for very light duty and mainly for small fasteners like what would be used to secure sight and scope fasteners.
            Blue is for medium duty usage such as larger screws and bolts that need to be secure but also be removed easily.
            Green is for a more secure retention of larger screws and bolts that are not usually needed to be removed for service situations.
            Red is for an even more secure retention in which there is not a foreseen need for the removal of the fastener.
            Black is the most secure and along with red will require the use of heating of the fastened joint to be removed and even then my not come loose without damage to threads.

            There is also a red bearing and sleeve sealer and retainer compound the is mostly used to seal threads on studs that are in a non blind hole where it not only has to retain fastener but also seal the threads and is also used to retain bearing or sleeves on shafts and I can tell you from experience if you put something together with it the only way you will get it off or out is to cut it off with a cut off wheel or heat the object to a orange white state with a oxcy/acetelyne torch.

            Buldawg



              • Reb
                yea the years at Harley did help, but we only used blue and red there. I actually went to Loctites website to get the info as I knew about purple, blue ,red and the red bearing and sleeve sealer and retention compound because I had to use it on the rear set of studs on my KZ 1000 when I had the head and cylinder off to put in APE studs and had an oil leak from the rear studs because they break into the oil galley for cam oiling. I was not sure of green and did not know they made a black.

                Buldawg



                  • Reb
                    Yep the red Loctite bearing and sleeve retainer actually looks brownish when it cures and it fixed the oil leakage at the rear cylinder studs on my KZ1000. I just hope I never have to take them out because I am not sure they will come out without thread damage since they are in aluminum and cannot be heated enough to cause the loctite to let go.

                    I imagine that the Loctite company ie. Permatex probably has some chemical the can be used to cause the Loctite to dissolve and release just like the 3M contact cement has a release agent you can use to get the contact cement to release.

                    buldawg


  4. It’s very interesting how some of your thoughts mirror mine, BB, and some don’t . But as you said, it ultimately depends on the maturity of the child as well as your own maturity and judgement. Perhaps one thing everyone will agree on is the unofficial saying we have at the weekly 25 yard Bullseye competition – “there’s no such thing as too much safety” when it comes to firearms. Now, back to sleep.

    Fred DPRoNJ


  5. I have not as of yet introduced my 5 year old son to the world of shooting as I do not think he is quite ready. I believe he is what they today define as ADHD. We used to call them boys. He is a wired out little dude and very head strong. When curious about something, he will grab it and then ask what is it.

    Both his parents and I have begun teaching him firearm safety though with the Wii and my Nerf pistol I keep in the end table drawer by my easy chair. When he is handling a “gun”, we teach him never to point it at anyone. I have also been teaching him to keep it pointed “down range”.

    One day he will have the attention span I am looking for and I will be able to instruct him in earnest.


  6. Buldawg,

    My “collection” has not yet reached a level where a Shoebox would even be useful, more or less practical. I have an Edge and a Talon SS at the moment. I think I would like to have another PCP, but I have not yet decided what I want.

    Well, that is not true. It is just that what I want does not exist and I have not yet found someone to build it for me. I guess I will just have to build it myself.



    • RR
      You need to check out these sites . I do not know exactly what you are wanting or have in mind but this guy makes some high quality and priced one of a kind air guns.

      xp-airguns.com and mrhollowpoint.com

      The xp site is a person that makes air guns one at a time to your specifications in calibers from .308, .38, .45, .50, .52, .58, and 72 calibers. The other site is the person that makes the ammo for those guns and has some videos of the various guns being shot.

      I myself if for no other reason as to just say I own one want the ” Quigley 72 ” which is the 72 caliber air gun that fires a 735 grain slug at 800 FPS with 1000 FPE at 100 yard target and is capable of killing anything that lives on earth at this time. I will grant that you only get two shots between 4500 PSI fills on high power and 4 or 5 shots on low power. I know it is very impractical and not of much need other than bragging rights but I am just that kind of person that has a craving for things that are on the extreme edge and out of the norm. The 72 caliber starts at 2000 bucks and goes up from there with option offered such as dual air reservoirs and repeating breeches and so on. So he may be able to make what you are dreaming of.

      Buldawg


  7. This is great and I hope everybody shares it wherever possible, too many people think the majority of gun owners are just leaving them around so their kids can pick them up and injure or kill somebody, which is a sad exception to the rule. Everyone here can agree that safe shooting and ownership are a constant in our lives and that risking lives and our freedoms is sin. There was a time when I was a kid that another kid got, not badly, but still, injured, and the incident was very serious. One kid went to jail, and this was just an accident with an airgun but the consequences of the decisions made, intentional or not, were there. No one leaves a gun around hoping someone gets hurt, but leaving it around is a decision with possibly dire consequence. Hope everyone has a happy safe holiday.


    • RDNA
      I agree with you whole heartedly on all that you said but would like to add that the ownership of guns, knives or any instrument used to protect ourselves and family is a GOD given right in the sense that we are given and allowed to protect ourselves and our families from evil in any form and with any means necessary required to do so. So to me that means that the ownership by responsible citizens of this earth is granted by our GOD and not by our governments or ruling officials and I am one that will not give them up without a fight to the death it that’s is what is required in order that my future generations will be given the same rights as I have been given by our maker.

      Buldawg


      • I agree that our right to defend ourselves and loved ones is god given, but somewhere in the bible it says to follow the laws of men because god put them in the position to make the laws…. but that was before 9/11 so I don’t think it applies anymore, lol


        • RDNA
          I do not consider those in the gov’t with the task of making laws and rules after 9/11 to be men but rather evil servants of the devil bound and determined to destroy the America as we have known it and turn it into a socialist regime or anarchy type of rule that will only serve and benefit those elitist few.

          It is time we all wake up and stand together to regain our country and freedoms that are being stripped away every day.

          UNITED WE STAND and DEVIDED WE FALL

          Buldawg


  8. A very excellent article, B.B.

    I started training my two kids about gun safety early and they both had taken deer by age 8. I now have 2 grandsons. One is too small but the other is 9 and has been shooting since he was 7 and has taken several deer already. I also teach gun safety and marksmanship to my retired neighbors who want to shoot at my indoor air gun range.

    I am lucky that I have had responsible kids and grand kids. I never take it for granted and am constantly aware of my responsibility by having loaded guns in my home. I have a concealed carry permit and always have a loaded pistol when I travel. It gets put away when I return home.

    There was a segment on 60 minutes a few years ago that really opened my eyes and has drilled home that you can NEVER trust a child with a loaded gun. The feature was about a mother who was an advocate of a program which taught children to immediately go tell an adult when they came across a gun (the Eddie Eagle program). This mother was confident that her child would do just that because of his training. A hidden camera was set up in a room that was a toy room. An unloaded .357 magnum pistol was planted within a toy box. Several children, including the little boy with the training, were allowed to play in the room. It didn’t take long for them to find the pistol. before long, the two boys (including the one with the training), were pointing the pistol at each other and trying to shoot it. Peer pressure overruled the training the child got and could have been a disaster if the gun had been loaded.



    • Jerry,

      Your story of the mom who was sure her son would respond to a firearm exactly the way he’d learned in the Eddie Eagle program reminded me of another story. I read a newspaper account of a deadly car accident involving a group of teenagers. All drunk, including the driver — who was very active in her school’s chapter of Mothers Against Drunk Drivers (MADD). Kids often believe that they’re immortal and not like others who cannot handle danger (guns, alcohol, etc.).

      From what I read in the papers, kids act very differently with their parents and other adult relatives. When they’re away from those adults, they morph into creatures their parents don’t recognize. Not a day goes by without reading in the paper that some child did something, and the parents are positive their child is innocent. When the confession comes and/or indisputable evidence is rendered, the parents continue to be in denial because it flies in the face of everything they’ve believed. They cannot reconcile the truth with the image they built up in their minds.

      Edith


  9. BB,
    Good blog. I would like to add that teenagers and young adults who are familiar with their parents guns have been responsible for several of the school shootings. Parents need to again go on high alert if their kids start acting differently at that age. That may be an age where the guns need to be locked up.

    I don’t know about others but I miss the contest that I was signing up for daily.

    David Enoch


    • Teen revolution! We’ve all been there.Think about all the things we did, mutiply x10 and point it in another direction?
      Remember everyone sitting down at the table for meals at the same time?
      We’re missing times like these in which the whole family undergoes their daily psychological evaluations’.
      On the contest
      It was a little work and I missed a few days by not remembering to register
      I kept waiting for some member of the blog to chime in with “Hey check this out!”
      But there are some happy airgunners out there somewhere. Maybe a couple will show up soon to talk about their newest additions’.


  10. My great-grandfather was a Milwaukee police Lt. for many years. His coming home for work routine, which was not a secret as he did it in front of his grandchild, my father, countless times, was to enter the home and make a beeline for the place he always kept his two revolvers. He would go straight to the kitchen, which had a corner cupboard cabinet that was probably just under eight feet tall. My six foot tall great-grandpa would pull up a kitchen chair, stand on it, and take down a shoebox he kept at the back of the top of the cupboard, put his gun and holster in it, and return the box to its place.

    Until my father was a teenager, no one in the family except my great-grandfather and grandfather were tall enough to reach that box, even with the kitchen chair to stand on.

    Of course, this was in a time before biometric pistol safes and trigger guards, although I suppose my great grandpa knew how to lock a revolver with the cylinder open with a padlock, but he didn’t bother.

    My dad, the only child in the house, was born in 1933 and wasn’t tall enough to reach that box until probably 1947 or so, and the system worked fine. That was a different time, however.

    As for the guns being inaccessible if there were an intruder, that would not have concerned anyone in the home. First, it would not have occurred to criminals in that town to break into THAT home of all homes. And, over the course of his decades on the force my grandpa separated perhaps four or five men from their guns and a dozen or so men from their knives with his bare hands. The “bad actors” in his precinct knew better than to challenge him, especially if their only weapon were a mere handgun.

    However, my great-grandpa was a special case. He developed an aura and legend of invincibility about him even before he walked, unscathed, out of the debris and dust cloud of the Great Milwaukee Police Station Bombing of 1917. He was like Bruce Willis in “Unbreakable.”

    Michael


  11. Your post this morning hits the mark. I, too, spend a lot of time considering how to safely share my hobby with my kids and grandkids. As a group, today’s kids are smart and teachable. They just need to be getting the teaching from the right sources. Much of the problem that you describe stems from the fact that responsible gun owners aren’t the ones who are doing most of the teaching that kids are getting regarding the topic at hand. That role seems to be filled by action movies, video games and unsupervised friends. That’s a lot of poor influence to overcome. Here’s how I handle it with three grandsons, including one who lives with me.

    When we watch action movies, they are generally age-appropriate. Sure, that means that we usually watch something like Spy Kids instead of Die Hard, but it really cuts down on the amount of make-believe violence that has to be explained. And I do explain it. The grandkids and I get a kick out of talking about how film makers make scenes look real. It surprises me sometimes how adept my 9-year-old grandson is at spotting gun-related goofs. (“Geez… How many times can that guy shoot without a reload?!”) The key here is that they understand that what they see in the movies isn’t real.

    As far as video games are concerned, I really draw the line in the sand. Absolutely no realistic first person shooter games. One of the things that kids struggle with the most at early ages is the ability to distinguish reality from fantasy. The kind of video games that I am describing blur that line. That doesn’t mean that the kids are missing out on learning to shoot. They get to shoot real guns with real targets. When this happens, they are always supervised, but I am confident that when the time comes for them to be on their own, they will handle guns in the way to which they have become accustomed over a long period of time. My way, not Hollywood or X-Box.

    The most difficult influence to overcome has been friends. When they come to my house, they want to run around with toy guns and shoot at each other. Even more of this goes on at other kid’s houses. That’s just going to happen, no matter what anyone tries to do to stop it. If little boys don’t have toy guns, they’ll use their fingers to shoot at each other. In this case, it seems that the best that I can do is to hold the line on the difference between play and reality. We constantly talk about the fact that kids should never point a real gun at someone, and that real guns don’t shoot nerf darts. Sometimes, we even call the nerf play “training”. To reinforce what I am telling them, we go to the range and shoot some real guns, so they can understand the difference.

    For me and my grandsons, shooting is “our thing”. I have a really nice ten-meter range in my photo studio, and I shoot my airguns every day. In preparation for teaching the boys how to shoot, I’ve acquired a couple of airguns that are the right tools for the job. Although I still have the Daisy 99 with which I leaned to shoot, the one that fits best, and they enjoy shooting the most is an older, steel-framed IZH-61, set up with target peep sights. Man, the 9-year-old really makes me proud with that one. Standing in the wings is a scoped HW30S Deluxe, for when they get older. All of the boys get drilled with the rule that shooting guns is something that they do with an adult. If they want to shoot, all they have to do is ask. Curiosity is particularly compelling if it is unfulfilled.

    Lastly, I just want to say that I don’t limit passing on the experience of age to shooting. When the boys get older, I would like to think that they didn’t learn to drive by playing Grand Theft Auto, or that they learned about family relationships by watching reality TV. Grampa’s got a lot of work to do.

    – Jim in KS


  12. Excellent write B.B.!
    My initialization to guns was the shock value of the destruction that could be done with them. Way before school I remember going to the range in our old station wagon, loaded down with all kinds of stuff to shoot. I also remember my Mom being planted firmly on her buttocks when she inadvertently pulled both triggers at the same time on her first side by side shotgun,I don’t know if Dad let that happen on purpose or not but I’m sure she didn’t feel very loving when we got home (she mentioned bruises more than once during our 35 mile backroad return trip) By age 7 I had saved enough for my RedRyder so I had a gun I could shoot anytime. After my parents’ divorce my Mother had remarried and relocated to Kansas and not a gun in the house. My new step-Dad took my Brother and me to a 4-6 hour class( required in Ks. before acquiring a hunting permit) before he would even buy a co2 BB pistol, after that It was On.a few years later he was involved in an accident that severely crushed and almost amputated his right leg and instead of going to work we harvested fish & game like a day job! All this training and trigger time really paid off when I was in Basic training with a M-16 that jammed on every round, requiring the Rangemaster to reactivate the weapon(adapted for rimfire with 40 rounds @ 40 yds, 8 in each position+ sight-in) Mine all went inside a softball but hit at 10:00 so no Marksmanship badge for me but after seeing some of the groups that did qualify,I’d still keep mine for combat purposes.
    I’m still learning. Matter of fact that’s why I’m here!
    Thanks B.B!
    Reb


  13. This is way off topic, although I agree completely with this subject matter. I’m trying to decide between a Diana 48 and a Diana 460. I know the 460 is supposed to be more powerful, but I’m concerned with the more efficient design and if they will “weather the storms” equally or not. I’ve read about seal burning and burning on the 460, but don’t know if that is really true anymore. If the 460 is as durable and well designed as the 48, I guess it would be the better gun as far as longevity and desirability in the future. What are your thoughts, comparing these two?
    Thanks for your far-ranging experience in these things and for letting the rest of us know important things.
    Skip


    • Skip,

      No need to stay on-topic here. Welcome to the blog.

      I have tested the 4560 Magnum and owned several 48s. I can’t tell you about seals burning but I do feel the 48 is the choice I would make. It’s more compact and has all the power I would ever need in a spring gun.

      I would also choose .22 caliber.

      B.B.


    • I ‘ll agree with BB on the 48 , but I have not shot the 460, It came out after I’d gotten the 48 . I have the less powerful 46 E in .22 , which is an entirely different rifle being a tap loader. My 48 in .22 cal is tuned to deliever 23 ft/lbs with the JSP jumbo pellets. Easy to tear down , and easy to sling, scope and shoot. The only issue would be if you were left handed. It is the most powerful air rifle that I own, and i bought mine after i had owned the 34 in .22 that I mentioned in yesterdays comment section for a few years. It’s a little heavier than some others ,but it is shorter than most powerful springers.


  14. No problem and no apologies needed. Considering the varied nationalities of the various followers of this blog it’s way too easy to get mixed up as to who is from where. If I can’t find Locktite I’ll try the suggestion of Pete of the Caribbean of using plumber’s tape although I think the Locktite is a more permanent solution.


    • Siraniko,

      After cleaning/degreasing your screws and screw holes, using a non permanent adhesive for your williams peep sight to clamp without moving is good advice.

      Make sure you also clean the grooves on your gun that it will be clamping to as well.

      If you can’t find LOCTITE (correct spelling) good sticky substitutes are rosin (old school on guns) or contact cement will work.

      No matter what you use follow the directions….let the loctite completely dry before shooting. If using contact cement coat both parts first, let dry then assemble, etc., etc.

      kevin


    • Siraniko
      There is something else I mentioned in the past you could try if you can’t find Loctite. We do it at work sometimes.

      You can put two setscrews in the place of the one bolt. Tighten up the first set screw. Then take the next setscrew and grind a point on it with a bit of a long angle. Then put that setscrew in on top of the first one. When you tighten up. The point will push on the center of the setscrew where your Allen wrench would go. It will push on the first set screw and engage the threads tighter. It will not work loose and it doesn’t take much pressure tightening up on the second setscrew with the point.

      We use that also if your first setscrew has to stop at a given depth where the hole and thread go all the way through. When you put the pointed setscrew in it will not turn the inner setscrew that you have adjusted to depth. It will just touch and push the setscrew to engage the threads. It will lockyit in place very tight with very little effort.



        • Another substitution I found was an old tire marking pencil, which should still be findable, its a white gummy crayon that spreads thin and coats the threads great and stays pliable, so while it gums the threads up and kills any vibration or movement its not actually going to cure and be hard to come off.


          • RDNA
            We used those back in the day to restore the white letter tires on our muscle cars. I forgot all about them. That should work pretty good because it does dry out a bit.


  15. Parenting is definitely not for the week of heart 😉
    My sons are now 11 & 13.
    And much of what you say I’ve found to be all too true…kids are so inquisitive…and always testing a parents boundries in one way or another.
    And I feel that, as you say, children are pretty much the same as they have always been.
    (an interesting story…the classical composer/pianist Liszt was considered to be the ‘bad boy’ of the music scene in the mid 1800’s. It got to the point that concert halls would not book him because the audience, most young tended to trash the halls after the concert LOL)
    What has changed to some degree is parenting. Too many parents today (I feel) are so caught up in their own lives that they have children and then too often throw them to the proverbial wind…by which I mean surround their kids with video games and consoles (some of which should carry an ‘R’ rating) and let the children spend hours absorbed in some unrealistic fantasy world while they are off working those extra hours to put the 2nd SUV in the garage. (as you can guess this is a personal gripe of mine)
    We decided to have children and with that came the decision to give up a lot of our time to bring them up (which I know…the majority of parents do…it’s the 25% that don’t that bring up the troublemakers).
    From an early age…6 years and with their Red Ryders they were taught that any safety infraction…no matter how small meant the gun (and those were and still are cherished possessions for them) went away for a week.
    The result was that I’ve had comments from our rangemaster that he feels safer when they are on the range then more than a few of our adult members.
    The guns are always kept in a locked gun safe..with trigger locks to boot. This goes for both powder and airguns (well, truth be told I don’t trigger lock the Red Ryders).
    I do this not so much for them…but because they do have friends over. And I don’t trust anyone I haven’t personally brought up.
    Good grief…I could go on and on, but I’ll leave it at that for now 😉



      • Hey B.B…I don’t comment as often as I used to because others have more relevant things to say…but I read every single day!!
        A recent happening in our family hi-lights exactly subtle differences that are at play in todays world.
        My sons both like car racing video games…things like Forza and such. Just slightly behind games like Halo or Modern Warfare (all of which they have strict time limits).
        They ‘game’ alot with two brothers they know (who just also happen to be their best friends), who fall into the category I mention in my above rant.
        It recently came up in a discussion with their parents (they are actually quite nice and we are friendly) about what is going to be under the tree this year at Christmas.
        They are getting steering consoles for their X-Boxes….to the tune of $500. The cost of course is immaterial….and it is their Christmas present so who am I to complain in truth.
        But…my boys are getting RC trucks. About the same price. But these things have interchangeable gear ratios, you have to tailor the spring/shock ratios for different tracks and they have onboard temperature sensors to keep track of motor and gearbox temps during a race..
        Call me old fashioned…but which is going to give the kids a better understanding of how a car actually works…and what has to be done to make it perform properly.
        The only downside is that sadly, for the first time in 6 years there won’t be a gun under the tree. 🙁



          • We talk about that at work. They can’t get kids to come work at our machine shop. They don’t want to get dirty and have no desire to learn about it. And what’s crazy is they will start them out making good money. Very few will make it a whole week.

            They won’t hire somebody under the age of 18. My oldest girl likes girl stuff but she is a tomboy for sure. I think she gets it from my mom. But she has a job waiting for her when she turns 18 in not quite 2 years. She can’t wait. The youngest daughter will probably work in a office or on computers or something. But I could be wrong about her and I don’t reason know if I want them to be in this type of work either.

            In the older days it was the job to have. I never got layed off and always had so much work we couldn’t keep up. Always overtime available.

            I think them times are changing. A lot of machine shops in our area have closed up. So for this place I work at to be around for 30 years just may not happen.

            Maybe the kids are seeing something us old timer’s ain’t seeing.


  16. Gun safety/proper handling of guns is a topic I’m passionate about.

    Kids are just as curious today as they were 200 years ago. The mixture of guns, kids and many adults is more dangerous today than 200 or even 50 years ago because today guns aren’t the common everyday tools that they once were. There’s a broad lack of experience in the USA with guns because our need for guns has diminished.

    Not uncommon to find an adult today that has never fired a gun. Not uncommon to find an adult that is so prejudiced towards guns that they don’t even want to learn how to handle them safely. Of course their prejudice is passed along to their kids through vocal opposition to guns or at least the osmosis of attitude. Ignore. Deny deny.

    When you mix kids and/or adults that are ignorant of gun safety with guns you get accidents that could and sometimes do result in death.
    For this reason I’m passionate that everyone of every age learn to safely handle a gun no matter what their opinion of guns might be.

    IMHO, we, the people that read this blog share this responsibility to teach gun safety to everyone.

    kevin



    • Like CSD , I have two boys who are 10 and 13 . One thing we do is to take our kids shooting , and become proactive in firearms issues and training. I had my boys involved in 3-D archery league sponsored by a local church group this past summer and they loved it. There were many kids there aged 5-16 years old , and about 40% were girls. Unfortunately there are no programs like that in our school here anymore., and we are a rural area where hunting is popular. A lot of kids don’t have an outlet, and those non -shooting adults you mention are often their parents. Many of the other parents of kids ,who hunt and shoot and attend our school are afraid to promote responsible recreational shooting. programs /education. There are more of us out there than they think, and as you say, it’s about time more of us speak up.



  17. I have to say, the observations on “children and guns” should be a ‘must read’ for all.
    As a single guy “WLTPNK” (“With Long Time Partner No Kids”) one of the dangers is what I’d call “Failure to recognize not everyone leads the same life you do.”
    I am repeatedly chilled to the bone with parents making statements like;
    “My child is excellent and tells me EVERYTHING.”
    NO THEY DON’T and you’d be terrified beyond description if they did.
    “My little girl has no interest in guns of any kind so it ‘s safe to leave the automatic in the sock drawer.”
    Which may be true about your little princess but is to ignore that she’ll inevitably bring home a new dumbell boyfriend who will want to play with it, with predictable death and/or lifetime crippling injury.
    Read the newspapers. Happens every day.
    That’s not even to mention a further lifetime of legal nightmare in many or most states for “maintaining a loaded firearm accessable to a child.” In other words, the automatic in the sock drawer can and will lead to YOU wearing an orange jump-suit doing time in a locale not of your choosing.
    And deservedly so.
    It needs to be understood that human children really don’t have good sense, nor little or any real idea of the consequences of their actions.
    That’s why they’re children.
    And we adults are OBLIGATED to keep them safe from their not-yet-formed maturity.
    My policy is, if children (of any age, including some characters well into their 40’s,) are coming to the house, anything launching a projectile or with a sharp or pointy end on it gets locked up. Most kitchen items are somewhat exempt, but my Katana and HTG Rapier and Compound Bow are definately hidden/locked up.
    The terriers are somwhat harmless, and as they have many Human and Canine-American friends, they get to stay out. If they had opposed thumbs, it would be a different story, though. (The SUV would be gone and I’d be getting calls from the Highway Patrol, not to mention mysterious charges on my MasterCard.)
    Seriously, and again, the children have no good sense. Honestly, many nominal adults neither have good sense. We don’t need any more laws but it’s possible for us to…minimize… the situation by practising good sense ourselves.
    If you ain’t there, lock-em up.


    • 103David,

      You’re right — people don’t act the way we think they do. And children are NOT young adults. They ARE NOT born with “rights.” Rights are conferred by their parents, not by society, and only as they are ready for them.

      Or at least that’s the way it works in my Utopia.

      B.B.


      • Good report,My grandson was suspended for two days because he made an
        outline of a gun with his hand at another student .He was told the school
        has a zero tolerance policy.My god”When I was a kid in High School we had a rifle club
        and we were allowed to bring our guns to school and have them stored in the office
        Then after school we would pick them up and go to the range across town.
        We had them in cases and took the bus back and no one blinked an eye.
        What a difference today”With the mind set of most people,guns are evil.
        I always taught my kids to respect firearms long before it was trendy to do so
        and to this day they still do and we still go hunting and shooting whenever we can.
        I Wish we could return to those golden days of the past,But we can’t”
        But as long as responsible people do what you wrote in the blog,I think it
        will be better for all of us.But a few bad eggs spoil it for everyone else


  18. BB and all.
    This is off subject. I was going to ask this the other day and didn’t get around to it.

    I save my pellets and melt them. Usually they are in a old pellet tin and I heat them up with a propane torch. You know the blue bottles with the screw on head. It takes a bit of time to get them to melt. Then I go to the next tin. I’m sure that’s not very efficient that way. And I don’t skim them to get the lead clean. I usually use the them as targets.

    I was thinking about making a pellet swager like you talked about in the past for that .25 cal. Hatsan break barrel with the gas spring I got. So I wanted to melt the old pellets I recovered and skim them clean all at one time then pour them in the tins for further use.

    Is there something that I could get that’s cheap to do what I’m talking about instead of the torch and tins? And what are you using to skim with? I hope this isnt a bigger process than what I’m thinking.




      • BB
        OK I read the report about the lead melting.

        Two questions for now.
        I’m not going to mix any tin with the lead. I may only do 50 pellets if you will at a time to try the fit and weight and accuracy of the pellet I swage. The swage will be made out of bar stock like you talked about before and the pellet will look like the .20 cal. Sheridan pellet.

        OK here is first question. Do I need the bee’s wax if I don’t mix tin with the lead because I will be swaging instead of molding. Or does the bee’s wax need to be there to keep the lead together also.

        Second question. I have a old fry daddy I believe its called deep fryer. Do you think it will get hot enough. I believe it goes to 400 degrees. Or I have a old propane burner that was used for pan frying fish or boiling water or coffee on when camping. I don’t know how hot it gets to boil water and I think it would do that if I turned it up a little over half way.


  19. When I was in Boy Scouts we were given a course in firearms safety. Part of that course was a trip to the Cayuga County Sportsman Club’s range for some hands on.. Part of that was seeing a whole water Mellon shot with a 220 Swift. It just vanished in a cloud of red haze.That was in the mid fifties.

    I took my daughter, niece, son and nephew in the mid eighties when they were all around 8 years old, along with a head of cabbage, a 357 magnum and a 22-250 out in the woods behind our cabin on Cayuga Lake. Had the four of them taking turns carrying the HEAD of cabbage to a safe shooting spot. Shot the cabbage with there pistol. they all got a chance to stick their fingers in the entrance hole and their fists in the exit hole. We then talked about what would happen to a person’s head in the same scenario. The 22-250 vaporized it. We found one piece of it about the size of a maple leaf..

    Fast forward a couple of decades, my son, nephew and myself were sitting around at Thurston’s, a 500 yard rifle range, after an enjoyable shooting succession, chewing the fat. I sat back and listened to those two men talking about that head of cabbage.

    This summer I had the honor of watching my son and his wife give my grandson and daughter the same lesson with his head of cabbage.

    A most effective demo that I humbly suggest you all include in your own safety programs.

    When I was a kid, most every farm house had one or sometimes two loaded guns by the back door, a single shot 22 and 12 gage shotgun. No one picked up one of those guns and treated it as a play toy. It just was not done. We all knew better.

    Mr B


    • The head of cabbage sounds a lot like a day at the range with my Dad in the early ’70’s and probably cheaper than cantaloupe 🙂 and more resilient . He worked for a man named Bob Manning building and tuning firearms up til about ’78 and we had plenty of explosions at the range.It’s a big wake-up when you see that kind of catastrophic reaction from that kind of range!


    • Bruce your last paragraph is pretty much the way it was when I was a kid.

      And we use to pick the bad tomatoes of the plants the bugs or animals would get and shoot at them. I do the same with my daughters. Fun stuff.


    • Gotta stay prepared for them Chicken Hawks and things that go bump in the night,Usually a coon or possum rummaging through the burn barrel which was lighted but there’s also Coyotes that’ll make ya want a flashlight and laser.


  20. Adults who always do as they are taught,, when no one is watching,,, are rare, indeed. Children who always do as they are told,, when no one is watching,,, well,, I don’t think there ARE any. But, of course,, there are parents,, and grandparents, who believe with all their hearts that THEIR’S are the exception to this. God bless you.

    Home and personal protection with firearms is a two edged sword. To not accept that there is a real risk involved with having a loaded weapon accessible to you in your home when there are children there, also,, is not realistic. and the word use above,, ALWAYS,, is the key. It only takes once, to be a tragedy.

    For me, the choice is easy. If I’m not in the room with it,, in the safe.
    Ed


  21. Excellent Blog BB!!

    I have always had the “show them so they understand the dangers” approach. You can’t always be there to protect them. And “them” does not have an age range – it applies to everyone who is unfamiliar with the potential danger of a tool or product or whatever.

    My sister (as an adult) inadvertently made a bomb when she put the 5 pounds of chlorine (a violent oxidizer) my Father requested and the 5 pounds of ammonium nitrate (fertilizer) my Mother requested in plastic bags in the same package and shipped it to them in northern Quebec by plane!! She didn’t know. Fortunately the thin plastic survived the rough handling and no one was injured. My Father almost had a stroke when he opened the box!

    Been lucky with my kids that they have good sense and know to ask when dealing with something they don’t understand.

    Vana2


    • Vana2,

      You brought back a wash of memories from my childhood. When I was a kid and living in NJ, I recall a surprising number of news stories about housewives who were unfamiliar with the hazards of ammonia and chlorine. When cleaning fluids with each of these chemicals were combined, many of these women ended up in the hospital because they were overwhelmed with the dangerous fumes. My father was a chemist, and he couldn’t believe that people didn’t know that they shouldn’t mix these 2 chemicals.

      Edith



        • Here’s a story I’m telling on Tom.

          When we were first married, he often made fun of me because I wasn’t exactly a free & adventurous spirit 🙂

          One day I was trying to get rid of a stain in the white kitchen sink. I’d tried some Comet, which contains chlorine, but it didn’t work. Tom saw me, heard my dilemma and told me to add some other liquid I had there. I told him you can’t combine them. He then began to dance around the room mocking me for being so stiff and unbending and said, “Oooooh, we can’t mix them. It’s against your rules.” He also said some other things, but you get the gist of it. When he was done, I told him you can’t mix the 2 because one has chlorine & the other has ammonia, and the vapor from the mixed chemicals can be deadly. It took a minute or so before that sunk in. I remain satisfied that I’m the sane one in our household 🙂

          Edith



  22. Great post. Wish I had time to do it more justice but that would mostly be to agree with everything. The consequences of failure are irreversible. As someone commented online about the guy who was shot in the head while instructing a 9 year old girl on an Uzi: He won’t be making that mistake again. Kids are indeed curious and will get themselves in way over their head. When very young, I and my brother mercilessly hounded my mother for cheap toy rifles. I don’t know if they were popguns or just for show. My Mom noticed that the cheapo muzzle was made of sharp tin. So, to prevent my brother and I from using them without supervision, she placed them on top of a piece of furniture out of our reach. We were up early the next morning and as clever and resourceful characters, we managed to get hold of the forbidden rifles. We then commenced to play urban combat, charging at each other around corners. The last thing I remember was whipping around a corner and seeing a final image of my brother charging forward with the rifle up before he ran the end right into my eye. The pain was unspeakable and I suffered a major injury that was not fixed until not long ago with laser surgery.

    Yes, vice and certain personalities can combine for amazing results. Look into the history of the Sawney Bean family in Scotland. A certain natural low-life left home and ran into his counterpart. They started an incestuous family that numbered 30 or 40 people and lived in a cave, killing and cannibalizing travelers to support themselves.

    Yes, Wulfraed, I rotated the adjustable objective on my scope, and it is really screwed in every configuration. Gunfun1, I call dry nitrogen so because Wulfraed did, and he is very knowledgeable about these things. 🙂 Wulfraed? My guess is nitrogen can combine chemically with water as is done in the earth’s atmosphere. So, even though nitrogen is put into scopes to prevent water condensation, it is necessary to remove water from the nitrogen first. That’s all I know about nitrogen.

    Speaking of failsafe, here is the latest in my attempts to safely store my reloading supplies. I have built a cubical bunker consisting of 240 pounds of sand in sandbags lining the inside of a cardboard box. The flammable materials are inside of an unsealed metal ammo can open to admit air at the heart of the cube. The whole box is covered with a fireproof/waterproof tarpaulin. Then, I had a thought. The sandbags are supposed to prevent fire from reaching the powder and to contain a blast if it should occur. But what if the sandbags themselves catch fire? The material is plastic, and sure enough it will burn although not readily. If it should, the bags will break and the structure will collapse, hopefully smothering any flames. Still, I am now putting the powder jars inside a fireproof bag. So we have powder inside the fireproof bag inside the metal ammo can inside the sandbag cube inside a cardboard box under a fireproof/waterproof tarpaulin. What do you think? Is there any flaw in my defense or improvement that I have overlooked?

    Matt61


  23. Speaking of that NRA program, another thing about that way of handling things (go in another room and tell an adult about a firearm) is there may not be another adult present. Maybe an adult leaves their kid in the house with a firearm present.

    And, keep in mistakes happen. And when they do, don’t make your child feel bad about it if it wasn’t major. Teach them the right thing to do, not how to not do that again. How-to, not what not to do. Kids have an odd way of putting things they did wrong on themselves, which I don’t understand fully but it just happens.


  24. The situation in the UK with airguns are that it’s an offence as of 2012 to not provide reasonable security from the airgun for minors, after a few cases of kids shooting each other, use of a locked cupboard or trigger lock (often supplied)
    As for the case with firearms, home defence of this sort is not seen as a particular priority over here, there are less guns around overall, most criminals don’t have them, because most victims of crime don’t and vice versa…there are cases, but the odds are unlikely enough to not bear the accident statistic. It is because of this, and two high profile massacres that guns with a specific “human killing” purpose…ie handguns and automatic weapons are banned.
    Though US readers often comment on this as a restriction, there are a few fundamental differences, the main one geographic, we all live cheek by jowl over here in relatively small houses, with limited public space, if someone gave me an AR15, I actually can’t think of anywhere I could shoot it that wouldn’t hold a fairly decent risk of a dead dog walker.
    Some gang style violence does exist on some of the larger social housing estates exists, but tends to be sporadic single shootings between gang members that the Brit public see rather as Darwinism in action.
    The culture here is very different, in US movies, problems are always solved by the hero with the gun, and the gun has a starring role, and it’s culturally ingrained.
    My guess, is after a thousand years or so of armed warfare in Europe, we kinda know that the problems can actually start with the gun.
    The second amendment strangely is lifted entirely and verbatim from English law…


    • Dom,

      Yes, problems can start with a gun but if you’re unarmed these problems can grow into a dictatorship and you could find yourself herded onto a train headed for an oven.

      Our second amendment was not “lifted entirely and verbatim from English law…”

      Some argue that James Madison was influenced by England’s Declaration of Rights when he made the first draft but many scholars disagree for a variety of reasons.

      kevin


  25. In my family a kid is given a gun, typically a .22 for their first birthday. When they get old enough to show interest in their fathers guns they are showed the guns in the safe including the one that belongs to them. Over the years they are allowed to handle it, and eventually shoot it. Because it takes so long to earn each bit of responsibility, there is no way I(or any kid I’ve encountered yet) was going to break any of the rules about guns and loose that privilege. I’m not saying this is for every family. But hunting is a way of life for us and this works great.


  26. Howdy Mr. BB, Ms. Edith & the Gang, Ain’t got no curtain climbers, but do have “kids”. They’re all either gloss black & chrome, or go bang when I tickle ’em. Kinda sad, cuz I could learn ’em all about gun safety, cuz I already know it all, here hold my beer & I’ll show ya…
    Shoot/ride safe ya’ll,
    Beaz



      • Howdy Gunner, here everyday, but with you, B-dawg, R2D2, & Reb cacklin’ away like a buncha ‘ol hens, there’s no room for me ta post anymore!?! Thanx for askin’, yeah, still chasin’ that “holy grail” consistent, 23 yard quarter inch group w/T-Rex. Managed a .260 a couple weeks ago but most are still around .350. Poor me, practice, practice, practice!?! Hope you’re doin’ awesome, bud.
        Shoot/ride safe,
        Beaz


        • Beazer
          Sounds to me like you still got it with that T-Rex. (its been awhile since I heard it called that)

          And please don’t let us stop ya from post’n. Jump on in. I know you got plenty to share. And I would sure buy another round here if I could.

          And yep do’n pretty good. Enjoying my air guns every chance I get. See ya.


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