by Tom Gaylord
Writing as B.B. Pelletier
Sig P320 pellet and BB pistol.
This report covers:
- The test
- Air Venturi Steel BBs
- Hornady Black Diamond BBs
- Analysis
- Trigger
- Belt reliability
- Air Venturi Smart Shot BBs
- Evaluation
Today I look at the accuracy of the Sig Sauer P320 pellet pistol with BBs. These combination guns can sometimes be great with both BBs and pellets, but usually they are good with one and not as good with the other. The difference is due to the size difference of the projectiles. We will look at the accuracy with pellets in Part 4, so today it’s just BBs.
The test
I shot from 5 meters (just over 16 feet) with the pistol resting on the UTG Monopod. I was seated, so only the pistol was being tested — not me. This pistol has good crisp sights for target work, though they are not adjustable.
I decided to test two steel BBs and one lead BB. That way most of your questions are addressed. There’s no guarantee I found the most accurate BBs, but if another one is better it shouldn’t be by that much.
Also I would like to point out that except for the Daisy 499, no BB gun should be considered a target gun. I test on targets because they provide a record we can all see, but a BB pistol is for action targets like soda cans and plastic soldiers.
Air Venturi Steel BBs
First to be tested were Air Venturi Steel BBs. I used a 6 o’clock hold and the first shot struck about a quarter-inch below the bull at 7 o’clock — very close to where I was aiming. Ten BBs went into an open 3.517-inch group. The group was much taller than it was wide, measuring just 1.225-inches wide.
Ten Air Venturi Steel BBs went into this 3.517-inch group at 5 meters.
Hornady Black Diamond BBs
Next I loaded 10 Hornady Black Diamond BBs and tried my luck. These spread a little wider than the Air Venturi BBs, at 1.614-inches, but they weren’t as vertical, at 1.915-inches. The vertical measurement is also the size of the group.
Ten Hornady Black Diamond BBs made this 1.915-inch group at 5 meters.
Analysis
Looking at these two groups I would say the Sig P320 is accurate enough for targets that are very close, but it’s not as accurate as many BB pistols that are dedicated to shooting BBs — pistols that don’t shoot pellets also. But we are not done. There was one more test I wanted to conduct.
Trigger
This trigger is definitely a double action pull. Advancing the belt doesn’t take much effort, but the final pull is a bit heavy for precision work. Actually, though, that makes this air pistol a good trainer, because it does have a nice DA pull. You would pay hundreds of dollars to get a Colt or S&W revolver’s trigger to this level.
Belt reliability
I have tested many belt-fed airguns over the years and the Sig P320 has the most reliable feed I’ve encountered. I know this was a concern for some readers. I can tell you this pistol has never skipped a beat in all the testing I’ve done.
Air Venturi Smart Shot BBs
I knew someone would ask if I had tried Air Venturi Smart Shot BBs in the P320. It has a rifled barrel and they would wonder how that might bear on accuracy.
Ten Smart Shot BBs went into 3.331-inches between centers at 5 meters. That’s pretty big for shooting that close.
Ten Air Venturi Smart Shot lead BBs made this 3.331-inch group at 5 meters.
Evaluation
I’m glad I took the time to concentrate on just BBs today. If I had shot both pellets and BBs in the same test we all might have wondered whether I had given the Sig P320 pistol a fair trial. I feel today’s test was fair and thorough. Ten-shot groups tell you so much more than 5-shot groups, and we see that the P320 shoots roughly the same regardless of what kind of BB it’s shooting.
G’day BB,
Off topic!
Ever had that sinking feeling on hydraulic chairs?
Try applying Ballistol to the chrome shaft and move it around and up and down.
The chair I am sitting on now has lasted for about 8 weeks…so far with 1 or 2 let downs.
Another potential use?
Cheers Bob
Mine must be a gas piston design. I drilled it through and but a 1/4″ bolt w/nut clear through it. There was a definite “hiss” when I hit certain point in the drilling. Permanent fix. 🙂
Good Day all,…. Chris
Hey, maybe it will work on tired or leaky gas springs, most especially those on the rear hatches of cars?
Bob,
As a loss leader item for your next yard sale? 😉
B.B.
Bobfrom Oz,
The only thing that would prevent my office chair from sinking as I sit on it is my losing 50 or more pounds! (Unfortunately, I am not joking.)
Michael
Michael,
I can relate. Several years ago I lost 40# in 2 months with little effort. Now, at mid 50’s,… it has taken 2 months to loose 15#, basically doing the same thing. It does not get any easier to loose weight for sure. Conversely,… it would seem much easier to gain.
Still going in the right direction, but man is it ever slow. Some days it does not seem worth it. Some of the newer guidelines would have a person looking down right malnourished if one was at the low end of the scale. No plans on giving up,… but I do love to cook.
Idea: No food until 300 shots are done. ? Not only will I loose more weight,… but my shooting should certainly improve as well. Hey,… just thinking outside the box here,…. 😉
Chris U
Nobody said anything would be easy.
But I like that. I think you should market that idea and make a video even.
Never would of thought how much of a benefit air gun shooting could be. 🙂
Bob,
I almost forgot. Over the weekend I will have a small electronics job to do that will involve soldering pure silver coated solid copper bus wire. The wire has no insulation or coating, so after I solder it, I will use a cloth to apply a film of Ballistol to protect the silver from tarnishing. BTW, this will not be exposed to heat, so there will be no risk of the Ballistol igniting.
Michael
It’s very embarrassing when you accidentally kick the adjustment lever on these chairs while teaching a class and drop down in front of the students.
Matt61
BB,
It may be able to shoot BBs, but it is definitely not the ammo of choice for this pistol. It can be quite unnerving to allow a feral soda can to get that close before killing it. If you miss at that range you are in serious trouble, although with thirty rounds available you might be able to get off more than one shot if you are quick.
I have a feeling the pellets will do better.
GF1,
I hope so.
B.B.
Do you feel that shooting steel bbs thru a rifled pellet gun could have a detrimental affect on barrel life or accuracy when shooting pellets?
Coduece,
This question is asked a lot. I think the answer is, “No.” Too many pellet and BB pistols have existed for a half-century with no real complaint arising that I think the danger is in our minds.
Maybe if the guns were shot a half million times there would be some damage, but that doesn’t happen.
B.B.
Upon further thought the bbs are coated with substances that are softer than steel zinc,copper and in the case of the Black Diamond some proprietary material so probably not a problem with barrel wear.
Coduece
I think that’s probably the trick to protecting the rifling in a barrel when the steel bb’s are shot.
But on another thought I do my best to protect the rifling in my expensive guns. Hate putting something in them that could damage the rifling or crown or lead in chamfer on the breech end.
As BB say’n. Probably all of n the mind but still. I just feel better that I’m trying to keep my gun shooting accurately.
Right BBs for BB guns, pellets for both if the gun is accommodating.
Coduece
Yep. Buy just not for mine.
🙂
Slightly off topic, but why does the relationship between pellet size and bore diameter seem to affect accuracy so much more than the similar relationship in firearms?
Rambler,
I don’t know which firearms you are referring to, but bullet size is extremely critical to all the calibers I know. Just as one example, and I can give hundreds, the older .22 Hornet rifles have a 0.223-inch bore and require 0.223-inch bullets, while the current .22 Hornet bores are all 0.224-inches and need bullets of that size. The difference is either a 1-inch 10-shot group at 100 yards or a 4-inch 10-shot group from the same rifle.
B.B.
Rambler/B.B.,
I’ve seen it both ways, where accuracy was and was not affected. I’ve seen a Ruger Blackhawk .357 with the 9mm cylinder used. I thought it wouldn’t shoot good, but it did! It shot great. .9mm is different than the .38/.357 mag. I’ve also read where others has got the convertible Ruger Blackhawk in .357/9mm to shoot well with 9mm also. Now I am not talking match winning as that is the wrong gun for that.
Doc
I should have added, Ruger 22lr/.22mag combos aren’t bad either. I know the 22 mag case is a little different, but I’ve never measured the bullet to see if it’s slightly different too.
Doc,
Yes, the .22 Magnum bullet is 0.224-inches and the .22 LR is 0.223-inches. The smaller bullet is lead with a “heel” that expands when it fires, so the bore on that revolver is probably larger than it normally would be.
B.B.
What brought this question to a head was a recent purchase of a Ruger Blackhawk Elite at a pawnshop. With JSB and RWS pellets I got 1 1/2″-2 1/2″ ten shot groups at twenty yards but with cheap Chinese Beeman Pointed pellets the group could be covered by a dime!
If firearms are just as sensitive to different makes and models of bullets, then maybe the answer is that both bore and ammo sizes are more consistent in firearms than in the airgun world.
It just doesn’t seem like different brands of bullets give such divergent results in any particular gun.
Rambler,
I have an AR-15 that puts 10 handloaded 69-grain Hornady spitzer bullets into 0.375-inches between centers at 100 yards. The same rifle puts 10 off-the-shelf .223 Remington 55-grain bullets into 3+ inches at the same distance.
B.B.
OK! I’ll stop marveling and complaining and be glad that at least airgun ammo is cheap.
Gunfun1 right you are about the controlled nature of open sights. That is the essence of the problem with overglassing with a scope. The magnification that allows you to see the target also shows all of your errors. I heard of an offhand shooter who used a 30x scope under the theory that the errors magnified in the scope would be correspondingly reduced in real life but that doesn’t work for me. 4x is as high as I go for offhand at 100 yards. I thought that the way you managed scope movement in you video was first rate.
LarryMo, right you are about the shortage of medics unless you have private Desmond Doss. And you’re always working against human nature in making people abandon their comrades.
Just completed another airgun test which was to see if my rapid fire practice with the Walther Nighthawk pistol translates to recoiling firearms. Yes! It was a real Red Baron moment to see those sights jumping around, and they remained around the target more or less.
Reenactors rejoice. The upcoming Dunkirk film looks to have great footage of Lee Enfield rifles and maybe even P08 web gear. And there is always Wonder Woman to see and the Black Panther.
Matt61
I certainly agree with you about 4x scopes. That was the most common power back in the 60s & 70s with some going as low as 1 or 1.5 power, since if there were any dot sights they were extremely rare. Also, there was many a hunting article on how to utilize the 4x cross hairs for working out your maximum distance to take a shot – more emphasis in those days on “hunting” and not long range sniping.
Being a Marine in the 60s – 70s I don’t remember any policies about leaving your comrades behind for the corpsmen. You most often did NOT have a corpsman assigned to your squad and the mantra at the time was Marines never leave anyone behind.
Larry from Algona
Matt, that is one of the reasons I don’t like scopes. Without thinking about it, I try to correct the “wiggling” that the scope shows off hand. Then the wiggle becomes worse. If I do use a scope, I too like low power. I like the 1.5-4X scopes. I also have trouble with scopes when the target (or threat) is too close for the scope. I’ve always liked open sights best. Not to say I don’t own some scopes and red dots too, but I just like most open sights.
Doc
Doc Holiday – the problem with all your open sights now is that it’s hard to find a good set that gives you a good picture without those glow bug thingies. I kind of draw the line with my ivory bead front post and express rear sight on my 30-’06 or the red insert front post with white outline rear sight on my S&Ws.
Larry from Algona
Larry
Read my comment to Matt61.
Larry
Oh and that sounds like a cool sight.
Larry,
I don’t have too much problems with them. I used to not like semi-buckhorn and full buckhorn sights, but I learned to use them. I’m not a fan of V type rear sights, but again I can adjust. The glow bug things (firesights) are ok by me too. I either use the light tubes or just pay them no mind. If you can’t do that, I suggest painted them black. Presto, normal open sights. I agree that S&W have some of the best are far as the square notch sights are concerned. Never rule out peep sights on a rifle either. Funny thing, I shot with an old timer once (back in my early 20’s) that had a black powder pistol with no sights. He handed it to me to shoot. I said there is no sights! He said you don’t need them. I shot it and got close to the target, but missed the mark. He reloads it and hits the bulls eye. He said “you just need to learn where the gun shoots, then adjust”. LOL.
Doc
You know what I took probably 15 or 20 shots with my .22 caliber Tx I just got with no sights on it yet. Was shooting a 2 litre soda bottle at 20 yards. And yes after about 3 shots I was hitting every shot. With no sights!
You know that reminds me of something my dad use to always tell me. He would say remember if you don’t know that you can’t do something. You might just surprise yourself when you try and someone says how in the world did you manage to do that.
How do you know something is not possible unless you try.
Doc Holiday
Read my reply to Matt61.
And you know I said this before. Doc Holiday in the movie Tombstone is like my favorite character out alot of different movies I have watched. Just love that movie and Mister Doc Holiday. I can watch that movie over and over.
Gunfun,
Oh I know just about every line in that movie. I quote that movie’s Doc all the time. I own the movie and have watched it so many times I’ve lost count. Tomebstone, The Patriot, Quigley down under, 3:10 to Yuma and so many more westerns I love to watch often!
Doc
Doc
All I can say is yes with a big 🙂
And hmm. Maybe your the first person to leave Gunfun1 almost speechless. Almost. Who would of thought 😉
Matt61
I was going to just post something about standing free hand unsupported shooting. For rifles anyway. But figured I should read through all the posts first.
First off thanks about the video’s. But by far nothing professional. That’s just something I wanted to try was the phone scope camera. And the magnification I used was 4 magnification. I should probably do something again. But only got springers now. Tryed it once on my tuned very smooth shooting .177 Tx I had. The video was blurry when the shot went off. Just to much vibration happening on a spring gun. Well I should say strongly. Vibration a camera can see but we don’t with our eyes.
But here’s what I was going to post. And I might just be stepping in deep water when I say this. It’s a question. Has anybody noticed that when they shoot standing unsupported with a scope that they need to put a little different windage and elevation hold on the reticle than when sitting and bench resting. Maybe not much. But I have had to hold the sights on target a little different than shooting one way or another.
But when I shoot standing unsupported or bench resting open sight or low magnification with a scope I don’t have to change my sight holds for windage or elevation in the same distances I shoot with my scope guns. Talking like 15-50yards. My eyes don’t pick up on what I call the sighting to shot error. With the low magnification or open sights. My eyes don’t really see exactly how much my mind thinks I could be off with my aiming.
With the scope on say higher magnification like 9 magnification and up. It makes me see how much I’m moving. It’s much much harder for me to keep my scope reticle on target shooting standing unsupported then open sights or lower magnification.
And Geo791. I think that’s something you might already be aware of or maybe not with your sparrow pesting to keep them away from your bluebird’s. It’s much harder to stay on aim point unsupported. And then throw in the fact you got to be on the game. Those sparrows don’t just stay there waiting for you to aim for your perfect shot. And I’ll be darn if they like to move just right when you decide to pull the trigger.
So when I pest. I want the most accurate easy to shoot gun I have. Matter of fact I want it so accurate I can’t even imagine how that’s possible. But that’s what I want. I want all conditions to factor out my errors.
Imagine how good that guns got to shoot do that. Actually almost hard to comprehend.
GF1
Maybe my eyes are not as good as yours. Forget about open sights at 25 yards. The front bead is like three times wider than the kill zone on a sparrow. I need to keep my scope dialed up to 9x to get a good image of the target. I don’t shoot offhand if I can avoid it. I open my sliding door and grab the edge of the door and rest the gun on my hand. You are correct is saying that sparrows don’t sit long in one spot and wait for you to get the crosshairs lined up on them perfectly. Matter of fact, they get so wary that as soon as I slowly open that sliding door, off they fly, especially after they have been shot at a couple of times.
Geo
Your not suppose to put the open sights over the target.
You know how BB talks about the 6:00 hold. Well that means put the top of the front and rear sight at the 6:00 position.
That means you should see the sparrows chest or a bit lower above the top of the front and rear sight.
In otherwards where you want to hit should sit on top of the front and rear sight.
So you should still see the sparrow. And side to side you just center the sights the best you can on the center of the sparrow.
Sounds good in theory but the application is much more difficult…at least for me. I removed the scope from my RWS 34 before shipping it to Tom. I went out back and tried shooting some groups with the open sights just to see how I could do. I had been shooting at 25 yards at a 1/2″ bullseye on 1/2″ grids. I couldn’t even see the 1/2″ bullseye. So I printed out some new targets with a 1″ bull…still could barely see that black 1″ dot. I had to move my target in to 15 yards. My groups were so bad I didn’t even record them. I gave up on the open sights really quick.
Oh, and I wasn’t covering the target with the front sight. I was using the 6 o’clock hold as I should.
Geo
I know this is going to sound crazy.
But why don’t you have a true to size sparrow silhouette drawn on a peice of paper. Then put it out at the distance you will be shooting the sparrows at.
Put some on the ground. Or a couple feet off the ground and at how high they can be at that you could place a target without to much work.
Then do some shooting at a given distance. If you can’t hit consistently then move in till you can. That will tell you what you and your gun is capable of.
Tell me what you think. That’s what we did as kids growing up on the farm. Then you will know for real what needs to change to get the result you want.
You know, when I was a kid I thought that my Crosman multi-pump was dead accurate. I never questioned it’s accuracy. If I missed a target I always blamed myself, though I didn’t miss a lot either. Back then I never thought about trajectories, except with a bb gun as I could see those bbs dropping when I shot. I shot that Crosman with open sights too.
Sparrow silhouettes might be fun to shoot at but I wouldn’t get the feedback that I do from shooting a 1/2″ bull with 1/2″ grids on paper targets. I don’t have the option of moving in closer to the sparrows because the area is an open back yard with no trees or anything to hide behind.
The sparrows do learn quickly that landing on the bluebird nesting boxes is not a good place to be, even though I miss them often they soon learn it is a dangerous place to sit. Many people don’t understand why sparrows are so bad. They will attack the bluebirds if they can catch them inside the box and kill them. They will also raid the nest and peck the eggs, then throw them out on the ground. They are vicious little buggers. I have seen the bluebirds fight with then and go right to the ground. The male bluebird is very protective once the female sits on the nest. He watches from a distance for any invaders. It’s strange because the male won’t attack most other birds. He allows the finches and chipping sparrows in the area…just not house sparrows or starlings. I googled bluebirds and once I saw what the house sparrows did, I declared war on them and kill them every chance I get.
I like the tree swallows too and the sparrows try to drive them off too. If I don’t stay right on it, the tree swallows will leave and look elsewhere to nest. They are so fun to watch. Didn’t get any nesting swallows this year for some reason. I miss them. A coon raided the bluebird nest and was able to get all the eggs apparently. When I saw what had happened I immediately went to Home Depot and bought 4″ PVC pipe and put that over the posts so the coon could not climb up to the nesting boxes. Sorry for the longggggg post.
Geo
I grew up on a farm. Sparrows are bad news. They nest in the wood rafters in the barns and would peck out holes in the wood. The next thing you know your roof would be caving in.
And I live out in the country now also. We have blue birds and swallows among other birds. So yep I want those birds around.
You should see what the blue jays and black birds are like. They are rediculous. The black birds and starlings are my number one targets. The blue jays are another story. I believe they are on a protected list so can’t shoot them. But they are very vocal birds and always chase the other birds away from the feeders. I don’t shoot them but I sure go out and chase them away. Well me and my little hunting buddy. A short hair miniture Terrier. He’s a excellent sqerrial and bird dog. He definitely does not like blue jays. And doesn’t bother the song birds. And the swallows which I call my bug birds. They hover around the yard an snatch up bugs.
So yep there is a time for everything as they say.
We love watching and feeding the birds. It gets pretty expensive but it’s worth it. Some of my favorite birds are woodpeckers. I have a 6×6 with 4 holes bored thru it. I buy woodpecker suet & peanut delight suet and cut the suet into 4 strips. I then poke the holes full of the suet. The woodpeckers love it. We have the little downy, the hairy, and the redbelly. I like the redbelly because he is the only bird that will drive the bluejays off. When he comes to the feeder he is the king. I even had a pileated come to the feeder one time. They are magnificent at 18″ long with a 4″ beak and look like woody woodpecker. At once time they were near extinction but have come back in the past few years. They look almost prehistoric and are very wary. Yeah, love those little swallows and yes they eat a LOT of bugs, skimming them from the air.
Geo
I love watching the different ways the swallows can fly. They zip around like lightning around the yard. Then in a split second they slow down and hover. Way cool birds to watch.
And yep we have a few of the big red head woodpeckers as we call them. And little 8″ tall black and white zebra striped woodpeckers. Don’t know the real names for them.
But back to pests. You got to watch the sqerrials too. They will mess up wiring in the attic of your house and will go after baby birds in their nest after they hatch.
Geo791,
Thanks for the background on why you have declared war on the sparrows. Your post was longer than most but not as long as some of the more epic posts by the other members.
Siraniko
Hi Matt61,
I don’t think I ever noticed needing to hold differently at higher magnification, but some years ago, shooting FT with a TX200 and 6-20 power scope, I found I couldn’t shoot with good results at any power above 6X. Today, older and shakier, probably 4X is my max.
As to the problem of hitting small moving targets like sparrows, concentration may have something to play.
Again, some years ago, i was shooting my brother’s AR-7, a .22 LR semi-auto that doesn’t have a very good reputation for accuracy. It had a peep sight, no scope. We were shooting tin cans on a dirt berm about 4 feet high, about 20-25 yards away. I hit, probably just below the can in the soft dirt, and it jumped up several feet in the air, then fell down in front of the dirt bank. While it was falling, I hit it three more times in mid-air. I’ve never done that before or since. Trying to understand how I suddenly became such a good shot, my brother pointed out that it must have been the heightened concentration of hitting the can the first time. After that, instinct took over. I wasn’t consciously aiming, just pointing and hitting. Now if I only knew how to capture that level of concentration again. In marksmanship, I think we are sometimes our own worst enemies. The game is more mental than it seems.
Flintrocker
You got it. I mean dead on. People need to read your comment over and over.
That’s it. But I don’t mean different holds at different magnification. I mean from bench resting with a sight in verses standing in supported.
It seems that I always hit to the right more and up more when shooting standing unsupported verses bench resting. I shoot right handed. I tend to rotate or cant the gun to the left when I hold and pull the trigger standing unsupported. It’s the way the but off the gun fits my shoulder I believe.
But that’s what I was talking about shooting different. I did mention magnification. But didn’t mean it in this case.
Ah, I see what you mean about standing vs bench. Yes, the hold does change, much as you try to make your bench rest hold like your offhand hold. And the POI will change. How much, takes experimentation.
I’ve always been puzzled by those who “sight in” their rifles on the bench to go deer hunting, and immediately quit and call it good. Often they don’t stay at the range a little longer and shoot offhand, or sitting, or leaning against a tree, or any of the situations that commonly come up in the field, to confirm that the rifle they sighted in works when it’s not on a bench.
Flintrocker
Yep that’s what I was trying to explain.
Got to shoot different positions to know how your gun shoots.
Not carved in stone, you understand. Otherwise, I’d have to quit buying air guns, right?
Larry from Algona
I must concur with BB on this. I have an old Crosman Mk II CO2 pellet/BB pistol thats 46 years old thats had hundreds upon hundreds of BBs fired through it as well as thousands of pellets. Main reason for using the BBs is that, in this gun, they shoot almost as accurate as pellets. The BBs did not “erase” the rifling like I thought they might. The rifling is still there just as sharp and deep as the day I took the gun out of the box.
Reallead
Do you still have targets to compare from both bb’s and pellets when you got it till 46 years later?
Would just like to see them. And buy the way what pellets did you use over 46 years?
Oh and what bb’s? Forgot that.
Gunfun1
No, I do not have any shot-up paper targets from 46 years ago. Things like that have a way of getting tossed in the trash after a shooting session. What we (myself and a friend) shot at for fun were bottle caps at 25-30 ft., which were hit at an almost equal number of times with BBs as with pellets. I used ordinary Daisy BBs and National brand pellets, which were made in England. They were the typical bulldog style, English diablos. I bought them locally from a hardware store called OTASCO for under a dollar for a tin of 500. They came in a red, white, and blue can. Cheap in price but not in quality. They were the best pellet that could be had locally at the time-way more uniform that Daisy or Crosman pellets. I havent seen that brand now in decades. OTASCO was the only place they could be found and OTASCO hardware stores are long gone, at least from around here.
Reallead
So really no way to compare the results back then till now I guess. Especially if you don’t have the same pellets to try.
So I guess what your saying is that it can still hit bottle caps at 25-30 ft. with the pellets and bb’s of today. So I guess that’s all we have to compare to. That is if still can hit the bottle caps.
Can it?
Something that kind of puzzles me about using open sights or a low magnification on the scope is that it actually masks the movement. The movement is still there, you just can not see it at a low mag. At least when I use 9x I can see if I am shaking too much to take the shot. A low power setting, or a high power setting does not change the fact that maybe you had too much coffee that day to hold on target.
Geo
But like you said it’s still there in either scenario.
And did you just hear what you said.
“The movement is still there, you just can not see it at a low mag. At least when I use 9x I can see if I am shaking too much to take the shot.”
Like you said the shake is still there. So what shot would you take. The shot without the shake or the shot with the shake?
Sounds to me like you would take the shot with the least amount of shake.
But that means you need to trust the sight your using what ever way you take it. Coffee or no coffee. 😉
Well, there are many variables to consider when evaluating the reason for poor shot groups with these break-barrel springers. Is it the wrong pellet? Is it an inconsistent hold, or wrong hold? Is it bad shooting technique? Or is there a defect in the airgun? My problem has always been trying to determine which of these things, or combination of things, it the cause. My hope is that Tom’s evaluation of my RWS 34P can narrow down this list of causes. If Tom can determine that the rifle in not defective, and that a specific pellet shoots good groups for him, then I can work on the remaining problem…ME!
Geo
That’s why I always mention the words to many variables when trying to shoot consistent groups.
What is hard about the situation is when something is not performing as expected. You have to try a different thing.
Like you mentioned before that you thought about trying a PCP. And a known accurate one by multiple people.
I think that’s a excellent idea. I know it will tell a story once you get some shooting results compared to what you been getting with your spriger.
Might not be the result than one person or another might think will happen. But it will definitely be some good information.
While I catch up on the coment here I am sitting at the kitchen window with a cup of coffee and watching for the chippie to wake up and pop his head up. This is the first morning since I saw him that I have time to watch for a shot.
Gopher
Well was it lights out or what?
The hunt was not a success. He did not show before I had to run some errands. I saw him run off on my return when I got out of the truck. I will try again another day.
Gunfun1
After reading your blog referring to my Crosman Mk II 177 pistol with claims that it can still hit bottlecaps at 25-30 ft., I detected a bit of the apostle Doubting Thomas in you. This intrigued me and I accepted the challenge. Its been several years since I last shot this gun, so, not surprisingly, C02 leaked out of every outlet in the gun it could, even after a generous application of Crosman oil in all the right places. My gun is an earlier version, where the C02 cartridge is pierced by rotating a lever in the base of the piercing assy. 180 degrees. The cartridge is loaded upside down in the grip, for those who dont know. C02 even leaked from that area. But after a couple more cartridges and a little more oil, I finally got the leaks to stop
So now Im ready. But after 46 years, things have changed. The pellet brand the gun liked best has been long gone. I have lots of Eley Wasp pellets, which most closely resembles the National brand, but they’re all .22 caliber. I settled on JSB Exacts. Still not the same but they’ll have to do. The shooter, as well, is 46 years older with cataracts. It went like this-I shot at bottlecaqps placed 28 ft. downrange. I first used Daisy nickle plated BBs. They hit the cap with the first two shots, then the last 3 shots went “all over the place.” Nix the Daisys. Then I tried the JSB 8.4 grainers. Same thing. The first two connected, the next 3 missed, but not by much. So I decided to try shooting for groups, using Shoot N C targets. I used BBs for this test. Hornady Black Diamonds group at 28 ft.: 1.8″. Then I tried some copper plated lead BBs. Their group was 1.4″. I think the brand name is H&N. Dont know for sure since the label on the tin was gone. Then for fun I tried some JSB Heavies which grouped 1.5″. By this time the C02 was beginning to run low so the last 2-3 shots hit low, opening the group.
So there you have it. This is the best I can do with the gun. I might comment that I am not the steely eyed shooter with sharp reflexes that I had as a 20 year old kid back in ’71. I hope this satisfies you.