Black Bunker BM8 survival air rifle.
This report covers:
- Survival rifle
- The “purse”
- The test
- JSB Exact RS
- Crosman Premier
- H&N Baracuda Match
- Shot cycle
- Discharge sound
- Cocking effort
- Trigger pull
- Summary
Today we look at the velocity of the Black Bunker BM8 survival air rifle I’m testing.
Survival rifle
There was some chatter on the blog that the BM8 survival rifle isn’t coming into the United States and BB must have gotten a hand-picked one. No, I didn’t. All Pyramyd AIR is selling at this time is the survival BM8. Yes, it has threads for a silencer. Val Gamerman told me that the non-threaded rifle may be selling in brick and mortar stores but all he is ordering is the survival rifle. He has not ordered the bayonet yet, but there is nothing preventing him from doing so.
The threaded BM8 is the only rifle Pyramyd AIR is selling.
The “purse”
You guys called it a purse — I didn’t. I’m referring to the box that fits inside the rifle when it is folded into a triangle. Will it hold a Crosman 150 pistol? Will it hold a shopping cart? … a semitrailer? This box measures about 7 inches by 8-7/8-inches on the inside. It’s perhaps an inch deep. It is not square but oddly shaped to fit inside the folded rifle triangle. Whatever will fit in that space is what it will hold.
A Crosman Mark I sits on top of the BM8 box.
The BM8 box is just under 8-7/8-inches wide. The dark foam doesn’t go all the way to the left side in this photo.
The BM8 box is about 7-inches in this dimension.
The test
I shot three different pellets in 10-shot strings to test the rifle’s velocity. According to the specs it should deliver around 1000 f.p.s. maximum in the .22 caliber I’m testing.
JSB Exact RS
The first pellet was a 13.43-grain JSB Exact RS dome. The first string of ten varied from 701 to 773 f.p.s. That’s 72 f.p.s. difference. After seeing strings from the other two pellets I threw this first string out and shot a second string. In that one the low was 751 and the high was 790 f.p.s. — a spread of 39 f.p.s. The average was 770 f.p.s. At that speed this pellet generated 17.69 foot pounds of energy at the muzzle.
Crosman Premier
The second pellet I tested was the 14.3-grain Crosman Premier. They also gave a large velocity variation the first time through but when I came back to a second string they varied from 796 to 818 f.p.s. — a range of 22 f.p.s. The average velocity was 809 f.p.s. At that speed the Premier generated 20.79 foot-pounds.
H&N Baracuda Match
The final pellet I tested was the 21.14-grain H&N Baracuda Match dome. By the time I goit to this third string the rifle had settled down and I got a good string on the first try. The low was 645 and the high was 655 — a spread of 10 f.p.s. the average was 650 f.p.s. At that speed this pellet generates 19.84 foot-pounds of energy.
So it is safe to say the BM8 rifle under test generates right at 20 foot-pounds of energy at the muzzle. In no way is the test rifle capable of 1,000 f.p.s. Maybe with trick pellets it can go that fast, but not with something anyone would actually shoot.
Shot cycle
The shot was quick with very little recoil. There is also almost no vibration.
Discharge sound
The BM8 is on the loud side but not overly so. A shot registered 102.5 dB on my sound meter.
Cocking effort
The BM8 I’m testing takes 43 pounds of effort to cock. The butt plate is slick plastic and slipped off my leg several times during cocking. I finally had to cock it with my left arm so I could hold the rifle steady with the right. The BM8 is not my favorite rifle to cock!
Trigger pull
The trigger seems like a single stage with a variable letoff. There is some hesitation at the start, then the trigger starts to move through an arc with no increase in pull. It’s light but vague. I measured the pull at 3 pounds 5 ounces.
Summary
That’s it for the velocity test. The BM8 I am testing is a 20 foot-pound rifle, which is certainly enough power for small game. The trigger is vague and the rifle is difficult to cock.
On the plus side there is very little recoil and vibration. We will look at accuracy with the open sights next. Actually, since this is a survival rifle the open sight test is the most valid one. I will test it with optics, but this rifle was not/is not intended to be a scoped target air rifle.
Tom,
Since this is a gas piston rifle there is going to be no easy way for the cocking effort to be brought down. I wonder though if the muzzle can be practically be extended by threading an extension to it so that it can be easier to cock. It would make for an ungainly rifle though. Or maybe just slip on an extra length of pipe just to make cocking less of a chore for you.
Siraniko
Siraniko,
I beg to differ.
”Since this is a gas piston rifle there is going to be no easy way for the cocking effort to be brought down.”
Have SIG build it; it will be a gas spring, more powerful, much quieter, and have a substantially lower cocking effort required.
I wonder how much more accurate than this “survival” device as well?
It has been done.
shootski
shootski,
Really? Like that is going to happen? Have you not been paying attention? The only airguns that Sig is going to manufacture these days are the ones that the couch commandos will buy. I am not so sure they are “manufacturing” those either. They are not even importing that target air pistol and slapping their name on it anymore.
There is just not enough money in the airgun world to hold their interest, most especially after they were awarded that contract by the DOD. You should consider yourself most fortunate that you managed to snag up those two ASP20’s of yours. Maybe there are enough out there that some aftermarket parts will be available.
Just wondering how many ASP20 rifles were sold. How many would justify setting up to repair them with Sig or made parts?
Deck
Decksniper,
how about a clear dis- and re-assembly video, including component measurements, probably by a capable videographer, a capable gun smith and an owner of a once working ASP20 ?
No, I am not yet aware of such, just dreaming… 🙂
hihihi
Do you know of anyone who has an ASP20 in Europe? Just guessing that sales were so low there and here that Sig called it a failed investment.
Deck
Decksniper,
I only know of one whose ASP20 came from Germany. It has the F in a pentagon mark, which makes me wonder how many might have been destined specifically for the German market?
Decksniper,
One of my SIGs came in a double boxed plain brown set of cardboard cartons. The other rifle came in the same cardboard boxes but also had a graphics sleeve slip fit to the inside box (the box with the fitted closed cell foam insert) that has a longitudinal cutaway detailed engineering drawing (think Blueprint) that appears to be 1:1 and exact.
shootski
Shootski
Just now seeing this as there was no email alert.
“has a longitudinal cutaway detailed engineering drawing (think Blueprint) that appears to be 1:1 and exact.” Maybe someone who wanted to make after market parts could make use of it.
Deck
I have no clue. I would surmise not many really. They were quite expensive and I have as of yet to even see one. About the time they started to catch on with serious airgunners, Sig quit making them.
RR
There was an Sig ASP20 on a table at the 2022 Carolina show in Newton, the day we met. Don’t know if it was for sale or show. I already had mine at the time.
Deck
Deck,
I do not recall seeing it, but I looked at a geegob of airguns that day.
If I did look at it, I may have also noticed the price tag and moved on. I MIGHT give someone up to $200 for a synthetic stock one, but I would likely have to give that some very serious thought. Many of the “old gals” around RRHFWA have moved in for far less than that.
RidgeRunner,
You are of course totally correct in this.
I believe you know me well enough from here on Tom’s blog to get that i prefer first hand experience over couch commando speculations.
I was trying to use my limited first hand experience with gas piston powerplants instead of depending on secondhand knowledge.
I also doubt if SIG USA will ever staff up inhouse to build anything close to their SSG ASP20 ever again.
shootski
I too believe we will never see the ASP20 again. It is a shame really.
Maybe Ed Schulz will be able to bring his experiences with Sig back to Crosman.
Siraniko,
As I said at the beginning of Part 1, this is not an air rifle that I would ever have considered for myself. I’m testing it because one was sent to me and because there seems to be a large group who are fascinated with it. I will test it thoroughly.
BB
BB,
That’s some decent power; the cocking force is high, but this isn’t the kind of rifle you are meant to sit and use for an extended plinking session.
I really hope the accuracy is on par with the power level.
I think you’re right that open-sighted is the way this gun is intended to be used.
That being said, is it possible to remove that rail on top of the rifle?
It looks like it’s just held on by a couple of screws on each side.
It’s certainly an interesting piece; thank you for choosing to review it. 🙂
Blessings to you,
dave
Dave,
I will look at removing the Pic rail but I don’t know that I will do it. And you are right — it is certainly interesting!
BB
BB, yes, sorry, I didn’t mean that you should do that; I was just wondering if it is possible to do that.
A comment to the effect that it’s possible would suffice; thank you. 🙂
Dave,
It certainly seems possible.
BB
It is interesting for sure. If I was a collector I would want it. Now my wife thinks I’m a collector for some reason.
Deck
Sounds like it would work for a truck gun for those unscheduled hunting/pesting chances.
Use the “purse” for a game cleaning kit?
OP,
… or a place to store pellets, etc. I always carry a pocket knife and I have dressed many deer — both roe deer (Reh in German) and whitetails with it.
BB
This thing may not be great for Jackalope hunting. With the bayonet it may be OK, but it is starting to sound like this thing may only be good for snipe hunting. At least you can put any snipe you catch in the “purse”.
I was kind of afraid of that. This is starting to sound like one of those “fishing lure” airguns. I do not have enough years left in me to play around with one of these things. There are too many nice quality airguns out there for me to play with.
Thanks BB for looking at this thing. As I am not likely to go Jackalope hunting, I do not need this.
Jackalope hunting….
Breeze,
The misspelt “propogation” clearly shows it’s a fake, a forgery, a…
wait…
what…
“The Jackalope… often accompanies cowboys singing…”?
Oh ok, bonafide! 🙂
———
What a document! Thanks for making me smile… ! 🙂
edit: my girlfriend too!
My brother’s trophy from the hunt.
Ya notice slingshot only?
Breeze,
yes, I saw that, for example, napalm is out. However, “Slingshot tranquilizing pellets are legal.”
As it does not exactly specify, how those have to be used, I imagine a non-firearm classified shotgun of sorts would be optimal. One would not want to miss a Jackalope on account of their “… Knife-like antlers.” 🙂
Congratulations to Mr. W. Bingham, your brother, who must’ve successfully clambered around the Dakota Territory mountains in the very early morning hours by the light of an almost full moon. It wasn’t atop a president’s head by any chance that he spotted the Jackalope’s ears (and antler)? 🙂
I mentioned Jackalopes to my girlfriend. Then I had to explain… 🙂
Finally, I read out aloud Black Bunker’s closing words on their page featuring this folding-stock breakbarrel airgun. Before I had even finished, she started walking away, saying: “people are stupid”.
____________
Clearly my mistake has been, taking this BM8 thing seriously. I think the people at Black Bunker are much more imaginative and have a much greater sense of humour than I. Must be my German jeans, erm, genes…
Breeze,
That 5,000′ or above altitude limitation for the hunts, even in the full Dakota Territory, is very limiting since most all of the territory is well under 5’000′ MSL (Mean Sea Level)…dang bureaucrats!
shootski
I want one!
This fine mount has been in the family for decades. And will be in his will.
I can well imagine. I can remember as a young kid seeing a mounted Jackalope. It makes me want to get a BM8 with bayonet for myself.
Not sure if the bayonet fits both the threaded and unthreaded or how it is retained on the rifle. The barrel cap or the locking pin that is used to hold it in the folded position.
I emailed the company and suggested they simply sell the bayonet as a stand-alone item that just happens to fit it. That way the responsibility for the rifle with it installed is on the owner who went out of his way to purchase it and install it.
I will assume most collectors will want it to complete the package with all accessories like any other military rifle. Nice to have and display but not really intended for use, other than an emergency, whatever that may be?
So, BB, in hindsight, you never really shoot hundreds of rounds through these ‘new’ rifles being tested to smooth things out a little, do you?
That information about the bayonet was from HAM and I believe he got it straight from the horse’s mouth, sort of speaking, at the gun show. Things change.
Like the way you described the trigger feel. If I pull it real slow, I can feel a slight stop but never know when it will let off exactly.
The piston link has no real pin to hinge on when it engages the piston and travels in a small arch, some smoothing of the metal and the addition of some lube may help with the cocking effort.
Bob M,
I for one do appreciate your insight on this thing. Your personal experiences with the trigger and the piston link add to the knowledge being imparted by BB. This thing seems to be more of a “novelty”, “fishing lure” or “collectable” than anything else. Quite suitable for Jackalope or Snipe hunting, but that is about it. 😉
Maybe you can glue some rubber on the end of the stock to make it not so slippery as BB describes.
RR,
The stock has lots of ridges, as evidenced in the P/A pics, but being composite material and having most of the weight well forward of the pistol grip it just is not that stable resting on it. A small price to pay for a breakdown folding rifle.
I actually just read instructions on how to cock a break barrel. Rest the stock in your lap area and break it open forward, away from you. May help?
The BM8 is shooter friendly like BB mentioned. Almost like a TX200 as far as I can tell. It feels like no other air rifle I own. Not better or worse, just different.
Bob M,
BB’s and your description of the trigger makes this a nonstarter with me. I have too many very nice triggers here at RRHFWA to take such a big step back. Can it be fixed? Maybe.
“Black Bunker BM8 survival air rifle…”
I found it curious to observe an apparent fixation on the 4th word, “survival”, to the exclusion of all others.
So I checked, and discovered that this phenomenon is not unique to us commenters here. Many others, maybe even everyone else online, considers this thing as something that allows one or more humans to survive. Certainly it is marketed as such by Black Bunker.
At black-bunker.com, they say, because it “… can shoot nearly indefinitely… “, it is “… the ideal survival rifle… ” and that it is “..easy to store and transport..”:
“..in a backpack,
car trunk,
motorbike storage box,
shelf or
on your wall.”
Hmm, maybe I didn’t understand the survival situation after all?! 🙂
——–
“purse”
Erm, sorry, if I started that one.
Here’s what I commented below Part One:
“… I was trying to think of other ridiculous devices, wondering whether a similarly folding handgun, with a little plastic purse in the centre, would sell?… ”
Shortly after, another commenter said (in a different conversation) “… pellets and bayonet can live in the purse.”
( https://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2024/02/black-bunker-bm8-survival-air-rifle-part-one/#comment-513545 )
So, us two had originally offered the word, not realising how sticky it was because, in Part Two, it appeared five times in the article itself and even more often in the comments below… 🙂
The writer over at Black Bunker describes it as a “waterproof storage box” or “… case”. 🙂
——-
Personally, I would like to offer an alternative that, once seen in my minds eye, I cannot unsee: lunch box ! 🙂
“I found it curious to observe an apparent fixation on the 4th word, “survival”, to the exclusion of all others.”
hihihi, here in the USA there are many survivalists and preppers.
I’ve worked with a bunch of them.
Some of them have never hunted, or even been out in the woods (LOL! =>).
But most of them had, and many had military experience.
If you have a cool-looking rifle, and it has the word “survival” in its description, you have people who are already looking to buy it…much more so if it gets good reviews.
I’m sure there are many survivalists reading this set of reports, anxious to see what BB has to say.
If his verdict is that it’s a credible piece of kit, I predict there will be many happy campers. 😉
thedavemyster,
isn’t it amazing how many adults have retained their capacity for childlike imagination?!
This reminds me of some enthusiasts who put a lot of energy into dressing up as one of their favourite cartoon characters. Apparently they have big gatherings too, to show off and share their efforts with likeminded people.
Sadly, I am just an old man, although, I am still sometimes awarded a “don’t be silly!”. 🙂
[Air rifle] Field Target shooting versus Cowboy Action Shooting
hihihi, speaking of dressing up, back when Brad Troyer (great guy; his website is here: https://www.airguns.net/) got me into Field Target shooting, I brought my wife down one day to show her our airgun range, and I heard some shooting on another range, so we went over to check it out. The people there were doing Cowboy Action Shooting, and I was most intrigued and wanted to try it out.
Unfortunately for me, my wife chose to have a long conversation with one of the shooters, and the guy she singled out told her that he’d spent ten thousand dollars on all the clothing that he had for events; this, of course, did not include the cost of his two pistols, rifle, and shotgun.
My wife’s reaction was: “You see that guy over there? He told me he has $10,000 invested in just the clothing for this sport! Forget about the guns and gunsmithing! This is not the sport for you; stick with Field Target.”
Hence, my career in Cowboy Action Shooting ended before it even started. 😉
thedavemyster,
$ 10,000.00 just for one man’s fancy dress wardrobe? What a Prima Donna! 🙂
In my ignorance, I must ask, have you ever felt tempted to prove that even less than wealthy people can have fun pretending to be a cowboy with four guns?
————
Edit: I wonder, did you take up competitive muzzleloader shooting as some kind of substitute for Cowboy Action Shooting?
hihihi,
One half of that, “$ 10,000.00 just for one man’s fancy dress wardrobe?” could easily be consumed by the cowboy boots, bolo tie, and
buckle/belt!
And, still needing to get that 10 gallon hat…
shootski
shootski,
what an eye opener! And, oh dear! Sounds a bit like a Rhinestone Cowboy, but with gem stones, ie to suit a Prima Donna mentality…
Oops,
hang on,
HYPOCRITE – ALERT !
Come to think of it, were I to reduce my airgun toys by a couple of revolvers, a lever action rifle and shotgun, what’s left, would still total more than $10K… hmm! 🙁
Still way less than the value of Imelda Marcos’ shoe gallery, hihihi. So, feel no guilt and enjoy your satisfying acquisitions.
Fawlty Manuel,
I believe you are right. Can you imagine the space available… I mean, after all the shoes have been removed?
I bet it would take a while or a Bob M, to fill… 🙂
“Edit: I wonder, did you take up competitive muzzleloader shooting as some kind of substitute for Cowboy Action Shooting?”
Hmm, it may have been partly that, but also it was a good way to get in practical practice for hunting; besides that, I met some great fellow shooters…which is something I have noticed with ALL the types of shooting in which I have ever participated: skeet, trap, .22 Bullseye, muzzleloader shooting, and, of course, Field Target and all airgun shooting in general.
Yes, contrary to the way shooting sports are portrayed in Main Stream Media, 99.99% of all the shooters I have met have been real class acts, always willing to share their knowledge with shooters who are new to their sport. 🙂
thedavemyster,
that’s quite a number of various shooting disciplines!
I wonder if you have found your one and only favourite yet and/ or whether you’ll continue to sample more shooting sports?
hihihi,
My Lunch Box MUST have room for a Thermos® bottle!
shootski
shootski,
I am glad for your comment, and rather sad too, because, I thought to find an example of a thermal hip flask to suggest for you and… failed. Why does nobody make a thermal hip flask? 🙁
I guess, that means, either
a) a conventional hip flask, filled with an ambient temperature (!), adult, liquid lunch, or
b) a conventional sandwich, small bar of chocolate, bag of crisps, little banana and small carton of orange juice, ie predominantly toxic, lunch.
Please indicate your choice before the preceding day’s close of kitchen.
Regrettably, late choices cannot be accommodated (which means, make up your own, using breakfast items) – thank you for your understanding. 🙂
hihihi,
The Thermos® bottle is just to keep the keep the cracked ice from melting.
My Lunch order is: bottle of wine, baguette, grapes, and good cheese.
shootski
hihihi,
I have two hip flask that usually have Bourbon in one and Vodka or Rakija in the other.
shootski
hihihi
Sent my lst Reply to myself!
Cutting of my Rakija ration…
shootski
shootski,
you’ve hit my giggle-button, again. 🙂
Those lunch wishes align almost perfectly with our dinner today.
Seedless white grapes were within easy reach in the fruit bowl on the kitchen dining table. However, I was distracted by the red grapes, in a bottle…
You see, when my girlfriend and I hunted and gathered at one of our local supermarkets today, I spotted the cheapest bottle of wine yet (~ $1.43) and, in order to establish exactly how bad that had to be, in the shopping trolley it went. 🙂
Back home, Vickie was the first to take a sip and swiftly left in search for a palate cleansing bottle of white… “urgh – awful, soo awful! Try it…” :j
So I did, after having first blown some bubbles through it with a straw, and…
… I didn’t mind it at all. 🙂
I almost always take my wine Roman style, ie mixed with water, which softens any harshness and allows me to notice the pleasant flavours – like a delicious dish that must not be too hot for me to enjoy – but this wine, I enjoyed neat.
I wonder how close I am to being a connoisseur of fine wine? 🙂
Anyway, our simple dinner also included a baguette. We shared it in ‘friendly bread’ fashion – an expression we learnt in Italy to describe breaking off a piece before passing it on – and dipped pieces of it in a dish of baked brie, yum. 🙂
So, the above should have satisfied your lunch order, but would have required some ingenuity to fit the lunch box, eg decanting the wine into a small plastic bottle that had been crushed flat, melted brie in a bubblewrap wrapped airtight container, maybe likewise with some crushed ice (?), etc… 🙂
hihihi,
That is where having 206 L (54.4 gal.) of storage space in my EPIC 18X Single or 251 L (66 gal.) of storage in the 18X Double provide room for a small camping stove, Dutch Oven, coals/fuel/ kindling folding chairs, folding table, shade/rain fly, cooler, dishes, utensils, wine glasses and of course the food and libations; just fo a short day trip to an island picknick spot. You should see our load plan [as much as 520 lbs (240 kg)] for longer expeditions.
I like toasted slivered almonds with my baked brie and friendly bread breaking is the only way to share a fresh baguette.
shootski
shootski,
I like the event that you make of a picknick. To get all that equipment aboard and leave some room inside the hull for the pilot must require some careful packing. 🙂
hihihi,
Both in the single as well as the double the dry storage compartments are separated from the cockpit(s) by solid bulkheads so nothing intrudes into the paddlers space(s.)
Normally the only things on deck are chart cases, the bow and stern (Tow and Tie up lines) painters, spare paddles, paddle floats, rigging to re-enter, and hand bilge pumps;
occasionally sail(s) and sail rigging.
The careful packing is limited to not messing up the boat’s TRIM.
shootski
My guess is that the “purse” is designed to hold a PPK if the silencer is separate…
Elmer,
Now THAT is interesting! I had the exact same thought! And I have a PPKS and it does fit.
wascally wabbit! 😉
BB
Photo in the next one on this weapon please? Now, we just need some exploding ammo for the rifle. 😉
Elmer Fudd,
you may have meant your comment differently but I much prefer the idea of James Bond placing a picture of his handgun inside the lunch box, inside the survival triangle, inside the motorcycle storage box. 🙂
Then he can continue to concealed-carry his actual short police pistol, ready to draw upon hearing “and Action! … ” 🙂
I agree that he needs his concealed carry available for instant use. This one would therefore be a backup…
Elmer,
Weapon? I presume you refer to the PPK/S? Cause the air rifle ain’t no weapon.
BB
Good point, and perhaps the reason that Q specified a bayonet!
B.B.,
With the Silencer removed?
I’ll bet a Clip on Bowtie [bow-tie/ bow tie/Unicode Character “⋈” (U+22C8)] would fit in there too!
shootski
shootski,
your comment has had me looking up James Bond’s bow tie. I discovered that I have seen his character in multiple styles of bow tie = eyes wide shut, eh?!
Oh, and that mine is called a butterfly, who knew?! 🙂
What I really wanted to know, is, whether James Bond wore a clip-on or an actually tied bow tie. The answer is: dunno. 🙂
But I suspect the latter.
B.B.
Before you do the accuracy test, could you please leave the rifle cocked overnight, if not longer?
That is supposed to be one of the advantages of a gas spring. Then crony that one shot and see if it is within the high and the low velocity for that pellet.
-Y
Yogi,
That’s a great test, but I think I will do it after the accuracy testing. Don’t wanna sacrifice that for one test.
BB
Accuracy test next, BB? FM sees this Bunker as potentially creating a furor in airgun world…or maybe not.
What a lovely Crosman Mark I.
Guys, how I recently enjoy the Crosman 2240… Amazing. With the wood custom grips and some extra weight… I shoot it almost every day.
I’m a little dubious about its practicality as a survival rifle, but what I’m not dubious about is it’s value as a collectible a decade from now, especially if it turns out to be accurate and has a short production run.
SB,
Your thoughts mirror mine.
This “survival air rifle” is an oddity/curiousity in my view and not much more UNLESS IT HAS STUNNING ACCURACY.
I believe that it’s only fame will be relegated to collectibility in the far future because of a short run of production.
Anxious to be proven wrong since this concept certainly has pushed the limits of airgun design and I embrace this wholeheartedly.
Kevin,
Depending on the survival scenario forming a tribe or bonding group with the correct mix of skills beats any tool or device.
To protect the bounty such a group can produce takes vigilance/detection at short and long range. A very effective weapon(s) at long range and a scatter gun(s) in close. Mine fields are just too hard for most groups but well placed traps are open for consideration.
shootski
PS: Does a firearm and firearm ammunition hold up longer than an airgun? Work and continue to work in more adverse conditions? At greater ranges? More effectively at larger groups of bandits/raiders?
Recall reading that Hiroo Onoda, the Japanese soldier who held out for 29 years before surrendering to the Philippine military in 1974, preserved the ammunition for his Arisaka rifle with coconut oil. Whether this would have worked or not is uncertain as he did not fire the rifle at all during his adventurous evasion.
FawltyManuel,
WOW!
I knew aout the Guam instances:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoichi_Yokoi
but missed the one you posted.
shootski
FM learned something he did not know as well – thanks for that link, shootski.
As a “survival rifle”, I just don’t see where being able to fold it into an 8 lb triangle makes it significantly more useful than any other spring piston airgun. It’s still a little too big and heavy for backpacking and while it might stow under the seat of a car a little better, it’s not a major advantage. What I’d really like to see is a rifle like this that folds or breaks down completely into a truly compact package.
It’s fairly powerful however and if it’s got better than average accuracy then I might consider buying it. It’s always kind of cool to have that weird gun that almost no one else has especially if it also happens to be a good shooter.
Frivolous and immature behavior. Playing with guns. Who’s to say?
I have been accused of both but often it is by people who struggle with life, from beginning to end.
I believe there are two kinds of people. Those who do not take charge of their lives and live with never ending crisis, and those who plan ahead and avoid having any. You need to be serious, and act mature, when you are always on the verge of failure in life. You can afford to do anything you like when it’s all in order.
I know people who live life day to day, reacting to what life hands them in any way they can. Often totally unprepared.
Then there are people who decide what they want out of life and what they want in the end and do whatever it takes to achieve it. And that is the big problem. Dedication and willpower.
Many people simply lack the ability and will always struggle to stay ahead of things. Then there are people who seemingly have all the luck, or so they think.
There are key decisions that you must make to get you going and keep you on track. Thay can be difficult. And then there are many small decisions all along the way to keep you on track. So many that it determines your lifestyle.
They can be fleeting decisions that often are made by your subconscious, “It costs too much”, no way!
Eventually you may realize that everything is going great. Your future is all taken care of and have ‘Left over’ time and money to do whatever you want. That is often looked at as frivolous and immature behavior by those still in fear of what life holds for them.
Thay do not realize that you spent your whole life doing what’s right and everything is taken care of. Including your future.
Try to avoid pointing out the errors of their ways. Thay already hate and envy you for being so “Lucky”
Just realized, I have one, or more, of every Airgun I could ever need, well want, and airguns like this, new and innovative one are the only thing that I look forward to. And, spending left over money on !
Over did it on the planning stuff. More backups than I needed.
Bob M,
what a profound and deeply philosophical comment.
I don’t know too much about this subject to contribute but I find it interesting and thought provoking. 🙂
B.B. and Readership,
I kept think where oh where have i heard Black Bunker and bunkers talked about…grab your FLAG boys and girls…PAINTBALL!
I think i have found the NUT of this:
http://WWW.KOREOUTDOOR.COM
Still looking for the BOLT in this or maybe it is a woodscrew….
shootski
shootski,
I wonder if the connection you’re looking for, is, for example, at the very bottom of this linked page, where it says, “… BLACK BUNKER IS A KORE OUTDOOR BRAND… ” ? :
https://www.black-bunker.com/black-bunker/bm8/downloads/BLACK_BUNKER-Details.pdf
hihihi,
Ever since first seeing this device i have been searching for the mentality that would spawn and fund such a thing.
It is in the same category as the Madison Avenue types that come up with advertising campaigns that have catch phrases like: Its Miller Time
https://adage.com/videos/miller-high-life-welcome-to-miller-time/1169#:~:text=“Miller Time” and the line,and then for Miller Lite.
Sell unsuspecting people Time Shares…
…that cruising is all about going to Sea on a floating 15 story building built on barge and finding yourself cheek to jowl with thousands of your new best friends…selling you on an airgun that Bear Grylls would kill for…playing with paintballs or airsoft AS IF…
shootski
shootski,
I think I know what you mean. To make sense of the BM8 marketing, I have an idea that the guys at Black Bunker have a great sense of humour and, who knows, maybe all this started out as a bet… 🙂
Shootski,
I’m no businessman, but I would assume being in a sporting gun business already they did some marketing research first to assure success. It is a first. Unfortunately, you probably do not fall into their market sector. An educated, well-respected officer and a gentleman.
I, on the other hand, being frivolous and immature fall right into place. 🙂 I just enjoy high tech stuff being mechanically inclined. Irresponsible, not.
Then again, they could be gamblers and jokers, in which case they may not be around for long. Time will tell.
Bob M,
I was raised as an Ensign by a great CPO!
I got to wear all three Chief collar insignia under my shirt collar in succession over my career; starting as a Lt.jg
“It is by no means enough that an officer should be capable. . . . He should be as well a gentleman of liberal education, refined manners, punctilious courtesy, and the nicest sense of personal honor. . . . No meritorious act of a subordinate should escape his attention, even if the reward be only one word of approval. Conversely, he should not be blind to a single fault in any subordinate.”
J.P. Jones
So much better than: “Enlisted men are stupid, but extremely cunning and sly, and bear considerable watching.” – USA military army officer’s guide 1894 quote.
It will be a collectable at a minimum.
shootski
Shootski,
Ah, the key word there is Army and in 1894 it may have been true?
Sometimes I question why an educated and skilled officer would remain in the service when there is so much more to be made in civilian life. Suspect job security and benefits, not to mention adventure.
I have a historical book that reflects the way things were as well. Something like “The Problem with Black Men in America”, don’t remember the exact words. It was only distributed to members of Congress. Not sure who would value it more the NAACP or the KKK? Most controversial.
Bob M,
Thanks for the Warning last night.
My AAV recorded your call an shot ;^)
I can only speak for myself about why i stayed for a full career. As a Naval Aviator there is no other place to be and get to do the same things. I was recruited by the airlines for long distance and instructor positions; yes for way more money, along with other outfits but just didn’t see myself in those rolls. I did even better than most NA because of my subspecialties.
Had i been earlier on this earth i might have jumped to Flying Boats.
shootski
Shootski,
I totally understand. I wore a suit and tie in high school in prep for college and eventually decided it was not for me. I just never fit in and felt like I was surrounded by idiots.
I enjoyed working with my hands. Aircraft Maintenance, AMH, in the USN was the perfect job for me. Both, challenging and rewarding. The family and career benefits compensated for the relatively low pay, to some degree.
I actually declined to go up for E6 for 5 years because I did not relish the thought of being a desk jokey. I was actually ordered to. They keep putting me in charge of things anyway so I figured I may as well get paid for it. I was a ‘working’ supervisor for many years. Airframes, Check Crews and Flight Line Troubleshooters.
They did it to me again as an E6 ,.. ‘Acting Division CPO’ and standing duty as Officer of the Day, OOD, in the TAR program. Had fun at morning musters, “Hay, you can’t do that”,
My reply, “Hay, you made me OOD”.
On two-week deployments on board Fast Frigates with H2 helicopters (ASW) It was always the same from the Detachment CPO and O in C. “Call me if you need me Bob, you got it”. “Thanks, I don’t know how you manage to keep track of everything?”
So, it was always challenging, but nothing was more adrenalin pumping than working an aircraft carrier flight deck at night in a ‘black out’ condition (No white lights) during Cyclic Operations (Nonstop takeoffs and landings) I imagine with you flying was life, the rest was just waiting.
May have mentioned it before. I took an administrative pay grade reduction, E6 to E5 just to get into the “All Shore Duty” – Training, Active Reserve Command (TAR ) Mainly to get into DC-9s for the future. Kept me in San Diego for over 15 years.
So much for Shore Duty. Always on West Pac deployments for weeks and the same on Reserve Ships for training. Just to supplement a downsized regular Navy.
And I gave up a reenlistment bonus for this? I made E6 right back but lost time in pay grade and had to wait years to go up for CPO. I believe they also extended the hard-to-get into with limited open billet TAR Command from a 20-year program to a 30-year and locked up promotions for 10 years. Nobody got out.
Bad timing for me but being a CPO is like Dead Time for aircraft maintenance experience when applying for civilian employment. So, I retired an E6, no openings, but my Resume really shinned and getting a great job with ABX Air and another pension more than made up for it.
Put in charge again, ‘ticking off’ senior people, this time 🙂 And getting paid for it as well.
Aviation … It’s not just a job, It’s an Adventure! And you get see the world for free.
hihihi,
The analytical part of my ‘Rememberer’ is always looking for food for thought and never shuts down. Sometimes it’s a blessing and other times it’s a curse that leaves me in analysis paralysis with no conclusion in decision making. Always another ” What if … ” or ” But then …”
I had a hard time trying to decide on outstanding success in life with gut wrenching responsibility or a comfortable job with peace of mind. A lot of compromise involved.
Fortunately, it worked out well for my career in aircraft troubleshooting. My inferiority complex in my youth may have been a driving factor with my success in life as well. Always trying to outperform to be superior in any way I could. I slept well at night.
Just took another shot in the dark with the BM8 and nothing but the sound of the piston slamming home. Big change in noise level. Then I thought, (but of course, lets Analize this) I had the piston compressed for hours, did it bleed down? So, I tried it again, same familiar sound, just like a TX200.
I did yell out “Fire in the hole!” to warn Shootski this time. He does get around.
Bob M,
once again, I’m surprised by the philosopher in you. 🙂
I think I understand the character you describe yourself as and I’m glad you appear to have arrived in a contented place.
Although I know I’m different, I have yet to examine myself to understand the details.
——–
You may be interested to know that, according to Black Bunker’s website, the BM8 is offered in many different power- and equipment levels. For the extremes in gas ram power, a 24 Joules BM8 is available in the United States of America, while their German customers have to survive on 7.5 Joules.
Ignoring the marketing nonsense of “survival”, I wonder which “seriers [sic]” has the most pleasant shot cycle and would that also be it’s most precise power level? 🙂
(comparison table [scroll down to page three] here: https://www.black-bunker.com/black-bunker/bm8/downloads/BLACK_BUNKER-Details.pdf )
Oops, I just re-read my awkward expressions above and, erm, to clarify what I meant by “… it’s most precise power level?”, I was actually wondering about the airgun’s best power level for most precise shooting, sorry.
Assuming this airgun behaves like most other springers, there should be an ideal gas ram pressure (which I would expect to be relatively low), to allow the shooter to achieve his or her best accuracy, shouldn’t there?
hihihi,
Looks like a list for retailers from various countries to order from to comply with their country’s laws. Without being able to adjust the piston pressure we will probably never know. I would try to get that information from Black Bunker. However, they never replied to my question about the bayonet.
Bob M,
I think, not replying to your email is poor form.
Reminds me of Barra, who seemingly ignored my email too. To be fair, I should at least try one more time… 🙂
In an earlier comment you said, “… I emailed the company and suggested… the bayonet as a stand-alone item…”.
Almost by way of an answer, they say, on their website, “… The… knife… will be available as a standalone item…”. 🙂
I see this gun? As a marketing ploy based on scare tactics and questionable claims. Not the first time money has been made on these appeals to the paranoid.
I don’t need the accuracy tests to see this gun would not be a good survival tool.
Don
Benji-Don, and All.
A lot of airguns are replicas of real steal firearms. I doubt anyone in possession of a real firearm would prefer this airgun over it in a genuine survival situation, however in certain situations it may be the only option available and may be useful to a limited extent.
I believe they just looked at what would be desirable in a real steel survival rifle and tried to incorporate as many features as possible to achieve it in an air rifle worthy of the term survival rifle. Simply because it looks like one. How it performs in that situation remains to be seen when they need to balance accuracy and cost to be profitable. To me it’s just a replica of what would be an ideal Survival Rifle.
Bob,
What you say makes sense. But, if you read page 2 of the pdf file referenced by hihihi above the company is pushing it as a fantastic survival tool in all scenarios.
Don
PS: even as a powder burner I see little value in the gun as a survival rifle.
Benji-Don
Think food, like rabbits and don’t forget about protecting yourself from other people trying to survive as well. The man with the gun always wins. Three days without power, water and food and things can get real ugly.
Caveat Emptor !
BD. and anyone else who might be reading this late reply,
You must understand that we who appreciate the finer points in air rifles, are not the majority of those who buy them. In fact, we are likely in a very small minority.
For that reason, marketing departments aren’t looking at us for their sales. It always amazes me as to just how many people fall into the “end of the civilized world” type of thinking. It is those who are the real target.
Simply putting “Survival” on the advertising or packaging will attract the attention of that segment. And then there are the gun accessory crowd who like anything different. This is right in their ball park. Add in the kids who want to stand out from their friends ( and have parents willing to shell out just under $300 to satisfy junior), and you have a substantial market.
Of course,, if BB finds it to be reasonably accurate,,, well who knows. It might actually still be around next year.
Ed
Not saying BM8 won’t sell. Just pity the fool who tries to take my rabbit with the BM8.
Don
BD
I must have missed your last comment regarding protecting oneself against those who might cast covetous looks at your,, rabbit. No doubt that in an EOCAWKI situation (end of civilization as we know it), the targets would likely be more durable than your furry friend.
In that case,, something with AR of AK as part of it’s name would be of more use. As I told one would be prepper friend. If you are going to stockpile something,, make it ammunition.
Ed
Not practical even if it was a powder burner.
True there are much better survival rifles like the AR7 or Little Badger. Or even the double folding AR15.
As a powder burner it would be much to big and only the fact that it folds could it be called a compact survival rifle, but being a reasonably powerful break barrel airgun it must be more substantial to include an air piston and the associated linkage.
So, what other ‘stand-alone airgun’ would be better used as a survival rifle, without support, for the long run? Small game is not going to stand still while you pump one up and it would not be compact with a pump. Although something like a Crosman Legacy 1000 with a collapsible wire stock and good removable or shorter barrel might be nice? Pump before the hunt.