by B.B. Pelletier
Photos and testing by Earl “Mac” McDonald
Before we begin I have a word about my health. Next Tuesday I’m going to have my pancreas repaired. This is hopefully the final operation I will have to undergo. It will be a major operation where they open me up rather than going in laprascopically, so I’ll be in the hospital for a week or possibly longer to recover. I have written blogs to cover the time I’ll be away, plus I’ll probably have my laptop at the hospital, but I may not be as easy to reach next week. If everything goes according to plan, I should get the drain out of my side and the stent out of my pancreas by the end of this year. And, while I’m away, I’d like to ask the veteran readers to help out the new guys, as you always do.
We’re back with the big Diana 75 target rifle today, and it’s velocity-testing day. Mac was kind enough to test the rifle with quite a few pellets, so we’ll get a good picture of how powerful it is. Along those lines, I was asked this week by someone in the UK how difficult it would be to boost the 75’s power up to the UK legal limit of 12 foot-pounds. I told him it would be impossible to do because the rifle was engineered to do a certain thing, which is shoot targets. The powerplant doesn’t have the swept volume to go as high as 12 foot-pounds. But from his question, I could tell he wasn’t asking what he really wanted to know.
He actually was so impressed by the 75’s accuracy at 10 meters that he extrapolated it out to 55 yards and wondered what a wonderful field target rifle it might make. Well, a TX200 is just as accurate, and it’s already been engineered for field target.
I see that viewpoint from the field target crowd a lot. They see the stunning 10-meter accuracy of these target rifles and assume they would be perfect for field target, if only the power could somehow be boosted. Back in the 1990s, people were going crazy by turning $2,000 Olympic PCP target rifles into $3,000 field target competition rifles, when all they had to do was look around at some of the fine rifles that already existed. Just because a gun shoots a tight group at 10 meters doesn’t mean that it’s also going to be as good at long range. It probably will be pretty good, but so will a purpose-built rifle costing one-third as much.
A .45-70 revolver doesn’t have the same range and power as a .45-70 rifle, not to mention its wrist-snapping recoil! You can’t just extrapolate a certain feature out to infinity and have it remain stable all the way. Things tend to work best when all the many factors are engineered to complement each other and to work together. Okay, so now we understand that. Back to today’s report.
Mac’s rifle is still in the original styrofoam shipping container it came in back in 1979! Kevin saw it on Mac’s table at the Roanoke airgun show, and he commented how new it looked. What he didn’t see, because it wasn’t displayed, was the complete original set of tools, sight inserts, literature and parts that also came with the gun. This really is a complete set!
As complete a set of original accessories as you’ll ever see. There’s even a sighting adapter to allow you to shoot at 6 meters instead of 10!
And, the sights are a wonder to behold. Back in its day, the Diana 75 went head-to-head with Feinwerkbau, Walther and Anschutz. All four makers had beautiful target sights that helped the shooter extract all the points possible from their target rifles, and Diana did not scrimp in any way. When the rifle was resting on your shoulder, the rear sight cup came right to your eye and closed out all of the world except that little black circle 33 feet away. It worked like radar, guiding your body to keep the black circle centered inside the front sight element, which was usually an aperture of some kind. Though you looked through that huge adjustable rear sight, you had no perception of it being there. All you saw was the front sight element and the bull.
Once you had it up to your eye, you lost all sense of the huge rear sight and fully concentrated only on the front sight and target.
The front sight of the 75 is a traditional globe with a wide variety of inserts. You can see in the picture what was available back in the late ’70s when this rifle was new, but today the clear Lucite aperture has replaced all the old inserts in popularity, because it enables the shooter to see much more than just the bull he’s shooting at. Shooting at the wrong target used to be a huge problem when there were 12 bulls on a target sheet, and the clear front inserts solved it. Of course, these days, the targets are presented electronically, one bull at a time, so the possibilities of doing that are greatly diminished, as long as you don’t shoot at your neighbor’s target.
The globe front sight is typical for 10-meter rifles. Of course, it accepts many different inserts.
Velocity testing with RWS Meisterkugeln
Now, it’s time to test the rifle for velocity with several different pellets, starting with RWS Meisterkugeln. This 8.2-grain pellet is made for target rifles and averages 564 f.p.s., with a spread from 551 to 576 f.p.s. The average muzzle energy is 5.79 foot-pounds.
H&N Finale Match Rifle
H&N Finale Match Rifle pellets averaged 532 f.p.s., with a spread from 526 to 540 f.p.s. The average muzzle energy generated is 5.14 foot-pounds.
The RWS Hobby pellet is generally the lightest lead pellet available. In this rifle it averages 619 f.p.s., with a 28 foot-second spread from 607 to 635 f.p.s. The average muzzle energy is 5.96 foot-pounds.
JSB Diabolo Exact 8.4 grains
A popular round-nosed pellet is the JSB Diabolo Exact 8.4-grain dome. JSB labels this as a match pellet right on the tin, but of course you cannot shoot in a match with anything other than wadcutters, so it really isn’t a match pellet. That’s just the name they gave it, and I prefer to call it a dome to avoid confusion. It averages 566 foot-pounds, with a spread from 554 to 581 f.p.s. The average muzzle energy is 5.97 foot-pounds.
RWS Superdome pellets are one of Mac’s standbys. He likes their performance in many guns and always falls back on them in a pinch. In the Diana 75, they average 538 f.p.s., with a spread from 524 to 544 f.p.s. At the average velocity, they generate 5.46 foot-pounds.
Mac noted that all pellets fit the rifle’s breech easily, with Hobbys being the loosest fit. And he reminded me to tell you that this gun has been resealed. If you recall, I mentioned that all RWS Diana recoilless rifles have problems with their original piston seals dry rotting, so Mac has had this one resealed with a more permanent material. Outwardly, the gun looks brand new, and with the new seal it acts as good as it looks. The 75 I owned years ago averaged 630 f.p.s. with RWS Hobbys, so this rifle is in the same ballpark.
Mac made one additional observation. It was 56 deg. F in his garage when he chronographed these shots. By the time he reached the third type of pellet, the velocities started to vary wildly. He thought the rifle was failing; but when he shot at a test soda bottle, the shot seemed as good as ever. What it boiled down to was the battery was dying and the cold weather was speeding it along. The 75 is so fast to cock and load that Mac was staying ahead of the battery’s recovery time. When he slowed down between shots, the battery caught up, and the velocities returned to normal again. With cold weather hitting us now, that’s something to keep in mind.
We’ll look at accuracy next, and I promise you, this rifle has it in spades. You’re going to be envious.
88 thoughts on “RWS Diana 75 10-meter target rifle – Part 2”
I have succeed to proof once for all good pellets from bad ones 🙂 .Right out ballistic jelly rifling on bad pellets wasn’t wright (mostly head of pellet was damaged) ,now that can indicate scratched barrel (i don’t think this is a case here) or bad pellet type -all accurate types of pellets had a good rifling on them…
You can do pretty much the same thing without shooting if you have access to the rear of the barrel with a cleaning rod. Seat a pellet and push it half way down the barrel then push it back out. The rifling should have engraved both the head and skirt of the pellet evenly all the way around. It is not necessary for the engraving to be deep. It just needs to be uniform. This tells you that the pellet is large enough and that the pellet is not badly formed. You don’t want to push the pellet out through the choke because it will squeeze it tighter and may give the impression that the pellet is a good fit and is made well when it is not.
A well made pellet with a good fit still does not mean that the rifle will like it. There is just a better chance that it will.
All the very best for next week BB and I hope you all enjoyed Thanksgiving.
There is something about target rifles and especially pistols I find a bit intimidating.
Possibly the ‘Bauhaus’ look of them.Function over form sort of thing.
Got to admire the dedication,patience and moderation of the target shooters though.
What is the freezing point of your ballistic jelly?
Damn cold here.
Dave here is also cold ,now that you mentioned- if you freeze jelly you will get “ice burns” white spots then you need to re melt it again .It is close to freezing point outside .
Good luck next week. Want to see them get you fixed up good so you can get this stuff over with.
Will be praying for you next week. GOD is in charge so keep the faith.
I never forget that. I praise Him every moment I can think of it.
The nurses in the hospital were surprised when they had to do something that hurt. Instead of swearing, I was praising the Lord. I think that even surprised me, because in my younger years the words would have been salty!
Praise the Lord! So many people forget that obligation. Continue to suprise the nurses, bb!
I’ll be praying that this operation goes well too.
I’m not saying your method isn’t good or anything but mythbusters tested feeling pain (hand in iced water) saying ordinary word against swearing and when swearing people were able to withstand a lot more pain!
Now, praising the lord doesn’t have anything to do with ordinary words and it wasn’t tested but to those who don’t have the faith…
Now on a completely different topic I took my Trail NP 495fps barrel apart yesterday after shooting some groups (semi-rested it gave me these : http://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/FfDUhGhWOGyD_fcdFpYXFA?feat=directlink ) for a friend who’s hesitant to get one and the barrel inside is the shroud(?) is blued like the rest of the action and the end of the barrel is threaded and seeing the Titan has a muzzle break, I’m tempted to say that these rifles are exactly the same, am I wrong? The difference in price could just be the better scope?
The groups were shot at 10m/33′ (the length of my garage).
I’m posting this for a podcast listener who sent it to the wrong address:
Hi Tom… i’m Iyonk your podcast BIG fan from indonesia…
I have a question for you:
How important is Pellet sorting and pellet preparation? some people seem to shoot straight from the tin and got excellent accuracy, but some swear by sorting and prepping them before shooting them… how about you?
so far i’m shooting stright from the tin for years… i’m using RWS pellets for my japanese SHARP ACE and INNOVA…
Thanks alot Tom…wish you and your familly all the very best… keep up the awesome work!
Wilyjanto aka Iyonk.
Wilyjanto aka Iyonk,
Yes, sorting pellets does make a difference in accuracy! Here are some reports that address it:
I hope this helps,
Wilijanto aka Iyonk,
Yes, sorting pellets does make a difference in accuracy! Here are some reports that address it:
I hope this helps,
Hope your hospital business goes well. Will be praying for you.
Yes, you are in our prayers also. Seems to me that there is an international prayer chain out there praying for and with you. Yes isn’t in wonderful the way we changed from young and “salty” to who were are now because of having the Lord in our lives.
Yes, it really is. How many years I wasted, when life could have been so good!
Wilyjanto aka Iyonk,
Here is an article about sorting pellets that kevin gave us the link to a couple of years ago. http://www.network54.com/Forum/79537/message/1189430606/Pellet+sorting+-+inspection+-+batching+-+my+present+ultimate+strategies+for+long+ranging+
The gentleman who wrote it has an incredible amount of knowledge and an unbelievable passion for air guns. He posts under the name of Yrrah.
God bless you and you and your medical team.
You probably knew this but….that rear aperture sight that sits on your Diana 27/Hyscore 807 came off of a Diana 75.
No I didn’t know that Mac had squirreled away the complete sight set for that wonderful Diana 75. I really like complete, original sets.
Yes, I knew that. It’s quite a beauty, too.
Did you know that today and today only Pyramyd Air is still offering a buy 3 tins of pellets and get fourth free AND with orders over $100.00 you get free shipping AND you get 10% OFF your total order amount? Usually you only get 10% off or free shipping not both. For heavy items like guns and pellets this is a wonderful deal.
As of right now PA’s internet is down but should be back up in awhile. Be patient.
Hey… add my prayers to the queue.
You and Edith are in my prayers. I will say a special prayer for you when I attend the Holy Mass on Tuesday.
God bless and may He keep you safe in His hand.
All the very best Tuesday. Hope Edith keeps us updated that evening or Wednesday morning.
Now a question: As you may remember, I bent the pull rod on my new RWS Diana 54 and had to replace it. Then the replacement unexpectedly snapped during the cocking stroke and the anti- beartrap kicked in. I sent the rifle to Glenn at Umarex who replaced it yet again, and to this day nobody knows how the second one snapped. I didn’t like the adjustment of the third one and tweaked it and it’s been perfect since. Still, I worry every time, and I think the pull rod is simply a trifle too weak, since it requires periodic readjustment for the lever to “snap” shut and say shut “just right” every 500-600 shots or so. Now then, your picture of the Diana 75 cocking lever in part 1 really caught my eye. The square tubing pull rod looks much sturdier, and seems altogether a better mechanism than the rod on the 54. I asked Umarex if I could replace the lever assembly on the 54 with this one and they said no. Yet from the picture it looks like it might work. I’d like to ask you a favor: Can you measure the exact dimension from the hinge pin hole where it connects to the rear of the cocking lever to the front pin?
I will ask Mac for that measurement. But distance isn’t the only factor. The hardware has to interface, too.
I know… I’m hoping the inward pointing cant of the handle end of the cocking lever won’t interfere on the 54. One more measurement, please– also the distance from rear hinge pin hole of the pull rod on the cocking lever to the rear hinge pin hole of the cocking lever itself. If these measurements pan out I will order the entire cocking assembly of the 75 and try it on the 54, and I promise you details and pics of the results.
This is going to take time! I just got off the phone with Mac on the first measurement. It will be tomorrow before we talk again.
By the way, where are you going to find a Diana 75 cocking link? The gun has been discontinued for many years and there aren’t many parts guns around.
Shhh… Umarex told me they still have one in stock, but parts are getting scarce for the 75.
I’ll have my laptop with me on Tuesday and will keep everyone updated as things progress.
Good, I’ll be following the updates.
Thank you. May His strength and healing hands touch you both.
B.B. and Edith:
All the best. Get well quickly. We NEED you!
My 54 has never been apart,about 8 years old and about about 5000 pellets through it. I never gave the cocking link a second thought until I read about yours. Sure enough it was slightly bent.
It will not bend when cocking only closing if it is adjusted too long. I placed a thick rag between the rod and the lever,put a little presure on the lever now it’s almost straight and good to go. I guess it was adjusted a bit long at the factory.
The cocking link of a 54 is supposed to be slightly bent. That is how it is designed and why it acts as a spring to hold the cocking handle tight to the side of the gun. Alan had apparently bent his more than the designed amount. Trying to close the lever without pressing on the anti-beartrap ratchet button does it every time.
Neither Mac nor I have ever heard of one of these links breaking, but it would be possible if the cable inside the link did not have a proper crimp at one of the attaching ends.
The link is thin and whippy, which is how it has been designed so it will flex and act as a spring. It’s really an elegant design when you look into how it’s made and how it works.
Cable? I believe that there’s a thin threaded rod inside the outer sleeve.
It’s a threaded steel rod. B.B. must have eaten too much turkey.
Yes, a rod, not a cable.
Thanks for that info. It still has aslight bend so it should be allright.
As the others mentioned, it’s a thin solid rod, threaded at both ends. The slight bend is correct, and supplies the spring tension that keeps the cocking lever snug to the rifle. It was the second, brand new rod that snapped on me, about 1 inch from the start of the threaded portion near the rear end. This happened on about the third or fourth cocking cycle after I replaced it, while about two thirds of the way through the cocking stroke, at the point of maximum pull tension. I’ve never liked the mechanism since although I love the gun. I think the pull rod is a cheesy flimsy design, and the one on the Model 75 proves Diana could do it much better. Damn the cost-consciousness of the modern age!
I eagerly await Mac’s measurements to see if a substitution is at all feasible, in which case I’ll have a worthless hybrid gun that will have collectors scratching their heads a hundred and fifty years from now, but which I can cock fast without fear.
For every medal-winner who bought or at the stop, was given, one of these rifles, there would be thousand of amateur shooters who’d buy them. Airgun ranges in Germany and other parts of Europe are like pool halls or bowling alleys in the US, just all over. Or like golf courses – in fact that may be the best analogy because people were willing to spend a fair amount on their guns and pellets and equipment, and it’s sort of a middle to upper class sport over there.
Thus, the incredible quality of these guns. Also, 10-meter guns are designed to shoot thousands and thousands of pellets reliably.
Good luck with your surgery on Tuesday
B.B., best wishes on Tuesday and let’s hope that this is the end of the business. I’m all in favor of prayer, but don’t forget to help yourself out too. Breathing techniques work wonders. I figure if they brought me back from the killer strikes of the Russian commandos, they must be good. And they were very helpful when my arthritis was flaring. Keep the body loose and relaxed. Tension attracts pain and retains it. Breathe in through the nose and out through the mouth with even duration both ways and just let the pain pass through you.
A small editorial point. When you write: “engineered to compliment each other and to work together”, I think you mean “complement.”
I’m jealous of all the front sight reticles for the 75. I didn’t get anything like that with my Anschutz; they all look the same. I understand that the optimum width of a post sight is the same as the diameter of the target bull. Even though one does not actually look at the rear aperture in the sight picture, I wonder if size does matter? I believe most target shooters go for the smallest possible rear aperture while Jeff Cooper takes the dissenting view that a larger aperture is both faster to acquire and more accurate. “Complete set” in the blog post reminds of the comment of a sportswriter after Mike Tyson bit both of Evander Holyfield’s ears.
Kevin, I guess that saving the life of your client is what the professional hunter is for. Sounds like a story. Did you get it done with your Winchester 94?
I wish I could take on you and CowBoyStar Dad in remote control car races. After obsessive practice I am getting the hang of it and spent the Thanksgiving vacation surfing the dirt with my various maneuvers. Did you know that speed is perceived as the time it takes for an object to displace its own length? Thus, the basis for the concept of “scale speed.” My car has a scale speed of 300 mph. Your adrenaline would be racing and no one could get hurt. 🙂
No, nothing that dramatic. He was one of five hunters in my camp. He was the fifth drop. Told them all to stay put and I would be back for them before dark. Four of them listened. Started snowing around noon that day. I got to the third guy and he was soaked and wasn’t able to light a fire but at least he stayed put. Went back to camp with the first 3 guys since he was on the verge of hypothermia. Had to take it slow with the horses because it was slick.
By the time I left camp to pick up guy number 4 and 5 it was getting dark and temperature was dropping. It was about an hour to get to guy 4 and another 20 minutes to get to where guy 5 should have been. By the time guy 4 and I found him two hours later he admitted he took off early because he was cold and wet and had walked about 4 miles in the opposite direction of camp. If we hadn’t had a fresh snow I wouldn’t have found him and I’m not sure what would have happened to him that night. He listened to me after that.
Wow, that is scary stuff. I read a book about tracking by a Rhodesian soldier but have never been able to practice the stuff.
Changed to “complement.” Typos happen. I try to catch all of them, but sometimes it’s impossible. Thanks!
Good catch on the spelling of complement. I see that Edith has fixed it.
On May 7, 2009 you said,
“Thanks for your input. I was at the range today and made a conscious effort to keep both eyes open. As a result, I was able to see the crosshairs of a 4-power scope bisect a 2″ bull at 50 yards. I shot a 10-shot group with a new type of .22 rimfire (writing an article for Shotgun News) that rivals the best groups I ever got from a stock 10/22 and a 24-power scope.”
Can you share the name of this new type of .22 rimfire and ammo used that impressed you?
I had to search for it, but the rifle was the Colt M4 by Umarex and the ammo was Winchester-Western Super-X. Ten shots in 0.508″ at 50 yards. CCI Green Tag Competition grouped 10 in 0.8″ several times.
Didn’t mean for you to have to search.
With a 4X scope that’s impressive to me. Must not have made an impression on you.
My browning takedown has a 4X scope and shoots the wolf target match the best. I only broke 1″ twice at 50 yards shooting it a lot this summer. Wind was a bigger factor than I realized. I need more scope and more practice for 100 yards. Won’t even tell you about my group sizes at 100 yards with that little 4X LOL!
You must be encouraged by all the prayer for your surgery and recovery. Lots of people all over the world concerned about you.
I’m praying for the day you shoot the ballard LOL!
Wind is huge on .22LR, even at 50 yards, but when you get to 100 it gets really hairy. I was shooting a good group (for me) one day at 100, very little wind, and had a spotter (bored range officer :)). All the sudden there was a “flier” 3″ or so away from the main group. The next one joined it — had the scope shifted? One more to “debug”, back in the main group, and I notice that my head felt different on that one. All the sudden it hit me that there was a breeze (tailwind) on the fliers (crosswinds are blocked somewhat by berms and shed, no flags out that day), so I started verbally predicting the shots depending on the wind/no wind condition as felt, and had two respectable groups a good distance from each other. I was getting the hang of where to place the shots, when the wind conditions changed substantially (as they always do mid-morning), and there was work waiting for me at home.
Scope magnification only helps if you are going to try to correct each shot, which is impossible for the likes of me, to anything other than to mediocre levels. My humble .30-06 will do sub-MOA all day at 100 yards and 3x in anything short of a storm. It seems that scopes tempt us to shoot further than the projectile should be shot at time, i.e., pushing the useful range. It is fun to push the capabilities, but don’t be down on yourself or the equipment if it only does what it is capable of.
I’m terrible at doping wind whether it’s with a pellet gun or a .22 rimfire. If it’s blowing even a little I don’t shoot pellet guns at long range anymore. The gun range that’s only a couple miles from my place in the mountains is a valley open on both ends. When the wind is out of the north or south it’s not bad to shoot rimfires. We place target stands beginning at 20 yards and in 20 yard increments thereafter out to 100 yards. Orange pieces of yarn are tied to the tops of each target stand (our cheap wind flags). It’s rare to see each piece of yarn blowing in the same direction. Canyon effect.
Even with these multiple wind indicators I don’t do well. The rifle I’ve hunted the most with was a .300 Weatherby usually using 180 grain soft points. Never had to worry about wind. Wind is a relatively new phenomenon for me in shooting. Not sure I’ll ever be great in wind with a pellet gun or rimfire LOL!
I noticed this effect when moving my 1911 from 7 to 25 yards, and I don’t think it’s the wind. 🙂 I saw a good idea for wind doping at the range. You get these slim metal stakes with ribbons at the top and plant them at intervals in your fire lane all the way out to the target. They you just figure out the net wind effect from the various flags. How you weight the different ribbons based on their range is another problem…:-) This wouldn’t work out in the field but it will for non-competitive target shooting.
I was afraid you would notice that, because in reading the article in my files it says I mounted a 2.5-10-power scope on the gun. I don’t know why I wrote that, unless I also tried a different scope, or I had the variable set on 4 power.
Well…..you’ve given me incentive to shoot more. Got some work to do with the rimfires. Had a calm day in the city today. Best 50 yard 10 shot group with the AA S410 was .471 using weighed and sorted jsb’s. Shot the 18.2 gr. pile at 871fps-892fps. That was with a 24X scope though. Pretty good for me. If I could shoot a rimfire that well at that distance with a 4X scope I’d get a job writing about guns.
That would be pretty good for anyone!
check out the link for scopes under accessories. seems to be linking to itself (?) https://www.pyramydair.com/accessories/scopes
Yes, we’ve had a problem with that page since Black Friday. They’ve been working on it. Hopefully, it’ll be resolved soon.
I hope and pray the procedure goes well for you. Ease back into it as you feel like it — this sounds like some fairly serious stuff, but you have a wonderful wife and a lot of friends pulling for you.
I hope everything is going to be OK with you and wish you swiftest recovery possible!
B.B. Hope all goes well and you have a speedy recovery.
Here’s wishing you a successful operation and a speedy recovery. You will be in my prayers.
Good luck next week B.B. ,all the best!
Good day all!
I have been shooting my TX 200 .177 with CP lights for a couple months already. I have been getting velocity values in the 950-960 fps range. Yesterday, I tried CP heavy pellets. I had read earlier that heavier pellets sometimes are better for high-powered springers, plus I figured there is less chance for leading the bore.
Well, no, not for the TX. Spring twang and recoil became noticeable. The sound it made was disturbing to say the least. So, I stopped after the second heavy pellet. I am curious as to what is the experience of other TX shooters with heavy pellets.
I’ve had similar experience with light vs. heavy pellets. The most recent was with a friends 6 month old HW50 in .177 caliber. I cleaned up the wood on his gun, tightened stock screws, made sure his scope mounting screws were snug, adjusted his trigger and had some time left over to shoot it before he picked it up. His gun is untuned but has almost a tin of pellets through it (according to him) and it’s breaking in nicely (according to him). To me it’s still harsh and twangy but has the potential to be a fine gun.
He shot jsb pellets the most in his gun but I couldn’t get them to group. I must have tried 10 different pellets in that gun before he stopped by. One of the last pellets I tried was CPL (cardboard box). I know B.B. reaches for these pellets quickly when he’s pellet testing but once upon a time I had bad experiences with them leading a barrel so they’re usually among the last for me. BINGO! The Crosman Premier Lights were a winner! I was shooting his gun at 25 yards and these pellets were a winner by a large margin over all others. Then I thought to myself, the HW50 is a powerful gun in .177 caliber why not try the CPH. Like you noted, the guns firing cycle completely changed. Like it was choking on something. Accuracy was horrible. I think I only fired 2 or 3 of those pellets to determine that the gun hated them.
I’ve never owned a TX 200 but on another forum there was a recent discussion about the TX 200 pellet preference. Almost 3-1 said JSB Exact 8.4gr. 4.52 head size. A few said JSB Exact 8.4 gr. 4.53 head size. CPL was second choice followed by JSB Express 4.52 head size.
What is the word on the IZH 60 and IZH 61? I understand that the rifle sold now is maybe a slight downgrade from the rifle B.B. reviewed several years ago. Does it still have the same barrel and is the trigger nice still/ (I understand it is not as adjustable as before). How about the sights?
I want to get one soon as an open sight (or aperture sight) gun for shooting at home and during travel
T.E. Don’t expect the IZH to be as refined as the TX it’s a little crude but it’s still a very nice little rifle, it fits good in a take down rifle case and is easy to transport everywhere, accurate, light.
For me it’s a keeper.
I got the Izh-60 because I was affraid the mag wouldn’t hold up and I wasn’t I could get one in a few years and end-up with a useless conversation piece. It’s a nice little rifle, when you pull on the cocking lever the bolt springs open and after returning de cocking lever you put your pellet in the breech and push it in when closing the bolt.
I put a 3X9X32 leapers scope on it but I might put a smaller 4X one or put the iron sights back on it’s too light and fun to bother it with a big scope.
My was my 2cents.
ps: for a 100$ it’s hard to resist
I find the current IZH 60 and 61 to be step down from the guns of the past. The steel breeched guns seem to have the accuracy edge over those with plastic receivers.
I just can’t get the new rifles to shoot as accurately as they used to.
I expect that this is true. My IZH61 cannot keep up with my B30. I thought I could count on the Russians to stick with a proven formula rather than going with fashions. However, my IZH 61 is still plenty accurate enough.
Get it. It’s still a terrific rifle for the money. You will be hard-pressed to find something more accurate and faster shooting within its range.
When you order make sure, if you buy the IZH-61, that you get extra clips and the single feed insert. I think it comes with two clips but you might want more and definitly order the single feed one, not for any special reason except you might want it someday.
I couldn’t find the single feed clip on PA’s accessories. Maybe it comes with the rifle. I know I have one but now don’t remember where I got it.
Plastic Izh-60-61 is a huge step down for all mankind 🙂
It fell victim to marketologists, alas. Here it is sought only for its good cheap barrel or for conversion into PCP.
If I were you, I would look for metal-breech on secondary market. In Russia price difference between a new “plastic” and used “metal” can be as high as 2-2,5 times, and it does worth its money.
However if you are higher than average 175 cm, you should think about customizing stock – some rubber “boot” on its end or a complete new stock, with bigger grip. This rifle was built mainly for teenagers and women, however it is loved and used by heavily-built guys 🙂 For example – in this kind of stock, made by Slavey http://i2.guns.ru/forums/icons/forum_pictures/002086/2086639.jpg for FT, 25m distance.
My TX200 like your’s prefers medium weight pellets, but if I may suggest also try the JSB 8.4 gr. exact.
I shot a field target match with those and my rifle absulutely loves them.
This rifle is beautifly engineered internally but mine was lacking for lube, and rather twangy. So I followed B.B.’s instruction TX disasembly & lube on the blog here. although I have a spring compressor you don’t need it on the TX. Use moly lube and a small amount of spring tar from Air rifle headquarters.
And by the way my TX is about 8 months old got it from Pyramyd in 177 cal.
I bought an IZH 60 single shot at the Roanoke show and really love it as a plinker fun rifle. I took a look at the 61 with mag. system and thought it looked kind of cheezy. But the single shot is an engineering marvel. You just cock it and close it, the bolt opens automatically you drop the pellet in close the bolt & shoot. Quickest single shot I’ve ever shot.
Since I can’t use an open notched sight anymore i removed it and installed a Williams peep sight , now its perfect and quite accurate at 25 yds.
My rifle is the older one or maybe a transitional model because most parts are plastic but the trigger has two adjustments sear engagement and and trigger spring weight. Now the new one according to the new owner’s manual on the Pyramyd web site seems to have just the sear engagement adjuster, and thats the most important adjustment.
I think you would enjoy this little fun plinker.
It’s not as fast as the 61. I actually think that the clip feed is really cool.
Try the Air Arms falcon 7.33 gr. pellets in your IZH 60 they work wonders in mine fastest & most accurate. Also I didn’t even like my Beeman R7 before I discovered those falcons.
Okay, here you go. The distance of the 75 cocking link from the center of the rear anchor hole to the center of the front anchor hole is 23.5 cm. That is with the spring inside the link relaxed.
The distance from the link anchor hole to the cocking lever hinge hole is 3.25 cm.
Mac looked at both a 54 and the 75 and he thinks the 54’s cocking link is stouter than the 75’s. He wonders whether the 75 link will be able to withstand the strain of three times the cocking force.
Thanks very much. I guess looks can be deceiving… perhaps I shouldn’t try it.
AlanL, we keep on telling you you’re just too strong for this rifle. We have to find something made out of cast iron if you insist on bending these steel rods with your bare hands 🙂
Ah yes, ever since Slinging Lead slung Popeye’s spinach can at me the spell has been permanent. If only y’all knew just how puny my arms really are… Hold-Up suspenders is the only way for me! 😀
So, there I was the other night in my snug indoor range with the wind howling outside as I changed out magazines on my Crosman 1077. I figure I was practically at the Chosin Reservoir.
On another note, I’d say this girl is a match for the fellow who fires .45s with his feet.
Don’t forget to watch the faces of the judges.
I probably was too hard on the IZH 61, I might like it if I tryed it I just like the open breach better.
Well, today I “pulled the trigger” on that Daisy 70th anniversary Red Ryder, just had enough light to shoot a few sighters, got one of those BIG jars of Daisy BBs, 6000 I think.
I’ve shot these before and frankly, they’re fun. This one’s a little stiff but I expect to work that out soon. It seems to shoot a wee left, and low but the low is easy to adjust, with no tools yet. I like the slightly bigger size than the standard Red Ryder. Yeah the lever is PLASTIC but it seems OK.
Wally’s had these for $50 then changed their mind and priced them at $25, that got me thinking again about it.
Short of a semi-auto, you can’t best a lever for fast loading and cocking. This is really fun for tin cans, various plinking type targets.
That’s about the most fun you can have for $25.00, unless there is a young lady by the name of Mercedes nearby.
Nice video, however I think she would spook the deer getting into position and be a little too distracting for the other hunters…
LOL if I can get the crows to “mob” me I can get some close in shots and lot of hilarity. Saw them ganging up on 2 hawks late this afternoon, getting ’em to gang up on you is a ton of fun, they feel they’re safe because they have all their buddies with them, right? So they come in CLOSE, and even a wimpy gun works OK. The secret is to hunker down in some bushes so they can’t make you out real well, then they assume you’re an owl.
The RWS Diana 75: A rifle after my own heart, altho’ I would probably opt for one of the modern aluminium beauties now on the market.
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