by Tom Gaylord, a.k.a. B.B. Pelletier
Update on some reports
Before I begin, here’s an update on a couple reports that you’re waiting for. I went to the outdoor range yesterday to shoot both the Walther LGV Olympia and the new New AirForce Condor SS at 50 yards. When I got there, the breeze was too much for the LGV, but I did try to shoot several groups with the Condor SS. I shot three 10-shot groups, waiting out the winds for every shot; but in the end, there was just too much wind to make the test a fair one.
One good thing did happen, however. I shot a certain .22-caliber heavyweight pellet that I haven’t tested before; and despite the wind, I got fairly good results. I’m going to save the pellet’s name for when I actually do the report, and I’ll also show you the group that I got.
I’m also working on the summary report of the rifling twist-rate test. I have all the data, but it’s taking me some time to make sense of it for you. So, that’s coming, and after that all 3 barrels will get tested at 50 yards, as well.
That’s it for now. Let’s look at today’s report on the Hatsan AT P1 PCP air pistol. I got a .22-caliber gun, and they come in .177 and .25, as well. We know that Hatsan knows how to make good precharged pneumatic airguns, so I’m expecting a lot from this one. I’m testing serial number 011320161.
I will let Edith tell you her first impression of the pistol. To use her words, “Oh, my gosh!” That’s her way of noting that this air pistol is a little large. It’s a little large just like an International Freightliner tractor that’s been turned into a custom pickup truck is a little large when you see it taking up 4 parking spaces at the grocery store!
It’s large, but it is a pistol — not a carbine. If you want a carbine, Hatsan has built one for you. They call it the Hatsan AT P2 PCP air pistol and shoulder stock. The P1 we’re looking at is just a pistol — even if it does weigh 4.5 lbs., or roughly the same as a Colt Walker revolver. When you examine this gun, you can see that it seems to be a PCP rifle that’s been cut down to fit into a pistol stock.
Hatsan rates this pistol at 780 f.p.s. in .22 caliber, so most of you will know without asking that it’s going to be loud. Can’t have a PCP with a barrel this short and a pellet this fast and be otherwise unless there’s a silencer…and this gun doesn’t have one. They also say that there are 35 shots per fill. We’ll test that, of course.
The pistol action sits in a synthetic pistol grip stock. The grip is for right-handed shooters, only, but it isn’t shaped well for my hand. It hits the heel of my shooting hand, pushing the pistol’s muzzle up. There’s also an adjustable palm shelf like target pistols, only this one is very difficult to adjust; and when it becomes as small as it will get, it’s still way too large for my hand. So, I have to rate the ergonomics down a bit.
The palm shelf adjusts up and down for hands of different sizes. It’s hard to adjust and doesn’t go very far.
The metal parts are finished to a matte sheen. The bluing is even over the whole gun. There’s a mix of steel and aluminum parts, all finished matte black; and with the black synthetic stock, the pistol has a very “black gun” look.
The quick-disconnect fill probe is a proprietary size that, fortunately, seems to have male 1/8-inch BSPP threads on the side that connects to the air hose of your tank or hand pump. To charge the gun, the fill probe is inserted in the reservoir fill hole and air is transferred. Fill to 200 bar (2,900 psi). An onboard pressure gauge tells you the state of the air pressure in the reservoir.
Here you see the threaded muzzle and cap, the fill port and part of the built-in pressure gauge. The wheel under the front sight is for elevation adjustment.
The gun is cocked by a sidelever on the left side of the receiver. Cocking also advances the 10-shot circular clip to the next pellet. The circular clip is held in the gun by a brass pin that’s slid forward on the right side of the receiver to remove the clip. The sidelever must be pulled all the way back to get the clip out, for it attaches to a bolt probe that passes through the clip to seat each new pellet in the barrel. This probe has to be retracted or the clip cannot be removed from the gun. A second clip comes inside the plastic gun case that holds the pistol
The 10.4-inch barrel is entirely free-floated, being attached at the breech, alone. The muzzle is threaded and covered by a removable cap.
The sights are fully adjustable for elevation, both in front and at the rear. The rear sight adjusts for windage, too. Both front and rear sight have fiberoptic tubes, and the front sight is not cut square, so precision sighting will be impossible. The gun does have a clever scope base that accepts scope mounts for Weaver or 11mm dovetails. Given the power of the gun, most owners will elect to scope it, I’m sure.
The rear sight is adjustable both ways. The scope base accepts both Weaver and 11mm dovetail mounts.
At first glance, there’s a lot to see on this Hatsan pistol. I don’t like all the features, but I haven’t shot the gun, yet. If it shoots well, a lot can be overlooked.
The one thing it has going for it is the price. At $450, it’s one of the least expensive precharged pistols on the market. It’s just $20 more than the TalonP. And the Hatsan is a repeater.
Further testing will determine if the Hatsan AT P1 pistol is a force to be reckoned with.
54 thoughts on “Hatsan AT P1 PCP air pistol: Part 1”
It may be a large gun, but the grip looks about right.
BB glad you got to do some testing at 50yrds. with the LGV and the Condor SS. Interested to know what that heavier pellet grouped like in the wind. And also the barrel twist test.
And as far as the Hatsan pcp pistols and rifles are concerned I like the style of guns that they are.
But I wish they would of Incorporated a shroud into the design. I shoot air guns at home mostly and have a pretty good place to shoot. But I do have some neighbors fairly close (one of them shoots airguns also and I shoot with him every once in awhile). The other neighbor. She lives by herself with her dog. She comes over sometimes and shoots Bow and Arrow with my Daughters and Wife. And she also owns a .38 and we will shoot it every once in a while when I have my .17hmr out. So yea I’m pretty luck to live where I’m at right now.
But all my air rifles are pretty quiet and I like to keep it that way just so I don’t disturb the neighbors when I’m shooting and they aren’t. So quiet is a pretty key factor for me when I’m making a decision about purchasing a new air rifle.
I really like the version of the pistol that has the shoulder stock. And again quiet is a big selling point for me. So I probably wont buy one. But I’m always interested in gun accuracy tests. So you know you got me waiting for that again BB.
Looks like a prime candidate for a bullpup conversion to me! I have been looking at these and the PRod for some time now.
With my big paws that grip would probably work. A “stock” Izzy grip is a little snug for me. This would likely make a good vehicle gun if it has the power and accuracy. It will take a pretty good size holster if you should decide to strap it on for a trip in the woods with it.
It most definitely needs to be shrouded, but that should not be too difficult with the free floating barrel. It probably would not be too hard to fit a Lothar-Walther barrel to it if it needs help in the accuracy department.
Dear BB and all fellow bloggers,
I’d hereby, like to mention a couple of things that come straight up to my mind, seeing the first part of this review.
First of all, i’m pretty sure that the pistol is going to shoot high (especially with heavier pellets, as they’ll take a millisecond or two more to leave the muzzle), because there’s no doubt that such a short barrel on such a powerful pcp is going to flip! The only pump or pcp gun i own is a Zoraki ultra HP-01 .177 and with 3 or 4 pumps it recoils. At 3 pumps my Zoraki produces 7.8 ft/lbs and at 4 pumps 9.5 ft/lbs with 10.5gr premiers! Just think of the Hatsan producing 20 ft/lbs and do the math. It’s going to kick back! So, adjusting the back post all the way down and holding it at “six o clock” aim of point is probably the best way to shoot it out to 25 yards.
The second thought i have is that, it’s going to produce a much louder “bang” than a .22 rimfire. Imagine a stream of air rushing through such a narrow and short barrel to produce 780 fps of velocity. My Zoraki sounds almost like a .22 rimfire at 9.5 ft/lbs. Double the power and it’s going to panick the neighborhood. Being an engineer myself, i know that a .177 is much louder than a .22 caliber gun ’cause the air achieves much greater pressure levels inside the 18% narrower tube while making it to the muzzle and the sound effect is amplified significantly. So, i guess that, the .22 version of the Hatsan is going to wake half the neighbours up and the .177 is going to scare the hell out all of them producing a sound close to the striking one produced by a “minimal” caliber supersonic powder gun!
And here is my third concern about this gun. I’m really very curious to see if this gun is capable of producing 35 shots as advertised, with such a small air cylinder and such an “unproductively short” barrel! How much pressure are you going to put in it to make it all the way to shot #35? Five thousand PSI’s??? I’ve yet to see a valve that will achieve such a marvel!
Well, dear friends, that’s all for now. The time is 14:15 in Greece, the temp is 86 degrees Farenheit and i think it’s time for some swimming and sunbathing:) I’ll put my blue swimming pant on, forget all about German Neo-Nazis and their artificial “monetary crisis”, pick my wife up from her office and make it to the cottage “by the sea”, just 40 minutes out of Athens! I wish you all the best, have a nice day and above all, stay lucky, healthy and happy, enjoying what you love most!!!
Welcome to the blog. You and I have some of the same thoughts about this pistol, although I don’t think it will be as loud as a .22 rimfire. But we’ll see.
I am just as curious as you to see the number of shots we get from a fill. This will be an interesting test!
Here in the USA the Zoraki ultra HP-01 is branded as the Webley Alecto Ultra. I have one outfitted with a left-handed grip.
My impression was that it should be pumped one, two, or three times, but not four or more. Have you had problems with yours pumping it four times?
For my purpose, killing aluminum cans in by backyard, two pumps provides sufficient power.
Since you own the “ultra” edition, you can pump it up to 4 times without any problems. I’ve put about 2,000 pellets through mine and it has gained 4-10 fps on each single pump. This doesn’t sum up to 16-40 fps through pumps 1 to 4. It’s just the specific amount of fps on every individual pump count. For example, when i first bought the gun about four months ago it produced the following velocity figures with CP Heavy .177 pellets, measured at 10.5 grains each with a Frankford Arsenal electronic scale:
a)1 pump: 354 fps, b)2 pumps: 495 fps, c)3 pumps: 571 fps, d)4 pumps: 629 fps.
After about 2,000 pellets the numbers are:
a)1 pump: 359 fps, b)2 pumps: 499 fps, c)3 pumps: 580 fps, d)4 pumps: 639 fps.
So, not only is the gun damaged in no simple way but, it seems healthier day by day! To be honest, i use a couple of tricks to keep it going strong. These are:
a)I turn a little bit loose the two philips screws that keep the barrel tight inside the “overlever”, the allen screw at the “front underedge” of the gun and the little one that holds the delrin piece of barrel shroud in place and pulling it out of the barrel, i let the barrel a little “free” in position. I then put the gun facing downwards on a quite soft surface (preferably book) and push a little bit so the barrel goes back a little micrometres and face perfectly the o-ring of the transfer port. This way, i achieve minimal air leal at this point. Keep pushing gently the barrel straight downwards in order not to bend it, i re-screw what i’ve slightly unscrewed before starting with the one at the “front underedge”, then the two philipses and last but not least, the delrin shroud of the barrel.
b)I turn the transfer port’s hexagonal screw (in fact, the whole transfer port is the screw) all the way in and then, i turn it loose one third of a turn. After thoroughly testing the gun, i found out that this is the point that the transfer port works the best. If you leave it all the way in, the gun loses about 50 fps of velocity! If you unscrew it more than a full turn, the valve bleeds the whole air quantity. Adjusting the transfer port of the Zoraki is something i’ve never found in any kind of article. Everybody messes around with adjusting the pump valve on the furthest back of the mechanism.
I also use a coule of tricks for keeping the locking mechanism and the trigger running smooth and free of wear:
a)I put a small quantity of Molycote BR2 on the inside of each locking lug (the inside hook) at the back of the receiver. This is a critical point of wear and if not properly lubricated, after sometime the lugs become loose and the receiver breaks open when the gun shoots on 4 pumps! You also have to take care of the two simple springs on the inside of the locking lugs (buy some spare ones, they’re extremely cheap). If they become “soft”, the gun will also break open when shooting on 4 pumps!
b)I take the back pin out, lift the whole pump/valve off the receiver (taking care of/holding in place the left and right locking “triangles” and their tiny springs, as they rotate freely and fall off the system), wipe off every particle of transparent cheap grease of the shiny metallic upper plate of the trigger mechanism (it goes forth and bask like a tray when we pull the trigger), apply gently a quantity of Molycote BR2 and assembly the gun the reverse way.
Don’t mess with the inner valve screw adjustment that’s been extensively described in the internet as it’s very possible to have difficulties in reassembling the mechanism (I did it but don’t forget that I have 19 years of engineering on my back) unless you’re a professional engineer or someone with strong gunsmithing skills! To be honest, I just regulated the inner valve screw to let off all excesive pressure after 4.1 pumps, practically preventing the gun from being overpumped and damaged! I only gained 10 fps of velocity by making this adjustment but the real goal is the “overpumping protection” I enjoy since.
So, you asked me a question dear Michael and I came back with my personal tweaking manual. I hope, it proves helpful for you and every other friend interested in the Zoraki HP01/Webley Alecto Ultra 🙂
So, dear friends, please don’t hesitate to ask me anything that concerns the Zoraki/Webley. I’ll be glad to respond!
WOW! That IS a great handbook for the Ultra.
Thanks very, very much,
i’m really glad you like my response. I just forgot to mention the following couple of things:
a) It’s essential to do the “push back” trick with the barrel (especially if you use pellets that seat very firmly in the breech), because, although no one of us can feel it, the barrel slightly creeps forward after some hundred shots, resulting to poor surface contact between the o-ring seal of the transfer port and the barrel itself, leading to minimal air leak at the point of contact and loss of 15-25 fps when shooting on 2 or more pumps! Ok, that’s a small amount of energy lost but, since this gun is sooo accurate and smooth on full power, why should we lose some? Just take care of the receiver’s thread that the two philips screws use to screw-in because, been made of synthetic, it tends to be destroyed after some screwing-unscrewing if over-tightened! I’ve bought a spare upper part of the synthetic receiver just in case. I think it costs about $20 in US. Take also good care not to over-tighten the front “under-edge” allen screw cause it destroys the threading and also pushes the barrel’s muzzle slightly upwards resulting in very shifted point of impact! Always use the “long” part of the allen key when screwing holding it by the “short” part otherwise, you’ll put too much torque and destroy the threads! After the whole “push-back” operation you might have to re-adjust the sights but not much.
b) A quite large number of friends, complain that, after some time the gun tends to become less accurate. After extensive testing, tweaking and re-testing, i came to this conclusion: The gun tends to become a little bit inaccurate indeed BUT, it’s easily repairable! In fact, the ONLY reason that lead to this behavior is that, the trigger loses it’s cheap transparent factory grease gradually and becomes creepy. Even the slightest creepiness destroys the phenomenal accuracy of this gun. That’s why i treat the trigger mechanism with the Molycote BR2 as i described in my previous post.
After this couple of ” tweak-tricks” I’d also like to inform you that, if you have the time and space to use the gun for hunting, you’ll be amazed of what it’s capable of! About a month ago, using the Zoraki rested on a thick branch of a short olive tree, i took down a pigeon at a laser-measured distance of 62 yards, shooting a CP Light 7.9gr pellet on 4 pumps, at 727 fps. The pellet struck the target on the right side of the chest, went completely through it exiting just under the left wing and the bird simply fell like a brick from the barn roof it was sitting on! Needless to say that although 40 years old man i felt like a 40 month old boy in a candy shop, cause that’s the longest distance i’ve ever shot down a bird with an air pistol!!! Hunting with airguns is prohibited in Greece but, ok officer i admit i’m a sinner, that’s the only “outlaw activity” i allow myself to keep practising…:D
That’s all for now dear Michael and all other fellow bloggers, i wish you have a nice day and best of luck!!!
This is HUGE and ugly but if it’s accurate…
I’m waiting for the detuned version of the AT-P2 with the nice, convenient shoulder stock.
I think it’s nice that they’re making it in .177, .22 and .25 is it just me or is .25 seems to be getting more popular?
It’s nice to thread the end of the barrel for a shroud. I had a fill adapter that connects to a foster fitting machined, it makes filling a lot easier, that way I don’t have to unscrew the foster fitting to screw the Hatsan fill adaptor everytime I want to fill it.
Can’t wait for the accuracy report.
I better get one of those adapters, so I can fill these oddball guns, like you.
One of my pet peeves about pcp’s is proprietary fill adapters. So unnecessary. Install a male foster quick fill and call it good.
If I’m understanding your description of the fill probe for this gun the adapter that would work is a male quick disconnect with 1/8″ BSPP female threads? The ones that Pyramyd Air carries for $9.95?
Is that the safety I see inside the trigger guard?
Yeah, yeah — I know I’m lazy. I just asked Edith to get one for me. I really need it.
Yes, that is the automatic safety in front of the trigger. I will talk about the trigger, the safety and cocking the pistol more in Part 2.
I have these male foster adapters on all my proprietary fill probes.
It’s not about being lazy. It’s about when I want to shoot, I want to shoot not be messing around with fittings on my tank and probes.
In this same vein I need to put a plug in (pardon the pun) for Pyramyd Air. I really like the male adapters they sell:
Not only are they stainless and rated to 5,000 psi but the delrin insert eliminates the need for the old washer with rubber insert that was needed to seal this style of adapter. Even a small nick in the rubber insert to the old style washer usually caused a leak.
I paid the same price but mine was machined to fit the Hatsan airtube (male foster fitting/hatsan fill probe) nothing to screw or leak.
I don’t know if it’s a good idea or unescessary but I also had a plug made to plug in the female part of the foster fitting to keep dust out. Am I being overzealous?
If you’re overzealous about keeping dirt, dust and debris out of your pcp’s while filling then I’m your twin brother.
I use the male fosters that I linked to on Pyramyd Air’s site earlier (with the ends filled with silicone caulk) and plug them into the female foster quick connects that are on the end of the microbore fill hoses on my tanks and pump. Cheap peace of mind.
Thank you, it’s comforting to know I’m not alone.
Mine is the usual male foster fitting but without the center hole and the other side has a small nipple to which I fitted a key ring. I used to attach the plug to my hand pump handle so it kept the hose free of dust, moisture and debris but it also kept the hose out of the way and nicely placed along side of the pump tube.
Now that I have a tank I miss my old hand pump…
KIDDING! No way I’d go back to the pump now that I have discovered the darker, more expensive part of the dark side! LOL
It’s not just you. All real men prefer greater destructive power in their air guns. This means higher fps, larger caliber etc.
If they made a decent 9mm version for the same price, that would be even better. The main problem with larger caliber guns is that they cost too much and manufacturers think they can charge us a lot more for a smaller number of pellets. This seems to be changing slowly.
I’m not a fan of Hassan guns but I give them credit for bringing some price competition to the over-priced Pcp gun market.
This pistol is ugly. It looks like a diy job. It’s like I carved it myself and it went wrong.
For the $600 it would cost for this gun plus a hand pump, I would be tempted to go for the air ordnance SMG 22. Full auto .22 at 600fps with co2, or 700 fps full auto if you feed it compressed air. Can’t think why I would buy this gun in .22
B.B, maybe it’s just me but the grip on this gun looks like it would be uncomfortable to hold. Looking at the photos on the website it appears to be “skinny” and maybe even angled somewhat. I’m looking at this pic specifically…
It could be just the angle that the picture was taken. In your testing did this pistol feel solid in your hand?
Thanks, Jim H.
No, I have to say that it doesn’t feel solid in my hand. But I haven’t shot it yet. Maybe that will be when things change?
It doesn’t feel solid? How so?
Looking at the picture, you get the impression that the top of the grip maybe too small, but it’s a big gun. You say you have small hands. Does your finger over-each the trigger, or is it fine?
It’s also very heavy. How is the balance?
As I said in the report, the heel of my hand hits the back of the grip, pushing the muzzle up.
The top of the grip is right-sized. The grip is just too long. My finger reaches the trigger exactly.
Sorry about that. I missed that paragraph. Almost seems as if they are expecting that the shooter relax the wrists down, like a free-style pistol, but may have gone too far. The reason I thought that the grip might be fine is that some air-pistols grips are too large at the top while making the lower portion too narrow (requiring putty), making it harder to reach and work the trigger well.
Seems like the gun is made more for exercising than shooting.
That picture link I posted didn’t work as I hoped. The picture I’m referring to is the 8 of 13 of the series of photos below the main photo. Sorry about that.
Just a reminder that this site is meant to be read by adults and children, so please watch your language. This includes acronyms that translate into words we don’t allow here. If the acronym includes a word that you’re pretty sure wouldn’t be allowed on a PG site, then please don’t use it.
Gosh Ms. Edith, I’m fearless, except for babies, bunnies & bbw’s, but you ma’am, are scarin’ me! I looked at this gun & mumbled some naughty words to myself & you heard ’em!?! WOW! No more sittin’ at the ‘puter w/out my tinfoil helmet on. Sorry, I’ll be more careful about thinkin’ too loud. Update, no screamin’ yet, my TX ordered 5/1 was b/o to 5/30, then 6/5, now 7/19. Yup, bein’ a southpaw really is a handicap. Hmmm, wonder if I could use that as an excuse ta park the sled in onea those special spots? So for the next 5 weeks guess I’ll hafta work on my Super hero underwear collection. Shoot/ride safe.
Haven’t seen you post in some time. Glad you’re okay. It’s good that I can’t read minds…it already scares me just being able to read what people say. What they think would really be frightening!
This is one of the few sites I feel I can let the boys (now 9 & 12) read with no supervision from me.
Refreshing in this day and age of ‘anything goes’ on the ‘net.
When I read the comments, I consider whether or not your boys or Les/Desertdweller’s grandkids would be offended or verbally assaulted by what’s said. I know others have kids/grandkids, but the two of you have mentioned your youngsters enough times that I use them as my standard for decency. Everything I see here is weighed with young readers in mind. If it passes that litmus test, it’s good to go.
Thanks for keeping my grandkids in mind.
Have you read some of the comments, and video presentations on utube? They are horrible. Some are so bad that, even IF the subject is interesting (like gun related), I can’t finish them because of the overuse of profanity. What’s the point of so much profanity, other than making the point of one’s immaturity.
Are you saying there’s profanity on Pyramyd Air’s YouTube videos?
No, not PA’s. I very rarely visit utube, but I did recently to check out a particular airgun related video (I won’t even bother mentioning specifics). They presenter was probably in his 20’s, but extremely profane in his presentation and abusive in his comments. I was shocked! I had no idea that utube allowed for that.
My point is that utube is apparently very popular with kids, and yet there appears to be no standards.
Sometimes profanity is warranted. Tomorrow the fedex driver is going to get an ear full since he decided that delivering packages in his truck is optional today. When I called fedex he said I was lying and I was not home. I have been here all day.
When I was a kid I started swearing at school like most kids to act like a grown up. When I let one slip at home in front of my mom, she wasn’t angry. She sat me down and asked me why I used that kind of language. I tried to find a reason but couldn’t. So she told me that people used that language because they lacked vocabulary to express their toughts…
I’m not saying I never swear but can honestly say that I don’t swear a lot now.
In second grade, I said something. I don’t remember what, but I know I wasn’t in the habit of cussing. Anyways, whatever it was that I said, got me in real trouble with a teacher. This was back in the 60’s. The teacher literally washed my mouth out with soap and water. That was a horrible experience.
I grew up in an ultra conservative family, so I never spoke back to my parents, and I never cussed at home. I was in my mid-20’s the first time I cussed in front of my father. It slipped. He didn’t bat an eye, but I was stunned. I actually realized at that moment that this was the first time I had done this.
I’m glad that the Hatsan pcp is profiled,I was under the impression that the air tank
was removable which would be nice in the field .I have the AF Talon pistol in .25
and I am very happy with it.The psi is near fifty fp lbs.I think I will buy the Hatsan soon I have the Evanix pcp pistol in.22 which also is up there in power,but I also have the very rare Shark pcp
air pistol in .25,with a lot of power,I apapted an 88 gram tank instead of bulk co2 only
325 were sold in the USA,It has powerto go thru than half of a tele. book,but it
is out of service for now.The instructions were in Spanish and have a picture discription but
all contacts with them fall on deaf ears.I hope somebody out there knows about this air gun.
Yannis of Greece mentions the Zoraki which from his discription sounds a lot like
the Webly Electro, I thought Greece was tough on all guns not unlike New Jersey
from which I have happily departed forever never to return.
Fredpro NJ will have a tougher time getting any gun now since the state has
just approved fifty new anti gun laws waiting to be signed, adding to already to the worst
gun rights violations in the country bar none even Cal.Sorry to pontificate but any time
I can open peoples eyes about the unfairness of NJ laws I will,Believe me we are next
it is only a matter of time before they go after air guns.
Yannis” I to can go to the beach every day too,I live on the Gulf coast with the worlds best
fishing bar none,and there is a large Greek community here in Tarpon Springs who started
the sponge industry when a blight in the twenties killed off the Greek industry
I can’t wait for the follow up on this new air gun.
For info on the Shark you need to contact Jorge Chavez in Miami. He was the importer. He ran Sunshine Airguns and Collectibles.
For me accuracy is still the No. 1 attribute a gun must possess to earn my hard won money. However, after looking at this pistol I’ve decided aesthetics runs a close second. As J-F said, this thing is HUGE and UGLY. If you can envision this gun without the trigger and trigger guard it looks like the fore end of a rifle stuck on top of a skimpy pistol grip despite the fact that the grip is large. that’s how out of proportion this thing is. The version with the stock is no better. (Apparently I’m in a grumpy mood today)
Anyway, this is just one man’s opinion.
By the way, I think my Talon SS is very attractive. Proportions and details are wonderful.
Looks a bit like something you’d pull out to take down a tiger! Or maybe out of a 007 movie… I find it strangely attractive and loaded with possibilities due to the threaded barrel. In .25, with an optional detachable stock, a scope and a silencer and it’ll be ready for anything! I just hope it performs….
With the detachable shoulder stock it does sound very appealing to me too but sadly without the silencer 🙁
I think if it can have similar or better accuracy than the Marauder pistol even if it’s uglier we’ll have a winner… with the shoulder stock 😉
The Hatsan P1 doesn’t look that large to me. But, I like to shoot my old BSA Scorpion pistol which is also large. I think it is not the size that will be the problem handling the P1, it will be that the grip is at the rear in standard firearm pistol location instead of underneath the gun as it is on my old Scorpion and other large pistols like the old Remington XP100. This will make the Hatsan feel much heavier than it would with an under grip.
If you have a Talon Pistol handy you could snap a picture of the Hatsan P1 as compared to the Talon Pistol.
This thing is kind of what I’m trying to do with a Crosman 2240. I put that project on hold for a while since I have way too many projects going on right now. My latest started today with a fedex driver that thinks delivering packages from pyramyd air is an optional part of his job.
He says he knocked on the door and I was not home so he did not leave my package. When I called him on this he lied to fedex and said he was here. Funny how I was here all day. The computer tech had no problem getting hold of me. The mail carrier was able to get hold of me. Even UPS got hold of me. But FEDex just didn’t bother to stop and deliver. I’m now working on trying to take that driver’s job. He wasted an entire day of mine And he’s wasting tomorrow too and I have things I need to go get done all because he didn’t feel like delivering to me today.
Tell FedEx to hold your package at their location and you’ll pick it up OR have them email/fax you their authorization form, sign it, stick on your door and that will permit FedEx to leave the package if you’re gone.
As I said, I have been here all day long. UPS stopped and delivered and the mail carrier also stopped and delivered. Even a computer tech stopped in. Problem is the fedex driver didn’t bother to even come near here. I watched for him and he never showed up. I guess he wasn’t in the mood to deliver a package here. Maybe tommorow he’ll be in a mood to do his job. God knows I raised enough noise over his lying about showing up today. I’m working on taking his job he doesn’t feel like doing.
It happened to me when we rented a house in the US a few years ago. It was a PA delivery by FedEx. There was 6 of us + the kids, it was right on the beach so we took turns staying on the balcony waiting for my airguns, there was no way he could reach the door without us seeing him. At the end of the day when I checked the tracking number it said “delivery attempt no one on site, card left” or something like that… no card was left because the guy never showed up but the FedEx office was a 2 hour round trip but we weren’t there for a whole lot of days so it was a bit scary. We got it 2 days before we left… PHEW!
Seems that it would be a good idea for PA to reevaluate their shipper and go with someone a bit more reliable. i once had fedex bringing in stuff I intended for christmas presents. They never got to me because the driver delivered my delivery someplace else town. Then the driver told fedex he delivered it to me. So I had to call the place that I ordered from and they were good enough to resend the order through UPS which got here no problems.
When shipping from the US to Canada (where I live) UPS are comparable to highway robbers. They charge outrageous brokerage fees and they don’t seem to follow any guidelines either. When you have something coming from the US by UPS here it’s like playing a lottery that you always lose, you just don’t know how much. On a 100$ item, it can go from a few dollars to almost a hundred $ !
Good old USPS is slow but cheap and fairly good.
USPS doesn’t deal with certain things though. In my case this is one of those new crosman MK-177 air rifles I’m waiting on. I waited until the black one came in and the time was right to order one. Normally since I’m just a few hours drive time from Pyramyd air the gun is here the morning after I order it. For some odd reason this time I am required to wait until the driver decides he’s in the mood to deliver what is in his truck. I have used USPS to ship a few custom air pistols I made though. They did the job right. I was impressed with a job they did today. I found a place that sold a certain candy I had not seen since I was very young, I wanted some so I ordered a bit. USPS said they could get it here in 3 days from California to Michigan. I was watching the tracking and it looked like it was still in California 3000 miles away yesterday. Today They delivered that package of candy. I’m not quite sure how they pulled that one off. UPS just pulled off a 1 day order from Colorado to Michigan and got it here at around 2 pm which is about the time they usually stop and deliver. So imagine my aggravation when fedex can’t deliver until the driver feels that he is in the mood.
I’m not going to defend the actions by FedEx in your two experiences you’ve shared.
I will tell you about my experiences.
I ship items daily. Have sold and shipped over 200 airguns in the last 3 years. I’ve used USPS, UPS and FedEx.
This is not speculation but experience speaking.
USPS tracking is a joke. The only time you know where the package is at enroute is when it’s delivered if it’s delivered. Their signature confirmation is a sick ruse since staff cutbacks because it’s common for mailmen (all over the USA) to never get out of their trucks but instead leave an “attempted delivery” slip in the mailbox. Their insurance is a scam. I had two claims with USPS and will never use them to deliver anything but a letter anymore.
UPS is hit or miss. Didn’t use UPS for very long since their advertised shipping rates conveniently leave off gas surcharge, handling and what else I don’t remember. Felt like I was getting ripped off with their rates. UPS tracking is better than USPS but not as good as FedEx.
I’ve used FedEx as my primary shipper for over 2 years. Good rates. Good service. Best tracking. For insured packages over (I think) $450.00 adult signature is required and is no charge. Minimum charge for adult signature on any package whether it’s insured or not. I only ship with Adult Signature required. Learned my lesson on expensive packages “disappearing” from front porches and delivery confirmation without signature to a dishonest recipient means nothing. Adult Signature required by me doesn’t get much resistance from my customers since they are sent, via email, tracking information at every stop their package makes. I’ve had 3 FedEx insurance claims out of hundreds of packages in the last 2 years. They were all handled quickly, efficiently and VERY fairly. The paperwork is a pain but FedEx processing is quick including shipping the item back to me on their dime.
Summary. If PA quits using FedEx I’ll shop elsewhere if I have the option.
I have gotten many many things throughout the years from FedEx and UPS. Performance car parts,R/C Airplane stuff, Airguns and parts. Have had very good luck with both shippers.
Most of the things that I have received lately have been arriving by FedEx. And from what I remember they are the only ones that deliver on Saturday. And they have even delivered normal ship packages to me all way up to 9:00 at night which I have been very glad about.
And I guess USPS delivers Saturday. But like Kevin said about USPS tracking service. It is a joke.
And John believe me I have had some interesting things develop with different purchases with other Company’s (not mentioning no names cause I ain’t making the comments here to down a company).
But with me. I will give them the benefit of the doubt. And let it slide once maybe twice. But I guarantee you if it happens more than that some kind of change will happen.
And I’m totally with you on the point of somebody doing their job that there getting paid to do. And it frustrates the heck out of me when they don’t. But I will say this on my point. If I do talk to them and it really was some kind of problem. I ain’t got no problem saying sorry. And you will find that most good company’s will try their best to satisfy the customer.
And I guess that is one piece of freedom we still have left in the US. Is that we can still shop where ever we want.
And believe me PA to me is by far in my mind the best place to do the air gun shopping at. How can you go wrong.
Save up your Bulls eye Bucks, use one of the 10% off coupon codes with free shipping, buy 4 of your favorite tins of pellets and get the 4th one free. And include a new airgun with that order.
Your talking big savings there.
Anyway back to the Pistol and no shroud. Yep pretty easy to add a shroud to the floating barrels. And when you add the shroud yourself you are probably getting closer to the performance that you want. Because you are deciding what you want to purchase to put on the gun. But I guess the thing that gripes me about it is. That you are still paying a pretty good Penny for the gun; then you have to pay more for a add on shroud. And that add on shroud would probably buy me some more pellets to shoot if it was already on the gun and didn’t have to purchase it.
What is interesting though is Hatsans new Tactical PCP rifle. And what I’m referring to is it looks like there is a place in front of the trigger in the stock were 2 Magazines can be stored. Maybe I’m wrong. But that’s what it looks like to me. If so looks like they are probably serious about shot count per fill and hunting. I forgot the name of it. But it is a cool looking rifle.
“FedEx Home” delivers on Saturday… But not on Monday.
UPS implemented some sort of cost cutting measure a few years ago.
It used to be they’d make three attempts with a package (leaving notices on the door), and then hold it a week while mailing a notice.
Now… If the package doesn’t mandate a signature, they tend to just leave the package on the doorstep. Or, if they don’t leave it, they’ll return it to sender the day after the third delivery attempt. Only signature required packages get a week before being returned.
Signatures are normally required for >$100, but even that is not sure these days.
Not sure who carried my recent purchase. FedEx carried the computer and left it at the complex offices, with a note on my door. That was a $1400 box. The $500 monitor and $100 speakers had arrived a few days earlier, and I found them on my door step — no signature asked for.
I didn’t realize that they didn’t deliver on Monday.
I will usually order on Friday or Saturday. So it is mid week when I normally get a package. So never gave Monday deliveries a thought.
But it is kind of nice to order during the week and get it on Saturday when I’m off work. Then I still have time to do something. For me most of the time it is parts for something I’m working on.
Its called a AT44 10