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Ammo Umarex Fuel air rifle: Part 4

Umarex Fuel air rifle: Part 4

by Tom Gaylord, The Godfather of Airguns™
Writing as B.B. Pelletier

Part 1
Part 2
Part 3

Umarex Fuel air rifle
That’s right! The Umarex Fuel carries its own bipod legs tucked against the forearm until you deploy them. And, in this test, we’ve learned that they work!

This report covers:

• Shooting off the bipod
• The scope could be better
• RWS Superdome pellets
• H&N Baracuda Match pellets
• What comes next?

Today, I’m backing up to 25 yards and shooting the Umarex Fuel air rifle for accuracy with its scope mounted. You may remember that this rifle slipped off the bathroom scale during the cocking effort test, and the muzzlebrake with front sight hit my leg, shattered and was lost. My leg is almost healed from that. But the scope is now the only means I have of sighting the rifle.

Two pellets stood out in the 10-meter test, so they’re all I’ll shoot today. Just bear in mind that there may be one or more pellets out there that are much better than either of these.

Shooting off the bipod
All shooting today is off the built-in bipod. It worked so well in the 10-meter test that I felt I could just continue with it at 25 yards. In the 10-meter test, I shot off both hard and soft surfaces, but today I just rested the bipod directly on the shooting table — so that was a hard surface. Too many variables to test everything at one sitting, I think!

The scope could be better
At 25 yards, the scope that came with the rifle isn’t clear enough for good results. When the power’s increased to 9 magnifications, the bullseye becomes too blurry; so, I had to run the scope at 4X. Even then, the image wasn’t sharp. I think the Fuel deserves a scope that’s clear from 10 yards to infinity.

RWS Superdome pellets
The first pellet I tested was the RWS Superdome. In the 10-meter test, it gave me good groups that had a few outlying shots. I think 25 yards will show a clearer picture of what this pellet can do.

Although the rifle was sighted for 10 meters, I still had to shoot 6 shots to get it back on target at 25 yards. When I did, it was time to test the airgun.

The first group of 10 Superdomes went into 1.714 inches. That’s hardly a group! I felt that maybe the scope needed to settle down after I’d adjusted it during the sight-in, so a second group was shot with the same pellet.

Umarex Fuel air rifle 25 yards Superdome target 1
The first 10 Superdome pellets scattered all over the target, grouping 1.714 inches between centers.

The second group of Superdomes measured 1.96 inches between centers. So, Superdomes are out of the running.

Umarex Fuel air rifle 25 yards Superdome target 2
The second group of Superdomes was even larger — at 1.96 inches between the centers of the 2 widest shots. The Superdome is obviously not the best pellet in this Fuel rifle.

H&N Baracuda Match pellets
That leaves H&N Baracuda Match pellets. The first group struck the target lower than the Superdomes. Ten pellets went into 1.281 inches, but 9 are in 0.742 inches. You can see the tendency for the pellets to cluster for yourself. Baracuda Match pellets look like the ones to try in the Fuel.

Umarex Fuel air rifle 25 yards Baracuda Match target 1
Now, this is more like it! Ten H&N Baracuda Match pellets went into 1.281 inches at 25 yards. Nine of those pellets are in 0.742 inches, which is great.

I thought that maybe the bore might like to be “seasoned” (same pellet shot continuously conditions the bore for more consistent results), so I shot a second group of 10. This time, 10 are in 1.429 inches, with 9 in 0.933 inches. That’s not as good as the first group, and it tells me that I might be getting tired in this shooting session.

Umarex Fuel air rifle 25 yards Baracuda Match target 2
The second group of 10 Baracuda Match pellets didn’t do as well. Ten went into 1.429 inches and 9 went into 0.933 inches.

What comes next?
Normally, I would end the report here, but the Fuel is such an interesting rifle that I think it deserves a longer look. I want to replace the scope that comes with the rifle with something clear and sharp, plus I want to try shooting the rifle with the artillery hold at 25 yards. So, there will be at least one more part to this report. I plan to stay with Baracuda Match pellets, so seasoning the bore becomes a non-issue. Stick around!

author avatar
Tom Gaylord (B.B. Pelletier)
Tom Gaylord, also known as B.B. Pelletier, provides expert insights to airgunners all over the world on behalf of Pyramyd AIR. He has earned the title The Godfather of Airguns™ for his contributions to the industry, spending many years with AirForce Airguns and starting magazines dedicated to the sport such as Airgun Illustrated.

130 thoughts on “Umarex Fuel air rifle: Part 4”

  1. This is a interesting test. It definitely deserves another chance with the bi-pod and most definitely the artillery hold at 25 yards.

    I have been using a adjustable bi-pod shooting stick a lot lately when I’m not bench resting. The pcp guns like it for sure. But so does my HW50s.

    It will be interesting to see where this goes.

    • GF1,

      It is funny that you should mention putting a Bug Buster on the FWB300 as that just happens to be what is on it at the moment. I finally broke down and bought one of them a few weeks ago. IMNSHO it is one of the best scopes you can buy for the money. Yes, you can get better optics, but you are going to pay hundreds more for them. I can see this thing sitting on top of a Weihrauch or a Diana. The only “complaint” I have with it is it is not a side adjustable parallax and I can live with that.

      No, the FWBs did not come with the rear sights. I myself was not concerned with such as it is my intention to build one into a minisniper if I keep one. I have seen them for sale on occasion, so they can be had.

      • RR
        I’m with you on everything you said. I have been wanting to try one of those little scopes and the parallax thing doesn’t bother me either.

        I don’t know if this is the same thing your talking about when you say mini-sniping. But we set different objects up at different places in the yard and take turns shooting at them. Kind of like field target in a sense put with whatever objects we can find. We even shoot at leaves laying on the ground. Fun stuff.

        • That is pretty much it. Here is a link to an “official” site.


          BB also wrote a little blurb about it.

          Basically it is about accuracy. Most of those who get into it like to use 10 meter rifles. The “official” rules are for small targets, usually 9mm casings scattered out between 10 – 35 yards. Think of it as field target on a back yard scale.

            • I may have to do some sniping this afternoon. My wife brought a bag of kettle corn home from work this week, but neither of us like it. They are nice round puffs about the size of a dime, perfect! What’s more is it is biodegradable and the birds and squirrels will clean up the mess for me!

              Eventually this may catch on and someone will start organizing matches and rules will be established and a few individuals will obsess over it and practice several hours every day and companies will learn about it and start manufacturing mini-sniper rifles and targets and the average guy will not stand a chance at a match and quit going and it will all go the way of field target and bench rest.

              • RR
                Does shooting the yellow flowers off of dandelions count?

                And read you loud and clear about the mini-sniping and how field target and bench rest goes.

                But at least we can make our own rules up in our back yard mini-sniping events. 🙂

              • RR,
                I’m afraid your projections are all too true. Cursed be the gamers, ruining the fun for the rest of us.
                But the bright note is, nothing to keep us from murdering a bag of popcorn from time to time on our own, perhaps to include selected friends, neighbors accompanied by a case of …
                Well, as it used to be said, weather a case of Corona or Beri-Beri, be careful about notifying certain organizations…the Marines will drink anything. 🙂
                Just be sure to lock up the Terriers before commencing the festivities, they’ll want to participate.

                • Well, not to murder the friends and neighbors, but rather the bags of popcorn, see?
                  And spellcheck doesn’t know the difference between weather, whether or, apparently, weaver.
                  In this case, “whether,” but who knows how it’ll print out.
                  Welcome to the English language.

                  • IE: the Norman/Anglo/Saxon language [What IS “English”… It’s not a Gaelic tongue which would have been native to Wales and Scotland… It seems to have dropped a lot of the Roman Latin… — what’s left is a mishmash of the Angles, Saxons, Danes, and Normans (themselves being derived from Norsemen invading Gaullic France)]

                    {said by a Vargr}

                    • Baron,
                      All very true indeed. As a Chinese friend of mine obliquely commented, “You mean, ‘Welcome to Anguish,’…David-san.”
                      A very long silence as we stared at each other solemly and I wondered if she knew what she’d just said. She broke first with a very sly smile.
                      “Really, really good,” I said, “two entirely different jokes in seven words. You’re getting good at this.”

                      A book for you to check out is “The Doomsday Book” by Connie Willis. It deals with the imperfect use and problems of fledgling time travel in the present. Not the least of which is learning to speak a foreign language no living person has ever heard before…notably, English as spoken in the British Isles in the winter of 1347-48.
                      And yes, the date is significant.

      • RR

        I have several of the bug buster scopes. I have found them to be very good although I use them only at 25 yds. or less. I agree, they are a great scope for the money. The problem for me using them at longer distances is primarily the objective lens size.


  2. Everyone,

    The home page of the blog has changed so there are now 7 blogs listed and all are excerpts. Hopefully, this will enhance your ability to navigate the blog.

    Please provide any positive or negative feedback.

    Thanks for working with us through these many changes!


    • Just what I was afraid of.The pages are taking minutes to load instead of
      the seconds that the last version took.
      The pics didn’t load for me at all and when I hit the reply button I had to
      wait for the whole page to reload before the reply box came up.
      I’ll try again a few times over the weekend but if this is what it’s going to be like
      I’ll probably give up on it.I hate to miss the blog but I’m impatient and it
      seems like there have been too many changes without much benefit,for me at least
      Hope yall have good luck and get the bugs worked out quickly and easily.

        • Edith
          I just checked out the blog on my phone and I totally like the new layout. That’s exactly what I was trying to say yesterday. And the pages loaded just as fast as they normally do for me. I like it. 🙂

        • The new set up is awesome, I’ve been too busy to get on everyday so can catch up immediately and pop in and out of articles, love it, don’t change a thing, unless science tells you there’s another way that bypass’s the laws of physics!

            • Last night got to take about 5 unorganized shots to find poi, didn’t put a paper up, wandering around my buddies backyard for a minute. Feeling out the trajectory some, you know? I think latter this morning will get to appropriately punching paper and completing the zeroing. I can say this, with the right pellet, I have a feeling this setup will make you work for a miss!

              • RDNA
                I was wondering if you got to get any trigger time on it.

                Is it shooting pretty flat? I think I was using 8.3 grn. Superdomes when I had that barrel on my 1377. It shot flat with the Superdomes.

                And I like to know what you think about that lower powered scope your trying. I like the 4 to 6 power on fixed power scopes especially if I’m staying inside of 50 yards.

                • I’ve had alot of guns like the heavy rws pellets, I have super mags right now, definitely need a few tins of domes, great all around pellet and better then tin cp heavies, never tried box heavies but I would think they’d be comparable. The new ruger hollowpoints are doing good, intricate nose and they look dirty but a little oil and they clean up as really uniform. They are also very nose heavy which seems to improve aero/accuracy. The fixed 4X scope is a good picture, good magnification for all necessary distances, but makes loading a bit fumbly to get under. The domes will make things easier in that sense as well.

        • Looks like my PC just wanted a restart.
          The blog seems to be working fine tonight.
          Sorry that I jumped the gun and complained too soon.

          I feel bad now to have caused you extra work.
          Thanks again for all that you do to keep us kids happy!

          • JT,

            Thank you for the feedback. Making the blog accessible is never too much work. I’m eager to do what it takes. I’m so glad you’ve fixed the issue and hope you’ll stick around. You’re one of the mainstays of our blog readership and go all the back to the old blog on Blogger.


            • As a long time fan I’m very happy to stay but I have to admit to being
              lazy and impatient at the same time 😉
              Even I have to admit that the recent changes have all gone
              very smooth from my side but I know it’s been a lot of work from
              folks on your side to make it look easy and well executed.My apologies again for getting cranky when things didn’t work the way I wanted right away,especially since the probs were on my end not yours.

    • Edith,
      Very often I have to right click on the daily blog ( from the Home page ) then click on “open link” in the drop down box to access the blog. Other than that it works fine for me.


      • Pete,

        That’s one way of doing it, and it works just fine. But you can also click the READ MORE link for each blog on the home page.

        With the update made last week, Pyramyd AIR stopped blog links from opening in a new page unless the link takes you outside of the blog itself. If the link takes you to another blog page or a blog search, it opens in the same page you were reading.

        Tom has fought long and hard to get this decision reversed, but it’s not going to happen. Apparently, it’s no longer considered netiquette (net etiquette) to open new windows or tabs for links on the same site. That’s because a large percentage of people are accessing the blog thru mobile devices such as smart phones & tablets. To accommodate them, Pyramyd AIR has changed how pages within the blog open.


  3. I hate to say it but this is about all I expected after the 10 M test. The distance is 2.5x and the group sizes are 2.5-3x. I know occasionally we see the distance increase without much degradation in group size but that seems to be the exception and not the rule.

  4. I have run a few of these Barracudas through the QB-36.The ones I have are from an assortment of 3 head sizes that got mixed up by teething puppies but they ‘re hitting where I aim them so I’ll be getting a tin that are all the same size to use in it and try in my Airmaster, which isn’t picky at all.

    • Hey Reb, so sorry for the delay, I got the pellets in a box ready to go, missed the danged post office over the weekend and my whole weeks been stupid, they will be out soon, I promise!

      • Same here. Don’t sweat it!I had a week full of appointments, 4 on Friday alone! I’m in no rush for them and it’ll be the 3rd before I’ll have postage but I’ll get them out to ya as soon as I get it.

  5. Interesting, it really is hard to square the bipod’s performance with the artillery hold. If the bipod is loose and allows movement, it wouldn’t be stable. If it’s stiff, it should interfere with the artillery hold. Perhaps the movement can be routed away to where the rifle is held by the shoulder and trigger hand, but that seems unlikely. Maybe all the reports on the exact way to rest the rifle on your hand were on the wrong track.

    Gunfun1, you’re welcome. Any time. You’re wise to delay investigating until you’re ready. Some of the deals might have you buying in spite of yourself.

    Baron Wulfraed, so is the .17HMR actually a .22 diameter? I guess I don’t know the meaning of “necked down.” I thought that referred to the case. You’ve got a point about the liability for Savage but given the enormous market for the AR, the most popular gun in America, Savage is cutting itself out of a large market over a rather fine point that is pretty-widely known.

    I know we have plenty of outdoorsmen who enjoy nature by motorcycle, car, and ATV. Anyone taken their adventures on the water? I’m just discovering the joys of kayaking and expanding my windowshopping skills from guns to boats. There is a whole class of kayaks for camping with all sorts of storage compartments. I could see dropping a .357 magnum into one of them and them taking off for the wilderness. There was a story of some woman who tried to row around the edge of the Great Lakes, tying her boat up to sleep in at night. Trouble was, some guy assaulted her. Apparently Michigan’s Upper Peninsula can be kind of a wild, Deliverance-style place. A compartment for a revolver would have been just the thing for her.



    • Matt61
      I tend to jump into things to quick sometimes. When I do start looking for the Garand I want to do it right and I will definitely contact you.

      And I don’t mean to jump in on you and Wulfraed’s conversation but the little .17 hmr rounds are pretty cool little rounds. Me and my brother both have rifles that take that round.

      They look like mini centerfire rounds. They have the smaller size projectile/bullet and the stepped up diameter on the case. But they are rimfire not centerfire. And I’m pretty sure there is now way to reload them because of the primer is in the rim of the case like the .22 cal. rimfire cartridges.

      They usually have a 17 to 20 grn .17 cal. diameter projectile/bullet and with the polymer tips. They will shoot around 2500 fps. If you stay around 75 yards or less it will usually blow up what ever it hits. We shot a coyote with one out at my brothers at 50 yards with a head shot right between the eye’s and the entrance hole could hardly be seen but the back of its head was missing. It had a 3” hole back there. And the fur was smoking when we rolled it over to see where it hit. I would of said it was body heat causing the smoke if it would of been cold out. But it was like 90 degrees in the middle of the day. They are hot little rounds.

      • Gunfun
        You ever tried to shot one of those 17 hmr bullets in one of your pellet guns, I just wondered if they would fit the bore or are they to big. I think the JHatsan or Mrods would have enough umph to spit then out pretty good especially the 17 gr bullet. Just curious so I thought I would ask.


        • buldawg
          It was a buisy day yesterday didn’t get a chance to do much of anything I had on my mind to do.

          But no never gave the .17 a thought in a air gun. I think that would be expensive without figuring it out.

          I don’t think you can buy the projectile by itself so you would have to take them out of a loaded case which is something I don’t care to do.

          And I think they would be to heavy for most air gun’s. I bet you would need something like a AirForce escape and put a .177 barrel in it and maybe they would shoot.

          • GF1

            You guys are missing something…
            .17 and .177 are not the same thing . If I remember right, the .17 has a .172 bullet . Same size as a BB . Not gonna work .

            People have thought about this idea before. Gonna work about as good as shooting .22 stuff out of a .25.


          • Gunfun
            Yea I had a busy day also making the flash suppressor for the 177 hipac and modifying a bolt handle for my Remington 1100 12 gauge shotgun

            So you can’t get just get .17 cal bullets by them self, I have never checked to see or if you could even buy .22 cal bullets. I just check midway for .17 bullets and all they sell are 20grs for 15 to 30 bucks for 20, or 25 so they would be way to costly and to heavy also except for like you say an Air Force or other large reservoir powerful air gun. It was just a thought because I think they may be accurate if you could get then to shoot above 1000 fps, but most likely would not be below that.

            I just got my Benji nitro titan in the mail and was supposed to have my venom also but it did not show up so I guess it will be here Monday. My daughter and her boyfriend are painting the back porch right know so I cannot shoot it till tomorrow when the paint is dry. I have needed the porch painted for 2 years now so when they offered I could not say no and it does look much better I have to admit. But tomorrow will be an all day shooting and tuning day for my hipac and getting used to the benji.


            • buldawg
              Its always nice to get some help. And I’m not a big fan of any kind of house painting.

              Only one nitro gun. Did a scope come with it?

              And I got looking at my 54 and it had a cracked scope ring. It has the picatinny style rings on it and they are on that UTG droop mount adapter. So luckily I had some more scope rings. I was putting the Hawke scope on it when I noticed it. No telling when or how that happened. It was in a hard case the whole time it was at my brothers. Anyway its got new rings and the Hawke scope on it now. Getting ready to sight it now.

              But I did get the Bushnell on the HW50s. Its got a fine reticle and its working out nice on the HW50s.

              • Gunfun
                Yep the porch looks real nice now , it was still just the plain wood for the last two years since we had the house vinyl sided and a porch built on the back. I am not a painter at all so that is why it was still in wood without paint. Now it is bright white paint and it realty makes it look much better as the siding is white also.

                Yea I only got the 22 cal Benji that I just bought a week ago, the Venom I bought 2 weeks ago was shipped snail economy and it showed it getting to Atlanta yesterday but it has not made the last 90 miles to Oxford yet so it will be Monday when I get it. I have not shot the Benji yet but it feels pretty good in my hands so I may keep it also. I got it to take the GRTIII trigger out to put in the venom and for the scope level that it had also along with a 4×32 scope, just did not have ring with the scope. The level is one that you attach to the dovetail rail to level the gun and then be able to level scope to gun.

                I got to get some cheap scope mount for the benji as the Venom has a scope and mounts with it, just have to get it here. The porch will be dry tomorrow so I can use it as my rest again and get some tuning and shooting in for most of the day.

                Glad you got your 54 back and all the scopes swapped and mounted. hope all your sighting in goes good and you are happy with the choices.

                Got to go now as Alabama is playing Florida and I got to watch them win. Its the only football games I will watch is when Alabama plays.


                • buldawg
                  I forgot how well the 54 shot.

                  I use to shoot AirArms pellet in it but don’t have any more of them. So I sighted the Hawke scope with the JSB 13.4 grn. pellets. Then tried the box 10.5 premier’s and the aim poi stayed the same which usually don’t happen wit other guns I tried them in.

                  But the 54 is making one hole clover leaf group’s out at 50 yard’s. It makes me wonder why I decided to PCP 5 years ago withe the 54 shooting like it does.

                  And enjoy your game.

                  • Gunfun
                    That’s why I told you that the one I built for the CMP instructor was so good that I wished he did not want to fix it so I could buy it cheap and fix it for myself. They are the best of the best when it comes to a spring gun as far as I am concerned due in my opinion because it is not a break barrel but a side cocker with the receiver recoil design and a fixed barrel.

                    If I had a 54 it would be hard for me to switch and the only flaw that I see it having is its weight, but then that also makes it shoot so good to so it an acceptable trade off to me. I just would not want to do much walking hunting with it because of its weight.

                    The game is been good so far and it is still close so I will talk to you in a little while, enjoy your 54 some more.


            • Id love to see the chrony comparison as they are both crosman gas, .177 right? If they are neck and neck it will give me a pretty good idea what mines doing as well, also, have you ever “chambered” a springee breech? Any idea the effects of tapering the rifling? Got to go search but wondered if any personal experience, aka chrony results?

              • RifledDNA
                I let my eyes get ahead of my mind again and thought the above post was from GF1
                If you read the response I left for GF1 they are both not 177 gas spring guns, one is a crosman nitro venom in 177 cal and the other is a Benjamin titan gp nitro in 22 cal.

                I just chronyed my firepower spring gun which is a crosman Quest/Optimus/Vantage/Phantom clone and with 10.5gr CPs in 177 cal and it does an average of 800 fps. The Benji titan nitro gun with 14.3gr CPs in 22 cal; does an average of 740 fps. I have not received the crosman nitro venom yet so I cannot give you any numbers for it yet with 10.5 gr CPs, but when I get it Monday I will get you some if that will help. What are/is yours doing with 10.5 CPS.

                What are you meaning by chambering the breech, I have no experience with doing that as I am not sure what you are meaning by “chambering the breech” .

                If it is different than deep seating the pellets then I cannot help as I have not tried to deep seat the pellets in my spring guns at all.


                • Mines a .177 and have no chrony data, the .22 “nps” got the ten for ten and did 800 with the rws hobbys, that’s all I know, but your 800 with 10’5s in .177 is indicative. By “chambering” the breech I mean opening up the breech a bit so the rifling is tapered out towards the breech, basically it’s like the pellet is deep seating itself by being introduced to the rifling gently in the first 3/8ths of an inch or so.

                  • RDNA
                    No I have not tried chambering in a spring gun and as long as my guns are shooting as well as they are I don’t think I will change them . If I did anything it would be to deep seat them rather than chambering as I would not want to make a mistake and ruin a barrel.

                    I would like to see some result also like you before trying it my self, I may search some blogs about it or maybe BB can give us some more info.


          • Gunfun
            I got your post in my email about the chrony result for the two nitro guns, but it has not shown up on the blog.

            The nitro guns are different calibers. The nitro venom is a 177 and the Benji nitro is a 22 cal so the chrony numbers would not be close. I can chrony the Firepower spring gun and the venom nitro gun to see the difference between the spring and gas but not the 2 gas guns.
            I did chrony the Firepower when I first got it and with CP 7.9grs it was around the 950 to 960 fps area if I remember right, but that was not broken in so it may be different now.

            I will chrony the two 177s when I get the Venom and let you know the difference between a coil spring and gas gun.

            I am going out to tune my 177 hipac right now so I will get back to you in a little bit with those results also.

            Later Buldawg

            • buldawg
              You got to start looking to see who left you a reply. That was RDNA that asked you about the velocities of your guns.

              But thanks for posting because I was interested in knowing also. 🙂

              And I just got through cutting grass and eating lunch. Going out right now to shoot the 54 and HW50s right now. Let me know how the hi-pac gun goes.

              • Gunfun
                Yea I just noticed that after I got done tuning my 177 hipac. I keep letting my eyes get ahead of my mind or cannot keep my mind with me all the time I have not figured out which it is yet.

                I got the 177 hipac tuned ,but it is not with the stock spring as I could only get a high fps of 650 with the stock spring turned in 15 turns from flush. So I went back to the heavier spring and have it set at 1 1/2 turns out from flush with the end cap. here are my results with 10.5 CPs.
                High = 934.5
                Low = 783.7
                Avg = 877.6
                ES = 151.2
                SD = 45,63
                This is at a starting fill of 27/2800 psi down to 1000 psi with a 32 shot count and 20.38FPE with the highest FPS shot at number 21. The bad news is now the fill check valve o-ring is leaking just like the 22 cal hipac did so they both have to have the foster tube pulled back off and have a better o-ring and valve stem put in them so they will not leak. if I remember when I had them apart the valve stems head was not any bigger than the o-ring and had a somewhat sharp edge on the outside diameter of it so I believe that at anything over the 2000 psi range is compressing the o-ring to the point it is being cut very slightly by the head of the valve stem. More down time to fix another missed engineering issue. It may take me months to get them to work at 2800 to 3000 psi, but they will be made so that they can and will handle those pressures.

                I did chrony the Firepower on 10.5 CPs in 177 and got an average of 800 fps and the 22 cal Benji nitro with 14.3 Cps averaged 740 fps so they are very good guns and if I remember right the Firepower with 7.9 CPs averaged at 950 fps so if the nitro venom is in those ranges I will be happy.


                • buldawg
                  I think your shooting the hi-pac down to low. I think I would stop around 1600 psi. you will have less usable shots but it would be more consistent on the fps spread.

                  And the Firepower and Benji nitro gun is at a perfect fps. That’s what I like anyway.

                  And I’m glad I got the 54 and HW50s sighted back in yesterday because we are have a constant 10 to 20 mph wind today. So I’m getting to see how good the JSB 10.3’s are today. So far the HW50s is shooting to the left about a inch at 50 yards. The 54 is only shooting a quarter inch to the left. I guess the higher velocity that the 54 is making is helping it out to stay on target better. Anyway kind of fun. I haven’t shot in this much wind in a while.

                  • Man my phone.

                    Please ignore the s word at the end.

                    Suppose to be haven’t shot in this much wind.

                    And farther up in my reply (would) should replace whatever word my phone tried to spell.

                    • GF1,

                      Yeah…those evil cell phones. You should see the texts I get from others! I have disabled auto-correct on my cell phone and all my computer’s auto-correct features. If I make a typo, it’s generally still understandable. When the cell phone or MS Word auto-corrects, it’s usually awful and no one knows what I’m talking about.

                      Instead of putting your comment in the trash due to language, I’ve edited it per your followup comment. Let me know if I didn’t get it right.


                    • Edith
                      There was no place to reply by your comment so I hope you see this reply.

                      Thanks a bunch for editing my comment. I couldn’t believe it when I read it after it posted. And yes you got it right. Thanks.

                    • Gunfun
                      The problem is that these Chinese phones don’t speak English.

                      I know my shots would be more consistent if I stopped at around 1600 psi, the problem is the hipac has no gage so with out the chrony there is no way to tell other than the report and it does not change in report until it below 500 fps.
                      I am just using my chrony to tell me when I am in the middle of the curve such as shot numbers 10 thru 25 are in the 850 to 930 range. I think if I keep it tuned like it is so that I can get 30 shots above 800 fps it will give me a good usable number of shots and still be accurate in those 30 shots. I will know more when I go to sight it in and see how the POI changes as the FPS varies.

                      But before I can even do any sighting in I have to take them both back apart and fix the fill check valve leaks.

                      Sounds like you are getting some good practice for judging windage calculations and estimates today shooting with the winds you have blowing there. If your 54 is as powerful as the one I built it is shooting those 10.3 JSB out about 150 FPS faster than you HW is and that is why they are not hitting as far to the left as the HW is.

                      I just got frustrated again with the leaks developing and have called it quits for today. I am not feeling real well either I think some of the fumes from my kids painting yesterday have messed with me. I will get back to it tomorrow when my other nitro gun gets here because at least they cannot leak and mess up my shooting and fun.


                • buldawg
                  Look at your numbers you just gave for the hi-pac.

                  You have a gauge. Its your pump or bottle.

                  Fill your gun to whatever psi you have been then count down 10 shots and check with your bottle or pump. That will show your new starting fill psi. Then shoot counting down to your 25th shot. Hook up your pump or bottle and that will give your end pressure. All you have to do is count down your shots. You will end at the same psi everytime. That’s what I call the usable shots per fill.

                  • Gunfun
                    I see how you are figuring usable shoots, but I think that usable shoots will be the ones that you can maintain a consistent POI with and then when it starts to change then that would be your start and stop pressures. I just have to get them to hold pressure for more than four or five fills before they start to leak and then I can really get them dialed in.

                    I think I have the hammer spring set about right on both the 177 and 22. I just like you say need to be able to sight them in and determine my fill start and stop pressure by the most consistent POI versus POA in the shoot strings and then I can really determine the best pressures. Unless I am looking at it wrong I feel that would be the best way because just because the shoots 10 thru 25 may be the flattest part of the curve it may not necessarily be the most accurate. It would really help if I had the printer setup to go with my chrony so I would not have to write every shoot reading down to do a graph. like I say though I first have to have them stay dependable and not leak so easily.


                    • buldawg
                      You will see when your shots start falling off on the poi It will be real close to your low fill psi.

                      I guess it will be a while again.

                      And I thought I had bad luck.

                  • Gunfun
                    I agree with you when the POI starts to drop that will be the low pressure and I am starting at 2800 psi or so as my gauge on my hand pump may be off by 100 psi + or – so the first 5 to 8 shots are in the low 800 fps and it hits 900 around shot 8 to 10 so I will check the pressure when the fps is around the 880 to 890 range to get an idea of the start pressure. I was just hopping that the POI would not vary to much in the 25 to 30 shot range that is between start of the 800 fps to the end of the 800 fps, but they will probably change to much with that much spread.

                    Burt yes I got to get them to hold the pressures consistently first before I can really get them completely dialed in. At least it is just the foster tube that has to come back off and I have some better stem and o-rings to put in them and thought about changing them when I had them apart but did not and now am mad at myself for not doing so, but that is part of research and development is to test, test, test until it is right. it just should have already been done before us consumers get the final product.

                    Its called Murphys law and I guess its my turn for it till I can find someone else to give it to.

                    I will have both my springer tomorrow to play with and get dialed in and at least they will be way more consistent in their FPS and they cannot leak, I may make the 177 nitro gun into my hunter class gun instead of the 2240 untiol I get it all sorted out and reliable.

                    If at first you do not succeed try try try again.


                • Thanks, it’s good to see the numbers are realistic on the boxes for these nps, I believe the .22 was quoted 1000 and 850 with lead so the 800 that it got was pretty good, but it’s the consistency that wins on em I’d say, the extreme spread was 10 fps after the excluded obvious diesels. SD was something like 5 or 6 !

                  • RDNA
                    The box that my benji titan nitro came in states FPS of 950 with alloy pellets and does not state a FPS with lead pellets. I fired 10 14.3 CPs to get the average of 740 FPS in the 22 cal with a ES of about 4 or 5 FPS also so yes the consistency is excellent. I did not oil it at all before I shot the ten for some numbers and have no idea how long it has been shot or set with out being oiled so that may account for the slightly lower number from what yours did or it may not be broken in yet. I just shot it while I had the chrony setup to get a base line of numbers before I lube it and go over it for any minor issues it may heed addressed. I will be getting my crosman nitro venom in 177 caliber tomorrow so I can give you some numbers on it then if it is not raining as the weather men say that there is a chance. If it is as good as my firepower crosman clone or better then I will be happy. the 22 cal nitro benji is very smooth when shooting but is not really any better in the recoil or smoothness than my crosman clone spring gun. I just think I got very lucky with the Firepower with it being so smooth and easy to shoot for a springer. It has got me hooked on break barrel guns now for sure.

                    I will get you some number for the 177 nitro gun tomorrow.


                    • Those numbers were unoiled, the hobbys are 11.9 gr so sounds like yours would be a bit faster with them if you got 740 with 14.3grs

                  • RDNA
                    No reply at bottom below your last post so I am replying here.
                    My 177 nitro venom is out for delivery now so I will have it around 3 PM and it is sunny here, I have some H&N hollow points that are 12.65 gr so I can oil both guns and shoot them to get them thru the dieseling range and then get you some numbers that would be closer to your 11.9 hobby’s.

                    I will post some to you later when I get them.


    • Matt61
      As I had told you before I grew up in Cocoa beach Florida which is home to the thousand islands of the intercoastal waterway and I camped out every weekend from the 7 grade to the 9th grade on the islands and was always hunting, swimming, water skiing or snorkeling all the time. The only way that I would or could be drowned is if I was unconscious because I am like a fish in water. I was water skiing at 7 years old and slalom skiing at 8. I have had junior and senior lifesaving training and in senior lifesaving training you had to float in a pool for 12 hours with out treading water to pass, you ball up in the fetal position and float and when you need air you just pick your head up out of the water and take a breath and then you will sink about 6 to 8 inches below the surface and then come back to the surface and repeat to save energy and be capable of staying alive for several days using that technique. Like I said I have done most everything I have wanted to do in life and never looked back just keep going forward until the lord takes me away.

      The main reason for camping out on the islands every weekend in 7th thru 9th grades was because my parents had a curfew of 10 pm to be home on weekend so if I was out camping with my friends on the islands there was no curfew and you could get to anywhere in CB by boat and my best friend at 15 was able to walk into any package store or minute saver and buy beer or liquor without being carded. So we had a lot of fun times on the islands until we were old enough to drive or ride street legal dirt bikes and then it was even a larger area we could cover and explore on our bikes. I have been shot at by orange tree farmers with rock salt for riding thru there groves and chased by more cops than I can count. On a dirt bike you just turn off into the woods and the chase is over because we knew the whole area like the back of our hands and could lose the cops with ease,

      Boy do I miss those teenage years of eternal fun and adventure.


    • I used to whitewater canoe and raft. I made a very brief foray into the world of whitewater kayaking, but I could never master the roll, so I stayed away from those little things.

      That woman you spoke of very likely would not have been armed in any case. For one thing she was likely of the mindset that guns are evil. Also, if she was circumnavigating the Lakes, she would be crossing the borders of states and countries that are not gun friendly.

      It is the job of the various law enforcement agencies to protect you from harm, not yourself. How can you possibly think that you should take on that responsibility. You are incapable of having the good judgement to be able to even own a firearm, much less use one for self preservation.

  6. RR
    I am so glad that we have law enforcement to protect us from the bad guys and ourselves as I don’t think I would have survived this long with out them. I would hate to think what would happen if the numerous donut shops went out of business as then our well trained law enforcement would not be able to get the required nourishment to be able to stay fit and healthy enough to respond to calls of us incapable citizens for protection.

    In the world we live in today law enforcement is not going to be the ones saving us from ourselves it will be our own responsibility to learn how to hide under rocks and tunnels until all the bad people have been rounded up and given a luxurious place to relax and be supplied with all the necessities they require to keep them content and happy.

    I am so glad to live in the land of Dixie where rednecks still abound in large numbers so that we can just all gather together and party to keep the bad guy happy and don’t have to worry about them wanting to hurt us or take what we have spent our whole lives working to own.


      • RR
        You are so correct and I guess I have never learned how or what is or is not politically correct and am to old to start now not that I would even want to as to me this is still the land of the free and the home of the brave. So if I say something to upset or offend anyone it is there problem to learn how to deal with it as I still have my right to free speech and expression. So if it bothers someone they will just have to get over it and learn to get thick skinned.



        • As long as we keep in mind that it is not necessary to use vulgar language to express our ideas and we should not stray too far from airguns here. We do not wish this place to spiral into a garbage pile unfit for sensible people to read and force Edith to take action.

          • RR
            I would not want this to spiral out of control either and become a garbage pile that would require Edith to take action. Most of our gov’t has already done that so I think it would take quite a bit to top their efforts. From now on I will refer to you as an Applachain-American as long as you are willing to refer to me as a Redneck then we can both be happy and Agree to Disagree.

        • No problem, probably weren’t expecting me since I’ve been out for awhile, life gets crazy through the warm weather for some reason. Can’t seem to keep up! Unfortunately being busy doesn’t always mean business is good.

          • RifledDNA
            No since I replied to Ridgerunner I just assumed it was a response from him. You know what happens when you assume something, you make a axx of you and me.

            I know how it is in the summer months when I worked as a mechanic because people would bring their cars ion to be checked and were wanting to leave in 2 hours. it always seemed that they would wait till the last minute to get their car looked at and then get upset when it was not done in 10 minutes.

            I hope that things get better fro you here in the fall.


            • Thanks, things are always meeting the fan in the fall, piling up behind it like the leaves, sometimes it makes sense to rake, and sometimes you just don’t have bags or a place for it all.

              • The best worm bed I ever had was a small ditch in the front yard where I dumped all the leaves and would run them over with the Cub Cadet. all the runoff from the driveway silted them in after about 3 rains.One tilling fork full would easily render 2 dozen. But it took a couple years work.

            • Yeah and run 3/4 throttle trying to get there before we closed for lunch! It woulda been funny but catalytic converters, headers and transmissions gets hot pretty quick when you’re pourin’ on the coal and won’t be anywhere near cool until tomorrow morning when the dew falls and who has time to break for lunch, maybe a sprint across the road for some quick & dirty grab joint. I’m gonna miss those days!

              • Reb
                The only thing I miss is getting to drive some of the cool cars after PDI inspection when you would get to take a 6 speed trans am out for a drive and use up 10,000 mile worth of rubber in 4 miles on the test drive or a new caddy with the northstar motor and turn the traction control off and Power brake then let off the brake and watch it change lanes because of the torque steer from the front wheel drive.
                I can say I tested Pontiacs and Cadillac’s speed limiters in their new cars on most test drives and in 97/98 they would both do 155 before the speed limiter kicked in and shut the spark down for milli seconds to keep them from going any faster.

                That is all I miss though as far as cars go, but it was also cool to get to go around the Talladega Super Speedway on a Harley motorcycle at 110 mph in the pitch black of night at 2 AM with only your headlight to see the track and the 33 degree banking coming up at the end of the back straight. I only wished that Harleys could go faster than 105 to 110 mph.


            • Gunfun
              No reply below your SRT4 post but yes they are fast to but I don’t think they will do 186 mph so any 1000 cc or up crotch rocket will still leave them in top end. The 1999 hayabusa would do 201 mph and then in 2000 the European gov’t complained to the jap bike makers and said that if they did not limit the top speed to 186mph they would not be allowed to sell them in Europe so the japs caved in and limited the top speed of all crotch rockets to 186 regardless of where they would be sold. another UN global unitization scheme at work.

              We can stop now so are you saying you are not happy to be label as a Hoosier, I won’t hold it against you as we are all still good ole red blooded AMERICANS.


              • buldawg
                I had a different computer in the SRT4. Factory they were set at 149 mph. My top end limiter was removed as well as the rpm limiter was raised. The speedometer went to 160 or maybe more; can’t remember exactly right now. The car redlined at 6500 rpm. It was at 5200 rpm at 150 mph in 5th gear which was 1 to1 not a overdrive. So if the crotch rocket’s were limited to 186 then that’s probably why I could pull from them.

                I ran a Viper from 70 mph up and had about 3 cars on him the whole way up till I hit my redline. He got one one car length closer then he shut down. Heck my SRT was running 130 mph in the top of 4th gear in the quarter mile. Now day’s you can’t under estimate a 4 cylinder that’s for sure.

                • Gunfun
                  If your SRT4 would do over 186 and pull away from crotch rockets then you are just as crazy as I am and from the talks we have had I believe its true. The japs put a speed limiter in the computer on there bikes and lowered the sprocket gear tooth count on the front to limit speed, the limiter was easily overridden by putting a resistor in the wire from the speed sensor that cut the reading the computer saw in half thereby fooling the speed limit range and then just add on one or two tooth bigger front sprocket and the busa and ZX1400s would do into the 200s. You also likely pulled away from a lot of crotch rockets because not every rider has the guts to go that fast as if you do not stay down behind the wind screen and are not holding on to the bars very tightly at 180 plus and you sit up from behind the wind screen at that speed it can pull you off the bike or put the bike into a high speed wobble that will make your butt cheeks leave a crease in the seat.

                  I had a friend in 78 that had a 69 charger with a 440 six pack in it and it had a 293 to 1 or 292/1 whatever the real low ratio mopar had back then in the rear end and he had had the heads hogged out to the point that you could put your fist in intake ports of them. We were on our way to a Led Zeppelin concert in Tampa from Cocoa Beach and had to take the beeline expressway which is 50 miles of straight flat highway and we were running late so we decided to see what it would run, the six pack was three Holley 650 CFM two barrels and he had an electric fuel pump back at the tank and one under the hood. We got to about 135 and it started to nose over so he flipped the pump under the hood on and it set is back in our seats and promptly buried the speedo at 160 and was still pulling hard when a state trooper went by in the other direction. He lifted off the throttle for a second and the car started to float across the road so he put his foot back in it and we decided that there was no way the trooper could turn around and catch up to us before we would reach our exit and disappear.

                  He later put that motor in a 71 duster and drag raced with it and would turn 10 second 1/4s consistently.

                  You are right nowadays four bangers make as much power as V8s it just cost more to do it.


          • RDNA
            Id call him a brother redneck that just got lost at birth and found his way home.
            Heck I was a air force brat that was born in Britain and lived there for 6 months ,then to savannah GA, Little Rock ARK, Stillwater OK, Bedford MASS, Cocoa beach FLA and finally found my home in the HEART of DIXIE.

            It ain’t where you start it just where you heart is at that matters.



  7. B.B.
    I can’t help wondering if the damage your scale did may have effected the accuracy somehow. There don’t seem to be any blog readers who own one of these posting or is it boasting how well their Fuel shoots at 25 yards so your rifle is the only game in town. I agree this rifle deserves at least a retest with a better scope like a “Bug Buster” 3-9×32 can’t obtain a second sample to test.


  8. BB
    In the American Airgunner episode that just aired this week where you demonstrated how to disassemble a spring gun, what was the gun you disassembled. I am just curious as to who the maker is so I know which one uses the thread in spring seats. I always take the barrel off first so I can secure the receiver action by the barrel pivot hole at the front and use blocks of wood on the sides to keep it from moving sideways while removing the spring.


  9. I picked up the QB-36,with the 4×20 Red Star scope, yesterday to run some rounds through and noticed ,for the first time , a bright spec of light @ about 12:30. Further inspection revealed another one 180 degrees across the eyepiece lens. Sound like a cracked lens? a more complete inspection,involving removal of the eye bell,revealed no other clues.


    • Reb
      I have no clue if you cannot see a crack in the glass lens that runs all the way across between the specs of light. if it was a piece of aluminum or steel you could dye check it to find a crack but it being something you look through you would not want to do that as you could never get all the red dye out of the crack or off the lens because it penetrates into every little nook, cranny and crevice it can find.


        • Reb
          That may be it as I have tried to take old broken scopes apart to see just how they are made but have never been successful in doing so. It may just be time for it to be put to rest.


          • I never liked it anyway but it’s the only way I have to aim it until I get some money to spend on it. I can’t risk my Tasco on it, it’s only been on pumpers since I took it off my Remington 550-1, it’s only rated for rimfire, I’m sure it would be gone in fewer than 10 shots.

            • Reb
              Yep the scope most definitely needs to be springer rated to be able to hold up for any length of time. If the scope is still holding the POA and only has the light white spots I would continue to use it until it no longer is holding the POA as it is already damaged so you cannot do anymore damage until it fails completely


            • You can’t tell if it’s an internal lens making the lights? Maybe take a jewels loupe to inspect the outer lenses. I’ve found loupe to be invaluable asset in airgun work. I found a WWII German made folding loupe that is practically a microscope in a house clean out that is blowing my mind and getting a lot of use. Luckily it’s built to German bulletproofedness, a real heirloom built piece.

    • Reb
      I would think that if you could see what appeared to be a crack in a lens it would show up all the way across the glass. I don’t know what would be the best way to check for sure, if it was metal I would recommend dye checking it, but you would never get all the red dye out of the nooks and crannies of a scope.


  10. B.B.,

    I am a little frustrated. It is common for you to try the Superdomes and Barracuda Match pellets when you are looking for the best pellet for a rifle.

    I have never had any luck with either of these pellets in any gun. Can you think of any reason why this might be or is it just a matter of that’s the way the cookie crumbles?


    • Hi, folks. Many of the H&N pellets, like the Baracuda Match and Field Target Trophy, some in several different head sizes. I wonder if, in addition to the cookies, some of G&G’s and B.B.’s different results might be down to the head sizes?

      I myself am just about to test the internet forum wisdom that the some of the 5.53mm H&Ns are winners in the Marauder Pistol…


  11. I own the Umarex Fuel and the Umarex Octane, I like the Umarex Fuel more, the Octane is longer, heavier and bulky and you need more strength to cock the Octane of which if you shoot alot of pellets at one time you will work up a sweat , being heavy the Octane is a Bear to move around to get into position, both shoot accurately after firing so many pellets through it .. I like the Fuel better…..I like the fact that the rail is not welded on like the Benjamin Titan. After shooting so many pellets it is a good idea to check the screw behind the trigger and the two screws up front on the sides of the stock to see if they are tight or not…

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