by Tom Gaylord
Writing as B.B. Pelletier
Crosman’s 150 looks plain and simple, but was a pivotal airgun.
This report covers:
- The test
- Different type of inlet valve
- Not much sight adjustment
- RWS Hobby
- JSB Exact RS
- Change the aim point
- Crosman Premier
- General observations
- The sights
- 2016 Texas Airgun Show
Today we’ll look at the accuracy of my Crosman 150 CO2 pistol. Several of you said you have either a 150 or a 157, and this report reminded you if what a nice airgun it is. So you dug them out. I hope to hear some good reports from you.
I don’t think I have ever shot this pistol for accuracy. If I did, I forgot about it. This seemed like a test of a brand new airgun, to me.
The test
Since I knew nothing about the gun I decided to test it at 10 meters off a bag rest. Instead of 10-shot groups I went with just 5 shots, thinking I would test each pellet on both low and high velocity. That assumption faded with the very first pellet I tried.
RWS Hobby
First up was the lightweight RWS Hobby pellet. In .22 caliber it weighs 11.9 grains, and is sometimes a very accurate pellet in a particular airgun. I began the test on low power (cocking knob pulled out one click). After the shot I was surprised to see no hole in the paper. So I walked up to 12 feet from the target and shot again. It hit very low and to the right.
Not much sight adjustment
When I saw this I looked at the rear sight and discovered there is no vertical adjustment possibility and very little in the way of horizontal. I shoved it as far to the left as it would go and fired another shot on high power (two clicks out on the cocking knob). This shot landed higher but was still 3 inches below the aim point. So high power it would have to be.
RWS Hobbys
The first group was more or less centered on the bull, but still very much below the aim point. The group is very vertical which surprised me because the sights are very sharp. Perhaps Hobby are not best for this 150.
Five RWS Hobbys went into this vertical group that measures 1.119-inches between centers.
JSB Exact RS
Nex, I tried some JSB Exact RS pellets. These always seem to do well in lower-powered airguns. And this time was no exception. Five of them clustered in 0.651-inches between centers at 10 meters. This group was fairly rounded, so the gun can shoot when it wants to. These pellets struck the paper very close to where the Hobbys hit, so the pistol is still shooting very low.
Five JSB Exact RS pellets made this 0.651-inch group at 10 meters. The gun can shoot!
Change the aim point
For the last pellet I decided to change the aim point to get the group higher on the paper. I took aim at the top of the bull, but couldn’t see the front sight clearly enough. So I aimed at the black clip that held the target. While it isn’t as precise as the bullseye, I could see the front sight clearly enough to take good aim.
For Premier pellets I used the bottom center of the clip as the aim point.
Crosman Premier
The final pellet I tried was the Crosman Premier. It went more to the right than the other two pellets, but was about as far below the aim point as the rest. Five Premiers went into 1.091-inches, but 4 of them were in a much tighter cluster that was just 0.662-inches between centers. Because the aim point was not a standard one, I think I should consider Premiers for this pistol, along with the JSB Exact RS.
Five Premier pellets went into 1.091-inches at 10 meters, but 4 of them are only 0.662-inches apart.
General observations
The 150 is very loud on high power. My cats all complained about the noise.
The gun also recoils. That was very obvious when I concentrated on the front sight.
I said the trigger was creep-free in Part 2. That isn’t correct. Now that I have really concentrated on it, I can feel some slight creep in the second stage. It’s nothing some moly couldn’t take care of.
The sights
I wonder what I am going to do about these sights? They are far enough off that it’s going to take some real engineering to correct them. I doubt this 150 will ever be a favorite go-to air pistol, but it might be nice to find a fix, so owners with the same problem have a solution. If I can think of something other than shaving down the front sight, I might come back to this airgun at some time in the future.
2016 Texas Airgun Show
Just a reminder that the 2016 Texas Airgun Show is approaching fast. It’s held on Saturday, August 27 at the Arlington Sportsman’s Club. I believe there are still a few tables to rent for $30, or just come to the show to see what a good airgun show is all about.
We’ll have the American Airgun cast and crew there, plus other personalities from the world of airguns. And the door/raffle prizes will be given away all day long. Yes, there are public ranges, and you can bring your own guns to shoot or try out something you find at the show before you buy it. Most of the major distributors will have tables there and their guns will be on the ranges to try. Click on the link for more information.
You could always put a shim or washer under the rear sight to raise your point of impact. You can also take a file and elongate the groove the rear sight screw rests in so you have a little more lateral travel. Obviously that is a permanent modification and you probably don’t want to do that to a classic airgun so why not swap out the original rear sight with a newer one from a Crosman 17xx, 22xx or 13xx series. Lastly, how about using the Crosman 459MT Intermounts and mounting a red dot to take the sights out of the equation altogether?
Cmz128,
I thought of the shim, but I think too much height is needed. As for the dot sight, I don’t like optical sights on handguns, so I’ll probably not go that route.
I did think of trying to mount the optional rear sight. I have to look into the feasibility of that.
Thank you for thinking of these options for me.
B.B.
I must be lucky. My 1958 Crosman 150 sights are spot on using a combat sight picture at 15 yards..
__ __
[ O ]
Digitalfoot,
Welcome to the blog.
Yes, you are lucky about the sights aligning. Good on ya! 😉
B.B.
Poor sights seem to be the bane of my air gun pistol shooting. At least with my miserable sights I can blame the poor shooting to the sights and not to my lack of skill. I really think there would be a market for good adjustable rear sights. Some of us might have to take the pistol and sights to a gun shop if there is drilling and taping involved, but it would be in some cases worth it.
Best wishes
Harvey
Harvey,
I seems a shame that a potentially accurate arm is plagued with poor sights like this. But if I can find a clever fix that isn’t difficult to do, maybe that will be the silver lining for this cloudy result.
B.B.
Can you shave down the front sight? This reminds me of the front sight of my SW 686. The red front sight is very clear to me but darned if it doesn’t seem the tiniest little be canted. Staring as hard as possible at the sight, I cannot see any deviation. But the canting keeps appearing when I shoot. It would take a fortune to send to Smith & Wesson to fix. So, I expect that I will get used to it. The gun shoots very well as it is.
Matt61
Matt,
Shaving the front sight occurred to me. But the post is short and I wonder how much shaving will be needed to get the pellets on target. If I go too far, maybe there won’t be enough front sight to see.
B.B.
BB
You posted tonight. I’m surprised. Wasn’t expecting you to post already after the surgery.
Are things going ok?
B.B.
I have made spacers out of epoxy putty that work well. I coat the parts with a couple of layers of car-wax (as a release-agent) and use tape to define the shape of the spacer. A bit of paint and they look ok.
Hank
Hank,
You have given me an idea. What if I built up the rear sight higher — not elevate it, but raise the top of the sight, then file a new notch in it? That would work, I think. It might look bad, but the pistol is no beauty as it is.
I have to think about it.
Thanks,
B.B.
B.B.
If the back face of the sight is flat/smooth (and clean) you can glue a new piece of sheet metal to it (permanently) with Gel-CA adhesive.
A piece of “packing strap” (the blue/black metal band they use to secure bundles of wood and such) is ideal – it is thin and doesen’t bend easily (nice and springy actually) and is not too hard for filing. It can be cut with a good pair of tin-snips but the edge of a fine-cut square file leaves a smoother edge. The strapping is available in different widths and free from most shipping departments (they throw it out). I always keep a couple of lengths in my “good for something” box.
Touch-up the cut/files edges with a black Sharpie marker and it will look pretty good.
Hank
Hank,
That’s an even better Idea. I will think about it for a bit before doing anything.
B.B.
All this discussion about the minimally adjustable open sights on this Crosman 150 increases my admiration for the FWB P44 & Morini 162 MI pistols that B.B. recently tested.
After shooting those pistols and then the Crosman 150 it must feel like climbing out of a Rolls Royce and then getting into a VW bug. 😉
kevin
Kevin,
More like a Rolls to a deuce-and-a-half!
B.B.
B.B.
“My cats all complained about the noise.” Poor kitties! My cats don’t like CO2 guns, but they are OK with my Tempest. =>
For the 150, it would be a shame to modify a vintage airgun like that; but could you take a new sight for a Crosman 1377 and modify it to fit on the 150 (like without having to do anything to the 150). Then you could crank up the rear blade, and hopefully, get that thing shooting where it looks. Good luck!
take care & God bless,
dave
B.B.
According to some blogs, the rear sight for the old Crosman 1300 (Medalist II) is the same as the sight for the 150, except that it has the sliding piece for vertical adjustment. That might do the trick…if you can find one.
You said you are about 3″ low at 10 meters (32.8 feet); that’s 3″ low at 393.6″; with a sight radius of about 9″, that means you only need to raise the rear sight about 70 thousandths of an inch ( x = {3 x 9}/393.6 = 0.0685″).
That’s not too much; you should be able to tweak that bad boy in; and if you do, please do let us know how it works out. =D
take care & God bless,
dave
I think I would go with some shims. Milk carton plastic is cheap so you can use as much as needed. Once correct, you can color them black. It sounds like you would also need a longer screw(s).
Mike
Yes; that would be a nice inexpensive solution.
With all the discussions about pistols I have been taking a new look at a pistol that was left at my house 15 yrs. ago by a one-legged man that never came back to pick it up! Its a Diana Model 5-G. I never.shot it much and was just saving it for him if he came back. After 15 years I guess it’s mine now. Talking about sights on pistols, this has beautifully adjustable rear sights, positive click detents and ingraved marking for repeatable settings.Trigger is 2 stage adjustable and very smooth! ( I wish I had this trigger on my Discovery). I was thinking about selling it, but now I think I will just learn to shoot it. Its just too nice to let go of! Fit and finish are still like new, and looking at it in this new light it is just downright pretty! Its like, after 15 yrs., you realize there is a beautiful woman living right next door and she is interested in getting to know you! BB, .thankyou for rekindling my interest in pistols. It just adds even more fun to my airgunning adventures
Bruce
Bruce,
The Diana model 5 pistol is a classic. There were several versions of the gun made, and each has its good points. The pre-war ones have the nicest finish, but the ones from the ’60s are probably the best of all.
Enjoy,
B.B.
BB,
I don’t know the manufacture date but its marked” Made in West Germany” so I guess its made before 1992. It is really nice and I am looking forward to getting to know it much better. It has molded grips, but is righthanded only.
Bruce
Bruce,
It sounds like a later gun. Should have a hooded front sight and a gray(?) grip. As late as it is, you know the piston seal is most likely a blue lifetime one.
It’s a good gun.
B.B.
BB,
The grips on it are brown wood look with a full length shelf for thumb on left side grip. Wirh the angle of of the grip it doesn’t allow me to lock in my wrist but l will keep trying to practice the form you brought out here. Whole new insight into airgun pistols!
Bruce
I have a 6G from the 80’s. Fancy wooden grip with palm shelf.
I let it sit for 25 years. Tried shooting it, third pellet through my seal disintegrated.
Check your seals before you shoot it, or send it to someone to check them for you.
Enjoy, they are real fun…
-Y
B.B. thoughts and prayers for you.
B.B.,
It took me a while to locate my 157, but it still had a bit (8 shots on high power) of CO2 in it after I don’t know how long, certainly more than a year, probably more than two years. The 8 shots were loud, but not as loud as when I put a fresh CO2 Powerlet in it! As with last time, I carefully dropped some Pellgunoil directly into the reservior and on the Powerlet both, intentionally overdoing it. This was a leaker when I first came into possession of it, and I didn’t want it to go back to its old ways.
VERY loud in my basement. I also found only a slight difference between the low and high power settings, both with my phonebooks and in loudness, so I went with high power only. (Too cold and wet outside for chronying lately.)
I’m low on .177 Hobbys at the moment, so I went with the economy version of them, the RWS Club pellet, also 7 grains. I also tried Crosman Premier Lights and Crosman Premier Heavies. I shot five shots with each pellet at 10 meters in my basement, seated and off a bag. I used home printed targets that say, “Slow Fire Pistol” on them and nothing else. They are very large compared to the sheets of Olympic Air Rifle targets that I usually use, but my eyes are really starting to fail me, so without optics . . . I did wait 30 seconds between each shot as my 157 gets cold — even in my 71 degree basement — very quickly, probably more so than any of my many other CO2 pistols and revolvers.
The RWS Club made a group I could ALMOST cover with a quarter, and the CPLs and CPHs were not quite as accurate with my pistol. Except for one CPL that was an outlier, they “grouped” under two inches. OK, 2.25 inches for the CPHs to be completely honest. Each pellet struck the target slightly high and slightly to the left.
I do have better results with my Beeman P17 and Avanti 747, so perhaps the recoil of the 157 is a factor with me.
Michael
Michael,
Thank you for your report. I don’t think I ever owned a 157, so it’s interesting to hear how it performs.
Enjoy your airgun!
B.B.
B.B.,
I shot my 157 again briefly this afternoon, but my aim was worse than before, so even though it was fun, it was also frustrating, so I shot only three more five-shot groups with the same three pellets as above. I have been grading papers today, and that affects my eyesight for a while. That and the cats upstairs (not allowed in the basement) probably hated the noise.
All three pellets go slightly above the bull and to the left. Might the landing to the left be my technique? I am left-handed and wonder if I am pulling ever-so-slightly on the trigger. I might try wrapping my right index finger over the trigger guard and see if that changes anything.
Michael
BBB! The 5G is one of those “fun factor” guns. I have guns that are prettier and I have guns that are more accurate, but not many of my guns are as fun to shoot. No refilling. No bad seals. Just cock, put a pellet in it and take a shot. It’s like potato chips, you just keep “eating” ’em!
I have the same kind of relationship with my Haenel 311 and a few other guns. Not new technology, not inaccurate, but not like today’s new stuff either. Just fun to shoot.
Shoot that 5G!
Motorman
Motorman,
In my first serious session with it I went thru the last 75 .177 pellets I had on hand in about an hour! Darn, I just had to go buy some more! Quality just feels good in the hand.
Bruce
Reader Steve sent this to the wrong address, so I’m posting it for him.
Hello B.B.,
I realize you are a busy man and I’m sure you’ll get many many emails. Please do not feel obligated to take your time to respond to this. I’m not very good with computers and so I’m not sure if this is the best way to contact you but I just wanted to say thank you. I’m new to airgunning, and after purchasing my first air rifle (hatsan 135 vortex) I’ve had nothing but fun, except for accidentally bending my Barrel! I must have been on my 150th round and with tired hands it just slipped through my fingers while cocking ( I would never pulled the trigger while barrel was breached!) In a complete panic I happened across your post on bending barrels and using your methods was able to completely restore my gun to its former glory. I just wanted to let you know I am grateful for your posts and blogs and will continue to read them. Keep up the good work
Thanks again,
Steve
Steve,
Thanks for your comment! I’m happy when something I write helps out an airgunner.
Good for trying,
B.B.
Hey Reb,
Happy Birthday!
Thanks Joe! Just sitting here alone waiting on a friend. Got paid today so I don’t have to go without any more for a bit anyway.
Thanks for remembering me even through my extended absence
Reb,
Maligayang Kaarawan! (Happy Birthday!)
Everyone,
Just returned fropm filming “Amrican Airgunner”. My retina detached on the drive home, leaving me blind in the right eye. I go in for surgery tomorrow morning. Please pray for me.
B.B.
BB
Just read your post about your eye. You bet I’ll pray!
Fido3030
Wow BB. Don’t know what to say. You sure are having a tuff time with health issues.
Serious stuff there. Hope all goes well tomorrow. I’m afraid to ask what eye.
Done said a prayer.
Please update us when you can.
GF1,
It’s the right eye — my sighting eye. The doctor says there is an 80-90 percent chance of fixing it with one surgery, so the odds are in my favor.
B.B.
BB
I was afraid of that. You know there is people out there praying for you. It’s going to work out. Faith and trust will pull you through. I know you know what I mean.
Please post if you can when your home. You don’t have to hurry but would like to know how you are.
BB,
Prayers and good luck with surgury tomorrow! Sorry to hear about your right eye!
Man,this “getting old” stuff is getting old, really fast! I’m sure we all out here will be thinking of you till you are able to let us know how well it all went.
Bruce
B.B.,
You got it. Best of luck. 90% is pretty good. Please keep us posted as best possible.
Chris
Prayers sent for empowering the doctor and prayers sent for your speedy and complete recovery.
Yikes, I’ve been worried about detached retinas from judo. Vision for shooting–and everything else–is all important. Our prayers are with you, and the doctors tell me that they have good success in repairing retinas. You should be fine. Let us know the outcome.
Matt61
Tom,
Our prayers and best wishes for a speedy recovery.
Jim
B.B.
I just saw this Sir. Dear God PLEASE put it right. I’m praying for you now, don’t worry as you are a good person and God will be with you & fix everything. God Bless you Sir. How are you now?
Errol
BB
FWIW, I’ve been playing with Crosman 1377’s lately, and the more I do, the more impressed I am. The three I have been testing are unmodified with the exception of of a shoulder stock and a lighter trigger spring and using the original peep sight will shoot under 1/4 inch ctc most of the time using JSB 7.33 grain dome pellets–when i do my part! One likes 2 pumps, another 3 pumps and the third 4 pumps for best accuracy. I’m using them only for 10 meter informal target and quiet backyard plinking, and they do this just fine!
I’ve learned a couple of things: when pumping hold the pump wide open for a second or two to let the air in. Verticle stringing can result if you pump too fast. Experiment with the number of pumps since velocity varies a little between guns, to match the pellet to the rifling. The guns like the forend to be held firmly. Shoot by pressing the very tip of the trigger. If they don’t group check the crown for burrs.
I’ve learned a lot from the machine rest and CO2 Crosmans about how the little things add up that I’ve applied to the pumpers and my shooting techniques. I still haven’t figured How to use the rest for the pumpers.
Thanks again to all who have helped me with advice on this Blog. Cordially,
Fido3030
Ps Happy B-day Reb!
I was writing the stuff about 1377s while BB posted about his eye. Had i known, i wouldn’t have.
BB, you have no idea how much you mean to all of us
Fido3030
Fido3030,
Thanks for that.
People say there is a good chance for recovery if this is treated in time. The doctor came into his office to see me yesterday and is doing the surgery this morning. I have to look straight down for the next month to let the gas bubble he puts in the eyeball press the retina in place, but he says he thinks there is a good chance for complete recovery.
B.B.
B.B./Tom
Don’t push yourself to post a blog this month. I’m sure we can entertain ourselves while you rest and heal. Maybe somebody else can do the editing and posting for a while. Guest blogs anyone?
Siraniko
Fido3030,
Nice testing and much was learned. I’ll bet that you have notes coming out your ears,…. 😉
A quick update on my end. Got the .25 M-rod, Freedom 8, LP compressor, dryer, buddy tank. Reading all the manuals and playing with this and that. Scope, rings, pellets and other goodies on the way Mon. or Tues.. I got all the big stuff here earlier because I was not yet done with my research on scopes and some other things. Finished that up Friday.
Keep us posted and I will do the same.
Chris
Chris,
Glad to hear you are finally getting all your stuff together for “the big project”! I’m sure the moment will be buffered by the news about Tom but I would be about to jump out of my skin with excitement at this point! I just want to say thank you for sharing your journey with all of us. It is people like you and all the others that make this blog such a great place to learn! All those new toys must be burning holes in their shipping boxes, just waiting for you to get them open. Keep us posted.
Bruce
Bruce,
Thank you,…. thank you very much for that. Sharing sums it up pretty well. And,… in the interest of sharing,…. I have just used the Freedom 8, the California Air Tools 5510SE LP compressor and can not say enough about either one. (Worked flawless). Auto cut off on the Shoebox kicked in at 4600 psi per tank gauges. Both,…. VERY quiet.
I was just a (wee bit scientific) on the first fill of a Buddy bottle from 0 psi to 4600 psi. I measured 2nd and 3rd head temperature, both with cover on and off. I measured motor temp. also. (The basis for the fill was 15 min. on and 20 min. resting),… with the F-8 fan on.
The temp. on the LP comp. never rose above 103 F. It only ran 40 seconds for every 10 minutes of HP comp. run time.
The second and third stage head temperatures never rose above 114 and 111 F respectively.
The motor never got hotter than127 F. But, when cover was on, only rose to 118 F. The pistons were running at 108 and 105 with the cover off. Bottom line,…. leave the cover on. The fan blows the air in and the motor sucks the air out.
Fill time, from 0 to 4600, given the 15 on and 20 off,….2:33 run time and 3:00 rest time. Now filled to 4600, the “top up”,… from 2250 to 4600 will take 1:30 run time, with a rest time of 1:40.
Moisture?,….. I could not even see any. I bled the LP tank 3 times and the dryer as well.
Air cooler,….. you may remember that I was going to try coiled plastic LP hose in a 5 gallon bucket with water and ice packs,…. BEFORE it hit the dryer. Worked great! The water temp,. stayed between 50 and 55 F over the course of 6 hrs. 50′ of hose in the bucket.
So, shortened run times, and rest between,…. kept the heat down and the moisture as well.
For “sharing”,… that is it for now. Chris
Tom,
Prayers are on the way asking our Lord to guide your surgeon’s hands for a successful surgery and your speedy recovery.
Bruce
Gunfun1, for an automatic airgun all I can think of is the one that B.B. used to put 5 shots in a single hole. I think the name was Evanix or E something. However, I share your resistance to electrically powered automatic actions. One can’t say they are artificial since we’re talking about a machine, but they are not like the mechanism of an automatic firearm that we are trying to imitate.
My worst airgun purchase ever was an airsoft M4 with full auto that cost $20 with $20 in shipping. The red dot sight was way off point of aim. It did function on selective fire I have to admit, and it made the bushes thrash. But it sounded like a typewriter, and all seemed to was destroy airsoft ammo at a high rate.
Matt61
Matt61
Yep the typewriter sound. It just ain’t right.
The FX Monsoon is a cool gun. But it does have some issues. And for the money they want for it there shouldn’t be no issues.
And just thought I would mention. I put my green laser on the Talon SS today. I’ll put it this way. It’s very simple to hit with. And no exaggeration. My oldest daughter shot it today. And this is the first time she tryed this way ever. She hit the 50 yard spinner 3 out of 5 shots and that was holding the gun to her waist.
Here’s a picture of my Talon SS with the scope mounted bipod and the green laser.
http://s1378.photobucket.com/user/gcarsgp2/media/Mobile%20Uploads/IMG_20160501_180002781_zpsodqmsoco.jpg.html?filters%5Buser%5D=144995042&filters%5Brecent%5D=1&sort=1&o=1
Tom,
Hope all goes well for you. I had some of the inner lining on my eye repaired a number of years ago – it was a quick procedure and all has been good since.
Hank
B.B. Your Model 150 looks identical to my Model 157? Except the rear and front sights are different! The two stage power with two stage with second stage creep trigger and other than the grips are metal etc! My Model 157 is pretty accurate! The rear sight is adjustable windage left to right, right to left with notch! The front sight is higher and both are all metal! The whole gun is metal except grips! Don’t think that sights are a problem on this Model 157? Shooting on a rest is pretty accurate with wadcutters!! Been praying for you for a long time!! Late to read the blog! Been out of state to two different gun shows! Semper fi!
J. Lee,
You have the original sights that came on the gun. I have a late replacement that Cosman sold for years after the models were discontinued. The front sight is plastic and the rear, which is original, doesn’t adjust.
B.B.
Everyone,
I can only see out of my left eye, and that is very blurry. I can’t answer questions like this. Please understand and bear with me for a while.
B.B.
Follow your doctor’s order and keep your face down. This blog can and will survive as long as everyone cooperates and chips in to field the questions thrown at it. We’ll still be here when you come back. Hopefully you will recover very well from the surgery. Your retina needs time to make new blood vessels and this first week is most critical. The weeks following will allow it to consolidate, but this first week is critical. So take it easy and rest.
Praying for your complete recovery.
B.B.,
I will second that. (Siraniko’s) comment. Should we all start typing with all capitol letters? 😉
Continued prayers, take care, Chris