by Tom Gaylord
Writing as B.B. Pelletier
ASG’s CZ 75 SP-01 Shadow BB pistol is large and heavy. The guns they are shipping have red fiberoptic sights in front, like those found on the firearm.
This report covers:
- The trigger
- My firearm
- Not a CZ 75
- Clean the screens
- Velocity Dust Devils
- Velocity ASG Blaster BBs
- Velocity Daisy BB
- We need BB action targets
- Shot count
- Trigger pull
- Evaluation
Wow — what a report this is stacking up to be! I have so many things to tell you today. Let’s get started.
The trigger
Boy oh boy, I wasn’t expecting all the negative comments about the thin trigger in Part 1. Some folks just went ballistic!
The trigger is not thin. First off, it is shiny and that makes it look thinner than it is. Second, it was photographed from the side. You could not see how wide it is. I took a picture from the front today so you can see what it really looks like.
The trigger may look thin from the side but its width makes up for it.
My firearm
Next, I took some heat for the firearm I showed you next to the ASG pistol — the one I said I was going to test alongside the BB pistol. That was deserved. Like I told you in the report, I tried to save money when I bought that pistol. Well that was all I did — save money. I ended up with a firearm that is not representative of the CZ 75 SP-01 Shadow. Not at all! It’s like going to an all-you-can-eat steakhouse and being surprised that the steak isn’t as good as you had hoped.
That pistol was made by IMI — an Israeli weapons manufacturer who also made the Desert Eagle for many years. They are a fine firm, but the Bul Cherokee pistol that I bought is not representative of the true CZ 75 — any more than a cheap 1911 clone is representative of the genuine Colt. So I have changed my plans.
Not a CZ 75
The basic CZ 75B is much better known than the SP-01 Shadow, but that’s because it has been around longer and there are so many more of them in the world. It is a fine weapon in its own right that might be a good gun to compare with this BB pistol, but the SP-01 Shadow firearm has certain advantages over the base model. It would be like comparing a basic government 1911A1 to a 1911A1 made by Wilson Combat — not a fair comparison.
I’m communicating with CZ USA to see if I can get a genuine 9mm CZ 75 SP-01 to test. If I can, I will. If not I will buy one, because I have plans for these guns that go beyond this report. I want to do this right.
Clean the screens
The next lesson came when I started chronographing the pistol, because today is velocity day. I wasn’t getting any readings. An error code told me skyscreen 2 wasn’t “seeing” the BB. That happens every once in awhile, but this was consistent. After the 6th shot I realized that the skyscreen might be dirty so I looked at it. It was covered by a film of oil particles and dust from recent tests. Time to clean.
Skyscreen two was fogged with oil and dust.
I cleaned the skyscreen with a cotton swab. It cleaned up instantly. While I was at it, I also cleaned screen 1, though it wasn’t as bad. The results were instantaneous!
A clean screen put me back in business.
Velocity Dust Devils
Now that the skyscreens were clean I was back in business. The first BB to be tested was the Air Venturi Dust Devil. These averaged 326 f.p.s. with a range that went from 317 to 331 f.p.s. That’s a spread of 14 f.p.s. across 10 shots. Normally I wait for the gun to warm up when shooting with CO2, but with this pistol each shot seemed to go faster. I tried to wait 10 seconds between shots, but when I realized that wasn’t necessary I sped up. The last shots in the string were going faster than the first. At the average velocity the Dust Devils produce 1.03 foot-pounds of energy at the muzzle.
Velocity ASG Blaster BBs
Next up were ASG Blaster BBs. These weigh 5.4 grains, so we expect them to go slower, which they do. Blasters averaged 303 f.p.s. in the SP-01 Shadow. The range went from a low of 289 f.p.s. on shot 2 to a high of 310 f.p.s. on shot 10. That’s a spread of 21 f.p.s. across 10 shots. Like before, the gun sped up as it was shot. At the average velocity Blasters averaged 1.10 foot-pounds at the muzzle.
Velocity Daisy BB
The last BB I tested was the Daisy Premium Grade BB. These are very much like the Blasters, but a trifle lighter, so I expected a higher average, but it was exactly the same, at 303 f.p.s. The spread went from a low of 288 f.p.s to a high of 309 f.p.s. — so an identical 21 f.p.s. spread, as well. At the average velocity, Daisy BBs averaged 1.04 foot pounds at the muzzle.
We need BB action targets
Readers have been discussing the fact that there are no good action targets for BB pistols. Because of their low power, BB guns are not powerful enough for most action targets that are made for pellet guns. I had planned to cover the Air Venturi Dueling Tree for you with another BB pistol, but it really can’t be used with the gun I wanted to use. This pistol is another one that can’t operate it.
Shot count
Shot 52 was fast, at 307 f.p.s. with Daisy BBs. I figured it would get a lot more shots. However I didn’t take the blowback into consideration. I fired some blank shots and the next shot I chronographed was number 75, going 231 f.p.s. with Dust Devils. I was then interrupted for half an hour, and when I went back I figured the gun was out of gas. I fired one more shot and the cartridge gave up its last gas. Call it 65-70 shots per cartridge to be safe.
Trigger pull
The double action trigger pull on the test gun is 11 pounds, 4 oz. The single action pull is 1 lb. 12 oz. Both pulls are smooth and the single action pull is very crisp.
Evaluation
It’s obvious how much I like this BB pistol. The designers have gone to a lot of effort to mimic the firearm faithfully, and they have succeeded. I sure hope it’s accurate!
B.B.,
Nice tip on the sky screens. Ever since mine was new, I have put about a 3″ piece of electrical tape (Colored, not black. Black will leave a goo) over each screen. Peel them off at use and you are good to go. Mine stays on a tri-pod and a dish towel drapes over the unit when not in use. Same remote read unit you have.
Good Day to you and to all,… Chris
…., and yes,… I have forgotten to peel off the tape a few times. I did not work so well. 🙂
Chris,
That’s a good tip.
B.B.
B.B.,
Mine also has a 1/8″ piece of aluminum that goes under it and up the front and back. It may stick up 1/2″ above the chrony body. I did have to get a longer screw to mount it to the tri-pod. Most of my shots over it are 2-4″ above the body/eyes. At least it will offer some added protection for an “off” shot.
Yours looks to have suffered some very serious abuse. Then again, what you do for a living must be taken into account. When I chrony, it is much as you do. Indoors, ceiling light, muzzle maybe 12-18″ from first screen and the pellet trap is (very soon) thereafter. Gun is supported front and rear on adjustable plastic saw horses which also double as an indoor shooting bench when topped. Level and height of all components is adjusted as needed.
Like “they” say about other things in life,… it is not a matter as IF it is going to happen,…. but rather more of a question as to when it WILL happen. 😉
Chris
Chris
Off subject again as usual.
I was going to ask the other day again but got side tracked. How is your winter’s pepper plants doing. And your others too.
GF1,
The 2 Cayenne pepper plants that I over Wintered are about 30″ tall. They are together in 1 space. My 3 tomatoes are just as tall and the 6 Cayenne pepper plants are 15″ or so. We had a heat wave and the warm soil temp. really made everything take off. The (Ghost Pepper) is about a foot tall. Very different looking. More squatty with very broad leaves. All are caged. That is about it for an update.
Chris
Sounds like they are all doing good. And the ones you did over winter shows they got a head start. Now to see how they compare later on.
BB
In Tyler’s u-tube on the Hellboy he noticed that the Dust Devils were not faster? Perhaps we need to pay a little more attention to what kind of airguns they favor?
I found out my phone had the Wi-Fi disconnected so I could not forward pics of the Hellboy earlier. Please pardon the off topic interruption for two pics. One disassembled and one customized. The pistol grip mount block actually comes out too, but you will play hell trying to get it back in. The selector on the side has to engage a free floating safety drum in that block. Kinda like inserting a dime in a scope adjuster.
The flash hider has a set screw and LH threads on the removable outer barrel. Also the front pin that secures the receiver upper and lower seems to be retained on the right side by a ball and detent so don’t beat on it too hard.
Pick 2
GF1
In the pic above, that’s about all the grass we get this year in CA. No need to mow. However we do need to work hard keeping trees alive !
Bob M
Bob
Didn’t you say the grenade launcher came with it like in your bottom picture? And by the way. Back when I started my machine shop career back in “82” I made the 40 mm grenades for them launchers. The live green and blue practice grenades. The machine shop that I spent most of my years at was probably 85% military arms contracts back then. We even made the buffer bodies back then. Bomb loaders for fighter jets on the air craft carriers and even the jet engine changing cradles for the fighter jets.
And I see it’s even got the gas tube on it like the firearm version. Pretty cool replica gun. I like.
And lucky no grass cutting for you there. I got to cut every week here in the Midwest. If I don’t I’m in trouble next week. The grass cutting does slow down a bit in July and August though when it starts getting in the upper 90’s and 100’s. And like here at those times I bet you got to watch were you throw your matches or cigarettes.
GF1
If a grenade launcher comes with it you received someone else’s mail. No, I had an Airsoft rifle with one. It works with a wide verity of Airsoft 40mm ammo but its just there for a more dramatic photo and show what’s possible. The quad rail, butt stock and scope are swaps as well.
I haven’t checked yet but I’ll bet those reverse threads out front will accept loads of various Airsoft fake suppressors and flash hiders.
Bob M
Bob
You will have to let us know how it shoots.
By coincidence I came across the first video I’d seen of the Hellboy last night, which perked my interest in the gun. Velocity is lower than I’d like and I wish it shot pellets, but it looks fun. I was sad to see the Winchester MP4 be discontinued…
/blog/2014/08/winchester-mp4-co2-rifle-part-4/
HiveSeeker
As a collector I’ve learned, if you snooze you loose. Especially with special editions like the US Marshals Colt SAA. Got my Winchester MP4 early and like you I wanted to compare the two replicas and noticed it was discontinued.
Upon investigation it seems the rotary mag that worked so well in the M14 failed badly in the MP-4 . The mag on the MP4 was held in the C02 mag housing and the M14 held it in the receiver. Probably why they dropped it ??
An interesting point. There is a lot of room available to lift the hammer on the mag higher for more impact that may? increase the velocity if tinkerers figure out a way.
I have already cured the crude linkage drag on the trigger and shortened the travel some with a piece of small straw installed on a guide pin that acts like a roller, for now at least. It may result in slightly less velocity by altering the hammer contact point but I need to shoot it through a chrony for testing.
Also, I didn’t have a chance the last couple days to congratulate Paul on a very nice write-up on the Stiga Zenit. That was well done!
HiveSeeker,
That is indeed a compliment, coming from you. I have enjoyed your multi-part articles, too.
Paul
Kudos to Paul for the fine work on the Zenit review. Good writing, clear. concise, is much more difficult that it would appear. (Don’t try this at home…) It makes reading and understanding a pleasure. B.B. is an experienced practitioner so I’ve come to expect near-perfection, but from a “civilian”, very impressive.
A topic shift: I bought our oldest Grandson (14 yrs) a metal CO2 BB pistol. It is a semi-authentic not-true-to-anything pistol with a blade safety trigger, a blow-back slide and a 17 round magazine. I took him out to my plinking range and started to explain safety and how to hold. Turns out that he’s been devouring U-Tube videos and was already up on the FBI hold and the dynamics of sight picture, etc. He proceeded to whip Grandpa. Very humbling. I need to buy a pistol for my own training…
Dan
Did he whip out his smart phone and show you a video or two out at your plinking range? And yep you got to watch some of these kids nowdays. They will surprise you as to what they know. My daughter’s always got something they want to show me when it’s something they are interested in.
But sounds like you both had fun.
GrandpaDan,
Thank you! Writing an article like this is fun for me, but it is a lot of work. Many edits and re-edits over a couple of weeks, and I still cringe when I send it in.
Paul
Just an off topic question… I am considering the 1399 shoulder stock for my Crosman 1377, as I would like to get tighter groups for off-hand target shooting. If I do my part, can I expect similar accuracy at 10 meters to my Daisy 953 or closer to my Daisy 880?
Jeff
I would have to say that all depends on how well you shoot.
But I can say that my 1377’s I have had over time were easier to shoot more accurately with the 1399 stock than without.
For off-hand pistol, I seem to do better with my Beeman P17 – I think because it has a lighter, smoother trigger. I am also happy with my Daisy 953, which I am most accurate with. Both of these were pretty good right out of the box after sighting the in… Does the 1377 require more of a break-in period? Using it as a pistol, I just don’t seem to be consistent. Maybe it’s just me… But I’m hoping by turning it into a “carbine” I may tighten up my groups.
Jeff
I haven’t owned a P17 so I don’t know how they shoot. And another thing. I’m not really a pistol shooter. I do shoot pistol and u do have pistols but I like a long myself.
And I have had 953’s and 880’s and for me anyway my 1377 and 1322’s with the 1399 stock have been more accurate than the Daisy’s we are talking about.
And no I haven’t seen a break in needed for the 1377’s. But what I will say is when I put a Crosman steel breech and a Discovery or Maximus barrel with a scope on my 1377 I got real good accuracy.
And all the guns I just mentioned was shooting the best groups bench rested with the guns resting on a bag. Oh and all scoped.
Gunfun1
That’s reassuring. I have heard great things about the 1377 and glad to hear your results. I would love to be as accurate with it as with my 953. Maybe I need to shoot it more… maybe do some mods too ☺️! Thanks.
Jeff
Yes definitely shoot it more.
And remember I’m a modder. So yes some mods too.:)
Let me try my first paragraph again.
I haven’t owned a P17 so I don’t know how they shoot. And another thing. I’m not really a pistol shooter. I do shoot pistol and I do have pistols but I like a long gun myself.
And another thing. Your talking different ways of shooting and with different types of guns. I wouldn’t compare a pistol of hand to a rifle. Or maybe I missed where you was going with that.
And I meant.
I wouldn’t compare a pistol to a rifle in off hand shooting.
True – I think the P17 has such a nice trigger that I may have been expecting almost rifle-type results offhand with my 1377. I think my 1st mod will be the shoulder stock… Thanks again.
Jeff
All good. Just make sure you give a update with the 1399 stock.
And here’s something to get your modding blood going. You can get this from Pyramyd AIR.
/product/crosman-177-cal-steel-breech-kit-fits-1377-1740-1760-pc77-air-guns?a=4386
And you can order the Benjamin Maximus or Discovery barrel from Crosman. I myself like the Maximus barrel the best of the two. Supposedly they use a new process to make the Maximus barrel and they are very accurate barrels.
If you ever decide to do the steel breech and a Maximus barrel just let me know and I’ll post the part number for the barrel from Crosman.
Sounds great! Looks like I’ll have some more modding in my future!
Jeff
Cool. I think you will be happy.
Jeff,
I just recently read a repeat of a long ago lesson I was taught by the Gunny. It is something I use when I help family and friends with target shooting. Before you stock your pistol try one thing and see if it doesn’t improve your groups. Use a pistol target and keep it close, say 10-15 feet max. Shoot a group of 10 or more the way you currently shoot. Next try this: Concentrate on sight alignment! By that I mean rear and front sight. Just keep the gun more or less automatically pointed at the target. Try not to look or think about anything other than sight alignment; when the sights are aligned squeeze the trigger more…when the sights are not aligned stop increasing the squeeze. Remember, NO worries about the Target’s lineup JUST the sights.
See if your score doesn’t improve; maybe even by a surprising amount.
If not a stocked pistol is the way to get better groups for sure.
Good shooting!
shootski
Shootski
I remember hearing about some target shooter who held his 45 with only one or two fingers. If some one remembers the story have at it, I don’t. Evidently it was his secret. Perhaps it acted somewhat like an artillery hold for a pistol?
Bob,
That’s B.B.’s recollection of Commander who showed Tom how to shoot a “gun room” stock U.S. Army Colt .45 like no bodies business! I was taught to hold the .45 like you would a banana that no one was going to takeaway from you! I have tried the middle finger hold with the other two just along for the ride…less hand and forearm (mine) is what I found. That and if you have some bad hand/finger habits it eliminates them. I think the lowered fatigue showed up on my scores toward the end of the full course of fire…when it counts most!
shootski
Shootski
Thanks for recalling that. I had no idea where I picked up on that info.
From what I remember range training with the 45 in the Navy was mostly about safety and handling of the pistol as well as recovering your target during rapid firing. I found that most interesting. Developing a sort of rhythm.
A “trifle?” 😉
Glad to see you’re going to get a more representative firearm for the evaluation. Anxious to hear what your future plans entail.
Hi BB,
The CZ75 really feels good in my hands but I have never had the opportunity to fire one. Do I remember right that it can be carried cocked and locked? I don’t like double action/single action automatics.
You mentioned the shortage of action targets for BB guns. I doubt anyone is going to make one due to the chance that they will be used with steel BBs instead of Dust Devils. I expect that it will be difficult to build a target durable enough for steel BBs that will not recoil BBs back towards the shooter. Aluminum cans are probably the best bet.
David Enoch
David,
There is a rubber compound that might work for BB action targets. Have you seen it? They make large targets that high-powered handguns can roll around and they can absorb many hundreds of shots.
B.B.
B.B.,
This is a very interesting report. Although I have handled only one CZ handgun, the CZ75B, I found it pleasing to hold and pleasing to shoot. I am not sure how useful it really is, but the accessory rail may be either useful or just fun to play with.the railed optic mount. Aside from that, I can’t say it has the grace of the classic CZ75.
/product/cz-75-co2-bb-pistol?m=3480
that I would prefer if not attaching anything. But suspect the two are comparable in the co2 versions (they also sell for the same price).
I am wondering if these ASG co2 pistols share the same or similar bb loading system as the GSG 92 you reviewed back in 2011.
/blog/2011/07/gsg-92-co2-bb-pistol-part-2/
The Colt Commander sold by Umarex directly and via PA.
/product/colt-commander-co2-pistol?m=3397
has the same kind of loading system. I like it.
~ken
BB,
Those plastic self healing firearm targets even bounce pellets unless they can swing freely.
B.B. , let me try this again. I got cut off last time. I have some self healing targets for rim fires and center fires. BBs and pellets bounce off these targets. The only luck I had was hanging a 2” circle from two pieces of string that let the target swing backwards when hit. One of the manufacturers of these targets made some self healing plastic targets for pellets out of 1/16” thick plastic. I don’t know if they are still on the market and don’t know how they would react to BBs.
David Enoch
David,
Perhaps the system that inflates used water bottles with the really thin plastic bottles might work; but not for repeated hits…. I recall the European carnival shooting ranges that had small candles to shoot out the flames. One final idea and that is be cheap homemade candyglass that you can make. Just collect the sugar shards and melt down and recast! No idea if any of that would work for you…but you know about what free advice is usually worth!!!
shootski