The benefits of oiling pellets: Part 2

by Tom Gaylord, a.k.a. B.B. Pelletier

Part 1

Let’s begin testing the effects of oiling pellets. There are numerous ways to approach this issue, and I have to pick one at a time and limit the test to just that. But I think as long as I’m testing one aspect, I ought to test it thoroughly so someone can’t come back and second-guess me later in the report.

So, today I’ll test with one rifle, and the next time I’ll test with another. What I won’t do is test with each different brand of airgun, just to see what will happen. If a powerful gas spring rifle performs in a certain way, I’ll assume that all powerful gas spring rifles are going to do the same. If the difference between dry pellets and oiled pellets is close, I may do additional testing; but if there’s clear separation, I’ll accept that as the way it works.

What am I testing?
The question that started this experiment was, “How much faster will oiled pellets shoot than those that are not oiled?” One reader has asked me to also test this downrange because he wonders if a thin coat of oil changes the laminar flow of air around a pellet. I may get to that at some point, but for the present I’m just concerned with muzzle velocity because all pellets slow down after they exit the muzzle — oiled or not.

I suppose this needs to be tested in all three powerplant types, but today I’m testing it in a spring-piston powerplant. Today’s gun is a weak powerplant, so next time I’ll test it in a more powerful gun.

I’m using an HW55 SF target rifle to test three pellets. This rifle is a variation of the old HW50 rifle, so it shoots in the 600-650 f.p.s. region with lead pellets.

Since oiled pellets will leave a film in the bore, I tested all pellets dry first, and then tested the oiled pellets afterwards. Before the first test shot with oiled pellets, I fired two pellets to condition the bore. That turned out not to be enough, but I’ll come to that later.

Pellet shapes
I’ll test the three major pellet shapes in this test. They’re the wadcutter, dome and pointed head. There are other shapes, like hollowpoints, but they’re based on one of these three main shapes, so this is all I’m testing.

How I oil pellets
I oil pellets in the following manner. A foam liner is placed in the bottom of a pellet tin, and 20 drops of Whiscombe Honey are dropped onto the foam. Then, a single layer of pellets is spread on the foam, and the tin is rolled around. I shake the tin lightly to move the pellets around…but not enough to damage them. Whatever oil transfers to the pellet is all the oil it gets. I’ve been doing this for many years and it works well.

Oiling pellets
Twenty drops of oil on the foam is what I use. Then, a single layer of pellets.

Oiling pellets tins
One tin for each type of pellet used in the test.

The pellets end up with a very light and uniform coat of oil. When I handle them the tips of my fingers become oily, but I can’t see any oil on the pellets. Other people use more oil than I do, but this is what I am testing.

Whiscombe Honey is a mixture of two-thirds Hoppes Gun Oil (not Number 9 bore cleaner!) and one-third STP Engine Treatment, by volume. Shake the mixture until is takes on a light yellow color. It will look like thin honey, hence the name. This mixture should not detonate easily in a spring gun.

Test one — dry pellets

Crosman Premiers
Crosman Premier 7.9-grain pellets were the domes I tested. The average velocity for dry Premiers was 606 f.p.s., with a low of 577 and a high of 616. So, the spread was 39 f.p.s. The average muzzle energy was 6.44 foot-pounds.

Gamo Match
For wadcutters, I tested Gamo Match pellets. The average for dry pellets was 652 f.p.s., with a low of 640 and a high of 663 f.p.s. The spread was 17 f.p.s. The average energy was 7.14 foot-pounds.

H&N Neue Spitzkugel
The pointed pellet I selected was the H&N Neue Spitzgugel. When shot dry, they averaged 601 f.p.s., with a low of 585 and a high of 620 f.p.s. The spread was 34 f.p.s. The average muzzle energy was 6.81 foot-pounds at the muzzle.

Oiled pellets
Now, I shot two oiled pellets through the bore to condition it and began the test.

Oiled Crosman Premiers
Oiled 7.9-grain Premiers averaged 591 f.p.s., but the spread went from a low of 545 to a high of 612 f.p.s. That’s a spread of 67 .p.s. The average energy for oiled pellets was 6.13 foot-pounds. I did notice the pellets were going faster at the end of the shot string, so I thought I might come back to them after testing the other pellets.

Oiled Gamo Match pellets
The oiled wadcutters averaged 658 f.p.s. — a slight gain over the dry pellets. But the real news was the spread, which went from a low of 651 to a high of 663 f.p.s. Instead of a 17 f.p.s. for the dry pellets, the oiled pellets gave a spread of just 12 f.p.s. That’s too close to draw any conclusions, but it’s interesting. The average energy with the oiled pellets was 7.27 foot-pounds. So, with the oiled pellets, the velocity went up — along with the energy — and the shot-to-shot variance went down.

Oiled H&N Neue Spitzkugel
Oiled Spitzkugels averaged 609 f.p.s. — which was a small increase over the same pellet when dry. The average energy was 6.99 foot-pounds. The spread went from 585 to 620 f.p.s, which was identical for the same pellet dry. Velocity and energy were both up slightly from dry pellets, and the shot-to-shot variance¬†remained the same.

By now, it’s obvious that the bore needed more than two shots to condition it, so I retested the oiled Crosman Premiers. The second time the oiled pellets averaged 604 f.p.s., which is just 2 f.p.s. slower than the same pellets dry. But the spread that was 67 f.p.s. on the first test of oiled pellets and 39 f.p.s. with dry Premiers now went from a low of 594 to a high of 613 f.p.s. — a much tighter 19 f.p.s. total. The average energy was 6.40 foot-pounds.

Observations
From this test, I observed that these three pellets either remained at the same velocity or increased very slightly from the light oiling I gave them. In two of the three cases, the velocity spread got tighter when the pellets were oiled.

I further observed that it’s necessary to condition a bore with oiled pellets before doing any testing. As a minimum, I would say that 20 oiled pellets should be fired before testing.

These are very small differences from oiling; and although I can’t draw any conclusions yet, I would think that such a small change is not enough to matter. It hardly seems worth doing at this point. However, there’s still a test to be done in a powerful airgun. Until we see those results, I think it’s too soon to say anything for sure.

Although the question that drove this test was how much faster oiling pellets makes them shoot, I think we still have to take accuracy into account before forming any opinions.

And now for something completely different
Pyramyd Air is looking for a manager for their tech department. If you’re interested in the position, below is the job info and where to send your resume.

Directs and coordinates activities of the department in providing customers technical services and support; directly supervises employees. Responsibilities include but are not limited to:

Coordinates technical support services between management, tech support staff, sales department, and customers.

Establishes and documents department procedures and objectives.

Accomplishes department objectives by selecting, orienting, training, assigning, coaching, counseling, and disciplining employees; communicating job expectations; and monitoring performance.

Maintains and improves support operations by monitoring staff and system performance, identifying and resolving problems, and preparing and completing action plans

Provides technical assistance to customers and labor quotes. Handles escalated calls or provides assistance requiring more complex issues.

Installs common accessories and kits in accordance with customer orders.

Performs tests on guns to determine advertised performance specifications.

Required experience, skills and background:

Bachelor’s degree and 3 years managerial experience, or an equivalent combination of education and experience required. Previous industry experience required.

Must be detail-oriented with good mechanical aptitude.

Ability to prioritize and multi-task.

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Good computer skills.

Hours: Monday through Friday, 9am until 5:30pm; longer hours and some Saturdays are expected, especially during our busy peak periods.

Preferred experience, skills and background:

Previous experience in airgun repair or troubleshooting desired.

Send your resume to resumes@pyramydair.com

61 Responses to “The benefits of oiling pellets: Part 2”

  • kevin Says:

    Interesting that these, presumably, extensive lube tests are only focused on velocity.

    The reasons that lubes interested me and provoked personal testing was about accuracy.

    Users of some lubes claimed that at certain velocities the barrel didn’t lead as fast and accuracy was retained for a longer period. Other users of some lubes claimed that they helped seal pellet skirt imperfections insuring a better seal and tighter spreads that resulted in better accuracy (usually wax infused lubes). Still others claimed that using certain lubes for specified periods (because of graphite additives) helped break in an airgun barrel quicker and once that was accomplished you should cease using the lube.

    In all cases the airgunners were convinced and therefor tried to convince others that they had found the holy grail in accuracy and named it “the ultimate lube solution”.

    There were some truths in my accuracy testing with lubes. I have no experience in velocity testing with lubes so I should probably shut up now.

    kevin

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      Kevin,

      Accuracy testing is coming after velocity testing. Same gun, same pellets.

      I have to do this for springers, PCPs and CO2 guns, so just the basic test will take a long time.

      B.B.

      • kevin Says:

        Tom,

        Apologies. I should have gone back and re-read part 1 where you said that accuracy testing was also going to be a part of your lubed pellet tests.

        When you get to my age you may have trouble remembering things too.

        kevin

  • kevin Says:

    ps-The Manager of the Tech Department at PA is an interesting idea. I fit all the criteria but one. Never created a resume in my life so I’m out.

    kevin

    • Edith Gaylord Says:

      kevin,

      And would you even want to move to Ohio?

      Edith

      • twotalon Says:

        Edith…

        Lake effect snow anyone ?

        twotalon

      • kevin Says:

        Edith,

        Nope. I’ve spent too much time there and know better.

        kevin

      • J-F Says:

        There are a few openings at PA, I went to look at the houses near PA… geez I tought the housing in Texas was cheap… 25k for a house! It doesn’t buy you a trailer here! Given it’s not a great house and it might not be a great neighborhood (I have no idea what Cleveland is like in term of neighborhoods).

        But If I could/would move it would be to somewhere warm.

        J-F

  • Lee Says:

    I agree with Kevin here. If I were to oil the pellet my primary concern would be accuracy downrange, and indirectly, accuracy due to cleaner barrel.

    From this test only, it seems that tighter velocity spread should contribute to accuracy at least for low power springer.

  • goatboy Says:

    Interesting results to start with and very useful for me,but when you get around to testing a high power air rifle i assume you mean something producing 20FPE+.This will be useful to know the results but not practical for UK readers, unless they hold a FAC. Personally i would like to see a test on a rifle producing around 12 ft/lb and hope you will get around to doing this one.

    Not owning a chrono i find your tests very helpful and i hope you keep them up, thanks for a splendid article and look forward to further entries. I bet you keep the best till last with the accuracy results.

    TTFN

    Best Wishes, Wing Commander Sir Nigel Tetlington-Smythe.

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      Sir Nigel,

      That adds a third gun to the test.

      I will do it, but can we confine that to just springers? This test is huge, because I also have to do it for COs2 and PCPs.

      B.B.

      • goatboy Says:

        Thank you B.B. That would be splendid if you could add 12 ft/lb springer’s to your already extremely comprehensive list of rifles you are planning to test. Hope You and Edith have a lovely day as you have cheered up my day no end, i wait with bated breath for your report. :)

        Best Wishes, Wing Commander Sir Nigel Tetlington-Smythe

    • kenholmz Says:

      Suspecting I am not the only one who has been a bit curious about you, I post this link:
      http://angryangryguncompany.blogspot.com/2013_01_01_archive.html

      Have a good one. ~Ken

      • goatboy Says:

        A good day to you Ken. Guilty as charged, that would be my blog which i only hope will get better with time. But all thanks must go to my lovely wife Amy who designed it, edits it, and came up with the title, bless her cotton socks.

        Best Wishes, Wing Commander Sir Nigel Tetlington-Smythe

  • /Dave Says:

    I lubed pellets with 3 in 1 oil for a while and never really noticed a big enough difference to keep doing it after a couple thousand shots. I wasn’t really “testing” the lube vs unlubed though, so this report is interesting to me. Maybe something out there is better than 3 in 1 and makes a bigger difference. Like Kevin, I’d be much more interested if the lube improved the accuracy!

    Does the managerial job include a whip and shackles? Or would I have to supply my own?

    /Dave

    • Edith Gaylord Says:

      /Dave,

      Sorry…no whip and shackles provided :-)

      Edith

      • Matt61 Says:

        Well, if you want a whip and shackles, Ohio might be the place.

        http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/02/22/tenant-in-arrears-gets-whipped-on-rear-by-belt-wielding-landlord-police/

        Notice the bit about the “little marks.” The things a police officer must do. I just had to renew my lease with a new landlord. She’s very business-like with an enormous new lease that ran for many pages and covered everything under the sun. I walked into her office with her immaculately dressed self as cool as could be and presented my signed lease. Then at the right moment when she judged things in order, I said that I had an addendum to the late fee policy that I wanted her to consider, and I handed over the folded article. She bit as hard as could be and opened and started reading aloud… Heh heh. But I admit that she recovered well and said that she might even waive the late fee to avoid this scenario.

        Matt61

        • Robert From Arcade Says:

          Matt, I’m a landlord and have a few units, and I can tell you from experience that there have been a few tenants that I would have liked to beat to a pulp. Landlording is a tough business for tough people. God bless him. Wish I could be on the jury who hears that case. Not paying your rent is irresponsible, and a theft of services.

  • twotalon Says:

    B.B.

    I see that you have so far avoided fooling yourself by seeing the need to shoot enough that the bore becomes stable. If you plan on an accuracy test too I hope that you have already done it, but are holding out on us. Otherwise you would have to do a lot of barrel cleaning and reconditioning.

    twotalon

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      TT,

      I am right where all of you are, at this moment. Yes, there will be a lot of barrel cleaning ahead!

      B.B.

      • twotalon Says:

        B.B.

        I have used Gun Scrubber a few times (followed by clean dry cotton patches). I went to extremes one time on one rifle that I put some REALLY wrong stuff if the barrel.

        twotalon

        • B.B. Pelletier Says:

          TT,

          I have the synthetic-safe Gun Scrubber and it works so well that I always keep a can on hand, so I will use it.

          Thanks for reminding me.

          B.B.

  • Yiannis From Greece Says:

    Dear B.B.

    What i’m always afraid of when hearing about lubricating pellets is that, tiny amounts of the lubricant will remain inside game’s body if they’re used for hunting. Apart from microscopic fragments of lead and grease (used for tuning the airgun), isn’t it too much to add some more chemical to what we’re supposed to eat afterwards? No matter how well we wash the game, you know that’s impossible to remove every little part of the materials i mentioned above. When going for head shots there’s no obvious reason of worrying because we’re gonna cut the head off after skinning and dispose it but, when we use body shots to get our target shot down, the danger exists.

    Thank you in advance for spending some time to read my comment, congratulations for remaining an enthusiast and a pure lover of airgunning instead of becoming a cruel professional and last but not least all my best wishes to you and your family. Be strong and stay away of health troubles, with a little bit of luck and some care, i hope you hit the “100″ mark still shooting for “bullseye”. ;)

    P.S: If i lived closer to you i might apply for the job as i’m a qualified aircraft/flight engineer with more than 20 years experience in tuning airguns (as a very serious hobby) and more than 15 years of working as a manager. I’m also a friend of Steve Pope of V-Mach and i’ve had numerous hours of talking with him about tuning and testing airguns. But i like Greece a lot despite the so-called “monetary crisis” and i’m not willing to abort it…:)

    Your sincerely
    Yiannis (John in English)

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      Yiannis,

      Welcome to the blog and thank you for your comments.

      I remember eating goose and encountering lead shot that was used to down the bird. That’s pretty common when eating game taken in the field.

      We used to spit out the shot on our plates when we would encounter one. Not very polite, but sort of funny at the same time.

      B.B.

      • kevin Says:

        Always soak your game in salt water before cooking. The lead pellets will rise to the surface and can be easily plucked from just underneath the skin before cooking.

        kevin

      • Matt61 Says:

        Yikes, I hate bones. This is not for me. Surely some of the lead shot will slip past and go down the hatch. Wouldn’t that pose a danger of lead poisoning?

        Matt61

        • B.B. Pelletier Says:

          Matt,

          That’s not the kind of lead that is harmful, though you shouldn’t ingest it intentionally. Lead oxide is a far more dangerous culprit.

          B.B.

      • Yiannis From Greece Says:

        Dear BB,

        Thank you sir, it’s always been a pleasure reading your articles. Back to our point, i’ve spitted lead shot myself while consuming wood pigeons, grouse, geese and rabbits that i’ve hunted through the years and i know that’s practically unavoidable to not “chew the lead” if you’re likely to consider yourself a real hunter…:-) It’s just that i’d like to avoid lubricating the pellets cause the vast majority of little birds i take down with airguns (like sparrows, starlings, magpies and crows) go straight to feeding my cats. Unfortunately, our little friends don’t have the ability to spit whatever intoxicates them. As i said before i usually have no trouble with bigger birds or rabbits (the kind of game i consume) cause i go for headshots that leave no hazardous materials in the game’s body.

        Apart from asking if lubricating pellets could be hazardous for our health, i’d like to hereby mention my own experience of extensively testing pellet lubrication about 2 1/2 years ago. The guns i used for the tests were what i’m still using for all my airgun shooting:

        a) HW80 Lazaglide in 22 cal, thoroughly polished chamber, custom made 30 coils V-Mach spring, honed transfer port opened up to 3.8mm, shooting 860fps with FTT.
        b) HW77 Lazaglide in 177 cal, custom made 31 coils V-Mach spring, honed transfer port opened up to 3.5mm, shooting 965fps with CP Lites.
        c) HW45 Self Tuned in 22 cal, custom made spring, 1.5mm increased piston stroke, shooting 430fps with H&N FTT and finally
        d) BSA Supersport in 177 cal, self tuned with modified breech bolt and shims of HW80 used, thoroughly polished chamber, honed transfer port opened up to 3.3mm, V-Mach spring / spring guide / piston seal, HW80 breech seal and polished trigger with modified metallic trigger blade of BSA Goldstar used, shooting 940fps with CP Lites.

        The pellets i used was CP Lites Domed for .177 testing, CP Domed and H&N FTT for .22 testing. All barrels were cleaned and fired before testing in order to be as “pure” as possible. All pellets were washed, dried and then carefully selected by weight and lubricated with WD40, Rem Oil, Pellgun Oil and ABRO Silicone Spray. Elevation was 0m because i did all my testing in my summer cottage house’s backyard which starts exactly where the beach ends.
        What i observed in general (i have full records but i prefer not to refer to them extensively because, it’s probably going to be exhausting for you to read, unless otherwise advised) was that, after an initial raise of a constant 5-10% in velocity, probably due to very slight detonation in the back of the pellets, all results dropped by 5-10% in comparison to the “pre-lube” chart of velocities i had thoroughly recorded!!! I think that this was the immediate effect of the bore being progressively over-lubed shot after shot and friction decreasing. As an engineer i believe that a little bit of excessive friction is essential for keeping the pellet hot and in-contact with barrel walls and rifling in order to achieve maximum velocity and consistency.

        That’s what my conclusion is dear BB and all friends here in the blog. I’m kindly asking for your comments.

        Yours sincerely
        Yiannis

        • B.B. Pelletier Says:

          Yiannis,

          So far my few results agree with you, except for the tightening of the velocity spreads. But there is so much more testing to be done that it’s too early for me to draw any conclusions.

          Hang in there and we will get through this.

          B.B.

          • Yiannis From Greece Says:

            Dear BB,

            Glad to hear that our results tend to agree. My own explanation about spread tightening is that, “bigger diameter” barrels with deep and wide rifle grooves are much more critical to formatting a pellet skirt when shot through them leading to bigger velocity spread when dry. They are also much more prone to accumulating quantities of lubricant in those grooves, therefore creating a “slippery sheet” between the pellet body and the barrel wall which lead pellet to act as if running through a smoothbore when lubricated, thus reducing velocity spread phenomenon and, slightly, velocity itself. On the other hand, “smaller diameter” barrels with shallow and narrow grooves, are not that much affected by lubricating the pellets because they don’t “contribute” to pellet skirt formatting as much as the first type of groove mentioned and they also don’t have the ability to hold significant quantities of lubricant inside them. The problem with this explanation is that, things can work exactly the opposite way!!! So, what i’d like to propose you is, go on testing pellet lubrication using one 22 cal gun with wide deep rifle grooves and one 177 cal gun with shallow narrow grooves. Thanks again!

            Your sincerely
            Yiannis

            • B.B. Pelletier Says:

              Yiannis,

              Great idea, but I don’t have any pellet rifles with wide deep grooves. They all have narrow lands and grooves and they are very shallow. That’s in all calibers.

              B.B.

    • Victor Says:

      Yiannis,

      You bring up a good point here! I wonder if there are purely organic solutions for lubing pellets. Welcome to the blog!

      Victor

      • Wacky Wayne Says:

        Victor,

        I’ve used coconut oil to lube pellets… and actually it will clean the lead dust off the pellets as well. I did a test like BB is doing… testing dry pellets (JSBs) first for both tightness of spread, and accuracy. I saw a tighter spread in all cases by about 10% as I recall. I was shooting a PCP at 12fpe at the time.

        I tested weighed lubed JSB 7.9 for accuracy indoors at 19 yards, and I didn’t see any consistent change in accuracy. I shot the dry pellets first of course… I was shooting bench rest targets and one card might have a score a couple points higher, but the next card might be a couple points lower… scores would range from 245 to 249 out of 250 possible.. of course the goal is to find the pellet/barrel combo that produces 250′s consistently:-)

        I did see longer periods between the need to clean the barrel and a lot less lead build up when I did clean.

        The good thing about the coconut oil is that it won’t detonate… it has a very high flash point… and it is totally natural and actually very good for you to eat. I use it on my toast and anywhere you would use butter. It’s very good to cook with. It does turn solid at temps below 70 degrees, so warm it first if you are in a cooler location. The warmer and more liquid it is the better when using it to clean and lube your pellets. I was very generous in the amount used and sometimes would put them in a larger tin with dry foam liners on each side to dry them off a little.

        But I’ve also used them when they were so coated on a cool morning that they were had a solid heavy coat and the skirt was totally full of coconut oil and they shot just as well.. so go figure:-)

        I have since met some folks who shoot bench rest and lots of 250 scores with their group of seven FWB P70s. They have convinced me that no lube at all, is the best thing for accuracy… they say lubing helps sometimes, but doesn’t work well on a consistent basis… and they tried all of the “special lubes” they could find out about, testing them indoors over the winter at their indoor 25 yard range… That was done using seven different air guns, albeit all the same make and model….
        sort of what I found as well.

        Wacky Wayne,
        Match Director,
        Ashland Air Rifle Range

      • me Says:

        Coconut oil and non roasted sesame oil are the most stable common natural oils. How about testing mineral/baby oils?

      • Yiannis From Greece Says:

        Thanks Victor, nice to meet you too.

        Speaking of “purely organic solutions” for lubricating pellets, brings a certain incident of my “wild, mad-scientist youth” on my mind. Once upon a time, about twenty five years ago, spending summertime holiday in the cottage, i used very light olive oil and refined corn oil to lube pellets. What happened? Well, after a couple of dozen shots the inside of the barrel of the airgun i was using for “experimenting” back then (Diana 38 in 177 cal), became something that later reminded me of the grilling device they use in McDonalds to prepare the bacon in: a tar-like covered metallic thing, tacky and greasy, which smell like a burned frying pan!!! Needless to say that the gun roared like a howitzer each time i pulled the trigger and smoked probably like Davy Crockett’s black powder musket or a poorly tuned NASCAR vehicle nowadays…:)

        Best wishes
        Yiannis

    • cowboystar dad Says:

      Yiannis, considering what mankind has put into the environment over the last 150 years (both air and ground), that wild animal eat, I don’t think the miniscule amount of oil on a pellet (much of what will likely shed during it’s flight to the animal) will harm you.

    • billythekid Says:

      use BALLISTOL for everything look up on internet

  • twotalon Says:

    Edith…

    I picked up a couple tins of H&N FTT 4.51 a little while back that had the wrong lids on the tins. The lids indicated that they were .22 cal. while they were really .177. These had the screw on lids.
    Anyone else see this ???

    twotalon

    • Edith Gaylord Says:

      TT,

      I’ve sent your comment to Pyramyd Air, and I expect a reply today.

      Edith

    • Edith Gaylord Says:

      TT,

      Someone at Pyramyd Air has checked all the remaining stock of the .177-cal. H&N FTT 4.51mm pellets, and all tin lids say .177. None say .22. Obviously, some gremlins were at work at the factory!

      Edith

      • twotalon Says:

        Edith…

        Someone must have thrown a few of the wrong lids in the machine by accident. It did not matter to me, as the label on the bottom was correct and it was what I wanted. I just made up some 4.51 labels and stuck them on the lids.
        I do like the new screw on lids by the way.

        twotalon

  • john Says:

    Definitely too soon to tell if oiling has any effects on the pellets. I’m really hoping the pcp gun used for that power plant is a condor, but I’ll wait and see. I don’t normally fire anything low powered since as I have said many times I hunt with my guns. Target shooting is simply practice when i get bored because there’s nothing out there to hunt. So my guns must be both hunters and target guns capable of nailing a medium to long range target. I’ll be waiting for those tests.

    Changing the subject a bit. I’ve grumbled about the horrid trigger on the Crosman TR77NP which is a good gun with a lousy trigger. It could be a great gun if it just had a nice smooth crisp trigger. Today it got a GRT3 trigger. Now I have a great gun with no real issues to grumble about. My first few shots were showing me a hair trigger, but a few adjustments and it will drop a fly at 10 yards now. Might take a very large bug at 35 yards if the planets are in alignment. I still need to upgrade the optics, but they are satisfactory for now. I gotta focus on the AK47′s currently waiting to be finished so no money or time to work on it’s optics.

  • Matt61 Says:

    Oiling the cucs again, eh? The blog anticipated my question about dieseling, so I guess it is all in the concoction that you use. By the way, I have had success in my pellet search for the Walther Nighthawk. I think that the H&N match pellets will work. The trigger pull is not so hard, and they certainly are accurate. They would have to be an expensive pellet.

    B.B., I believe you could eke a blog out of anything. As a matter of fact, I got the idea from a blog of yours about calibers that touched obliquely on this point or got me thinking in this direction. But there’s much more to be done. Another example was my recent information about how many ammunition makers consider the 7.62X54R as more accurate than the .308 NATO. There’s a cluster of near identical 30 calibers and there seems to be an optimum lurking in there.

    While surfing around, I came across a new method of concealed carry for women called the flash bang. The gun is held inside the bra and then whipped out. Concealment is good but access is tough. Anyway, this would be the perfect response to the leering Clint Eastwood in Line of Fire when he asks his FBI colleague in a cocktail dress where she was concealing her firearm.

    Matt61

    • Mike Says:

      The 7.62X54R more accurate than the .308 Win. Perhaps. But, have seen bench rest guns in .308 shoot groups of almost one hole at 100 yds. So, the difference can’t be much. That was in the 80′s. The guns, bullets, and powders are better today.

      Mike

  • Victor Says:

    B.B.,

    There are pellets that seem to work great in some rifles, but not in others. I’m referring to pellets that are of reasonable quality, and can perform well. Assuming that a pellet shoots well in some rifles, and are of reasonable quality, I wonder if that pellet would shoot better in the rifle where it seemed less accurate? In other words, I wonder if lubing is a cure in some instances? I’m wondering if this would always work. What I am wondering is if this is something that should be considered when you know that a pellet is a good performer in other rifles.

    Victor

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      Victor,

      Lubing or oiling pellets was never supposed to improve accuracy. It was supposed to reduce leading of the bore. Indirectly that will maintain accuracy, but not improve it.

      You seem to be asking if oiling pellets changes their performance in guns. I don’t know. It’s something I have never looked at. But I guess we will see in this test.

      B.B.

      • Anonymous Says:

        B.B.,

        Lubing or oiling pellets was never suppose to improve accuracy, really? I thought there were cases where it did. I guess an even more important question is, will this hurt accuracy (or when will this hurt accuracy)? Obviously it would depend on the particulars.

        Victor

  • Vince Says:

    How about the other way around? Squirting a moly or graphite spray into a barrel, then shooting a few pellets to burnish it into the metal and remove the excess? I’m wondering if that would reliably deposit the lubricant down the length of the bore and give more consistent results.

  • Jamie Benjamin Says:

    I think that it’s a good idea to season the bore first . That is why I like to use t/c borebutter for black power guns on all my guns . Yes most people ask me why ? So in turn I will explain that all metal has open pours that need to be closed and if the bore is seasoned it will be easier to clean after shooting .I have a Cross man rt 77 that is rated to shoot at 1200 f p s and all my shots are very close to 1400 to 1390 f p s with h&n pellets with the point and placket skirt . I am very happy with both air guns and will probley hunt with my daughter next year

  • robert w Says:

    i have been using whiscombs honey for a long while and i wash my pellets first in dawn then let they dry. i use a felt in a pellet tin on both sides like you did. some of my guns shot more accurate but they all seemed to just shoot a little better . when i wash them its suprising how much junk is in the wash water . i use a strainer and a big pot full of hot water and a generous amount of dawn tumbleing them then a clod water rinse. if im in a hurry i use wifes hair dryier and dry before lubein them up. im goin to have to keep abreast of your studys to see just how they all respond. very interesting article b.b.

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      robert w,

      Your approach is the standard I have seen. Most shooters who oil their pellets wash them in Dawn first. I don’t, but that is unusual.

      Thanks for your input.

      B.B.

      • Wulfraed Says:

        Lovely… Dawn brags about being used to remove oil from critters encountering spills…

        So: wash the pellets in a degreaser to remove any oils on them (along with any preservative coatings)… and then add oil back to the pellets.

  • twotalon Says:

    B.B.

    Back when I tried washing pellets, one of the things I did was to use a little sonic jewelry cleaner filled with alcohol (Crosmans are DIRTY). Note that I said “sonic” and not “ultrasonic”. It just sat there and vibrated. Got some of the flakes off, but not nearly all of them. Should have spent the money on an ultrasonic……or forgot the whole thing.

    twotalon

  • robert w Says:

    well i use my tumbler i use to clean brass sometimes . as for washing crosman pellets are extremely dirty and makes me wonder if that is why a lot of guns shoot a lot of fliers? i notice i dont get a lot of fliers when i wash n lube my pellets . b.b. you need to just try washing some crosman premier pellets just to see how much residue is in the pellets . it will suprize you. i washed some rws domes and didnt see much left behind . but then i might have gotten a cleaner tin of rws .

    • B.B. Pelletier Says:

      robert w,

      I have heard others comment on how dirty the Premiers can be.

      Thanks for the advice. I’ll look into it.

      B.B.

  • billythekid Says:

    clean too much & pellets get smaller. BALLISTOL cleans & lubs add a little to rinse water

  • robert w Says:

    b.b. 1 thing i failed to tell you about oiled pellets . when im done shooting oiled pellets i always take a jag and run 3-4 dry patches down the barrel, as i store my guns muzzle up. i didnt do that to a diana 34 and it set for 2 months . i got it out and shot it . it dieseled for several shots too. but when your testing notice how the patches come out looking. when i look at them they dont have that dark grey color to them so it has to be easier on the barrel as its not picking up lead and particles from the pellets when shot . might be something to look at while your on the lubed pellet testing . but your on a fine subject tom

  • kou Says:

    You guys may simply try pure silicone spray with no solvent, slightly and evenly coating on pellets, no sticky feel and helping decreasing fricition in the barrel, which is great for low powered air guns under 400 fps.

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