Air Venturi Seneca Aspen .25-caliber precharged pneumatic air rifle: Part 1

by Tom Gaylord
Writing as B.B. Pelletier

Part 1
Part 2
Part 3
Part 4
Part 5

Seneca Aspen PCP
The Air Venturi Seneca Aspen precharged pneumatic air rifle.

This report covers:

  • Pay attention!
  • The .25 is different
  • The real reason to buy an Aspen!
  • A brand new gun
  • The manual
  • Physical differences between the rifles
  • Things that come with the rifle
  • Power
  • Description
  • Summary

Pay attention!

Read this paragraph, because I don’t want to have this discussion a hundred more times. The Air Venturi Seneca Aspen PCP with a built-in pump is a complex airgun. The complexity isn’t in the design or in the build — it’s in how the rifle operates. So I have provided the links to the first 5 reports on the .22-caliber rifle I already tested last year, for those who want to go back and see how I tested it. After today’s report I will only link to the test of this rifle.

The Aspen is a PCP that also has a built-in pump, so it can also operate like a multi-pump pneumatic. In my opinion, at least to this point in the testing, it makes more sense to operate the gun as a multi-pump, because you can then regulate the pressure in the reservoir. That gives you precise control over the velocity, where just filling it like a PCP will only give a handful of shots. All this is speculation, because I have not yet done the testing, but after seeing the pressure curves in Parts 2 and 3 of the test of the other rifle (in the links provided above) I am almost certain that I’m right.

The .25 is different

In talking to Tyler Patner at SHOT, I learned that the .25 Aspen performs differently than the .22, in that it comes on its power curve when closer to 3,000 psi is in the reservoir. We learned while testing the .22 that it likes 2,200 psi on low power and 2,000 psi for high power. And I told you that because this gun has a built-in pump, you become the regulator. If you keep it at the optimum pressure the accuracy will be superb — at least out to 25 yards.

That means I really need to go through all the Part 2 pressure over velocity testing again. If I didn’t own a chronograph I would only be able to read a test like this one that somebody else did and watch my onboard pressure gauge as I shot.

The real reason to buy an Aspen!

But yesterday, a reader named Mike Ogden gave me some surprising wisdom. This is a quote from his longer comment.

“I am going for the Aspen and i am not so much a nube that i don’t clearly see a scuba tank and a compressor and an FX impact or some such.”

Do you remember in Superman when Lex Luthor said that some people could read the ingredients on a chewing gum wrapper and unlock the secrets of the universe? I think Mike just did! What I got from his comment was a fellow can buy an Aspen and have a working precharged pneumatic airgun that he can shoot immediately without buying all the support stuff like tanks and compressors. In other words, the Aspen may be an ideal way to get into PCPs.

A brand new gun

The Aspen I will be testing for you here is brand new. The .22 I tested was one that was being passed around the shop at Pyramyd Air for their testing. So I am going to see some things with this one that I haven’t seen with the other one. The first thing is the scope that comes bundled with the gun. It’s a 4X32 scope with AO. I mounted a UTG Bug Buster 3-12X32 scope on the .22. I can now comment on the scope that comes with the rifle a little better because I  have one to examine.

The manual

The second thing about a new gun is it comes with a manual. For the other rifle I always had to look online at the Pyramyd Air library of manuals. All the information is there, but I find that a paper manual I can hold is more conducive to how I like to operate. I only consult the online manual to find the answer to a specific question, where I can read the entire paper manual at my own pace.

In reading the manual I have learned how and where to lubricate the Aspen, plus how to adjust the trigger. I had looked online for the trigger adjustment on the first Aspen, but it’s always easier (for me) to have the manual laying open when I do the job.

Physical differences between the rifles

Other than the difference in the diameter of the bore, there are no real obvious physical differences between all three calibers of the Aspen. It is offered in .177 and .22 right now, but .25 caliber is scheduled to become available in June. Other than the caliber, there isn’t any practical difference between the rifles in all three calibers.

Things that come with the rifle

Besides the rifle, manual and scope you get a fill probe, whose tail end (that sticks out of the gun) is a male Foster fitting. So, filling from an conventional air tank is straightforward.

They also included a small bottle of silicone oil for lubrication. I lubed the test rifle right off because it was bone dry as it came from the box.

One 8-round circular magazine was included, and the rifle had an aluminum single shot tray installed when it came out of the box. Both the .177 and .22 versions have 10-round magazines. And I never had the single shot tray to test.

The final item in the box is an Allen wrench to adjust both the trigger and the striker spring tension. The manual tells you that after about 3,000 shots it may be necessary to adjust the striker spring to maintain power. I know there will be some people who will want to crank the rifle up as far as it will go right away, but that’s not my plan. I am looking for the best accuracy with decent power.

The first rifle I tested didn’t seem to have a trigger return spring (or it was very weak) but this one does, so I may adjust the trigger. As it came from the box it is definitely two-stage.

Power

The .177 is listed to deliver 800 f.p.s. on low power and 1,000 f.p.s. on high. The .22 lists 700 and 900 f.p.s. In my testing we saw a low velocity of 774 f.p.s. and a high of 946 f.p.s. with .22 caliber RWS Hobby pellets. Does that mean this .25 will also be faster than its rating? There is no rating for .25 caliber up yet, so I don’t know what we are expecting, and, since there is also no .25-caliber Hobby pellet, I need to test everything thoroughly — just so we’ll all know.

Description

I put this at the end of the report because we have already gone through it with the .22. The .25-caliber Aspen is a PCP repeater with a built-in pump. It features a hollow synthetic Monte Carlo stock and a synthetic pump handle. The rifle weighs 8 lbs., even. It is 43.3-inches long and has a 21.5-inch barrel.

The pull is 14.25-inches. The black rubber buttpad is soft and grippy. The stock also comes with sling swivel studs.

The rifle is a bolt action and the bolt is operated by a sidelever. I found that very easy and convenient when I tested the .22.

The shroud is not baffled. The barrel seems to pass through a bushing, so it is not free-floating. The rifle has a two-stage adjustable trigger. There are no sights, so some kind of optics are required, and a scope and mounts come bundled with the rifle.

Summary

The Seneca .25 is already of interest to several readers. I plan to test it just as thoroughly as I tested the .22, whose tests are not yet completed. But I think if this proves to be as accurate as the .22 the only choice you have to make is the caliber. I say that because the Seneca stacks up to be a best buy. And it may also be a perfect entry into the world of PCPs.

57 thoughts on “Air Venturi Seneca Aspen .25-caliber precharged pneumatic air rifle: Part 1

  1. I got an Umarex Gauntlet last month because it just showed up in .25. The Seneca Aspen was what I wanted until I saw it was coming out in .25. So I got the Gauntlet and was waiting for the Aspen to come out in .25.

    My Gauntlet is working out better than the one you tested, so I’m happy as heck. But now that the Aspen/Nova is coming I’ll watch this review closely.


  2. B.B.,

    In your original post you said this is not actually a price point pcp, I would submit that in fact it is. Given that it needs no external air support and that it comes with a scope it is in fact cheaper than the other PPP’s that need to have a scope and air source added to make them shooter ready.

    This does look like a great deal, your testing of the .22 gave us a good idea of the accuracy of this rifle and I would think the .25 should be about the same.

    Mike



    • Yogi,

      I suspect that the Aspen will take some effort to bring it up to working pressure but (I’m guessing) that it will only take a few pumps per shot to keep it there.

      Hank


  3. Well, alot has happened in my life over the last three years! What hasn’t happened was that I have not stop reading the blog! Just no log in! Now with Seneca 25 cal., well I guess I’m back in the market for that all around rifle! Semper Fi!


  4. B.B.,

    Looking forwards to this new round of reports. Most interesting (before) was that the rifle did best when kept topped at lower fill points than the 3000 point..

    Good Day to you and to all,……. Chris


  5. BB

    I will be following your tests of both this rifle and remaining reports on the .22 Aspen. By the time Santa loads his sleigh we should know much more about how well these rifles stand up over time. I am especially interested in how durable is the multi pump. Can it take the wear from pumping required to reach optimum fill pressures? Hope to hear from readers who have shot lots of pellets through their Air Venturi Seneca Aspen.

    Deck


  6. Ok was that a comparison, well i will take it as contrast & comparison and leave it at that. I may have also in the past maligned the practicality of a hand pump, but i can envision that being an acceptable option for a marauder pistol or some similar capacity pistol or even a discovery or a fortitude and yes 3000psi but its regulated more useful shots and all that. For me its a matter of time and effort vs the return and i have options so time.

    So like everyone i have my preferences i like spring piston air rifles, but i don’t care so much for any distinction and arguing the finer points is kind of a pointless. All that matters for me is do i enjoy it. I have owned and used Co2 and multi-pump that i liked. So the Aspen is a multi-pump PCP to my mind it is the logical progression of a multi-pump. Only one thing can get in my way when shooting.

    I don’t know how other people feel when shooting, but i suspect one of my quirks is not normal and to explain i am dyslexic, but grew out of the worst of my problems by the age 16 and dont know maybe other issues to one degree or another. So here is my attempt explaining when i shoot i do as i was taught and i get focused me and the target gun leveland calm slow heart rate & breathing even hand pressure and between or holding breath exhaled even trigger pressure and from that point i get a mental picture that is kind of an expanding flat plane and any rough feeling or creep disrupts it and describing the feeling as annoying is not sufficient and the best way i have for an explanation is the feeling an old Gamo stock trigger with never ending creep and pull and grit is almost but not precisely painful its worse as i could block out actual physical pain. The very short and match type pull never is anything more than a short clip. The first time my dad handed me his Gamo shadow i think i shot it twice before i handed it back and did not shoot it again until i had the GRT installed and it was the same but i couldn’t stand shooting it. Fast reaction tracking and leading a moving target i don’t recall it ever being an issue.

    My point if i had one is when you catch me complaining about a trigger you might want to consider the source, but i have no real clue how common or uncommon this kind of thing is. Until a couple of years ago i had no idea about 4,3 and 2 cone color detection and i guess for good reason first of all not that much actual science done on tetrachromat study, because that’s what humanity needs another way to separate us from them.


    • Mike,

      I am dyslexic as well and it was years before I realized that I see things “differently” than non-dyslexic people do. While I have to be very careful with numbers and decimal points I have found that my “different” view of a problem has often helped me find solutions during my career as a designer.

      I can relate to what you FEEL when you shoot and it is difficult to describe. In talking with Chris USA he coined the phrase “the Zen of shooting” – think he summed it up pretty well.

      Know what you mean, something as simple as a rough trigger can be totally distracting and spoil the flow of taking the shot.

      Its not easy to explain my MER (Maximum Effective Range) shooting style but I am putting together some notes and will ask B.B. if I should write a guest blog on the subject.

      Cheers,
      Hank


  7. B.B.

    Thinking about Joe from yesterday’s blog, I’m in that boat too. I will keep using my airgun, but the way to finding it is a long and winding road. I know that I’m not unique in the world of newbies. even after reading this blog for a few years and scoping out the archives. BTW, excellent job tagging blog entries to make them available to search. I still have the feeling that something is missing. That I still don’t know what I don’t know. I’m wondering if I should have bought a TX200 MkII on day one. Of course I didn’t know about it. 😀

    I think that your last line in the blog is an excellent summary of my search thesis, “My goal is to obtain things that work the way I want them to, and then use them that way. If I succeed in getting what I want, I don’t think about the money anymore.”

    The process of educating myself has cost far more than buying the TX200 in the first place. As well, I now have a number of less useful airguns for which I need to find new homes.

    I’m so pleased that you seem to be well now. May you live long and prosper.

    Dan



    • GrandpaDan,

      In my experience I have found that every gun is a good gun within the effective range of the hardware (gun, sights/optics, ammo) and the software (the shooter).

      The trick is to match the effective range to the requirements… For example, my iron sighted 350 fps Slavia is effective on sparrows to about 25 feet; my scoped 825 fps FWB 124 is good to about 25 yards, my scoped 950 fps HW100 is good to about 65 yards (10 shots in a 1″ kill zone) but the shooter (me) limits its effective range on sparrows to 45 yards.

      My point is that regardless of power, accuracy or cost, each weapon (fishing rod, camera, tool, etc.) which it performs adequately for the job required of it is a good one. As users, we need to choose the right one for the job we want to do or adjust our expectations accordingly staying within the maximum effective range of the hardware and software.

      I have a TX200 mk III, it’s a beautiful rifle in both aesthetics and performance. I love how stable it is to shoot. Most of my friends find it too heavy for their application – carrying around in the bush hunting. …Is it the “perfect” rifle for you and your application? You won’t know until you try it and find out for yourself.

      I found that I need several rifles to cover my needs – enjoy shooting them all.

      Best of luck finding your special rifle Dan!

      Cheers,
      GrandapaHank


      • Vana2,

        My fellow Grandpa, I agree with almost all of your points but want you to contemplate adding another element to your computing analogy: the physical shooter is actually firmware. The software is loaded into the shooting system’s: brain/nervous system by training, study, experience and reflection.
        I agree that given the hardware specification fulfills the requirements then the other two factors can only diminish the performance of the total system. The firmware needs to be healthy and as physically fit as possible; the amount of improvement possible has is within set Parameters. The software is the place that we have the greatest amount of control through original build: quality, debugging, patches and version upgrades. Of course someday we may find a way to erase and replace with an entirely new build!

        Any IV&V is appreciated

        shootski


        • Shootski,

          I have not quite figured out exactly “what/all” yet,…. but you have much to teach those that reside here. 😉

          I do admire your “health” approach to all matters. That is something that I should seriously reflect upon. Not bad mind you,…. but I do get the strong “sense” that things do NOT get better,…in general. 😉 Counter-measures to aging become more and more key.

          Good Day to you,….. Chris (stick around) 🙂


          • Chris USA,

            Cliche: In the end all we really have is our health.

            We certainly have more wonderful life reatures available to us beside health.
            But in my experience and in observing my peers our health certainly effects all of the other elements of our lives in major ways. Fitness seems to be the core of getting to be seventy and older and having the capacity to face with grace the many issues that affect our cohort.
            Simply walking to include: parking out, using stairs down and up frequently is a great start. Swimming is an activity we can do for life. Any other excercise related things that we can add is all to the good in the long run.

            I paddle, swim, XC ski, hike, PT to eat and drink what I please!

            shootski


            • Shootski,

              Besides all of the obvious points (good ones) that you made,…. I like to cook and eat and do catch cooking shows on a regular basis, to get ideas. I do eat pretty well in general though. One TV chef, in rather good shape, made a comment on exercising/work outs. They said that they HATE it,…. but do it to eat and drink as they please, to your point. Nothings free,……. 😉

              Chris


        • shootski,

          Agreed – your are analogy is more appropriate… the firmware – the shooter; the software – the training, study, experience and reflection. Like that, mind if I use it?

          hmmm… any chance we could slip “AI” into this discussion?? LOL!

          Cheers!
          Hank


          • Hank lol AI!

            Sure we already have balstic calculators that connect with Bluetooth to our scopes, Windmeters, autotriggers, autoleveling hydraulic actuated shooting rests…. But, I thought we were talking about users???
            Can we call someone who makes use of all that gear a shooter?
            CHRONOGRAPHS especially those that use RADAR or LASER measuring engines excepted!

            As far as permission to use anything I post here I consider it to be in the public domain. You are very welcome to make use of them in any way you see fit. Of course your use is at your own risk with no actual or implied guaranteed safety or functional certainties; also your mileage may differ! My deepest SECRETS will never be revealed but to my blood family members…must be my Neanderthal genes kicking in!

            shootski


            • shootski…

              – autoleveling hydraulic actuated shooting rests – check
              – balstic calculator that is connected to our scopes – check
              – automatic range estimation – check
              – automatic target velocity and angle-off calculation – check
              – windmeters that automatically compensate for drift – check
              – autotriggers that actuate when correct firing solution is presented – check

              …. But, I thought we were talking about users??? … we are – I do this for every shot! LOL!

              Those radar chronographs are way-cool! Would love to have one of them to play with!

              shootski, I had a couple of thoughts that I wanted to bounce off of you off-line. If you don’t mind direct contact, could you contact me at: “hank dot vanderaa at gmail dot com”.

              Cheers,
              Hank



              • Hank
                Sounds like your talking about those very expensive smart guns the military has that explodes the projectile just above the targets head or behind a wall. A firearm that never misses it’s target, no escape from it ! Recorder a show on it.
                Bob M


                • Bob,

                  I was actually describing (tongue in cheek) the sophisticated ballistic calculator that we all have between our ears LOL!

                  … its not the firearm that never misses – though blaming it is a common thing 🙂

                  Cheers,
                  Hank


  8. B.B.,

    I want to ride on Tom Ogden’s and your coat tails for a moment.

    The Seneca Aspen is tempting, not only because it can be used without external equipment. I have read a couple of articles you have written in the past. In both, you concluded you choose a multi-pump rifle for survival purposes.

    I don’t know what caliber will be more useful for survival purposes, but I do think the Aspen may be a reasonable successor to the standard multi-pump.

    Here is one link to the past when you explained your reasoning for choosing a multi-pump.
    https://www.pyramydair.com/blog/2010/04/my-survival-gun/

    Of course, regardless of which rifle is chosen, it pays to know how to take care of it.

    I pray you are well and your cats as well,
    ~ken


    • Oh … and the Aspen also has a shrouded rifled steel barrel.

      I must remember to use “search” first. B.B. brought up using the .22 Aspen as a survival at the beginning of Part 1.

      ~ken


  9. B.B.,

    I have come to think of the Aspen as a PCP with one very special extra feature, the ability to top off with no additional equipment. If I were a hunter (I’m not) and bought one, I would still also buy a compressor and tank, but I would not have to buy a small bottle to bring along when I went hunting. Within its power, caliber, and price range, that extra element makes the Aspen a very tempting choice.

    I think of the Aspen as an important PCP development the way these new multi-shot springers are an important development. If I wanted to purchase a springer to kill the occasional pest around the house, I would strongly consider the multi-shots. They can deliver a follow-up shot so much more quickly than other springers. To me that would be a huge benefit.

    Michael


    • I would buy the gun first and then decide on a tank and/or compressor. I shoot the Aspen while sitting two feet away from a tank and I still pump it up rather than stand up and hook it up to the tank!


  10. Everyone,

    I’m just wondering what I might have missed in the last 5 years of blog, been searching for anything about gas rams here and not finding the sort of answers I’m looking for. Like, what materials are typically used for the seals? How much pressure?

    Anyways, I wound up reading Crosmans patent for their Nitro Piston 2, which didn’t have anything to do with gas ram design. But it does have something very interesting for all spring piston platforms. US Patent #9,562,738 granted Feb. 7th, 2017 For a ‘Split Compression Piston’

    This is how Crosman got their Nitro Pistons to stop rebounding & vibrating at the very end of the shot cycle. The ‘braking system’ as it were which stops the piston from moving until the shot cycle is over

    In the attached pic, #110 is the expanding bushing

    If this was examined in more detail during the previous 5 years, then I’m sorry my searchfu powers were not enough!

    Anyways, I might have to admit my previous idea for building an air rifle instead of just buying something is starting to look more like owning a boat! It’s not going to be about saving money if I’m actually going to get anywhere with it…


    • Clicky,

      Interesting. Being here for a few,…. the technical stuff does get addressed from time to time. Sometimes, very in depth. In general though, it is about thorough reviews, performance and guidance. Sometimes basic. Sometimes philosophical. Sometimes just plain fun.

      Where you get into the (really) technical stuff is when you toss stuff out there. Stay engaged. I have found that people that have similar interest/knowledge/ideas are more than happy to chime in. Maybe not to your degree, but I have been there, done that. What I have found is a bunch of great people more than happy to help you to get to wherever it is that you are going,…. in general. 😉

      Hey,…. nobody said that turning the air gun world on it’s head was going to be easy,……. did they? If so,…. I was not in on that E-mail loop! 😉

      Chris


      • Chris,

        I have a very profound respect for what it takes to mass-produce any new designs

        If I had millions to blow at a legal firm which specializes in filing patents, I might be a millionaire by now…


    • Clicky
      How about this … Install a seal on the piston rod end inside the ram cylinder and create an air snubber that compresses air between it and the gland seal as it expands. Air would be compressed at a calibrated rate to produce just enough compression inside the ram cylinder to prevent the ram from making hard contact with the receiver at the end of the stroke and rapidly bleed off.

      Been done in various ways with hydraulic pistons.
      Bob M


      • Bob M,

        Well, that might work to some extent, but that would be an air spring also, so I would expect that secondary spring to have some bounce to it

        What about something more like what is found inside gas charged shocks? I’m most familiar with japanese dirtbike shocks, having torn a handful of those apart including one just recently. They use a bump stop to absorb bottoming out forces. Of course, these are typically found at the opposite end of the cylinder

        So in the case of a gas ram for an air rifle, I would look into a ballistic material that wont disintegrate or permanently deform. I would try something like what is described here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dilatant

        A disk of such advanced plastic, located inside a gas ram cylinder to act as a bump stop

        But, if the ram is damped and the piston continues forward without the ram, even if for only a tiny distance, it could still oscillate fore & aft

        I’d rather take a damping system like this and use it on the stock, to absorb the recoil of the action. Maybe put some inside a two-piece weaver rail



          • Clicky
            Sounds like something they have in the shock absorbers on my Twin Turbo 3000GT VR4. Variable Electronically Controlled Dampening Level. Also locks in for Sport or Touring operation.

            I’m thinking more along the line of a variable or fixed air restrictor that would eliminate bounce altogether at the end of the stroke. Perhaps a tapered pin like set up? Just a thought for airgun designers.
            Bob M


            • Bob M,

              Air, or in this case, nitrogen gas, is a very flexible medium without any inherent damping, so trying to use that as the damping medium should be a bit more challenging than what those Mitsu shocks are up to!

              And in that light, I think the use of a software controlled active damping system might be very interesting for a gas ram

              Consider your mode selector switch to choose between ‘Sport’ or ‘Touring’, what if that was instead on the stock of an air rifle and was for selecting different pellet profiles you could tune via bluetooth app?

              That is, you could set a target mode that dials down the piston speed for more consistent shooting with a very smooth finish to the shot cycle, or switch to a more ramped-up mode that tries for max power with a more aggressive braking at the end of the stroke. Maybe even something advanced like allowing one single bounce back with hold so as to create a vacuum effect in the barrel for quieter shooting


              • Clicky
                Now were talking about something that even the Defense Department might have a hard time appropriating money for 🙂 … or you could just get a variable powered PCP like this one and say the heck with it !


                • Bob M

                  I’m the sort who will never be happy with off-the-shelf unless it has my own name on it…

                  And that vacuum mode silencing tech is taken from a DoD report on how to make an anti-tank platform more stealthy. So that actually is a very well proven trick. I guess I should link to it or something? But I didn’t bookmark it!

                  Daystate has a nice software driven platform. I like what they’re doing

                  Navy seals are using a .357 PCP for nighttime sniping because it doesn’t have a ‘Hey guys, I got an american looking muzzle flash over here!’


                  • Clicky
                    “Moving over to the dark side” takes on a new meaning there, more literal.

                    I looked at the Daystate Pulsar a while back and concluded it went well beyond my needs. And ‘Because we can” when asked why. Similar to Mitsubishi putting four wheel steering on the 3000 GT. Something for the pros to appreciate, but I have to admit changing lanes is a very smooth maneuver.


                    • If I make a rifle half as good as anything from Daystate, I’ll be fine with that!

                      I’ve been looking for constructive excuses to learn how to program microcontrollers, so when I look at what Daystate is doing, I’m actually looking at what I could be doing 10 years from now if I wasn’t so lazy!



  11. B.B., and Half,

    When picking the “Review, article, latest buzz” on a PA product page (example, Fortitude) the link now goes to Part 1 instead of the latest Part in the series.

    Don


  12. Aspen
    The barrel is recessed 41/4″ and the spacer is about 8” down. The shroud is1″ OD, actually 63/64″ and the ID is as close to 29/32″ as I can get. I don’t consider it loud but then again I don’t consider ‘any’ Harley loud either. Just right !
    You could probably drill some holes in the barrel spacer to disburse more air and I’m sure there are some baffles for a 1″ shroud out there somewhere. At least you would not have to extend the shroud any.

    It has already been pointed out that the pump handle becomes a convenient place to hold and carry the rifle but it really shines shooting it off hand, standing. It allows you to rest your arm against your chest wile resting the rifle in your palm for real steady shooting and it helps prevent fatigue. It’s worth repeating.
    I have been considering putting risers on lower weaver pails with rubber covers for some other heavy rifles. Like the M200 Intervention has. Something like an AR rear sight handle with a weaver insert only on the bottom rail. Could even be swapped out with a scope on an AR-15.

    The FX Independence has been referred to as the “Holy Grail” of airguns being a self contained high powered rifle well this is the working mans version. Time will tell how well it holds up but I suspect it will probably need pump servicing over the years just as any other hand pump would and if parts are always available, no big deal.

    This is one of those airguns you have no regrets getting. All considered, this is a super price point PCP with all you get and ‘don’t need to get’ considered, as BB said. Especially when compared to the ‘only other one’ out there by FX.
    Bob M


  13. BB and all.
    Talking about health and food. I’m 71 and for about a month or more I’ve been taking this Advanced Formula Dietary Supplement Collagen, Type 1,2 & 3, 18 essential amino acids + 100% RDA vitamin C. (6 pills per day) You will have to find the name but it’s sold on line and in a big name bulk supply big box store. No more joint pain or aches. My neighbor gave me some to try. He even gives it to his old dog to stop his winning. I’ll be on it for life ! No more neck pain either. I never thought it would work much but was I surprised. It slowly kicks in till one day you realize you feel great again. No, I don’t own stock in it . 🙂

    Bob M


    • Bob,

      Just returned from weekly shopping and looked for the product that you generically described. Do you have a (specific) product name/link/pic? As you (anyone?) knows, the supplement aisle at Wally World can be mind numbing and what I figure is mostly “snake oil”, slicked up in a fancy little bottle. At least the snake oil waaay back in the day was mostly alcohol! No wonder people thought they were “cured” and/or “felt better”. 😉

      Something called Carnivora (sp?) and some beet juice pills to increase nitrous oxide is making the rounds on radio. Probably snake oil as well.

      Chris

      Thanks, Chris


      • Chris
        Didn’t want to waste too much time on the blog off topic, but if BB wants to remove it so be it.
        It looks like a COSTCO item from Youtheory. I got it through Amazon. The price varies a lot and there are some other variants and quantities available under the name. I got 3 bottles of 390 pills for $53.38 but cant find it that low again ? Evidently some people buy it wholesale and sell it on line cheep.
        It takes a while for it to heal you at first depending on how bad you are, but hang in there. I wake up with no hip, shoulder, back or neck pain or actually aching. Wellness sneaks up on you. Good luck !
        Bob M


        • Bob,

          Thank you. I will look further. This crowd seems to be of the,.. shall we say?,… of the older “vintage”. Anything that helps to regain some youth-like attributes I think would be most welcomed,.. by most.

          Thanks again,…. Chris



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