Benjamin 397C: Part 3

by B.B. Pelletier

Photos and tests by Earl “Mac” McDonald

Part 1
Part 2


The Benjamin 397C (right) is noticeably shorter and smaller than the 397 long gun. It’s three inches shorter and more than a full pound lighter than the rifle we know today.

Before we begin today’s report, I’d like to give you an update on two projects. First, I’ve replaced the trigger in the RWS Diana 34 P rifle,ย so I’m ready to do the T06 trigger evaluation. It was the easiest trigger replacement/piston removal I’ve ever encountered! I used to think Weihrauchs were easy to work on, but now that Diana has gotten rid of the T01 trigger that had a couple small things you needed to know how to do, replacing a trigger in one of their rifles is about like putting batteries into an airsoft AEG. I did the whole job in 20 minutes, start to finish, which included set-up and clean-up time. A lot of the credit for that goes to the Air Venturi spring kit that was in the gun, because the mainspring is not under a lot of pre-compression. I’m sorry to see that product go, because it made a world of difference in the performance of the gun.

I was so pumped with the success of the trigger swap that I tackled the Slavia 631 next. It’s also easy to take apart, and you won’t believe the improvement that just lubrication has brought. A 35-lb. cocking effort is now down to just 21 lbs.! I had guessed it could drop to 28 lbs., but that was way too conservative. I also got rid of 80 percent of the vibration, but that’s something I will save for the next report. Since the rifle is now so different from the way it was, I’m going to retest the velocity for you in a special report.

There’s lots more to tell about both projects. This was just an update to let you know how things are going. And, wprejs, this week I’ll pack the harmonica rifle and send it to Vince. Now, let’s look at today’s test.

Let’s take a look at the accuracy potential for the Benjamin 397C that Mac’s been testing. There’s been a lot of interest in this little rifle since this report started, and practically nobody knew of the gun’s existence before now. Even so, it was produced so recently that there’s still a good chance of finding one in near-new condition and still in the box, so this is one of those sleeper opportunities that abound in this hobby. As I finish this report, you have to ask yourself what it is that you like about airgunning; because if it’s finding rare guns for very little money, this carbine is one to look for. And, you need some references like the Blue Book of Airguns to help you find things like this.

The test
Because this is a multi-pump pneumatic, there are some things we need to know before we look at the targets. The number of pumps that were used for every shot. Mac shot the carbine off a rest at 25 yards, and each shot got the maximum of eight pumps.

The way this gun works, some high-pressure air will always be trapped in front of the pump piston head after the pump stroke is finished. All the air does not go into the reservoir, even on modified guns.

As the number of strokes increases, the amount of air trapped in front of the piston head increases, so naturally it’s always the greatest when using the maximum number of strokes. When that happens, the air pushes back on the piston head, forcing down the pump lever, which is the carbine’s forearm, just a little. When you shoot, the air pressure inside the reservoir drops instantly and the tiny bit of high-pressure air in front of the pump piston head pushes its way into the reservoir. That allows the forearm to return to its relaxed position, and the shooter feels this as the whole gun settling. It’s a trait very common to a multi-pump, and it allows some movement of the gun with the shot.

There’s nothing a shooter can do about this movement when it happens; when it does, the pellet is already out of the barrel. The slight movement should have no effect on the accuracy of the gun. However, I want you to remember this discussion, because it had an effect on the outcome of the test.

Mac notes that the little carbine is hardly a bench gun, and we wouldn’t expect it to be at just 4 lbs. Sometimes, light weight and overall shortness can be a detriment to accurate shooting, as these little rifles are so twitchy (sensitive to how they are held).

You’ll remember from Part 1 that there is a Williams peep sight on this gun. Mac installed the hunting aperture, which has a larger hole for more rapid target acquisition. Peep sights with large apertures are quicker to get on target than regular notch sights, but the downside is you give up some precision to get the speed. I love the way an M1 carbine gets on target in an instant, but nobody will ever confuse it with a target gun because the large aperture reduces it to a minute-of-person weapon.

Accuracy
The first pellet Mac tried was the 7.9-grain Crosman Premier ย dome that’s usually one of the most accurate pellets in these multi-pumps from Crosman, Benjamin and Sheridan. But this day there was no joy as five pellets went into a group measuring 0.93 inches.


Crosman Premier lites were disappointing, producing a 0.93-inch group for five shots at 25 yards.

Next, he tried RWS Hobby pellets, which he also thought would be wonderful. They disappointed as well, with a five-shot group that measured 0.77 inches at the same 25 yards.


RWS Hobbys that usually do well were only so-so in the 397C. The group measures 0.77 inches.

Finally, Mac tried the pellet he likes the best for most air rifles in .177 caliber — the RWS Superdome. But try though he might, five of them grouped only 0.84 inches at 25 yards. Then, he had a thought.


RWS Superdomes that Mac likes didn’t do so well, either. This group measures 0.84 inches at 25 yards.

Inspiration!
Remember that forearm that moves on every shot? Mac noticed it, too, and was holding the rifle with his off hand close to the triggerguard, the way you’re supposed to hold a breakbarrel. He decided to throw caution to the wind and rest the rifle with the forearm lying on the flat of his palm. He just knew that the moving forearm would throw him off, but he tried another five RWS Superdomes and discovered the secret. That’s the perfect way to hold this little carbine! Five pellets went into 0.24 inches at the same 25 yards.


Mac discovered the secret hold! Resting the forearm on the flat of his off hand made this spectacular five-shot group with RWS Superdomes. It measures 0.24 inches between centers.

What this test tells us is that conventional wisdom isn’t always right. This reminds me of the time when I decided to hold my Beeman C1 carbine with a super-light hold to see how bad it would group and wound up discovering what I now call the artillery hold!

The bottom line for this little gun is that Mac loves it. He likes it most for its size and weight, and it’s the gun he most often hands to guests when they want to do a little shooting. Offhand, it shoots much better than these groups might suggest, and Mac doesn’t worry about the loss of velocity. As long as everyone has a good time and can hit the targets, everything is fine.

59 thoughts on “Benjamin 397C: Part 3


  1. Well, this begs the question – did Mac go back and try the other pellets to see if they would improve as much as the Super Domes? What a dramatic difference, and what a super group!



  2. Can’t wait to get Vince’s report on the Harmonica rifle.
    Finished the stoning of the trigger parts on the TF 87 and awaiting the arrival of my Moly grease which hopefully is this week. Also while the trigger assy was out I adjusted the pull weight down to approx 3 lbs- much easier than doing it while it is attached to the action.
    Pete


    • Pete

      How long have you had your TF87? Coincidentally, I purchased a TF99 a while back from Vince, which is essentially the same rifle as yours but without the adjustable trigger.

      Would you by any chance be the Peter that left a review for the TF87 on the PA product page? A Leapers droop compensating scope adapter is mentioned in the review, and I have a few questions.


      • Sl,
        I have had my TF 87 for about 9 months. Yes. That was my review.
        What I got was a UTG 11mm-to Weaver Adapter. The droop compensating mount would not work because there is no scope rail attached to the action. Did not know how to correct the review.
        Sorry about the mix up.

        Pete



          • SL,
            The QB36-2 (= your TF99) is still my favorite; its detuned to something reasonable to cock and shoot; I’m sure Vince did an even better job than I did (I wrote it up in my youth on the old blog). Is yours .22 or .177? By the way, the TF87 has an even longer chamber and should be substantially more powerful, i.e., there is more difference than just the trigger.


            • BG

              You were a youth only 3 years ago? I thought you were a little older than that. ๐Ÿ˜‰

              Good job on the guest blog. I had not read that one before. Mine is .177 BTW. I would have prefered a .22, but you take what you can get. When I saw the gun advertized on the YF, considerably cheaper than new and being sold by Vince, I jumped on it.

              I never discussed with Vince what all he did to it, but it is a great shooter. I was worried about the trigger feel since it is ‘ non adjustable’ but it is a very crisp, predictable single stage.

              I liked the part in your blog about banging the gun against the post to get the spring out. Maybe our mechanical abilities are not so different!


              • SL
                Under 40 seems like my childhood now. The trigger is excellent on such a heavy springer (at full power, it will “sling some lead”). I actually like the single stage with no mush and no trying to anticipate.

                If you notice yours starting to lose power and/or diesel, check the breech seal on the sliding cylinder — it gets squashed after a couple of years. 5/16″ black fuel line makes a cheap replacement and probably seals better than the original, although it may not last as long.

                .22 in the QB36-2 would be OK, but I really want one of the TF87’s in .22 — the compression chamber looks to be almost 50% longer, which means to me that it could be toned down for behavior and still put out a lot of power. Even 36-2 in .177 is good long range plinker for a springer; at one point I could hit a small tomato paste can at 50 yards very reliably with it and worked up to 75 or so, but that was iffy.

                Pete’s offhand problem is due to the long length of pull, I bet. It is 14.5″ or so, a horrible problem for most people offhand on a heavy rifle, and the buttplate isn’t the type you can shoot easily from the arm. Before I chopped off my 36-2, it gave me a backache trying to pull the muzzle up, as my arms are too short or else too “brawny” ๐Ÿ™‚ to get my elbow against my chest with the original pull length, even holding right in front of the trigger guard. After modifying the stock and re-tuning it, the rifle is the one I grab whenever I get a chance to shoot, although I have had a peep sight on there for quite a while that sucks some of the joy out of shooting it(for me) — need to take that off and go back to the open sights.


                • That sounds a lot more like the BG I know. The blog made it out that you were going to scope this one! I know your aversion to glass. ๐Ÿ˜‰

                  Mine is unscoped as well. I like the open sights despite the fiber optics, and was able to hit a small jelly jar several times at 50 yards. This is not to say I did not miss several times.

                  I would like to scope it just for a minute or two, just to see what it is capable of, but it is bound to be an open sight rifle ultimately.

                  Thanks for the tips.


                  • SL,
                    It is actually air rifles that made me into an open sight fanatic again. I was convinced that I needed a scope to shoot everything, but it was losing the fun factor, so I got my Hammerli 490, figuring I could at least see to shoot at 10M. I liked the springer concept, so I got the 36-2, but I figured it needed a scope for 25 yards and more and it could fill in for the rimfire target practice. By the time I had it working well enough (smoothed out) to actually use a scope, it stayed on just long enough to prove it worked, then I went back to the open sights. Now I actually shoot 50 and even 100 yards with fixed, primitive sights on my muzzleloaders with some relative success. My eyesight hasn’t gotten any better, but the practice has made it a viable option again. All thanks to BB and airguns :). The peep was part of a Quigley fascination, but for me it doesn’t help; feels more like a handicap.


          • Sl,
            The weight makes it difficult to shoot accurately off hand. I have been pumping iron to make my left arm stronger and that has helped a little. Any tips for an older guy??

            Pete


            • Tips? Ibuproferin! ๐Ÿ˜›

              But seriously though…. I brace my elbow against my hip so I don’t have to support all that weight with my scrawny arms.

              I don’t mind the dark color of the stock so much, as it is so different from the rest of my rifles.


  3. B.B.

    As far as I remember, Benjamin Sheridan has bronze barrel. This is more than OK for lead pellets and it could last more than owner’s lifetime. However we all know that copper alloys have higher temperature expansion than iron alloys. Does it affect rifle’s accuracy in any significant way?

    I finally got my camera back, so this evening I’m going to make a long-promised photo of my latest achievment – if you remember that shot of three targets, I’ve finally outdone myself this time. I’d like to put it as an illustration of barrel longevity – it was more than a year and more than 7500 shots between those results (15 tins of JSB and 2 gas spring service re-fill) and it seems barrel hadn’t become a hair worse, it’s just me improving my skill.

    And joy – it seems next week my synchro is going to arrive ๐Ÿ˜‰

    duskwight


    • duskwight,

      I suppose if the place where Mac shoots was terribly hot at times it could affect the barrel, but it doesn’t seem to. Sometimes scope are affected by the rapid temperature swings they have at certain times, where the temp can drop by 40 degrees F. I saw that in field target a lot.

      B.B.


      • B.B.

        Yes, maybe I’ve seen something like that with the scope. First shots in gallery after I come from -20 into +18C room seem to group well, but a bit to the side. Then when rifle warms up a little POI comes back in place.

        duskwight




  4. Mac keeps going beyond the call of duty — springer is one thing, but the pumpers will wear you out (at least me :)). There seems to be no middle ground on Superdomes — people either love them or hate them. They have always worked well for me at reasonable ranges (<35 yards or preferably much less), and accuracy isn't why they fail (for me) — they just run out of juice; the BC isn't much better than a wadcutter. On the other hand, I hate the Hobby pellets and have wasted all the time I care to with them; the Diabolo Basics always work better for me. But it can be different for each rifle and each person…





    • wprejs,

      The HW 75 is a single-stroke pneumatic, so it’s all or nothing. There is only one power level in this gun, but what a wonderful air pistol it is. It is the same as the now-obsolete Beeman P2 that was created by accident when Weihrauch misinterpreted Dr. Beeman’s design ideas.

      B.B.



        • wprejs,

          Sure! The Beeman P1 for one. But why on earth do you want it? All it does is confuse you. I never shoot the P1 on low power, so it’s wasted.

          Now many PCPs have adjustable power, but again you have to re-zero for each power level. Just like with a firearm, you can;’t shoot two different rounds to the same place.

          My advice is to find a gun with the best power and accuracy and pellet and stick with it.

          I think I’m going to blog this, because I bet it confuses a lot of newer shooters. This Friday?

          B.B.


  5. Whoa, minute of angle there is very impressive. This makes me think that my guns may have some secret hold that will transform them that I have never bothered to investigate.

    Thanks for all the feedback on my reloading difficulties. Wulfraed has discovered what appears to be the intention of the Lee Challenger Breech Lock Press that I discovered from snooping around. It’s not a question of attaching above or below. You’re supposed to drill through the support surface and bolt the press on. Now, why didn’t I think of that? Perhaps because I didn’t want to face the fact that this tool requires a whole dedicated piece of furniture! With my close quarters this is a big complication. I did think long and hard about the tough choices I’m facing that include drilling through my desk. B.B. what is the difference between bolts and screws? They both have threads on them. And once you drill the press through a piece of wood, how are you supposed to mount it to the desk? With some sort of clamp as Chuck suggests? As a newly-created solderer, welding is totally out of the question. So, what I finally decided to do is cough up another $100 for the special Lee Reloading bench which should be coming in another few days which has the holes drilled in there. At least it is pretty compact. Upon my life this is mounting up between this bench and the Hazmat fees, and I’m falling deeper into the hole before reloading my first cartridge! Luke the Apostle where are you? Actually, I feel more like a character in a James Bond movie. It was not one of the memorable ones, and I can’t even remember its name but it was unusual in that Bond was fighting a South American drug lord instead of someone trying to destroy the world. At one point, there is a massive explosion caused by Bond, and a thin bespectacled American financier who is employed by the drug lord rises up and screams out, “Well, there goes another $80 million write-off.” The drug lord replies evenly, “Then let’s get rid of the overhead” and presses the trigger of his Uzi! The message seems to be that only executive ruthlessness and a certain amount of suffering will get me through this.

    Milan, thank you for your information about the killer pig, Entelodont. I’ve been consoling myself with watching YouTube videos about it. Why, study such a repulsive-looking, vicious, dangerous animal which I would shoot on sight? (By the way, I’m siding with Kevin that the best weapon for this animal would be some mounted machine gun, perhaps the Special Forces dune buggies equipped with an M2 heavy machine gun and an automatic grenade launcher. But this would only work in open spaces. In the overgrown brush that the pig likes, I think you’d have to fall back on a hand-held minigun). I suspect that the source of my interest is the power embodied there. It’s probably the same impulse as people who like to buy airguns that shoot at 1300 fps. And like an indigenous hunter, I also wish to somehow imbibe that power although only through the medium of understanding. Consider, the grotesque bony projections on the face of the Entelodont that look like miniature horns. The word is that they serve as attachment points for muscle that enable unheard of leverage for the animal’s 90 degree bite. Here is an idea that bears on another question that has intrigued me for a long time. How is it that mammals that are our size or smaller are so much stronger than we are? Badgers can reportedly dig right through an asphalt road, and supposedly a female Neanderthal could have easily defeated the most powerful men today in arm wrestling. I feel sort of inferior. It’s not just that these creatures are more active in the outdoors. There was a study done which measured trials of strength between chimps (which are roughly our size) who lay around all day in cages and human powerlifters at the peak of their conditioning. It was no contest; the chimps kicked their butts. The basic muscle physiology with the sliding filaments ratcheting past each other must be the same. The muscle can be packed differently and may be denser but that doesn’t seem to explain the difference. I asked this of a veterinarian and she told me in a very self-assured fashion that, in the case of the badgers, it’s because of their determined mentality. I’m sure that instinct is part of the equation but as a total answer it seems simplistic. However, different attachment points for muscles could make the difference. In the case of the Neanderthals, the shorter limbs and the different attachment points gave them a lot of leverage which we do not have. Whatever the reason, as Entelodont trots through the videos scanning the surroundings, the only word to describe it is…badass.

    I actually like to think about the Entelodont paying a visit to the people from Gamo who are shooting pigs with undersize calibers for advertising purposes if that’s what they are really doing. Maybe the Entelodont, could just kind of casually tap them on the shoulder while they are shooting away. I think what Gamo is doing is awful and that they should be reported and prosecuted. Otherwise, the story on Entelodont is that after 20 million years of dominating North America as the apex predator its brain that was the size of an orange could not keep up with new, smarter competitors like the Bear Dog which displaced it. However, it is my observation that big, mean, and dumb have not been eliminated by evolution and are still very much with us….

    Say, how about this idea? It started from David Tubb’s product of moly-coated bullets which can be fired down a barrel to lap it and increase accuracy. What if you fired short rods down a barrel to straighten it and even recut the rifling? If barrels can be straightened by hand (at least for airguns) it seems like you could do the same thing with the inherent power of the discharge (trying to play John Browning here by redirecting the gun’s energy back into itself).

    Matt61


    • Matt,

      You didn’t know that a reloading press has to be bolted (never screwed) to a bench? With all your research I am surprised.

      Screws are for holding lightly and bolts are for taking real strain. Use bolts.

      And now that you understand that the press has to be bolted to the desk maybe you can forget the plank idea. I just thought you were having problems with the architecture of the desk. If you can install the bolts directly, do so.

      B.B.


      • B.B., you’re reminding me of my super-smart college roommate who said, “Are you telling me that you didn’t realize that the element XXXX is the only one that allows for the chair conformation of the organic molecule YYYYY?” Well, not before but I do now. ๐Ÿ™‚ I don’t see why they couldn’t have stuck a C-clamp on the bottom of the press to allow me to attach it anywhere. Anyway, I’m on track now with my reloading bench ordered and have even made some progress in setting my up my powder scale.

        Matt61


        • Matt,

          I wasn’t trying to be a smart a**. Some jobs asked of a reloading press, like forming different-sized cases for wildcat cartridges, require so much pressure that the C-clamp would not be able to do the job. Most jobs like resizing and bullet seating are easy, but squashing a .30-30 down to a .22 to make a .219 Donaldson Wasp, is a high=pressure job and the press really has to be anchored.

          Having said that, I will soon publish a photo of my Forster press that I do mount with clamps as you suggest. But the press itself is bolted to a plank like I told you and this press generates the greatest amount of pressure with the least input.

          B.B.


    • Wulfraed has discovered what appears to be the intention of the Lee Challenger Breech Lock Press that I discovered from snooping around. Itโ€™s not a question of attaching above or below. Youโ€™re supposed to drill through the support surface and bolt the press on. Now, why didnโ€™t I think of that? Perhaps because I didnโ€™t want to face the fact that this tool requires a whole dedicated piece of furniture! With my close quarters this is a big complication. I did think long and hard about the tough choices Iโ€™m facing that include drilling through my desk. B.B. what is the difference between bolts and screws? They both have threads on them. And once you drill the press through a piece of wood, how are you supposed to mount it to the desk? With some sort of clamp as Chuck suggests? As a newly-created solderer, welding is totally out of the question. So, what I finally decided to do is cough up another $100 for the special Lee Reloading bench which should be coming in another few days which has the holes drilled in there.

      Back when I was doing sporadic reloading (.30M1 carbine; .357 magnum [at .38 Special wadcutter level for an indoor range]) I had my press mounted to a cheap Craftsman pegboard workbench… No longer stocked, it would appear (mine was only about 24″ wide, with a 12″ drop-down extension on each side…)

      If drilling the actual desk is out, then yes, I’d probably be going for something like a length of 2×6 (or 2×8 depending on needed set-back from front edge for rearmost bolt). Drill the bolt positions, then countersink one side [take that back, if using Forster bits to get a flat bottom, you’d do the counter sink first, then drill through for the bolts] — the countersink would be just deep enough to take the bolt head and a flat washer to distribute the load. Nuts and bolt threads would be on the top side of the press. Then use heavy C-clamps to hold the board to the desk. Powder measure could go on the other end of the board.



    • wprejs,

      The P17 is one of the best airgun deals on the net. However, it is made in China and therefore subject to a bad one now and then. Mostly the seals go bad and they are easily replaced, I have read.

      The P17 is a Chinese copy of the Beeman P3.

      B.B.


    • I bought of these, the first one lasted less than 10 shots and if I couldn’t buy another one right away I would sell the second one. I don’t think you can go wrong with this pistol.

      J-F



    • wprejs,

      The P1 and Hw75 are cocked in exactly opposite ways. Both are overlevers, but the P1 cocks on opening, by compressing a spring, and the HW 75 cocks on closing, by compressing air.

      You would probably like to look at the older Webley Senior and Mark I/II series guns–especially the slant-grip models. Also there is the American Hy Scpre 800. Then there is the German Haenel model 28. Read these blogs:

      /blog/2009/9/the-webley-senior-part-2/

      /blog/2006/2/hy-score-800-spring-pistol/

      /blog/2007/04/blast-from-the-past-the-haenel-model-28-pellet-pistol/

      The Haenel cocks backwards of the others, but you might like it.

      B.B.


    • If you want easy to cock but still accurate the Webley Alecto is VERY easy to cock. It’s a BIG pistol but the grip is so well made that you don’t feel it and it’s not very heavy.
      /s/m/Webley_Alecto_Air_Pistol/2238

      J-F


  6. All three of those guns are beautiful , my favorite being the Webely senior its such a elegant looking gun but i doubt I have the money for it , since i don’t yet have a job and when I do get one Ill only be making around 600 dollars a month.




  7. Hello B.B. and Fellow Airguners. I have been waiting with great anticipation for Dr. Beeman’s podcast interview. I was able to listen to it in it’s entirety this afternoon and now I have to wait for part two. Talk about having a captive audience. What a man of vision . I would be amiss if I didn’t recognize his wife, Tashiko either. As the company was a joint effort. Please correct me if I am wrong. With your connections and personal wealth of knowledge in air guns, we are a lucky group of air shooters. My hat goes off to you,and Edith.


  8. Hmm, but then again I’m not sure…. Can anyone please help me choose a pellet pistol, Because I looked around online and the old Webleys aren’t that expensive and I cant decide which to get?


    • What is it your looking for? Does it need to be quiet? How much accuracy do you want? How much do you want to pay? Do you need something new or is used ok? etc…

      The more details you give us the best we’ll be able to help you out.

      In this class of pistol I own a HW45/Beeman P1, Webley Alecto (aka Zoraki HP-01), Daisy Avanti 747 and the much, MUCH cheaper Beeman P17 (and a few others).

      For the price the Beeman P17 is VERY hard to beat and to me would be a very good entry point into airgunning world.

      Then again already owning these wonderful guns if I could find a nice HW75 I would jump on it.

      J-F


    • wprejs

      My choise would be HW45 for its power and reliability and HW75 for its precision, and quality of both is OK. Note that both resemble M1911 ๐Ÿ˜‰ That’s for thoughtful plinking. Maybe customised Crosman 2100 as well, but choose only LW barrel.
      For soda can mass extermination I would choose Umarex Colt or Beretta lookalikes – 8-shot pellet revolvers disguised as self-loading pistols.
      For 10 m target practice I would say IZH-46M. Cheap, precise, high-quality pistol that is very hard to break, but it may take some time and work to adapt its handle to your hand – some cutting and sanding may be needed to fit you perfectly.

      duskwight


  9. Might exclude most PCP-types as you’d need to factor in a scuba type tank or air pump (~$180) — unless you have such for a PCP rifle already and may only need adapters to fit.

    Still leaves the questions of: power plant (PCP – with or without CO2 option, 12gm CO2, 88gm CO2, spring piston, multi-pump pneumatic, single pump pneumatic); noise level (and if baffled systems are legal); power level (not that one will see rifle levels from any moderate pistol); fun (plinker) vs target (and that puts one into the hassle of 10m paper vs metal silhouette) vs small pest extermination (Marauder pistol)

    My current handgun stable has: Umarex “Walther” CP99 (CO2, repeater, plinker); Daisy 717 (single-pump, intro 10m style plinker [trigger is too rough for competition]); Baikal IZH-46M (single-pump 10m; I still need to finish carving/sanding the grip to fit); Crosman 2nd-gen Silhouette (PCP; I already had an AirForce pump for the Condor, and adapters to mate with a Marauder rifle which works on the pistol too). All .177 caliber. The latter two pistols still need sighting in (just got the replacement Williams rear sight for the Crosman; the first one was badly mis-machined). Ignoring the hand-pump, the most expensive pistol was the Baikal [I really should have moved the red-dot sight from the package to the Crosman HEH]


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