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Accessories Hakim air rifle: Part 4

Hakim air rifle: Part 4

by Tom Gaylord, a.k.a. B.B. Pelletier

Part 1
Part 2
Part 3

Hakim is a large, heavy military trainer made in the 1950s by Anschütz.

This report covers:

• TF90 dot sight
• Eley Wasp pellets
• JSB Exact Jumbo RS pellets
• RWS Hobby pellets
• RWS Superpoint pellets
• Evaluation so far

TF90 dot sight
Today, we’ll look at the accuracy of the Hakim trainer we’ve been examining, but with the Tech Force 90 dot sight mounted. Last time, I told you I was going to mount it on this rifle, and today I’ve done it. The sight base is short, which accommodates the Hakim’s very short 11mm dovetail grooves cut into the end cap.

Tech Force 90 dot sightThe Tech Force TF90 dot sight is a perfect match for the short dovetails of the Hakim. This is a large sight with a lot of target visibility.

Because it has no magnification, this dot sight is the perfect companion to the Hakim, since it will be mounted so close to my sighting eye. I discovered another great thing about it. Because it’s clear, I can see the entire front sight and hood through the eyepiece. I found that if I bisect the bullseye with the top arc of the sight’s hood and put the dot in the center of that, I eliminate all tendency to cant the rifle. This also eliminates all parallax. It sounds odd but it works. With the dot centered at the top of the hood, I know the pellet is going to the center of the dot. You can’t ask for more than that!

Eley Wasp pellets
The first pellet I shot was the Eley Wasp that did best in the previous test where the open sights were used. In that test, Wasps gave a group size of 0.349 inches for 10 shots at 10 meters. This time, 10 Wasps went into a group sized 0.351 inches. It appears smaller than the first group, but the measurements are too close to call. After shooting this group, which was a little to the left of center, I adjusted the sight to the right.

Hakim 10 meters Wasp group
Ten Wasp pellets went into 0.351 inches at 10 meters. This is a nicely rounded group. I adjusted the sight after this group.

JSB Exact Jumbo RS pellets
Next up were JSB Exact Jumbo RS pellets. These pellets not only landed to the right, they also climbed up quite a bit. I didn’t adjust the elevation, so there must have been some odd sideways strain on the erector tube from the horizontal adjustment.

In the first accuracy test with open sights, 10 RS pellets went into 0.495 inches. This time, they went into 0.375 inches, so they were clearly tighter with the dot sight.

Hakim 10 meters JSB Exact RS group
Ten JSB Jumbo RS pellets made this 0.375-inch group at 10 meters with the dot sight.

RWS Hobby pellets
Then, I tested 10 RWS Hobby wadcutters. In the previous test with open sights, Hobbys grouped 10 in 0.426 inches. With the TF90 dot sight, 10 Hobbys went into 0.389 inches between centers at 10 meters. This group was very round. It’s clearly smaller than the other one, but not by much.

Hakim 10 meters RWS Hobby group
Ten RWS Hobbys went into this nice round 0.389-inch group at 10 meters.

RWS Superpoint pellets
The last pellet I tested was the RWS Superpoint. In the previous test with open sights, 10 Superpoints made a 0.524-inch group. With the dot sight, 10 pellets went into 0.429 inches at the same 10 meters.

Hakim 10 meters RWS Superpoint group
Ten RWS Superpoints made this 0.429-inch group.

Evaluation so far
The Hakim seems easier to use with the TF90 dot sight. It doesn’t necessarily make the rifle more accurate, but it seems to be easier to shoot it accurately when the dot sight is used — especially after learning that trick of aligning the dot with the top of the front sight hood! These groups are almost as small as the 5-shot groups I used to shoot at 10 meters with Hakims back in the 1990s.

Before you hock the family jewels to buy one of these rifles, though, let me remind you that I was shooting at 10 meters today. Things always look a lot better when the target’s that close. Maybe, I’ll try some groups at 25 yards in a later report — just to give some perspective.

Having said that, though, notice that all these groups are small. The Hakim is a very accurate and forgiving spring-piston air rifle.

I’m now ready to open up the Hakim and look inside to see what can be done about the buzzing. I’ll do that in simple steps, like I did with the Crosman 2240.

The TF90 sight will come off the rifle, and I’ll start a separate evaluation of the sight next week. I plan to mount it on one or more of my other pellet rifles that could use a nice optical sight. Don’t wait for that report, though. There are only limited numbers of these in stock — and when they are gone, no more will be available. At $20 I don’t see how you can do any better than this one!

author avatar
Tom Gaylord (B.B. Pelletier)
Tom Gaylord, also known as B.B. Pelletier, provides expert insights to airgunners all over the world on behalf of Pyramyd AIR. He has earned the title The Godfather of Airguns™ for his contributions to the industry, spending many years with AirForce Airguns and starting magazines dedicated to the sport such as Airgun Illustrated.

212 thoughts on “Hakim air rifle: Part 4”

  1. I agree, it’s time to step back and see how far out they can keep in those tiny clusters.
    On another note, I nominate the TF-90 for use on the 2240 test subject, It probably won’t be the most accurate option but it could easily be used in either pistol or carbine mode without adjustment.Just pop off the stock.


          • Gunfun
            It does not look very promising for tomorrow’s sighting in session as it is already raining here. I did get to shoot about ten shot with my Hatsan in the backyard with JSB jumbo monsters at 25.39 gr thru the moderator installed ( no chrony numbers) but I can say that I could only hear the hammer hit the valve and then the pellet smack the metal target. There is virtually no report what’s so ever with it installed. It is hitting low and to the right without any adjusting on the scope yet. It definitely will not spook any game and they will never know what hit them.

            I have one question on the scope, when you adjust the eyepiece to get the reticle clear and crisp for your eye sight, it there a way to lock it in that position like most scopes by turning the grooved ring down tight against the scope bell. I cannot get the grooved ring to come loose from the rubber part of the eye guard to lock against the bell. The manual says to do that if it has that feature and I was just wondering if the hawke varmint scope that I got like your will do that and if it doesn’t how do you keep it from moving when in use.

            I don’t like that I can’t lock that adjustment from moving and when flipping up the lens caps it wants to turn some, I know it is not a lot but I would rather it be held securely from rotating if possible. if it should turn to lock how do you hold the rubber part of the eye piece to get it to turn and lock.


            • buldawg
              Man you are going right up to the big stuff. And I know its going to hit hard. And you may be able to put one on top of another at a given distance. But wait and see what happens when you try to hit something at different distances. Your POI will be changing more than I think you will like.

              And yes that particular Hawke scope does not lock the eye piece. I will say this so you can see what I do.

              I take my scope that is already mounted on the rifle and shoulder it. Then I look at something like a white refrigerator. And I don’t care if it is only 5 yards away. And I don’t care about focus for the side of the white refrigerator. All I want to do is look through the scope and see the reticle as sharp as I can by turning the eye piece adjustment.

              If you put your flip up covers on straight up after you do that you should no way turn the eye piece adjustment anyway enough to mess up the focus of the reticle.

              And then the next step is put your scope at 10 power and turn your side wheel focus to get the sharpest focus for the distance you want to sight the gun in at. I use 50 yards. And what I do is turn the scope down to 6 power after it has been sighted at 50 yards. After all of that your gun should shoot within a half mil dot at 50 yards or closer.

              But here is the thing. The pellet has to fly good and level. Those trajectory’s that look like a roller coaster hill is no good. I think that’s what is going to happen with that pellet you chose.

              You want a pellet that can shoot flat as possible which more than likely will be a lighter pellet than you have. If the pellet fly’s level for a longer time it will be easier to stay in that 1/2 mil dot zone. And it will be easier to hit your target.

              And even if it was a bit bigger than the 1/2 mil dot zone that would be ok also but depending on what your hunting.

              • Gunfun
                I just had those JSB 25 grainer already open and I was only shooting to test the moderators performance and boy does it work well, as I said there is absolutely no hint of a report just the mechanical noise of the trigger, hammer and valve, then the loud smack on the target.

                I wish the eye piece lock in place, I see that if you keep the flip covers on it will stay at the same place. My problem is when I flip open my eye piece lens the hole cover comes off instead of flipping open. I will get used to it, but I like the bungee corded removable caps better. I think I can cure that by placing a ty-wrap around the rubber part of the flip lens to hold it on the scope when opening the flip lens, The big end flip cover work ok without coming off.

                I will use your method when sighting for fifty yards and I have H&N barracuda copper plated 21.14gr, H&N rabbit magnum II 25.62gr, H&N field target 16.36, JSB jumbo heavy’s 18.13, JSB jumbo monster 25.39gr, H&N hollow point 12.65gr, RWS super h-point 16.2gr and CPs in domed and hollow point 14.3 gr and the gamo rocket steel ball 11.7 gr. so I will be busy testing to see which pellet will group best and produce the best fps and fpe overall. It will be a extended test session for sure to narrow down what pellet is best for the intended use in hunting or target shooting.

                I have my work cut out for me in a lot of testing. But my overall impressions of the gun and the scope are very good, I definitely like the side focus instead of the front focus style. I will let you know how my testing progresses and which pellets is the best overall. I know the 25 grainers my not be the best in accuracy at 50 yards but if I can get them in 1 inch groups at 30 or so yards they will have a lot more knock down power than the lighter ones so it will all depend what I am out hunting for and the expected ranges I will be encountering. With three mags I can have different pellets in each mag and be able to swap out for the game I encounter because they are very quick, easy and quiet to swap.

                I may get some time Sunday afternoon if the weather clears like they say it will.


                • Personally I prefer the Bikini covers for my scopes rather than the bungee cord ones. You do not have the “banging” of the hard plastic against the scope or air rifle.

                  • RR
                    I don’t know what bikini covers are, where can you get them and how do they work. Do you have a link or can you tell me where to buy.

                    Thanks Buldawg

                • buldawg
                  I think you will be surprised at what the mid weight pellets will do. The H&N 16grn. and the JSB 18 grn.

                  I have had good luck with those in the higher powered .22 cal air guns. They seem to give a flatter trajectory. That way you don’t have to use hold over or under as much or at all even if you stay with in that 50 yard and under distance. Then you don’t have to carry multiple tins of pellets with you.

                  And the heavier pellets usually have that roller coaster hill type of trajectory from what I seen when I used them. But who knows maybe that Hatsan will have the power to shoot them good.

                  But let me know how it goes. And I got to work today so I might not be able to answer back.

                  • Gunfun
                    What are bikini covers, I have not heard that term before so I don’t know what they look like. Where can you get them.

                    Yea I kind of figured the mid weight pellets would be best also, but I wanted to try a full range so I can see the differences and determine which pellet is best for each type of shooting involved. the testing will tell me what I will use most. It is raining here so no good for today, but tomorrow is looking good.

                    Hope you have an easy day at work and get back to me about the bikini covers when you can. I Ty-wrapped the rear cover on last night and it stays in place when flipping open with no rotation so it will work, but I would like to see what those bikini cover are.


                    • buldawg
                      We are going to run out of room here replying. I will post a reply at the bottom of the page.

                • Buldawg,
                  I saw a “new to me” Loctite formulation the other day meant to soak into parts that are already threaded together, If it keeps coming unadjusted you may consider this option.


                  • Reb
                    I don’t think I would want to Loctite it in place in case it would ever needed to be moved you probably could not get it loose. It is also plastic and you cannot see the threads to apply it to, I would also be afraid it may damage the internals of the scope itself. I know what you are talking about as I have used it but it is more for steel parts that cannot be fully disassembled to apply Loctite directly to the threads.

                    I appreciate the thoughts and info .


  2. Well,I’ve shelved the 3120 project for the time being and got my 392 going again .Now I’ve got space to work on a New project! I’m gonna whip up a spring compressor and follow you through this one. “QB-36 here we come!”

  3. BB
    Shoot the gun at 25 yards before you pull it apart to get rid of the buzz. That way we have something to compare to for after you get rid of the buzz.

    If you shoot the gun at 25 yards after you take it a part and it groups good we wont know if its what you did with the buzz or if the gun just groups good at 25 yards.

    I want to see if your debuzzing makes the gun more accurate.

  4. BB,
    Remember when I told you about the Brazilian training air rifle based on the FAL? Well, good news: I found a good example for sale and I am negotiating it. The current owner shared pictures with me. If you want to take a look at them, let me know.

  5. BB, My TF90 arrived yesterday. The lenses look dirty. The objective lens looks like it has two smudjes at the edge of the lens. The ocular lens has what looks like a dusty, uneven lens coating . Cleaning ( lens brush, lens paper, lens cleaning fluid )does not remove them, they must be on the inside of the lenses. Is this why the TF90 is on sale? The sight functions as it should, and the dirt (or internal lens coating) problem is not noticed when I look through the sight. Should I return it, or are they all like this one? I have been using dot sights since the 1970,s . I still have (and use 2 aimpoints) and they have clear , clean lenses.. Thanks, Ed

    • Ed,

      There are no flaws in these sights. What you found wasn’t supposed to be there. I would return the sight for a replacement or a refund.

      This sight was made at a factory that makes optical sights for the Chinese army. Their standards are supposed to be very high.

      You got a bad one.


        • I remember my first set of Great Neck wrenches.Very impressive! They actually fit! And the steel was much harder than anything I had ever used from Taiwan. I started making a point to make sure they didn’t make what I was looking for before I spent my money with Snap-On.There’s a big difference between Japanese and Chinese steel, finishing details like flashing removal and polishing however do not appear to be a major priority.


  6. I had been wondering why no-one made a receiver mounted intermount for these guns. Hey Buldawg! check this out!


  7. B.B.,

    Just thought I’d let you know. I bought a custom stock from Steve Corcoran but instead of putting it on the Marauder I put it on the 1720T. The stock fits like a glove and the gun is super accurate. What a great carbine for off-hand, silhouette and informal field target shooting. Just light enough to stand and shoot for a long time.


      • B.B.,

        I didn’t say it above but it’s a great looking stock too. (walnut). It’s not easy getting one of his stocks new. He doesn’t take orders anymore, at least that’s what he told me. He just makes what he feels like when he wants to. I was very lucky and got him at exactly the right time. This stock never made it to market. He finally told me he was working on one at the time and sold it to me as soon as it was finished. Kind of felt like I was getting a little blessing on this idea. See my remarks to Reb above about what I’ve done with the rig. Have a great weekend.


    • G&G,
      You stepped it up a couple notches higher than what’s being done here with the 2240,but that’s what we’re looking for- A lightweight manageable and powerful carbine that hits where you aim it. Congratulations!

      • Reb,

        Thanks. As far as power the 1720T is .177cal. which is what I wanted for the field target aspect. It was shooting an avg. 701fps out of the box but I now have it shooting at an avg. 748fps. with JSB 7.87gr pellets, about 9.87ft/lbs.(would have loved 12ft/lbs but that just wasn’t going to happen with this gun and I knew that). Took a lot of fiddling to get it there but I wanted the extra zip to flatten out the trajectory as much as possible. Paid a pretty high price regarding shot count to do it but I thought that would happen too. Gets about 25 good shots now. I can live with that. I believe I am getting everything I can out of her now. Groups are .30″ to .50″ now at 25 meters. I hope I can get them consistently closer to the .35″ mark without too many fliers. We’ll see. I am very happy with this carbine now. An excellent and fun rig for the money. I actually got the idea from one of Crosman’s Team shooters. He is using a true F.T. stock though. I wanted it more versatile and light.


        • G&G
          I put a heavier striker spring in my 1720T. And don’t ask me how many pound spring it was. All I know is I got a heavier spring out of a assortment of springs that what was in the gun. Mine was shooting in the mid 800’s with a 8 grn. Superdome. And deadly accurate. That’s all I can say.

          • Gunfun1,

            I don’t think you need to say anymore. I am always reluctant to mess too much with the stock configuration. I have no idea why. It’s stupid. It’s probably because I don’t know what I’m doing when it comes to working on airguns. But boy do I love shooting.


            • G&G
              And it don’t really matter about getting that extra energy if it is adequate for the type of shooting your doing. I just like kicking the guns up in velocity because I do use my accurate guns for pest control at times too. But mostly target practicen and plinking.

              And yes. I love shooting too. 🙂

              • Gunfun1,

                Actually I haven’t shot it out at 40 yds yet which I basically need to be able to do. I hope at 748fps I don’t need too much holdover. If I do I might actually look into a longer barrel or heavier striker spring. I wouldn’t want the barrel any more than 16″ long. Right now it’s 12″. I don’t know if a 14″ barrel would get it up to 800-850fps. Which I would love. I’d also be concerned about even a L.W. barrel not being as accurate. Also, I don’t want to add more than 4-6 oz. of weight at the most.


                • With 8-10 grain pellets at 750 and sighted at 25 or so yards, you should be dead on at 40 yards.That’s where I like to set up my hunting guns. and with a little adjustment or hold-over 60 yards isn’t that much different.


            • G&G
              I have a 2289 with a 18 inch disco barrel on it and it is very accurate and as far as adding any more weight and increasing fps going from 12 inches out to 14, 16 or even 18 inches will not add enough weight to be noticeable. It will help fps and accuracy at the same time. It just depends on what you think looks good to you, adding any more length will help, but anything over 6 inches without a stronger hammer spring or lighter valve spring will most likely not add ant more fps. You can buy or make a rear tube/spring plug that is threaded to allow for adjustment of the hammer spring tension. I have one on my 2289 as well as a lighter valve spring, but mine being a pumper not a CO2, I have it set to full dump all air at any number of pumps all the way up to 25 pumps because with a pumper you are not concerned with shot count.

              I am going to convert my 2289 from a pumper to the Hi-pac HPA setup very soon by swapping the pumper tube and internal part to a 2240 tube and guts, then add the Hi-pac with 2 extensions so the air tube will be just short of the 18 inch barrel. I actually have a small barrel weight to balance out my gun to make it a great shooter.

              See pics attached <a href="http://s1376.photobucket.com/user/buldawg76/media/DSCF2245_zpscee368d2.jpg.html&quot;

              Hope the link works as I am still new to adding pics here,

              Edith if you need to edit to please feel free to do so to allow pics to be viewed. thanks


                • G&G
                  Thanks, it shoot real good and is well balanced with the weight out on the barrel. It is highly modified also so that at 25 pumps it is shooting ion the high 900s to low 1000s fps range with CPs 14.3 gr. it is just getting to much for me to pump that many times so it is either put a valve with less air space back in it or do the Hi-pac swap. Since I would rather shoot without pumping it is going to be swap to HPA when I get the funds up for the parts to swap with.


  8. B.B.
    A quick but important (to me) question for you. I have a UTG Accushot 4-16X56 scope for my Marauder. I have Air Force high mounts for it. While trying to “center” it, I discovered that I have to adjust the windage by 2 1/2 complete turns from center to get on target. I remember reading that you think more than 3/4 turn is reason to use an adjustable scope mount. I have ordered from P.A. a pair of Sportsmatch fully adjustable rings. I also remember reading an older blog post that said most of the adjustable scope mount manufactures have gone away because the 2 piece adjustable mounts can bend scopes bodies.

    Have I made a mistake by going the route of the Sportsmatch 2 piece fully adjustable mounts? Thank you for your help, once again.

    Jerry in Texas

    • Jerry,

      I don’t think you’ve made a mistake. Scope tube bending usually occurs when people shim the rear ring up too much, and that can happen with one-piece rings, too.

      I would just get the mount and see if it corrects the problem.


      • Thanks B.B., I am anxious to try it.

        I am really looking forward to the Ft. Worth air gun show. I want to purchase one or two more PCP air guns this year and I hope to be able to actually get to handle the guns there. I have my eye on the Air Force Talon SS, the AF Talon pistol or one of the Air Arms repeater rifles.

        I really made the right decision when I started with the Marauder. I made just about every mistake I could make, but I learned from them and am about ready to take on another one. Your input has been invaluable. I really appreciate what you do for us. I would not be this deep into airguns if it was not for the blog and the enormous amount of information that I get from the other contributors and especially your reviews and comments. I think you know that I am retired and the first thing I read every morning is the current blog report. Weekends are kind of bummers because there is no blog to read. If the blog and your reviews suddenly stopped, it would be a sad day indeed for a whole bunch of us.
        Hope to see you in Ft. Worth in September.

    • Jerry in Texas,

      If you are worried about damaging the tube you could try out the new FX “No Limits” mounts. As one end of the scope is lowered or raised the mounts tilt to compensate. No damage at all. Their not cheap though.


  9. Off subject if ya don’t mind.Has anybody had any experience with H~N baracuda Hunter and Hunter extreme.IF so are they accurate to say around 1” or less at 50 yards? The polymags are great for some but my gun does not like them and what a shame because these things are murder on what ever they hit,massive damage.I’m getting ready to order from PA and am looking for some good expanding mushrooming pellets.My JSB’ and Baracudas are just sailing threw at breakneck speeds but only just the hole and no massive damage.Can’t always make a head shot and sometimes have to take a heart~lung shot and for that you really want instant damage that a reliable hollow point will cause.

    • Steve,
      Have you tried Crosman’s pointed pellets? They are sledgehammers! I shoot them in both .177 &.22 with excellent results. Even my finicky 392 loves them, I was looking for something other than round balls to shoot in it and these fit the bill and cheaper than round balls.

    • I’ve shot the hunter extremes and they were as accurate as cp heavy in the ruger blackhawk, the expansion was the best and most uniform of any pellet I’ve shot. The cross shaped hollow point opens up and they flatten out beautiful while retaining ALL of their mass. They will cause massive damage, just stay away from the sound barrier, the shape doesn’t like it in the next dimension, lol.

      • I wanted to clarify by uniform I don’t mean a an even flat shape but the AMOUNT of “squish”, though see below, the wavy shape upon squish is consistent also.

    • And the way the shape flattens they get this wavy “toothed” shape that’s just absolutely mean looking. I have a 3/4 full tin Im saving for small game when I get a new gun. I ended up using mostly the rws supermags because I had more and they flattened the same amount, but definitely won’t cause the same damage, the hollowpoint on those extremes will just explode when entering where the wads are smashing the outside first.

      • Thanks for the reply guys,Next week I’ll put in a order for a tin of the hunter extremes along with some of my favorites in the 25 cal. Let ya know when I punch paper with um about the accuracy.Then when season opens hope I can report great damage with these.

    • steve
      I use the 31grn. Barracudas in my .25 cal. Marauders. The plain old Barracudas. They will put one on top of the other if I do my part.

      And when I hunt with my Barracudas I want it to penetrate. I don’t want hollow points. I want that pellet to go as deep as it will go. And if it makes it all the way through I’m more happy.

      • He didn’t say what cal but Id say your right, especially with body shots. When your pellet is already making a hole the size of an expanded 22, might as well just have it zap right through. The hollow points might be actually better for headshots in 25 cal because then you get some forgiveness if a glance shot, it will catch an edge and still break neck or concussion brain.

        • RDNA
          A while back I was talking to TwoTalon about head shots like on ground hogs or such. And he had a good Idea. But never said how it worked out. I was going to try it also but forgot about it till you just brought the head shot up.


          But they only make them in .177 and .22 cal. I wish they made them in .25 cal. because I would sure have some. And I think what TwoTalon was thinking is that metal tip would try to dig in and not allow the pellet to glance off. I think its a good idea.

          • Gunfun
            I forgot to mention I have some poly and metal mags to test in my Hatsan also. I glad to hear that they shoot good for you and I hope my Hatsan likes them.


          • That sounds, ahh.. sound if you ask me. I haven’t had a chance with poly or metal mags but had shot redfires and was not impressed with accuracy but the deformity was cool. I hear predator makes a much better pellet, and the metal tip could be devastating on a heart and lung with the tip bouncing around and the shrapnel spread of the pellet itself. Good times… lol

      • Gunfun1,I agree about the 31 grn.H~Ns,they are my go to pellet.But there are also times when just a 25 cal.hole will not do the job and the squirrel will have a few seconds to escape into the den hole.That’s why I’d like to find a do all pellet for head or heart and lung shots and when I say do the job I mean heart lung shot when head shot is not going to happen because he will only stay still for seconds and ya gotta take a chest shot.that’s when damage such as the polymag comes in but as I said they don’t do well in my gun like they did in BBs test of the Airforce Escape 25 cal. 24” barrel.I will continue to shot the H~Ns until I find a better mouse trap if there are any besides JSBs.

        • Gunfun!,Almost forgot,yesterday the only Friend I know around here that is a air gunner brought his new Beeman P11 22 cal. pistol here for me to shoot yesterday and I have one thing to say “WOW!” that pistol is a needle treader! Only shoots around 460 fps but I put nearly holes in hole with at 60” and I don’t consider myself the best with a pistol.HE has a 2x BSA scope on it. And I hit a 3” spinner at 80” and just put it down because I didn’t want to shot a second time and spoil my blown up ego for that great second.This pistol will tell you one thing for sure,either your a good shot or ya can’t shot a pistol and I say that because it does not miss only the person pulling the trigger does and that can be me.He’s the gut that buts every gun in two’s and he got two of um along with two Jim Shockey 22 cal. rifle that’s another story sometimes because I shot that one to.Its good to have at least one friend around here that gets different toys then em and I get to shot them.HE is 74 years old and has been shooting springer’s sense he was in his 30s I believe.

        • steve
          Read my reply to RDNA about the metalmags. I think that would be a good over all hunting pellet. But they don’t make them in .25 cal. which is kind of strange to me.

    • I like the barracuda hunter/Beeman Kodiak. It has a longish skirt to help it fly true. However it only shoots well in 2 of my guns. In my .22 RWS 350 THE velocity is only around 730 fps and the expansion of the head may go to .24 to .25 or so. This pellet REALLY performs in my .22 FX Independence. At 900 fps, pellets recovered from squirrels measure up to .30. From these results I can infer that this pellet needs a PCP rifle at 850-900 fps to make it expand well in game. The FX smooth twist barrel seems to shoot many different pellets well with no changes to windage settings.

    • RDNA
      But you did read about the stuff and catch up right? I have thought about were the heck is RDNA right now. This stuff were talking about right now is right up his alley.

      You got to stay tuned in or you will miss out. You know how that goes I’m sure. But at least its all saved and you can come back and read anytime you want. 🙂

      • Reb, I have no clue what Im going to besides a longer barrel when I start messing with a 2240, but I do know Im going to replace the trail pistol first, then grab another blackhawk because it is so cheap and easily smoothed out to an unbelievable level, that’ll get me shootin all these .177 pellets I got, then Ill get a new project 2240. And for GunFun I have gone back and read the articles but need a moment to go through comments. I hate when I forget to read daily, I feel like Im failing my post, lol but I know you all got it covered. Kids and summer makes for very full days so please excuse if I miss a day or two, don’t worry, I’ll always be back! There’s always a couple months were I don’t really shoot almost at all and do all the summer stuff because I either shoot indoors or go woodswalking, so Im shooting spring fall and winter, summers my hiatus, always goes like that.

        • RDNA
          I know what you mean about kids and work and all that other stuff. And this may sound funny to some people but shooting air guns and having while having the radio playing is my way of relaxing.

          But your right though some times it helps to take a break from something and when you get back to it. It becomes fun again.

    • G&G
      Well you asked about how to get that tight screw loose on your fore arm stock but you never did say how you got it loose.

      It sounds like you have if you got the other stock on that you got.

      • Gunfun1,

        Well, Reb’s suggestion about using heat did not work. All I did was, using my dremel I cut a little square out around each screw then I just turned the piece of plastic the screw was in and turned them out that way. I was very careful and did not touch any metal. After I got the plastic pieces with the screws out I still could not get the screws to turn out of the plastic. It seemed like the plastic had melted or something onto the screw threads. It didn’t look melted though. I don’t know but I got the forearm off without marking anything.


        • G&G
          When I got the screws out of my 1720T I looked to see if I could find any Loctite or something Crosman may of put on them to keep them secure. But I didn’t see anything. They were just tight. I had to put it to them but they finally came loose.

          I didn’t want to tell you that and have the chance of your gun breaking. I would of felt bad then. But glad you got your new stock on.

          So how do you like your new stock? Does it make the gun more comfortable to shoot?

          • Gunfun1,

            The stock fits like a glove when you shoulder it standing. It’s too short for benchresting but that’s not what I wanted it for. I wanted it for off-hand shooting and it’s a dream for that. Honestly, it’s the best fitting and shooting carbine I own now. Not to mention it is gorgeous. I also put one of Michael Chavka’s wire style stocks on my P Rod. That also fits fantastically (feels really good) but the P Rod is not nearly as accurate as the 1720T. Also, if you haven’t seen one check them out. They are really cool looking. I do recommend very much.

            Steve Corcoran’s stocks (the one on the 1720T) speak for themselves. As B.B. said Steve has a great reputation for building great stocks.


            • G&G
              I have seen the wire stocks. And I would like to see the wood stock on your 1720T.

              And my 1720T will shoot rings around the Prod I had. The 1720T is a heck of a accurate gun.

    • G&G,

      Have a great match! Where do you shoot FT? Are you shooting your 1720T as a pistol or a rifle?

      Am I correct that the 1720T comes with two different transfer ports? Safe assumption that you’re using the larger one to get your 10-ish foot-pounds from it?

      Sorry if I’m asking about stuff you already told us about!


      • GenghisJan,

        We have a club here in Yulee, Fl. just north of Jacksonville, Fl. We shoot F.T. here(not as much as we should) and the occasional match here or elsewhere. We are sanctioned by the USARB. I am shooting the 1720T as a rifle (carbine). Yes, it has two ports and I am using the larger one. It came out of the box that way. Feel free to ask anything you want to at anytime. That’s how we learn.


        We have a club here in Yulee, Fl. just north of Jacksonville, Fl. called N. Florida Shooters (Airgunners) and are sanctioned by the USARB.’ We shoot F.T. here ( not nearly as much as we should) and at other clubs. I am shooting the 1720T as a rifle(carbine). It does come with two ports and I am using the largest one. It came out of the box that way. Please feel free to ask anything you want at anytime. That’s how we learn. Today’s actual match does not include F.T. But we will shoot that after the competition informally.


  10. Buldawg
    That was RidgeRunner that said something about the covers. I haven’t heard of them either but my guess would be they are a type of soft cloth cover.

    And I forgot to tell you something. I put the 60c barrel that I turned down back on the one 2240 hi-pac conversion I got. I was trying that short 15” .22 cal. barrel on it. It no way performed as good as the 60c .177 cal. barrel.

    So the two 2240’s that I have will stay with the long barrels. The full length .177 cal. 60c barrel on one. And the full length .177 cal. Discovery barrel on the other.

    And I chronyed the Disco barreled gun yesterday with the 8.3 grn. Superdomes. I only did the 10.3’s the other day and they did around 750 fps. and I thought the 8.3’s would do around 800 fps. I was wrong. They averaged a hair over 900fps. Like 905fps. That’s coming close to what a factory Discovery does in .177 cal. But they just ain’t as accurate as the 10.3 JSB’s. So the JSB’s are the winner again in my guns anyway.

    • Gunfun
      I see that it was RR now I just glanced thru the post quickly and did not see who it was from. I thought you would get better results with the longer barrels. The heavier pellets seem to be more stable probably because they are not tipping into the trans sonic range like the superdomes.

      I will get with RR on those covers, Thanks


      • buldawg
        But what is kind of cool about the 2240 conversion the way it came from the factory with Co2 and the stock .22 cal. barrel the pistol shot at only 460fps.

        Now the same pistol is a rifle and its making almost double the power output at 905fps. That’s a big increase in power from simple modifications. And I think there will be more to come for the 2240’s.

        • Gunfun
          That is way cool, I got my eye on a deal for a 2240 tube and all the internals for 40 bucks to swap my 2289 into a 2240. I just can’t decide if I want to get the kit for 40 or buy a whole gun for 60 bucks, I don’t really need the whole gun but could probably sell the parts I don’t need on ebay for some cash back. just don’t know if I can get over the 20 buck difference.

          To complete the swap with my 2289 as it is now it would be 150 bucks to get the 2240 kit and the Hi-pac+ 2 extensions , 40 for the kit and 110 for the hi-pac.

          got to sell some stuff on ebay for sure. I definitely want to make the swap.


            • Gunfun
              I will definitely let you know how all the pellets do, I hope the metal mags are one of the better ones.

              Hopefully get some time in tomorrow if weather holds. I want a 2240/89 conversation so bad, just got to get funds.


          • Buldawg,
            I was talking to B.B. the other day about the Crosman 600 and modifications to it, including longer barrels.What I’m wanting to say is that you aren’t stuck with just the 2240 for your Co2 donor gun. If you want to use the HyPac system just make sure it has the right size female end like the 2240.My plan is to skip a couple steps by going with a 2400KT, starting with a steel breech and 18″ barrel but I’ve been looking at some of Crosman’s older guns also. Most of them come with male threads but can also be bulk filled.I don’t think I’d fill one to 3000psi but bulk filling would work for me and by changing the seals I’d be confident with it, after consulting experts, of course.

            • Gunfun
              I had thought about the 600s also but was not sure if they mounted the barrel and the trigger the same as a 2240. My 2289 already has a steel breech and 18′ barrel as well as hollow bolt probe and reworked trigger. All I would have to do with the 2240 swap would be to make the hammer spring adjustable by drilling and tapping the tube plug to fit my screw in the 2289s rear plug and swap all the pieces from one to the other. The only other thing I would want would be a aluminum barrel band instead of the plastic one on the 2240. I can’t see paying what a 2400KT cost because I already have the good stuff and just need the tube and internals. A 2240 is 59.99 from crosman on ebay with free shipping and no tax, which is the route I will most likely take for the swap, then all I would need is the metal barrel band and the Hi-pac parts.


            • Reb
              Sorry I got in too big a hurry to respond to replies and sent the response to Gunfun instead of you. It is the response right below your reply to me. My 2289 has a 18 inch barrel and at 25 pumps with the hammer and valve springs set to do a full dump of all air it will shoot in the low to mid 900 fps. it has to be cocked to pump it up, if you do, not cock it first the hammer is holding the valve in the open position. I am hoping with the hi-pac conversation at 300 psi and some valve tuning I can achieve the same numbers out of it.


                • Reb
                  That was supposed to state 3000 psi not 300, I thought spell check is supposed to be smarter than us humans, it should have caught that to correct it LOL.


                  • Being that I’m starting from scratch the deal costs just under $100, steel breech, 18″ .22 barrel,and Brass stabilizer weight(prolly black primer that) and shoulder stock…HiPac…hand pump…extension.I’ve got some mowers out back I need to get out front with some signs($) on ’em 😉 I spent today fixing up my Mako-cool little 20″ dual suspension 6 speed bike. All the cables were froze by rust, I’m swapping out the wimpy calipers and got a new thumb ratchet shifter, fresh cables and board-track tires, the handlebars are still stuck too so I can’t raise them yet but it’s comin’ along.


  11. Like anybody but me really cares, but I just had the opportunity to shoot one of the FWB300S’s I am rebuilding. Nice ten shot one hole group. Sweet! 🙂

      • A few things to keep in mind here.
        1. I am not an Olympian.
        2. This rifle is not broken in yet.
        3. I am not as of yet used to shooting this rifle.
        4. This is probably not THE pellet for this rifle.
        At ten meters, shooting RWS R10 8.2 grain, 10 shots, .142″ CTC.

            • Super nice group man! My 953 paid it’s keep yesterday, that head-space mod made this thing lethal to any small pest within 10 meters especially with my Daisy point sight! Quick,quiet and painless!

                • I had a Grackle greet me all the way to the mailbox and back.The 953 was sitting just inside the door,zip-bang -Boom! I’d say about 8 yards, neck shot & death spiral I wouldn’t push it past 20 on game but maybe pests.

                • I read the other day about a project involving installing a check valve in a P-17 by cutting back the piston . I’ve been brainstorming this idea for some time on a 953. I don’t think the stock compression tube would hold much more pressure but how about bumping wall thickness up? The pump arm will definitely handle it! I wish the 880 was still metal.


    • RR
      If that 300s shoots anything like my friends 124 I built for him a month ago, it a very sweet gun. That 124 would put pellet on top of pellet at 15 yards and was smooth as butter when shot.

      I got first dibs on that 124 when he decides to sell it, hopefully it will be soon.

      I checked out the Bikini covers you mentioned and they look good, but I think that when removing them the eyepiece would still try to turn. I have rear flip up cover ty-wrapped on and it works ok now so will see. I mat end up trying the bikini cover also. I like the plastic cup with elastic best myself because they are only on the when gun is put up not when out shooting so I don’t worry about the noise they make when removing and installing.


      • At 10 meters I am quite certain that this air rifle will literally shoot rings around a 124. The trigger on this thing is to die for. It also has a recoil system that the Diana 54 was based on. I didn’t measure the 25 yard group I shot, but you could just about cover it with a dime.

        She ain’t purdy but wow can she dance!

          • I have not tried 50 yards with it. My experience with these has taught me that after 25 yards the pellet is going so slow that it drops like a rock. I had a FWB601 that I mounted a scope on and zeroed for 10 meters. At 50 yards it dropped over a foot and had about a six inch group. You could watch the pellets arcing through the air.

            This 300S might do a little better. I think it is pretty hot for a 10 meter rifle. If I can get my hands on a chrony, I am going to check it out.

              • It is hard to remember as that was over two years ago, but I seem to recall the POI rose a little at 25 yards, but not much.

                Now with the 300S it rose well over an inch. The main reason I would hesitate to try it at 50 yards is I have already pulled the scope from it and put it back on my Edge and rezeroed it. I am setting my Edge up as a mini sniper, but if I keep one of these I may change my mind about that.

                • RR
                  I wish you still had the scope on it. Even if the group does grow I still like to know what kind of gun it is at 50 yards. That’s just something I do with all of my guns. That way I know how far out I can use the gun if I want. And for what purpose.

                  • I linked this for Buldawg so he would know what rifle I was talking about. BB shot his at various ranges including 50 yards. You can go there and see how it did.


                    I am seriously thinking of having a mini sniper rifle shoot out between it and my Edge. The outcome will likely decide what stays and what is sold. I’ll let you know how it goes.

                    I also need to finish putting the other FWB300S together and see how it functions.

        • RR
          I am not that familiar with a 300s design, but I have built a RWS 54 for a friend also that is most definitely the smoothest and least amount of recoil I have ever experienced from a spring gun. if the 300s is design with the same sliding receiver as the 54 it would absolutely shoot better than a 124, although I am not sure it would be any more accurate at 10 meters, but would be much easier to shoot at longer distances. The 54 I built would shoot 177 CPs 7.9 gr at 980 fps all day long without braking a sweat. the 124 only averaged 800 fps so the farther distance would be it down fall. I know the trigger on both the 124 and the 54 were very smooth and crisp, with the 54 being a little more precise between the first and second stage, but both were great guns. I prefer the 124 due to the 54 being almost twice the weight of the 124 which made it harder to aim without the aid of a rest or bi pod.


          • The 300S is a 10 meter competition air rifle. It is probably heavier than the 54, but not anywhere near the power. I did not use a spring compressor when I rebuilt it. The recoil is not much to begin with and with the slide…

            The trigger on this rifle has more adjustments than you can shake a stick at. You can adjust position, length of first stage, amount of pull on the second stage and if I am not mistaken, the over travel of the trigger after release of the second stage. By comparison, the Rekord trigger is crude.

            This is why I am spoiled. Most of the air rifles and pistols I have had are 10 meter. It makes it really difficult to appreciate even a real nice sporter trigger.

            • RR
              I cannot believe it is much heavier than the 54 as it was quite a beast. The fact that you did not use a spring compressor is not as unusual as you would think. When I built the 54 of my friends I did not use one either, although looking back now it would have been a lot easier. If I did not weigh 220 lbs and was unable to put my weight behind the spring it would not have gone back together. When I shot the first time it was not broken in yet either. I am familiar with 10 meter guns as I have a CMP range right here in my town 10 minutes from the house and go on Tuesday and Thursday nights when it open to the public for shooting to sight in my low power rifles. Their target system is excellent for sighting a gun in to the be able to hit the eraser of a pencil laid lengthwise facing you at 10 meters. I have a 853 that was given to me and I have rebuilt it to shoot up there and it just about impossible to miss anything dime sized if you do your part. I just wish I could sight my high power guns in there but they would destroy their pellet catch system.


              • Here is a lengthy blurp by BB on the FWB 300S.


                This blurb also has links to other vintage 10 meter rifles. Read through some of these only if you dare. You will likely find yourself trying to find some of these gems. For what you would pay for a top shelf sproinger, you can pick up a primo version of one of these and it will shoot almost as well as the latest and greatest of the new 10 meter rifles.

                • RR
                  That was indeed a excellent blurb as you put it. I can see why you like the 300s so much. it still does not look like it could much heavier than a 54. I never knew there were so many older type of target rifles out there. Up at the range the sponsored shooters all have the modern Insect’s and FWBs in exotic metals to make them as light as possible and also cost in the thousands of dollars.

                  There is a Creedmoor sports shop which is affiliated with the CMP that has the high dollar target guns for sale in town also. I could never see my self paying that kind of money for a 10 meter gun. I guess I kind of the same with my guns as I am with my motorcycles. I have always had a need for speed and can never be satisfied with a stock machine and therefore are never satisfied with a stock low powered gun either. My 853 I built I did some mods to get it up in the low 600 fps also and it has not effected accuracy. it is still a very accurate gun and fun to plink with in my backyard but does lack the power to take game at anything over 10 meters.


        • G&G
          I hope it is as good if not better than the one I built for my friend. His was made in 1974 and was one of the second version made according to what BBs 15 part review stated. I just hope it has not gone the way most things nowadays have and been made with cheaper materials and quality. That 124 was one sweet springer.


          • buldawg,

            Well, FWB certainly isn’t known for that and the price sure doesn’t reflect those type of changes. However, you can charge a lot for just a fine reputation.


          • buldawg76,

            Well, FWB certainly isn’t known for that and the price sure doesn’t reflect those type of changes. However, you can charge a lot for just a fine reputation.


            • G&G
              Lets just hope that they are not resting on their reputation and still desire to build a fine crafted 124. I have not checked what they want for one now but if it is any where near what the one I built it would be worth every penny. I can’t wait till my friend will sell me his as he said he would give me first chance and if I pass it up BB has second on it. Like that will happen.


  12. Just ran the QB-36 over the Chrony, I guess it’s falling down, I was getting pretty wild variances.8.18 Stoeger X match in the low 600’s, tried 9.8 Winchester round nose down into the low 400’s, got smoke so it’s got oil.Time to get in there,I just wonder how many pieces the spring’s in I saw a kit from Archer under $20 spring and all.
    I borrowed a bar clamp from my brother to mount on a 2×8 but it’s too short by the adjustment length.On to plan B


    • Reb
      If the kit from Archer air guns is the QF-2 kit it is a good value for the money, just a word of caution do not use the oil that come in the kit for anything other than wiping the outside of the gun down and it ain’t really even good for that. The oil is very poor stuff, the rest of the kit is good quality. I used one of those kit when I built the two B3s I bought for 20 bucks, The older B3-2 had a leather piston seal and the new B3-1 had a synthetic parachute type seal and that is the one I use the kit on. The older one I used BBs advice and just soaked the seal in non detergent motor oil for a few days to soften it up. I put the new spring from the kit in the B3-1 and put the spring from the b3-1 in the older B3-2, I also put a steel washer on the rear plastic spring guide to allow the spring to rotate on the plastic without wearing the plastic and also found a 1/2 inch headed nut with built in washer on the front end of the spring to also allow it to rotate smoothly inside the piston when it is collapsed and expanded. then lube the piston seal and piston bearing outer surfaces with moly grease, lube the spring and seats with a thick grease like waterproof wheel bearing grease and assemble.

      I am not familiar with the QB 36 as to whether it has a synthetic parachute seal or a leather piston seal so if you are not sure you may want to take it apart first to see. if it leather and the leather is still good without pieces missing or cracking it can be soaked and reused. Archer has most all the parts you would need.


      • A half inch nut is pretty heavy, and having it at the front of the spring adds that weight to the piston, if Im visioning it correctly. So my question is if you saw an increase in velocity because of the heavier piston?

        • RifledDNA
          I cannot say for sure that I saw a increase in fps or not because I did not chrony either of the B3s before I rebuilt them. In talking with BB when building them he said that the B3s were good for about 500 fps give or take 20 or so either way. I did more mods than just the washer on the spring guide end and the nut on the front piston side of the spring, I also swagged a 1/8 inch piece of brass tubing into the chamber transfer port to close the diameter of the port up about 1/16 of an inch to restrict flow and increase air velocity per BBs suggestion. I cannot say how much difference the added weight of the nut made and actually until you mentioned it I had not even considered it adding weight to the piston.

          I did chrony the two guns after rebuilding them and the B3-1 shoots right at 650 fps with the synthetic parachute seal piston. The B3-2 with the leather seal piston shoots in the high 500s to low 600s fps. The b3-1 got the new spring from the kit which was about an inch longer than the one that came out and that spring was put in the B3-2 because the B3-1 was basically a new gun when I bought the two of them but had been sitting for quite awhile. so its spring was newer and slightly longer than the B3-2 spring.

          The B3-1 is very accurate at 10 meters, the b3-2 is not as good but the front sight has been bent up some and I straightened it as best I could.


      • Yeah that’s it, I noticed their cautionary statement about the oil. Is it that stinky stuff I smell every time I load it? If so I’ll use it for target practice. You said it came with a piston seal right? Will I need anything else besides lube?


        • Reb
          Yea its the stinky stuff and I would not even use accept to oil the outside of the gun to keep it from rusting and I not sure its even good for that. The kit has everything you would need provided your gun has the synthetic parachute type seal. the kit has the spring, piston seal, 2 breech seals, trigger sear, trigger spring, cleaning rod and brass brush, cloth brush and the funky oil. if your gun has the leather seal and it is still good just soak in 30 weight motor oil. What I told you to do above is what BB instructed me to do when I built my 2 B-3s.


  13. B.B.,
    With visions of spring coils bouncing around inside my QB-36 I’ve been window shopping and ran across Crosman’s NP conversion.How difficult do you suppose it would be to use a gas spring in it?

    • Reb,

      It would be major machining, if possible at all. Gas springs and steel springs don’t even latch up the same. Steel springs latch in the center on their rods. Gas springs latch on the periphery of their pistons.


      • Well, many springers don’t have rods – the sear DOES catch the outside of the piston (Gamo and the Chinese B3 series come immediately to mind). I believe the QB36 might be in that same category.

        I still have the parts from my Gamo/Quest conversion experiment. The QB36 has a shorter spring than either of those, but a MUCH shorter stroke… so it may be possible.

  14. GF1 and Buldawg,

    The Bikini scope cover is black elastic and will fit scopes up to 62mm in diameter.


    They also make a mini version for small scopes, dot sights, etc. They are very inexpensive and actually work pretty good. Every time I get another scope, I pick up one of these.

    I absolutely hate those flip opens. They never seem to fit right and are always falling off or are in the way if you have to adjust anything.

    • RR
      I am not a fan of the flip open cover either, I have not tried the bikini covers but likely will. I do like the bungee cord one though because as I said before they are only on when the gun is stored and not when hunting or target shooting because they make the images through the scope blurry and distorted especially the ones with the yellow rear lens.

      I found the bikini covers on ebay for 10 bucks with free shipping so I will try them out.


        • Gunfun
          The gods are not happy with me, it is still raining here so another days wait to get to shoot and sight it and my new springer. I have the springer sighted in for my backyard range , but I want it to be sighted for 50 also because it has the power and fps to reach out that far accurately. I have plenty other for plinking and target shooting out back. I need a couple for long distance hunting guns.

          How is your HW50 doing, has it got better with more shoot thru it or are you tied up with your hi-pac conversations right now. I have decided to go with buying a whole 2240 instead of just the tube and guts because I think I can a least make my 20 buck difference back on the parts I don’t need on ebay.

          I am praying for the rain to stop for tomorrow.


          • buldawg
            Bummer about the weather.

            And thats the distance I sight my guns at to.

            And that is the 3 guns I have been concentrating on. The HW50 is a excelent gun. Its shooting real well. And yes it seems better everytiime I shoot it.
            And both of the 2240 conversion guns with the long .177 barrels just sip the air and still gets around 25 usable shots. I can get a bit over 30 shots on each gun but the POI starts dropping off.

            I did shoot the .177 & .25 cal. Marauders Friday also.

            I worked yesterday so I didnt get to shoot so Im ready today. Matter of fact going out right now. So talk to you later.

              • Gunfun
                I am glad you are happy with the HW and getting your 2240s sorted out. I wish it had not rained today also, but I think I have a back up plan. another friend has about 5 acres of land with a shop that has about 75+ yards before the tree line and railroad tracks. I am going to go over there to sight them in because I can setup inside the garage and shoot out the roll up doorway to the targets without having to be out in the rain. I will just have to shoot during the breaks in the heavy rain.

                I did not think about making a plinker out of the parts from my 2289 and the 2240. that’s has made me decide on the whole gun for sure. I will be shooting both the Hatsan and the springer tomorrow for sure rain or shine.


                • I’ve been shooting out my bathroom window for the last month, had to set up another back stop but it’s 20 yards without baking in the humidity and burning sun.

                • buldawg
                  Sounds like my place.

                  I shoot from a breese way. Its cool in the summer and warm in the winter. And I dont worry if its raining.

                  I think you will be able to concentrate better there when you shoot also.

                  Let me know how it goes.

                  • Gunfun
                    I just talked to my friend with the garage and he has a doctor appointment in the am but will be home by mid afternoon so I will be there tomorrow evening and Tuesday doing my testing. I have a back porch with a big ceiling fan where I normally shoot and try to do the shooting in the AM and PM when its not so hot. I wish I had a room that I could shoot out the window.

                    I just got the dickens scared out of me, I was filling my 4500 psi buddy bottle to take to my buddies to fill my gun with without having to take my scuba tank or hand pump and I had a 5000 psi burst disc on the output side blow out with the pressure at 4200 psi. I will be putting in a 7500 psi disc now as I have the paint ball regulator set with a solid spacer so its output side will be what ever is in the tank and I just fill slow and shut off at the pressure I want in gun. I guess 5k is to close to the 4500 tank rating on the output , the input is 7500 so I will put a 7500 in the out put also.

                    Yeah I will shoot rain or shine, I would think that heavy rain would hinder accuracy because of the rain hitting the pellet and destabilizing it. Will find out how much and let you know what pellets are best.


    • RR
      Thanks and I do have a couple of covers like that. But I’m sure they are not that brand. I guess they must of came with some scopes I got at one time. They are nice covers.

  15. Dear Tom,
    It must be a full time job answering all these questions!

    Hey what’s one more gonna hurt ?

    Would you be kind as to help me find a .177 co2 gun with high shot count and velocity around 500-600 fps.
    There are big gaps between the crosman 114, QB, and disco.

    Current runners are QB/9oz, XS60C pcp, brass crosman bulk fill, anything on a tether.
    I don’t need high power or good hpa performance, but a low power plinker with a gallery gun sort of feel.

    Your endorsement of the Daisy Targeteer as the “weakest bb gun ever ” was enough for me to want one for shooting flys in the house.
    A magnet on the roomba belly should help me recycle steel ammo too !

    Also wondering if there was ever a game like the ducks you knock over as they swim by?
    That bit should fill in the picture.

    Thanks in advance !

    • John in FL,

      Welcome to the blog.

      Have you considered the Crosman 1077? It’s a wonderful gun and can be converted to get hundreds of shots per fill with a small paintball tank.

      In fact, I think I will do a report on it, because there are many new readers who probably don’t know this fine airgun.


  16. buldawg
    Well that’s kind of crazy. I have now had my Benjamin carbon fiber buddy bottle for roughly 4 years or so. Nothing like that has happened yet.

    Was it a sudden burst or a gradual but fast leak down? I do not like that kind of stuff at all. High pressure air is scary if things go wrong.

    I fill my guns real slow when I transfer fill from a bottle. And the guns reservoir tube will still get warm. And if you think about it look how slow a hand pump or ShoeBox compressor fills. Its a very gradual fill. That’s why I always take the time to fill my guns slow.

    And I’m going to say something that other people may say I’m crazy when they hear it. But I like shooting in the rain or other weather conditions also. But its funny about rain. I have still got good groups when shooting in the rain. I don’t know why. Maybe the guns I have shot in the rain are shooting the pellet fast enough and I usually shoot a heavy pellet. Maybe that’s enough to help keep the pellet stable?

    I say try out your Hatsan and the break barrel gun in the rain. That way it will be one more condition that you will know how the guns perform in. And I think you will be surprised if you try it.

    • BB
      Do you think it was maybe just a faulty disc or is 4500 psi to close to the 5000 psi disc rating to cause it to blow. I am trying to use the 4500 psi carbon 68ci buddy bottle to fill my Hatsan to 2900 psi in the field without having to carry my scuba tank with me.

      You are saying that I should not put a 7500 psi disc on the output side of the tank, the input is 7500psi and I have the regulator spool valve set in a fixed position with a spacer in place of the spring and washers so it will output whatever is in the bottle to the gun and I just fill very slowly to shut it off at 2900 psi.

      Your thoughts on this setup.


      • Buldawg,

        Don’t make this more complicated than it is. If the tank is rated to 4500 psi, then you should not put more than 4500 psi into it at any time.

        Are you positive the gauges you use in filling are spot on at 4500 psi? Because if they are off, you may have tried to put 4800 psi into the tank, instead of 4300 psi. That could cause a disc to blow.

        It might have been a faulty disk, or the wrong disc could have been installed. How good is the configuration management of the company making the tanks? How about their quality control?

        Use the correct burst disc and install it per the specifications (i.e. torque the fitting to the correct torque).


        • BB
          I was only trying to fill it to 4500 psi which is what it is rated at, when I got the tank it was set up for paintball use with an output pressure set at 850 psi. It had a 1,8k disc on low side and is a 68ci carbon fiber tank. I am wanting to use it to fill my Hatsan to 2900 psi in the field. I had tried adjusting the valve with Belleville washer to output 2900 to 3000 psi, but to get that pressure on the output side with .042 washers would not allow me to get the bonnet screwed all the way on so I made a spacer to fit on the valve so it would not move and allow the output to be what ever was in the tank and I could fill slowly and shut off when gun is filled to 2900 psi.
          My gauge on the hand pump was reading just over 300 bar or around 4300 psi so I guess it may be a inaccurate gauge on the pump, I had not checked what the gauge on the tank was reading before the 5k disc that I replaced the 1.8 k burst.

          I was just going to fill to 4000 psi instead of 4500. Are you saying it would not be safe or wise to put a 7,5 K disc in the output side if only filling to 4500 psi. What are your recommendations on my choices.


            • BB
              What is not safe or wise filling to 4500 psi or replacing the disc from 5k to 7.5 k.
              What other route should I take to be able to fill in the field without having to carry the scuba tank in my truck when out shooting away from my house.


              • BD,

                Fill to 4500 psi all day long!

                Replace the burst disk to 7000 psi and you just defeated the burst disc design. Your disc explodes at a pressure above where the tank is rated to operate. That means the tank may explode to protect the burst disc!


                • BB
                  Ok I will just have to check my gauge on the tank as well as my pump to insure I don’t overfill, I really did not want to go to 7.5k disc but for the exact reason you stated that it removes the safety factor. I just did not think I was at 4500 psi yet but I know it was close. I replaced the burst disc with another 4500 one and will see what happens when filling to 4500 psi.

                  Hopefully it was a bad disc. Thanks for your input, because I do not want a bomb for sure.


  17. Gunfun
    I was filling the final 1500 psi with a hand pump so it was going slow as it was taking all my weight on the pump to get it to fill. I was at 300 bar on the pump gauge or just under 4300 psi. It was a fast blow of the disc that why it scared me so because it was fine then a loud pop and air escaping rapidly.

    I was going to shot in light or heavy rain as long as I am not out in it and the paper targets will hold up to being wet.


    • buldawg
      Take a old phone book and wrap it with some duct tape. And draw you some circles on it. Then you have a water proof target that can be used over and over. After you shoot just put some more tape over it where the holes are.

      Forgot I also cut a few pieces of 2×4’s and put on the back side and tape them up also. It works pretty good at containing the pellets also. And if you have targets and it ain’t raining you can take some masking tape and tape your target on it. That’s what I do.

      • Gunfun
        That may work for your phone books, but my book is barely 1/2 inch thick and it would take 5 of them to be any good. I have an old small eraser board that I picked up at a garage sale that has three legs and an adjustable height stand , the board is plastic so you can write on it and erase it easily so I was going to use paper targets until it rains then switch to duct tape like you said. The board is about 18 x 24 inches and I can adjust for height so I will be firing at it in a level line of sight. just getting my buddy bottle filled back up and waiting for my buddy to call telling me he is home to go shoot.

        Give you an update later tonight.


        • buldawg
          I think you would be surpried at how well it works.

          The phone book I use is only 1” thick. When you put the wood on back and duct tape it the pages are held tight together. And they are held tight to the wood. The pellet will mushroom and compress the pages and that turns into a bigger area of mass hitting the wood. Works resl nice out at 50 yards.

          • And the more you shoot at it the more pellets stay trapped in the paper.

            That helps slow the pellets down also and then when you keep adding more duct tape it will get stronger. And the more you shoot at it just keeps getting better at stopping the pellets.

            • Gunfun
              I did not get to go shoot today because my buddies doc appointment took longer and he had just got home around 6:30. I will be going tomorrow morning to sight in the 40 buck break barrel because he has another doc appointment at 11:30AM 50 miles away but Wednesday is for sure on the Hatsan.
              I am only sighting the break barrel in and not trying to find the right pellet because it seems to like the CP hollow points from wally world very well and they just got some Jim Shockey Benjamin’s in for 750 at 10 bucks so that is what it will get fed.

              The Hatsan is going to take longer because I am sighting it in as well as finding the best pellets.

              If my eraser board does not work well I will try your phone book trick with duct tape, I just threw out the old phone books a few weeks back, but got plenty of old cycle world mags that would work just as well so I will see what works best and let you know the results. I am just getting my buddy bottle pumped back up after the burst disc and am only going to go to 4300 psi instead of 4500. I got the scuba tank that I can get the bottle to 3000 psi with but have to pump the rest of the way to 4300.
              I think I may look into renting a tank from airgas as it will have 6000 psi in it and I think HPA and Nitrogen are the same cost. Just cannot afford a shoebox yet.


  18. BB

    I notice you using the TC90 dot sight on this rifle, would this sight be suitable/reasonable for use on my FWB 603?

    The stock aperture sights are great for 10 meter target but not so suitable for casual sniping.

    The pop-up loading port on the 603 precludes the possibility of mounting a scope but the rear sight has a 3 inch long dove-tail that might be suitable for a dot sight.

    Any suggestions?


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