Generation 2 .25 caliber Benjamin Marauder: Part 5

by Tom Gaylord
Writing as B.B. Pelletier

Benjamin Marauder air rifle Gen 2
Second-generation Benjamin Marauder in a synthetic stock.

Part 1
Part 2
Part 3
Part 4

This report covers:

  • Not the normal test
  • Trigger adjusted again
  • The goal
  • Velocity test — JSB Exact Kings
  • Early hiccup!
  • Striker adjustment 1
  • Striker adjustment 2
  • Change of plans
  • The rifle’s performance with this adjustment

This is a continuation of the test I’m running on the .25-caliber gen 2 Benjamin Marauder. So far I have evaluated the rifle as it came from the box, adjusted the trigger, installed the exciting new UTG 2-16X44AO Accushot scope and UTG rubber armored folding metal bipod, sighted the rifle in at 25 yards and installed the RAI modular stock and folding butt extension. Then I went to the 50-yard range — twice — and shot the rifle for accuracy. That was where I discovered that the .25-caliber JSB Exact Kings are the best pellets for this rifle. And the .25-caliber Benjamin domes that have no brand name are a close second.

Not the normal test

Veteran readers will see this is not the kind of test I usually run. Normally I describe the characteristics of a gun in Part 1, test the velocity with several pellets (and power settings when appropriate) and things like the cocking effort and trigger-pull in Part 2 and finish with an accuracy test in Part 3. I do it the same each time so readers will always know what to expect from one of my tests. But this Marauder is different. This is my personal airgun that Edie and I bought for extended testing and modification. I am testing it the way I would test something for myself.

I had already tested a .25-caliber first generation Marauder back in 2013. That test alerted me to the performance characteristics I could expect from this rifle, so many of the mysteries were already solved. Despite what you may think, there isn’t that much difference between the rifle I’m testing here and a first generation Marauder in the same caliber. The trigger was modified so it could be moved back in the frame, but the performance remains about the same.

Trigger adjusted again

I mentioned in Part 4 that I didn’t like the way the trigger was adjusted. Stage one was too long — probably because the hand grip of the RAI conversion places my trigger finger much closer to the trigger blade. This is the reason I don’t like an AR15 configuration that much. But I have fixed the trigger on my AR15 by installing a Guiseley competition trigger and adjusting it to suit my preferences. So, after the last test with this Marauder, I adjusted its trigger again. I adjusted stage one to be much shorter, which shortens the entire trigger pull. Then I adjusted stage two to release as light as I felt was safe for a sporting rifle trigger. It’s still above 2 lbs. at the release. There is still some movement in stage two, but it’s not the jerky feeling of trigger creep. It does make the rifle easier to shoot with precision.

The goal

There are two objectives to today’s test. First I want to see the velocities of the first 16 shots following a 3000 psi fill the way the rifle is currently set up. Only one pellet interests me — The JSB Exact King. I noted in both trips to the range that the first 8 shots were always more accurate than the second 8 shots. I want to see what those velocities are, and if they vary by a lot, which I strongly suspect.

The second goal is to adjust theΒ  striker spring tension to achieve a tighter velocity spread. I have been given lots of “advice” on modifications I can do to improve the power of this airgun, but that’s not what I want. Although I don’t know the numbers yet, I think it’s powerful enough for me as it is. I’m looking for 16 accurate and consistent shots. If I want sheer power I have a .25-caliber AirForce Escape that generates nearly 100 foot-pounds; I don’t need this Marauder to compete with that. The Benjamin domed pellets, which are only slightly less accurate than the JSB Kings, should follow along with any changes I make.

Velocity test — JSB Exact Kings

I filled the rifle to 3000 psi and loaded 8 JSB Kings into the magazine. The first shot was 850 f.p.s. on the nose, which means the rifle generates 40.47 foot-pounds at the muzzle with this pellet. While that is good, I can accept less power for more shots on a fill and greater stability. Here is the first shot string.

First string after a fill
Shot……..Velocity (f.p.s.)
1……………..850
2……………..850
3……………..853
4……………..847
5……………..843
6……………..845
7……………..841
8……………..839

The average for this first string is 846 f.p.s., which equates to a muzzle energy of 40.36 foot-pounds. The total spread is 14 f.p.s.

But the string tells me a lot more. The rifle is maxed out at the current setting. See how it rises only a small amount on shot 3, then goes into a steady decline? I know the next string will be both a steady velocity decline and probably a much greater spread from the first shot to the last. Let’s have a look.

Second string after a fill
Shot……..Velocity (f.p.s.)
1……………..834
2……………..831
3……………..825
4……………..819
5……………..814
6……………..807
7……………..800
8……………..791

The average for this string is 815 f.p.s. That works out to 37.46 foot-pounds. The total spread is 43 f.p.s. That is what I expected — both from the results seen in the first string and also from the targets shot at 50 yards on 2 different days. This is what I have to address to get the rifle more consistent.

Rather than selecting a desired velocity out of thin air and working to achieve that arbitrary number, I choose to work with what the rifle seems capable of delivering. At this point no adjustments have been made, but now they will begin.

First question — is my rifle maxed out as it came from the factory? To get more velocity I need more air — it’s a simple as that. But — and this is very crucial to understand — there are two things that control the airflow. The length of time the valve remains open is one, and that is controlled by the striker spring tension. The amount the air transfer port is open is the other. Both things have upper limits, so I need to find out where the rifle is right now.

Early hiccup!

The first thing I discovered is that even through the RAI stock folds to the side, providing access to the striker adjustment screw through a hole in the stock adapter, I did not have a 1/8″ Allen wrench long enough to reach through to the screw head. So, the entire RAI modular stock had to come off the gun. If I was going to adjust the striker spring a lot I would get a longer wrench, but once I get it adjusted where I want, I’m going to leave it alone.

Striker adjustment 1

I then turned the striker adjustment screw in 8 full turns. I was looking for the stop, but after 8 turns I decided to check the velocity. The rifle was filled to 3000 psi and here are the shots.

Shot……..Velocity (f.p.s.)
1……………..485
2……………..493

Striker adjustment 2

Obviously this wasn’t where I wanted to go. So I turned the screw out again until it was 1-1/2 turns in from where it was from the factory. I then finished the string of 8 shots.

Shot……..Velocity (f.p.s.)
3……………..792
4……………..792
5……………..792
6……………..798
7……………..795
8……………..798

This was almost exactly where I was hoping to be with this pellet! I reloaded the magazine and fired the next 8 shots.

Second string after a fill
Shot……..Velocity (f.p.s.)
1……………..800
2……………..802
3……………..802
4……………..804
5……………..805
6……………..808
7……………..807
8……………..808

This was looking very promising! The velocity was increasing, but at a very slow pace. So I reloaded and shot the third magazine of 8.

Third string after a fill
Shot……..Velocity (f.p.s.)
1……………..810
2……………..805
3……………..805
4……………..808
5……………..806
6……………..803
7……………..801
8……………..799

This is wonderful. I am now getting 24 shots on one fill with a maximum velocity spread of 18 f.p.s. Well, I can’t say that for sure, because the first 2 shots were with the striker adjusted differently. But at least 22 shots were achieved. However, I was inclined to adjust the striker once more and very slightly. I turned the striker adjustment screw out 1/4 turn and recorded the following.

First string after a fill
Shot……..Velocity (f.p.s.)
1……………..778
2……………..786
3……………..790
4……………..785
5……………..786
6……………..808
7……………..790
8……………..797

Second string after a fill
Shot……..Velocity (f.p.s.)
1……………..796
2……………..798
3……………..800
4……………..802

STOP

I stopped because the velocity had risen to the place I was after. Now I wanted to find out how much air was in the rifle, so I connected the air tank and opened the valve. The needle on the tank gauge stopped rising at 2500 psi. There was 2500 psi in the rifle!

Change of plans

I was running on a 2500 psi fill at this point. If I could get enough shots at my desired velocity, this was where I wanted to be. So I started recording the velocities again, this time from a fill of 2500 psi.

First string after a 2500 psi fill
Shot……..Velocity (f.p.s.)
1……………..799
2……………..803
3……………..803
4……………..804
5……………..808
6……………..799
7……………..811
8……………..808

Second string after a 2500 psi fill
Shot……..Velocity (f.p.s.)
1……………..807
2……………..808
3……………..807
4……………..808
5……………..802
6……………..803
7……………..802
8……………..801

The next shots after this second magazine were:

Shot……..Velocity (f.p.s.)
1……………..801
2……………..796
3……………..793
4……………..788

The rifle’s performance with this adjustment

My .25 caliber Marauder now gives me 2 complete magazines (16 shots) with a little extra on a 2500 psi fill. The average velocity with the JSB King pellets is 804.6 f.p.s., which produces 36.51 foot-pounds. I’ll take that and smile! The maximum velocity spread is just 12 f.p.s. I’ll also take that!

Yes I could get more power from this rifle and I could probably get 16 good shots at the same time. But not on a fill to 2500 psi. That’s what I want, because it’s all the power I need and I’m saving a lot of air.

A final benefit is that the rifle is MUCH quieter at this reduced velocity. I guess it was wasting some air before. I can’t wait to get back to the 50-yard range and see what this adjustment has done for accuracy.

134 thoughts on “Generation 2 .25 caliber Benjamin Marauder: Part 5







        • Vana2
          If they last 5 years before needing serviced as in replacing the o rings then in my opinion that is very acceptable life span and am more than willing to live with those service intervals for a much increased shot count and better velocity spread per fill and I will be finding out first hand as the 25 Brod ( bottled Mrod ) I have built has a regulator installed and I am in the process of tuning it right now.

          See slide show in reply to RR below for pictures of it

          BD


  1. BB,

    I don’t have a PCP (yet) and I’m trying to learn all that I can about them. After striker adjustment 2, you had 22 – 24 very consistent shots out of a 3000 PSI fill. At this point, why make further adjustments before testing accuracy with the striker 2 adjustment?

    I can understand the advantages of a 2500 PSI fill over a 3000 PSI fill if you are using a hand pump or if that is the rifle’s sweet spot. Are there any advantages to the lower pressure if you are filling from a scuba tank?

    Thanks,

    Jim



    • Jim,

      I could have said more about my choice for the final adjustment, but I see that you understand. Yes — it is very desirable to fill to a lower pressure if you get what you want in terms of velocity. You get more useful full fills per air tank. And you said that.

      And, yes, the way this rifle is set up it lends itself to using a hand pump, as well.

      B.B.


  2. I’ve always bought American made products! I want to continue to buy American? Provided I may purchase the quality I desire! German air guns, guns period are tops for me at this time! Your TESTS on most all your guns lean me that way? Until I see others test the same guns and sometimes when you retest or rewrite in another parts of the blogs! Now I ‘m not floating in money! But! I don’t mind paying for what I want and can usually do that! Got out once before! Don’t plan to get out again! And I’m to OLD to start tuning air guns again! But! Not to Old to learn! I’ll get to the age that all I might be able to do is tune in my shop? I know others that tune and shoot that have years on me! I don’t think I’ll be to old to have fun with air guns or shooting for that matter! Out of the box? Having some one to tune or tune myself? I spend hours daily on airguns, air gun blogs etc. learning! I do shoot powder guns also! BUT! Airguns are the main event! Thank you and all the reply’s on this blog for helping me enjoy, continue with my education in air gun world! Semper fi!



    • GF1,

      I didn’t touch the air transfer port. It is set as it came from the factory.

      Remember me telling you that I was testing this gun like I would for myself? Well, when something works, I don’t then make more changes, just to see where things are. I stick with that works.

      B.B.


      • BB
        If you open the transfer port screw up about 2.5 more turns you should still get consistent numbers with your velocity. Also the velocity should increase.

        Remember the transfer port adjustment is after the valve has done opened and closed to let air po ass to the barrel.

        It should not affect you tune. It should only increase velocity.


      • BB
        Just wanted to remind you. If somebody make a reply to a person’s comment and you delete it.

        Well that person still gets that email reply. You know know the one about the simple math.

        Just reminding you.


      • That is how I see it. Tune it down for longevity and ease of use. And being some form of mechanic most my adult life, I stay away from extra parts (also would not use a regulater).

        I wouldn’t buy a hybrid car for the same reason. Keep it simple stupid.


  3. to all
    I just got my 25 marauder together with the same stock and RAi setup as BBs rifle only I modified mine with a Wicked Air Rifles 550 CC bottled kit and their WAR valve with a Huma regulator installed. It is running with a 3500 psi fill with the regulator set at 2200 psi and a 12.5 # hammer spring set at zero tension and zero striker travel so it has full hammer travel at the lowest spring tension of the 12.5 # spring. I shot my first string today with H&N 31.02 grain pellets and recorded the following 32 shot string before it came off the regulator and got 5 more shots off the regulator.
    Lo = 876.6
    Hi = 903.8
    Avg = 890.2
    ES = 27.16
    SD = 5.56
    FPE = 54.57

    Shots
    1 = 903.8
    2 = 893.7
    3 = 899.9
    4 = 898.2
    5 = 896.8
    6 = 897.5
    7 = 892.6
    8 = 896.0
    9 = 889.1
    10 = 892.7
    11 = 892.4
    12 = 893.4
    13 = 886.0
    14 = 888.6
    15 = 887.1
    16 = 886.2
    17 = 880.9
    18 = 884.6
    19 = 888.3
    20 = 890.2
    21 = 885.7
    22 = 889.0
    23 = 996.8
    24 = 891.1
    25 = 889.3
    26 = 887.2
    27 = 893.4
    28 = 887.9
    29 = 888.3
    30 = 890.2
    31 = 883.7
    32 = 876.6
    off regulator
    33 = 886.0
    34 = 873.6
    35 = 871.4
    36 = 870.1
    37 = 861.5

    It is obvious that the 12.5 pound spring id to strong for the valve with the regulated pressure set at 2200 psi so I am going to put in a 10 pound spring and retest to see if I get the same fps with a longer string and possibly lighten the hammer weight as well or lower the regulator pressure but it looks pretty good for a starting string and I hope to tune for 40 shots at close to 70 fpe with the JSB 33.95 grain pellets shooting at approximately 960 fps.

    BD


    • If it were my gun, I’d be happy to enjoy this tune and tweak it in as many ways as is readily available on the rifle instead of rushing the project ahead to put someone in their place.
      Nice tune by the way!


      • Reb
        I am in no rush at all to put my fellow FT club member in his place by any means as this gun has a long way to go as far as it capabilities still. that was just the first string and is at the bottom of what the is truly capable of in terms od accuracy and power.

        Its shooting at stock 25 caliber marauder velocities and power right now and can be turned up to make double what it is right now and that is the end goal to take a good gun and make it a great gun for less than I can buy a great gun. Right now with what I gave GF1 for the gun and other items that I have sold to recoup most of my initial cost for the 25 and the WAR bottle kit and valve I have 1100 dollars in the gun total. once it is tuned to my goal of 70 plus fpe and 1 inch groups at 100 yards I will be where I want to be with it and then I will just enjoy it but I did not buy it to leave stock and enjoy a stock gun I bought it to modify into a high powered long range thumper and I will not be satisfied until that is what it is and I will still be at less than half the cost of the custom Rapid that I will out shoot with it and have the pleasure and satisfaction of knowing I built and tuned it myself instead of paying someone else to do it for me because by doing it myself I am learning to build better and better guns with every one I rebuild or modify on my own.

        I have never been one to just be satisfied with something as everything can be improved from what the factory builds as they are constrained by costs and time. I on the other hand am constrained by neither one as it may take time to buy all the item I need but it will get done just like my bikes as they took several years to build but when done they make me smile every time I ride them and blow the wheels off newer bikes that should be able to outrun mine but do not since they are not built with the attention to detail and experience that the years of being a mechanic has afforded me to put the right parts into a package that work as one well oiled combination.

        BD


  4. To all who responded,

    Thank you all very much…the advice and opinions were exactly what I was hoping for. I kbow that it would take a ton of space here to respond to each individual who offered up suggestions and/or advice ( I generally tend ti be a bit long-winded when writing anything anyway πŸ˜‰ ). So I think this form of thanks is better for in here
    The responses actually helped me greatly to narrow the selection quite a bit. Over the next couple of weeks I’ll likely make my choice, after more reading of current and archived posts and comments as well as reports and evals. But I gotta’ tell ‘ya, I see where I’m leaning so far.
    For the price, quality, accuracy, ease-of-tune, etc., I’m looking closely at the Diana.
    I know that the other choices mentioned by you folks are all very good rifles…and maybe at some future time I’ll buy one of them… (or 2, or… πŸ˜‰ ). But for me, at THIS point in time, I think the Diana may be better for my situation. When I DO actually finalize my decision I’ll let it be known here. Till then, I’ll continue to research.

    Thanks again, Denny.



    • Denny,

      That is great,….the best thing you could have done, and are doing,…is your homework. Get the fact’s, get opinions and make the choice that is best for you. Kind of like checking Cosumer Reports before you buy a car, mower, weed eater or coffee maker. Lucky for us, we have B.B. and “all” here to do just that! πŸ™‚


  5. BB and Buldawg,

    You guys have just demonstrated what I have been saying recently. You do not need 50000 PSI of air in your air rifle for great performance. I more and more am becoming an advocate of “low” air pressure. That is one of the main reasons I have begun to seriously consider a Marauder. The old timers did it with less than 1000 PSI. If I recall correctly, sproingers only develop about 1000 PSI.

    There is the advantage of more shots per fill with higher pressures, but it costs more to get to those higher pressures. The hammer spring, hammer, valve, etc. have to be more robust also. With the lower air pressures, it is easy to refill with a hand pump or if you use a tank, you get a bunch more fills per tank.

    I need somebody to build me a 1000 PSI open lock big bore. πŸ˜‰


    • RR,

      Gary Barnes built the outside lock (also called a Liege lock) that I reported in a blog. Gary understood how to get good velocity by timing the cam that holds the valve open.

      I have not seen another maker who was making a lock like that. Gary no longer makes airguns, as far as I know, so you may be looking for some time.

      B.B.


      • BB,

        Oh I know. Dennis used to build them also back in the late 90’s. He had a hard time selling them. I tried to talk to him about it, but he seems to still have a sore spot about them. If I could get some good drawings or even photos of the internal layout of the lock, I could probably build one. I may give it a try anyway. I think I have a pretty good idea how it works.

        I may even try to catch up with Mike Reames. He built a couple of outside lock CO2 rifles. They were knock open, but that could still work. I also think I know where that air rifle Gary Barnes built is and I think it can be had.


    • RR
      But that’s the thing about the Marauder.

      They can be tuned for high or low pressure as they come from the factory. You don’t need to put in a heavier striker hammer or a spring. The stock components will work just fine.

      Also with the transfer port adjusting screw you could ( if you wanted ) set the transfer port screw so a .177 caliber Marauder is a 12 fpe rifle and on up without even touching the striker and spring adjustments.

      I have my .25 Marauder balanced pretty good right now with the .31 grain Barracudas. And very accurate. I played with opening the transfer port up until I didn’t see anymore rise in velocity. Then adjusted the striker to full stroke and backed the spring all the way off. Then I started adjusting the spring to have more tension 2 turns at a time till I seen velocity come up. When the velocity stopped increasing then I was done. Shot about 3 fills through the chrony from 3200 down to about 1800 psi and watched what the velocity did. It stabilized at the highest velocity at 3100 fps. And it held with a 12 fps spread roughly ( I think I got one fill with a 16 fps spread) down to 2000. And yes its right on 900 fps on the last chrony I did over the weekend. Oh 24 consistent shots. I can shoot from 3200 down to 2000 psi also and get more shots per fill and I have not seen any accuracy change by using the full amount of fill pressure down to the low fill pressure.


      • GF1,

        I know you do not have to change out the hammer, etc. on the MRod. It was built that way to begin with. And yes, because it can be tuned easily is one of the main reasons I am seriously considering one. The down side is I will have to find a custom stock for it, but it will still likely be cheaper than a Daystate. Another down side is I will have to break down and buy my own chronograph.


        • RR
          You know you can just shoot it out of the box for a while before you get a chrony. They do shoot good that way.

          And what caliber do you think your going to get? And why a custom stock? I know you like walnut. But the adjustable comb is nice on the gen 2 Marauders.

          You know Lloyd was having that person make stocks for the Marauder at one time. Maybe Lloyd can hook you up with him and get you a good deal on a stock.


          • GF1,

            Why a custom walnut stock? It will probably be THE PCP in my “collection”. I want it to be eye candy.

            Crosman should bring out a nice looking version of the Marauder instead of trying to make it and every other air rifle they have look like a Mattelomatic. That is one of the reasons I do not own a Crosman.

            As far as caliber, that is a tough one. I have been leaning toward .25 for some time now, but I think .22 will actually serve me better.

            Of course I could just get me a RAW HM1000X in .357. πŸ˜‰


            • RR
              That’s why I asked why about a walnut stock. I know you always ask if a walnut stock is a option on guns all the time. I like walnut also. I do wish Crosman would offer it on a Marauder one time for like a anniversary edition or something.

              And I just have to say this. If you want a Marauder that can play multiple roles then look right at the .25 caliber model. You can plink with it. You can target shoot. You can ring the steel spinners. And you can hunt. And the .25 caliber will do all that out at farther distances than the other 2 calibers.

              Why I’m saying that is I have had the other calibers and the .25 is it is all I can say. And if somebody tells you that the other calibers shoot flatter then they ain’t got their .25 Marauder tuned right.

              Get a .25 caliber Marauder RR.


              • I have not ruled one out. I am well aware that I will likely have better performance at longer ranges with the .25. That is why I am building the Talon SS up in .25. If I keep the TSS, I will have a .25.

                Now the RAW HM1000X in .30 or .357 is really tempting, most especially because I like shooting long range, AND it is a nice piece of eye candy to boot.


                • I considered getting one of Hatsam’s Carnivores but a quick rundown on state game laws still prohibit taking anything other than squirrel and that’s what my .22’s are for. But I’d like to try a .25.


                  • You would get better down range energy and less affect from wind with the .25. I have been thinking about the Carnivores, but I have yet to try one or seen any in depth reviews to convince me it would be the way to go. Also, they are not very good eye candy. πŸ˜‰


                • RR
                  With out a doubt the RAW is a nice gun. But you could buy a couple Marauders for that price.

                  Maybe if you got lucky and found a sale you could get one of each caliber to see what the Marauders are all about.

                  .25 caliber Marauder RR. I’m going to keep saying that over and over till your mind finally says yes. πŸ™‚



                    • RR
                      Then maybe you should consider a used Marauder if your going to do all that changing around.

                      I can see putting a different stock on it to spiffy it up a bit. But that makes me laugh everytime when I hear people say their going to change this and that on a Marauder or other guns for that fact and they don’t even have one to see how it is from the factory. And shooting somebody else’s gun a couple times ain’t the same as having it a while to get use to it to see how it performs.

                      You know what I mean.



              • Reb
                I been eyeing the .30 caliber Hatsan myself.

                But if you do for some reason get a Marauder. Get the .25. The knock down power is crazy and they are accurate out at a good distance at that.



                  • RR
                    Yep I believe that is true.

                    So a thumbs up for Green Mountain barrels. Because the .25 Marauders do shoot good.

                    I wonder if they make the .177 Marauder barrels also. Their pretty accurate to.

                    Well then again the Discovery’s shoot good too. Had a few of those in both calibers.


    • RR
      Nope you don’t and my going the bottled route is not so much to increase the power of the gun although it is due to the WAR valve I installed but is mainly to increase shot count significantly over stock. the bottle I installed is 550cc versus the factory cylinders 215cc so it over twice as much air available to use for a higher shot count.

      I am still in the tuning stages so the results below are just the first string with it and I fully expect to increase shot count by at least another 20 to 25 shots while still maintaining a fps of mid 900s with 31 to 34 grain pellets and if I want all out power I can turn it up to shoot 45 grain pellets at 1000 plus fps for 100fpe but unsure of the accuracy at those velocities but I have a sampler pack of rat sniper slugs that are spitzer shaped bullets specifically made for 25 caliber air guns in the 31. 32.8. 37 and 45 grain weights and the seller has the same 25 Mrod I have built and says with a Jim Gaska ( Marmot Militia ) 24 inch barrel he is shooting the 32.8 gr bullets at 1010 fps with 3/4 inch groups at 75 yards.

      Here are picture of the Brod I have built.

      http://s1376.photobucket.com/user/buldawg76/slideshow/25%20mrod

      BD



      • Nice build! I met Jim and Tracy at the Fun Shoot this past spring. They had a Marauder set up like that and they also had the prototype of their .30 rifle.

        Being a pumper, that 3200 PSI sounds like a lot of work to me. πŸ˜‰


        • RR
          Thanks for the compliment, it is turning out quite nice so far and still in the early stages of tuning for the best overall power and accuracy as my goal is 70 fpe with 33 to 34 grain bullets/pellets.

          I don’t pump myself I let my shoebox do the pumping for me as yes 3500 psi would take me all day just to fill once and then I would be so worn out I would have to wait till the next day to shoot it. It is not a gun to hand pump at all and if I did not have a shoebox the project would not have been considered at all.

          BD


  6. I feel the same way about regulators, at our UK power limits we get many more shots anyway, My AA S400 classic gives over 100 shots on a fill and 65 of those are in an 8fps sweet spot, it’s just learning where it is….I tend to find regulated guns give a greater shot count at expense of a bit of shot to shot consistency…..if that makes sense…ie my AA would give me 90 shots at a 15fps average difference…
    I know what I mean πŸ™‚


  7. BB, J-LEE,REB< BD–and others who have or are interested in IMC PIONIER rifles–I wondered why my pionier was much more accurate with Crosman box premier pellets than any other pellets that I tried. I looked at the breech and I saw that it was cut on an angle, like BB,s Diana 23 and my D 22. The short Crosman pellets seated flush , the skirts of the other pellets protruded at the bottom. Then I remembered what BB said– " if the breech is angled, deep seat or the pellet will be mangled". Well, if he did not say it, he should have could have said it. Deep seating improved the accuracy , but not as much as I would have liked. I also found that this gun has a safety that I like (a rare occurrence). It can be put on when the gun is uncocked, or when the barrel is broken, or after the gun is loaded and cocked. It is easy to put on and take off and it prevents the dreaded beartrap, when it is on. How reliable it is in this regard, I can,t say for certain. You can,t reliably judge a gun from only one example, so I hope other owners of Pioniers will write in with their opinion. Ed


  8. BB,
    I’m one of those who still likes to pump their own air so I’m considering a Daisy 953. You mention partial pumping to get the velocity up. About what FPS did you get with 2 partial pumps?

    Thanks,

    Brent


    • Brent,

      What a memory. The partial pump (for a single stroke pneumatic) was to make the pump head more flexible — not to pump more air into the gun. A flexible head pumps the greatest amount of compressed air possible. I believe that with a pistol I was getting a 60 f.p.s. boost.

      B.B.


      • B.B.,

        Let me get this straight, are you saying that by doing some partial strokes on a break barrel or an under lever will get get more FPS? ( heat’s the seal up, making it more flexbable and better sealing? ) If so, any gain would require the shot to be taken fairly quickly before the seal hardened again. Just a guess, but first I have heard of this. If so, 2?, 5?, 10? partial pumps? I would think that it would need to be fairly quick stokes.

        Chris


        • Chris
          They are talking about single pump pneumatic gun not break barrel or underlever spring guns like your TX or LGU. They are talking about the daisy 880s, 753,853.953. and crosman single stroke pump guns.

          BD


          • BD76,

            Obviously I am not up to speed on the subject. While not sure still, am I to take that instead of the compressed air being exhausted in 1 shot,…..the single pump of air is stored and then has a regulated release, such as a PCP would have? Very confused,….. ;(


            • Chris
              A single stroke pneumatic exhaust all of its air with each shot and requires a single pump for each shot. I have not heard of the short stroking method either so I myself am not sure just how it would work to add any more to the amount of the pressure of the air compressed in the single stroke as you are not pulling the lever far enough back to allow for more air to be added to be compressed un less there is a slight leakage past the piston cup or o ring when partial cocking to allow for a miniscule amount of air to be added to the compression reservoir and in turn increase the volume and/or pressure of that compressed air to increase the velocity. when shot.

              BD





                    • Reb
                      A car engine gets way hotter than a single pump gun ever will unless you short stroke it 50 to 100 pumps to get the temp up and we are talking a difference of plastic piston seal or o ring versus steel piston rings and aluminum pistons so there is no comparison between the two in that respect of getting it warmed up.

                      BD


              • BD76,

                Forgive me, that sounds like any break barrel, side lever or under lever to me. (( OR )) is it a single stroke of compressed air that is (stored),…and then released by a (valve)?

                Sorry, I just am not aware of this.


                • Chris
                  Its just a single stroke of a lever that stores air in a valve that when you pull the trigger it opens the valve and releases the air so think of it as a PCP that has to be pumped every shot instead of storing a large volume of air in a cylinder it stores only enough air in the cylinder ( valve ) for one shot per single pump and then you have the Benjamin’s and crosman multi pumps that you pump up to 10 pumps per shot depending on the power you want per shot only a single stroke pump gun only has the one power setting as if you pump it twice it still only compresses the same volume of air as the valve is open to the atmosphere at the pump arms fully open end of the pump stroke so any air compressed in the first pump is released at the full extension of the second stroke.

                  So the only way you could gain air pressure or volume is two short stroke it very fast in hopes that a little seepage can be attained past the seal or o ring to add a little more air and increase volume and pressure with the stroke if I am understanding the method correctly myself.

                  BD


                  • BD76,

                    Thanks. Was not aware that such things existed.

                    Count on me to ask the “dumb” or “obvious” questions. But!,….in my defense,…as the B.B. man has said many times,…if “one” ask,…then there is many more (unheard) asking the the same thing.

                    Glad to be of service. Really, I am. Cause you know what, I AM asking, and I am learning! πŸ˜‰ Chris


                    • Chris
                      No problem as I am still learning as well I just have a slight head start since being a mechanic for 45 years and fixing everything that rolls down a road.

                      Look up in PAs site the daisy 753.853.953 or when you hold your cursor over air rifles click on pumpers and then single stroke pumpers and you will see the guns they are talking about.

                      BD



                • You got it that time! My 953 will produce the samepower andmatch 10 pumps on my 760 but that’s ’cause I’m putting all that air in there in one stroke and yeah, no kidding about the fingers!



                  • B.B.,

                    I made a comment on today’s (8/26) blog. Thank’s for the offer. I figured it out. I had a 10 pumper as a kid. Sorry, maybe a little too focused on springer’s? I promise to do better on my “studies”. πŸ˜‰ I guess the context of the comments is what “threw” me.

                    Chris



        • With a single stroke pneumatic it all about getting the pumparm closed very quickly against the pressure building in the chamber more and more the closer you get toward the end of the stroke(Watch yer fingers!) My 953 is fun because it’s so accurate but I wouldn’t wanna take it to a 10m competition because that’s a lotta work!


          • Reb
            I have a 853 in a 753 tiger wood stock that was given to me by my gunsmith that did some work on my 1400 for me but it only shoots at mid 500 fps and my grandsons 760 will shoot at 800 fps at 15 pumps but then I have modded the valve and put in a flat top piston and flat topped the valve with a different valve spring so it is a full dump gun and has to be cocked to pump it up as the hammer spring holds the valve open when not cocked.

            My 853 is also a very accurate 10 meter gun but its only good to 25 yards at best.

            BD


            • You forgot about swapping to a longer barrel too.
              I pushed my 953 out past 40yds when I had my Tasco Pronghorn on it and it stayed on paper with some adjustments but I’ve taken a couple Crackles with it inside 20.


              • Reb
                What about swapping to a longer barrel, do you mean you did on yours or I did on the 760 as I put a rifled barrel in it but its the same length as the smooth bore barrel so no added length to the barrel in the 760 to add velocity.

                My 853 just does not have the power to be accurate past 25 yards as it will hit past that but not accurately.

                BD



                  • Reb
                    No the grandsons 760 has had the barrel replaced with a rifled barrel from the late seventies when they had rifled barrels but it is no longer than the smoothbore that came out of it.

                    The mods to it are the flat top piston and valve and lighter valve spring so that the hammer spring is stronger than the valve spring and holds it open unless its cocked to allow for it to be pumped up. The valves internal volume was opened up by about 25% to increase air volume for the compressed air charge. Then the transfer port is opened up to 7/64ths of an inch or 75% of bore diameter which is the optimal port size for the most velocity and power in a pneumatic gun whether its a PCP or pump gun. and then of course polishing of trigger parts to improve the feel and release when firing so it is capable of being pumped up to 20 pumps for max power and anything over 20 does not give any more gains so at 20 pumps it is shooting just shy of 800 fps. My grandson usually pumps it to 12 to 15 pumps so that is in the area of 700 to 750 fps out of it which makes it a very accurate little gun out to 40 yards with the 3 x9 x32 scope on it.

                    Its my 1400 you are thinking about with the longer barrel as it has a 24 inch disco barrel on it since the original barrel of 20 inches has no rifling left in it from hundreds of thousands of pellets being shot thru it over 10 plus years of use and abuse by a teenage hunter who used it and put it up wet, dirty and was not so concerned about it proper care as having all the fun that could be had in the least amount of time possible.

                    BD


      • BB
        A 953 like Brent is talking about uses am o ring on a lactic piston so there is no pump head or cup to make more flexible by short stroking as you say unless I am missing something as the o ring I what is doing the sealing not the plastic piston pump head. So its more a matter of keeping the o ring well oiled than creating heat to soften up the piston seal cup like my 1400 uses.

        Or I am missing the process you are referring to here.

        BD


        • The piston is the pump head it’s just sealed with an o-ring, remember the piston cup fill mod? That of trade air volume for higher pressure because that cup is part of the compression chamber.


          • Reb
            My 853 does not have a cup in the head of the piston as it is perfectly flat so no need to fill the head in and sand flat as it is flat already. I did make a little disc pellet out of a RC car body mount bolt which is just a nylon bolt that sits inside the spring in the valve body that hold the valve poppet closed till the hammer opens it so that the disc pellet takes up air volume to reduce the amount of air space inside the valve chamber so when pumping it will increase the pressure due to less air volume but it still only shoots around 550 fps. that mod gave me that 50 fps more as before that it was shooting 500 fps which is what Daisy show them to shoot at stock.

            BD




  9. B.B.,

    Please clarify one point for me. The new stock sold by RAI that you have installed is the one titled Gen2 Benjamin Marauder Modular Chassis correct? It has nothing to do with the one sold by Teryx? I just can’t tell from your pictures.

    G&G


    • G&G,

      RAI was asked by Teryx to streamline and lighten their modular stock. When they produced a better stock, Teryx offerred to sell them the company and they bought it.

      Then they designed their modular stock I have. It’s both lighter and less expensive than the gen 2 Teryx was.

      B.B.


      • BB
        I have a question for you on the RAI stock as I have the same stock with my bottle kit from wicked air rifles and when I assembled the gun I notice that the action is canted slightly to the right in the stock with the single stock screw tight. I am unsure if it is the stock being machined slightly off of centerline in relation to the mounting screw or if the wicked air rifles air tubes trigger mounting and barrel/ cocking arm slots have been machined and drilled off the centerline so that it has the action canted in the stock.

        When I have to remove the bottle and drop down adapter to adjust the regulator I was going to install the action into the factory synthetic stock to see if I could determine if it is the RAI stock or the wicked air rifles ait tube being incorrect but thought if you could tell me if your factory action sits straight up in the RAI stock would give more info as to it being the wicked air rifles ait tube being machined and drilled off of the centerline in relation to the RAI stock mounting hole. I have noticed that there is some rotational movement of the action in the RAI stock since the trigger does not actually sit against the stock ay the bottom like the factory stock but rather is contacted on the upper edges of the RAI stock and the mounting screw only holds it tight against the side of the stock.

        Any info you can give me would be helpful in determin9ng if it is the RAI stock or the wicked air rifles air tube.

        BD



          • BB
            The stock used by wicked air rifles is made for them by Dave Rensing of RAI so its the same stock you have the only difference is the air tube that wicked air rifles is shorter by about two thirds as it is an 1/8′ short of the end of the modular stock and was why I asked if your had any cant in the action when in the modular stock as I am trying to determine if it is the modular stock that has the mounting hole slightly off which I doubt greatly or the air tube is not made exactly perpendicular in relation to the modular stocks mounting hole position.

            Since you have no noticeable cant which you can see by looking at the two side retention screws holding the valve in the tube and look to see if they are basically even with the top edge of the stock on both sides as mine is visibly noticeable that the right screw head is lower down inside the edge of the stock than the left one is and when looking at the action from the rear of the gun with the gun supported level it is noticeable that the scope mounting rail is not level with the stock so you can see the action is canted by about a 1/32″ to the right.

            BD


      • B.B.,

        Got it. I also noticed on RAI’s website they are no longer selling the one made by Teryx. Now I know why.
        Your’s is a great looking stock. Seems as though you like it very much.

        Thanks,

        G&G


  10. Made it to Wally’s and found 750 Benjamin hollowpoints for $5, they’re much more reliable than I recall the CPHP’s being back in Abilene and accurate enough at under 10m to reset my targets.
    I guess 1000+ rounds makes a difference!


  11. Hi B.B.,

    I plan on coming to the show this Saturday. I am wondering if folks can get in early by paying the table fee like last year? And what time that would be.

    Looking forward to it.

    Mark N


    • Mark,

      Yes, they can. The club was surprised when some people did that last year and I had to explain that’s the way it goes at good airgun shows. Of course they had never seen that many people at a show before, either.

      If you have any problem, because the gate is not the building door but it’s farther away from the building this year, just tell Darrel Clark that Tom Gaylord said it would be okay for you to pay the early buyer’s fee.

      B.B.


  12. Some her may remember me shimmng the back of the scope in my Benjamin Regal last week, well today I stripped it down to see how to tighten it’s barrel joint and found a screw to tighten.
    1st 5 shot group was 5/16″ or 8mm ctc with 4 in one hole that looks like a .22 round made it! With box store pellets.
    My range is limited to 8yds but I had no idea this thing would shoot like that halfway through a trigger mod.
    Thanks Gunfun1!


    • Reb
      Did you blue Loctite the pivot screw so it will not loosen up again as if you did not clean the oil off of it and Loctite it you will have to tighten periodically with use.

      BD



      • I injured my left shoulder cocking it once and set it aside for a while to heal but we were talking about variable scopes and poi changes with magnification changes and I pulled it out to participate in a joint study and it came back to life. I ran outta 10.34’s and had nothing else I thought it would tolerate but it’s looking like it’s gonna be accurate enough with whatever I feed it, and my resettable target likes it so it’ll probably be getting a lot more attention. I found the trigger parts I pulled out so long ago and will be finishing the trigger mod after the show.
        The softer pellets look almost like fireworks through the scope! πŸ™‚




          • I borred the breech seal from my QB-36 and took a few shots through the QB-88. It’s gonna be a keeper!
            Got 3 wood furniture 760’s( one pumping air so far) a buncha 880’s a few 2100’s & 766’s the American Classic, a buncha little Daisy BB guns and booku parts.
            I’ll post as I get em sorted out.


            • Turned out to be 30 guns and a bunca parts but like I was thinking there’s a few gems in there like the QB-88 and Daisy 120 & a couple 1894’s I think I’ll get one outta the 2, the spring’s still strong in the one that fires but no barrel in it the other has a dirt dinner nest in the muzzle and only Vicks halfway.


            • That was supposed to be borrowed and it turns out that this QB-88 IS substantially harder to cock & hits hard enough to reset my targets but I gotta get a study to keep elevation right. Buncha projects that will give me something to do when I gotta close the doors this winter!


      • I took both it and the Impact but didn’t get to use the range. I wanted to shoot the Texans but I guess you gotta be louder on the range than I was comfortable being.
        B.B talked me into taking a sit down break with a Diana 25 that was a sweet dish! But instead of pulling the money off my card when I reserved the room it came off when I checked in so I had only $200 to play with.



    • Reb
      The Martians are coming so you better hide and be ready to put your rabbit ears on to tune into their radio waves so you will blend in and they will pass you by when the abduct their test subjects.

      BD


  13. I love my Marauder…

    I can tune it for .177 10.6-grain H+N Barracudas at about 19 ft-lbs, and get 30+ shots per fill with about 13 fps max. variation. The same (or similar) tuning can shoot .22 14-grain pellets at 24 ft-lbs with about 20 fps variation, and all I do is twiddle the velocity screw (I cut back a notch on the synthetic stock to gain access to the screw without having to remove the action from the stock).

    But I hate it too… Tried to convert my .177 to a .22, with little success (tried two different Crosman .22 barrels). It would shoot 1-1/8″ groups on average, at 30 yards, but no better with any of 12 different “precision” domed pellets from a variety of manufacturers. I’m going back to the .177 for now, I know I can hold 5/8″ groups at 30 yards and around 1″ groups at 50 yds with it. Maybe someday I will pony up the money for an aftermarket .22 barrel.


  14. Remember I’ve been saving for this show for about a year? I’m gonna have to unload the rest tomorrow.
    I did get a Crosman 2200 and a couple more worthy of honorable mention but I’ll tell more later.


    • Truth be told, I’m the one that got the grab-bag. I noticed a buttstock that looked a lot like a FWB300 sticking out of the top of a trashcan full of guns, when I pulled it out I couldn’t find any markings but I asked if the vendor knew and he didn’t either them I asked “what’s the deal with the guns in this barrel?”… Gimme $100 & I’ll take em to your car!
      I’ll be busy this winter!
      I think it was a TS-46 that caught my attention but it was on top of the trashcan and on bottom in the trunk.
      We’ll have to find out more manana cause my dogs are barking’!


      • Reb
        What was the grab bag suppose to be? You got one gun out of it. But you bought the whole thing for a hundred bucks?

        Well then if so you got to tell about what was inside.


  15. BB,

    Thank you so much for the detailed instructions on tuning this gun. I have a few questions though… After Striker adjustment 2, it looks like you would have obtained 24 shots going from 3,000psi to 2,000psi, with a maximum velocity spread of maybe 20 f.p.s. To me, this seems like a better setup than what you ended up with, as you would get more shots with less SD. Am I missing something here (entirely possible!), or is there a reason for your additional adjustments?

    Also, I am considering a new .25 Marauder and would ideally like to end up with results similar to what you got after making Striker adjustment 2. What is the best way to do this? (And feel free to tell me to move along if this is too time consuming to explain – no feelings will be hurt.) Based on your procedures above, it looks like it would be best to fill the rifle, adjust the port screw to get a velocity of about 800fps, and then adjust the hammer spring preload to get a tight bell curve over 24 shots. But this seems too simple, and THINGS NEVER GO SIMPLE FOR ME!!!

    Thanks!


    • Gear_Junkie,

      I reported what happened. Sometimes what people think and what actually is, are different. I need to spend more time with the striker length adjustment. I am planning another report after I adjust the gun one more time. Maybe I will get it right then.

      Things are never simple for you? That’s what is happening to me with this rifle. You are seeing my discoveries in real time, instead of me telling a complete story start to finish. Hang in there.

      B.B.



    • Buldawg76

      there are two regulators 1 altros and huma
      i want to get 900 to 950 FPS with JSB 25.39 grain at least 16 or 24 consistent shots.

      what is your advice and recommendations to get desired target.

      thanks


Leave a Reply