by Tom Gaylord
Writing as B.B. Pelletier
Benjamin 392 multi-pump pneumatic.
This report covers:
- The rebuild
- The test
- Test 1
- Analysis of test 1
- Test 2
- Analysis of test 2
- Test 3
- H&N Baracuda Match
- JSB Exact Jumbo Heavy
- Analysis of test 3
Today we look at the Benjamin 392 that has been resealed. The first report was done on the gun as it came from the pawn shop. All I did was oil the pump head with ATF Sealant and then test the gun. It’s been a long time since Part 1, so you may want to read it again. In the last test I said this was the fastest 392 I have ever tested.
The rifle responded well to ATF Sealant. I will run those number with today’s test figures for comparison.
I sent the gun to reader Jeff Cloud for a rebuild. He is the guy who rebuilt my Sheridan Blue Streak a couple years ago.
I was just thinking new seals, but when he examined the valve body Jeff told me it was aluminum and had welded itself together, so a new valve was needed. He ordered a brass valve body replacement from John Groenewold. So this rifle I’m testing will be different from the previous one. A pneumatic valve in an air rifle is like the engine in a car — change it and everything changes.
I will test the rifle with the same pellets that were used in the last test. And I will run the same tests. Let’s get started.
This is the velocity of the rifle with Crosman Premiers on 3 to 8 pumps.
6……………569 no air remains
7……………596 no air remains
8……………624 some air remains
In the test of the rifle before the valve was replaced, these are the numbers.
6……………599 no air remains
7……………632 no air remains
8……………652 no air remains
Analysis of test 1
The new valve is not as hot as the previous one. However, it is hotter than the factory new valve in my Benjamin 392 pump assist rifle that tops out at 608 f.p.s. on 8 pumps.
How consistent is the new valve? Here are 10 shots on 4 pumps.
Analysis of test 2
The velocity with the new valve on 4 pumps varied by 29 f.p.s. The previous valve varied by 53 f.p.s. in the same test, so the new valve is more consistent. I’m thinking there may be some breaking in of this new valve before optimum performance is realized. I say that because all of the shots in test 2 are faster than 4 pumps in test 1 with the same pellet.
The last test. Let’s see how the gun does with two other pellets.
H&N Baracuda Match
First up was Baracuda Match with 5.51mm heads.
JSB Exact Jumbo Heavy
Now let’s look at the rifle on JSB Exact Jumbo Heavy pellets.
Analysis of test 3
In this test the lighter pellet was more efficient. It produced more muzzle energy. That shouldn’t happen in a pneumatic. That fact, coupled with the air that remains after 8 pumps, suggests to me that the striker spring is weak. If this was my rifle I would replace the spring. However, I got the gun resealed in trade for the B3 underlever, so I am done with it. That probably sounds harsh to some of you, but I have already spent more money than I wanted to, just getting this rifle resealed. It now performs in the range of a new 392, so my part of the bargain is finished.
I plan to shoot the rifle for accuracy at 10 meters. Since it’s a .22, there is a wide range of premium pellets to choose from.
This test and the next one is setting us up for the surprise I mentioned a week ago.
125 thoughts on “Revitalizing a Benjamin 392: Part 2”
The old striker spring most probably looked straight and true. What is usually overlooked is that the spring of the new valve will most likely give more resistance than the old valve spring. As you said “A pneumatic valve in an air rifle is like the engine in a car — change it and everything changes.” Balancing those springs are time consuming and is probably not worth the trouble on a rifle that is going back to be sold. Eventually with use the springs might come to balance anyway.
Sorry for going off topic, but get a load of this: It appears your all-time favourite air rifle, the Diana 27, is being relaunched as a special edition model!
The new 27 will be a modernised version of the classic air rifle, a bit heavier than the original at 7 lbs, but fitted with a 6“ scope rail, proper iron sights (no glowy thingies) and best of all, the T06 trigger.
A limited number of ex-demonstration models in .22 cal are available at the moment. Do you think you could get your hands on one and test it for us?
I reckon more than a few of us readers would be keen to see if the new 27 can recreate the magic of the original, or even exceed it.
I will look into this. This new rifle may carry the model 27 name, but I doubt it’s the same gun., I doubt the ball-bearing trigger has been retained. So it’s probably more like a modern Diana 28 than a vintage 27. But I’ve been wrong before, so we shall see.
Is the vintage ball-bearing trigger better than the T06 in your opinion?
It’s not better — just different.
And yes, let’s hope it’s the real deal and not an attempt to cash in on nostalgia for the vintage 27.
It is an attempt to cash in on nostalgia. Everyone else is after the Baby Boomer Bucks, why not Diana?
“Hahaha!” laughs the Baby Boomer, who will hold on to his Boomer Bucks till B.B. does a test on one of these new 27s and gives his opinion on it versus his old tried and true model. =D
I’m having difficulty finding the model 27 in the U.S. I am going to ask PA.
It does have the no glowy thingy sights going for it. I am certain it is really nothing like the original Daina 27, but it still might be a pretty nice air rifle.
BB has confirmed it’s not based on the original model 27. That’s a pity, but hopefully it’s a good performer in its own right. Here’s another photo of it.
OK, you have my attention. I would much rather have an original, but if this one is in the same ballpark, this should be sweet. Where do we go to find what I am sure is limited information about these?
Try googling “Diana 27 T06 Sondermodell” on Yahoo and you’ll find some info on this model.
Off-topic, but again and again I find myself looking at the Diana Chaser Rifle version and drooling on my computer keyboard. It looks like it is straight out of an episode of The Man from U.N.C.L.E. (And I mean that as a compliment.)
If you were to test the rifle version of that, I, for one, would not complain (Hint, hint.)
I am certain Napoleon Solo and Illya Kuryakin would have been proud to carry this. It might even turn James Bond’s head. Most certainly have Maxwell Smart’s attention.
As long as B.B.’s accuracy testing doesn’t include the phrase, “Missed it by THAT much!” That would be disappointing.
LOL! Oh, I don’t know. It would be appropriate, although I do hope it is accurate. Being able to swap out barrels will allow you to use the barrel of your choice, including a LW. For the price, if you can kill feral soda cans with the pistol at 25 yards and with the rifle at 50, what more do you want?
I wonder (Hope) if one springs for the multi shot magazine,can you still see the open sights, or would the mag block the view.
On the stormrider the mag is not in the way and it all looks similar enough that I don’t think it will here, either. That rear sight is one of the few good features on the stormrider, IMO. The mags don’t hold up well. They have a tiny set screw that adjusts the tension on the clear rotating rear face. A groove is quickly worn in this plastic part and then it has to be re-tensioned, rinse, repeat. With improper tension the plate flops around on each shot and obstructs the bolt on the following shot. They are cheap though.
I wonder if any type of lubrication would help the plastic? Silicone or maybe even a thin grease? Probably wouldn’t but I thought I’d ask anyway. I had a S&W 22a 22LR piston that the slide was wearing a small grove on one side of the frame (alloy frame). Gun oil would do nothing. Then a gun friend of mine (Air Force Vet Cryptanalysis and former trainer) told me grease worked great in a lot of gun applications (very sparingly). I put grease on it and the wear stopped (or slowed so much it wasn’t noticeable). I know this is just a plastic to metal part you are talking about, but maybe?
It might work. I’ll give it a try the next time I have it out.
That sounds like one strike against this entire Diana/Snow Peak line. They are going to have to correct that issue if they expect this to keep going forward.
Have you thought of putting a small washer on that screw to provide a bearing surface?
You may be thinking of the screw that forms the axle of the rotating cover and doing something there may be the answer, but the screw that is scratching the groove into the underside of that cover is out near its periphery and passes through the body of the mag. It adjusts the force that is exerted inside a small detent that is responsible for holding that face plate in alignment.
That problem also pales in light of some of the other ones that I have had to deal with on this gun.
It does indeed sound like Diana is going to regret putting their name on the Snow Peak line. The short term reviews have been pretty good, but if your experiences are any indication of what is to come…
When I first heard of this I suspected the first run quality out would be pretty good so as to get everyone’s attention, but they may already be taking shortcuts to meet production and allowing the quality control to slip.
To me,… I would separate the Diana name from the China stuff. A lot of companies make a primo product and sell it under their name and (also) make/sell another product that is more budget friendly and yet still gets the job done for the average user,…. but is under a (different) brand. Diana has too long a history and reputation to be slapping their name on China stuff,…. IMHO.
Maybe a little file work on that screw end to take off any sharp edges may help.
If you remember, a while back I was having an issue with the magazine in my Urban. Once in a while the pellet didn’t load into the chamber on first try. I had to fiddle with the mag a little and then it would load okay. I think the problem stemmed from my not pulling the bolt back all the way till it stopped. I don’t have that problem any more.
Anyway, I did take the magazine apart to see how it functioned. It’s a very simple design with no adjustment for alignment. When I was reassembling the mag I noticed a light scoring mark on the back piece which is metal. After further investigation I discovered that the end of the tension spring was just a tad high where it came through the little hole. I used a file to remove about .030″ and that did the trick. I also applied a thin coat of silicone grease to the metal plate and the plastic front piece. The mag rotates smooth as butter now and I haven’t had a problem with it since. I assume the Stormrider mag is also rotated with a spring?
Me too on Dana Chaser Rifle. If Diana is aiming at the accurate Crosman Custom airguns I want one.
And while your at it, maybe test the pistol version too
I plan to. I said that back when I first saw it at SHOT.
Getting the feeling that this Diana has piqued more than a little interest? :^)
Before the clunky (to my eye) add-ons of today’s modular sniper rifles, movies and TV depicted them as sleek, modernist, elegant, viper-like mechanisms kept in briefcases and quickly assembled on hotel bedspreads. The stuff of U.N.CL.E., Bond, Flint, Mission Impossible, Banacek, Peter Gunn, and so on.
To me this has that black tie tuxedo and two-olives-Martini look: “I admire your courage, Miss? Trench, Sylvia Trench. I admire your air rifle Mr.? Bond, James Bond.”
Thank you Sir. It muat have slipped by me
I mentioned it the other day that they in a sense coppied the 2240 and the modability of it.
But they took it one step farther and made it a kit. Crosman has the custom shop guns of course. But with the Diana gun you can get it wherever you want.
If it’s accurate and dependable it should definitely make some manufacturers aware and take note. I hope.
That does look sweet. I was thinking it was pistol or rifle, not both! My bad. I saw the word kit, but I didn’t read, just figured it meant the rife would come with some C02 carts, pellets and such.
So why ain’t this one popular.
Think I know why.
Hmm picture didn’t post.
I have kept thinking about the Morph ever since it came out years ago. It’s the accuracy in a plinking BB gun that always has me considering it. But I am less of a rapid fire guy than I am a load, cock, aim guy, even when it comes to ridding my back yard of soup cans.
Once I try out Dust Devils, however, my whole metal-plinking world might expand considerably. :^)
Bet it would be a fun plinker.
And just think if it shot pellets instead and ean on hpa.
You would know much better than I (and a good number of the rest of us) about the HPA possibilities that might already be out there from the many aftermarket 22XX series modifications online sellers. How many options are there to convert a Crosman CO2 pistol/carbine into a PCP?
The big questions probably have to do with threading, tube diameter, and such.
Start (no pun intended) bulking up the profile of the Chaser, and its appeal goes away for me. I like that it’s sleek and elegant. Extend that tube, and I would no longer be interested.
Google “2240 hpa conversion’s”. Then click on images. You won’t believe how much is out there for the 2200 guns.
Check it out and let me know what you think.
It’s bewildering to look at!
The Chaser just looks incredible! And it looks incredible in a way things aren’t designed to look like anymore. It’s a throwback. It is much more Julie Newmar than Julia Roberts.
I am drawn to airguns for different reasons than are many others. To me hunting (hence power) is of no consequence. Looks, you bet! A replica of a childhood favorite from movies and TV, absolutely! Fun to shoot (which also requires a minimum of accuracy), no question. Extreme accuracy, of course.
And here’s one that has great potential to snag my interest: iconic status among airgunners in-the-know. That is why I have an HW45, Diana 124, Diana 300s, Webley Mark I, HW30s, TX200, HW77, and Sheridan Blue Streak. I’m surprised I haven’t laid my hands on a Crosman 600 yet.
I am drawn to legends.
And now only if it came in a briefcase.
I think I saw that on this one a long barrel “extension” slides up against the pistol barrel. That doesn’t sound like a formula for accuracy to me. Moving out of one barrel and into another.
It does join up like that, but, when B.B. tested it, the accuracy (for a smooth bore bb gun) was very very good. That despite the long heavy trigger. Also, for a bb gun, the velocity is quite high at 600+ fps. I wish the rear sight was further down like it should be. I would love someone to test these for velocity and accuracy with the new smart shot and dust devil bbs!
I wasn’t aware of that review, so thanks for the heads up.
Just glad I coild help someone on here. Seems I am always asking the questions lol. Well since I posted the review, I had to go back and read them all. Makes me want one and the Diana too. I am an open sight type guy though. So I wonder if there is an affordable open sight that could attach on the Morph’s rail. If not next would be red dot for me
Read my short reply to Michael above.
I was hoping that “extension” on the rifle barrel was a silencer, but I see nothing in the description. Darn. I have a place to go to shoot loud airguns and firearms, but I like shooting in the back yard cause its so easy. I live in a subdivision and neighbors are close. I can shoot my pumps ok, but even the C02 riflez (crosman 2260 & Daisy 990) get loud for me (lots of little kids around). C02 just seems to Pop louder. I don’t have a springer right now (save for bb guns). I never have owned at PCP but I guess they are loud too without a silencer
MIchael, I was going to mention that BB test that same airgun. You beat me to it. Also the new multi-pump Seneca Dragonfly, by Air Venturi. The latter is going to be in direct competition to the Benjamin 397/392. It’s all wood and metal like the Benjamin’s. The Dragonfly uses a 9 or 7 round magazine, depending on caliber.
I have one, it’s the Artemis model, but looks to be identical. The price that PA has it for makes it pretty good, I paid to import it and would not recommend it at that price.
I hope these new models doesn’t suffer from flaw of the Stormrider with the bolt/receiver abnormal wear problems that was reported on here! That is a big turn off for me anyway.
I’m curious to see if anyone else reports that problem with the stormrider.
I really hope they don’t. I hate seeing a name like Diana have issues. I know it’s a “cheaper made in China” gun, but come on. QC needs to be better if that is the norm to be.
B.B., I think the Benjamin and Sheridan pneumatics are great guns (naturally, I’m biased toward the older models); I was OK with the push/pull windage adjustments; they were fiddly, but once you got it dialed in, it stayed in; I never liked the non-locking fine screw for elevation; I went to a scope, using their “inter-mount,” but it sat too high and I didn’t like the way it stressed the gun to pump it without having your other hand over the receiver. However, once my Dad got his machinist friend to drill and tap it (it’s an old 1970s model, not tapped from the factory) for a factory receiver sight, it has been awesome ever since. It’s compact, accurate, and light-weight…an excellent rifle for hunting. True, it only gets one shot, but that taught me to make my shots count. =D
take care, God bless, and keep up the good work, B.B., ” ‘cuz we’re a-countin’ on you!”
Bob and everyone,
I checked with Pyramyd Air and they checked with Diana. This model 27 that Bob mentioned this morning is being made for another market other than the U.S. It is based on their model 28.
Oh, that’s a disappointment! Why can’t Diana just resurrect the model 27 proper? By all accounts they captured lightning in a bottle with that one.
By the way, is the model 28 the same as the model 280 that’s sold on this side of the pond?
There are so many parts in a Diana 27 that to reproduce it would require a retail price of $400+. Nobody would pay that.
You might rethink that statement.
If it truly represents a 27 when they remake it. There are people that would pay that money for one.
Look at the price of quality springers now days that are good shooters.
If it indeed was a true remake I would prefer the new one verses a old. I said this before about muscle cars. If GM reproduced a 70-1/2 split bumper Z/28 I would by the new one verses a rebiult or as original as can be old one. Granted now days also that both cars would go for very high prices.
I say let them make a new reproduction 28 even if it’s $400+. But it better be like the original one of old.
Suppose to say 27.
I have a modern 393 that I bought last year just before I had to have surgery on one of my hands and it was put aside and more or less forgotten until this report. What would you or anyone else recommend for affixing a scope to this gun and what do you mean when you refer to the aluminum valve welding itself together?
PS, Was the link to “Beeman R9” above “Part 1” intentional?
I do not recommend scoping this rifle. If you have to, use an Air Venturi Intermount.
When there is an electrical flow in some metals like aluminum (caused by a chemical reaction), the parts will weld to each other through electrolysis.
Respect your warning and I think you have expressed it in the past because of hand placement while pumping. I deal with that on a Crosman 2200 Magnum that I own and for the amount I use it I can endure the hassle. On the other hand, if there is another reason, I’m all ears.
Coduece’s rig with the Williams sight has my attention as well. I usually go with a scope because I suffer from WHOOFS (Wow! How Out Of Focus Syndrome), but I have found that peeps mitigate the condition somewhat.
“WHOOFS”,… I will have to remember that! 😉 I too prefer scopes. I do well with the 499 peeps though. Opens seem to elude me. Front sight in focus but target out of focus? Huh? Ok, I will accept that, but for me I want it (all) in focus.
It mounts with a couple of existing screw holes on the right side of the action. https://www.pyramydair.com/product/air-venturi-williams-64-peep-sight?a=5
Thanks for the reply and pic. That sure looks trim but is it easy to use that far forward? Seems like I have seen those mounted much further back on other rifles. Is it just a matter of aperture selection? I only have a little experience with the 1377, 22XX, etc sights and the double ended one that came stock on the Armalite AR7. Are you using the stock front sight? Sorry for all the additional questions but it really does look like a setup that I’d like to try.
Thanks again, Half
My 392 wears a Williams peep which I love, it increase the sight radius which helps with accuracy and it just looks classic.
How does it mount? I guess BB’s recommendation against a scope stems from his finding the scope blocks the ideal right hand position for pumping, as he has noted in other mutipump rifle reports. Does your peep get in the way at all? Do you have a pic?
Got some news to post about the 1077 I have with the WildFire pcp air resivoir tube in it.
I mentioned I was going to put a Huma regulator in it like I did in the Maximus I have. Then machine a .177 barrel to fit it. Haven’t done the barrel yet.
But I did get the Discovery/Maximus Huma regulator and put it in Wednesday. Figured I take it one step at a time and see how the regulator performs before the barrel mod.
Well astounding news actually. But first I’ll start with the install. It was unbelievably simple this time since I done had exsperiance with my Maximus and Huma regulator.
Here’s how simple it was. I didn’t even take out the gauge block this time. Your suppose to take one o-ring off on the gauge block towards the muzzle end where you slide the regulator in. That’s suppose to help from pressure spikes on the regulator between shots. But I got thinking. That pressure spike should help when rapid firing to keep the regulator pressure more stable between shots. Anyway I set the regulator at around 65 bar which ended up at 1000 psi on my gauges after I filled the gun up. So basically all I had to do was is depressurize the gun then take the muzzle end fitting out of the air tube and slip in the regulator and srew the fitting back in. That’s it. Done. Didn’t even have to take the stock of the gun off.
So right now the gun has a 1000 psi working pressure after the regulator and going to the guns valve. That’s right at what a full 12 gram Co2 cartridge produces for pressure to the guns valve. So all the components are seeing is the pressure they were designed to work with in a 1077 from the factory. Now on the other side of the regulator I have been filling the gun to 2000 psi. And remember that’s what the air resivoir was designed for in the WildFire.
And here is the other part of astounding. The shot count and reliability so far. I’m off today so I have been shooting and refilling it to 2000 psi since Wednesday and shooting it. Absolutely no leak down issues as of yet or before the regulator when I was filling to 1500 psi. And here’s the shot count and with no slow down in velocity. And of course this is on the regulator. I’ll say something in a second after I give this shot count. Here it is, 72 usable shots that equals 6 mags that hold 12 pellets. Now about after it fell off the regulator b below 1000 psi. I was in the middle of the 7th mag and it came off the regulator. But I still finished off the mag with no poi drop. So that means I got the regulator set just a bit above the good working pressure. Oh and that is with the same velocity the gun was getting before the regulator but without it dropping as the pressure cane down. It is averaging about 700 fps with the 7.9 grn Daisy wadcutters.
So I say a success so far. Now the “Time Will Tell” thing is next. To see if it holds up like I think it will. Then comes the Maximus barrel mod. I know I just added another $115 to the gun. But I think it’s going to be not as likely to leak down working at the regulated pressure now. Plus I got good consistent shot to shot performance and way more shots than a 1077 or WildFire gets from the factory. But we will see how all goes. But definitely like what I’m seeing so far.
That all sound great so far. What will you do to see if it holds up? I bet you do the barrel mod as soon as you get a chance, if what I’ve heard about ya can be believed! Just make sure we get to hear no matter how it works out. I have 3 1077s and a pair of Wildfires that will be watching.
All I can say is if Crosman would release the WildFire parts diagram I would be buying me a air tube and the gauge block and roll pin.
It would go in my WildFire with yes another Huma regulator.
I just shot several 84 shot 2000 psi fills today. And I’m talking extreme rapid fire. When I get that last mag off I catch myself shaking my head up and down saying yep that’s what it’s all about.
I’m telling ya I like it. I don’t want to jinx the situation but I believe strongly it’s a good combination with that regulator in it.
Good job Gunfun1,
Seems like you made the Wild Fire what it should have been in the first place.
Perhaps a cost point thing as it would have added at least $120 to the original price but it would indeed have been a better product.
Look forward to the barrel mod, hope you do a before and after accuracy test on that.
Thanks. And I will for sure do a before and after accuracy test.
I do hope the Maximus barrel will be more accurate.
We shall see. 🙂
So far realy good results. With the Maximus barrel the front barrel bushing on the 1077 barrel tube will be critical. There is not much can be done at the breech end with the plastic between the sight and barrel.
You have a good project going. Thanks for the effort.
Thanks and I done checked into the muzzle plastic peice that is the front sight.
It should be able to be drilled out to the size of the Maximus barrel and have a good amount of plastic left for strength and support.
The machine work will take a bit of time to make sure I do it right. But other than that the Maximus barrel should work out.
GF1 — Off topic, but I got my Yong Heng week before last. Set up was easy. I have filled one bottle so far — a 115 cu in carbon fiber set-up. I forgot to start my timer until about 1:30 or 2:00 mins in, and then stopped for a couple of minutes at about the 15:30 mark to adjust the pressure shutoff, and add some ice to the cooling water. Even with that time counted, it took about 24 mins total to fill the bottle from zero.
It is noisier than expected, although I had it in the kitchen at my office, which has a wood floor. I set it on cardboard to avoid any scratching or marks. I am a little concerned about the “cheap” feel of the water pump. Have you had any problems with yours? Have you looked at replacements?
Also, do you just use a bucket of water, or have you come up with an upgraded solution?
I found a video on YouTube about a modified cylindrical in-line filter. I have not received the filter yet, but have all the other components. The guy took a piece of 1″ PVC, cut to fit inside the metal tube. He filled it with molecular sieve, held in place by about 1.5″ of that cotton filter material in each end. I spoke with the manufacturer of the molecular sieve product, described the set up I was going to replicate, and he said that would actually deliver “breathing quality” air. I’m not likely to test that, but it should keep water out of my tank and airguns!
Here is how I have mine set up. And the picture is from back when I got it.
I have no problem yet with the water pump keeping the compressor cool. But I’m filling my guns individually so my compressor runs for at the most a little over a minute. The start temperature is around 70° and the end temperature is around 95°. End I usually keep the water pump running for a few minutes after I fill the gun to get back down to around room temperature.
And if I was fill something like buddy bottles or bigger tanks I would probably do something better for a air dryer. But for the little time my compressor runs it had been fine so far.
And it sounds like you like yours so far.
Thanks for that info, and the photo. Mine has a Celsius thermometer, and got up to 60 degs C, which is 140 F. That’s why I was asking about the water setup. I am thinking I either need to put a big chunk of ice in the water, or maybe use a two bucket system where the warm output is not put back into the intake bucket.
A small difference, but your inline filter is different from what came with mine. It is at my office, or I would post a pic, but it does not attach by the cylinder, but rather at the other end of the output line.
And yes, I am happy I decided to give it a try. Even with the money I am spending on the upgraded filtration, I am still going to be way below the cost of most HPA compressors.
My temperature gauge is in Celsius also. I just figured I would give degrees since most use degrees.
But don’t know if you remember Buldawg that use to post here. He has one of the compressor’s like you have. He uses ice in one bucket from what I remember. And he is the one that got me to get my China compressor.
And I’m glad you like it. I definitely like mine.
Ok comparison of the 101 vs 392. First the triggers and the 101 wins hands down. the 392 trigger is very stiff and gritty, guess I have another project to work on. The 101 trigger is much lighter and very smooth which might be attributed to it seeing a lot more use over its longer life. The peep sight on the 101 measures about .050 vs about .115 on the Williams sight. The .065 difference is huge making the Williams sight like a ghost ring sight compared to the 101. But .050 is kind of dim and I think I might open it up a bit. At 25 yards I got 1.5 inch 5 shot groups with both guns and both gave four shot right at 1 inch. 6 pumps with the 101 gave around 510 fps while the 392 was 520 with 5 pumps. All in al I like the feel of the 101 both for shooting and pumping. But for loading the 392 wins hands down with a nice loading trough.
You summed up the difference between the 101 and 392. The 101 has a smaller pump diameter that helps make it easier to pump. The other difference is the barrel on the 101 can be easily replaced. I put a Maximus barrel on my 101 and reduced my 5 shot groups to 1/2 inch at 25 yards.
How do I go about getting a Maximus barrel, do I just call Crosman? Does the barrel come with a front site? I call my 101 my pal not only because I enjoy shooting it, but I’m a big fan of palindromes.
Never odd or even
I had to finish another cup of coffee before firing up my PC. To purchase a Maximus barrel from Crosman you need the part number. They make two different configurations. The original Maximus and the Euro/Hunter version. Both versions seem to be the same accuracy from what I have tested. Go to Crosmans web site and download the parts diagram and list for both versions of the Maximus. The main difference is the front sight. The Hunter version does not have one and the barrel weight is pressed on the end of the barrel. They both come in .22 and .177 caliber
Maximus Barrel Hunter Version .22 cal —- 6-GBMP22-001 $28.20
Hunter/Euro Adapter Silencer — 6-2250XL-001 $12.29
Maximus Barrel Hunter Version Dust Cover — GBMP-033 $1.64
Maximus Barrel Original Version .22 cal — GBMP22-050 $29.89
Once you get the barrel you need to machine the breech end to fit the smaller breech on the 101. I had two barrels machined a .22 and a .177 for my 101. So far I like the .22 caliber barrel better. The two barrels cost me $40 for both to have them machined on a lathe.
This is the what the breech end of the barrel looks like. The barrels have the same overall O.D. so the barrel band fits.
Thank you for the wealth of info, I’m going to do this as I have access to a lathe so no problem there. The dramaticly improved accuracy sure makes it worth it. I notice a little hitch in the last little bit of bolt closure and I wonder if that’s happening as the pellet enters the barrel? Once I get my em-ge running I’m on to the 101 barrel swap.
Here is a picture of mine. you could cut the barrel shorter also if you want to match the original length. The Maximas barrels do not have a choke so you can work from either or both ends.
I’m thinking about filing down the front sight on the 101 to bring up the point of aim. I have the rear sight as low as it will go and it still shoots about 8 inch’s low at 25 yards. What do you think?
I think you mean you have the rear sight as high as it will go!
I would remove your barrel and check that it is not bent. The original rear sight has quite a bit of adjustment. I spin my barrels in my drill press and bend them till they are straight. You can also roll it on a flat glass surface and see if there is any wobble as the barrel rolls across the glass.
If you file down your front sight for 8 inches at 25 yards you need to take of 0.182 inches, that is about all of the front sight. If the barrel is not bent then maybe figure out a way to get more elevation from the rear sight.
I don’t remember what muzzle velocity you have. How many pumps are you using for your 25 yard targets and how heavy of a pellet. Give it a couple more pumps and see if the pellet drop decreases.
Right I get mixed up on that it’s like shimming a scope. You shim the rear to raise poi. Being a multi pump I don’t do a lot of extended sessions with it. So I’m still getting to know it. I was just going the wrong way with the rear sight.
Good that saves a lot of fuss. I go the wrong way all the time i especially get a mirror image when fabricating. I knew a machinest that was given a titainium rocket engine that was machined in a mirror image. He was offered enough to retire if he could save the engine. After about a month of his own time it went to the scrap heap.
Here’s my em-ge piston seal fresh out of the mold. Now a soak in oil.
Very impressive for a piece of leather. Quite creative on the molding. How you could you even tell what the original seal looked like given that brass embedded, gunked up piece of “trash” that you had to start with?
By the way, did you ascertain what the brass particles were?
That’s just what it should look like. Good work!
I appreciate the 392 work & i like the look and feel of that model as a friend of mine had one, but i am old & his was a .20 in the multipump i think is the most logical application of that caliber just my opinion.
As for the Diana Chaser boy do i like the way it looks and i have waited for it, but i do see one little problem with it. The bolt is set up for use as a right handed pistol i guess pistol held in right hand bolt op with the left however set up as a rifle with a mag and it is set up for the left hand. A win for the left handed and hey they get left out often enough so fair enough.
As for the Diana 27 well i am not looking for anything new until i see the Sig ASP20
in action and some of the other new models coming out. After years i just got my 56th so its hard for me to justify a new air rifle, but i have been searching for the right bug buster forever hope the chaser has the accuracy the Daisy 753 is my first choice though it is more than i want to spend. Sorry just my ramblings.
So many good choices coming out makes me happy.
Fellow air gunning mates,…
I sighted in the Maximus today with the new regulator and new scope. (34 zero, 10, 20, 30, 40, 50) It was a bit windy the whole time, so not ideal sighting in conditions. 🙁 A rain front coming in this evening. What was the most fun was the wind indicators that Vana2/Hank showed us all how to make. They worked flawlessly! 🙂
I had them at various yardages. 10, 30, 50 for example. It was quite the learning experience. I ((highly)) recommend using them. What you (think) you see and hear and feel,.. is not always what you think it is. At least these give an “indication” of what is happening in real time.
What I learned the most was that despite some wind, the pellet was still able to hit the POA with no hold off. (5-10 mph?) Of course,… that will only work up to a point. And, I need to re-do the sight in to be exact. But,.. at least I have some fairly accurate hold over/under #’s to at least start with.
At least now I know that I can still shoot to POA up to a certain amount of wind with the set up I have.
Yep on the certain amount of wind. And distance. Shoot out at some longer distances next time with more wind indicators or space them out father apart. See what the pellet does then. And not only one day but multiple days. I think you might find it interesting.
I have been shooting some of the JSB 18.13’s out of my Maximus. They are definitely better in the wind than the JSB 15.89’s
But I see the 18.13’s going low on poi (point of impact) sooner than the 15.89’s. So about 5 or so less usable shots per fill.
For me I’m thinking I don’t care about loosing those shots if it makes my gun more repeatable in the wind. Been shooting them for about a week and have decided the18.13’s is what I will use in the Maximus now. And since I have the regulator in it now and I got my China pump loosing some shots per fill doesn’t bother me.
Yes, wind stability is a good thing. I plan to use it at 50 and under for tree critters,…. so much past that is not important. When setting up the wind indicators, I was pretty bummed with the wind they showed. Not good for a sight in/data day. But, I wanted some (actual) hold over and under for quick shots so I went for it anyways. I was really impressed with how well they worked.
The trees and brush are all still bare at this point. Once they fill in, wind influence will be much less.
Yep with what you did with the Maximus.
But I’m talking about out to a hundred with your .25 Marauder. Place some wind indicators at say 30, 50, 70 and 90 yards and see what happens.
And the reason I say do it multiple days is because the wind direction will be more than likely different on different days and at different distances.
What it boils down to is finding the pellet that bucks the wind the best to give you the most consistent shot.
Don’t know if your getting what I’m saying. In other words good what you did with the Maximus and using the wind indicators. But you got to find what makes your shot better in those conditions. And that would more than likely be weight and velocity when your talking wind.
Yep,… I got it,…. weight and velocity. That is why I like the PCP’s,… they can handle and do both pretty well. Not to mention PCP’s tunes which can push the velocity some more.
True with the pcp’s.
But you know what. It would of been nice if we lived closer and knew each other when I was trying different air guns.
The reason I say that is I think you would be surprised what a Diana Air King will do. And in .177 or .22 caliber. They are a magnum spring gun that shoots like a pcp. In otherwards. No recoil felt, pcp velocity and accuracy and unlimited shot count. 🙂
True. However,.. I do not think I will ever buy a springer again. The TX was great and I still have the LGU, but give me a sweet shooting, multi-shot PCP any day. But hey,… that is just me.
I know. But it’s nice to return to the basics and know there are springers that perform.
I know this is taking things to the extreme. But what would happen if you didn’t have electric anymore for your hpa compressor. Say like a end of the world thing.
And I know a springer can break also. But I bet I could have a springer back in action one way or another easier than a pcp.
Of course there are other ways to get food to survive.
But you know what if. And there are springs that can fill the bill.
Yup,.. that is why I am keeping the LGU,… well,…. unless some really wants it for a fair price. Not as pretty as the TX, but accurate and hey,… I am a sucker for Schnabel’s. That is what drew me to it in the first place. I would love to have the synthetic thumb hole stock for it though.
That would be “buy now” if I could ever find one.
No, that’s me too… 🙂
And look at where the conversation goes.
Open minds or not.
And only if to learn.
One thing I really like about my Urban PCP is that, unlike my breakbarrel springer, I don’t have to de-cock it each time when a sparrow or starling flies before I can take a shot. I just pump the Urban to 3000 psi and then de-cock the hammer each time. It’s always on the ready when that sparrow lands on my feeder.
Or take a 54 Air King and cock it and load the pellet and your ready.
And yes it’s heavy and there are heavy accurate pcp’s too. But your probably supporting the gun on something anyway. And your not out in the feild carrying weight around. Your just grabbing the gun cocking and shooting.
You see where I’m going. It don’t have to be this way or that way. They all can work in one way or another. And one can be just as easy as the other.
Well, I’ve done it both ways. With the Diana 34 and with the Urban PCP. I will say it is much easier and quicker to decock the Urban’s bolt than to decock the Diana 34 with the barrel. I also find it to be much quicker to grab the Urban because it is light and short compared to the Diana 34 which is much longer and heavier. I may be a bit prejudice due to four years of not being able to shoot the Diana 34 accurately because of hold sensitivity.
Prejudice or experience? Sure,… there is a “fine line” in there somewhere,…. but we know what works,.. at least for us. 😉
My shooting time is limited. I do not have time to be fussing with stuff or perfecting holds.
I agree. Unlike GF1, I don’t shoot thousands of pellets over hours and hours of target practice. I don’t mind shooting a few targets once in a while just to verify the POI at various ranges but shooting paper is not the primary use of my airgun. Also, it’s not fun to me chasing the POI of the pellet around on paper trying to figure out why it is not where I aim.
I can only answer positively.
True with the air guns you have shot.
What can I say.
So your saying that practice does make perfect.
Whatever perfect may be.
Definitely makes on a better marksman 😀
I don’t do thousands of pellets target practicing.
Although I have shot many targets over about the last 9 or so years with different guns and pellets and do know what works and don’t and what guns also.
And chasr poi. Why are you chasing it. That tells me right there your not getting consistent shots.
If you can’t do it in paper. Why do you think your better when there is a sparrow in your sight?
And again going off of what your saying. Just asking what you mean.
I would venture to say that you may shoot more pellets in 1 week than the average reader shoots in an entire year. That would be a 52:1 advantage. Best/worst? case, you shoot more in a month than most do in a year. That would be a 12:1 advantage. More shooting = an advantage. Not all of us have that or even willing to invest that kind of time in it. For one,… me.
I’ll take what I can get,… when I can get it. And,… when I do get it,… I want it to be as effortless and easy as possible. That is where (I) am coming from.
The statement that gets me that Geo made is that I shoot hours of target practice and Chase poi on paper.
I shoot for sure. But it’s not all at paper.
I do that to get to know my gun. After that it’s to know that I hit what I’m shooting at.
And for the most part I shoot my WildFire/1077 rapid fire at multiple targets along with my rimfire guns.
And do you see what I mean now. Shooting paper only happens when it needs to to verify.
Seriously if you can’t hit paper then how good are you really?
I know you do not just shoot at paper. You really mix it up.
Maybe you should be one of those You-Tuber’s that test air guns day in and day out? Then again,… B.B. said that is a very bad idea and the quickest way to go broke. But hey,.. you have the passion to push it to the limits and we can all learn from that,…. even if we only make it part ways. 😉
Out’a here,…. got 1 good day of shooting in,… back to work in the early AM.
I shoot for fun most importantly.
But I also want to be good.
What more can I say.
Like Chris said, you shoot a lot more than most of us and that’s not a bad thing. It’s what makes you such a great shot. I’ve seen the groups you have posted with your springers and they are impressive to say the least.
Sorry, I thought I remembered you saying you shot thousands of pellets a month or something. I’m sure you shoot more in one week than I do in a year. I do consider you to be one of the experts here on the blog that has vast experience and lots of credibility. I you state something about an airgun, it can pretty much be taken to the bank as fact.
Regarding chasing the POI, that was with the Diana 34. You know the story about me trying to shoot consistent groups with that rifle. I was historically speaking about chasing the POI. I certainly am NOT having that issue with the Urban. For the longest time I didn’t know whether my accuracy problem was caused by me, the rifle, the hold, or the pellet. All the accuracy problems are a non issue with the Urban PCP. 🙂
So when you do shoot paper. How repeatable are you?
If your not repeatable. Do you think you should be shooting at those sparrows?
The reason I ask is first where is the shot going if you miss. Next if your not sure of yourself your probably wounding the sparrow.
I know I’m probably going to deep. But you got to know your gun before you put it to service. And if you don’t shoot as much as your time will allow your probably not the best you can be in more ways than one.
I think you misunderstood my comment. I did not mean that you chase POI on paper, I was having that experience with my Diana 34.
I have not had an opportunity to shoot very much at distance yet. My range down in my basement it 17 yards. I have shot about 400 pellets through the Urban since I got it back in Feb. I am very impressed with it’s accuracy so far. I shoot groups of 1/4″ to 1/2″ at 17 yards, repeatedly. I was able to shoot outside at 30 yards one day and was able to keep 48 of 50 pellets inside of 1/2″. So I have great expectations of accuracy at longer ranges. And I definitely verify my POI on paper before attempting to dispatch any pests.
Yep that is pretty good shooting for one day.
48 of 50 in a 1/2″ at 30 yards.
But the question is how many different days can you do that.
That’s when paper chasing becomes important.