by Tom Gaylord
Writing as B.B. Pelletier
Hatsan Proxima underlever repeater.
This report covers:
- Why no single-shot tray
- RWS Hobby
- Teaching point
- JSB Exact RS
- RWS Superdome
- H&N Sniper Magnum
- Discussion
- Cocking effort
- Trigger pull
- Summary
Why no single-shot tray
I am usually sensitive to the questions of my readers, but in Part 1 I missed it completely. Reader HawkEye asked why the Hatsan Proxima doesn’t come with a single shot tray. I ignored his first comment, thinking he was just joking, but he persisted so I finally answered him. I said this.
“This rifle isn’t made to be shot single shot. No tray because it doesn’t work that way. Cocking is too hard and the loading space too confined.”
And I wondered why he would even ask such a question, until it dawned on me that he couldn’t envision the scale. I had shown him an enlarged picture of the feed probe and, looking at that, he could see plenty of room to load a pellet.
This is the picture I showed you when I talked about the probe. It looks like there is plenty of room to load a single pellet by hand, doesn’t it?
This is the Proxima probe with my thumb for scale. As you can see, the magazine slot is far too narrow for the fingers to feed a pellet.
Perhaps you had the same question as HawkEye. I hope I have cleared it up for you.
Today we look at the Proxima’s velocity. I’m testing a .22 that Hatsan rates at 720 f.p.s. We don’t know what pellet they tested to get that velocity, but today we will explore that question. Here is what I think, and I’m writing this before conducting the velocity test. I think Hatsan used a reasonable lead pellet for their velocity test, because they have a reputation for being conservative with velocity figures. Let’s say it weighed about 14 grains. The magic number is 671, at which velocity the weight of the pellet in grains is equal to the energy in foot pounds. So I am guessing the Proxima is in the 15 foot-pound range — 15 and change. And Hatsan is conservative, so it might top 16 foot pounds by a little. Let’s see.
RWS Hobby
I’ll start with the lightest pellet, the RWS Hobby. Hobbys weigh 11.9-grains and until lead-free pellets came along they were some of the lightest pellets you could get.
Teaching point
Okay, this doesn’t always happen but it did with the Proxima, so I’m going to use it. The first string of Hobbys looked bogus to me, and I will tell you why. Let’s take a look.
Shot………Vel.
1…………..829
2…………..823
3…………..824
4…………..815
5…………..808
6…………..796
7…………..792
8…………..780
9…………..788
10…………779
This is a brand new rifle and you can see what’s happening as I shoot. The velocity keeps dropping. The decline does seem to have slowed down by shot number 6. In an instance like this I wanted to see what a second string might produce. And, by the way, the average for this first string was 803 f.p.s. and the spread was 50 f.p.s.
Let’s look at the second string with the same pellet.
Shot………Vel.
1…………..797
2…………..797
3…………..797
4…………..801
5…………..808
6…………..794
7…………..786
8…………..783
9…………..775
10…………784
The average for this string was 792 f.p.s. and the spread was 25 f.p.s. You can see that the rifle is quieting down. It’s still a long way from fully broken in, but it’s a lot closer than it was on the first string. At the average velocity on the second string this Proxima is developing 16.58 foot pounds of energy at the muzzle. Let’s look at another pellet.
JSB Exact RS
The next pellet I tested was the JSB Exact RS. And I learned something with this one, too. The average with the RS pellet was 682 f.p.s. and the spread went from a low of 644 to a high of 694 f.p.s. That’s a difference of 50 f.p.s. At the average velocity the JSB Exact RS produced 13.87 foot pounds of energy. You can see that is way below the first pellet and this pellet is still varying too much in the shot string. I don’t think the RS pellet is suited to the Proxima.
RWS Superdome
Next to be tested was the RWS Superdome. They averaged 725 f.p.s., despite weighing 14.5 grains and the JSB Exact RS weighing 13.43 grains. The spread for Superdomes went from 701 to 753 f.p.s., so a difference of 52 f.p.s. At the average speed the Superdome developed 16.93 foot pounds of energy at the muzzle. So the rifle hasn’t settled down yet, however it does seem to like this pellet. I think it has to do with how well it seals the bore.
H&N Sniper Magnum
The last pellet I tested with the Proxima was the Sniper Magnum from H&N. This is a 17.9-grain domed pellet that I have never tested. It averaged 660 f.p.s. in the Proxima, which is good for 17.32 foot pounds of energy. The spread went from a low of 646 to a high of 665 f.p.s., a difference of 19 f.p.s.
Discussion
So — what do we have? The Proxima exceeded my estimate — producing energy of over 17 foot-pounds. I told you Hatsan is conservative!
This rifle needs to be broken in before it will perform like it should. And some pellets, like the JSB Exact RS, are not well suited to the Proxima’s powerplant.
The 12-shot rotary magazine functioned flawlessly throughout the test. I just had to remember to depress the cocking lever safety button to return the lever, after cocking the action. When you shoot the last pellet the empty magazine doesn’t permit the cocking to go forward all the way. It goes about halfway and then the probe stops it from going the rest of the way because it stops against the empty magazine.
Cocking effort
I measured the cocking effort at 53 lbs. at the start of the test. But as the shooting progressed the rifle seemed to get easier to cock. So I measured it again at the end of the test. And, I was shocked to see it has increased to 57 lbs.! Apparently, I got stronger as the test progressed. “I’m strong to the finishchk ‘cause I eats me spinishchk…”
Trigger pull
As the rifle came from the box the two-stage Quattro trigger released at 4 lbs. 4 oz. I was able to adjust it down to 3 lbs. 11 oz., but that was as far as the adjustment screw went.
Summary
This Proxima is turning out pretty good! The power is better than I expected and everything seems to work as it should. The cocking effort is on the high side, but I told you that in Part 1. I don’t think it matters that much for hunters, but know that the Proxima is not for casual plinking.
I’m excited to see how accurate it is. It has the same fat red dot bead on front with an open notch in the rear. This time I won’t make the mistake of shooting to the center of the dot, like I did with the Vectis.
BB don’t go crazy reveling in your new found strength, no arm wrestling with sailors in bars
I am glad we finally got one decent shot string.
Sean.
BB
My Hatsan Edge has the same fat dot fiber optic sight and with a globe that’s a little different than what the Proxima has. But similar.
I have actually been having good luck with the factory sights on the Edge. And that’s the way I decided I’m going to shoot it now. But I tryed the scope that came with it and my Tasco red dot sight. And I have to say I probably like the Tasco red dot the best. But the factory open sight have been working.
I just put the factory from post dot at the 6 o’clock position and I can see my target above the dot and below the top of the globe hood. The gun actually points pretty quick like that. And mine has the green fiber optic rear notch with the front post red. I can pick up on and center the sights real quick actually.
Just figured I would throw that out there.
B.B.
Typo-” I don’t think the RS pellet is suited to the JSB Exact RS.”
Was there any difficulty loading the Sniper Magnums into the magazine. They must be pretty long.
-Y
Yogi,
Thanks, I fixed that.
The Sniper Magnums loaded the easiest of all the pellets I tried. There is plenty of room in the mag for them.
B.B.
B.B.
“Why no single-shot tray”
Why not something like one of these:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOnyZf24Wp0
Or one like in the attached photo.
I like the half clothes pin idea that already has a trough, if I were to make one. Also, could you not remove the tray once the pellet has been “loaded/seated” into the breach by pulling the probe back, removing the loading tray, then push the probe back in? Or just shoot the gun with the loading tray in place. Or am I missing something?
One idea for a single tray would be able to shoot longer pellets which would not fit into the magazine. Such as Predator Polymag, sniper magnum pellets. Maybe a moot point for this gun and caliber. But, for the Hatsan BT65 the Eun Jin .25 Cal, 43.2 Grains, pointed pellet does not fit in the rotary magazine.
Looking forwards to the accuracy testing and breaking in period.
John
John
I made this some years back for a Hatsan at44qe I had. It had a deep and narrow opening for the mag to fit.
The tray I made worked great. I would kind of drop the pellet in by the angle on the tray and let it roll down in place.
Here’s another veiw.
GF1,
I need to find my round tuit and make one of these for my HM1000X.
RR
Yes you do.
Nice GF1!
I will be making a single-shot tray for my FX Royale 500 as they are way over-priced IMHO. Would cost me $50 (part, tax and shipping) to get one!
…besides, it would be a nice little project on the milling machine.
Hank
Hank
Thanks.
And it only took me about a half hour to make.
I made one for Buldawg for his at44. And believe it or not I didn’t even have my at44 yet. I made his off dimensions he gave me over the phone. Sent it to him and it fit perfectly and worked great.
I then made the one in the pictures after I got my at44qe. And it fit nice and worked great also.
And yes you should make one for your Royale. Then in fact it will be Royal with a custom made single shot tray. 🙂
GF1,
Your single shot trays look very nice. Are they made out of plastic or wood?
John
John
Thanks.
Its made from Delrin. Very easy to machine and durable.
Wonder if a 3D printer could make one faster than what it took me to machine it.
And thinking about the one made from the wood close pin. I imagine that one could be made out of wood like I made out of the Delrin. Probably could even use hand tools and a vise. Wouldn’t need a Bridgeport vertical milk like I used.
Never thought about wood. But don’t see why it wouldn’t work and hold up.
GF-1,
Thank you
I bet a 3D printer would work great.
Alas, I have no experience with one.
I am thinking about the clothes pin one, so I can try those .25 cal Eun Jin 43.2 grain pellets in the BT65. I am curious how they will perform. I have shot 3 by using pliers to insert into the breach but, it’s too time consuming and tricky to get any real results. I wish I had chronographed those.
John
Make one. I would like to know what your shooting results are with those pellets.
And come to think about it now. I thought I remember seeing a single shot tray offered by Hatsan for some of their guns. I’ll have to search and see.
Guess not. I just checked.
B.B.,
Looking forwards to the accuracy testing. On single shot, there is swing out single shot drums too. Rowan Eng. in the U.K. has them. Several people use them in Daystates and other brands, despite having single shot trays. While a tray is cheaper to make, maybe we will see a budget rifle maker offer something like a swing out (single pellet) drum in the future.
http://rowanengineering.com/products26.htm#fxssl
Good Day to you and to all,……… Chris
Chris,
Not likely because of cost. Keep in mind they want to make a profit, which is their primary goal. Now they may go with a one piece something or other with a hole through it that would slide back and forth.
Chris,
I have one of these for my .177 HW 100 and they are very nice/convenient to use.
hmmmmm… The magazine on the FX is quite tall and needed high scope rings to clear it so there is quite a bit of room to put in a single-shot drum. I’ll throw some dimensions into AutoCAD and see what I can come up with… Thanks for the idea – there’s another addition to the mill’s project list =)
Cheers!
Hank
BB,
Just wondering if, with all the leverage created by the cocking lever, you think that the magazine could be easily damaged by denting it or even piercing it with the pellet probe when attempting to close on an expended mag?
Half
Half,
I think it’s the other way around. The magazine is very tough plastic that could damage the probe if you didn’t stop it while returning the lever. That’s how it feels to me.
B.B.
Halfstep
I’m with BB on that. That’s the quickest way to bend a probe on a semi-auto air gun with a miss fire. And also with repeaters on a miss load.
And if the probe gets bent a little but still functions that can cause accuracy problems.
GF1,
I have often wondered if those weird fliers that show up occasionally are caused by a pellet that has been seated improperly.
The 10 foot wide, 6 foot high backstop on my south facing shooting range is made from dark colored logs and in good side lighting (mornings and evenings) I can often see the arc of the pellet as it travels down range. Every now and then I get an unstable pellet that does a spiral on it way to the target.
I am making a shooting rest that has my Chrony built in such that it maintains the exact same alignment (Chrony to barrel) while I am testing pellets at different ranges. Hope that this arrangement will help me relate the pellet velocity to POI so I can monitor things and check if I get an unexpected glitch in the group.
Hank
Hank
I can see the pellet fly while looking through the scope if the lighting is right. Really cool on those hundred yard shots.
But yep there has to be a hidden answer for them flyer’s somewhere.
And you will have to post some pictures of your chrony set up when you get it done. Sounds cool.
Yeah, those fliers bug me. I can accept the “glitch”- life is like that – but I would really like to know why/how it happened.
Will post pictures of the “shooting rest” when it is finished – right now my sketches have it looking like a cross between a gimbal mount and a sundial. LOL!
Hank
In the end is what matters.
I’m sure you will get your chrony rest finalized.
But I think those flyers are influenced by those little Gremlins. Evan as cute as some are they can be very devastating.
And here’s a saying that’s hard to say this time. “Time Will Tell.”
I hope I have enough time left to figure out where them flyer’s really come from. Some are predictable. But some. Wow!
GF1,
Some bikers (motorcycle) have little “gremlin bells”, real bells, hung under the front frame of the bike. It is supposed to keep “road gremlins” from jumping on board, (by scaring them),.. and causing problems.
On flyers,….
1) Sort ten ways to Sunday
2) Shoot over a chrony 100% of the time
3) Keep meticulous records
4) Shoot from a viced gun
5) Pull the trigger with some other regulated device, other than your finger
That will tell you what causes the flyers,… for (that gun) and (that pellet).
No doubt,.. I left out about a dozen other “must do” factors. 😉
Chris
Chris,
Really? Dr. Mann spent 37 years studying why there were fliers and never found the answer. It’s all in “The Bullet’s Flight From Powder To Target”.
B.B.
B.B.,
Of course you are right! 🙂 That was powder burners, so maybe things are easier with air guns? Or harder? The chicken or the egg quandary comes to mind. 🙁
I did leave out that you had better have 37 (plus) years to figure all of this out. 😉
While I have not read any of Dr. Mann’s work’s,…. I would at least hope that some questions were answered definitively,.. some answered with high probability,.. and that some that were dis-proven.
You do have to admit,… at least what I offered (and the other dozen things I left out),….. would at least narrow down the field of mysteries to a fair degree.
Chris
Chris
Right. Do all that plus more.
And the gremlin still bites.
Half
The easiest way to find out is to hand one to Bubba.
tt
TT
If any body can do it it’s gonna be Bubba. No doubt it my mind there.