by Tom Gaylord
Writing as B.B. Pelletier
Beeman R1 Supermagnum air rifle.
This report covers:
- The tune helped!
- Important changes
- No luck
- One last group
- New R1 book next year
Today will be interesting, because today we will see the Beeman R1 in a new light. At least I now do.
In Part 3 I told you that my R1 has always been a twitchy rifle to shoot accurately. Even when I wrote the R1 book, I had problems getting this rifle to shoot at any distance. Ten meters was easy, but beyond 20 yards the rifle just didn’t like to put them all together. But in every group of 10, 4 or 5 would be in a single hole — indicating the airgun wants to shoot. When I encounter an air rifle like that I call it twitchy, because it really needs the right hold to do its best. The problem is — I hadn’t found that hold for this rifle yet.
The tune helped!
In the past this R1 has been a hard-recoiling air rifle. That made it difficult to hold correctly every time. The tune that Bryan Enoch put on the gun earlier this year has changed that, and it’s now possible to hold the rifle as steady as any of my other tackdrivers. But in the last test I never discovered the one hold that the rifle likes. It’s still twitchy. So, today, that will be my goal.
I mentioned last time that the trigger was adjusted too heavy for my taste. This time I adjusted it lighter. It now breaks at just less than 2 pounds.
Also, the scope I used last time was a cheapie that happened to fit on the rifle quickly. This time I took the time to find and mount a scope that is more appropriate. I’m shooting an obsolete UTG 3-12 SWAT scope that looks and performs very much like their current one. The reticle is thicker than I prefer for long range target shooting, but perfect for hunting.
I mounted that scope in a pair of BKL 30 mm high rings that have 2-screw caps. They look small for a powerful spring rifle, but Bryan’s tune has tamed the beast to the point that these rings are now ideal. Together with the short scope, they add very little weight to the already heavy air rifle.
The new scope and mounts look good on my R1. The small size of the scope makes it a handy sight without adding weight, and the 2-piece BKL high mounts are all this smooth shooter needs.
With the rifle now adjusted and scoped, I sighted-in at 12 feet. The round struck 2 inches low and one inch to the left, which meant it would be okay at 25 yards. It took three more shots to get on the bull at 25 yards and I was ready to begin the test.
The first part of the test didn’t go well. I tried three different variations of artillery holds — off hand touching triggerguard, hand halfway out and hand all the way out. Nothing worked. I would get several pellets in the same hole and then they would spread out. I tried Crosman Premiers and H&N Baracuda Match with 5.51 mm heads. Both gave me similar results — a scattered group with several pellets in the same hole. The group I’m showing measures 1.692-inches.
All the groups shot with the Baracuda Match with 5.51 mm heads were like this one. It’s 1.692-inches between centers.
Then I switched to H&N Baracuda Match with 5.53 mm heads. When I made the switch I was holding the rifle with my off hand extended as far out as was comfortable. This time I got a group. It wasn’t a super group, but it was better than anything I had seen up to this point. Ten pellets landed in 0.94-inches between centers, and 8 of them are in 0.545-inches. This was the best I had seen from this rifle in a long time, so I thought I was onto something.
The first group shot with Baracuda match having 5.53 mm heads went into 0.94-inches. Eight of those pellets are in 0.545-inches. This pellet shows promise, but the hold still isn’t perfect.
By the time I shot this group I had fired 56 shots and was tiring out from the cocking and concentration. But I didn’t want to quit, now that I was possibly close to the answer I was looking for. I thought I would give it one more try.
One last group
I had read in a book somewhere — I think it was the Beeman R1 book — that when spring rifles are exceptionally twitchy you can sometimes get results if you rest the forearm on the backs of your fingers. The wide forearm on my Maccari custom stock lends itself to this because it spreads the weight over all the fingers.
So, I took my own advice and rested the rifle on the backs of my fingers. And that’s when I think I discovered how to shoot my supertuned Beeman R1! This time 8 shots went into 0.484 inches at 25 yards. I could not believe it — they all went into the same hole!
But what about those other 2 shots? They aren’t in the main group. On the first one, which was shot number 5, I felt I wasn’t as relaxed for the shot as I should be. There was some tension in my hold, but I wanted to see what effect that would have, so I took the shot anyway. That pellet opened the group to 1.184-inches! Normally that would discourage me, but when I resumed the correct hold, the next shot went into the same big hole that was forming.
What I was learning was how twitchy my rifle is, and also how to control it. That’s much more important than some random small group. So, on shot number 9 I did the same thing. I didn’t relax as much as I should have and this shot also went wild. It went in the same direction as shot 5, but not as far from the main group.
This is the group that gives me confidence. Eight pellets are in 0.484-inches, and the 2 shots I felt were not held right (shots 5 and 9), went away from the group. Maybe I’m finally in control!
Here is what I think I have learned from today’s test. First, I needed the trigger to be lighter to suit my shooting style. Second, by changing both the scope and mount I achieved a better sight picture that I feel helped me shoot better. But none of this matters without the correct hold.
Finding the right hold for the rifle seems to have made all the difference. I say it seems to because I need to test this hold more times to see if I can repeat the results. And I need to try it with different pellets, to see whether it’s just the hold, or it’s also partly the pellet that makes the difference. The way this test went, it’s difficult to say which change helped more.
You can also argue that I should have sorted the pellets with the .22 caliber Pelletgage before shooting. Maybe those 2 wild shots were caused by differing head sizes rather than variances in the hold? I don’t think so, but it’s too early to rule anything out.
I will agree that all my testing with the Pelletgage does show there are great differences in head sizes, and those differences do affect the results on the target. But I haven’t tested other air rifles that way in the past. If I do use the Pelletgage, it will be after I have verified the best hold and the best pellet for this rifle.
After 66 shots with this springer, I was too tired to continue. That remains for another day. I plan to stay at 25 yards until I’m sure that I know this rifle.
New R1 book next year
I’ve decided to bring out an updated edition of the Beeman R1 book. There are many corrections to the original manuscript that need to be made, but the plan is to identify the new material so people can see the original book within the new edition.
The R1 book now sells for crazy prices, just because it is no longer available. When I still had them on hand I almost could not give them away. But the airgun community has grown to the point that this is now a venture worth doing. I have rounded up all the files and have started converting them for the project that will probably take until at least the middle of next year.
In the last chapter of the book I talk about the Gaylord dream rifle and what I wanted it to be. When I wrote that I had no idea of where my journey would take me, but I think the tune that’s on the gun now is the one I dreamed about in 1994 — 22 years ago. So I will add a new chapter to the book that describes this tune and what it has done to the rifle.
87 thoughts on “Beeman R1 supertune: Part 4”
Your exsperiance you had this time around sounds so much like how that Diana 46e I got a little while back acts.
The hold is everything on the 46. It’s 2 different guns in the way it groups by just the hold. It does not want to be held. I bet if I layed it on a table and pointed at a target and pulled the trigger it would shoot a better group than me holding it.
Of course I’m joking about laying it on a table. But the lighter I have a hold of it the better. Matter of fact I keep feeling myself want to tighten up the grip on the gun as I’m pulling the trigger. It actually feels totally wrong to me. But the group it shoots that way tells the story.
If I wouldn’t of learned out how to hold that gun I’m sure it would of went up for sale. Still amazes me everytime I shoot it.
Its funny you say about wanting to grip it, I tried pulling a twitchy magnum 22 into my shoulder and holding tight like a shotgun and it grouped better then it had, then found its light hold that worked. While the shotgun hold wasnt as good as its best with the right light hold, it was respectable and repeatable, and the tight hold is actually what lead me to the hold it liked. The tight shotgun hold put my hands were they were most comfortable and where my muscles natural fell, then completely relaxing it shot perfect. Might be worth a try.
You wouldn’t believe how many ways I tryed holding that 46.
I was about ready to give up and I just let the gun rest on my shoulder and on the rest. Had my on hand laying on my leg. And the other hand on the trigger. Aimed and puled the trigger and it hit in a different spot it was hitting at. Did it again and the pellet hit exactly in the same spot.
Ended up shooting 5 or 6 more shots and they all touched. Resighted the gun holding the gun like that and the dang thing shoots like I don’t know what. No way will I get rid of it now. Definitely a keeper.
Got my pump order is recieved! Got the G6 refurb, and was hoping BB could vouch for the refurbs a little… just wondering what kind if thing mightve needed fixing on it? The reviews on the g6 run the gambit, hard left and right. Im going to go back and reread your review of it but fingers are crossed its solid.
I’m replying here because there was nowhere below left to reply about the 3-9 magnification scope you had on the Walther Talon.
You know that saying don’t you. You don’t know what you really have till its gone.
Well one thing I have learned since I been messing with the air guns that I did not learn when I had the muscle cars.
When it feels right or works right I guess I can say. I should hold on to that feeling and keep what is working. Then think again about what if I did not have it anymore.
Sometimes when something is gone all you can do is try to remember what it felt like.
I know exactly what you mean, talking to reb I remember the airmaster that was a tackdriver, that leapers, a saturn sl-1 that only needed a little front end work that in hindsight should’ve just had done. A couple other great cars that I wrecked that were in perfect working order including a sweet Cadillac. The worst is when you wanted something so bad and its awesome but then after awhile you get that buyers remorse telling you you really didnt need it so it goes and then you remember how awesome it was and why you wanted it and that it wasnt cause you needed it! I guess thats a poor mans malady, lol.
And you know everybody has had that feeling one way or another.
It’s what you do with that feeling is what’s important.
I haven’t used a refurbed G6, but the pump is built to be maintained by the owner. It should be fine. If it works at all, it will work a long time — as long as you keep it clean.
Tom, In reading your part 4 on the Beeman R1 you mention that you were going to update your book. Did this happen & if so can I purchase a copy?
No, I never got around to it. Sorry,
Tom, any chance you have a copy of the book you could sell me?
The triggerhand might need some adjustments. With my hw80/R1 I do not apply the “handshake grip”. Quite the opposite in fact. My thumb can almost touch my indexfinger’s (triggerfinger) knuckle.
And my thumb nail is at 1-O-clock.
The trick with the r1/hw80 is to use the shoulderpad as less as possible, and only apply pressure with your shootinghand’s thumb and indexfinger. The off hand’s middlefinger should touch the cockingslot, leaving the rifle rested in the palm of your hand.
In the past I had trouble shooting this rifle benched…. whilst shooting kneeling the rifle shot amazing unreal groups (remember the video I send you??). So when I applied the same principles (I use kneeling) on the bench, the groups tightened up dramatically.
So the rifle has the potential to shoot very tight groups at 25 meters out off the box running at 18 footpounds.
Given that you had this rifle tuned in such an impressive way, I had thought the twitchiness might be gone now. Can you talk a little about what might cause that to continue and why you think it was there to begin with. I have ideas, but I’ve read your reports for years. New guys might not have any clue at all.
I don’t know what causes twitchy-ness. I just know some guns have it and others don’t. It seems to follow the gun through all manner of tunes.
This is the first time this R1 has shot consistently for me, and this is the very rifle I used to write the rook.
Both my Regal and Impact are Magnum Springers and neither seems to mind a slightly heavy hold, of course I seldom shoot @ 25m anymore..
When I got the Regal back from the pawn shop last time the trigger actually felt pretty amazing. They’re also budget guns, guess I’m fortunate to be lucky.
It does not have to be expensive to be good. A certain level of quality is going to have a price tag on it, but it does not have to be over the top. An air rifle from Wang Po Industries will more often than not shoot just as well as an air rifle from Svinehund Corporation. Now the air rifle from Svinehund may have a better finish to the steel and a nicer piece of wood. Also the trigger may be a little nicer.
Wang Po may also bring their costs down with cheap labor and other cost cutting manufacturing techniques such as using a barrel pivot pin instead of a bolt with a locking screw. They will produce larger numbers and accept more defective returns due to a lower standard of quality control.
With a little tinkering and tuning, some Wang Po air rifles can be dressed up pretty nice and perform with the best of them. Therein lies the some of the greater costs of the air rifles from Svinehund Corporation. Some of that tinkering and tuning is done before it leaves the factory.
Also, Svinehund has to pay some unbelievable labor costs and they manufacture fewer air rifles, so they are unable to make up profits with large quantities. They also have far fewer rejects and customer complaints.
Have you tried the other ruger 34 clones? Air hawk, black hawk? Couple different stocks, 4 actually, and they are the absolute simplest things to tear down and rebuild and make unreal smooth AND under 100$! Impacts the same thing but 22 version with a cool stock, its like techy/classic wood, somehow.
My r1 .177 shoots best with the least hold possible. Hn barakudas also are best for me. I can bench mine with good results. I allow the rifle to slide on a slick surface, like a poly grass seed bag that is usally dusty. My vintage supersport BSA is also the same in that it is twitchy too but superbly accurate at long ranges. Other rifles are much easier to get equal results but with less ft lbs. Thanks for the full circle. It is really nice to read your posts about this legendary rifle that started it all for me and I’m sure many others.
On the TX200, last Sunday, I found that I the reticle level was off when the forearm was completely relaxed on the flat, hard rest. It had been a long time since it was set and apparently when I did it, I had the rifle shouldered tighter and held more, ( tilted to the left ), ever so slightly. I reset the reticle level and the groups improved dramatically over what I had just been shooting.
The group, 5 before and 5 after the level change, also changed POI from dead on,.. to about 1″ lower and 1″ to the left. If the reticle was at 45 seconds before, (think 60 seconds on a watch), it was at about 47-48 seconds totally relaxed.
Bottom line, that little bit of left tilt that I was imparting on the rifle, made a difference. All things being the same, the left side of the forearm had more rested pressure than the right side of the forearm (and) I must have been adding some extra twist at the pistol grip and added/different pressure at the shoulder in order to “level” the reticle that 2-3 seconds. So slight that I did not even realize it.
By that time I was 60 shots into the session and wanted to do some 50 yds. with the LGU. Swapping pellets and 2 ten shot groups of ???, I did pull off a 1 1/4″ group. Not great, but not bad for me. Getting tired and cold, I quit for the day. Sad,…that may be the last 25 and 50 for a few as the weather has starting turning much colder.
At any rate, just a little info. on what I found on hold, rest and level influences. Chris
I am most envious of you. You own two of the air rifles that I covet.
Order a TX200 today. Life is short. In two months you won’t miss the money and you will have the rifle forever!
LOL! Oh, yes I would miss the money right now and more importantly my wife!
I will just have to be patient. I should be able to add a one to my collection early next summer. If not, I am quite happy playing with my 1906 BSA, my Edge and my Izzy.
Thanks,…they are nice. They can both out shoot me. Mine are both .22, so I don’t know if .177 would serve you better. Good comment above on quality vs price. Well put and seems to cover most, if not all “bases”.
I remember you from when I first came on here about a year ago. So you know the playin’ and tunin’ I have done. I would recommend either if you can scratch up the coin. Chris
That’s called (cant) when the gun is tilted left or right.
Picture your scope reticle and your using 1 or 2 mildots of hold over below or above the horizontal retical centerline. Now tilt (or cant) the gun left or right. Look how the (+) or your zero point moves to the left or right.
The higher your scope is mounted from the barrel and the more mildots are used exaggerates how far POI can be from POA to the left or right.
That’s why I like a lower scope mount and I use a lower magnification setting when I shoot. The lower magnification keeps the mildot spacing closer together. That all makes a difference the farther distance out you shoot.
So if you have a target that has no way to reference a true level horizontal plane. Like shooting a sqerrial in a tree you need a way to know you are keeping your gun level. So that’s why people put buble levels on their scope. Once their gun is set up the way they want they reference the buble level to make sure the hold is true to their sight in.
Once you start seeing how things affect the way you shoot you change them if you can. Then you just have to see if they produce the results you want.
Thanks for the reminders. You have been a great help in my learning.
I do use a level on the dove tail and a homemade magnetic one on the scope. Seems to work well. I still need to check the TX with them given the new “level” setting. I did stop putting cross hairs on my homemade targets.
The main thing that I was trying to relay was that the corrections that I was imposing on the hold, did seem to make a difference.
2 notes,….I swear I read here…..1) If you cant your rifle in a natural hold, you scope should still reflect a level reticle, hence your scope IS mounted canted to the rifle.
2nd.) I remember BB canting the rifle to the extreme of like 45 degrees each way. The groups did shift,…but nothing like the 1″ down and 1″ left like I got with the 2-3 degrees rotation. Therefore I thought that the difference I got was due more to stock pressure/hold, and less to do with cant. Chris
But to me it sounds like you changed the way your rest your gun now compared to how you rested it when you originally sighted it in.
So now if its resting different it will change your POI compared to the original sight in.
So yes if your not pulling the gun into your shoulder the same as when you originally sighted it in you could get a elevation and windage change too.
And remember you have to repeat where your gun rest on your shoulder because your line of sight might change as to where you rest your cheek on the comb of the stock.
That all plays into repeating your hold so your group’s will also repeat and represent your true POA.
Like I said above. My 46 shoots better the less I touch it. It wants to reapeat itself the way it rests better than I can hold it and shoot.
All good info. Cheek rest repeatability is a factor. While both are raised and are nice, the cheek rest area(s) is rather non-descript. There is quite a bit of fore and aft before your cheek can feel a distinct difference.
I would say that I use a edge to edge, clean and crisp “sight picture” as my biggest deciding factor to when “I got it right”.
I have heard of tape, hair ties/bands,…( got a few of those), 😉 ,to help repeat cheek placement. Then again,….maybe the whole “Zen” thing might work,…..Mmmmmm,….”Become one with the gun”…..? Chris
You know if a person was to keep notes on all this stuff a person could probably write a book about how to air gun.
My notes,.. have notes! Will be doing a review this winter.
Ha-ha. I know somebody that once was that way.
I have enjoyed following you R1 articles, I admire your perserverance Tom and it has paid off.
I have a BAM 30-1 which is a Diana 48 copy and this once run-in shot good groups at 10m but was all over the place at 20m. Then I found your artilary hold and results improved, now I have found JSB Exact 8.44gn pellets
and now gettting a very good group.
Don’t worry about the spell check. I make errors all the time. Fat fingers! 😉
Thanks for the feedback on the artillery hold. It’s nice to know it’s helping people enjoy their airguns.
I, too, have fat fingers, like fire hydrants. I’ve been using computers for virtually all my writing since the early 1980s, and when keyboards started to have mushy Chiclet keys, my typo rate skyrocketed. But not since I discovered Das Keyboard. It has large, deep, sculpted keys with that old IBM tactile click and crisp touch. For the record, I did get the Das Keyboard with characters printed on them. For the hard-core, they also have a model with unmarked keys. I highly recommend Das Keyboard.
DasKeyboard uses Cherry MX switches. The Model M uses buckling springs. While they are both mechanical they feel a bit different.
Unicomp makes a new model M using the old molds.
Personally I use a real Model M from 07-17-1990.
If I plan to do hours and hours of writing (and if I do not actually get out my Olympia SM9 or Olivetti Lettera 32), I will get out my 1980s Northgate Omnikey Ultra, in my opinion the greatest computer keyboard ever made. It has ALPs switches and an incredible feel. To use it I have to put on a DIN to PS/2 adapter, and then a PS/2 adapter to USB adapter.
I hope they make one for a Mac!
I’m sure you checked already and now know this, but yep, the Das Keyboard 4 Professional for Mac.
I hadn’t gotten around to checking, so I followed your title and found it.
Helps to use the spell check button before posting : should be artillery hold
I have two of the Swat Compacts, one with and one without EZ Tap. Although the Compacts do not have the clarity of the regular Swat and they do have pretty heavy reticles, I like the size, ruggedness and the side parallax adjustment. The newest Bug Buster line are nice little scopes also.
I couldn’t get my QB-88 loaded with the 4×32 front AO, it doesn’t really look that compact to me.
Anything I may be missing?
The Bugbuster scope is shorter than the scope you have.
The Bugbuster leaves plenty of room in front of it to load my 300s.
Okay I’ll have to get one, that’s probably why I had it in my cart instead, I really don’t have a problem with the price on a fresh paycheck but I’m gonna get a gun safe outta what’s left of this one.
Is that also the one that focuses down to 3yds?
I really don’t care if it has an illuminated reticle but would like a side focus.
Yep 3 yards. And the Bugbuster is 8.5″ long. The scope you got is about a 1/8″ shy of 12″.
So the scope you have is roughly 3.5″ longer than the Bugbuster.
I guess the scope over hangs the loading port on the gun now.
The scope you have now would be nice on your 2400 but I guess you got something on it now.
I put the 4×32 on the 2400 and it’s a nice little package!
Today I put my point sight on the 2240 in hopes of testing it before dark tonight but missed that window. It’s supposed to be 29℉ tomorrow so unless I build a backstop and shoot that loud booger inside I won’t be able to get it sighted in.
In other news: I was talking to my apartment complex manager today when one of the maintenance guys heard me and came to tell me of his latest move out score.
He said it was a m4 BB gun but the description of a working charging handle and missing clip leads me to believe that it is in fact a Winchester mp4 like the one Hiveseeker blogged he said he’d give it to me just to keep his 2 sons from fighting over it.
Sounds like I may be playing Santa myself this year! 🙂
So you like the scope? Is it enough magnification for you?
More than likely,
Remember I was hitting out to 80yds with my 4×32 Tasco on the Airmaster and this one’s not only clearer but also has mil dots which I feel I’ll learn to use effectively along with the AO for range estimation shortly after some range time. The Pronghorn on the other hand only has a duplex reticle. So it’s gonna be a big step forward for me.
Ok I know some people say they can’t see their target good enough at lower magnifications.
It sounds like it will work for you.
I know that little UTG golden image fixed 4 magnification scope I had was sure a bright clear scope. That’s a scope that I wish I would of never let go.
I think I got spoiled by the 50mm objective I have on the Regal but I’m well aware of the added weight too.
And trying to keep this gun light and simple.
I’ll probably get a 40-44 objective for the Impact for a brighter image.I’ll see what leapers has for it before I check out the Hawke line. But I’m thinking about the bugbuster for my next optics purchase.
One of my first “real” deal air rifles ( over 100$, not from wallybox ) was the walther talon magnum, for 200$ it came with a leapers 3-9x illuminated mildot reticle… the gun I could live without now but I cant believe I didnt hold onto that scope… 🙁
Something tells me “the Gaylord dream rifle” is NOT a .177 spring air rifle that can shoot pellets at 2000 fps., take down a whitetail deer, and costs under $50.00. ;^)
the R1 book I bought from you in Virginia so many years ago is one of my, if not my most prized airgun book in my collection. I’m so glad you autographed it for me and came down a bit on your “outrageous” asking price which, I was initially prepared to pay! I look forward to your new books and wish you much success. I guess I’ll have to travel to an airgun show that you’re at to have the new books autographed as well.
By the way, last night was our last 25 yard Bullseye competition for the season (we shoot at an outdoor range and none of us old foggies like shooting in freezing weather). I tried the 10M hold you described in 10M shooting. While the toe-in stance was a good find for me, locking my wrist down and trying to raise my arm to put the sights on target I found was physically impossible for me. But I did win high point in the “turkey shoot”. Price was either a frozen turkey or an apple pie. I like apple pie.
So, that was you I sold that book to? Well, I’m glad you got it.
A new book will stop those horrendous prices, plus it will have even more content. So everybody wins.
Please make the new book available on amazon kindle or something else digital. That way it never goes out of print.
With the current book “BB Guns Remembered” I went to print on demand first, then to Smashwords and Kindle. So anyone can have it.
I’ll do the same with the R1 book.
I don’t see it on Kindle. Will it be available soon?
Amazon has the paperback, though.
It’s available in Kindle right now. The problem is, I let Smashwords publish the Kindle file and now it’s invisible to anyone who doesn’t go to the Smashwords website.
Epub, Mobi and txt, awesome!
Sold to me too. I would suggest raising your smashwords price to half the print price (right after I get a chance to buy one at the current price)!
I just read through the first three chapters. The book is great.
Received my copy of BB Guns Remembered yesterday. I read the whole thing last night. Wonderful stories. The book is a treasure. Well done!
Now I’m looking forward to the second edition of the R1 book to join my airgun book collection.
Of course, both will have to be signed. I’m going to be looking for you.
There will be another book like “BB Guns Remembered”, after the R1 book, God willing. I have an unbelievable photo of two boys with what looks like a 1915 Indian and a huge string of fish. Gonna make a cool story out of that one. Plus I have about 100 more old pictures to write about.
I love the whole idea, its completely original, extremely creative. I’ve never heard of this photo inspired short story collection and your already cooking up a volume 2! Keep up the great works!
Speaking of spring air guns, I got pulled in by the Dark Side and bought a UTG 96 airsoft sniper rifle from a pawn shop for about $40. I love the heft and fit of the gun but I really love the trigger. Wish I had as good a one on my air rifles. I got some 32’s to shoot with it and groups pretty well at 6 yards in my apartment. Guess I’m going to have to learn a whole new lingo if I get into airsoft. I saw that amazing group, baby, that you shot at 20 yards on your report on the UTG 96. Looks as good as a lot of air rifle groups at 20 yards, good enough for airsoft field target 🙂 Do you remember if that group was typical of that gun?
You are talking to your iphone, aren’t you? Siri always finds a way to embarrass me.
I just looked at that report and, as best I can recall, that was a typical, though great, group. You get those when the airsoft BB you shoot matches the bore and the powerplant perfectly.
I haven’t seen many airsoft guns that could equal that.
I mean, BB 🙂
Turns out the vise I was looking at yesterday is meant to be mounted on a drillpress, the price was right and I liked the compact design. So I got it today and I’ll put it on my Workmate until I get a good deal on a drillpress.
The safe I was gonna get however was gone. I’ll call to see if there’s one in the back.
Called CS and spoke to Joe in sporting goods and they put the safe on hold for me.
I guess someone grabbed the display model.
Regarding the Duke Colt SAA pellet revolver you reviewed yesterday…since you say Umarex listens to us. I’d like to see this gun: weathered, .22 caliber pellet, 4 3/4″ bbled gunfighter model, rifled, stag horn grips, and no reference to John Wayne on it.
Also, can you tell me why the hammer has to be set to safety cock only instead of resting all the way down against the frame, as well as the reason for the vestigial rubber ‘firing pin’, both of which I find irksome?
Joe, I like the suggestion of a .22 version and might have recommended it myself but I believe those days are over although I’d like Umarex to prove me wrong. I’d definitely be interested in one and aesthetics really wouldn’t be of much interest, I actually prefer the simulation burly dark wood look and plain ole blue but#1 would be performance.
Ya listening Justin?
The hammer is not resting on the safety notch. It’s held there by spring tension to what purpose I don’t know.
The hammer doesnt strike the co2 valve? The HK USP co2 pistol used the actual hammer functionally striking the magazine integrated valve… but you still haven’t showed us the co2 insertion or discussed the valve configuration, maybe the tension and offset from full rest is the hammer resting on the striker?
Of course the hammer strikes the valve stem. But it doesn’t REST against it on the safety cock notch.
Who would I speak to at Umarex to find out why the hammer has to be set away from the frame, as well as the reason for the vestigial rubber ‘firing pin’? How would I get in touch with them?
Well, Umarex USA would be the place to start. Email them.
Here’s Umarex’s answer.
Well, that was somewhat less than useful. Do you suppose they’re trying to tell me it’s a trade secret, or what?
I cannot other than to say that it is the way that it was designed on purpose. I do realize that this and a few other details take away from its historical accuracy, but some things cannot be changed and allow the gun to function as it is intended.
From: Umarex USA [mailto:email@example.com]
Sent: Saturday, November 21, 2015 12:33 PM
Subject: Umarex USA Contact Us Form [#19069]
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Can you explain to me why the hammer has to be set away from the frame, as well as the reason for the vestigial rubber ‘firing pin’?
They are saying they don’t know, either. I have seen several other airguns with this same design, so apparently it is common.
Are they really, seriously telling me that they do not understand how a gun that they make operates? Is the gun perhaps made by someone else and only sold under the Umarex name?
I am assuming that the vestigial firing pin softens the hammer blow so that the metal parts do not crack with repeated firing.
And why does spring tension on the hammer have to set it away from the frame, if it doesn’t have to be so on a firearm SAA?
Not trying to be anal about this…I really want to know. As I said, I grew up with a Colt SAA .22 and I would really like Umarex to fix these two anomalies. And I would really love to have this gun with the 4 3/4″ bbl ASAP. Perhaps with a holster that incorporates a 45 degree angle steel insert that deflects a pellet from lodging in my leg or foot if I screw up on a fast draw.
No — someone in the Umarex corporation understands the gun quite well. Maybe not the marketing rep who answered your question.
Umarex is a German company, with an US component in Arkansas. So “they” is a very ambiguous term.
Also, there may be proprietary reasons they don’t wish to discuss the design. Or liability reasons.
You know, Tom,
I Wonder if the vestigial rubber ‘firing pin’ and maybe even the spring tension on the hammer setting it away from the frame are Umarex’s attempt to keep buyers from trying to convert the SAA to fire powder cartridges.
Does the John Wayne pellet revolver come in the wooden box that the SAA comes in?
Are you the Ton, designed the escape and tv personality Ton Jones?
If you go to the description on the Pyramyd Air website, there is a picture of the box with the gun.
Just got the book. Wonderful stories…thank you. What kind of scope stop is on the R1 ? Pin in one ring?
The rings are BKL. Click on the link and look at them online.
They hold by clamping pressure, alone. No pin.
They are the only rings that can do that.
Lol! No I am not. I am just a humble guy from the Caribbean. Ton is short for Tony which is short for Anthony.